Locked In with Ian Bick - Ex-Fresno Bulldog Gang Member Reveals How the ATF Set Him Up | Paul Calvo

Episode Date: April 7, 2025

Paul Calvo gives an inside look on the Fresno Bulldogs gang and how he was set up by the ATF. He breaks down the undercover operation that led to his arrest, the tactics law enforcement used, and what happened after he was taken down. This is a raw and real look into gang life, law enforcement stings, and the consequences of the streets. #FresnoBulldogs #ATFSting #GangLife #TrueCrime #UndercoverOperation #PrisonStory #LawEnforcement #CrimeAndConsequences Thank you to SHADY RAYS & DRAFT KINGS for sponsoring today’s episode: Shady Rays: Get 35% off polarized glasses at shadyrays.com - code LOCKEDIN Draft Kings: New players can get FIVE HUNDRED CASINO SPINS ON A FEATURED GAME! Just sign up with code IANBICK and wager a minimum of five dollars to receive FIVE HUNDRED CASINO SPINS ON A FEATURED GAME. Connect with Paul Calvo: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paul-calvo/ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://convictclothing.net/collections/convict-clothing-x-ian-bick Timestamps: 00:00:00 From Stanford Student to Aspiring Author 00:05:37 Family Influence and Early Life Struggles 00:12:01 The Influence of Upbringing on Gang Affiliation 00:17:34 Challenging Stereotypes: Diverse Family Backgrounds 00:24:16 Life After Juvenile Detention: A Shift Towards Crime 00:30:05 Accepting Consequences and Tough Love 00:35:18 Navigating Legal Battles and Sentencing 00:41:09 Life in Isolation: Experiencing County Jail Conditions 00:46:50 Life Inside Florida's Coleman Prison 00:51:50 Life in Federal Prison: Solano's Experience 00:57:48 Intense Prison Fights and Survival 01:07:08 President Obama's Unexpected Prison Visit 01:08:56 Turning Points in Life Choices 01:14:19 Renouncing Gang Life: A Journey to Redemption 01:20:08 Journey to Engineering: Overcoming Academic Challenges 01:25:08 Overcoming Adversity: From Gangs to Stanford 01:30:23 Changing the Stigma and Providing Hope Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Visit MyFICO.com or download the MyFICO app to get started today. Paul, welcome to Locked in, straight from California, man. Thank you. I'm liking the hoodie. That's where you go to school, right? Stanford. It's so cool. Good old Stanford, man.

Good old Stanford. From president to Stanford. Yeah. If we ever write a book, that should be the title. Yeah. Well, I'm actually in the process of writing a book. I just don't have a title yet. I'm working with a book coach, and we have that, you know, going on right now.

but we have quite a few titles, but in mind. But I don't know. I might do something like that. At first I was thinking, like, you know, from like, you know, gang member to engineer or something, something along those lines. That's cool, too. Yeah, you know, but we'll see what happens. It's in the beginning stages, so. And are you getting some of your tattoos removed, it looks like?

Yeah, yeah. But I haven't gone back since, like, I stopped going during the pandemic because everything just shut down. And then I just was like, yeah, whatever. Like, I'll get to it when I get to it, you know. Does that hurt? Yeah, bro. Yeah, that's bad. It's bad.

I've had, you know, I've been stabbed, broken bones. All types of different things happen to me. And that, like, tops everything. Is your whole body tattooed? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I have sleeves and my legs and... Oh, wow.

You're even getting the hands removed. You're going all the way. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so there's this clinic out in the Bay Area out in San Jose, and they're now in Sacramento, California, called New Skin. And they do it a little differently. They don't do, like, per square inch.

It's when I was going, it was $80 for three minutes and $100 for five minutes. So if you could just sit there, bro, for three or five minutes, they go. They just jam. And that's what I would do. I just, I would, so I would do. I would do one side of my face, and then they would move me, and I'd do another side of my face, and then I would take maybe like a five second, ten second, like, little breather, and then they would just jam on the hands.

What hurts more getting the tattoo or getting it removed? Oh, removed. Oh, removed. Like, just blows it out of the water, bro. Like, it's bad. Like, removals is horrible. Yeah. Well, let that be a lesson to people interested in getting tattoos.

Yeah, especially gang-related tattoos on your face, you know. Yeah, probably not the best of ideas. No, no, it's not, no. But that's why the testimony is so important, people here in your perspective and the growth. Yeah. Do you grow up in California? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I was actually born in Tucson, Arizona, and moved to Fresno. I was like 10 days old, so pretty much born and raised in Fresno. bounced around from Fresno to a little city called Clovis right outside to living out in the country for a little bit, back to Fresno. But pretty much to Fresno area. Who'd you grow up with?

So I have three older sisters that live in Mexico. My oldest sister, she was living with us for a little bit, and then she went back to Mexico. And then it's me and my younger sister. So it was me and my younger sister and our parents. Both parents stayed together the whole time. Yeah, yeah. Old school Mexicans that, you know, through thick and thin, you know,

doesn't matter what happens. They're still going to be together. And what they do for work? My dad, for a while, worked in the fields. And then he started working. painting houses, remodeling homes. And then my mom, she, she did some like consulting.

She was a teacher. Pretty much it throughout, you know, growing up. Hi, all, before we jump more into today's episode, I need your help. If you're watching on YouTube, make sure to like, comment, and subscribe. Let me know your thoughts in the comments. And great news, you can now comment on Spotify episodes too.

So drop a comment. and a review, and let me know what you think of the episode. If you're listening on Apple Podcasts, a rating and review goes a long way in helping us grow. Also, quick shout out to Shady Raise. They are giving out their best deal of the season exclusively for Locked in listeners. Had to ShadyRase.com and use code Lockton to get 35% off polarized sunglasses. We will talk more about them later in the episode. Hope you enjoy.

Do you guys have money, you would say, like middle class? I would say at first we were, we were, I don't say like dirt poor, but we were like lower income. Once my dad's business started doing well, then that's when we became middle class. Yeah, my dad's, and, you know, although my dad and I, we didn't, you know, see eye to eye growing up, that is one thing that I can't respect about him because he stopped going to school and, like, the sixth grade when because he's from Mexico and so he had to take care of his uh he younger siblings he's the oldest of 15 so yeah he dropped out in sixth grade and then came to this country in 85 uh worked a bunch of different jobs um uh you know working with heavy equipment he was an operator

and then uh worked in the fields when he came to california because fresno's was ag, you know, nothing but ag and it's the big moneymaker. And then started doing his own business and it did well, you know, for sixth grade dropout, you know. So I give him respect in that area. Did he pass on that trait to you of like hard work and determination, grit? Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. But it was like at the time I didn't see it because we would bump head so much. you know we just we we did not vibe well we were always at each other's throats and so it wasn't until

later on in life especially when I paroled that's when it really kicked in who were you closer to your dad or your mom I would say my mom I would say my mom for sure um you know me you know my dad and I we have a a solid relationship now but it's not nowhere near, like, the relationship that my mom and I have, you know, I can't really, like, when it comes to my dad, it's very just like, oh, hey, dad, okay, what's up, you know, you just shoot the shit, you know? We barbecue, we hang out, whatever, but we don't really have, like, those deep, meaningful conversations, you know, it's very, um, kind of like just, I don't know if you're just

hanging out with the fellas, you know, nothing, uh, nothing too deep. you know as far as like chit-chatting and and and also too he's he's never really been like that you know he doesn't do the I love you's he doesn't do the he doesn't do any of that anything that has to deal with emotion he does not vibe with you know so how do you think your siblings would describe you back then wild maybe a little unhinged um yeah I would say I would use I would use those descriptions. Can you describe a moment where you feel like you first exhibited those attributes, characteristics?

I have to say. For the first time in your life? Probably third grade, my first fight at elementary school. I just, I don't know. I just, there were certain things that would set me off. And then it was just like nothing could bring me back. can calm me down. Like it was just, you know, immediately, you know, 100 miles an hour.

And then I found a way to like get away with fighting at home. I just had to tell my dad that either the kid was racist or he said something about my mom. And then it was like, oh, okay, you know, oh, okay, good job, you know, that's fine. my dad was very very everything had to be solved with like violence everything was very you know someone says something you punch them that's how he was raised you know so

you know makes sense that he would follow in that following that way you know raising me and so you know fighting wasn't really seen as like a bad thing and so I just would keep going with it. You know, I just kept getting in fights over and over. The principal of the school that I was at in sixth grade, I feel like he knew how my dad was,

and he just would always threaten me, oh, next time I'm going to expel you, next time I'm going to expel you. And it never happened. The worst thing that happened was the last fight that I had in sixth grade. we had to me and the other kid we had to stay

after school for a week with the janitors and help clean up you know the entire school take out the trash just just as it work as if we were janitors you know for

it's like three hours each day so it was like a total 15 hours or so but that wasn't really all that bad You know, he just hung out and, you know, kicked it with the janitors, went around on their carts, cleaned up, you know? So we weren't really like, oh, this is a consequence, you know, so. And then, yeah, that's, I'm, the fighting just, you know, escalated. Finally, like in high school, they, you know, they don't, it's different.

I mean, or at least I should, you know, give a timeline here. Sixth grade was 99. So once I was in like ninth grade, it was like the early 2000s, 2002 or something like that. Back then, you would go to Juvenile Hall for fighting. You know, and so that's what kicked that.

That was your first experience in the system. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Was for fighting. Do you think you had a lot of anger in you? Oh, yeah, I did. Where do you think that came from? My dad. My dad.

So do you feel like you? You were just born with that? Like, that's always in you? Or does it get brought out through his actions? You know, I, you know, the whole nature, nurture thing. I feel like it was just the way he was with me, the way he raised me. You know, everything was met with force. You know, him, you know, he would also, you know, make me fight his friends' kids.

And, you know, it was just a lot of violence. I shouldn't say violence because, you know, we could be interpreted as, you know, weapons and stuff. But it was just, it was a lot of fighting, really, you know, a lot of fighting. And that's what caused me to be like that. When you had later become gang affiliated, did you see similar gang members with the same type of background as you? You think that's a common trait? And that's actually one of the things that I want to write about in my book. and the reason why

I feel like a lot of us in juvenile hall felt so drawn to join gangs because when I went to juvenile hall, I wasn't involved in any gangs. I wasn't a gang member. I had the slightest clue as to what neighborhood, this, that, whatever. I didn't know anything.

But I got into a lot of trouble in juvenile hall to the point to where, you know, the other gang members noticed it. And they were like, oh, you should come kick with us. You know, stop eating over there at the rejects table and come over here with us, you know. And so doing that and getting to know them, I was just like, oh, yeah. Oh, okay, your dad's the same way. Oh, shit.

Oh, your dad's the same way. Oh, okay. And like, we all had similar backgrounds. You know, our dads were all, the majority of our dads were from Mexico. and they were very, I don't want to say tough because you can be tough without being abusive. They were very overboard with the discipline, which led to abuse.

And in realizing that, we just all kind of like, of course we didn't talk about our feelings, we didn't have freaking therapy sessions, right? But we realized like, oh, okay, we all share that. And like, in a weird way, it kind of brought us closer together to where we just, we literally saw each other as like brothers, you know. And so that's where that started to pick up,

at least for me in my journey, to where when I was then released, I was like, oh, okay, these are my new friends now. Like, I'm going to roll with them. And that's how that kicked off. Who was the gang that approached you in there? The Fresno Bulldogs. Because it's the biggest gang in Fresno.

And they have been for a while. And so you, of course, you have your bloods and crips. And we have a large Asian population. So we all have, you know, TRGs, A, B, Zs. And so, but for Hispanics, it's mainly, you know, Fresno Bulldogs. Honestly, I've never heard of them until you reached out. Yeah. I thought it was like a fraternity or something.

We picked up the mascot from the university. And do you know some of the background on the Fresno Bulldogs? Like where they came from, how it started all that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was a big break from the NF and really just took the whole Fresno car. And so that's why I say like it's the biggest like Hispanic gang. because when when the older guys that you know started everything from fresno they broke off from you know the nf they not only took the whole fresno car with them but like what would be the future gang members right like their sons and other younger guys that were you know joining you know going into the system or um you know just joining neighborhoods at the time you know because that was another thing that i did notice was a lot of the the guys, especially when

I got to prison, a lot of their dads had been to prison. You know, it was just like a legacy of prisons, you know. It was kind of something that's just like a cycle, you know, just handed down to like, oh, okay, well, this is my dad did, so now I'm doing it, you know. Well, his dad,

his dad was a gang member, and he was a gang member, and now I'm a gang member. You know, I've seen that, you know, where there was a grandpa, the dad. And I think it's cool. Yeah, yeah, they do. And it's sad because they feel like that's the only way of life. They feel like that's what they have to follow in their footsteps. And so, and again, that's something that I want to touch on in my book is the power that we as fathers have.

you know because being at Stanford dude I've seen what money can do for you you know I've seen what wealth can do for you and just seeing like how their parents how the other students

how their parents raise them what they do for a living where they come from how they've done in life so far you know it's like I have this memory your dad just popped up right now. I took this computer science class

and like the kids are like talking about, oh yeah, what does your dad do? And they're like, oh, neurosurgeon. One was like a neurosurgeon. One was a engineer at Google or something. And they asked me like, oh, what does your dad do? I was like, well, he's retired, but he used to work in the fields.

And he, you know, ran like a construction company. And they just were kind of like, oh, like they didn't really. realize like, you know, other people don't just, you know, not everyone's a doctor, not everyone's an engineer, you know. And I don't know, I think it was just, I think little, my time there has been kind of like little wake up calls for some of the students, you know, that like, yo, you live in a bubble, you know, like the real world isn't like this. Thanks to Shady Ray's for supporting Locked in. If you're looking for sunglasses that are stylish, durable, and built for every adventure, Shady Ray's has you covered. Their premium polarized lenses and rugged frames make them the perfect go-to,

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And hey, even send me a picture and you rock in your new pair Shady Ray's. Now let's get back into today's episode. And I bet you when you meet these people, you're still happy where your roots came from and who you are. because you have way more life experience in them. And I compare that to like the influencing world. Some of the influencers whose parents are rich and loaded don't know the struggle and the grind of becoming to the level they're at now. Because it could disappear tomorrow and they'll still be fine. Yeah.

They don't know the true struggle in that grind of building and having no money, you know. So that's a part of it too. Yeah, man. What were the bulldogs known for? Were they known for like violence or anything specific or just a regular gang? Uh, really, they're just, I mean, man, they just, and now that I think about it, they just run wild. That's, that's really like what our big thing is, you can't tell us what to do. We don't have a shot caller.

We don't have, you know, a group of guys that control everything in Fresno and tell us what to do. Like, that's like the biggest thing with us. Don't tell me what to do, you know. And so, you know, in all reality, we just, you have some homeboys that like to deal drugs and guns and some run around and robbing people. Like, it's just kind of like mayhem with them, you know. But you do occasionally get, you know, homeboys that will do some wild stuff, you know, against, women or, you know, children. I remember an incident that happened years ago, and that's not tolerated.

So they'll get deemed no good, you know. We may run wild, but we will, like, we draw the line at, like, you know, rapists and and chomos, you know, like, no, we're not going to deal with that. Like standard type prison politics. Exactly, exactly, yeah. What you expect from guys in prison, basically. Now I was reading up on the Bulldogs and they're both a prison gang and a street gang.

Or is that a misconception? I feel like that's a misconception now because with time it's changed. So yeah, it may say that now. But that's stated because the majority of the guys that broke off, you know, broke off from the NF. the NF is a prison gang.

And so it may have started in prison and then, you know, came out to the street. But it's not like your typical prison gang that you would think of, you know, A, B, you know, Mexican Mafia, NF. So that's, I think that's why they keep saying that. How does it compare the Pisas? So the Pisos are, they're, of course, I mean, they used to, always be just Mexican nationals. I know quite a few guys that like aren't gang members and their families are from Mexico, but they were born here, but they're like, yo, but I'm not a gang member, but you know, and so they're, so they roll with the Paisas. And they're just a bunch of, I mean,

the majority of them are from Mexico and it's like the same thing with them. You know, of course, they don't, you can't be a rapist or, you know, Chomo. or anything like that. But they too don't really have like shot callers. And, you know, it's more along the lines. Like, they'll have a few that, like, control a yard and might, like, make a final decision. You know, I know from the prisons I was at that did have BISUS, that's how they typically ran. You know, they didn't really have, like, structure or, you know,

mandatory workouts or anything that was like what would be deemed as like a prison gang or a gang. Really, they've just formed just for protection. Years ago, though. Now they're freaking deep. You go to any yard where there's bice house and there's like hundreds of them, you know. So, yeah. Tell us what happens after you get out juvenile detention that first time, how your life kind of starts to shift. Oh man so that that is a you know like like I said I'm working on a book and so I've been doing a lot of like

you know reflecting and and that was like a pivotal moment because that was like when it was like oh okay these are now the guys I'm going to kick it with and that just you know turned into you know selling drugs selling guns and so that's when it like became like, okay, this is my life now. You know, and that was where, you know, one thing just led to another. And, you know, I started picking up bigger cases. You know, so the, you know, my first serious conviction was for AK-47.

And then that turned into, you know, possession of a firearm with controlled substance. And then that turned into my federal case. So it was kind of like things just kept escalating, you know. And it all stemmed from my release from juvenile. Why in AK-47? Oh, man, because it was a really beautiful-looking gun. You know, it was called the Shorty Mini Blonde.

It was just this tiny AK, you know, and I was like, yeah, I need to have that, you know. and so that's what I got popped with. And I was 17 at the time. 17. And I did a year for that. The Great Rewards Hunt is here and the adventure starts now with Draft King's Casino. Follow the path to huge jackpots,

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This is now the big leagues that probably went against his values. Yeah, yeah, it did. But there was a event that happened before this where he walked in on me spray painting a shotgun. I was spray painting it all black. I covered the pieces that were wood. And he kind of just stood there and looked at me. and was like, oh, okay.

You know, and like, he kind of stared at me for a while, and I was like, uh, uh, you know, um, and he just was like, oh, okay. So you're a man now, all right. Okay. You know, and, and later on, he would tell me like, hey, man, I don't want to hear you crying over any consequences. You think you're a man now because of this. All right.

How about it? It's almost as if he knew, but then he was kind of like, what, what am I going to, what can I do to stop him? Or like, I already know what he's going to do, right? So my dad, I'm assuming this is what he was thinking. Like, it's, I can't tell him anything to make him stop. I just can let him know, hey, man, sooner or later, some consequences are going to come, you know, from this. I don't want to hear any crying.

I don't want you, you know, bail me out or, you know, give me a lawyer. You know, I don't want any of that, you know. So he wasn't surprised. when I got caught with the AK. And true to his word, when I was fighting that case, because there were more charges that were added on, he was kind of like, you made your bed and now laying it. You know, I'm not going to, we're not going to get you a lawyer.

We're not going to do any of that. Like, you need to deal with this. And that's how he pretty much was after that. Every time I went to jail, it was like, no, bro, you, this is what you want. You know, this is the life you're living. living. You know, so I would call and right away, like, you know, my dad would be like, no, we're not getting your lawyer.

I'm just like, man, I'm calling to check in on you guys, you know, like. Are you glad he was that tough on you or no? Do you think he should have acted differently? No, no, no. That's exactly how, that's exactly how you should have acted. Because I know, and I'm going to do everything. of my willpower to make sure that my son doesn't follow in those in those footsteps but that's what I would have done like now bro that's what you wanted now now deal with it there is no more

coming back from this like you can't undo this like you now need to roll with the punches you know like there is no help from us yeah we'll visit if we can but you know we're not going to sit here and bail you out. We're not going to do any of that. Because I've seen how sometimes that can lead to, oh, well, I can just do whatever I want now because I can fall back to mom or dad or whoever, you know, sister, whatever, whoever's, you know, bailing them out of their troubles, you know. So, no, I feel like he did, he did right. So what happens after you do that year for the gun? Uh, bro, I get out. and get right back to the same thing, man.

Just run around with guns, homeboys, you know, tried selling some dope. I just, like, I would sell a little dope here and there, but it wasn't really my, I don't know, I just didn't really like it. Like, I didn't like dealing with, you know, the hassle, the tweakers, the. the, you know, can I, can I, can I get you tomorrow or hey, I got, you know, it's just, oh, it was just so stressful. I rather just do, you know, I had a pretty sweet deal, you know, bringing guns down from Oregon. And it was just very straightforward. You go up, you get the guns, you come back down, they're already sold.

You go and give them to whoever you pay, you know, is going to pay you. And within an hour of being in town, they're sold. You're going on about your business. I don't need to worry about this tweaker at two in the morning. You know, hey, man, I need a fix, you know. So to me it was just, it was just extra hassle that I didn't want. And, you know, hanging out with a buddy of mine who, that's what he, that was his get down. He liked to sell dope, you know, so I started getting involved in it.

but then I got popped. And so that's when I, like I said, I caught that case for a firearm and a controlled substance. Since they noticed that there were a lot of homeboys at my apartment during the arrest, they then added on the gang enhancement. So the gang enhancement kicked that whole case up. It was crazy because the gang enhancement alone was like going to be more time than the gun and the drugs, you know. At the time, you know, DAs in California were trying to like, I think it was 10 years,

if I'm not mistaken. Or if I don't know, it was, I'm probably wrong on the amount of years. But DAs were just trying to crack you over the head for gang enhancements. As a matter of fact, when I was fighting my Fed case, I remember there's quite a few homeboys that were in there for shootings and they were getting more time for the gang enhancements than they were for the shooting. And I was like, what the, like, this is weird. Like, I mean, I didn't have to worry about it at that time

because I was a federal case, and they were still fighting, you know, they were fighting state cases. But now you're a felon charged with a gun too, so it's a lot different than that first gun offense. Yeah, that is true. Yeah. So, so, you know, sorry for going off on that tangent there,

but I was just trying to, you know, elaborate how out of hand the DAs were getting with gang enhancements, you know, just trying to send everybody to prison, which some may argue was what they were supposed to be doing, right? But, you know, back to that case, I ended up signing, I fought it for a while, signed for a strike just to get out. And then the federal case, like you said, that's when I got cracked for that, it was a lot more serious for me because of that prior conviction. and they were even trying to bring up my juvenile conviction. But the feds, and I didn't know this at the time, my lawyer had to find this out, the feds can't use any juvenile convictions against you.

So once my lawyer found that out and let it be known like, hey, the DA, you can't use this juvenile conviction, they had to, you know, get rid of that one and not use it. So they only used the prior conviction as an adult. So did the feds pick up that state case that you were facing 10 years on? No. No, no, no, no. Sorry about that. I ended up getting out on that. Like I said, I signed and was released and I was on probation for that.

They gave you probation even after being caught as a felon with a gun? Wow. Yeah. I signed for a – well, they wanted me to sign for a strike. It was signed for a strike and you get time served. I forgot how long I was fighting it in the county. Oh, so your bail was revoked, so you're doing time. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, so I was fighting it from the county. They gave me time served. I had a lawyer in that case, and he did his thing. Like, he was able to get it down to where it's like, just give him time served, you know, have him sign a strike, send him on his way. because at first it was like, I don't know, I think it was like five years or something that they were trying to give me

that they were very like adamant about but I wouldn't have I wouldn't have to sign for a strike because what they were going to do was drop the gang enhancement to a misdemeanor but part of the stipulations then for me to

get out was to sign for the strike and now that I look at it they did that on purpose because they were like oh yeah he'll come back he'll come back. he'll come back. You know, this little bit of time, however long it was, you know, a year fighting it, year, a little over a year fighting. And they're like, yeah, it's not enough for him. He'll come back.

You know, and sure enough, freaking eight months later, I pick up a Fed case. And the feds, I mean, it's a whole different ballgame. You know, I know you're aware with, you may not be aware of like state, California state, but I know you're aware. I know you're aware with how the feds play, man. That's a whole different ballgame, you know. I picked up a, I want to say it was a super rigged case because it was the ATF that planned everything and set us all up. So the ATF had a dirty agent, and we didn't know he was dirty at the time.

we found out fighting the case. He has a confidential informant that used to be an old school homeboy, did time for a murder, got out, got cracked again, and then that's when he flipped and became a confidential informant.

And my co-defendant was the one that brought him in because he was his apartment manager at his, you know, the apartments that he lived up. and they created this elaborate scheme of, we're going to rob a drug house, and you guys will,

you guys can take off with the dope. You know, we'll split it all up. Mind you, we didn't go to them for this. They came to us. And so that was the whole thing that we were fighting was outrageous government conduct. And we were, you know, going through a it's like two weeks yeah it was like close to two weeks uh just every day just going through

you know bringing up our evidence then the DA had theirs and then that's when we found out that the uh ATF agent was dirty because he was allowing the confidential informant to still sell dope and didn't care about it you know he even paid him $18,000 and the confidential informant didn't put that on his taxes. They popped some dope dealer and took his truck, gave it to the CI. So the CI, this snitch is rolling around in a brand new F-150. He's got 18,000 in his pocket, you know, living alive, selling dope. And they're okay with it.

they didn't do they didn't they didn't they didn't pop them they didn't take them back to jail they didn't even his the ATF agent didn't even tell him like hey you should stop selling dope he was just like oh okay whatever don't get pop you know and it was just like what the where or what the hell like what's going on right now you know like and I'll never forget it was the last day uh presenting evidence and the judge is like

okay, you guys come back tomorrow. I'm going to give my ruling, whether we're going to dismiss it or not. And we had quite a few deals at the DA throughout us, but like the last one was like 15 years or, I don't know, some outrageous amount of time where we were like, we're not going to sign for that. Like me and my two co-defendants were like, we're not going to sign that. Like, you're tripping.

About two or three hours after the judge told us that, I'm back in the county jail. my lawyer pulls me out and he's like, hey, the DA wants to see if you'll sign for seven years. And I'm like, oh, yeah, seven years. Like, let's go. Run that, you know. But the thing was is if I didn't sign, then my co-defendants couldn't, like, get the deal. So in order for them to get the seven years, I had to sign.

And I was like, yeah, okay, whatever. Like, let's just get this over and done with. You know, I don't, at the time, I was kind of skisking. scared too because I didn't want to run the risk of the judge being like, okay, I'm not going to dismiss it. And then now it's like, okay, we're going to trial and we're going to get screwed. You know, the feds, like I said, they don't play. They have a, what is it, 99, 98% conviction rate, you know, so I was just like, yeah, give me the seven years.

Like, let's go. I want to get the hell out of county jail. At the time I was in isolation, which is just like one hallway. It's 10 cells, one hallway, in front of your cell is like a brick wall. The shower is at the end. They have a freaking camera in the shower, you know? So it was just like living like that. I was like, nah, dude, I want to get to prison already.

I want to be able to at least live better than this, you know. I'm shocked they had a camera in the shower. Yeah. Yeah. I never heard of that before. That was weird. My first time taking a shower in isolation, it's in the friend of the county jail, it's FF. You know, every floor in the main jail has an FF pod.

And there's six floors. And, yeah, my first time taking shower was like, what the hell? I looked up and was like, it's a freaking camera. What do you guys? And they didn't want to bring you the federal holding building? They just left you in a county jail. Yeah, well, at that time, that's what they were doing. So I think it's called California City now.

I, I don't know. I don't know. the feds have an actual detention center now, right, in Los Angeles? Oh, yeah, but we don't go to that one. Oh, that's too far? Yeah, that's too far. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because back then, what would happen is you would fight your case from the Fresno County Jail.

You would then ship to Laredo, and then from Laredo, you would either, you know, go to Victerville for a little bit, the transfer center in Victorville, or you would catch a flight from Victorville to Oklahoma City. Yeah, I went there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of Mexicans there. A lot of tat. I've never seen so many face tats in my entire life. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, man.

So tell us what happens with the rest of your case. Yeah, no, no, dude. So we, we, we, we, I signed. I signed, you know, let's go. My lawyer then went and talked to the, to the two other lawyers and my co-defendant signed and. So no one got hit with cooperation and all? No, no, no, no, no.

because, I mean, we all, I mean, you know what it's like. You, as you're fighting your case, or at least, you know, for us, you're presenting paperwork. So everyone, all the homeboys know what's going on. And so, you know, none of us, we all held our own. Nobody told the only thing that was looking good for us, like I said, was the outrageous, yeah, the outraged government conduct. And so we signed and the next day we went back to court and the judge was like, oh, I heard you guys have a sign and okay, so I don't need to get my ruling.

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Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yep. And then off to prison, we went, man. What happened to high school? Did you ever graduate or would that be in prison? So I actually was very fortunate. I did a lot of units when I was in juvenile hall to where when I was,

I got out, I went to a continuation school. It's no longer called Cambridge. They actually merged Cambridge, JD Young, and like an online. And so now in Fresno it's Farber, but back then it was Cambridge continuation. And I could go to school on a Friday and they would give me all my work. And so I would do it. Next week, come back on Friday. Turn it in, get my new packet. So I really didn't have to go to school, you know. And so I was able to finish up like the 20 units that I needed when I got out of Juvenile Hall. And I was able to get my high school diploma.

That's awesome. Yeah, yeah. So where was the first federal prison they ended up sending you to after you got sentenced? USP Coleman 1. All the way in Florida? Yeah. Wait, why would they ship you from? Wow.

Yeah. That was your first spot? Yeah, yeah, dude. So I spent all the pens and. Yeah, right. So I spent a lot of time in Laredo. I then went to Victorville, caught the flight to the Oklahoma Transfer Center. And I get there and the CEO is like, hey, you know where you're going?

I was like, nah, I'm, you know, it's my first time in the joint. And he looks. He's like, oh, okay, I give him my number. And he was like, looks, he's like, oh, yeah, you're going to call me one. I was like, oh, where's that? He's like, Florida. I was like, Florida. Like, what do you?

That's the interesting thing about Oklahoma City is that like no other place will, unless it's a really cool guard, will tell you where you're going. But in Oklahoma, like, I didn't find out I was going to Wisconsin until I got all the way to Oklahoma. And then the guy told me there, normally they don't tell you so freely. Yeah. Yeah, because of security issues. I guess they figure because you're already in transit, your phones get cut off, like in a certain thing. There's no way to know.

To say, hey, I'm going over here. Wow. Yeah, but yeah, you know what, that's weird. Because every time I would go through the transfer center, I'd ask, oh, yeah, man, you're going here. You know, they didn't, they weren't like trying to be hush, hush about it. They just... Yeah, I'm surprised they didn't even send you to Texas where they sent a lot of the Mexican gang members or anywhere other than Florida. Yeah.

What year was this that you went there? 2010. 2010. You probably know some of the guys that I was with at Fort Dix. A lot of black guys, though, so I don't know if you guys would have been associating with them. Yeah, yeah, we're cool with blacks. Okay. We're not, uh, like we don't have any, you know, anything against, you know, the black gangs or any black inmates.

Yeah, there was a lot of guys at Fort Dix that when I was there that were serving life and then Obama commuted their sentences to 20 years. Oh, wow. Because of the drug commutations and whatnot. Oh. the crack and weed and a bunch of others. So they automatically left Coleman and came to Fort Dix because it's 20 years or less at the low. Oh, okay. But they came from the penitentiary?

Yeah, right to the low. Yeah. Dude, I bet you they were loving it. Yeah, well, it's a blessing and a curse because the younger guys are like, it's a whole new realm. They're getting into trouble. But the old geez, the older guys, they're more calm and relaxed. They're just trying to do their time. They still go into the shower with their boots on and the chairs.

which you would see a lot of that at the lows and it's those guys that work their way down. Yeah. But tell us about your experience at Coleman what that was like for you. Yeah, it was actually kind of like, I mean, it was prison, but, you know, I made the most of it.

It was actually like fun at times, you know, because I was tattooing. We were doing other little shenanigans to make money, you know. every Friday I was tattooing he wasn't he wasn't clicked up or gang related he was he was a white boy from Texas

I mean of course he had to follow the rules for you know the the white guys but he made moonshine every Friday and he'd give me

he'd give me a water bottle filled up with moonshine. You know, there was certain crips and bloods that I would tattoo on. They always had weed. So whenever they would have some weed,

they'd kick me down a joint. And so it's just, we're just, it was like we were, you know, on the streets. And then every once in a while, you go on a lockdown because, you know, shit happens. So it sounds like the white guys have the biggest problem with other races,

because I've talked to some white gang members where they can't even tattoo. on a guy on another race. Oh, yeah. So silly. Yeah, that's more of a... And you know what's crazy is... Like, some of that will happen,

but then, like, you know, if the only... If the only people on the yard that have dope are the blacks, the whites still go and get dope from them. You know, so it's like... Come on, man. You can buy dope from them,

but you can't get... Like, it's just... It's ridiculous, but it's prison, right? Like, you know, it's the politics. But for myself, I could tattoo blacks, whites. I just, on the whites, I couldn't tattoo anything gang-related, you know, anything, any swastas, none of that. What I was doing was all, like, biomechanical designs on sleeves. What I was doing was, like, a whole chestplate and, like, sleeves on this guy.

and nothing was gang related and then of course I could tattoo on the Crips and Bloods there was no problem with that Now even though you had a decent time there It's a it's a USP It's still a pretty violent dangerous place What were some of the things you were seeing there

During your time? Ma'am with as a matter of fact Within a couple weeks The Paisas killed some guy that was all drunk Talking shit Killed him I think that was the only murder that happened there in the three years I was there.

What happens when a murder goes down there? Oh, it just depends. It depends on who gets killed. If it's like a riot with two big, you know, cars and someone gets killed, then we're on locked down for a lot longer. If it's, like, within one car, you know, it's a removal, someone's no good, you know, then we could be on lockdown for a couple weeks, come right. back out.

But this guy was a Solano, didn't roll with anybody. You know, he's just drunk one day talking shit. And some Paisas, some younger Paisas dude jumped on him and freaking murked him. And we weren't even on lockdown for that long. Now that I think about it, it was like two or three weeks. We went right back out. Like I said, because it was like, oh, he's a Solano. You know, SIS does their investigation.

They'll figure who did. did what. Were there a lot of bulldogs there? No, dude. No, it was just me. It was me for a while. And then I had another homeboy pull up. And it was just us, too, for like, maybe a year and a half, I want to say. So who do you run with them?

So we, at that yard, we were cool with the Nortenos. We were cool with them and the NF. And so we hung out real tough with them. You know, we would play basketball together, eat together. sit together. There's no beef with us in the federal system. Maybe that's why they shipped you all the way out there to kind of separate. Probably.

I mean, I wish I could find out, you know. You really never know what the BOP does. It's so corrupt. I'd love to find out why they'd put me through what I went through. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and I just saw an article on, as a matter of fact, it was on LinkedIn. in and they were talking about

USP Lee and how like they're just what they're doing is just you know four point restraints leaving people tied to concrete in cells and you know this poor guy got an infection in his hip and now he can't walk

like dude it's some yeah it's some messed up shit you know insane yeah So what happens after you leave there, Coleman, where do you go? Because you only did three years. Yeah, yeah. So I leave there and I go to Tucson. I went to FCI Tucson and that was a whole shit show, man.

That was freaking, because at the time we, well, at least, you know, me and the guys that I was with in Florida, we were going at it with the Southern Hispanics. my boy that was there at Coleman 1, he went to USP Atwater, and three South Siders attacked him. They rushed him as soon as he went out to the yard. And he beat up all three, took a lock from one of them,

and he beat him up. And so we were kind of on that time, you know, once he got to Coleman 1, because he came to Coleman 1 after that incident at USP Atwater. And we were kind of on that time of like, oh, okay, you know, like this is what's happening with these guys. Like, instead of waiting for them to attack us, we'll start attacking them.

But, I mean, there's, at the time, there was like, I don't know, 10, 15 bulldogs in the entire federal, you know, in the FBOP, you know, spread out to out the country. So it was like, really, it was only really happening like sporadically. He wasn't, you know, and then even so there were some yards where, like, the Southerners didn't really trip on us, you know, so that you would have a homeboy there. But at Tucson, it wasn't, that wasn't the case. So I got into all kinds of shit, man. I went out to the yard, got into an altercation using a weapon in the shoe, the same thing. Like, it was all bad.

It's all the weapon and altercation story. Yeah. So I actually was, I made it to the unit and was able to make a tomahawk. I hit a dude and then, you know, crack him a couple times, knock him out. I then make it to the chow hall. And the only reason why I feel like we didn't get caught was because the way the unit is. So like the main floor. has some cells on the side,

but then there's some cells that, like, you have to walk down and, you know, go to those cells. And so where I got him at was in that little area. And so I hit him with a tomahawk, and I crack him a couple times, and he hits the ground. And I clean up because I busted my knuckle, and I make it to the chow-hall.

But by then, so this, I don't know if you're familiar with this, but I guess this is done at some prison. whatever unit is like the cleanest and does like the best right they go to chow first for the week yeah they win that every week they announce it yeah okay yeah so this prison out of the week or whatever it was called yeah yeah yeah yeah did that at fort dix oh okay okay yeah so this okay so fcii tucson did that so we were the first ones out and i make it to the chelho and i put my tray down and i just wait for like the first two guys to show up uh or whoever is in

to show up, but it just happened to be two southsiders. They come out and we start fighting. The bigger guy that I hit first, I didn't drop him. So then he rushed me and held me to a table. And I was trying to fight the other dude. And, you know, we were just trying to, I was just going back and forth, you know, and I had this guy just holding me to a table. That's all he did.

He didn't do anything else. And so the South Sider dude, He cracked me a couple of times. It wasn't really like somebody won. You know, we were just trying to hit each other going back and forth. And that only lasted, I don't know, maybe 10, 15 seconds. COs came, you know, did their thing, took us to the shoe. And then the next day in the shoe, the COs came by.

I don't know where the, you know, lack of communication was. But they asked me, hey, who can you wreck with? I was like, yeah, anyone put me in the cage with anyone. Put me in the cage with two more South Siders. So then I get into it with them. But I feel lucky in the, in a sense that, because they were uncuffed and I was cuffed. And the CEO put me in there. And they could have just jumped on me right then and there.

But they didn't, you know, and they let me get my cuffs off. And then I just started swinging on them and we fight. And those, one of them, though, one of them, he fucked me up pretty good because, I hit the first guy on the right, and we start fighting. And then I kind of back up and turn and tried to fight the other guy. But then, again, the first guy did the same thing. He just grabbed me and pressed me up against the wall. And so I'm trying to go back and forth with the other guy.

And finally, they get me to the ground. and the first guy that tackled me is now like holding me, right? And I'm trying to like get out. And the other guy stands up and he's just like dropping knees on my head, you know? And so that he got me pretty good on that one because he dropped about, I don't know, four or five knees on my freaking, you know, forehead. And then again, the COs came in. But you know what's funny is like when you fight in the shoe, the COs don't immediately come in.

they like give you three verbal commands and then they come in and it's like why are you giving those verbal commands real like yeah you know you know I don't know if it's their policies or whatever um but after that it was I was in a shoe for a while there in Tucson um as a matter of fact I got again I got lucky the warden she stopped by my cell and was like yo I don't like you. I don't want you in this prison anymore. I'm going to cut your shoe time. I don't care how much time you get.

I'm cutting it and I'm getting you the hell out of here. And so I was only there for like six or seven months before she, you know, was true to her word, cut my shoe time. And then I got sent to USP Macquarie. I was in McQuarrie. So you went from an FCI back to... Back to USP. So you went to a medium. back to a USB.

Back to a USB. Over that. Yep. All right. How was McQuary? That's in Texas, right? No, no, Kentucky. Oh, Kentucky.

Okay. That's a pretty notorious one. Yeah. I interviewed a couple guys there. Oh, yeah? That were from there. But more recently. Yeah.

Yeah. So as a matter of fact, it started getting like that, like maybe the last couple months that I was there. It was D.C. blacks and the Florida blacks, they killed two. The D.C. blacks. killed two Florida blacks. And that was like kind of like the beginning of the chaos

because those guys were never prosecuted. And then the administration, when you get to McCurry, they let you know like, hey, if you can't be here, don't call it to the yard. Like don't take the chance. And every so on, every once in a while, you get a little straggler that comes out and he thinks he can, you know, walk the yard.

Well, it was some white boy comes out. He couldn't be there. They kill him. They kill him in the cell. And the guys that they took to the shoe for that were never prosecuted. And then it was kind of like, oh, that's what we got going on here. Okay. And it was just fucking just all out, man.

Ham, bro. And then, and then I left, but I remember hearing later on still like, oh, man, this happened there at McQuarrie. And I'm like, yeah, makes sense because, like, they weren't prosecuting you. Like, they would take you to the shoe and somehow, some way, after a couple months, they were like, oh, okay, well, I'm going to prosecute you. And you went right back out to the yard. So people see that and they're like, oh, what? Okay. You know, and they just try their hand. I remember here recently I was looking up like, you know, something that I, some article I came across and it was still like that in McQuary.

You know, this guy got killed and no one's been prosecuted for it. And it's like, oh, I guess 10 years later, you know, it's still like that. Yeah, that whole thing is pretty insane. Yeah, yeah. But again, it's the, it's all the corrupt shit that happens in the BOP. You know, look at all the stuff that happened at the SMOO program. you know, in Lewisburg. Then they shut that down and make USP Thompson.

And then they shut that down because of all the corrupt shit going on, you know. C.O.'s putting you in cells with guys that you're not supposed to be in a cell with, you know. It's crazy what they're doing. And nothing's happening. You know, they just, oh, we'll open up another prison. And the same shit happens there. You know, it's like, okay, I guess. You know, so.

Yeah. man, McQuary was, was wild towards the end there. How long were you at Macquarie for? About a year. And do you go home from there? No, no. Actually, I was, I was supposed to go home from there. But my counselor, I don't know how he messed this up.

I, so the, remember how I was talking about my previous case? When I was, you know, I got the assigned for. for the strike. Well, I was on probation for that. And somehow, some way, they put a hold on me. Oh, a detainer. Yeah. And I didn't know about it.

My counselor didn't know about it. Nobody knew. And so my counselor was like, okay, look, dude, you got like, I think at the time I had, like, three years left or a little less than three. And he's like, look, you can do the RDAP program. And I forgot. I think it was like a year. You get a year off for the RDAP.

And then he was like, and then you, we're going to put you in for your halfway house. That'll be six months. And at the time, Fresno still had a halfway house. So he was like,

you know, it'll cut you down 18 months. You'll be home in about it a little over a year. And I was like, oh, hell yeah, dude.

Yeah, okay. So I'm like, Megan all the, I'm like, I tell my mom, I'm telling my sister. And he's,

he's, you know, talking to me about, you know, what RDAP I want to do. Like if, you know, if I have any, uh, places I want to go to for the RDAP. And I'm just like, well, well, whatever one like is close by or I don't know, one in California so I can get a visit. And then like, I don't know, maybe like a week after that.

It was like a total of like two or three weeks. He calls me back and he's like, hey, man, I messed up. He's like, uh, you have this. detainer, he's like, you have no action. You don't even have action at Halfway House, Ardap, nothing. And I was like, oh, motherfucker, bro. Like, I was pissed. And I wasn't going to, like, you know, beat him up over it.

Whatever. You know, I wasn't going to get all, you know, turn into more time. But I was like, and he could see that I was starting to get mad. And I was like, dude, you fucking told me, you know, like, I'm. I was like, you're messing with my time. I was like, I just called, you know, my family, you know, last week or, you know, whenever it was and was like telling them like, hey, I'm getting 18 months shaved off. You know, they all thinking I'm coming home in a little over a year.

And he's like, all right, all right, all right, you know, like, hey. And then he was like, do you want to go back to an FCI? I was like, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, hell yeah, you know. He was like, which FCI's. And I was like, FCI Mendota, which was right outside of Fresno. And then FCIL Reno I was like those would be the two ones that I'd like to go to He's like, okay, okay, he's like, I'll put you in.

He was like, oh, don't worry, I'll put you in. I was like, oh, shit, okay, cool, all right. And it kind of was like, all right, yeah, okay, cool, whatever. I mean, what can he do? You know you can't go home, right? So it's like, I was like, yeah, fuck it. Send me another FCI, you know? And I was able to go to FCI or Reno.

And were you on best behavior over there, better behavior? There was really nothing to do there. man. It was, man, FCII Arena was like a whole different world.

Like there wasn't, it was just like, you really passed your time watching football, playing tickets. That was it. You know, I will say,

though, I was there when Obama visited. Oh, he visited there? Yeah. Yeah, in 2015. And it was crazy because there was, you know how prison is.

Everyone talks. Everyone talks. the guards, everyone, there's communication going on, right? And so the word was, oh, hey, the president's going to come visit. And I'm thinking, like, the president's not going to come to no fucking prison. Like, are you serious? You get the hell out of here. And sure enough, I remember they locked down the entire prison just out of nowhere one day.

They just lock it down and we thought something happened. But no, sure enough, it was Obama. We saw him, Secret Service, like, walking. And they went to talk to the Ardap people. and they interviewed like maybe five or six people that were in the Ardap program. But I was looking out in my cell when. I was like, holy shit, that's Obama. You actually physically saw him.

Yeah, yeah, I saw him. So my cell, the window faced like the yard and the chauho. And I couldn't see like the administration building, but you could see, you know, if you walked maybe like 100 feet from that building going towards the yard or the other building, you could see whoever was there. And so that's the path he took. So we saw Obama, his, you know, the secrets, like everything, the Secret Service, the people, they had, if I'm not mistaken, I want to say they had some sniper.

I don't know. I forgot the amount of security he had, but it was obviously a good amount because he's visiting a damn prison, you know. Probably the only time they ever allow guns and do a federal person. Right. Because they're not going to disarm the Secret Service. Yeah. Yeah. And so I was like, oh, shit, I was shocked to see that. You know, and so I was there for the Obama visit. Did you spend any of those years bettering yourself in there, like kind of thinking about the future?

Or were you still on kind of like that gang mindset? So I didn't do anything to like better myself education-wise or, anything, but there were a few, you know, events that happened that made me reanalyze, like, or analyze, I should say, my life and my decisions and where I was at, at that, at those moments in life. One of them was a phone call with my mom after that whole fiasco in Arizona when I was in the shoe. And she knew I was in the shoe because she could tell by how quiet it was in the background. And she just was like disappointed, bro.

Like just complete. Like it was like at that moment she like gave up. She just was like, okay, this is going to be his life. Like I need to accept it. Like I no longer have a son that's going to be, you know, a productive member of society. He's not going to be, you know, an engineer. He's not going to be, you know, successful out here.

He's just going to be in and out of prison or eventually catch a life sentence. and so it was that phone call with my mom. It was another incident where some homeboys were trying to start this campaign to actually have me removed. And the very last incident, which happened at El Reno, was watching a Texas A&M football game.

And that's when it hit. I was like, fuck, bro. Like, had you not been this freaking dumbass, you could have been there, not there, you know, physically at that particular game, but you could have been in college. You could have been doing something with your life, you know, because at that time, I didn't know you could go to a community college and then transfer. Like for some odd reason, bro, I literally thought you had to go straight out of high school. And so here I was thinking like, fuck, bro, like, you ruin that, you know, say goodbye to that.

And so it was those three moments that kind of, not kind of, they did, like, when I got out, they made me just, just laser focus on not going back. And I even got to the point to where, like, I told my home was, don't call me, don't, you know, I don't want to kick it. I don't want to go to the club. I'm not interested in any of that shit. Don't bother me. You know, because I, I paroled from an active yard.

I never dropped out or P-Ced up in prison. It wasn't until I got out there. I was like, no, bro, I'm good. You know, like, first of all, none of y'all wrote me a fucking, not even a letter. You know what I mean? Like, forget putting money on my books. None of you guys even wrote me a letter to be like, hey, man, you good? Like, how's everything going?

You know, nothing. So, miss me with that shit. How they react to that? Are you allowed to just walk along? No, they, I mean, they weren't like, oh, we're going to kill you now. They just were like, all right, whatever. You know, like I said, there's not really, that doesn't really play into, play into the whole game unless you're, you know, prison game.

I mean, I just think it's so stupid. Yeah. Like, if someone wants to leave, like I interview, like, motorcycle X motorcycle club club people that were either in leadership or out, who are now out bad. If they have a target on their back for leaving, that's silly. Yeah. anything, even a prison game, someone wants to leave. And for the person, I think the person that's going to go hurt that person is even

dumber because you're going to screw up your whole life because you attack someone that wanted out. Yeah. Like I've been getting some threats in my messenger because I interviewed an ex-leader of the Latin King. And they're like, don't speak about our family without our permission. Whose permission do I have to get to interview? He's telling his story, man.

You're a grown man and you're threatening me who is, not in a gang. I don't care about that stuff. And you're, it's nuts. He starts out with, this is not a threat, but you need our permission. Dude, it's so crazy. This gang stuff. With the officer doofy. Even the Aryan Brotherhood stuff is so silly too, you know, like let the guys leave. They want to start their life. I get that you might be forced to join that in prison. When you get out and you realize there's a whole new world, you know. That's why I think those Brotherhood interviews and the white supremacist interviews are so powerful because they're kind of, you know, kicking back and fighting against that by, you know, changing.

And those are guys that are covered in swastikas and those gang signs, you know. Yeah, dude. It's harder than ever for them. Yeah. Yeah, because, yeah, I mean, you see a swastika. Everyone's like, what the, you know, it's different from any old other gang-related tattoo. But also, too, that's just how the prison gangs are, at least for California. you know, that's just how they are.

It's literally you are going to go out in a coffin, you know, and so. And I mean, I have like, like you just mentioned, I have mixed feelings about that. You know, now that I'm on this side, you know, doing good, I obviously didn't have to worry about that because I was never in a prison gang. But also, too, they kind of do tell you like, hey, that's what it is when you sign up. you're going to go out in a coffin if you want to leave you know so i feel like in an instance like that it's like kind of like you know what the hell you're signing up for but when you're like forced to do that because you know that's just the route that happens in prison that's kind of fucked up yeah and a lot of the guys are forced yeah you either left for the wolves or you're set up by the people that

you said no to yeah it's very hard to navigate yeah yeah how old are you when you got out i was 28 28 i was 28 yeah so tell us about the redoubt so tell us about the redone redemption arc to your story, you know, how you go from leaving, you know, renouncing gang life to where you're at now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, bro, it was actually pretty dope. A lot of the guys that I did time with didn't care that I was like doing the family thing.

And, and, you know, because I was married at the time. They didn't, they didn't care about that. They were kind of like, oh, okay, well, do your thing. You know, do enjoy yourself. So And also too In their mind It was like

I didn't PC up in prison You know like I still held my own I waited until I got out to be like No I'm going to live my life You know so they kind of were like All right whatever No one really gave me shit over it So

You know I get to Live in life All I know is I don't want to go back I think it's bullshit I was like It's stupid in my opinion at that time

once I was out I was like okay I don't need to worry about that game anymore because it's like yeah in my opinion I just was like

doing time is ridiculous like what fuck that right and so I was just like I don't want to go back and I'm you know

just working as a welder trying to trying to find a a more secure job back in Fresno I was supposed to go work with the union in Fresno

to go work on the pipeline as a welder's helper but that fell through and as I was waiting for that my sister was in college at the time doing like upper division stats class and was like

explaining to me what she was doing and I was half like bullshitting but half like I understood what she was saying and I kind of kept up with her and she was surprised by it. And then that was like, that was what started the whole, you should go back to school. And I was like, no, bro, I'm not going back to school. I have a criminal record. At the time, my whole face was tatted, you know, because I hadn't started laser removal.

And so I'm like, no, I'm good. I'm going to go work on the pipeline. I'm good. And like I said, I was waiting, waiting, waiting. And I called one day because I'm like, I should have been gone. And I was second on the list. I thought for sure, like, I'd be on the first job or at least a second job. But when I call, they're like, oh, yeah, man, we called you months ago. But, you know, we didn't get an answer. So we moved on. I was like, well, what number did you call?

Because I never got a phone call. And they read me my number, well, the number that I put down. And for some odd reason, I put my number down wrong. I was like, what the fuck? Why would I ever do that, you know? And then to me, I kind of took that as a sign. Like, okay, this is my sign. And so I called my sister and I was like, hey, I don't know what I'm doing, but I need your help to get into Fresno City College.

And so she was like, all right, let's do this. And so she did everything, bro. She did the placement. She set up the appointment for the placement exam because at the time you had to do a math and a like a reading and writing exam to see like what classes you're going to start off at. and she did that. She set that appointment up. I go in. I take the first math test and I kill it.

It was like I got 43 out of 45 correct. And the lady that's working was like, nah, dude, like we're going to give you the hardest one now. Yeah, like you shouldn't have scored this, you know, you should take the harder one. So I get the harder exam. I do that one. I knew about half of the same.

stuff that was on there because like there was like calculus and some other stuff on there. And then like what I didn't know was or what I didn't know, you know, like any question that I didn't know for some odd reason there would be like someone had already taken the test and like circled the answer, you know? So I was just like, oh, okay, I'll use that one, you know. Whether they're right or wrong, I don't know. But the test put me at either starting in algebra or starting in trig, which was right after algebra. And like I said, I didn't know anything about majors. I didn't know, bro, I was completely

green to all anything college. And my, the counselor, that lady asked me what I wanted to do. I was like, look, I don't know anything. She was like, well, what do you like to do? I was like, well, I like to work with my hands. I like to make stuff. And off the writ, bro, she's like, oh, yeah, you're going to be an engineering major. And I'm like, oh, okay, whatever. I don't know what I'm signing up for still, right? And she was like, well, because of that, I'm going to place you in trigonometry because, you know, you'll get done with the math quicker because you got to do all the math. And so I was like, all right, you know. And, bro, I always say this.

Whenever I tell this part, I never will forget. When she said trigonometry, I was like, how the fuck do you spell that? Right. I was just like, what the fuck am I doing, bro? Like, I don't even know how to spell this damn math class that I'm taking, you know. And so I take off from there and and I did well, dude. I did well. I did every math class because I did all the calculus, differential equations, linear algebra.

I got A's in all of them, you know, physics as well. Any kind of was electromagnetism, you know, mechanics. You know, there's another physics class that I didn't have to take, but I took. chemistry, I would get A's and all of that. And so I had about a 3.9 GPA. And I didn't, bro, like I said, I had the slightest idea what the hell I was going to do. I'm just taking classes.

I'm just like, okay, let's take this class. I got financial aid, so I'm like, all right, cool, you know, financial aid is going to pay for this class. Like I'm not knowing about transferring, you know. It wasn't until like a counselor saw how many units I had taken calls me in. It's like, yo, dude, like you need a transfer. Like you need to get the hell out of here, you know. And so that's when she started talking to me about transferring.

And she's like, with your GPA, you can apply to any school you want to. And I was like, oh, okay. You know, and I asked. I was like, text A&M. She's like, yeah, you could apply to any school. It doesn't need to be in California. And so I applied to Texas A&M, Georgia. Tech, U.T. Austin, Cornell, University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign, Berkeley, UCLA, and Stanford.

And Stanford. Stanford was one. And Fresno State. And I got into all those schools minus Berkeley and Cornell and but once I found out I got into Stanford I was like

yeah I'm going to Stanford that's it UCLA is pretty good too UCLA is good but that's where I wanted to go if I ever had went to college yeah UCA is good

but Stanford's financial aid was was the best like was top dog they

The financial aid covered everything for me. And there's no disqualifications for felonies or anything? No. And do they even on the college application, do they ask for? Yeah. Oh, they do ask if I was a felon. So Stanford asked if you have been convicted of any felonies. Do they question you when you checked yes?

No. I put on there all my felonies because you're supposed to, you have to list them all. And so, and thank you for asking that. Because as I'm filling out the application, because you got to do an on the Common app, right? You got to go on Common App and fill out that. And then it gets submitted to Stanford. And it asked that.

And then I'm thinking like, fuck, dude, I got to fill this out. And I fill it out. And then I needed more room to fill, you know, to keep going with my felonies. And I'm like, nah, bro, I'm cooked. Like, this is, this is crazy. But I still was like, no, dude, send it. Like, it is what it is. You know, like, this was, you know, I was convicted in 2010.

And I was applying in 2020. So my convictions, I put on there, they were 10 years old. You know, like I'm a completely different person. And I got in. I got into Stanford. And their financial aid covers everything. If you don't make, if you make less than $150,000, you have everything covered. Housing, food, tuition, books, all that.

So that's why, you know, UCLA is nice, but they weren't giving me financial aid package that Stanford was. What are your parents think about, you know, kind of like your redemption? So my mom loves it. She's like, especially now that, you know, I'm majoring in electrical engineering and I'm, you know, I have a job lined up as an engineer. She loves it. She's like, this is what I wanted for you all along.

You know, I wanted you to be an engineer. You know, and that was part of the conversation that her and I had when I was in the shoe. She was like, I had dreams of you being an engineer, going to school. Like, I didn't think to myself. that you were going to be this gang member in prison. She's like, I didn't, that thought never crossed my mind. And so she loves it.

She's like, you know, all ecstatic. You know, every time we talk about it, it's praise Jesus. And she just loves it, right? And I'm happy. I'm glad that I was able to do that for her. My dad, he doesn't really understand, you know, the gravity of the situation. Like he's, like I said, he dropped out in sixth grade. in Mexico, you know, he was, what, this was, because he was born in 1950s, so he dropped out

somewhere in like 1960, 19, whatever, 61 or whatever. So he's not too hip, you know, especially, like when I told him, you know, I got into Stanford, he was kind of like, oh, okay, cool, good job, you know. It didn't click, like it still doesn't register, you know. But he must appreciate that you're out of the gang. Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's glad that, you know, I'm on the up and up.

now and so he's he's happy for that but like as far as like realizing how difficult it was to get into stanford and he he has he's clueless to it how old are you now i am dang how old am i i'm 36 i mean you're still young i mean from when you restarted and went to start over going to college and stuff like most people are still actively doing that in their 30s like the gang stuff or criminal stuff you know and it's hard to start over but i think it's a good testament to you could really start over and get a second chance at any age. I mean, when I was, I'm 29 now,

so I got into content right after my 27th birthday. So I had a whole career change and start doing that, you know? Yeah. So it's okay to really, you know, the moral of the story here is it's okay to start over later in life. And some of the most super successful people

in the world didn't start till in their 50s. Yeah. And some later than that. Yeah. So there's so much opportunity. You know, you don't have to, if you're in a gang now, if you're doing any type of criminal stuff.

Like, there's an option. There's another life out there. You can use those skills over on this side. You literally can use those same skills over here. And even if you have to work for someone else for a few years to get to where you want to go, there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, you're working for someone else when you're selling dope. It's not like you're the one that's the, you know, big wig.

You're working for someone else. So it's like, doesn't. You might as well work for someone else without the risk of going to prison. Yeah, yeah. Or getting killed because you came up short or something. It's just not worth it, man. Yeah, yeah, no, for sure. It's not, it's not.

And I, and I like it now because I, I, my, my son, PJ, he's three. And now he can have that legacy of Stanford, you know. He's been living on the campus with me this whole time, you know, so it's like, now he gets to see this. He'll never know that life, you know. And so that's, that's another very, very. probably the best benefit out of all this, you know, is that he'll never get to...

He may hear stories. Of course, by then my book will be out, so he may know some shit through my book, but he won't ever be like, oh, I saw my dad do this one time. You know, he's not going to know that. What do you think is the biggest takeaway in life lesson you want people to take from your story?

Hmm. I would say that, and as corny as this may sound, but like, once you really start to snap out of viewing yourself in such a negative way, like you can really conquer some crazy shit. Like that's what held me back from going to school at first was I'm a convict. Oh, I'm tatted.

You know, people like me don't belong in school. You know, like that's not for me. Like, no, no, no, no. Like, once you get into that mindset of like, okay, I can do this. Like, I can snap, you know, I'm no longer that drug dealer. I'm no longer that, that, that, you know, whatever label society gives us, right? Scum of the Earth, all that stuff, right? As long as, once you snap out of that and you realize, like, no, I can do some crazy shit, like, in a positive way.

Like, bro, it's, it's, you never know where you're going to end up. You never know who you're going to meet. Like, the connections I've made through Stanford, crazy. Like, and like I said, that's what falls back. what you did over here, you can easily bring those attributes over here and have a better life. So I would just say, you know, taking what I want people to see is like not only like once you start believing in yourself, but like education, man. Education is powerful. Like, of course we can look at data.

I'm a math guy. So I would say let's look at the data. Data shows the higher degree, the more money you make. but mentally and how it affects you the way you view yourself and think about yourself, education is powerful, very powerful. Like when I wear the Stanford shirt

and people ask me like, you go to Stanford? I'm like, dang, that's crazy. And I'm like, yeah, I know, huh? I don't look like I go to Stanford. Yeah, that's what I love about you is like you don't look like you go to it.

So it's a big F you to like the people that, you know, and I hope they give you dirty looks and stuff because that shoves it right in their face, you know. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah, especially like if I were a Stanford engineering. Oh, man. There's people I went to high school with that couldn't get into Stanford. So, you know, good for you, man. Yeah, thank you.

I'm really happy for you. And it definitely changes the stigma. Yeah, for sure. And it gives people hope. Yeah. So I appreciate you coming on the show today, brother. And that is great to meet you. Likewise. Thanks for including me in your little podcast run. I know you're doing a couple of shows.

So it's good, bro. And if you ever need anything, feel free to reach out. Yeah, hell, yeah. Thank you. Looking forward to you, being a top engineer. in the country. Yeah. Let's go.

Awesome.