Locked In with Ian Bick - Ex Con Mom On Surviving Federal Prison | Jessica Bell

Episode Date: November 27, 2023

Jessica Bell shares how she got wrapped up in a federal indictment, what is was like to be sent to a women's federal prison and how she survived a 5 year sentence. Follow Ian Bick on Instagram: @ian_bick & Snapchat: ianbick Connect with Jessica Bell: FB: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61553763932724&mibextid=LQQJ4d IG: https://instagram.com/jessie_belllll Buy Merch: https://lockedinbrand.com Use code lockedin at checkout to get 20% off your order Connect with Ian Bick: https://www.ianbick.com 00:00:00 - Intro 00:02:15 - Growing Up on Dairy Farms 00:04:35 - Life after High School 00:06:46 - Introduction to Using 00:09:00 - The Effects of Using 00:11:20 - Falling into Addiction and Escaping Childhood Trauma 00:13:31 - Childhood Trauma and Escape through Drug Use 00:15:54 - Struggling with Using and Divorce 00:18:19 - Starting as a small-time drug dealer 00:20:34 - Dealing and Money Making 00:22:57 - Evading the Feds while Frog Gigging 00:25:08 - The Moment of Being Caught 00:27:18 - On the Run and Hiding 00:29:30 - The Chase Begins 00:31:49 - The Pizza Incident 00:34:10 - Arrested and Detained 00:36:22 - Women Dating in Prison 00:38:21 - Life in County Jail 00:40:41 - Going to Trial and the Outcome 00:43:02 - Women's Prison Camp and Average Sentences 00:45:26 - Relationships with Prison Guards 00:47:53 - Hooking Up in Women's Prison 00:50:14 - Creative Hustles in Prison 00:52:25 - Getting a Prison Tattoo and Life in Prison 00:54:44 - Living Conditions in Federal Prison Camp 00:56:59 - Visiting in Prison 00:59:17 - Life After Prison 01:01:36 - Adjusting to Life After Prison 01:03:44 - Overcoming Trauma and Using it as Motivation 01:08:21 - A Comfortable Interview Experience Powered by Creative Evolution Studios https://creativeevolutionstudios.com Produced by: https://www.instagram.com/shanedanahy https://www.shanedanahy.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In a county jail, you have these basically, like, a bunch of people, a bunch of women that, like, just don't care. They're crazy, ratchet. Like, the showers have no curtains. Everybody's watching you shower. And these girls, like, come and they post up with their chair. Like, you have an assigned chair. And you carry it over, and they just, like, they're sitting there watching you shower. This is so weird.

So you'll be in the shower and they pull a chair? Yes. And they put it in front. Right in front of the shower. And is that? What are you doing? Are you, like, are you intimidated by that? Like, what do you do?

It's like, you just put on a show or something? Like, what? On today's episode, we have Jessica Bell, a former addict and dealer on the show to share her story of getting wrapped up in a federal indictment, getting sentenced to five years in federal prison and what life was like within the prison walls. Remember, everyone, you can grab your official locked-in gear just in time for the holiday season. Use code locked in at checkout for 20% off your order. That's code locked in at checkout for 20% off your order.

your order. Thank you everyone for the love and support week after week, and I hope you sit back, relax, and get ready to lock in with Jessica Bell. Jessica, yes. Welcome to the show. Nice to be here. How are you today? I'm good. How are you? Good, comfortable. You need a pillow or anything? No, I got one. I'm all perched up. I love the boots. Thanks. Yeah, those are very stylish. It's my thing. That's your thing? Yeah. Awesome. So let's start at the beginning of your story. You have an insane story. You are one of the few women we've had on the show that have been to federal prison. We've had a couple others who are actually both in the Danbury federal prison.

You know the notorious one. You weren't at the Danbury one, so this will be a little bit different. But yeah, take us from the top. Where are you from? Where do you grow up? What's like childhood like for you? Okay. So I was born and raised in South Florida, a small town called Okachobi, very backwoods.

You know, everybody kind of like lives off the land. They still hunt and fish there today to make a living. It's fishing. It's dairies. It's just, you know, small town stuff. And let's see. My parents, they both work dairy farms. My dad was a, he still is to this day, a cow breeder.

He breeds cows. So he fathers a lot of children. And my mom, she milked. So, yeah, and I have three siblings, two brothers and a sister and yeah this is so bad no you're great

you're killing it already how'd uh how'd you guys grow up rich poor middle class so the dairy farms they don't pay much money like what they do is they they build small cheap houses and um they let the workers live there for free you pay your lights and whatever but still it's not a lot of money

so um we were poor and my parents kind of worked like opposite shifts so it was kind of There were no real role models around. My dad worked 12 hours. He'd come home and sleep, and my mom would do the same on opposite shifts. So, sorry, I'm super nervous. I'm making this bad for your editor, so.

You're totally good. Who are you closer to your mother or your father? Now, probably my father. What about back then? Back then, my mother, because, like, she's crazy. She is, she's crazy. And she does, you know, she's on drugs. And back then we got along better because I was.

too, you know. We were just running around doing crazy stuff and that's now it's just like I can't even really carry a conversation with her without being like, okay, this is enough. What about your siblings? Were you close with them growing up? No, not at all. Well, no. No, I feel like my sister hated my guts for a long time. I wasn't sure why. She's a little bit older than me. Well, I'm the youngest, so, uh, and my brothers, like, we've never been close. Never. I don't know. How, how would your friends describe you back then. Were you shy? Were you outgoing?

Were you like the fun, you know, enthusiastic one? So I'm super shy until you get to know me. And then I think I'm silly. I think they would say I'm silly and kind of like back then airheaded. You know, just go with the flow kind of person. Yeah. And did you go to public schooling, I'm assuming? I did.

And what was that like? Public school? For you, for your perspective of it. I don't. I don't really remember a lot of. school like high school I remember um so yeah kind of like sixth grade that's sixth grade and up i can remember uh i moved to gainsville florida yes with my mother when i was in the sixth grade your parents got divorced yeah my parents did get divorced actually they were never married um

my mom left when i was six and then i don't remember seeing her again so i was like 11 and um so yeah i moved to Pennsylvania, Florida, and it was a shock, like Okeechobee small town, and I knew one black kid growing up. And when I got there, like, it was definitely culture shock. There are, you know, all kinds of people in this. I'm wearing boots and wranglers, and everybody's wearing bell bottoms and, like, Nikes, and I had no idea, like, what was going on. Did kids make fun of you for the way you dress? Not that I know of. They probably did, you know. But you were you. You like to be you and who you were?

Yeah, no, actually, it bothered me because, you know, I felt like, you know, I'm different. know, I want to fit in. So, you know, I went to the Goodwill and bought some bell bottoms and some used nikes and try to fit in. And what about college? Did you end up going to college? I did, but not so much later in life. Later in life, okay. After prison.

After prison. Yeah. So after high school, what did you get into? Did you work? What was life like? After high school, I went into the military. I joined the army when I was 17. You're in the army?

Yeah. Why the army? Um, you know, I was like, you know, this tough girl. I wanted to be a Marine, but it didn't work out that way because I felt like, you know, people say they're jar heads. You're first in. You're fur to die. So I was like, maybe I'll just join the Army. I was like a tough girl and, and, you know, you grow up poor.

You want to, like, those are your options, you know, to get out of your, you know, what you grew up in. So that was, that's it for me, the Army. How long were you in the Army for? Not long. I, like a year, maybe a little over a year. I met my husband when I was on leave, my ex-husband, and got pregnant and got out. Okay, and they let you just leave because you got pregnant? Yes. Oh, so that automatically disqualifies you once you get pregnant. Right. Okay. Well, I mean, it does automatic. You get to choose, you know, you sign this child over to your parents or somebody that can take care of them or you can go home.

And when you were in the Army, what did you do? I was a military police officer. You were a military police officer? Really? Yeah. That's so cool. Yeah. Did you enjoy it?

I loved it. I was so good at it. Yeah. Isn't it funny that you would go from military police officer to federal inmate? Yes. It's insane, right? And so after you got out of the military, you're married now with a child and a husband. Yes.

So I'm going to go back a little bit. So while I was growing up, like I started doing drugs really all. In high school? In like middle school. What kind of drugs are we talking about in middle school? Meth was the first thing that I've ever tried. Meth is really the only thing that I've done. When I was 11, my stepmom and my sister were like in the bedroom smoking, getting high.

And mind you, my sister's only like two years older than me, two and a half years older than me. So she was super young too. But they're in the bedroom getting high. I have no idea what's going on. I'm just like, do, do, do, do this little, you know, this little, you know, airheaded 11-year-old running around. and they call me in the bedroom and they're like, here, try this. And, you know, I hit it. I smoked out of a light bulb.

I hit it twice and then I like went and cleaned the house. I never questioned it. It's like, it wasn't until, like, a little bit later. I was like, why would they do that? Like, did they think that I saw them and I was going to tell on them or, you know, like, I just don't know why you would smoke with an 11-year-old? But, yeah. So this is the first time I'd done math.

Wow. Yeah. Do you have hatred towards your mother now for... My stepmother? Yeah, for giving you, uh, introducing that to you? Um, no, I don't. Just because if it wasn't her, I would have done it with somebody else. And I, I know that kind of sounds weird.

Like, it wasn't right. And I just, I will never understand. But like, I don't know who she is now, but then she wasn't the greatest person. So. What was that feeling like for you when you did it for the first time? How did it feel to smoke meth for the first time? Yeah. I mean, I've never smoked meth, so I don't know what it's like.

Have you ever done Molly? I've never done Molly. I've only ever done weed. Okay. So, all right, so the very opposite of weed. So it feels great. You get a rush, you know, huge rush, and you're super happy. It's like everything good.

All your endorphins start flowing and, you know, you're energetic, you're happy. It's like everything good in the world. It hits you all at one time. And now, that's the stuff that can cause, like, scars on your body and whatever? Yeah, like, people get, like, tweaked out. and, you know, people pick and think there's bugs. I think a prolonged use or maybe somebody that can't, like, mentally handle. And I know that sounds crazy because, like, it's meth.

But they think that things are crawling or they just want to pick, you know, pimples or whatever. Like, and they cause scars because they just don't stop. Were you using meth while you're in the military? No, no. You got clean for that. Right. So it's like in Okachobi, I smoked meth. But, like, when I moved to Gainesville, I was a different person.

There was no meth. There was no drugs. So, yeah. Why do you think that was? Probably the people, the people I surrounded myself with or my family that was there. So just a change in scenery was able to... Yeah, absolutely. Wow. Yeah.

So you get back into meth after the military? Yes. What was the trigger? I think that just because I was so used to doing it, and I was in Okochobe, you know, back in Okochobe. you know, back in Okoshobe, and it's just, you know, all the people that I see there, they're doing it. Everybody I know, basically, and Okoshobe smokes a mess. So, you know, it's the same thing. Like, I'm hanging out with the people, you know, you get all these kind of, like, old feelings about smoking.

And it's just like, my husband did it. Oh, your husband did it? Yeah. So I was like, why not? And when does it reach, like, the level that you're addicted to it? Or were you never really addicted in your own mind back then? I think that, yeah, I don't think I was addicted because I could go and just not do it and not even think about it. You know, I'm not like Jonesing and trying to get it.

It wasn't until like two years before I was indicted that I was just like out there. And how long later would that happen? That was years later, eight years later? So what happens in between military and eight years that you end up federally indicted? Because you're how old when you're out of the military? 20? Mm-hmm. Okay, so you're about 20.

So this eight year span of time, what's like the first step into that, like you cross over to the other side, I guess you could call it? Yeah, no, everything was going good when I got married. You know, we cleaned up. We decided to clean up. We got married. Had my daughter. And we were clean for a long time. Well, I say a long time for a few years.

And, you know, you have that one friend that comes over and it's like, hey, what's up? You know, and life was going good. And we were hunting. We had a guide service. We took people hog hunting for a living. And, you know, that's going well. We're killing like 12, 13, 15 hogs a day. And the friend comes over and says, hey, look when I got.

Check this out, you know. And we had a serious conversation about it. You know, it's an addict conversation now that I look back. But we talked about it and we're like, we came to the conclusion that you were doing so well. Why not? Yeah, hi. one night. You know, it's right here. So that was it. You know, smoke one night, you get high the next night and the next night, and then it just keeps going. Do you think that there's

something like that happened traumatically in your childhood that wanted you to like have this escape with drugs at all? Absolutely. Yeah. What do you think, what do you think it was? Have you ever thought about it? Um, there are probably a few things that, um, you know, that kind of like bring me to that like comfort zone, you know, doing meth. It's, um, when I was, 12 my I didn't realize it then I thought I was a big girl hanging out with you know the adults but my Aunt Joanne basically like pimp me out to the drug dealer and I remember lying about my age I said I was 13 instead of 12 not that I made a difference it doesn't make a difference like you're a dirtbag you're a 27 year old guy you know you know my aunt would just call him on the phone like hey

you know guess who's here and he would come over and throw her some dope and we I would ride around with him for days and, you know, while he's selling drugs and hang out. Now, when you're saying, pimp out like this is, like, sexual activity? Not at first, but, yeah, eventually it got to that. And you didn't know exactly what was happening? No, because, I mean, I was a big girl. I was hanging out. I thought I was an adult.

So, like, nothing, you know, about her pimping me out or, like, her selling me, it just never crossed my mind because I was more, you know, engulfed in hanging out with the grownups. How long did that go on for? Probably a span of like three years. Three years? Yeah. Wow.

Yeah. That's terrible. It's insane, right? And your mom intervened in this? No, my mom was gone at this point. She was in Gainesville. Okay. So it was just my dad.

And my dad is the kind of person that like if something is not right in front of your face, like it's not there. It doesn't exist, you know? So I don't think. And true, like another thing is that he didn't know what was. going on. He had no idea. Would he have done something if he knew? Probably. And do you think, like, the drug use was an escape from those memories at all?

Um, I think that, yeah, yeah, it was. The childhood, like, you know, I don't have many memories, but, like, when I think about it, I think about, you know, my parents fighting over money. Like, we have never had money. And, um, so what? So my brother molested me when I was 11. So I think that was probably a big trigger. That was just like, okay, you know, this is much better.

I love the way I feel when I do this, you know. I love hanging out with people when I do this. It's just, and you just don't think about life. It was an escape. It was an escape. It was my blanket, my safety blanket. The only problem with the escape is it could become addictive. Yeah.

Whether you know it or not in the time. It does. It's bad. Do you think if, like, you had a stable family member there, this would have ended up differently for you? Like a sound home, like, I guess, normal family you could call it. Not that any family is necessarily normal, but something a little bit more, you know, structured and comforting. I do think that things would have changed if there were somebody there. But then again, like, I think that my life was, like, you know, chaotic for a child.

Would I have noticed somebody trying to be. to help if there were somebody, which I don't think there was. But, you know, I may have just been like, you know, this is the way I live. This is life. This is how I've grown up. Like, this is what I know. So what I've listened, I don't know. Yeah. So you're married, you're using again with your friend. When does it transition into selling drugs? Because that's like the first crime aspect to your story that happens. Right. It's not so much later. You know, I was married for oh god like six years okay six years and it wasn't until we separated that i started selling drugs what did he do for work um we hunted hogs that's a job yeah we had a guide service like if you're

from connecticut and you want to hunt a hog but you don't know how to do it we take you yeah yeah okay yeah and was that lucrative did you make money yeah yeah it's good okay so you guys are like two hillbilly type people exactly yeah hunted hogs Listen, my story is like swamp people and what's that other story about meth? I know what you're talking about. Like, they have a TV show, right? Yes. Yeah.

It's that combined, whatever that is. I forget. I've never heard the female version of it, though, so this is interesting. Yeah. Okay, so you guys get divorced. Why do you guys decide to get divorced? We got divorced because we were strung out on drugs and you didn't know. like he's doing pills he doesn't want to work like i i'm on meth and it's just it's just all bad you know

there's people around all the time influencing like your your marriage and it's just not good and are your parents in your life at all at this point because you're what 26 um no yeah yeah because i got indicted i think i was 28 um yeah i guess you could say but they don't know what's going on they don't know. It's not like, hey, you know, I call my mom every couple of days and let her know the tea. But, yeah. Do you have enough money to pay for both your drug habit and to live off of, or are you guys kind of struggling? No, life was easy. We, you know, we had land. We had a house. You know, we bought a house. And the money that we had coming in was, you know, we didn't have any overhead, you know, not really. So it was easy at first. It always is at first. But then, you know, you do drugs and you don't

want to go to work and you're not making money, so then it becomes an issue. We're almost halfway through the year, and a lot of people are running on empty without fully realizing it. Grow therapy helps you find care that's covered by insurance before burnout becomes the baseline. Whether it's your first time in therapy or your 50th, grow makes it easier to find a therapist who fits you, not the other way around. They connect you with thousands of independent licensed therapists across the U.S., offering both virtual and in-person sessions nights and weekends. You can search by what matters like insurance, specialty, identity, or availability, and get started in as little as two days. And if something comes up, you can cancel

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I think that I've always kind of like done like nickel and dime stuff, you know, just a little quick flip. But it wasn't until like I said, like two years before I got indicted. A friend of mine actually approached me

and he had a key in the back of the car. He's like, yo, meet me at the store. Let's talk, you know, are you still in the same business? I'm like, yeah, you know? And so I meet him at the store and he's like, you think you can push this? I was like, yeah. I think I can. So, you know, he gives me half.

Get rid of it, and it just kind of went from there. Did you have an advantage because you were a woman as a dealer? Absolutely. So do you think guys would pay more money or? They probably would. They probably would. But, I mean, I was a bad drug dealer. What do you mean by bad?

I'm too nice, you know? I'm like, here you go, just take it. Don't worry about it. You know what I mean? You don't make money that way. Was it dangerous to be a woman drug dealer? I think it's dangerous for anybody to be a drug dealer. But yeah, it could be.

You know, there are people. We got robbed down in Homestead once. You got robbed? Describe the robbery. So it was early in the morning, and we had two rooms. And, you know, we would leave them open in the morning, going back and forth. And it was super early, like, before the sun was up. And two people came in and just, like, calm down.

This is a robbery. You know, stay calm, put a pillow over your face, and just went through the room and left. Do they tie you up or anything? No, they just put the pillow on your face. So when someone's holding you down and... I'm not trying to move. I mean, I know I'm tough, but I'm not taking on these guys. What did they get?

They didn't really get anything. It took a bunch of pills, a bunch of pills. So you're moving pills too at this time? Yeah, but it wasn't like a big, big thing. Like if I got a good deal, you know, on pills, like they're not like they are now. You could get 30s for like six bucks back then and sell them for 15. So now they're just insane. And where's your kid at this time?

My kid is with her dad. Okay. Yeah. You guys had no relationship? No, yeah. We're still good friends. We've always remained good friends. And are you using actively during your drug dealing?

Yes. So how does that affect you in the business and stuff? Because they always say you shouldn't use while high on your own supply. It's true. It's not good. Like, you know, you're getting high with everybody, you know, hanging out. And like, you're the cool guy. It's just, it's no good.

know and you have it at your disposal. Are you making any money, like serious money, or is this just, like, petty drug dealing? I think that for a very short period of time, I was making okay money. That's when I wasn't, like, too strong out. But it didn't last long. Easy come, easy go, you know what I mean? It's just... How much money are we talking?

Listen, I don't... I don't really know, because I don't really know. know, like honestly. I'm getting like, at first I'm just getting like a couple ounces at a time for like 800 bucks and I'm reselling them whole as, you know, at $2,000, $3,000. So I mean, whatever that adds up to because I usually like just dealt in ounces. So. So you aren't this like queen pin, yeah, kingpin type woman. Right. So in my case, like there are a bunch of us. And It's just like this whole group. And surprisingly, they're like half women. You know, you don't really hear that. And even my prosecutor was surprised. He's like, I've never seen that in any case.

But we were all. Like, there were 65 people that went down in my case. And how many of those did you actually know? Oh, I knew almost all of them. Really? Yeah. Normally in these, like, drug cases, you never know like any of the people on your indictment. Oh, no.

I know. basically almost every single person. Maybe five I didn't know personally, but I've heard of. Wow. Yeah. But we were all, like, basically the same. You had this man guy, his name was Wildman, you know, this hillbilly that wears overalls. And he's just, you know, going through the Tri-County and passing him out.

So how extensively were the cops looking for you? We were, like I said, we were such a problem that, you know, they were pulling us over for every little thing. Things that weren't even true. Like, we got pulled over like three times for the tent on the car being too dark. And like the fourth time they pulled us over and were like, what are you doing? Where are you pulling us over for? Like, you guys are just being insane. And we pulled you over for your tent.

Like, no, we got smart. We took the tent off the window. There's no tent. And you're telling me you pulled me over for a tent. you know um there was another time we were out gaking frogs on the lake on the airboat and you know we pull over to kind of like hang out and rest for a minute and maybe get high i don't know but um we just pulled over shut off the engine and then a beam a light boom hits us and it's the feds you know or probably the game commission uh so this this my buddy has like a blackout switch

you know the motor runs but all the lights are out a little So we're running and I'm just like terrified. You know, we're going to hit something or like we're not going to get away. They're running an airboat 10 times, you know, bigger than ours. And yeah, that was pretty insane. This is all while you're on the run from them. This was not while I was on the run. This was before I was even indicted.

And they're just, why are they after you like this? Because they know what we're doing. They've been investigating us for 18 months. Like if they can get us doing this, you know. So you're running, it's like in the movies where you run through the swamp. people like with a big fan on the back of the... That's insane. And they're all like chasing you down.

Yes. Wow. And we got away. And you got a crazy part. How do you even get away with that if they're gunning for you? My buddy is like he has been running this lake for his whole life. He knows it like the back of his hand. Like anybody else would be just lost and we would have been caught.

Yeah. It was insane. So how do you first find out that the feds are investigating you? I had no idea. So listen, I don't. didn't even know what an indictment was when I found out I was indicted. It's okay. I didn't either. I was so naive and, you know, I thought, like, I would never get caught because I was a nobody.

And if anything, I had a good record, you know, the military, which is shitty of me to use that as, you know, whatever. But, yeah, I thought I would never get caught. And I was actually at my ex-husbands visiting my daughter because I had just got arrested two days prior. which is another story I'm getting to, but and his roommate comes in and she's screaming, oh my God, they just busted my dad, they just busted my dad. And, you know, just waking up like, what?

She's like, yeah, they got my dad. There's a whole list of people and you're on it. And I'm like, what? She's like, yeah, somebody posted the indictment on Facebook. It's just I'm reading through it. It's a 10 count indictment. You know, everybody's being charged with count one. You know, conspiracy to possess and distribute 50 grams or more.

Like, yeah, that was the first time. I even, I was like, what is this? I'm going to prison for 10 years. Like, I couldn't wrap my head around. I just didn't feel real. That's how much time you were facing? Um, yeah, everybody in it, you know, they say that like, you know, that count, whatever count one carries 10 to life. So they didn't physically come arrest you yet, though?

No, but the only reason they didn't, it was because I was not at the place they thought I was at. I had left early in the morning. Um, I was actually with another girl that was, um, on the case. We were walking down the road the night before and I was going to stay with her that night and for some reason ended up not staying. I went and you know saw my daughter and uh yeah they sent out like six teams maybe more of like six people six guys and arrested everybody at the same time at 4 a.m. And because I wasn't where they thought I was they're like where is she you know what I mean. But when she came in, they got her dad already, and I was like, fuck, what do I do?

You know, I need to go somewhere else away from my daughter. You know, I kissed her goodbye. I told her I was going to prison. She asked me for my phone. She said, can I have your phone? I was like, are you serious? No. And yeah, I just left.

I went to a friend's house that nobody would really, you know, associate me with. And I ran for like 20 days. You're on the run for 20 days? So are you, like, scared? I think I'm more concerned with figuring out what's going on and if I can get out of it. But yeah, I mean, I guess I was kind of scared. I knew I was going to get arrested. I was going to turn myself in eventually because my thoughts were like each day that I run is a day longer away from my kids.

Because like I'm going to have to go to this whole process and it's just stupid. What are you doing? You're going to get caught. So I was more concerned with, you know, figuring out what's going on. If I could get a lawyer, if I could get out of it. Where were you like hiding out? I worked for a CPA and, you know, she does everything right and I stayed in her pool house. Yeah.

And she allowed, she knew you were on the run? She did. Well, you said she does everything right. Right. Well, I mean, she knew what I was going through. Okay. And, you know, she's not going to say here she is. But, yeah, they kicked in my dad's door, which is where I was living at that time.

my sister's house. Another place that, you know, I was all over the place. We call this house is Granny's house. My husband's, my ex-husbands, I keep saying that. And that was, they did that twice. They went to all their places twice. And what was it?

I went to, I eventually went to Ocala because I didn't want to get this person in trouble, this CPA in trouble, by being there. So I decided I'd go to Ocala And that's my grandmother's place So I'm staying there And you know, I'm telling them like what's going on My grandmother doesn't want me there

You know, I get a little upset but like I understand But at that point I was just like All right, so where am I going to go? You know, my mom's trying to put me on a semi truck With some guy, she just met online or something Something big and to like travel country with this guy I don't know It's like, what do you do mom?

I have no money he's going to be taking care of me he's going to want something for taking care of me what are you doing I'm not doing that you're insane but no my yeah my grandmother wants me to leave and so

you know I get upset I go for a walk trying to figure out things it's Ocala's very woodsy and my aunt Chris probably lives like three blocks down the road and as I'm walking

two black helicopters are hovering and my mom catches up with me she's like you know are you okay whatever and so yeah the two I'm like those are for me so I like dip into my Aunt Chris's yard very very wooded and like they have cars like it's an old junkyard

and I climb into this old musty car with mosquitoes and so I can't like hear the helicopter anymore so I'm like fuck what am I going to do so I go back to my grandmother's house and I'm just like I'm just going to go back back to Okachobi, you know, back to Okochib. And I knew once I did that, that, like, I would be caught.

Like, on my way to Ocala, my buddy that was driving me wanted to stop at a hotel and stay the night. And, like, I don't think we should. It's a bad idea. Because, like, I had this feeling. Like, they were on my trail, like, the whole time. I wasn't, like, intentionally, you know, avoiding them, I guess you could say, or running. But I guess I was just one step ahead.

And he wanted to stop this hotel in Wildwood, and I was like, it's not a good idea. This hotel is two stories, and there's only one way in. That means there's no way out. And we get the hotel, and we get all our stuff. We go in there, and as soon as he closes the door behind him, and he goes to pull the curtain, two cops, come up the stairs and go past the window. He's like, oh, fuck, I was like, what? Like, I just knew. I was like, oh, fuck, I knew this was a bad idea.

We shouldn't have done this, Google. And I look, and I'm like, let's just go. Let's just leave. So, like, we bolt out the door downstairs, but as I'm running down the stairs, I look over and I see SUVs parked across the fence at, like, the restaurant next door. So I was like, fuck. And we leave, and I'm just waiting for them to be behind us. But we make it to my grandmothers, and, like, she has a few acres and a gait. So in my mind, they can't come in, you know.

It's a private property. I don't know why it took them so long. Like, it was a few days. Like, once I left. They showed up like two days later. And they arrested my aunt because they thought she was my mom. They're like, where's Jessica Bell, whatever? And she's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, I'm not Charlotte.

And what happened was it was a whole Andrew Tate situation. And let me explain. So while I was in Okochele, you know, at this point, you know, I've been on the run. I don't have money. I'm staying with a friend. I'm trying to like keep it low profile. So I call and I'm not. hungry. I'm like, yo, can I get some pizza? Can you order me some pizza? I'm starving. Right? And

my grandmother orders me some pizza off her credit card. And when the fed show up and they're going through their phones, that's how they find out. Like, okay, she asked for pizza. Find out where she ordered this pizza. And let's go get her. How is pizza the trigger? How is pizza? Yeah. Where did she order this pizza from? I ordered the pizza with her credit card. Oh, because she wasn't with you. What address did this pizza go to? Okay. But couldn't the grandmother just be? doing pizza? No, they saw where I asked for the pizza in her phone. And it was different than the yeah. It's in Okachobi, like, you know. Why were they so gun ho after you? Like, you're a low-level person. Why are they like so after you? I think that in this town, it's small town, it's not

low level to them. Like to them, like we have been thorns for so long, you know, and this was a big deal. It was an 18-month investigation and they pulled everybody in on. Like the U.S. assistant, the attorney came with the teams that they, they rated everybody. Like, they were all on the teams. These lived there. At Hyundai of Glendale, Lisa New, 2026 Hyundai Tucson SC Frontwheel Drive for 269 a month, plus tax for 36 months, with owner's assurance in America's best warranty, 10-year, 100,000 miles.

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Okay, so the pizza happens. How do they show up after that? So the place that I was staying, the friend's house, made cameras on each corner. And it was an apartment in the back of a main house. And we're just inside. Actually, so the guy that took me to... Ocala

he came over he's like hey the Fed just showed up at my sister's house the CPA looking for you I was like oh great she just brought him right here which he did

the green suits come around the side of the building and they're I'm freaking out they're knocking on the main house door and the granny has Alzheimer's right so she's like

Like Jessica, which she also has a granddaughter named Jessica. She's like, yeah, Jessica's right here. She's right here. Who are you talking about? Like, uh, so I'm just like, fuck. I have two friends inside this building and I'm like, I'm going down either way. So how about I just open the door, I'll lock it behind me and they can just, you know, be done. They can't come in after that once I'm outside because I'm what they want.

So I smoke a cigarette and, uh, I'm like, all right, I'm ready. And I just get, go out the door that I lock it behind me. They're like, there's you. there she is, put your hands up, turn around, you know, walk. They did the whole thing. Like, you got any guns on you? Like, no. I'm in shorts and in, like, tank top.

So they rest you? And this is your first time ever been arrested. Well, no, I had been arrested like a month before that. But, yeah, I was only there for, like, two hours. This was, like, a big arrest, though. This was a huge arrest. And do you get bond? No, I am a minister to society and a flight risk.

So we don't get bond. And so what do they have you at, like the county jail? Yeah, so, you know, federal holding, they take us to this place called Rock Road. It's horrible. They put us in with the Max girls. I don't know why. Like, you typically, they would have a separate federal holding, right? Did you do that?

Yeah, we were at like a detention center. But it was some states you go to the county jail if you're federal. This was like a private detention center. Okay. Where they also had like immigration inmates too. They got good food there. No, it was terrible. Well, actually, it was, you could order, like, takeout once a week to, like, a restaurant that you'd get, like, a chocolate slice of cake and cheesecake and a hamburger and fries. That's something. But otherwise, the food sucked. It's always skimpy, you know? Skimpy. How was your, like, county jail experience?

So, yeah, like, it was my very first, like, extensive, you know, stay. It was, it was crazy because, like, in a county jail, you have these. basically like a bunch of people, a bunch of women that like just don't care. They're crazy, ratchet. Like the showers have no curtains. So everybody's watching you shower. And these girls like come and they post up with their chair. Like you have an assigned chair and you carry it over and they just like they're sitting there watching you shower. This is so weird. So weird. So why did the woman bring the chair to the shower just to sit and watch? Just to watch you shower. So you'll be in the shower and they pull a chair? Yes. And they see. put it in front. Right in front of the shower. And is that, what are you doing? Are you like,

are you intimidated by that? Like, what do you do? It's like, you just put on a show or something? Like, what? Do women approach you at all for like sex or anything like that? Yeah. So it's like a men's prison, but it's just reversed with like women. Yeah. So how does that happen? I don't think it's as rough as it is like in a men's prison. But I mean, a lot of girls end up dating other girls, you know, like they want companionship, they like it and they end up dating chicks. Did you date anyone in prison? Um, I did. You had a prison girlfriend? I did, but just, just so you know, my first girlfriend was in high school. So I've dated women my whole life. Okay. So it was normal to date someone for you in prison. Yeah, it wasn't gay for this day or anything. So how do, they have that in women's prison

gay for this day? Yeah, absolutely. This is women that are married and like, oh, my husband knows. You know, it's like more socially acceptable, though, for a woman to date another woman rather than a man, man day and another man. Yeah, much more. So how do they approach you, like to feel you out to see if you're about it? I don't know you have different levels to it. Like some women are just like super sweet and then, you know, there's just something about you that they like and they don't really, they've never really experienced this before and, you know, they'll slide you a little love letter and like, oh my God, you know, I don't know why I feel like this. I've never been with a woman, but you, you know. And then there's other chicks that'll back you into a corner and just like,

yeah. And did that happen? to you? Yes. So what do you do in that situation? Um, you know, I'm just like super like I laugh it off like what are you doing? Like you're not my type. You're like you're not my type. Do they back off? Yeah. I mean, they still kind of say things and they're flirting and you know, it's very like innocent, but they still do. It's not like, come here and give it to me. Are these women violent? Like are they going to grab you and like attack you? No. Okay. In my experience, No.

I don't know. You got lucky? Yeah. And what about the guards? How do they treat you? In federal prison? No, we'll stay on county. We'll get to federal.

How are the county guards? I don't know. You're different. They're all different. You know, some of them are super cool. But they definitely, I can't say, like, they all go by the book. There's no room to, like, kind of slip up because there's just constant, you know. I don't know.

Maybe surveillance. You can't do anything. there. What's the sleeping arrangement? So we had six bunks to a room with the toilet in the middle. In the middle? In the middle. In the middle of the room.

Is it awkward? Is it? Yes, listen. You have that one bunky that you have to sleep with a blanket over your head because they like to get up in the middle of the night and go. Listen, it's bad. And you got to be like at least kind of respectful. You get your towel and you cover yourself up and kind of tuck it so the smell stays in the

toilet and then you flush. This is the shit in prison? Yes. So women do indeed shit. They do. Wow. This is going to be shocking for a lot of individuals. Sorry, guys.

Wow. So it's in the middle of the cell? Yeah. With the sink in the middle too? Yeah, it sinks in the top. Wow. Are women clean in prison, like in the cell? Most women are.

You get your occasional slough, but most of them are. And are you guys locked in the cell? Yes. So it's nothing like a federal prison camp, the county jail. Nothing like it. Okay. And food is served in that cell, too? No.

We get locked down and then, like, for lunch, and then they serve to trays. And that's when they kind of like, they call, what do they call it? Chow or? No, no, where they roll the doors. They call them roll the doors or whatever. They just unlock the doors and let you out. How long do you do in the county? Ten months.

And do you go to trial, take a plea deal? I was very dumb and naive, so, you know, oh, my God. I don't deserve 10 years. What did I do to deserve 10 years? They weren't offering me 10 years. They were offering me 70 months. And I was like, I'm going to trial. I'm the last person to be caught in the case. Everybody else is caught. Well, you were on the run. Right. Right. So I'm also the last one to plea out. So it wasn't until everybody else played out, including the big guy. You got 25 years. So I'm like, oh my God, I'm the last person. Like, and everybody else pled out. this isn't going to go good for me. And, like, I didn't know at that time either that if you go to trial, they're going to bam you, you know, for wasting their time because you're guilty. So I finally was like, my lawyer came in and he came in and he came in and check on me. He's like, all right, I'm just making sure you're still ready to go to trial.

And I'm like, I'm ready to sign. He like literally had to leave, go to his office, get the plea deal and come back. And did you have a public defender or a paid lawyer? Oh, no, it was a public defender. Do you think if you had a paid lawyer, the outcome would have been different at all? No. Okay. The big guy in the case paid a lawyer.

However much, 100,000, 150, I don't know what. And he got 25 years. Yeah, he was also the head of it, though. Yeah, but 25 years. So how much time do you end up getting? I end up getting 65 months. Which is like five and a half years. Five and a half years.

How did that make you feel? I don't know. I think that I was still kind of like, it was just unreal. Like the fact that I'm going to prison, the worst part, I guess, was my kids, because I lost my kids. My kids went to the state, and depending on what I got, you know, they're like, if you get more than five years, we're going to prove you unfit. We're going to take your kids. So, like, right then, I knew, like, okay, they're going to, they're taking my kids when I got sentenced. So that was, like, the worst part, you know.

Yeah. Just knowing that. That your kids were out of your control. So they probably weren't even. able to visit you? My oldest did because she ended up with her dad. And it was like a year and a half in. I got to see her for the first time in Coleman.

So you go to Coleman Federal Prison Camp? That's in Florida. Yes. What's that like? Is that the one on the beach? Is that one on the beach? Yeah, there's a men's prison camp. I think it's Pensacola.

Oh, maybe. But no, it's not on the beach. It's in the middle of Florida. How many women are at this camp? Like 350 women. 350. Wow. Yeah.

It's a big camp because, you know, obviously it's a work camp. And there's also, you know, the other institutions you have a medium low and the two pins. So we basically take care of everything. You know, we cut the grass for all the institutions. You know, we go and we feed, you know, sometimes feed the guys when they get locked down. And, you know, we're making stuff and taking care of the whole place. Ready or not, summer is coming. And Wayfair's Memorial Day clearance is on now.

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But the other one, yeah, it's just white collar crime. I don't know. It varies seven years, 10 years, 15 years. I was actually locked up with Bernie Madoff's secretary. Annette. Wait, Bernie Madoff's secretary was there? Annette Bajorno. So what's she like?

She's, you know, a little tiny, you know. She was super cool. She was nice. And how much time did she get? I don't know. Actually, I think that while I was there, so she got sentenced and she only got a few years. Like, I want to say four to seven, I'm not real sure. But this was years ago.

Yeah, what year is this? This got to be what? 2010 and 11? Whenever she got sentenced the first time? Oh, she went to prison twice? No, I'm thinking, like, or maybe she just didn't self-surrender until later. Yeah. I don't really know what happened, but she was there while I was there.

What year were you there in the camp? 2016, I think I got there. Is it mainly white women, Spanish, black? Oh, it's a mixture. It's a mixture. There are a lot of, like, Cubans from Miami, you know, it's in Florida so that you don't want to, That's the closest to home that you could stay. You were probably one of the younger inmates there.

No, it was probably an average age. Really? What do you think the youngest was at a federal woman's camp? You know, I don't know, but there were definitely like, you know, I'm going to say 22, maybe. 22? And drug cases? Yeah. Okay.

Are a lot of these women, like women who were doing something illegal with their husband or boyfriend and they got caught up? Yeah, some of them were. Okay. Yeah. And did you get to like connect with these women? Yeah, you know, I met this chick, Laura. My first day in FDC, Miami is kind of like a transfer center. I spent two months there and I don't know what's going on.

My first time out of county and like I'm going off to prison and she pops her head in my room and like I have a room by myself. You know, so it's my first night there and she's like, hey, you got to move. Like, what? She's like she literally almost made me cry. That's how like the straw I was. It's like, yeah, I need a bunkey and I don't want a crazy one. You seem nice. So come on.

What do you think was the most interesting thing you saw at that federal prison camp? A lot went on at the camp. My first day there, my co-defendant was working landscape. And she's like, you know, Come meet my boss. He's super cool, you know. Boss is in a prison guard? Yes.

Okay. Yeah. And she's like, we're kind of seeing each other. I was like, oh, okay. And that was probably the craziest thing. There are like a lot of relationships, you know, between guards and the women. And how do those happen? It's, you know, it's people.

You know, you have a bunch of women. You spend a lot of time together watching these people if you're, you know, 12 hours a day or whatever. Like you get to know them And they're just Sleeping with each other Like what are they going in the closet The office where they go? It's wherever they

Yeah Closets Woods Were you ever approached By a prison guard Um The worst thing that's happened Was like when I first started

The landscape You have to chit out your keys So Like I knew this guy It was obviously seeing My co-defendant And would he hand hand me the keys and like he would

rub my hand like that's the worst thing that's happened wouldn't you say I'm like what are you doing like I'm not the one you know like that's maybe that's how you try you know do you test the waters you know if they're gonna you know what do

female women prisoners wear what's the outfit I think he's the same as men it's greens it's greens yeah but it's khaki is like two separate it's not like a jumpsuit it was like two separate pieces Yes, two separate pieces. Was there any other celebrities there other than Bernie Madoff's secretary? None that I can think of. No, I don't think so.

No one's special? No, no one that sticks out in my mind. Now, in men's camps, a lot of the men will, like, leave the compound, like run through the woods or whatever to go hook up with their wives. Were women doing that to, like, hook up with their husbands at all? Is it reverse? Um, I've heard those stories. Like, I've never actually witnessed it. But the women's camp, you have, like, free reign.

There's no fence. You know, you, and play, because we're taking care of, you know, all these other institutions, it's nothing for you to see four or five inmates in a truck driving around. You know, we're a landscape. It's 2,200 acres. We're everywhere, every day. So, you know, I mean, people are hooking up. That's so crazy.

It is crazy. What about food? Were you guys getting good food smuggled in? The girls would like It's silly, a woman's prison So they would get drops of like cigarettes, cell phones Gummy worms eyelashes

Hair straighteners It's like silly stuff You know What about Yeah cell phones Did you have one in prison? I did not but a lot of people did It's pretty common to have a contraband film

Yeah, in a camp yeah What are they doing with them just watching stuff texting? Yeah probably the same thing you do Yeah, that's what I... Yeah. You know, it's so fascinating that in different prisons across the country, everyone does the same thing. But no one, like, talks to each other. It's just, like, natural.

It's just, like, part of the economy. Yeah. It's so interesting. It is interesting. Especially, like, a whole different gender. Like, women are doing the same thing men are doing. Mm-hmm. Biggest question a lot of, like, the listeners are interested about is, like, the sex toys.

Are you guys making them? Are you smuggling them in at a camp? How does that work? So, in county jail... there was a tutorial that some chick put on and she was making dildos out of like a toothbrush you know the little toothbrush holders you get some contraband gloves

and I don't know what else use stuff in there but yeah like I've seen them make them I've seen one used not on purpose like I just kind of oh my God what are you doing but in federal prison no I didn't see much of that there wasn't much at all What are like some creative things women would do? Like would they have like a creative hustle?

Would they make things, dishes, food dishes? They were amazing cooks. They would sell cakes. Like these cakes, like you just went down to the bakery. I don't know how they did it. They add soda or something to make it fluffy. I don't know. They were amazing.

But yeah, they would sell food. They would make truffles. They have crocheting. So they would make blankets and outfits out of, you know, yarn. And they would sell that. They got some hustle. Some people would draw, you know, your standard, you know, drawing. Did you have a hustle?

No, I just work landscape. And how much do they pay you to work landscape? $120 a month. That's actually pretty good for a prison. I was grade one, so. But it took me a little bit to get there. So I started out obviously like, what, $0.23 an hour or something, whatever they pay. So I started out, like I got five bucks for the first couple of months, but eventually made it too.

Do women tattoo in prison? Yes. I have a prison tat. You got a prison tag? Wait, where is it? That's your prison tat too bad. What is that? Is that like an antlers?

Yes, it is. Okay, I guess that right. I'm glad. So, walk us through that. Why do you decide to get it? How does it happen at the camp? I've never heard. I've seen women get a prison tattoo before.

Right. So this was county jail. This was when I was still kind of like coming off drugs. And like, I'm going to blame it on that. And this chick, you know, she did nice, nice tattoos, pick and poke. I'm like, you know, it never crossed my mind. You're in a jail. You know, it's disgusting.

It's, you know, you mix together some V-O-5 shampoo, green shampoo. I forgot about the V-O-5. That's a prison classic. Yeah. And some lead from a pencil and go to town. And why do they call it a pick and poke? Because, you know, they make it out of like a staple. You know, they usually take the staples out, but somebody gets one somehow and, you know, you grind it down.

And you take some thread from a tampon or something. and like wrap it around a pencil and silly, I know. Does it hurt? No. It's like the aftercare. Do you put like lotion on it, sanitizer? There's not much.

Like you have antibacterial soap and that's really all I put on it. Lotion, obviously, but it's very bad. It's scarred. It's just, it's horrible. So what were you thinking? I'm brand new to prison. I've got to get a prison tat.

Yeah, I don't know what I was thinking. Why do you think everyone? associated with get prison with getting a prison tattoo I don't know I don't know maybe TV movies maybe probably it's like a stigma or something what about the meals wait do you have any prison to have no I never got one yeah I don't believe in tattoos oh yeah I don't have any I don't I don't believe you I don't I don't have any I can oh man he got me your leg says don't Don't believe. It doesn't say don't.

It says believe. I actually have baby Simba tattooed on my... Is there a reason? Yeah. It's a statement of like always remember where you came from. That Rafiki, true. Don't go there. Yeah, funny.

What about the food? Like, are women taking time that work in the kitchen to make good food for the other female inmates? Yes. There are, you know, you have your group that really are, like, you know, they're in culinary, this is what they want to do. Like, the food was decent. The food was decent.

You know, they take pride in what they do. It's not just a bunch of slop. What about sleeping arrangements? What's that like in the camp? Coleman was really nice. So, you know, in County Jail, you get a slab and, like, it's hard. And, you know, your mattress is, like, this big. Do they even give you pillows?

Because I think we had to, like, stuff our sweaters. Yeah, we would take our jumpsuits and do that and wrap it or and get a pillow case made or guys would tear apart mattresses and make pillows. but that would be considered contraband. Right. Yeah. So when I got to Coleman, it was amazing because you have, it's two bunks, you know, into a room. And you have springs.

And then you actually have a mattress with springs. It's about this thick. And real pillows. Yeah. People don't realize that there's springs in federal prison. Yeah. Not at the detention centers, but at these camps and lows. Right.

It's pretty nice. Yeah. I don't know about, I think, in the men's that they do have the, the, thin mattresses because of like bed bugs or something. They were actually talking about taking the mattresses out just, you know, because of that reason. They weren't there, but just in case. But even having a spring makes a huge difference.

Oh, my God. A big difference. Even like the metal bunk itself, you know, we had the springs across the bottom instead of the slab. So that alone makes a difference. Then you have the spring mattress. What about a, um, um, um, so all the rooms are two women rooms? Yes. Every single one? Every one. That's a lot of rooms. Yeah. And there's a door?

No door. Okay, no door. There's like cubicles. They are like cubicles. It's like you have the blocks. They're about five feet. You know, you can kind of see all room five feet tall that separate each room. What about bathroom, showering and stuff in the camp? The showers have have stall doors. Thank goodness. And so do the, so do the toilets. It's very, very private. So a bunch of sinks lined up, probably 10 on each side. Everything's a mirror, huge mirror. That's how it is at our camp, too. It's actually, it's nice at the camp.

You got the stalls and you got the showers. Water pressure was probably better there too. Yeah, it was decent. So overall, how would you say your stay was in federal prison camp? I mean, it was definitely the best part of my sentence. You know, county was the worst. You just because, you know, everything about it. You don't know what's happening.

You lost everything. You're, you know, coming down off drugs. your family's like, you know, it's just all bad. But, um, federal prison, like, I did ARDAP. So I learned a lot from ARDAP. I think that... Describe what ARDAP does. The ARDAP is like a cognitive program, you know, a drug program.

They help you change your thoughts, you know? Change your, what is it the logo? Change your thoughts. I don't know, something. It's a very strict program, though. It is. Yeah, it's 24-7. Like, you're in your own dorm.

Everybody in this dorm is in this program. It's like nonstop. They're, you know, watching you. And if they see something like your behavior or something you've done, you know, they call you out and find everybody. And that's how they help you. And what about visits in the camp? So we have visits every other weekend. Every other weekend, yeah.

Only on the weekends. And every other weekend? Every other weekend. Why every other weekend? I think because it's so packed, you know, it would just be too many people. And do you guys share the same visiting room as the male inmates or no? No. The separator?

Yeah, no. Is it like in mend camps and lows where the vending machines are a popular item? Yeah. You can bring 25 the max. Bring the max in quarters and once and come. Let's have pizza and ice cream and it's a picnic. The burgers are pretty good too. Yeah.

Big ass burgers. Yeah, those are so good. They were great and having a real soda and not like the fountain soda. Did you guys have like a salad bar and a soda bar? We didn't have a soda bar, but we did have a salad bar. Okay. Yeah, we had like a soda. It was a knockoff soda with like it had like a fruit punch.

I think like a Coke, a knockoff Coke and like a Sprite or something. Like RC Cola. Yes, that's what it was. It was something like that. Yeah. And then a salad bar, people don't believe that the feds have salad bars. Yeah. What was on your salad bar?

Salad. Yeah, but like the toppings. It was mostly just salad. Like, you know, you had your few little toppings, but it wasn't anything special. dressings and salad. Did your parents come to visit you at all? Yeah. Probably, it was much later.

I was there for a while before they came. Probably like two years in, my dad and my sister came, and then I got to see my daughter. So it was a while, though. Did prison help you get clean? Yeah, absolutely. And you stayed clean after getting out? Yes.

So do you think that, it was a blessing kind of in disguise that you went to prison to get clean. Absolutely. And it's kind of cliche, but like it did. It saved my life. Like I was just going downhill. Things were just, I don't know if they could have gotten much worse, but they were bad. But yeah, it definitely changed my life.

Like I said, Ardap was great. And another lesson that I learned, like even going through prison was the people you surround yourself with. Like, you have to be careful with who you surround yourself with. Because the people that I was hanging out with, like, I did. didn't like what they were doing, but I was still there. So, like, you're still associated with that, even though you're not doing it, and whatever they may be doing, right? Do you understand? Yeah. So I learned that, like, it took me a while. I actually went to county jail while I was in prison at the camp because we don't have isolation, what's it called? We don't have the shoe. We don't have

the shoe. We get sent off to the next county jail. So I went for, like, 40 days. And, but I went for, like, 40 days because of the whole, you know, officer and inmate relationship things. Just because of who I was, yeah. You got investigated. Women are just kind of conniving. Are there fights at all at these camps? Like, are girls fighting?

I have never seen, I have never seen a fight at the federal prison camps. County jail, yeah. There are a bunch, but. A lot of people when they're at the camp, they don't want to do anything to leave the camp. Right. Especially when the shoe's not on campus and they have to get shipped out. It would be silly. You know, you fight.

They're sending you down the road. And, you know, it's another four hours from your family. Like, it's just silly. Time off your sentence. Exactly. Or added to your sentence. Like, do you think you needed the five years to get clean or could you have done it with last time? I think that it was perfect.

I think that it was a perfect amount of time because when you do ARDAP, you get a year off when you complete that program. So, you know, I ended up doing four years. And I do. I think that everything that I went through in, you know, you know, you know. It definitely, I needed it, yeah. What year do you end up getting out? 2019. 2019.

So you got out, thankfully, before COVID. Yes, thank God. How hard was it to readjust into life with this new, you know, a clean life done with prison and what were like some of the challenges of now being a felon? Obviously, like, you know, getting a job is difficult. You know, you're going to go to Dunkin' Donuts and, you know, work for $8 an hour. And, you know, it just sucks. Like, you have no transportation.

You're starting over with nothing. and I went to Tampa and I don't have family there. I think that my dad lived like two and a half hours away or two hours away and that was the closest halfway house. So I don't know. It's difficult, like, you know, just readjusting. And I remember like sitting at the bus stop and traffic would make me dizzy because everything was just going by so fast. And, you know, even talking to people, like, I don't kind of talk differently. I don't know.

I don't know. You're not talking about prison or this, you know, what this chick's doing. What were some, like, habits that stuck with you or, like, routines that were hard to kind of, like, kick after prison? I am not institutionalized. No, you don't have to be. But I know, like, for me, it was weird to take a shower without flip-flops that first time. That was weird, but nice. It was, you know, nice.

I don't know I have any weird things, but I like getting up early. I get up early now. Like, no alarm clock. I just. I don't know how you do. that. I need like 10 alarms. Seriously? Yeah, I mean, I have like a fear that like I'll sleep through an alarm. So I have like 10 or 15 set. It's crazy. I know. I normally wake up before the alarms. It's just a fear that like I don't want to be late for something. Even though I'll sit in my bed bullshitting on the phone and then I'll be late anyways. That's funny. But yeah, no, I get up early, you know, um, I've always kind of like worked out. But, you know, obviously fell off when I was like on drugs. So, you know that's stuck with me that's very routine

we work out like six days a week all good habits all good habits like you know making your bed I'm never that person so I make my bed every morning and I know it all seems small but like I'm very like clean and tidy in particular

like this has to go here I make mine the prison way still like where you fold the top part and you have like you know the wool blanket they give you or whatever on the bottom yeah that would be on the bottom and then I fold it in half at the top I don't know, I just do it that particular way. Were the women working out in prison?

Some of them do. But is it like, are they doing burpees? Are they doing like the men prison workouts? Yes. And so, glad you mentioned that. I had a buddy. Her name was Christina and her husband was in the prison next to the camp. You know, they had correspondence.

So they would send over their workouts and their times. So we did 100 burpees and we did it for time. So they sent over their time. They did it in nine minutes, ten seconds. So we're like, all right, we're going to do this challenge, 100 burpees challenge for time. And we did it in like eight minutes and like 40 seconds and send it back like, bam, and we didn't cheat. So we would do that. So yeah, they were pretty hardcore.

I went to Greenville, not Greenville, yeah, Greenville, Illinois for the Ardap program. And they have actual weights, you know, Olympic bars, plates. Were you doing any of that? Yes. I was big in the whole CrossFit thing. And that's awesome. Now we hear a lot of times, like, in the world, it's a real issue with, like, women in the workplace and women's rights in the workplace and everything like that. Has it been more difficult not only being a woman, but also being a woman with a felony on your record?

I think that, yeah, it's more difficult. When I got out, you know, like, I got a job through my dad, you know, is like who you know kind of thing. But if you don't have anybody to help you out, you know, give you that leg of, like, yeah, it's super difficult. but like I had my dad and then I went back to school and became a marine mechanic so they're not really you know they don't really care if you have a felony you know you're working on a boat do you get any benefits now from your time in the military no nothing because you didn't serve enough time right what do you do now I'm a boat mechanic you're still the boat mechanic okay so you're good with your hands and whatnot looking back on everything what's like your biggest takeaway from everything you went through you know your traumatic childhood what you're you're you're traumatic childhood what you're you're you're you're you went through in prison, getting out of prison. What's your biggest lesson and all that? I think all of it combined is it's good to use it as ammo, you know, to propel you, you know, further in life instead of hold you back. A lot of people take trauma and things like prison and use them as an excuse to stay where they're at or, you know, complain, you know, be the

crybaby or I think that, you know, you use it as fuel. And also, like, surround yourself with good people. Like, it's, for me, it's a big deal. Like, obviously, people influence me, you know, in my life. And it's just, I've never had that or have chosen the good person, you know. So, or, like, you know, to be around. Just because, like, you know, drugs and hanging out and partying, it just was my life. So you just find somebody good that's going to be honest and tell you what you need to hear.

and stick with them. How do you avoid any urges to try drugs again or fall down in a bad habit? I think that I honestly, when I think about it, it disgust me. Like, half my family still does it, and I can't stand to talk to half of them. You know, the conversation, it doesn't go anywhere.

It's just like, wow, it's like, this was you, you know. And I hate it, and I feel, you know, I feel bad, and it makes me sad that they're still doing it. but I think it also it just shows me it's like wow I will never be that again you know so there's no urges like and I'm nowhere near

Okachobi so I mean I think that has something to do with it yeah sometimes we have to remove ourselves from negative environments like that people places yeah and you hear that all the time over and over but it really is the truth yeah how's your relationship with your children now um

two of them it's good You know, my daughter lives with us, my oldest. But one of them, the one that was adopted, I still have yet to talk to or see. So, you know, we're hoping something happens soon. Have you had conversations with your oldest daughter about your past, what you've been through? Yeah. Yeah, she knows. It was very open with her about everything.

Do they look at you kind of like as a badass at all? I think my daughter does. She'll do the whole thing. Like, she was in prison and she's like, flex, show your muscle. And I'm like, what are you doing? Well, that and like you're an outdoorsy person. Right. You've lived a very interesting life.

You're very much a badass. We went gator hunting like a week ago. Gator hunting? Yeah, like a 10-8. Badass mom goes to prison. Is that the title of this thing? That might be good. Badass mom survives federal prison camp.

Yeah, I like it. You like it? Cool. Let's rock with it. All right. Jess, thank you for coming on the show today. It's been great. I'm glad you're more coming.

with me now talking to me. Maybe we'll do this again. I guess I did something right in this interview. You're a good interviewer. Thank you.