Locked In with Ian Bick - 23 Years in Louisiana State Prison for Armed Robbery | Stephen Tweedle

Episode Date: April 1, 2025

Stephen Tweedle recounts his 23-year sentence for armed robbery, what he endured in Louisiana state prison, and what life after release looks like. #PrisonSurvival #TrueCrime #Incarceration #JusticeSystem #FederalPrison #CrimeAndPunishment #PrisonLife #survivor Thank you to DRAFT KINGS for sponsoring today’s episode: New players can get FIVE HUNDRED CASINO SPINS ON A FEATURED GAME! Just sign up with code IANBICK and wager a minimum of five dollars to receive FIVE HUNDRED CASINO SPINS ON A FEATURED GAME. Connect with Stephen Tweedle: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/s.tweedle_bro.khaleed?igsh=bTd6azFndGE2cTJ3 Book: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B08HPW8YLV/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr= Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/BrotherKhaleed/ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://convictclothing.net/collections/convict-clothing-x-ian-bick Timestamps: 00:00:00 From Louisiana to Detroit: A Journey of Family and Resilience 00:07:17 Childhood Reflections and Early Life Choices 00:15:27 The Illusion of Respect and Influence 00:23:33 The Enticing Allure of Military Recruitment 00:31:02 From Street Life to Military Service 00:38:47 The Impact of Community Disengagement 00:48:00 Life in the Military and Exposure to Drugs 00:54:24 Life Lessons from a Past of Crime and Redemption 01:02:55 The Impact of Non-Unanimous Juries in Louisiana 01:09:35 From Streets to Redemption: A Personal Journey 01:17:21 Challenges and Dilemmas of Plea Bargains 01:25:12 The Dilemma of Integrity in Prison 01:32:24 The Cover-Up Culture in Prisons 01:40:32 Exploitation within the Prison System 01:48:19 Transformational Journey from 2001 to Today 01:56:05 The Power of Self-Representation in Court 02:03:06 Importance of Family Knowledge Sharing Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Anyway, give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Up front payment of $45 for three-month plan, equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first three months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms at mintmobile.com. Stephen, welcome to Lockton, man. Straight from Louisiana. We were just trying to figure out if you're our first male guest from Louisiana.

And I'll have to double check that. but you made it. Louisiana's getting its first snowstorm. So you pulled through and you got here and thanks so much for coming. Yes, sir. Thank you. I thank you for having me.

I don't know if I'm the first Louisiana male that's been on the show, but I am one of the proudest. So thank you for inviting me. Yeah, of course. I got to make it to Louisiana one of these days to get the seafood, man. I really want to try that.

Party, party spot. You love a party. Come to Louisiana. You love good food. Come to Louisiana. You love music. Come to Louisiana. You love alligators.

Come to Louisiana. I don't love alligators. She was telling me out there that you're getting ready to move, though, to Detroit. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Awesome. That's where my fiancé lives as well as my mom now. So eventually I'll be transferring from Louisiana to Detroit to be closer to family.

That's awesome. Did you grow up in Louisiana? No, sir. I actually went to Louisiana from the military. Back in 1998, I was in the military about 18, 19 years old. And that's how I got associated with in Louisiana because I was stationed there. Where did you grow up? I grew up initially in Arkansas.

Oh, wow. I'm born and raised in Little Rock and hot springs and a few other places back and forth with, you know, different family members coming from different households. you know, growing up in the projects, growing up with multiple family members. I went from house to house, you know, broken childhood pretty much. Mother and father were there but not there, you know, off and on throughout my childhood. So I had more than one home, but my primary was Arkansas, you know, but I've also lived in Detroit. But I've lived in Atlanta, you know, different places. So now I'm in Louisiana and I'm trying to work my way back to Detroit.

Any siblings did you grow up with? Yes, I have two siblings. I have an older sister, Fidelka, I have a younger sister, Erica. What did your parents do for work? My parents, as I was growing up as a young man, my dad was more of an entrepreneur, hustler. he actually inherited like a newsstand and a nightclub from his father. So he was in the business of trying to do entertainment and sales and, you know, entrepreneur stuff back in the 70s and 80s.

My mother was always good with cooking. She's like the best cook I've ever known. And most of my life, I can remember her working in or managing somebody's kitchen. So entrepreneurship for dad and culinary arts for mom. That's awesome. Was she big in your life, even though you guys lived in different households growing up? Yes, she was always big. Now, to be honest, and she doesn't mind me talking about it because it's part of our story.

My mother did suffer from drug addiction at one time. So a lot of my younger years, she was not 100% percent. present and she when she was there it was always genuine it was always good quality but the times where she was high or you know her addiction was bothering her you know strong out um she would be gone a lot but it kind of balanced out because when she would come home and go through her recovery phrases. She was like the best mom ever. So, yes, we were close. We were close. I had to witness her going through these stages. I had to witness people turn their back on her. I had to witness family members turn their back on her. I had to witness friends turn their back on her. And by us,

you know, growing up in the house with her around when she was, She instilled a lot of things in us that you could even say was contradictory because she would teach us morals. She would teach me respect. She would teach me to be clean, to be nice. She would teach me to be honest. You know, so I got a lot from her when she was in her right mind. Although when she was in her wrong mind, her addictive mind, it was a lot of pain. but I begin to understand that she's not her addiction.

So as a grown man today with hindsight, yes indeed we were close. And we still are today. We talk pretty much almost every single day we talk or text, you know, pretty much. It might be a day or two we miss, but me and all my family, you know, we're very close. because I believe that, you know, family is everything, especially when you go through prison. You know that yourself. Family is everything.

And I'm learning that as a grown man. How was her relationship with your father when you were growing up? When I was growing up, when I was a little boy, beyond further than I can remember, they were married. And as I grew up, the years that I came. can remember kindergarten, you know, first grade, you know, five, six, seven years old. Those years, they had separated and later divorced. At first, they had a great relationship, as far as I can tell, as far as I know.

And from what I'm told today by my mom and dad, you know, just things started happening. And like I said, the drug era kicked in. Poverty, you know, takes its course. And so that had an effect on their relationship because, you know, in the household, that brings a lot of stress. And you have the man versus the woman, you know, in the house. And their relationship got more strained. You started, you know, seeing and hearing more disrespect. And they're giving up on each other.

They're tired of each other. They're getting sick of each other. You know, they're growing apart. So I witnessed some of that. But before that, I know they were actually married and happy because we still have pictures of the happy days. So their relationship was pretty good. It just got derailed, I will say. How would people describe you as a kid?

They would describe me back then, more nerdy, more booky. I like books. I like to read. I was reading early. I was more, I was serious, but I was also playful. You know, I like to have fun. I like to smile. I wasn't criminal yet, you know, as a little child.

So I didn't grow up destined to go to prison. You know, I grew up in a house that actually try to teach and, you know, breathe respect and things like that. So coming up as a kid, most people like that. liked me. You know, I was liked by my aunties, you know, family members, teachers, pastors, you know, people still have that, they take a liking to me because my personality has always been outgoing, outspoken. I am one of those who tries to bring positivity into the room, you know. So growing up a child like that, most people would look at you like a people's person, you know.

This is, that's my baby. You know, that's my boy or whatever it may be, you know. So I would say that people saw me as a decent young man. Were you attending school regularly? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. I attended school all away from preschool, kindergarten, all the way to the 11th grade.

That's sir. So did you graduate high school? No. You never made it past? No, sir. 11th grade was the end. Getting in trouble, you know, running with the wrong crowds. I eventually had to join the job corps.

And that was really the end of school. And from there, from the job court to the military, and then ironically from military to prison. And so in the process, I got my GED. So that's my education level, GED. The Great Rewards Hunt is on, Draft King's Casino is a place to be. Massive jackpots, weekly bonuses, and epic games are waiting for you.

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What happened? Right. Well, you know, in my case in particular, as I look back on hindsight, I know that the familiar presence, the family, I didn't have the balanced, stabilized family life because like I said, with my mom in drugs and my dad in drugs and not really understanding what it is to be the man of the house,

the leader, you know, the builder, it left me with an unstable life too because I didn't know how to be a man. I didn't know the responsibilities that come with being a man. I didn't know the mindset that comes with being a man. I didn't know what it was to be patient and work through problems. I didn't, you know, those type of values that have to be instilled by a father, I didn't have.

And when it came to my mother, I didn't see the best vision of what it is to have a good woman. I didn't know the difference between the, the neighborhood females that we would chase typically versus the Proverbs 30 or 31 type woman. So having that unbalanced in the house had an effect on me where I too was unbalanced. Because even as a good kid, I still wanted more. I still wanted to get involved with stuff I should not have been. You know, I didn't have to commit crimes.

I chose to commit crimes. I didn't have to. I actually, you know, join gangs. I didn't have to. I chose to. I wasn't forced into it like some people are. But because of my lack of family or my void in my life, trying to fulfill that or filling that in was one of the reasons.

that, you know, I did a lot of stuff that I did, like joining gangs, running with the wrong crowds, doing stupid stuff when you're young and dumb, that you don't really have to do. And people remind you like, why are you doing that? You too smart for that or, you know, this, that, and the other. So it's not necessarily that something happened to me. I look at it as it more as something,

didn't happen for me, which was the strong family structure. And by lacking that, I and many others, we attempt to fill that void naturally with unnatural practices. So in my case, I just feel a lot of unnatural, unnecessary stuff out of that pain of not having family. And I'll say this, I used to feel every time I'm. I see, you know, people at school when you have parent teacher conference, I see people with both parents. When you have Christmas programs, I see both parents.

When you have holiday events, field trips, when it's time for the brand new lunchboxes to come out, you will see other people with so many opportunities and so many different blessings. And it makes you feel like, well, dog, I don't get this. I don't have that. I don't have that. So it creates like a lack. And in trying to fulfill that lack, my life took a wrong turn in trying to fulfill it the wrong way. So that's how I end up running with the wrong people. I end up running with people that I should not have.

You know, nine, 10, 11 years old. I'm not thinking about school. I'm not thinking about a future. I'm not thinking about career. I'm not thinking about what I want to be when I grow up anymore. Now I just want to do something, anything that put money in my pockets right now. Or that brings me some type of belonging, you know, a sense of belonging, a sense of family. So it was more of not necessarily something happening in my perspective.

It was more of the lack. I had that feeling of lacking something. Did the gangs instantly give you that feeling you were looking for when you got associated? Somewhat. But, you know, in my young and dumb mind, yeah, it's cool. It's cool to be respected. It's cool to have people around you, people liking you. It feels good because it stroke that ego.

You know, when you young and don't really know and you're learning, it feels good to have. people looking up to you for the wrong reasons. It feels good to see people afraid or see people respecting you. You know, that's something you don't normally get. So, in a sense, you know, I can say as a young dummy, yes, it fulfilled what I thought I was missing. But now as a grown man, you know, hindsight looking back, no. It wasn't no good because what it led to. So, no, I don't think I actually found what was missing. Were you experimenting with drugs or alcohol in your teenage years?

Yes, indeed. Yes, indeed. What was your first drug? My first drug was marijuana. My first drug, my best drug was marijuana at the time, you know. because I lived in a house where drugs were fluent, you know, frequent. And my mom would tell you, you know, there were times where I would witness her with her friends, partying.

And, you know, back in them days, they had the weed on the tray with the little clamps and the paper. And, you know, that stuff be left out. And then you have times where they try to hide it, put it under the bed. and, you know, so I steal it. You know, so, you know, a couple of times I've stole it. And I want to see what it is. Cigarettes, beer, you know, alcohol, marijuana. Now, I've never been a, I've never done meth.

I have tried Coke, you know, so, but the number one thing that I actually endorsed in as a habit was marijuana. And I loved it. Do you think it influenced any of your bad decisions as a teenager? That's indeed. Absolutely. Absolutely. Because when it became something that was cool, something that was easy to do, it actually started influencing me to start selling it.

Because we would go to, matter of fact, I was in Detroit at the time when I started. But we would go to school and you would find $10 bags. And really, they're like five. or $6 bags, but they're hustling. So I learned to do it like that. Take a $5, $6, $7 bag, a couple of grams, put it in a little bag and sell it for $10, $10, $1,000, depending on who it was.

A lot of times you could double it. And that became more of a habit, but at the same time, the smoke in it was, I mean, just as a youngster with the pain and a youngster without that vision and without that man actually showing you your real, your real virtue, that marijuana comes in and replaces all that. It numbs that, it makes you feel good.

Like most people think, you know, I'm thinking my best when I'm on it. That's how I used to be. When it's time to focus on a decision or focus on a problem, smoke that weed. You know, when it's time to go do something stupid, smoke that weed. When somebody tripping, smoke that weed. And that just became a habit because I didn't know how to solve problems. I didn't know how to look and analyze problems and come up with a solution with my natural mind. So the natural thing with me and my people, we're going to smoke weed.

So, yeah, it influenced a lot of stupid stuff. I've been in a lot of trouble behind weed and drugs. It's broken up our family. and it even influenced my life in a bad way because we caused me to, I was in a military. We caused me to choose drugs over career. And so when I look back to. on it today and you asked a question, great question. Does weed or any drug make you do stupid

stuff or does it influence you? Does it affect you? Yes, indeed. Every day I think about that because I was just young and dumb and not looking at the future and not listening to the people who would try to warn you. You put all that to the side to listen to this devil, to listen to the weed to listen to the drugs, you know, and all the things that you want at that age. You know, so yes, definitely weed. Yeah, it caused a lot of problems in my life, myself and my family. So, yes. Whose idea was it for you to join the job corps and then subsequently the military?

Myself, along with other family members. and getting in trouble with the police at the same time. It was all a consortium of things. But I actually was in Detroit, going to Insta High. And 1995. Year I was born. Okay. Welcome to the world.

That was a good year. So, yeah, 95. was a very good year. In Detroit. And what happened, I was getting in trouble up there at an Ate's in her house. And, you know, not being respectful,

not being presentable, not being a, you know, a decent young man, not being civilized. I was arrogant, retarded, you know, young and dumb. And she eventually couldn't deal with me no more. So it ended up, resorting in her kicking me out and returning me back down south, like Arkansas,

in particular. And after that, because my mom wasn't around nor my father, who I thought was dead at the time, nobody being around that we saw as immediate family, my other A&Ts and family members all put together, you know, in on the idea. collectively that we ought to find something for him to do that's going to keep him away from trouble out of trouble and what they thought was something good for him in his future, you know, productive. That's how at 16 years old, the Job Corps option came up. I had an A&T that recently passed. You know, God bless her. May God be pleased with her soul for her efforts. She had friends

that she knew that she could talk to and was trying to find ways to help. So the job call became an option because I couldn't just keep going back to school getting in trouble. And they didn't want to deal with my foolishness at home, you know, because I was rebellious. I didn't want to stay in the house, you know, I sneak out the windows and, you know, getting caught in girls' house, you know, that kind of stuff. So it was too much. and one of the biggest things at the time was, you know, the military, of course,

always in the neighborhoods and the projects and they come in to get everybody. And it's easy to attract people because, you know, you see a man pull up with cars and money and jewelry. You know, that's the same thing you see with drug dealing. So it's enticing. And they use that as recruitment. But in the job court, the same thing. except the money don't come as quick, but you see a lot of brotherhood, camaraderie.

You go to work, you learn the trade, learn the skill, and you get paid. And so that's enticing when you see people come from that successfully. So all of that blended up together was part of the reason why job course seemed to be a great idea for me at that time. And then how do you transfer from, Job Corps into the military. Well, yeah, that's very interesting because in the Job Corps, 1995, 1996,

which was also another good year, thank Tupac. In 96, as I was finishing the Job Corps, I went through like 11 months between welding, cement finishing. after about 12 months standard job court they give you your certificate as being completed the program the training and then they try to place you with a job you know job placement so I did almost like 11 months to this point and after that 11 month I didn't want to mess with it no more because I had seen how hard seedment finishing was and I didn't like heat just like I don't know I sweat easy I didn't like welding I didn't like being in the booth with all that stuff on so I left welding alone

now cement finishing I could do because I like being outside I like the sun in a sense but that backbreaking labor I never saw myself you know that's not going to be my career so at around 11 months of doing that you know I'm still running

with the wrong crowd we we We leaving off the compound, the campus. We escaping on the weekends. We're doing stupid stuff. We smoking weed when we're not supposed to. And so I'm running with the same wrong crowds that got me in trouble in the first place as a child. And I had a partner out of Monroe, Louisiana, one of my best friends at the time. We went through a lot together through those years of Job Corps because Job Corps is almost like prison.

It's set up to be separatory. It separates. It puts people in classes. And then it's exploitive or exploitative. And you're really preparing people for prison with stuff like that. Let men shower together and hang around each other all day, not really around your family. Working, working, working for pennies. and then you have state food, state medicine,

you know, all the same stuff you have in prison. So, you know, in Job Corps, I got this, like, this gruntled feeling like I don't want to be it no more. And just cutting up. So what happened after, like I said, an 11th month, and these clowns in my ear, you know, I come up with the idea, I'm about to leave this stuff alone,

about to move somewhere, and go hit licks, go commit crimes, you know, go no hustle. This ain't for us. And at that time, again, Atees and family members in my family who did care about me, which I didn't see back then. Excuse me. They come up with another idea. I had another cousin in the military.

And the idea this time, let's, you know, offer the military as a, a junction. We had a family friend, family, you know, people in different places, pulling strings. So anyway, I run into a recruiter, you know, got the recruiter coming to pick me up and show me this and bring me here and, you know, convince me that I can be all I can be and, you know, all this kind of stuff. So me being young and dumb, all I see is the cars, the women, the jewelry, the money, the traveling, I like to travel. You know? So all of that combined, I said, man, after Job Corps, I'm going to the military.

So I ended up basically joining the military. And it only took me maybe four months to see like this ain't really what it's cracked up to be. Because, again, it was work. It was working for pennies. It was state food. It was, again, showering with other men. You know, just, it's like these institutions prepare you for prison, like the school to prison pipeline. That's what job court was.

That's what the military was. So going from, you know, to answer your question directly, going from the job court to the military was like going from, you know, a green apple to a red apple. They both apples. and it wasn't a hard sell for me because I was already used to not living around my family and I'm already used to this institutionalized life. So it was like just leaving one jail to go to another prison, you know, one prison to a jail.

And it was a period in my life where I was numb to a lot of stuff that family was talking about. about anyway because I felt like at the time, like, nobody really understanding what I go through or nobody's really, you know, in my shoes because they're not, you know, you don't know how I feel to have your mother on drugs and to have to go to school and people know this, you know, that kind of stuff. So going from Job Corps to the military was... not a big jump.

It was like I still was the same person, with the same mind, same attitude, F everybody, F the world. And I still had that void of not having family in the job corps just as well as I did in the military. So it wasn't really much of a jump to me. But I will say this. my family did try to help me

at the time I didn't see it and didn't know it but they did try to help me in the sense that they were always trying to find solutions to the problems far bigger than what I was trying to find you know when it comes to solutions. My solutions were nothing. I just wanted to run from the problems

get away from it and try to rebuild something from scratch that didn't make sense. You know, but they were trying to, trying to find something viable that was really productive and helpful to my situation. So that's also a reason why I went from the job corps and not following what I wanted to do, leaving a job core and go to the streets and sell dope and rob people. We ended up with the temporary solution of leaving the job core going to the military to see if we can work on this again.

you know, get it back right. What branch of the military did you join? And what was like your goal if you had one? Yeah, the Army. The Army was the branch. My goal at the time was just to keep working, making money, traveling in the world, trying to, you know, figure myself out. I didn't have any major lofty goals.

At the time, I'm only, when I joined, I was 17, 18. You know, I still haven't learned life. I still haven't learned. I didn't have morals. I didn't believe in God. I didn't believe in the, you know, the totality of family. And I was gullible because, you know, like I said, like a little fish that chases shiny things on the bait. You know, anything you're dangling from me.

Look at this new car. Look at this pretty woman. Look at this stack of money. That was my motivation. So, you know, I didn't, and I didn't hang around people that was. was, you know, saluting the flag every day and gung-ho and we'll die for America. I didn't hang around them kind of people. I hung around the people that sat in the back that all we wanted to do was party.

We was in there for money, women, drugs, partying. And like you see, a lot of the kids today in the military, they're not there to die. They're there because they like the money. They like to party and they like the brotherhood, like a fraternity. So it's like college life to them. but I didn't have goals. So my only thing was just going to work every day, make the money, do what I do,

enjoy my life when I come home. In the morning I put on a uniform, salute a flag. At night, I'm in the club doing drugs. So that was at that time the only thing I knew, you know. I didn't have any big lofty aspirations. I didn't think I'd ever be a public speaker. or a youth mentor, a published author. I didn't think I'd be helping people get their GEDs.

I never saw myself as a helper or a teacher or anything like that. So, now, the goals I had were simple-minded, and I always say... We're almost halfway through the year, and a lot of people are running on empty without fully realizing it. Growth therapy helps you find care that's covered by insurance before burnout becomes the baseline. Whether it's your first time in therapy or your 50th, grow makes it easier to find a therapist who fits you,

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parents like that and they still ended up in prison just like I did. And I know some today. So I wouldn't just say it's that I think it's a multitude of not being around the right resourceful people from preachers and teachers and family members and community members. People in your community. See, and part of my problem was I had, I didn't listen like I should to listen in class and around people that were giving me wisdom. I thought I knew it. So that ego would shut out the wisdom. But for example, you know, you have people that come around and they give you good things.

They give you good wisdom, good information, good knowledge. But what I didn't understand was that I have to take it apply it myself. I wanted instant gratification. I wanted, I wanted it to be handed on like a platter. So I didn't know the process to get from planting the seed to growing the fruit. I didn't know about all that. And I think in our communities where we find a lot of potentially talented people using their talents destructively for their self or their community, I think one of the things that we miss is the right resources, the right resource for people who not only come in and say, hey, don't do that.

You need to do this. Well, that sounds good, but we need people that don't do that. Come here, let me teach you how to do this. Let me show you what that looks like. I didn't have that. And not just my parents because my dad used to set certain examples and my mom used to set certain examples that I never forget to this day. For example, love your family while they're still around. I've always heard that from my mom and shout out to her.

So no, I don't think it's just the parents. I think it's because, you know, we had that saying about it takes the village to raise the child. And I think our village lacked the right people or right resources combined with the effort to put it all into fruition for that child to see. And I didn't have those examples. But let me also say this, because I can't just say I didn't have examples. I didn't know how to follow those examples. And I didn't know what was the right examples to watch. So, for example, you know, we grew up with a lot of Cosby show, you know.

And so when you see the Cosby show, we had a, and most of us watched it around, this was before your time. Now that made me feel old, man. Or I'm just very young. Okay. We'll go with that. That's a nice way to see it. The Cosby Show was something that gave us a sense of,

man, that's a nice family. You know, that family has it all together. That family is perfect. I wish I had that. I wish I had these opportunities and chances. Many people saw that like that. And when we didn't have it, it created, like I said earlier, it gives you this sense of lack.

Like, man, I don't have that. I don't have that. I don't have that. And so at that time, it takes more than, and Cosby Show was good for showing that, it was more than just the mother and father. It's the whole spectrum of family and community. Because there's many situations where you would have a mother and a father in the house

and they might be working, but they have an auntie that's taking care of the kids or they might have a neighbor that's also taking care of the kids. And if I did something back then, my neighbor had the right to whip me or my auntie had the right to whip me just like my mother did. So when we lacked that community involvement,

I think that for me that had a lot greater harmful effect for me was not having the best of community engagement. Because, you know, coming up, like I said, in the crack era, a lot of community turned, they backs on each other in a lot of cases. Not all, but some. And it became devastating because this neighbor no longer wanted to work with this neighbor. and like it is now today. Nobody tells nobody anything, you know.

You see the child doing something. Nobody don't say nothing. They just let them go on and do it. You know, that didn't happen like that back then. Now that's become prevalent. And I know that in my life, I'm like in between that shift, you know, from then to now I'm in the middle, you know, from them 80s and 90s babies.

our generation, we needed not just looking at Michael Jordan on TV or Mike Tyson or whoever may have been that was heroes. We needed somebody that we could see right there amongst us doing it every day and showing us this is how you do that. and making it look just as good as any drug dealer or any rapper or anybody else that we will follow. We needed to see visual. I needed to see visual examples of what success and excellence looks like for a young man with the potential to do good. And if the community doesn't seize on that opportunity, really, you just allow the devil to get involved. and that becomes the influence. And that's what happened to me.

So I don't just blame not, you know, my parents, but the community is part of that. What happened to your siblings? Did they go down a similar path? No. Or did they do something different? No. Excuse me.

Absolutely the opposite. My older sister, who's now a, a college graduate CPA, and my younger sister, who's a college graduate with a master's degree in library science. Both of my sisters were, you know, they stayed in school. Both of them duck the streets. Both of them turn out to be good. They're both successful to this day. I was the problem child. I was the middle child out of three for my mom. And they're both totally opposite. So looking at our family, you would never know that I was the, you know, by me being a problem child, me going to prison, you would never look and see like, wow,

they all come from the same family. So, no, no, they didn't choose that route at all. Neither one of them have ever been in jail, you know, for anything major, you know, some minor speed and ticket, that kind of stuff. They didn't get that. But crimes? No, I was the only criminal. I was the black sheep. So you ended up in Louisiana for the military, the Army? What happened that cut your time short with them?

Drugs and marijuana. A lot of party. I didn't want to go to work no more. I ain't want to listen. I didn't want to do what I'm supposed to do. Getting tired of it. Like I said, same thing with Job Corps. But one of the biggest things was getting busted, you know, messing with weed.

You know, you have piss tests. You have inspections. You have people that rats around you, snitches, and people that's going to tell for benefits, you know. So when you live a life like that, you can't just do what you want to do. You've got to be aware that there's consequences. And I was like, man, I don't care nothing about done of that. you know, young and dumb. Again, I'm about 21 when I got out.

So by me being young and dumb and not really experienced and, you know, with consequential thinking in the world, like my fiancé, I always talk about consequential thinking. That was not one of my strengths. And I was more of, you know, oh, well, you know, that attitude, F it. And so that's how I ended up getting in trouble, just like the job code. They did the same thing in the military.

Just effort. And then when I got out the military, the same effort attitude. That's how I wound up in prison. You know, just effort. So not just drugs. It's just that mindset that allows you to do the drug. Just saying, effort, give me that.

Let me smoke. And that allowed to, that led to, I think I got a, I got popped on, I got popped on two piss tests, excuse me, drug screens, your analysis. And the first one, they gave me a slap on the wrist warning because I was a decent dude. You know, I wasn't retarded. I wasn't mentally crazy. I wasn't deranged and angry and trying to hurt nobody and kill up people.

So, you know, they gave me another chance. But two weeks later, I got found, you know, guilty again for using marijuana. Now, the thing is in the military, this what my mind was, how retarded I was. In the military, marijuana is a serious offense. You know, anytime you fell a drug test. And marijuana at that time carried a year in jail, you know, federal prison. So the federal prison thing, I wasn't about to do that. You know, I wasn't trying to stay in the military.

I wasn't trying to go to no drug rehab. And I ain't trying to do no federal time. So I ended up taking like a plea bargain pretty much, what they call the administrative leave and administrative discharge and all that, where you sign your name agreeing that, okay, you're going to discharge, you ain't got to worry about none of this no more.

That was a decision that came out of my ignorance. Because had I known back then that I could actually stay and recover and heal myself and better myself and put myself back in a better position, you know, only a fool would deny that. Only a fool would say to hell with that, let me go keep being stupid. So, yeah, that was just bad consequential thinking. How did your family react to you leaving the military? Well, my mom wasn't around at the time. My father wasn't around at the time. I think one of my closest Aatis was my only big relative

or the closest relative at the time who was concerned with it, you know, from my viewpoint then. But it really hurt her because she already knew that. All right, if you're not going to do anything constructive, if you're not going to do anything that deals with discipline, you're not going to do anything that deals with dedicating your life to some type of value, then we know you're going down the road to destruction. And, you know, they used to talk about that, but I didn't, again, young and dumb,

you don't understand that. You don't even care. But she didn't like that at all. You know, because it showed her that I just want to be retarded. You know, I just want to get in trouble. I just want to do what I want to do, what don't make sense. And so she ain't liked that at all. And, you know, my little sister, Erica, shout out.

She found out later. She didn't like it. You know, nobody liked it because it just showed that, you know, you're on a path to destruction. And people that knew me could see that because I just had this, my attitude was like, oh, well, you know, don't care

when I should have, because they did. So none of them liked it. What happened when you left the military that landed you in prison? Oh, Lord. What didn't happen? Well, one of the main things was

because this same mindset, this devilish mindset of not caring and being selfish and being inconsiderate and unconcerned about your own life, let alone anybody else's life, that attitude had me running with gang members and planning to move to different places and live criminal activities.

You know, live out criminal activities. And in the military, you still have gangs. In the military, matter of fact, there's more drugs in the military than there is on the streets. Drugs come in through the military in a lot of cases. But you find all the weed, all the coke, all the pills, all the X back in the early 2000. The military basis was trap houses. Military bases were places where young kids could come, go to work, put on a uniform, go to work, make a paycheck, come home and get high every single day. As a matter of fact, they promoted drinking amongst the young military because you didn't have to be 21 to get drunk because they serve military base, serve alcohol on military bases to young military soldiers, regardless of the age.

So, and the logic was, I can go fight in Iraq and die for you, but I can't get drunk. So people didn't care none about no age in them. And so people like me benefited from that. So it's every day we party in. I love weed. We love alcohol. And we love these parties. And we love women and we love chasing his money.

That was my God at that time. I didn't believe in God, Jesus, Muhammad, Allah, none of that. Today I'm grateful. But back then I was more atheists. I didn't care nothing about none of that. And so getting out the military, I mean, that same mindset. what am I going to do to get what I need to get? I need this money.

I need this ride. You know, so running with the wrong people, and I don't want to use no names because I am on parole and I have stipulations. I can't go back to the town that I came from. I can't associate with the people that I associated with back then. As a matter of fact, two of my homeboys at the time were rats, you know, snitchers, used the evidence in court against me. That's how I got busted.

That's how I got locked up for armed robbery. But that's another story. But to answer the question, that mindset of not having your goals and your vision properly in front of you written down and trying to, you know, work towards them. and then having these false expectations and these false images in front of you, this devilish stuff, it just overwhelmed me. And afterwards, I was even more with negativity because now that I'm out the military, okay, I don't have any more restraints. So in the military, you got to get up every morning.

You've got to exercise, you got to work out. you got to come to different drills and programs and classes. You're going out in that field. You're going overseas. Getting out of it, I ain't got nothing to do now. I do what I want to do all day. No more restraints. That made me a bigger devil than before.

Now I'm getting more and more bold with evil, with wrong, with negativity, and destructive stuff. and so it pushed me to the point where I really didn't care no more and hanging with the wrong people who feel like the same way I felt I ended up in a situation where my charge was on robbery

excuse me my charge was on robbery and because I did it with other people or around other people and the things that we did do that makes a conspiracy. So I had armed robbery, conspiracy, I had gun charges, you know,

different stuff related to the armed robbery and various other little crimes that we were committing around the neighborhoods. There's little gangs doing stupid stuff. And, you know, because I'm fresh out the military, I'm energetic, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, angry. I love guns. You know, that's what they teach you. They take young people that don't know nothing and they teach them how to shoot guns. And they teach them how to lie, how to be deceptive,

you know, these type of things. So this is where I'm at. And this is how I ended up in a situation where I was facing first like about 100 years for, I think we had like 10 or 11 charges when they first hit us with the charges. But I ended up getting convicted of foe. Two counts of armed robbery and two of conspiracy because of the clowns I was running with, who two of them ultimately become rats,

that they use their evidence against me in court. you know, to convict me. Like I said, it's another story because that goes off into a whole other area of my life where I've found progress and change into the better person that I am today. So I'm grateful for it. But to answer the question, you know,

coming out of military, not having a plan, not having guidance, and then having the devil on that shoulder with this foolishness, it's a recipe for disaster. And I was one of those who ate that recipe. And it led to disaster in my personal life. So what did you guys, what did you guys rob?

Finance company. Finance company. And the one we got caught on was actually a loan company. And out of, in Louisiana. and this loan company has some very, you know, prominent people that worked there. And in having that, it became like a major local case because it involved people that, new people, that knew people. And that was like, I'm grateful for the outcome in the blessings and the, you know, the productivity that I got out of my prison time,

but that was the worst mistake of my life, is not calculating that beforehand and thinking that I had to do that in order to have something or be something. And it took 23 years of my life. But, yeah, that we robbed a finance company and that armed robbery, that conspiracy, changed my life forever.

They had cash at a loan finance company like this? Yes. Back then, you know, you had cash. It was before cell phones. It was 2001 I got locked up. Cell phones just coming out back then, and they weren't smartphones back then. You know, you didn't have come in with a debit card

and all that. Everything was cash. You go to grocery stores. It was cash. go to pay bills, it was cash. So you run into a bank is cash. You run into a finance company's a gas station, pigly-wiggly back then, grocery stores are all cash.

So a lot of people was robbing to make their money. We're almost halfway through the year, and a lot of people are running on empty without fully realizing it. Grow therapy helps you find care that's covered by insurance before burnout becomes the baseline. Whether it's your first time in therapy or your 50th, grow makes it easier to find a therapist who fits you, not the other way around.

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Bite it. Learn more at join mochi.com. Mochi members have access to licensed physicians and nutritionists. Results may vary. Funny. You know, it's a funny lifestyle. Robbery was a hot thing. So is this like a Western Union when you say finance company?

No, more like a loan company. Okay. No loan finance. Like a payday loan? Yeah. Okay. So like where you go up to a check cashing place. Yeah.

So it's different than a bank less security. Right, right, right, right. It's not a bank. And it's not federal time. state time. And that's funny because I used to sit up and think like, damn, I should have robbed a real bank because I'd have got less Fed time than I got for state time robbing the finance. Yeah, they talk about that in the feds all the time. If you go into a bank and rob it with just a note, you're going to get less time than the guy that walked in with a gun anywhere.

Yeah. I mean, it's retarded, but that's what it is. So that, but that, again, that just show how stupid I was. You know, why would you rob that and get 36 years? You can rob them and get five, you know? I'll do both is wrong. I'm just saying, that's how, that's how we didn't consequential think about what we're about to do. Were you making money from these robberies? Were they successful? Pinnies, man, pennies. You know, anytime you make anything less than 10 to 15,000 is not even worth it, because you can't even buy a lawyer. You know, you can't, you know, You know how much money I spent when I first got locked up? You know, my first three, four, five months,

you run through $5,000, $6,000 like that. Well, you know, you know, commissary, the phone, trying to find cigarettes, trying to get weed. You know, you run through your money. Even all your partners, you know, who don't have nothing, the gambling table, just so many different ways. You run through everything you got. but the robberies themselves, the crimes themselves,

any hustling that you're doing, man, if it ain't bringing you enough to buy your lawyers and beat your case, it ain't worth it. Because you losing your family, the money, and everything that you thought you built, you're losing all of that. And I learned that the hard way. So no, none of that wasn't worth it.

None of that wasn't, that was Trump changed because I was the trump and all the lawyers and judges and DAs was making the change. So you weren't caught red-handed if someone ratted you out then. Yeah, we got away with it. I got away with it. And I say that,

not out of arrogance or ego, you know, like I'm smart because it was really stupid. But I didn't get caught at the time. What happened was, again, having people around you that you don't know, people around you that you think you can trust. But when you can't read the room well and you can't read people, you think everybody cool.

And I learned the hard way that two of my so-called friends and fall partners actually was rats. And turnstates evidence took the standpointing me out in the courtroom. And that in Louisiana is enough to put a man in prison for life or for 20 years or whatever it's going to be. you don't have to have a pistol. They couldn't link me to a pistol. They didn't link me to a ski mask. They didn't link my shoes and feetprints. They didn't have my fingerprints.

They couldn't show anything relative to the fact that it was me other than these two pointed out saying, that's him on that video. That's how I ended up convicted. And it's crazy because, where Louisiana operates, the way they operate, two witnesses who can corroborate a crime at the time. That was law, that if they can corroborate that,

if these two witnesses, states, evidence, if they can corroborate that, then they're telling the truth. It's a fact. So that's evidence. That's acceptable in court. And I didn't know that at the time. Again, I'm young and dumb. I don't know the law.

I'm not even planning for this. I'm in the streets doing stupid stuff, but I'm not thinking about the consequences of if and when I get caught. You know, what am I going to do to get out of this? See, the smartest people think ahead and say, well, I'm going to learn the law. I'm going to get lawyers, and I wasn't even smart enough to do that. So that's why I mean, you know, just a lot of stupid stuff.

And yes, anytime you're doing, something that's going to bring brash consequences upon you, you really got to think in advance of what this is you're doing and what's going to come out of it and how many people is going to harm because it's not just for yourself, but your children, your family, your neighbors, your community, everybody suffers, you know, from stupid mistakes like that. So again, I don't say it like with whatever,

but no, I didn't get caught red-handed. I got caught because of rats. I got caught because of snitches. I got caught because of two co-defendants turning state pointing me out on film, you know, in the courtroom. And just to add this, it was so outrageous that not even all the jury believed I was guilty. So I didn't even have 12 jurors convicted me.

And that's the thing about Louisiana. At the time, you didn't have to have 12 jurors. They created their own little system where 10 jurors was enough to convict. Even though that's against the Constitution, they didn't care. That's the laws that they had. And I got convicted under that the non-unanimous jury. And it's still in effect today because you still got people locked up under that, as well as people who've died from that and can never fight their case again.

And then people like me, I'm on parole because of it. So if I was only a patient person that was taught how to sit down, shut up and listen and learn, I could have learned that before I went to prison. You know, even if you commit crimes, at least know the crimes you're committing, the consequences from it, and how to fight your way in court,

at least to defend yourself. because I got pinned with a lot of crimes that I did not commit. Just like I got convicted of crimes, I did commit. So when you're in courtroom, you can't really, I can't say I did this, but I didn't do that. That don't matter. You know, once they show you as culpable for crimes, they stick all this to you.

And that's how so many people get caught up with five and six and seven different charges and beating five and six, seven gun cases. and if we don't, or in my case, because I didn't pay attention and learn and listen, I got a bigger punishment than I know that other people in my situation did not get. For example, not just the rats who ratted on me and went home early, but you see this every day in courtrooms and court cases where two people commit the same crime, do the same thing in the same car, but one of them go home and one go to jail.

See, if you knew, or if I would have known anything about law or knew how to, you know, maneuver mentally, I wouldn't have did the stuff I did first and foremost, but then I also wouldn't have had to face so many years of trying to fight to get my freedom back after my mind changed to a more matured, a person because it didn't take me forever to learn my lesson in prison. It didn't take me 20 years

in prison to learn my lesson. It took me about two weeks, you know, from going to jail. I knew right then, oh, love, something wrong with this. This ain't it. You know, it didn't take me forever to understand that. So now that I look back on everything, no, none of that stuff wasn't worth it. You know, when I look at how much family I lost, how much time I lost, how much possible success I lost, you know, to a system that's insatiable, you know, they'll never stop devouring the community, you know, devouring people with these corrupt politicians,

you know, I didn't know I didn't know none of that. And so in that sense, I'm grateful. But on the other side, no, man, I was retarded. You know, the money wasn't worth it. The relationships wasn't worth it. The things that I thought that really had some benefit and some value wasn't worth it because you lose your freedom. You lose, some people lose their manhood.

I didn't lose my manhood. I wasn't a punk. I wasn't a chump. I wasn't a rat. And I love saying that and everybody didn't know me. No. But you see so much death and destruction. You see so many people broken. You see grown men turn into little girls. You see real strong, tough men have their faith in the, like they soul taken from them when they go to a courtroom and, you know, do 20 years. And the people say, nah, you ain't ready. You ain't did enough time. You need to do 20 more.

You know, and their children in the courtroom and their family there. So when you see so much of this, so much of the reality and the destruction that you cause or that's caused in our communities and in our lives, and then you see the consequences, now it's never worth it. Like I said, unless you're doing something where, you're doing, you're doing something where, you, you're You know, you might run a Ponzi scheme and you didn't rob five people or six people or families. But you're looking at how many grandchildren are going to get, you know, affected by this? How many communities going to have to pay for this for however long they're going to do?

you know, when we're looking at the mindsets of people who don't have consequential thinking, who not, excuse me, who not thinking about the people that they're harming, you know, victims, secondary victims, tertiary victims, you're not thinking about the long-term effects of what this is going to do. I was one of those people. I was one of those people where I felt like, um, What I do just affect me. It ain't got nothing to do with you.

Don't tell me nothing. See, that's the stupidest thing ever. Because what I learned the hard way from this crime that I was involved with to any other crime that I was involved with, the thing that I learned the hard way is that it's never just about me. Because once they get through with me and they looked at all the factors of this case, Now they rewrite the law book and they use pieces of this case to help them create a new law that's foolproof or one that you can't overturn or one that you can't win within court. Or they use something that's going to hurt those that come behind you or what they love to do, what judges and district attorneys love to do when it's election time.

See, because of the crime he committed, this is why we need to be. build a new jail. This is why we need a brand new set of handcuffs and, you know, a brand new electric chair. They use that politically as strategy. So not only am I hurting myself, I'm also helping them. So, you know, you really write up there with the rats. You know, you're helping the cops. So, you know, I start looking at all that.

So when you ask that question, you know, and I get. get that a lot because nobody thinks that who I am today has, you know, you couldn't see me back then doing what I would do back then to who I am today. Nobody believes it. So, you know, when I tell people that, yeah, I'll come out of projects and crack houses, you know, just what it is, homeless shelters, you know. But who I am today, through those experiences, you'll never know. it. But that's only by the grace of God because, and like I said earlier, it's not about being arrogant or proud, you know. Yeah, I got away with this or got away with that. But I really didn't get away because it took my life, you know, my freedom, my family. Like I said,

the prospects of success. All that goes out the window when you go to prison, especially for 23 years, I had to listen to people talk to me crazy. I had to listen to people that was half my age talked to me crazy, tell me when to go to bed, when to do this, when to do that. You witness all these killings. You witness, you know, and I don't glorify all that stuff in prison because it's dysfunctional life. It's a dysfunctional subculture.

Like, you know, I'm not, I don't even like to talk about you know, when you see all this stuff going on because it's not normal. It's not good. It's not healthy. But, you know, experiencing so much, you know, just to give a small example, you know, I used to do a lot of youth mentoring. And you see these young guys that they're worse than I was when I was their age. Well, I gave a little bit of a care.

They don't give none. and everything is death and destruction and killing. And we wasn't like that. I wasn't trying to just run around killing people, but they got them cast today. A lot of them just want to kill. That's the only thing they know. And so as a youth mentor,

looking at that, that dynamic, it makes you start to question like, damn, how the hell did we get to this? You know, and then what part that I'm, playing that because we all are responsible when you see a young generation come like that. So again, it's not always, I didn't get away, and it's not always just about me. I had to learn that. You've got other victims.

Sometimes it'd be young people that's looking up to you and thinking that I want to be like him when I get his age, but ain't nothing cool with that. because ain't nothing cool with a young punk telling you, shut up and go to bed, you know, get over here, boy, and get to work. You know, I do what I want to do. You know, what you're going to do about it? And those humiliating type of circumstances that's beneath a man. You know, so you're in an environment that's designed to humiliate you,

to dehumanize you. When they have a rule book and a law book that tells you the officer always gets to credibility, no matter what. You know, somebody can come in and call, you know it. Somebody can tell you something stupid, tell you something crazy, and you're expected to accept that.

And if you argue back, you're wrong. You know, just so many lopsided laws and policies like that, they really take away a lot of your spirit as a man and make so many people broken individuals that lose a lot of hope. So again, no, it's never a win and it's never worth it because there's so many consequences that can come from small actions. Like I said, with armed robberies and murders and manslaughterers, they change in the laws every year based on, you know,

this person might have won him. his case and that person might have won his case. So what they're going to do is they're going to go back and play the tape in this grand jury hearing or this trial and they're going to look at the pros and cons and they're going to look at what they can use and say, well, we're going to introduce a law next year that's not going to be defeatable. You know, so you're helping the system like that with the more we do that we don't think about the consequences or we don't think about the outcomes,

a sheriff running for office and cracking down on crime, a DA running for office, a judge running for office. They're using us in what we do to get in office or to prove their point. And so it's a bigger picture than just an individual, and I had to learn all that. And if I could say one thing, when it comes to learning lessons, or I'm the king of learning lessons.

I learned my lessons. I mean, like I told you, I learned my lessons in the first two weeks. It didn't take long. I didn't have to see the whole system. I didn't have to see every aspect of prison life. I didn't have to. It took me two weeks.

And I knew this ain't right. Something wrong with this. something is really wrong with this. And ever since then, I've been on a trajectory trying to change my life, change my focus, my viewpoint, how I think. And not only that, but I find the value of influencing and helping others. That's how I become a tutor and a mentor and teachers and, you know, over time. So there's blessings to be had in those lessons.

But at the same time, a lot of that you can learn if you just shut up and listen from the get-go. You don't have to go through that. Before you went to trial, did they offer you a plea deal? Yes, I refused it. How much was it for? Ten years. Arm robber.

They would have reduced my charges from two counts of armed and two conspiracies. They wanted me to tell on somebody else, just like they got my co-defendants. excuse me, to tell on me. I refused it out of my principles of loyalty, you know, and I still stand on loyalty and respect, and I'm not going to dishonor myself. But it was 10 years was the minimum for armed robbery at the time in Louisiana.

It was 10 to 99. That was what the statutory minimum for armed robbery was 10. So, excuse me. Any plea bargain was 10 years. And actually you do 8.5. So it's 85%. So there's 8.5%. But that was my first plea bargain.

And then, you know, I refused that because it involved not about guilt or nothing like that, but you want me to tell on somebody else who was actually a friend of mine at the time. So it wasn't a way I was doing that. and I still stand by that today. People ask me that all the time. Why you just didn't take the plea? See, that sounds good, you know, but you don't know what's involved

with taking the plea. And people don't just come at you with a plea because they love you or they like you or they care about you or your family or they're trying to get you home. That's what they tell us in them interrogation rooms,

but they ain't trying to bring you home. They're trying to lock up as many as they can. or, you know, trying to complete an agenda like a lot of sheriffs and police departments do when it's time to fill them quotas. We got to keep these jail sales full because that's where our grant money come from. You know, that's why our contract remains open like CCA and corrections corporation and all those people there that run prisons. they have mandatory field rates. You know, you got to keep this jail full in order to keep your contract with us.

So you got to lock up more people to keep it full. And so, you know, that fuse the plea bargain system where they use plea bargains when they really don't even have no evidence. Because like I said, in my case, they had no evidence against me physical. They had a videotape.

It showed people on the tape. can't prove that's me. That's why all the jurors didn't think I was guilty. They had fingerprints. None of mine. They had footprints. None of mine. They had hair fibers in the mass. None of mine. They had guns. No prints for me. So how am I part of this? Well, again, two rats that take to stand and cooperate, they become statewide. witnesses, two witness testimonies is evidence. It's just like physical evidence. If two witnesses say they've seen it, it's just like you physically be in there.

You know, so under Louisiana law at the time. So anyway, with the plea bargains, it was a bunch of reasons why I'd never been with that. And not only because I don't believe in the ratting part, but also because I don't believe that we should be tricked into giving up your freedom without even putting up a fight. See, I don't believe in that, especially when we know that they'll trump up evidence like they do in most cases. They'll trump up all the evidence, make you guilty, put it in the news, get the whole community to condemn you in the court of public opinion.

and then by the time it come to you for arraignment, oh, you're facing 163 years, and you're going to do this and that, and we got you. You know, for a person that don't know no better, like most of us, when we go in the jail, we don't know no better, so that stuff that scares us.

And we don't have a fight spirit. We got a run spirit. So, you know, a lot of cases, that's just, I'm guilty, Your Honor, and you really don't be. Now, like in my case, you might be guilty of this, but you ain't guilty of that or that or that. And so you can't separate it.

So when you say you're guilty, you're getting all that with that. That's unfair. And but there's so many people that fall victim to that. And even in my ignorance, I knew one thing. When I went to trial and my case is public, you know, I don't, I've been through the courtroom. I've been through Department of Corrections, and I've been through the parole boards and hearings,

and my story is, my story is just, it is what it is. I don't have nothing to hide. And when I talk today, I stand on truth. It's crooked. It was racist in that little time where I was at. It was wrong. It was evil. on the part of the lies and the corruption that's used to convict people that you know have not done what you've said.

And what I mean by that, they use evidence from two or three different cases and splice it all together to make one piece of evidence for this. And then want you to convict a plea to that, take a plea bargain to that. Nah, that don't work like that, especially when you know you didn't do that. And I see so many people rather than fight and get, you know, you're facing life. And they take the plea bargain. Matter of fact, they just had to, what the little rapper just did that. You know, winning the case.

And you get to the point where, you know, whatever it is that make you want to go home so bad, I did it, Your Honor. See, that's dishonor to me Because not only are you Um, dishonoring yourself, you dishonoring the people that's fighting to try to end this corruption in these courtrooms where you have these debtor courts and these juvenile courts Where these judges is finding people guilty for kickbacks.

And that goes on across America. So even at the time I was taking my plea bargain, I knew, nah, I mean, I was in courtroom. I called a DA, a liar, judges. I weren't trying to hear from the judge, the victims, the witnesses, none of that. I don't know nothing. Y'all are lying. I ain't part of this.

You know, that's my story. And I'm sticking with, you know, that was my mindset. Because you're not fin to stick all this crap on me when I know I did this or I did this, but I ain't did that. And the evidence showed that. So a plea bargain for me would have been like, man, I'd have sat in the cell for 10 years instead of 23. I would have sat in the cell mad at myself

and disgusted with myself for selling myself out. See, even though I did 23, by not taking the plea and going to trial and losing with four counts, I still slept good every night. I didn't feel like I lost my soul. I didn't feel like I'm less than a man. I didn't feel like I copped out and was scared. I didn't feel like I just sold my soul for whatever.

I didn't give in. So I slept, I felt good with my Lord. to you with my self-respect. And, you know, a lot of people don't understand that because some people say, man, the ought to took the 10 years and went home. My co-defendants did. But they got to live with the fact that you'll always be a rat. You'll always be a sell-out.

You'll never be able to say you stood up and defended your own manhood or your self-respect or your honor, your integrity. See, I stand on that today. So, again, it's not glory because. Because there ain't nothing glorious about a man being told when to go to bed and when to eat and when to shut up. And you can't visit your family today or your family got to leave right now or, you know, this, that and the other. There's nothing glorious about none. The GLP1 pill you've been waiting for is now on row.

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Shop Wayfair's Memorial Day clearance now through May 25th. Wayfair, every style, every home. There's nothing glorious about having to eat sleeping crap around other men and showering around other men and standing in line waiting for different people to get their food, you know, there's nothing glorious about none of that. And then when you're sitting in the dorms, you know, like in the Louisiana prison system, you know, all systems are different, but they have a lot of dormitories in different prisons. And you could be sitting in a dorm at the table playing cards or chess or whatever. And they're walking people through like different

investors and people that's coming through to invest in a new shower stall or they want to invest in a new electric chair or they got some brand new handcuffs that you don't even need a key for or they got a brand new pepper spray that only hits the the offender, you know, the criminal. And these people looking in the dorms, while you're sitting in the dorm playing cards or whatever you're doing, you know how I go, you've been, and they just marking stuff down. Yeah, it looks like we need some new tables or we need a new television or we need And when you're not thinking about it like that,

you really just contributing to that system. But when you start thinking about it and looking at it and somebody's pointing that out and teaching you how to see this, this is big business. This is nothing but corporate corruption, corporate schemes, where every year the wardens and different police officers getting brand new cars and brand new tasers

and brand new guns and brand new handcuffs and whatever. All that taxpayer expense, which is our parents, our family, our community, where I'm committing a crime, my people got to pay for that. And then not only do they pay for the stuff I did do,

they also pay for stuff I didn't do because I said, I'm guilty. So, you know, it's a lot that come with that, that I thank God that I never was the type of person to be a quitter and I don't give up when it's something I believe in. Even though I was in ignorant, stupid, didn't believe in God.

I still had a code that I would not break. So my plea bargaining, or my lack of plea bargaining, you know, was because of that. There's so many things that go into that. And I wasn't, like I said, many people don't understand it, but it's bigger than just, I would have took the 10 and went home.

Yeah, but you can't always live with yourself like that because some of us care about integrity, you know, and honor and different codes that we live by. I never lost that even though I was, you know, incarcerated. I still never lost my honor code. What were some of the things, the negative things you've witnessed during your 24 years of incarceration? Excuse me.

I mean, you name it. For example, if you look through, if you look through the news for the past, just say two years, I've been at a place called Elaine Hunt, right? Elaine Hunt is in Louisiana. It's one of the state prisons of Louisiana, which, you know, at one time was dubbed the prison capital of the world because of the

pro-capital numbers of people that they lock up compared to the whole population. Elaine Hunt was notorious for the past couple of years. You saw a lot of deaths come out of there, a lot of drugs, a lot of officers getting fired because of different reasons. But if you remember or if you go through the news, you saw a whole lot of fentanyl, mojo, different drug use, and what it produced or what it caused from that drug use. I've seen people lose their lives,

but I've also seen people that physically alive, but mentally gone. I've seen Young Brothers 1920 come out and, you know, one day they be intelligent, wise, and smart. The next day they'd be. zombies because the drugs just space them out. You know, different drugs do different things of different people. But one of the worst things that I could see, it wasn't the people fighting over the gambling

table or fighting because of somebody, disrespect to somebody and somebody had to get stabbed, you know, that wasn't it for me. What was it for me was watching dudes that I knew normal and go get high and come back abnormal. and come back like totally different to where they're not even functioning no more. I sit and watch young brothers howling at the moon, you know,

that dudes used to read books. And now when you see it in this, for me this was the biggest thing because in most cases, it'd be corrupted officials that's allowing this, that's doing this, that be behind this.

And they would be scot-free. But I've watched so many little brothers, and I hate it because, you know, as a, when I was working as a mentor, and you, you, you, you, you around these young brothers and you get to taking a liking to them because you start learning the person that they are, you know, outside of what the, the courtroom say and what people say, you get to see how a person really is, and you know these be good people. And then you see, you know, drug addictions happen. or whatever it may be, overdose, or even if it's not overdose,

sometimes it be just, you know, a dude to get high. And then you have poor medical staff or you have ineffective administration that don't want to get medical staff or bring them medical attention. And it calls a person to die. And the first thing that they say when they covered up with the lawyers is,

oh, he killed himself, he committed suicide, or he overdosed. But that don't really be the case. The case is, yes, he did drugs, but because of your lack of a response, he died. So what that causes is you have to witness not only the dude messing his life up, you also get to see the system covered up and blame it on him. And then we all got to suffer because when somebody die, you know, the prison go on lockdown. And Elaine Hunt was notorious for this, you know, just, I mean, for the past year or two, just Google it.

Google Elaine Hunt, Google Google corruption, Google drugs, Google, whatever. And it's not just that, but all throughout the prison systems in America. So the most heinous things to me wasn't just bloodshed. You know, you see bloodshed anyway. You see that in the streets. You see it with guns. in clubs, whatever. We see it on TV all the time.

You know, blood isn't, blood doesn't, blood doesn't, you know, have the same effect for me anymore. Like seeing this mental and this spiritual war that goes on, when you see people losing their mental and spiritual lives and then crooked people capitalizing off that. That became the sixth. stuff to me over time.

And part of that was because I knew in my case, in my case, I was railroaded with, like I said, two code defendants, many charges that I did not do. And I can't distinguish between, in the courtroom, I can't distinguish and say I didn't do that, but I did that. Can't do that because I'm not taking no pleas. I'm pleading a fifth. I ain't got nothing to do with none of it. it. You know, so it put me in a hard situation, but it allowed me to see how crooked this

game is that we play if you don't know the consequences to it and really the game you plan if you don't know the rules to it. So seeing all that in prison for me was the biggest thing. You know, I've seen rapes. I've seen stranglings. But, you know, that's, you know, that's, Those are not the every single day highlights of being in prison. The highlights for me was watching a medical officer or a doctor or a nurse get fired from a hospital on the streets because of malpractice or being ineffective and then get hired in prison because they're low quality. They can pay them less and they can actually. become a manager, you know, in prison.

You can manage the medical department coming from the medical field, even though you were suspended for practice. See, that's the kind of stuff that started bothering me because I'm looking at criminals now. I'm looking at criminals put in position where they're the ones calling shots over people lives and shaping policy behind that. And what that means is my mother who pays taxes, your mother who pays taxes, our neighbors who pay taxes, putting money in his pocket to tell lies. And then if he does a bad job and give me the wrong medication, I die.

And they say, I overdose. And they use their lawyers to defend it in court. So it becomes a big, it's a big, messy, um, it's a, it's a, it's a, a big, messy war, pretty much, for lack of better words. And to me, that became a bigger atrocity than just seeing two dudes fight. See, dudes fighting, you know, that aggression, that negativity, that anger, that's going to happen because this is the environment that's created for that. You know, these gladiator camps, most of these camps now are what they call gladiator camps where every day is get your knife and let's go or give me that bag or you know this

that and the other it's aggression it's hostility is competition um it's expressions of wanting to be men wanting to conquer wanting to have power wanting to be in charge of something want to be big but for me you know it wasn't that that didn't really That didn't have as much shock value on me as when I saw this courtroom and saw who the real gangsters was. And who I saw, you know, because, you know, dudes that I used to run with, dudes you run with in prison. Doos you see every day, you know, talk, talk, talk, talk all day. There's somebody punching one time and then they done. You know, you see that all day.

But what got me was people would be ready to kill me and you. for stepping on their shoe in line, but here come a brand new warden or rank or colonel or captain or whatever, and he talked to him crazy and tell him your mama can't come to visit because I don't like how you talk to me or whatever. But you won't tell him nothing.

See, those became the big atrocities for me because not only is that physical, war or physical conditioning. It's also mental and spiritual conditioning to the point where you're seeing people just give up their life, give up the fight, give up the struggle for freedom and betterment or whatever it may be. You know, like I say, it ain't about guilt and not guilt. When it come to prison, a lot of times it's about the politics involved and the money

involved because it's a slave-making system where a few people get rich off to ignorant masses. You know, so that became the biggest thing for me. And to this day, that's my biggest enemy is the capitalistic way that or the evil way that, or the evil way of few people like geo group and what used to be whack and hood and, and, and J-Pay, Securists, all these companies where a few people can manage thousands and thousands of prisoners and their family and their debit cards and have all this excess and info and just constantly exploiting. And you got a system that actually promotes this and they do contracts with this and they actually like this kind of. of stuff. And so, you know, like I said, as I start seeing that and the fact that you'll kill me for looking at you stupid, but you won't tell them nothing when they actually raping all of us,

you know, for lack of better way, that's what it is. When you got a company that charges you by the minute to talk and by the time, you, by the time, you, time you finish talking for one hour, you just spent $10, $15, $20 for one hour. When in actuality, a cell phone is $20, $30, the flip phone prepaid and the monthly bill for a prepaid $50, you know, that's a whole month that you talk out here. But in there, to $60 don't get you three, four hours. You know, so it's exploitation in that. And for me, that was what started to take the cake.

Now, I admit, when I first got locked up, yeah, it was, it's rough when you're seeing all this stupid stuff going on and you learn it. And you got to watch yourself and you got to be respectful and you got to pay attention and you got to be aware and you got to be visiting because stuff happened. It never stops because you're dealing with. mental health. You're dealing with these conditions of confinement in a, like a laboratory, like they do with rats. When they put them in the lab, they see how they behave. And prisons is like big laboratories. So I expect that. But like I said, the things that when you ask the question, you know, what did I see?

The things that I hated to see the most was how the system capitalizes off those who lack resources. knowledge, information, awareness, and they'll never believe that this, when I say the system, I'm talking about these orchestrators and administrators, they'll never believe that this church-going warden will do the things that he'll do for his job or his political party or whatever it may be.

They'll never believe that. And so as I started seeing that, it became my main enemy, you know, corruption because I used to work for many people. You know, in prison, you're going to work stupid jobs. You work in kitchens, you work in laundry rooms, you work around offices. You work around these people. So I hear you, on one hand, all the... offer me alcohol or drugs or money or offer me contraband or you do this and that. But when the cameras come out, oh, these prisoners are no good.

We need to build another jail. You know, I hate that. That became my biggest enemy because that was part of my case, but it's been part of so many other cases that I've seen. And over time, that hypocrisy becomes a bigger enemy than this little small everyday stuff that's going on. Because at the end of the day, it's not me paying taxes. My family paying taxes, you know. How did you do your time?

Everyone has like a different way of doing their prison time. What kind of time were you on? When I first started my time, like I said, I was young and dumb, you know, 21 years old when I came in, still running the streets, still love gangs, still love drugs. My first couple of years, really, I was ignorant, didn't know anything, didn't know myself, didn't know God, wasn't trying to know none of that. So I thought that my ignorant way of thinking was, you know, that was it. You know, everybody has their own truth. Everybody has their own opinion. That philosophy, that was where I was at.

And I did a lot of stuff that was stupid. I mean, I've been hit with tasers. I've been here with the water holes. I didn't have the dogs at my door in the cell block. Because, you know, just stupid stuff. And rebellious and not want accountability. You know, my first couple of years were rougher. You know, called a couple of write-ups, gotten a couple of fights.

You know, just I didn't fully understand or know myself and know the situation. So my first couple of years were rougher. I was just gambling, drugs, you know. I loved blackjack. That was my favorite game. I love to take my money and take my commissary. And, yeah, let's get it. So I say the first three, you know, when I was thinking that I'm going to go to court

and win my case because I'm knowing that my case is railroaded and not making sense. And that's why the jurors didn't even agree that I was guilty. When I thought I could win off a logic like that, it wasn't as serious to me because I figured, oh, yeah, I got this beat. You know, even the lawyer told me they shouldn't have won and it should be a mistrial. But what I didn't know was, that's just how this system is. And so as I started, like I said, understanding my time started flipping. I started living different, thinking different, doing different.

And it took great individuals that never gave up on me to pour into me and see potential. You know, I read the autobiography of Malcolm X. It changed my life. 2003. I became Muslim. Never looked back. You know, that allowed me to see. another side of life that I've never seen,

but another side of prison that I've never seen. And that changed my behavior because I went from gambling to not gambling no more. Went from the drugs to we're leaving this alone because we're seeing what it's doing. I went from, you know, being more disrespectful towards women to, nah, we ain't doing that no more. We're going to start respecting them.

It made me proud to be black. It made me proud to, not proud to be a prisoner, you know, in a sense that I'm just naive, but it made me proud to be a person that's knowing that I'm fighting, you know, even though I'm in prison. I started with learning a law. I learned a lot about the law. I did a lot of law where I never went to get officially accredited with no degrees. But I learned a lot of the law, a lot of certificates. So as I started learning, knowledge of self and knowledge of what's going on,

that changed everything for me because, like I said, I see a bigger picture now. I'm looking at corporate level crime and corruption. I'm looking at stolen or fraudulent elections, you know, when it come to judges and mayors and all that, and how judges not supposed to be. politically involved. So I would say that my fourth and fifth year, everything changed and I become more educated,

more conscious, more productive, more positive. I didn't look at life the same anymore after that. And it changed the way I behaved, the way I walked, the way I taught. Who I am today is not who I was in 2001. And people that knew me back then can't believe who I am today because of that. So how I live was to answer that question depends on what time we're talking about. Because when I started, I wasn't conscious at all.

I didn't even believe in a God. Now I live for God. So it changed with the knowledge and information, awareness, and putting it into practice. So my last four or five years, I was teaching young people, you know, helping young people. I'm a published author today because of that. So if you asked me, if you were to ask me that, you know, 20 years ago, I couldn't answer that. I never saw myself educate nobody. I barely had a GED.

I couldn't read like that. I wasn't smart. I wasn't teaching. I didn't care. But now that's my passion. And my behavior and character and conduct changed accordingly with my knowledge, my awareness changing. This podcast is sponsored by IQ Bar. Not to be a stereotype or anything, but I am one of those go, go, go girls.

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Excuse me. What is this? 25? I got out of prison six months ago. Wow. Yeah. June 14th, 2024. How many years?

How many years? I did 23. So you did the full 23? No, I actually had 36. I just didn't do all 36. I went home on parole after serving 23. when I reached 45 years of age, which was June 14th to last year, my birthday,

I came home on parole. Oh, welcome home. Oh, thank you. It's a great welcome because it's been a blessing because I've made a lot, you know, a lot of progress. And I'm doing better in my transition, and I'm surrounded by a great team of support. I mean, you met my fiancé, you know, beautiful, intelligent,

helpful. My mother, same way. She's helping in communities with young women coming through troubled lives and addictions and struggling. My sister, again, she promotes reading and education. She's a manager at a university. So I'm surrounded by intelligence. I'm surrounded by help, a team that really cares. So it's helping my transition. And, you know, shout out to people. like the Parole Project in Louisiana, who does a lot of reentry work and making sure that people coming home have a chance to succeed without just, you know, kicking them to the curb because they've been in prison. Like many, many businesses and corporations do. People like Walmart, McDonald's, you know, I've been turned down on all kind of jobs when I came home

with the skillsets that I had and ability to communicate and ability to maintain patience. And, you You know, they turned me down to choose people that you know ain't fin to do no work. You know, dudes come to work high and looking all crazy. They hire them. But me, I couldn't even get a job at McDonald's. And that's crazy. Two McDonald's turned me down. So, you know, shout out to all the prison reform groups all over this country

that work to make sure that people like me can come home and have another chance after incarceration, you know, facing the stigmas, facing the stereotypes, facing the hidden discriminations that go on, facing the old enemies and the old friends, and facing the haters and the naysayers, and facing these fake politicians that use your name for their purposes, you know, for whatever opposition, there's people that are helping to try to make sure that people like me, and you know, You. And shout out to you for doing this, what you do, you know, straight up because they got people

that come out of prison that have resources that don't do a damn thing. And didn't have people that come out that don't have much that wish they could do more. So shout out to everybody that helps because I've received a lot of help, you know, with you got, you got groups that provide and help with food. clothing and shelter, your basics. And when you don't have that, it makes it hard to do anything else. If you even got a house, a roof over your head,

clothes on your back, and food to eat, it's kind of hard to go to work for anybody. And so shout out to the parole project and the innocence project, Promise of Justice, different Louisiana groups, different cure groups, Innocence Project across the country that's trying to correct these old cases

and get these dudes free that need to be free. Shout out to all of them. So, yeah, when I got out June 14th of this past year, I was determined to never go back and always make sure I reach back to people that are still there trying to get their freedom because I remember the days when I wanted mine. and I needed somebody to help me.

So I try to, you know, live by that today. So I got out in June, and I ain't looked back since. What do you do now for work? Right now I'm a porter. I work for a Nissan dealership right now. That's the job I have now. When I first got out, I couldn't find a job for like two months. And I eventually had some help from, you know, down in Louisiana, the prison reform groups.

I think the parole project was one of them where my first job, I worked for an agency that helped with the elderly population. I was cooking. But I found a better job working for a car dealership. So I work for Nissan right now. That's awesome. Yeah, training to sell cars. Well, you're a smooth talker, so you're going to get that. there. Well, thank God because some, I used, good word, you know, smooth because I used to be

rough. You know, I used to couldn't put a sentence together that was intelligent. You know, I used to stutter in Oz and Arms and I couldn't complete a thought and it wouldn't make sense. And so I'm really grateful for communication skills because I believe all prisoners need that. For one thing, we labeled as if we're incapable. We're labeled as all these negative names and stereotypes because of prison. And one thing that we have to do as prisoners and ex-prisoners is learn how to speak up for ourselves. Because what courtrooms teach you is that unless you got a lot of money and power,

ain't nobody represent you in court and nobody representing you in life. So you got to learn to talk and represent yourself and speak for yourself because if not, they got people that's going to speak up against you and use that against you. You know, even in the court of law, if you plead the fifth in some courts, they're going to make that turn into guilt. You know, you look guilty. And the right DA going to spin it like that. So I've learned to one of my primary focuses,

throughout my incarceration and trying to rehabilitate myself, trying to teach myself, was getting involved with Toastmasters and different groups like JCs and different positive, productive groups that were giving me some type of skill that I can use. So one skill that we all need is effective communication because without communication,

no relationship can stand. And that's business, that's social, that's moral, whatever it may be, family. All relationships depend on communication. Even you with your judge. You know, people that have to, we got to deal with parole officers. And you got to be able to talk to them, you know, whether you like them or not, they ain't got nothing to do with it.

But if this man, the signing of his pen, determine your freedom or your punishment, you got to learn to talk to people and, and help yourself to find the best situations or the best outcomes in your situation. So effective communication is very, very critical to success. And I'm very thankful that God bless me to be around people that help me and pointed stuff out.

Like, hey, stop saying, um, so much and stop cussing. You know, I used to cuss. You know, stop doing that. Stop doing that. I still have a problem. I'll be looking off, but, you know, people train to stop doing that. And it takes those small nuggets of love and attention and care and concern that really helps us to become better.

So I've been blessed over time to have good family and friends and people that really did care. and they help you to do better. So I could never forget the value of that. And I think if more people could understand the value of a support team, you know, a network, man, if we could have more networks and more team building, we'll see more effectiveness in our communities and in the prison population as a whole.

You know, you wouldn't see as many deaths and murders. You wouldn't see as many rapes happen. You wouldn't see as many overdoses happen and people throwing their lives away and giving up hope and committing suicide. You wouldn't see that if we have more networks, more team building. So that's what I'm all about today. What advice would you give to your teenage self if you could stand next to him and go back in time? Sit down, shut up and listen. You know, just repeatedly.

Sit down, shut up and listen. And in that order. Sit down. Stop running around. Stop trying to get involved in everything. Sit down. Just be still. And shut up so you can hear.

You can pay attention. And not only do I need you to hear what I'm saying, I need you to listen with your mind actively, trying to understand, see the logic and wisdom and apply it in your life as if you know I'm telling the truth. Sit down, shut up, listen. because if I had done that, it wouldn't have took me 23 years to, you know, put my life on track. I wouldn't have to serve all that time away from my family had I listened in.

Stephen, thank you so much for coming today, man. This was an incredible interview, and, you know, it's definitely going to inspire a lot of individuals. And, you know, I wish you the best, and thanks so much for coming. And we'll have your book that you've published. Is that available online? I'm glad you asked that because, yes, it is available online. Surviving in incarceration by Stephen Tweedle. You know, my sister helped me publish it.

It is available on Amazon and a few more sites. I'm just simple to find. I'm the only person I think in America with that title and that name. So it's easy to find. But for you, I forgot to mention earlier. And my fiance has it right now, thinking of purse, we have a gift for you. Oh, awesome. You know, appreciation for you bringing me on and having this discussion because I really like the work that you've done.

I just learned about you this year, you know, within the past couple of months. So since then, I've been checking stuff out and, you know, checking out what you do. I really like what you do and come in here to see all this. This is really great how you've turned your time. your learning into helping other people to grow and helping other people to, you know, to like I call transition more effectively. Because they're like I said, they got many people that don't give a damn about us when we come home from prison.

Oh, you did the crime, you do the time. You know, that's the bed you make you lay in. And, you know, all these cliches is BS. A lot of times people go to prison because we don't know no better. we don't have the opportunities, the resources. Sometimes we just make stupid choices and don't have nobody there to really mentor us. So seeing you do something like this,

this is really what mentorship is all about, telling your 17-year-old self or your 17-year-old neighbor what they need to hear that's going to help them and not just saying, yeah, you're doing a good job, you know, you're doing a good job in second place and third place. that's BS.

So I'm really proud of what you do and I appreciate it. And as a token, I know it's not much, but I do have a gift for you. Thank you, Stephen. I mean, we appreciate all the gifts the guests bring as you see in the studio.

Like every, all the knickknacks are a piece of a guest. And we're just going to continue to add on to that. And we'll have the link to your book and the description in this episode. That's all. So people could check that out. Okay, please do. And remember, it's not even about the money.

It's about the knowledge and information because the more our families and our people know, the better off we can do. So I thank you. Appreciate you. Well said.