Lions Led By Donkeys Podcast - Episode 83 - St Clair's Defeat

Episode Date: December 16, 2019

The US dispatches some soldiers to fight Native Americans resulting in the biggest defeat in US Military history and the creation of American government as we know it today. Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/lionsledbydonkeys Grab some merch: https://teespring.com/stores/lions-led-by-donkeys-store Follow us @lions_by Sources: https://ohiohistorycentral.org/w/St._Clair%27s_Defeat https://www.lawfareblog.com/remembering-st-clairs-defeat http://touringohio.com/northwest/mercer/ft-recovery/fort-recovery.html https://armyhistory.org/the-battle-of-the-wabash-the-forgotten-disaster-of-the-indian-wars/

Boston, the Harriet. And welcome to another episode of the lines led by Duncan's podcast. I'm Joe. And with me as mostly always is the Nick. Said it first. You did. The Nicholas. The Nick. Von said it first. You did. The Nicholas Vaughn. The Nick.

Vaughn. Go ahead. Penis tattooed Stein. Nice. So, we're going to start this episode off with something we've never done before. Because we're a history podcast and very rarely is there a real time. We're going in the future? Yeah.

Future. Donkeys. Space. It'd be hard. Madness. Now, now we're gonna talk about an update to an episode we've already done now uh one of the weird parts about a history podcast is rarely everybody's already dead uh but this time we get to talk about our friend of the show nate clint laurence that's not n. That is definitely not Nate. What the fuck? So, for anybody who

turned in last week, we talked about Clint Lawrence and how he's now a free man. And I was under a... Hold on, is this an update like good for us? Oh yes. Oh cool. It's good for everyone. It's actually good for humankind. Now, I mistakenly believed when

he got a pardon and walked away a free man everything was gone turns out his uh dishonorable discharge still stands uh also he cannot get a job anywhere and i know this because he has a twitter account. And he blocked me, but everybody is sending me updates. Now, this is a tweet from him of which he posts his rejection letter from Target. Are you serious?

He says, quote, I still have a dishonorable discharge. Makes it impossible to find a job even at Walmart or Target. He then tags a parody Trump account on accident called Real Donald Trump without the D, which is a parody account. And Clint Lawrence is a dumbass. Told me my record would be expunged.

His staff in the White House must have disagreed because that's what they do. They should. This is an uphill battle. Now, he then posts an email that he got from Target. And this is the whole email. Hello, Clint. Thank you for your interest in joining the Target team. I should remember how I pointed out

he has a law degree and he can't work at Target. That's satisfying. We know that every career decision is an important one and we really appreciate you took the time to consider a career test to apply at the role of executive team leader for human resources, which is actually just a shitty

mid-tier assistant manager role in North Dallas, Texas. We wanted to let you know, however, that the hiring team has decided not to select you for further consideration of this role. Sincerely, Target. What a piece of shit. Yeah, fuck that guy.

I thought they'd go with like, nobody here for you to kill. Imagine you get at your job and you go work at Target or Walmart and you're like, here's your new team leader, Clint Lawrence. And Lawrence is like, go kill the family on aisle six.

Cover it up. That's just what I wanted to start this episode off by. I will continue to update this with Clint Lawrence's life's misfortunes until he inevitably dies of an opiate overdose. That's a good update. I've never heard that. That's the first time on this show. You only get that at one place. You only get that at one place Welcome to Lions Let My Dog

The only podcast Where you get to laugh at a war criminal's Midlife crisis Oh man Fuck that guy Now to the episode That wasn't the episode we're not done? No

I thought it was part two Part two, the target wars Now we have talked about America's various wars I thought it was part two. Part two, the Target Wars. Now, we have talked about America's various wars of expansion and aggression against the native population all the way back to our very first series on the War of 1812. One, I consider myself and have been called everybody's emotionally abusive history teacher, and I pride myself in expanding people's knowledge forcefully about the imperial

birth of our nation and it will never stop being important to me. I feel like this is a really big part of American history we all like to forget. But also because in the early stages of what we now understand to be American history, we kind of really fucking sucked at things like statecraft

and running a country. I mean, from wrangling Or just everything. Just living. Dying from dysentery. Stupid powdered wigs. Yes. From wrangling together racist, slave-owning libertarian farmers into a cohesive nation, into

building something resembling an army, even though the government and the people of the United States were deeply distrustful of standing armies at the time. Now, they still use powdered wigs. I don't know. I think they do. There's like three different powdered wigs.

It's super weird. I watched a whole video on it last week. Of course you did. Of course. Did you watch the Patriot and get really pissed off that their powdered w wings weren't accurate? No, I don't do that. There's not enough powder on those wings!

Now, this makes sense when it comes to everybody being really distressed full of a standing army. When you remember that we have an entire amendment dedicated to where you can quarter soldiers, which seems really out of place when you look at the rest of them. I'm still waiting. I'm really waiting for like joint base loose

and we quite a knock on my door like, excuse me, sir, do you have a guest room? This soldier here. It's just some shitty private who never showers. Yeah. He needs to sleep in your living room. Excuse me, sir. He's really into knives. Yeah. He likes to stare at you when you sleep now uh for people who did not pay attention in civics class that is the

third amendment the third it is amendment i will quiz you later i i won't honestly i'm gonna show up there's actually a really cool phone there's dude that'd be fucking awesome there's there's rooms in these houses on March Air Force Base in California that you can tell are add-ons from World War II because pilots and old crew used to sleep in those old add-ons.

So they used to get quartered with the civilians by March Air Force Base. Weird. Yeah, dude. This is the Air Force Room. It was around Army Air Force force but whatever dude back when the air force is cool yeah pretty much uh now we have talked about the ohio war before also known as the northwest indian war or what i like to call the little turtle rebellion because it sounds cool the little turtle rebellion yeah that's cool i like that that's kind of cute

it's like a disney movie yeah but with like stabbing white guys it's not access i'd watch a disney movie i would too if now pocahontas was like that yeah oh god that'd be great like just yes pocahontas lure him in so we could stab him so we talked about it but not in great deal because in the grand scheme of the war of 1812 it's kind of a side story. And we generally try not to do side stories in our series. We do completely different episodes about those. So this is what that completely different episode is a year later. So in 1783, the Treaty of Paris between the newly christened United States of America and Great Britain was signed.

This ended the American Revolutionary War. The Revolutionary War was deeply damaging to the United States and a large portion of the population was Britain was signed. This ended the American Revolutionary War. The Revolutionary War was deeply damaging to the United States, and a large portion of the population was killed or wounded, like a pretty significant percentage, because it was a small population. And most of the means of generating income was destroyed

or picked clean by marauding armies. This left the new government of President George Washington in a metric fuck ton of debt also fun fact they wanted him to be king if you didn't know that yeah i know that's like an elementary school thing but like like fun fact when you're six but like also that will never stop being interesting to me it won't imagine if we go from like fuck that king let's make this guy a fucking king but also like how hard do you think

it was for george washington to turn that down he's like i could be fucking king dude that must be fucking he's like napoleon didn't last that long he's like man fuck this i'm emperor yeah fuck the king you think i'd be king and they're like oh yeah he won't take it what an outstanding guy i'm your fucking emperor and I mean granted two different times breeds different people I think I would have taken king I think if America had a little bit more

infighting like we had the whiskey rebellion and stuff like that Shays rebellion if we had more of those I think he would have made himself king I think I would have taken it dude I mean that's a fun uh historical fiction novel for anybody out there who's taking ideas i guess um so hey not only had uh the revolutionary government or the continental congress uh had blown the entire

government's small budget on the war effort it turned out out... It's like $2? Yeah. All 16 pence and 25 wooden teeth. It turned out the Continental Congress, later known as the Congress of the Confederation, really sucked at setting up a sustainable way of governance.

There's a really good reason for that. It's because they kind of didn't want to. Really? For people who are unaware, the Constitution that we know and constantly get screaming about it online simply did not exist yet that wouldn't happen till 1789

we're not talking about the the government of 1789 quite yet the government we're talking about was an incredibly feeble central government bound by the articles of confederation which was also actually known by and kind of hilariously as the articles of confederation uh which was also actually known by and kind of hilariously as the articles of confederation and perpetual union yeah that didn't pan out whoops oh god yeah um now the articles of confederation look exactly like a document a bunch of independent-minded states would slap together after fighting off a tyrannical monarchy uh it's full of distrust of a government in general and a distrust of an army.

And by that mean, it left the central government mostly powerless to do anything. This includes small things to help with national debt, such as actually taxing people. Hey, can we do this? Shut the fuck up. Hey, you, president, sit the fuck down. My bad, my bad.

They could not levy any kind of federal taxes. Wow. Yeah. Whoops. Way to fuck yourself, dude. Like, Matt Washington sitting down like, Oh, we were totally fucking spaced on this. That's what taxation was for.

Fuck! Yeah, we actually have representation now. Yeah. This was all, we fought a war over this! Instead, the central government had to ask the states for money and it was up to them if they would give them to them and most of the time they just didn't either i'd be like fuck no hey yo north carolina can i have like 50 bucks fuck you you powdered wig bitch all right all right i'll go fuck myself my bad i guess i'll go fuck myself, my bad. I guess I'll go back to fucking Boston or some shit. This actually meant, while Congress was slapping together an army to fight the British during the war,

they really couldn't pay for it. And that's why the Continental Army... They don't have IOUs? Kinda, yeah. Really? Yeah. Like land? So that was part of it.

Wait, I think I remember this from our series. Fuck. It's all coming back to me now. That's why we do this show. The final is later, Nick. Okay, good. Now, there was no way to compel the states to help the central government

as the president had no enforcement methods on any individual states. At the end of the war, some states didn't bother to help the government pay down the debt, either because they didn't actually have to and because they have their own debts you know when i go for my fucking bachelor's in history i'm gonna look so bad by sourcing our whole show the whole time the good news is you do what i do you find something interesting and then you follow it all the way

down to their sources and then read those for like a paragraph and then you write your research paper. All B's, baby. You know what B's mean? Graduate school. That's right. You know what graduate school means? I hate my life. Now, eventually the young American government found a way to raise money. They would just sell the land of the Northwest Territory

to settlers and rich people because they could do that. The problem was there's people living on that land. Fuck them. I mean, the real motto of the United States is fuck them brown people.

Yeah, dude. It's so bad. God. I want a design. I don't know. I want a design. I don't know if I could sell this. I think Teespring would ban us forever. Yeah, right.

That'd be on brand for us, though. A seal that's like the seal of the United States. But in Latin under it, it says fuck brown people. Dude, do it. Because like. I have a brown person telling you to do it. There'd be like white people that buy like oh yeah fuck those brown people like no we're laughing at you yeah it'd be a bad message this would be the this would be the american history x of t-shirts it really would be

fuck we can figure out something else yeah um back to the drawing board back to the racism board said george washington the natives who traditionally lived on this land had been completely left out of any negotiations during the treaty of paris in case anybody was wondering of course they were um so their lands were divvied up to the u.s and they they quickly found out a bunch of white people were haggling over their goddamn house what yeah imagine you came home like to where you live and there's just like two completely foreign people haggling about who gets your shit my dad would be fucking pissed that's that's what happened to the natives they're like why are the brits and the americans talking about

what's gonna happen to our backyard oh no it's happening again get the french uh this quickly spun into a cycle of violence as settlers moved into the areas which they purchased from the government but they still had natives living on them and the natives would try to push them out god because they fucking live this fucking episode pisses me off already god i fucking hate that this led to what else but several retaliation attacks against them and what is now kentucky around 1500 people died this way in only a couple years. Which is like a lot of people in America back then. Eventually

enough settlers got pissed. They had spent their money on shit and found out that the whole area is just lousy with these natives. Yeah, it's already hard for us to stay alive. Doing crazy shit like defending where they lived. And they began to petition Congress to do something about it.

And of course they did. Like, we get to shoot it at Indians? Jebediah, get your musket. This is the new sport. U.S. Secretary of War Henry Knox and President Washington decided- Did you say Knox? Yep. Henry Knox.

The one that- Fort Knox was named after him. Oh, yeah. I think. That might not be true. It might not be, but it sounds like it. Sounds good. They decided they were going to use military force.

As one would. It turns out America was not really good at war yet. No, dude. Did you see the Patriot? It's actually documentary. They were fucking ass. Yeah. We need more Mel Gibson!

So in 1790, they dispatched 1,400 men under Josiah Harmer to handle the problem. That fucking name. Holy shit. It turns out this was not a good idea. Well, his name and there's never been a good

person named Josiah or Elijah. I'm pretty sure those are all just people in Utah now. Anybody named Elijah watching the show, because there probably is a few. Elijah Wood is a huge fan, actually. He is. I've seen him on the Twitter. That's probably not true.

You see, of those 1,400 men that were dispatched, only 320 were what you would call soldiers. The other 1,000 and some change were militia, limited contracts. what you would call soldiers the other thousand and some change were militia on limited contracts would you call soldiers back then uh they actually trained every once in a while everyone's what is treating to them mostly just drilling um like the the standard von stuben prussian type training but this is before what you would call a modern military even in 1700s time. Like there was not regular training going on, but these people were their job was being soldiers.

Look at these shitty line formations. They were the closest thing America had to a regular army at the time. But the other thousand some change for militia unlimited contracts. Now, a good commander can make up for bad troops sometimes. But Harmer turns out was just a drunk Harmer Rumored to be shit faced Ordered only 400 of his men under Colonel John Harden

To attack a native force of over a thousand That's a trend I think Yeah it's something we do a lot He then refused to send reinforcements And they inevitably got their asses kicked I imagine You said a thousand? Yeah it was Like 400 versus a thousand.

Yeah. Did he know the numbers going in? He did. He was drunk. So? Mistakes were made. All right, whatever, dude. If you were woken up from a hangover like, oh, man, I killed 400 people.

No, he did. Oh, that's true. He probably did. When Harmer retreated and got back to Fort Washington, he told the Secretary of War that they had won a huge victory. I've done that on Men of War for sure. Definitely killed a shit ton of people. Yeah.

Now, the important part is, like, he knew he lost. And he's like, how can I fake this? I don't know how you fake your way out of this. He just told the secretary of war that they'd won we're all your men I put them on leave because they did such a good job yes you know the thing is that the problem with this is is all of his men fucking hated him for sending them into a suicide mission I would too because all of his soldiers immediately began to tell everyone that their

commander was a fucking drunken idiot and like 400 of them had died. We lost. Like, imagine them all standing in formation and he's like, Secretary Knox, we've won a glorious victory. And someone's like, the fuck did he just say? Some of them are missing half their arms. They're fucking all fucked up. To his credit, President Washington actually already thought Harmer sucked. And he was not really surprised when he fucked the whole thing up.

The problem was, of course, he knew that and still put him in command. Good guy, that Washington. Good job, King President Washington. King President General Washington. Yes. Yeah, I mean, we give Washington a lot of credit. And a lot of credit is due right but a good general he really wasn't he was really good at not having his entire army destroyed he was lucky i mean he

definitely was lucky but he was the master look has a lot to do with a lot of things like i've said before i'd rather be lucky than talented right um but he was really good at retreating in order Oh yeah And he kept the army together Wasn't so good at the leading part Into the attack But he didn't have to be He knew that though Which is admittedly a shrink Though he did build a continental congress

Well I don't know Can you tell me about your times crossing the Delaware with Washington? I know you were in the army back then yes uh seven seventeen 2006 go fuck yourself old man so uh another funny thing that washington did was he actually did not accept pay while he was in uh while he was leading the continental army he would bill them later uh for his expenses. The problem was, of course, those expenses totaled like millions of dollars. I think he was just making up numbers at that point. He absolutely was.

He was adding on zeros. Yeah, he absolutely was. One gajillion zillion. Like, fucking... How much money did he spend? He's like, 100,000. And everybody's like, oh, that's not that bad.

He's like, 100's not that bad it's like 100 000 million dollars just like see where you get away with it now harmer actually uh was court-martialed on his own request um yeah this actually happens a lot in this episode because um you get to defend yourself at a court-martial right so you can be like look look yeah i understand that i lost but it wasn't my fault because these reasons yeah but how i you got drunk yeah yeah now harmer was fired um but that's pretty much all i ever have to him uh he was replaced by general saint claire and that is where we get the title like a solid guy this is where we get the title. Sounds like a solid guy. This is where we get the title of today's episode and what has gone down in history as

St. Claire's Defeat. Ooh, not a solid guy. No. St. Claire had actually been born in Scotland and moved to the American colonies as an officer in the British Army during the French and Indian War. He eventually resigned his commission and became one of the richest people in Pennsylvania. Yep.

By the time of Harmer's fuck-up, he was a general in the U.S. Army as well as the governor of the richest people in Pennsylvania. Yep. By the time of Harmer's fuck-up, he was a general in the U.S. Army, as well as the governor of the Northwest Territory. That's not a good mix. Nope. Sure isn't. Never is. It turns out, to get all those things, you just have to have a lot of money. Bagpipe dealer?

Black market haggislinger? What is he? What did he do? He came from Scotland. Do you want some sheep guts? No, thank you. Nevertheless. Nevertheless. Now, with St. Clair in charge,

Washington had to slap together another regular army. At this time, this is simply known as the American Regiment, because that is how small they wanted the standing army to be. That's a lot of armies he's trying to slap together. Since the First Regiment was badly demoralized from Harmer's shit show, Congress decided to raise another one. The problem

was, like I had pointed out before, they had no fucking money, nor did they have any way to find money. So they just had to cut soldiers' pay and have to be able to afford it. Makes sense. As you can imagine, this made recruitment nearly impossible and only half of the required number

of soldiers could be found. St. Clair would have to augment his force with thousands of militiamen from Kentucky and draftees on a six month levy under the authorization of militia effect, uh, the, the,

the militia act, not exactly an all-star force as St. Clair was given. Now, I was actually pretty surprised that they were able to draft people. Because it seems like it'd be like the antithesis to libertarianism that they liked so much. That's what I'm saying. They say, fuck you to the government. And they're like, oh, fuck. The government sent me this letter.

I gotta go. Yeah, it's like... Now, the state militias could call up people, I think it was for 30 to 90 days or something like that. So that was mandatory. It wasn't voluntary. State militia. It was,

but all men could be called up for defense. They decided this was defense. On September of 1791, as St. Clair marched out of Cincinnati, he quickly found out not to be a great selectionist commander. He was suffering from gout, which is a kind of... What a fucking asshole.

Which is a kind of arthritis, if you didn't know. That was so painful, he could hardly move every once in a while. For hours at a time, he'd simply have to lay down and wait for the pain to pass. Can I talk about the time I had to go to a field rotation and have to carry another soldier's rucksack because he had gout? People still get gout? Yes, they do.

Fucking assholes on crutches and I had to carry his rucksack. I hate people. Now imagine that you're a soldier in like the 1700s. I drink mud and die. The dysentery is a better choice than this.

Yeah. But I didn't know it at the time. I thought it was good drinking water at the time. This water is thick and brown. That's how I like it. Mmm, shake. Poopy. You're like,

why aren't we marching? Oh, the commander is having a good scream. Commander's a piece of shit. The commander's laying on his back like, God damn't we marching? Oh, the commander's just having a good scream. The commander's laying on his back like, God damn it, I got the count! We'll move as soon as he's ready. One, two, three, come! He has too much blood, get the leeches.

Yeah. Fuck the leeches, god damn it! He also came up with a brilliant plan for this campaign. He would build a huge series of forts as he advanced through enemy territory. Now, this sounds really good on paper. Like, we'll always have a fortification to go back to. Makes sense. But also, building forts takes a lot of time,

and that made the march incredibly slow. And expensive. It was made much slower by the fact his quartermaster kept showing up with the wrong supplies or not showing up at all. I brought pencil shavings.

Sir, we're building a fort. Do you have the wood? I brought socks. Fuck. Fort socks this will be. In many cases... No girls allowed. Put the sign up. In many cases... No girls allowed. Put the sign up.

In many cases, no building supplies would come. Other times, no food or tools. What the fuck? It's like the scene from Office Space where they sit down.

It's like, what would you say you do here to the quartermaster? He's like, I have people skills. This you do here to the quartermaster? He's like, I have people skills. This is another episode where the quartermaster gets shit on, like the Zulu Wars. Oh, you need ammo?

I will need your requisition form, please. There's like a spear sticking out of your chest. Yeah, your whole branch is garbage. God. I hope for the future of this show, that every time i bring up the quartermaster branch i get the shit on them for an hour you more than likely will all right i'm done so in the first day how like now remember how it takes you how long to ruck march like three miles not long a couple hours yeah well like i think it's like two hours yeah how about uh a mile less than that like 45 minutes if you're if you're at a leisurely pace at a leisurely place yeah sure so in the first day they made it less than a mile from the city

throughout the throughout the rest of the march they'd only make it between five and eight miles a day what are they doing? Building forts and then waiting for supplies to show up. Every mile? Uh, apparently. What kind of forts are these? Apparently they're all interconnected tree forts. They have to, so they have to They're fucking Ewoks? They have to be close enough

together so the string with the cup can go from each fort. We don't have enough string you see, so Also the quartermaster just keeps bringing us condoms. I think he's telling us something. We don't have enough string, you see, so. Also, the quartermaster just keeps bringing us condoms. I think he's telling us something. I don't like it. Now, this crawl of a pace and hard labor, combined with the

unseasonably frigid temperatures, immediately began to tear the army apart. And the commander keeps stopping. Oh, the commander's having a scream again. Fuck the count! Fuck the count! Oh, the commander's having a scream again. Fuck the count!

One of the other problems with the quartermaster fucking up in his entire existence is winter clothes were supposed to show up. They never did. He came back with, like, fucking beach uniforms. Oh, you brought the porn shorts and flip flops. Meanwhile, the quartermaster's wearing like three jackets.

They're just all warm like, hey, your winter stuff is here. I don't know what you're complaining about. I'm plenty warm. Also, he's Italian. Why not? Because they have no care in the world when they're giving shit out. So, hey, pepperoni, Tony here. The frost spoiled all the animal feed.

So, hey, pepperoni, Tony here. The frost spoiled all the animal feed. The roads iced over and which caused the pack animals to slip and die. Is this the daughter party? Except it's just the quartermaster eating people. Hey, there's food. This is just a pizza, man. I'm going back.

That's our subject. it's good for gout fuck it pass me a slice anything for this gout and that was when all the militia men who had been levied said fuck this and deserted it's been my 30 days i'm out i've been here 8 days this is bullshit i'm going home

you see our veteran here has been here for 30 he's the highest ranking this guy has eaten like six soldiers uh so the supply line which had already been broken completely fell apart eight miles yeah we can still see we can still see the bsa what the fuck which is weird because like how fucked up does your supply line have to be to not be able to keep up with an army that is literally going at the speed of gout.

If things could not get worse, for the troop numbers, their six month levies who did not desert received their discharge papers and just went home. Just, all right. Stop loss wasn't a thing quite yet.

See you later. Stop loss was not a thing yet. Then other people began to just get sick and die. Others killed themselves because they realized they were in Ohio. As they did. Yes. One soldier looks over and is like,

Josiah, Yes, Elijah? Are we still in Ohio? Takes off hat. Yes. He just shoots himself. Okay, that last one isn't entirely true. Nobody killed themselves that we were in Ohio. But maybe they did.

I would have. I would have, yeah. I once drove through Ohio. I haven't been the same ever since. We're city guys. I don't know yeah i dated a girl from ohio and she stole my car while i was in the field yeah i dated this girl uh who's from like columbus or some shit and uh we went out to the field for pre-deployment training and then someone one of my friends who was not in the field texted me he's like hey bro i just saw your car at a club i was like what that's not where i left it it was definitely the barracks

parking lot and uh he was like yeah uh your girl is here and she's she's with somebody oh they're making out in your car so my girlfriend from ohio stole my car. Technically, you got some. I'm assuming they fucked in my car. Nice. And then I reported my car stolen, and it was found in a Walmart parking lot. Nice. And that's why Ohio sucks. Drink up.

So funny story about that. What we used to say was cowboy and cowgirl cholas, which were basically... I just had beer come out of my nose. What? So we had different cliques of Hispanics back at my school. Sure. So we had the regular cholos, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, back in the La Pinta.

I don't know what that means. I am from Michigan. It's a prison. La Pinta is prison. Okay. Okay. So you have those. And then you have the cowboy Mexicans. I am from Michigan. It's a prison. La Pita is a prison. Okay. So, you have those and then you have the cowboy Mexicans.

I am familiar with those. Okay, cool. You do know those, good. Texas reasons. Okay, cool. So, the cowgirl Mexican, I dated one. What is a cowgirl Mexican? It's the same thing, but it's a girl. Is that like a horse girl? Sure. She likes to ride horses and she likes to see the horses do that weird

dance where they're doing that. Dressage? Do you know what it's called? Horse dancing. Yeah. Wow. I'm impressed. That is awesome.

It's on ESPN every once in a while. Wow. I don't know why. ESPN ate the ocho. ESPN 9. The dressage. This is where we whip horses until they prance. I take her out on a date.

Literally one date. Didn't vibe right. You know, date. Didn't, didn't vibe right. You know, whatever. Didn't go as well. So I leave my truck at the school one night. I go get right with my buddies. Come back the next day.

The wall of my fucking tire is gone. Like it looked like it fucking blew out. Yeah. But you could tell it wasn't blown out because it was too clean.

Dude, somebody took a knife to that shit. You could fucking tell. I got told it was her later on because I didn't want to because it was too clean. Dude, somebody took a knife to that shit. You could fucking tell. And I got told it was her later on. Because I didn't want to go out on another date. You know, it's a bonding moment between us. And I don't know.

There's a lot to unpack here and I'm not going to be the one to do it. You never do. So I'll say that. You know, I like to research history. Not my emotional baggage. Same. We like to keep it bottled in. Bottled in, and then the only bottles that we drain are full of Old Crow.

That is what my dad calls healthy, or called before he killed himself because he's an alcoholic. I feel like we're straying really far from this episode right now. My dad, not from Ohio. Speaking of... Oh, yes, back to it. Good segue. Yep. Bringing it back Speaking. Oh, yes, back to it. Good segue. Yep. Bringing it back around.

Oh, God. Now, back to St. Clair and this podcast that I wrote. He cannot take much more of this, so he did something you just never do. Split your army.

He sent the 1st first regiment, remember, the actual soldiers, to go look for the lost supply line. This is the American regiment? Yes. And he kept his militia forces marching. The American regiment's job

would be to find the supply line, which had already sucked and now had gone missing completely. And that is where his dying army got to the Wabash River and they set up camp. Now, the 300 men he sent were the only ones with combat experience.

They had survived the last fuck-up. Oh, man. So the army that he has with him, completely raw. The only thing that they're... They don't know about his fuck-up. Yeah. I think that's why he sent them off.

He's like, they know too much. They know too much. Just send them off and I'll fuck these guys up. This seems like a bad idea. Also, there's a bit of animosity within the ranks of the army. And they wouldn't even camp together. See, the regulars camped on one side of the river, while the militia camped on the other.

So his split army was split again. It fucking clicks. Yeah, apparently. And because everybody was tired, wet, sick, and hungry, nobody built camp fortifications. Now, if this is reminding you an awful lot of Isla Wanda, it should. Yep. Even down to the quartermaster. And that is when Little Turtle of the Miami people and a thousand of his warriors

attacked them. The beach people, yes. The known tropical getaway. Yes. Miami, Ohio. Yeah. So St. Clair's militia, who were camped on the side

of the river where they attacked, immediately ran across the river towards the regulars. There, the regulars were forming up in lines and holding the natives back with disciplined fire. Do you think they knew they were fighting Floridians? I mean, there is a Miami, Ohio.

I choose not to believe it, because I do know there is one, but I hate to believe it. No, okay. Just as much as I hate to believe that there is a Miami, Florida. I just don't like to believe that there's a Florida. That's true.

Actually, I do not believe Florida exists. It's against my religion. Now, actually, the only reason why I know there's a Miami, Ohio is from the college football team. Mine is from the office.

Because I was really confused that I was watching college football and I said, I think it said Ohio, Miami. I was like, what? That's a weird alliance. Alliance?

Like two shitty community colleges get together. So the regulars eventually brought their artillery down onto the natives. But it would have probably worked if they used it correctly. Now, the gunners really had no training. And so they began to fire way too high, missing them entirely. And before they could correct, they immediately got shot by the natives.

Because, remember, they didn't dig any defensive positions, nothing. They're just guns out in the open. Soon, the surviving artillerists ran into the line and joined the rest of the soldiers. St. Clair led regular... Their artillery broke. I've heard that too many times.

I don't think it broke as much as it never got started. Oh, man. It's like, yeah, yeah. So, St. Clair led regulars on bayonet charges while on horseback, which is shocking for a man literally paralyzed by gout 50% of the time. Only to have two different horses shot out from underneath

of him. It only makes sense that my horse has gout too. They're just both riding around on the ground like, Oh, it's the horse gout! My gout! Fuck! Just mid-banded charge. That's also how he got out of banded charges. He got shot up so much,

his uniform was full of bullet holes, but he was never shot. A musket ball came so close to his head that it shaved a portion of his hair off. That's too close. Yeah. So, like, St. Clair was a bad leader, kind of a badass, though.

On accident? He was really good at fighting. It was getting to the funding that was the problem other officers attempted to sally out of the camp with bayonet charges however the natives have been fighting white people for a really long time and already knew how to defeat those they simply let them do their bayonet charge so these these guys would stream out in a bayonet charge they made their starbucks out their hands. Call cops on their barbecue. Aww.

As the attacking force would sally out of the position, the natives would feign and go back into the woods. Nice. Letting the unit come more and more out of their camp and then just encircle them. Nice. Yeah. They just slaughter them slowly.

Colonel William Drake. That's a song. What? Slaughter them slowly. Killing them softly, maybe? Maybe. Oh, God, it's got to be the intro now, doesn't it? God, it's such a stupid intro.

Fuck! We got to come up with something else. Maybe Samaton wrote a song about this. I don't know. They're like our go-to soundtrack So Colonel William Drake attempted to Charge his way out of this problem On three different occasions

Each time destroying his entire command Alright Private, you're all that I have left In his last attempt He killed his own son Whoa Used him as a shield And Joseph Drake was under his command And died in the last attempt he killed his own son. Used him as a shield. And Joseph Drake was under his command

and died in the last attempt. Like, this didn't work the last three times. But you know what they say. Every third... Ah, that was the third time. There's not a problem we cannot ban

that charger away out of. This is why my marriages all end well. So St. Clair knew he was fucked and gathered his surviving officers together to organize a breakout towards Fort Jefferson. Their operation succeeded,

but it required them to leave everything they could not carry behind them to include all the wounded. Good luck, y'all. Bye! Play dead. Hey, guys, we're gonna break. Wait, where are you going? Oh, God, they're not coming back. Fuck, we're gonna break wait where are you going oh god they're not coming back

fuck we're still in Ohio as soon as any any type of native would come up to me I'm in Ohio put me out of my misery please just scalp me so the native no you shall live in Ohio now

no this is actually they fled and that's how gary indiana was built uh the native warriors built execution fires otherwise known as huge bonfires and threw all the wounded people on them alive jesus according to the book the tragic saga of the indiana indians by harold allison these fires burned for literally days afterwards. And as they were tossed on the pyre, each person was like,

Still better than living in Ohio! That's why the fire was okay. Yeah. It's a cleansing fire. Yes. When the battle was over, it was and remains the most horrific defeat in American military history. So is this whole episode just a rip on Ohio or is this actual episode?

I hope to make every episode a rip on Ohio. Somehow, like the Soviet-Afghan War, it's all an allegory for modern Ohio. I don't know how. The army Sinclair brought with him suffered 97% casualty rate. 632 were killed. 264 were wounded. Almost all of the 200 camp followers were killed as well.

Only 24 men who marched in the battle survived unwounded. That meant a full 1 4th of the entire standing American army was destroyed. It reminds me of Tropic Thunder. 24 survived. 12 wrote a book. 6 got a deal. Six got a deal.

One got a movie. One was a Navy SEAL. When word got back to President Washington of the Army's defeat, he began to scream and throw shit around his office. He demanded that St. Clair face justice and hilariously said, quote, I looked hastily through the dispatches. I saw the whole disaster,

but not all the particulars. Which means he didn't know any of the details, but he was going to be fucking mad anyway. The House of Representatives ordered an investigation into the events of the battle. This would actually be the first congressional investigation ever.

How the fuck would they investigate that? Mostly they just talked to all the survivors. Dude, had all the csi like music and all the somebody definitely some old fat guy with a powdered wig takes off sunglasses dramatically so saint claire arrived in philadelphia to face the coming investigation and he quickly began to point out everybody he thought was at fault, which turned out to be everyone. He blamed his quartermaster, Samuel Hodges. He also blamed the Italian Samuel Hodginelli and the entire war department for the failure of his army. He also demanded his own courts martial so he could prove himself innocent.

Washington refused St. Clair's request for a courts-martial and fired him, forcing him... Well, he actually forced him to resign, but we all know what that means. I think he got gout in the middle of the trial. He just collapses. No, it's the gout! And the horse, too, just...

Just holding his hands and shit. That did not stop the investigations, however. The House of Representatives began to subpoena certain documents from the War Department that they had used anything involved into the standing of the American Regiment. War plans, all that shit.

So I guess you could say, your candle's been blown out. Yeah! The CSI fucking guy from back then, dude. That would totally be it. Then this became a bit of a problem. This had never happened before in the brief amount of American history that had passed yet.

The brief amount? Nobody was really sure what to do. The Constitution had just been ratified and it didn't mention anything about congressional investigations. So that led President Washington to convene a meeting of all of his department heads,

something that is now considered the first ever American presidential cabinet meeting. And that's when Washington and his now cabinet looked around and were horrified because they suddenly realized they were, in effect, investigating themselves. So they did this on accident. Kind of. Yeah. Like, oh, fuck. And the investigation was quickly proving that senior administration officials had fucked up severely.

They'd found the quartermaster had been skimming supplies and money. They found that the War Department had failed to train any of the soldiers that they recruited. The people that were supposed to be soldiers they did send were under-equipped and many of them had faulty weapons and gear and rifles that did not work the the president and the secretary of war

were had ordered the army to go on the campaign far too late in the season hence ending with the cold snap and a lot of people dying it was becoming very clear that just about the last person who should face any repercussions was saint. Clair himself. St. Clair's plan kind of sucked with all the forts, but it still could have succeeded, if not really slowly. Yeah. And with all the winter coming up, you got fucking Washington talking about his time at Valley

Forge, wasting everybody's time. He's still talking. He's gonna talk about Valley Forge again. God damn it. It's around that season. Fuck. This quickly turned into something of a case for the separation of powers. Then Washington did something

that was not really legal or illegal at the time because nobody was really sure of what he could and could not do. Because remember, they're just kind of winging it here. Washington simply refused to give the House of Representatives any of the information they asked for. This birthed what is now known as executive privilege.

They don't need it. Now, executive privilege is something that is still kind of a motherfucker. For instance, have you ever heard of the gun walking scandal? I believe it's called Operation Fast and Furious. I've seen the movie. Not the same thing. Okay, then no. It was when the Justice Department of the Obama administration let a whole bunch of guns purposely get given to cartels.

Yes, I have. Yeah, so when that was investigated, he claimed executive privilege. Wow. That's the kind of shit executive privilege can do. What? Also, I believe Reagan did the same thing for Iran-Contra. You could just be like, nope, not gonna. Yeah, everybody's too busy on Star Wars.

Now, instead of trying to explain what exactly executive privilege is myself, I'll quote Mark Rozelle from a Time Magazine article. Quote, The right of the president and the high-level executive branch officers to withhold information from Congress, the courts, and ultimately the public when it comes to, one, national security needs, and two, protecting the privacy of the White House deliberations when it is in the public interest to do so. If that sounds an awful lot like we're not going to tell you when we fuck up, that's what it is.

Now, Washington did end up giving those documents anyway. He's like, yeah, sure, never mind. I was just kind of making a point of what I could do. But he sent a present that we're still dealing with today. So thanks, you fucking asshole. Powdered wig bitch. Now, this did have a side effect.

All of this. Eventually birthing the modern concept of the United States Standing Army. Something that really did not mesh well until after the U.S. Civil War. The different fobs. But the first attempt of a standing U.S. Army had a much cooler name.

The Legion of the United States! Ugh. These reforms set training, drill times, increased soldier pay, and also included longer contracts up to three years. Kind of like the one I signed. So half your army just doesn't go home halfway through the campaign.

The modern army, the modern US Army that we know so well now would get around that little detail by simply stop lossing motherfuckers and effectively forcing them to stay nice now the legion that would go on to crush the little turtle uh rebellion at the battle of fallen fallen tempers which we did talk about briefly in the war of 1812 a survivor of that battle a shawnee warrior named tecumse, would go on to form the Tecumseh Confederacy, leading right back into our series in the War of 1812.

Full circle, baby! Full circle! I did it! A year later. I did it! In and out. Real quick adventure. Yeah. You said 15 minutes. It's been a year. You know, I understand

that we had a tight and concise plan for Operation Lion's Lead by Donkeys, but if I just get an extension, a surge, if you will, in another year... That's not a good word. I will figure this out. In another year, we'll take a turn. We'll

reach a turning point. And I feel like if we don't defeat them in Ohio, they will attack us here in Washington. So they're coming for your house. That's what I got from this. And that is St. Clair's defeat! That was awesome. I am deeply happy that the U.S. Army's kind of modern birth is based on destroying the U.S. Army.

I'm kind of glad we got to shit on Ohio for a little bit. Every episode, there's a reason to shit on Ohio. Now, which brings us to our question from the Legion. Yeah, I still don't have a theme song. I'm not going to make one. Can it be like a catchy gamer? I feel like a gamer song is just screaming slurs. Not that.

I'm talking about like a game show. Our question this time is for you, actually. For who? It's for you. For me? Yeah. Nick's thoughts on California burritosritos a great burrito or the greatest burrito it's not a great burrito really no that's a letdown i figured that was something

that you guys are like really proud about or something dude that's what the surfers go for i came from la so we go for the fucking like tacos we don't go for burritos right i'm not a burrito guy only when it comes from el rey so yeah we're actually sponsored by el no we're not dude i'm gonna go talk to him so anyway yeah i'm not a fan of the gas station burrito place and yelm washington is gonna sponsor a military he loves me he knows he he's my taco father but yes no i'm not a fan of the fucking California burrito. What is a California burrito?

For us that are not enlightened. Rice, everybody makes it different, but it's basically like, think of a Mexican plate in a burrito. So you got rice, beans, meat. It could be your choice of meat. Most of the time it's fucking beef, but obviously you could put chicken or anything like that but no it's just not my thing face meat it's just not my thing I like tacos

hot take is not the greatest nor a great burrito interesting anyway maybe it's cause I'm not full white California that's fair maybe everybody thought you were. I don't know.

I honestly could see myself because I say a lot of bro, dude. Because I'm from fucking California. And clearly I'm the only one in my family that doesn't know Spanish. Which is sad. Which brings me to another question from the Legion, actually. Somebody asked if I ever thought about learning Spanish just to spite Nick. You'd piss me off more if you knew more slang than I did I know more slang than I know Spanish

There is no fucking way I could learn Spanish And I'll tell you why Because I took three years of Spanish And I still know less than you And you don't know any It's not that I don't know any Well I still know less than you And it was in a classroom where I was any well well i still know less than you uh and it was in a class room

where i was graded and i still learned nothing okay yeah uh so i mean i'm there with you yeah but if if it came to slings bro fucking west side bro he just did a strange hand he started like i started fucking crip walking yeah hiking up his fucking pants and his fingers just walked across the desk and i we need to go um because actually the lapd is flying in they fucking felt it to murder you in your sleep um now thank you for tuning into our show if you think what we do is worth a dollar you can throw it to us on patreon our show will always be free and we don't like to run ads so your support keeps us afloat, helps us pay for various subscriptions, books

and professional production work. Maybe even tattoos. Maybe even a tattoo. We now have a new Patreon goal of $2,000 a month if we reach that. We will get Lions Led by Donkeys tattoos in a part

of our body which can be easily hidden by clothes because I'm sure they're gonna be terrible I'll let somebody pick mine okay that's brave uh depending hold on no no no asterisk is you heard you heard what he said I have a dick almost like I deserve this I I'm gonna cut you off, sir.

All right. Fair enough. God damn it. Now, if you want to ask us a question from Legion, you can do that for a dollar. A dollar gets you that. It gets you access to our Discord. It gets you access to one bonus episode a month.

It gets you access to all of our episodes early. $5 or more gets you two bonus episodes a month. It gets you access to all of our episodes early. $5 or more gets you two bonus episodes a month. Gets you a sticker. Gets you everything that the $1 level does. $10 will get you a copy of my book, The Hooligans of Kandahar. It'll get you a sticker. It'll get you everything

else that everybody else gets. I have that book times two. I had them sign both. Good deal. You are doubly misfortunate. So thank you everybody for tuning in. You can follow us on Twitter at lines underscore by. You can follow me at JKS 99. You can follow Nick at Nick Cass M one.

That's me. Like share and review us on the iTunes machine so we can attempt to claw up the charts against the other history podcast. It's like a war of the romancing saga or whatever. We're all trying to kill each other and seize the greater podcasting territory.

And I don't have anybody worth to marry off. So we have to just do it through violence. Until next time! Yeah, later!