Locked In with Ian Bick - How Childhood Trauma Led Me to Addiction & Destroyed My Life | Paul Doughty

Episode Date: May 8, 2025

Paul Doughty opens up about how childhood trauma pushed him toward addiction, the battles he fought, and what it took to reclaim his life. #ChildhoodTrauma #AddictionStruggle #MentalHealthAwareness #RecoveryJourney #OvercomingDarkness #PersonalGrowth #LifeLessons #healing Connect with Paul Doughy: Website: http://www.pdspeaks.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pdspeaks/ X: https://x.com/PRDoughty Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/p/Pdspeaks-61569442085821/ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://convictclothing.net/collections/convict-clothing-x-ian-bick Timestamps: 00:00:00 Introduction and Guest Background 00:03:22 The Impact of Childhood Trauma 00:07:12 Growing Up in an Abusive Household 00:11:00 Breaking the Cycle of Addiction and Curses 00:14:51 Childhood Signs of Needing Help 00:18:37 Coping with Abuse: Turning to Alcohol and Drugs 00:22:59 Family Secrets and Discoveries 00:26:48 Hitting Rock Bottom: Walking Out on My Family 00:30:27 Journey to Overcoming Addiction 00:34:23 Chaotic Divorce and Home Refinancing Struggles 00:38:05 Transition to Public Speaking After Career Loss 00:41:51 Overcoming Public Speaking Challenges 00:45:28 Spiritual Awakening and Personal Transformation Through Prayer 00:49:17 The Therapeutic Power of Talking and Sharing Stories 00:52:42 Encouraging Teenagers to Ask for Help 00:56:05 Inspiring Change in Correctional Facilities and Youth Mentoring 00:59:22 Guest Appearance and Future Collaboration Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah, thanks for reaching out, man. You know, it's so easy for guests that want to come on the show to just reach out. We look at every email and then respond as fast as we can. Well, thank you. How do you come across the show? A podcast. I did some searching on the web, and I was looking for podcasts in the area. And your name came up because you're pretty popular.

So I did some research, and I thought this would be a good place to tell my story. I'm glad I made the cut. Yeah. I'm glad I made the cut. The platforms open to anyone, you know, like we were talking about upstairs. Yeah, very nice. Anyone with any type of trauma, criminal justice, law enforcement, backgrounds, welcome always to come on the show. Because that's what it's about, normal everyday people. Right.

And you see a new face every day, which is cool. You don't have to look at the same person. talking about things, which is I like because it doesn't get boring. Yeah, it must be good to talk to different people, different stories. Yes, different experiences. Of course. Is this your first time ever going on a podcast? No, no, probably the sixth or seventh podcast over the course of the past couple months.

Now, do you have a book or anything? Yeah, I do public speaking primarily to young adults. And in addition, I wrote a book called Resilience, My Ultimate Superpower. And the book is written as well for teenagers who have experienced trauma or some adversity and trying to help children get over that as I tried as I did. Perfect. Well, we'll have the link to that book in the description of this episode for you too for anyone that's interested. Very good. Thank you. Now, did you grow up in Massachusetts?

I did not. I grew up in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in the suburbs of Pittsburgh. So big Steelers fan and big sports fan from Pittsburgh. So, yes. Were your parents together at a young age? I'm sorry. Were your parents together? Yeah, my parents divorced when I was about 11 or 12 years old.

And what about your siblings? Did you have any? I have two sisters, two older sisters, one that is six years older than me and one that is two years older than me. What do your parents do for work? My father was a machinist and a football coach, and my mother was a choreographer and a dance teacher. Ah, football coach. Yes. Was there a lot of pressure on you as a kid to get into sports?

Not really. I enjoyed it. I went to practice when my dad was coaching. I remember running around the practice field. And that must have wore off on me because football was very important to me. It actually saved my life. I played football from third grade through 12th grade. And I played rugby after that.

But yeah, in third through 12th grade, I played. And I tell this story, six, seventh and eighth grade, I walked a practice one mile each way for three years. because my parents had divorced at this time, and I was more or less on my own, and I walked to practice one mile for three years, and I always asked myself, why in the hell did I do that, right? It would have been so easy to quit. Nobody would even have noticed, but it was my family. It's where I felt safe. It was where I could release some frustration and maybe, you know, and get rid of some of that frustration. So football saved my life, quite honestly. If I wouldn't a walk to practice for those three years. I don't know what else I would have been doing. I was,

I was in a bad time after that, during that time. How would people describe you as a kid? Quiet? I would think quiet, shy. Yeah. Yeah, I would say shy and quiet because of what I experienced, I was kind of, you know, shy and quiet. I kind of kept everything in. When was the first time you experienced trauma as a child? When I was about four years old, I think it was about four or five. But at four years old, I heard an argument. My parents were in the kitchen with my uncle. And my father was sitting at one side of the table.

My uncle was sitting at the other. And my mother was standing in the kitchen. And I heard an argument. Again, I'm four or five years old. So I peaked around the corner. And when I peaked around the corner, I saw my father pick up a half-gallon glass milk jug, the old milk jug. They weighed about four or five pounds, I read.

And he smacked my head, my mother over the head. She falls to the ground. I thought she was dead. She just laid their motionless. So that one incident when I was four or five years old changed my whole life. I actually kind of stepped through life in a fog, just going through the motions for 30 years after that. Not until 35 years old did I get out of the fog and the funk that I was in. How did you react after you?

saw that happen in that moment? I don't know. Because I really did because my sisters have told me other stories that have occurred and I don't remember any of them. And so that one incident really did. I shut down after that. I don't remember any of the fighting, any of the arguments, a couple things I remember, but not until my sisters told me some of the stories did I know them. Did that change your perspective on your dad as a father in that moment? I think it would have to. It had to. I probably didn't at the time.

But, yeah, it had to change the way that I thought about him. And, yeah. Did they separate right after that? No, no. We lived in that house with domestic violence for eight years. So it started when I was about four. and they divorced when I was 12. I think one of the latest things that happened, again, my sister told me this.

My father was chasing my mother around the house with a knife, and my sister called the cops, my younger sister Lisa. And they called the cops and the cops didn't do anything. This is 1970, 72. So they didn't do anything. They actually, I looked it up. I was like, why didn't the police do anything back then? And I looked it up and they said they were actually trained to take their time to be slow to respond because it would resolve itself. That's what they were trained back in the 70s.

So it just continued. That abuse just continued until we, until 12, until they divorced. And again, I think my father beat up my mother and knocked her teeth out. And I think that was the deciding factor. Did your dad have any problems with drugs or alcohol? Yeah, he was an alcoholic most definitely. Did you know that at the time? No.

No, but I mean, you see pictures. He's always had a drink in his hand. I mean, it's a family thing, not just my father. I mean, alcohol was big in the family. It's an Italian family. My father was an Italian, but yeah, he drank a lot. My sister told me that he used to sit there. My mother, again, she was a choreographer.

So she always had theater shows late at night and then she went out with people afterwards. And my father would just sit there and drink and just pound on the table, just waiting for my mother to get home. And then when she got home, that's when the shit would hit the fan. And my sister, Lisa, used to be with my mother a lot of times because she would go to the shows or whatever. So she came home to that as well. So, yeah, he was an alcoholic for sure. Do you remember if your mom ever took, you know, precautions to shield you guys from your dad? I don't know that. No, I don't know. I don't know. I don't think she did because we lived in it. And, you know, after my parents divorced, my mother wasn't around. My father was gone. He was doing whatever. But my mother wasn't around. We lived on our own. I was on my own from the age of 12, 18.

Wow, who'd you stay with? Well, we stayed, we had a roof over our heads, but that was about it. You know, we would move from apartment to apartment. One month would have no electricity. Next month would have no heat. I used to go out and collect soda bottles to get something to eat. You know, it was survival. It was survival from 12 to 18.

And I was into drugs and alcohol, and I was doing everything that I shouldn't have been doing. So were you in like a shelter or a group home or anything? No, no, never go. not to that point. And it's a good question because, you know, if that would occur today, social services would be all over you. But no, nobody was around. It was, we, we lived in the house for probably that we lived, the grew up in for our three years before we start moving to from apartment to apartment. So we lived in that house for three years by ourselves, the three kids. Did you ever find out why your dad had so much anger? No. But, you know,

it's a great question. I think there's two answers to that. One is generational abuse. My grandfather was abusive. It just runs in the family. And I just found out about this recently. A cousin of mine called me and told me about some of the abuse that they witnessed and were a part of from the family again.

So, you know, and I always wondered, why didn't anybody do anything? You know, why didn't anybody? Because it was normal. Everybody was doing it. Everybody was beating everybody up. And it was part of life. And I thought that as well. That it was had, I mean, I grew up from four to eight, twelve like that.

That's normal to me. And we used to hear the same abuse happening in the house right next door. Same type of fighting and arguing. And so it was normal to me. I thought it was normal. Did he ever put his hands on you? No. He did hit my sisters a couple times.

Nothing, you know, no major beating. But just because my, I think my sister was covering my mother and he was hitting her to get to my mother, I think was what happened. But he didn't beat, didn't beat me at all. Why do you think your mom stayed with him for so long and tolerated that? Good question. I don't know. You would think, you know, you would move on. But again, I think it was normal.

Her father was abusive. So her father used to beat up their kids, her brothers and sisters. My mother was the golden child, if you will, of the family. So she didn't get any of that abuse, but he used to beat up the kids, my grandfather. So again, it's just, it was a normal part of life back then. It kind of shows how generational curses get started and also how addiction gets started too and how it gets passed down. Isn't that the truth? Absolutely.

because it again, and that's what I was doing. I was doing the same thing. I was drinking heavily. I was doing drugs and snorting cocaine and doing everything. It was part of life, right? And not until I got out of that funk did I start to really live. You said this place was steps from the water. We just haven't found the steps yet.

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Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Abandonment is a, you know, a feeling that we all have. But yeah, most definitely. And how do you think that's affected your social relationships as you get older? Well, it did because before I, you know, seeked therapy, I was doing all the wrong things. I was drinking. I was going out and, you know, I was playing rugby at the time as well.

So, you know, we'd be traveling on the weekends. We'd be drinking and snorting cocaine and do all the bad things. So, yeah, it just continued until I put a stop to it. Did you ever try to ask for help at school? No. Yeah. And isn't that funny that we don't ask for help? And, you know, I talk about that when I talk to the teenagers and the young adults because 65% of teenagers that are struggling for whatever reason it could be, abuse or whatever it may be, 65% of don't ask for help. Only 35% of young adults who need help that are struggling with, you know, a lot of different things. Only 35% of, 25% ask for help. And why do you think that is having lived it yourself? Yeah, I think there's probably a few reasons.

One I think in most deaf is that a lot of people feel that they're being labeled as somebody with a problem, you know, that Paul has a problem. And it's all about how people will think about Paul because he went and they seek help and, you know, Paul's a little crazy, needs help. So I think that's the biggest thing is social judgment on how other people will think of me. if I were to get helped. So no one on your team or in the school saw that you were just like this lonely kid walking, you know, a mile to sports or kind of, you know, maybe even going through it.

I'm sure you showed signs of distress, right? You would think so. Yeah. I mean, yeah, nobody recognized it. I don't know if I hit it well, but nobody recognized it. Do you wish someone did? I'm sorry? Do you wish someone did?

Of course, yeah. If anybody could have helped eliminate that abuse for that number of years, yeah. Because, you know, witnessing it once or twice is different than I would think than a continual abuse of home where, you know, almost every night it's like fighting. I mean, it was fighting, you know, punching and hitting and screaming. and it wasn't it wasn't just arguing, which a lot of, you know, which a lot of people do.

What would you do in those moments? Do you have like a safe place at home or? We used to hide a lot. I remember, I remember actually huddling up with my sisters and just kind of trying to feel safe. I know my sister had a, like a police place for clothes,

a little treasure chest. Like she used to hide in there to get away from the abuse. And so my first. father wouldn't find her. So, yeah, we used to hide. And there were signs. I mean, if people would have looked at it really looked deep, they would have recognized the signs. I mean, I was, as an example, I flushed all my, my sister's baby dolls, the Barbie dolls, all the heads were flushed down the toilet. I mean, I wouldn't think I needed help or anything. There was one time that my sisters were watching me and they wouldn't let me do something. I don't know how old I was,

probably 10, 11 years old. I said, I'm going to go hang myself. So I put this rope around my neck. I tied it around the tree. I'm hanging from the tree. They look out the window out of the window and see my feet hanging. They thought they'd come running down and I was laughing. But, yeah, there was obviously signs that I needed help.

But I was just a mischievous kid back then. They probably thought. Were you and your sister's close? And did you guys discuss what was going on in your household? No. You know, it's funny, forever. I mean, not until I started this public speaking. Did anyone talk about the abuse?

Ever. Never. Never discussed. Never mentioned. It was like it didn't happen. And while I'm thinking about it, my mother just, I don't know, five, six months back, said, Paul, I'm sorry. I'm sorry for always leaving you alone.

She said that to me. That's the first thing that was ever said, ever. Tell us about how sports helped you escape through this time that you were mentioning earlier, those frustrations. Yeah. Yeah, like I said, I played football from third grade through 12th grade. And, you know, it was big in the family. My dad was a coach. My uncle was a coach.

Football was always around. So I think it kept me, it allowed me to not self-isolate because usually, when you're depressed and you're having trauma or whatever, adversity, we tend to self-isolate and just, you know, sit in a room and stare at the walls, which I've done later in life. But yeah, I was able to social and communication skills. I was able to develop because I wasn't self-isolating. So I think that and it provided me, you know, I think that's where my resilience started too in football.

I'm just, you know, getting knocked down and getting back up. I was always one of the smaller kids. I wasn't one of the bigger kids. So I think it helped me just persevere and continue to move forward in trying to overcome. I think sports truly helped me do that. Did you ever wonder how your dad treated the students on his team that he coached at? Because I'm sure they idolized him or looked up to him. Then little did they know he had like this dark life at home.

Yeah. No, I would imagine they looked up to him because. I mean, that's what you do when you're a fifth grade, sixth grade football player. I mean, you're your coaches, your idol for the most part. So I would think that they thought really highly of him. He was well respected in the community, just as my mother was. When would you say is the first time you turned to drugs and alcohol as a coping mechanism? I would say after my father left, around 12, we had a cabin in the woods,

and we used to steal alcohol from everyone's house, and we used to go down the cabin and drink it and have fires and do all the little stuff the kids do. So I would say at 12 I started somewhere around there I started drinking. And what was the feeling that gave you? I hated beer, I remember. I was like, oh, is that horrible? How do you guys ever drink that?

But I'm sorry, what was the question again? That feeling. What did that give for you? Probably numb, numbness. It eliminates some of that sadness that is underlying because, you know, there's always when normally when someone is indulging in alcohol and drugs at a heavy level, not just socializing, there's usually an underlying factor almost all the time. And mine was abuse. and I think I turned to drugs and alcohol to hide, to continue hiding is probably what I was doing. Did you envy the kids I had probably on the outside normal families, like a loving mom, dad, siblings?

Always. I still do. I still do. Yeah. Because that's always something that I wanted, right? I even wanted it for my kids. I was married twice. And my second wife, I had a child. with and I stayed with her much longer than I should have because I wanted to stay for him. I wanted one child to have both parents and that's what I was trying to do. So I stayed in a relationship probably longer than I should have for that reason. Do you think that trait that you carried was from your childhood, like wanting to stay for the sake of the child? No.

I think it was more of I have six kids altogether, three step kids. and two with my first wife. So again, I was just like, let's have somebody live a, you know, have a two both parents. I mean, it's what I wanted. It's what I wanted for one of my kids. But so that's what kept me in that relationship. What did you want to do in life when you were in high school? Like what were you thinking about your future back then?

Yeah. I wasn't, I didn't have any ambition. I really didn't. I was going through the motion. So, again, I went to high school. I liked my physics class. I said, well, I'll major in physics. You know, no thought.

I don't know how many kids say that. So I majored in physics and just stepped through the motions. That was what was next. So I got out of college. You know, I was playing rugby. I met a friend from high school. And I ended up getting married and having two kids because that's what you're supposed to do. So I just did that.

that as normal as you as a normal person, but the whole time I was doing that, I was lost. I was lost. And as I told my daughter, she was at what she came going on the talks that I did. And I told her, I said, I could have been married to Marilyn Monroe. And it wouldn't have mattered because I was just, I was lost. And you think that all stem from that first scene at the table? Yes. Yes. I know it did because I don't remember anything after. So it had to. There's no other reason. And perhaps it was reinforced with the continual abuse that I was witnessing.

Maybe that, you know, even made it deeper. But I know that that one incident was the incident that made me go through life in a fog. How was your relationship with your dad as you grew up through your teenage years? I didn't see him much. He smoked a lot. and he had emphysema. He lived on an oxygen machine. He would kneel down on his knees on an ottoman, on his elbows on an ottoman,

and that's how he would live smoking cigarettes with an oxygen machine like this until he died. Yeah. Why the knees on the ottoman? Is that just comfortable? Because he couldn't breathe. Because if you're kneeling, I guess when you have emphysema or whatever, you can't breathe. So by being kneeling down, he'd be able to. was able to breathe easier.

Do you think your mom had closure when he passed, or did she never talk about it? Never talked about it. Yeah. It was never. Again, never, never once. When her teeth got knocked out that I mentioned, I didn't know that. I didn't know at the time. I mean, I was even in high school, well, no, 11, 12 years old then.

I didn't know what happened. I didn't know until recently that the reason why she didn't have any teeth was because of my father. She just told you recently? Yeah, well, I think my sister told me recently. Recently, the past year or so. How was your relationship with your siblings as you got older going through the motions of high school college? It was good because, again, my one sister was six years older, so she was getting married and moving on. My other sister was two years older.

We actually went to the same college. I went to a, as I said, I majored in physics, but I went to an education school. No thought again. But I'm sorry, I got sidetracked. Your relationship with your siblings. Yeah, it was good. But, you know, again, they moved on. They moved on to their lives.

My sister started working for a church and doing youth ministry, I should say. And then she, as she was moving forward in her profession in the youth ministry, she started not they would throw nuggets of of religious things or different things just to try to get through to me, right? But I was at a point, well, I don't need help. I was fine. I didn't need any help. So, you know, my mother had given me books that sat on the shelf for a couple years and not until I started to break through the fog and use these different things that were provided to me. and those things helped me move forward.

How did your struggles with alcohol and drugs progress as you got older? It just got deeper and deeper. I start with, you know, slow gin, I think we stole a lot of times. We used to do that too. I remember one kid, we had a bottle of slow gin, he drank it all, and then he threw up in the snow, and it was like purple everywhere. It was the grossest thing in the world.

But, yeah, we used to just still, and I think, it just, I used to get, you know, when I quit drinking, I was straight vodka, as an example. So I think it just got worse and worse, right? You need more, you know, beer didn't work anymore. So I need, you know, vodka. And then, well, you know, the vodka is not, let's start smoking some weed. Okay. Okay. Now we'll start snorting some cocaine. And so it just continued just gets worse and worse. When did you first realize you had a problem? Probably when I started therapy. I started therapy at 35 and it was apparent that I didn't remember anything. So the therapist contacted my mother and said, you better write Paul a letter

and give him some context on what the hell happened. Because again, I didn't know. So I didn't know that it started at four years old until my mother wrote me that letter. So she wrote me a letter and kind of gave me some context. So that kind of helped me break through a little bit. That letter, some therapy. And, you know, I started to... How many discounts does USAA auto insurance offer? Too many to say here. Multi-vehicle discount. Safe driver discount. New vehicle discount. Storage discount. How many discounts will you stack up? Tap the banner or visit usa.com slash auto discounts. Restrictions apply.

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You know, it takes a lot for especially a man who's older to say I'm going to go to therapy. It's a good question because I don't know. I don't know what made me take that step. I don't know what it was. But I know that it took me there. But it was, I don't know if there was anything in. particular. Again, I think that I started to just break through some of that fog with just having some knowledge of what happened. And not until I did that, did I start to understand what I actually

was going through. Do you think you had like a rock bottom moment? Oh, I had to what it was. Well, yeah, I would say, you know, when I left my kids, I say when I walked out on my first wife and my two kids, I would say would be rock bottom. Why did you do that? Because I was lost. I was lost. I started therapy, though. I had already started therapy. So I kind of started to wake up and it was like, I don't like where I am. I don't like this. Because I married, I ended, you know, through therapy, and I ended up marrying my mother. My first wife was kind of like my mother. She was very, you know, needy or she, you know, she was very caring and so forth. So she kind of filled that role of my mother, I think, is what I kind of learned through therapy, my first wife. Would you advise

people not to do that, like go for the traits of their parents in a significant other? But don't we do that? Yeah. Yeah. Yes, I would try to stay away from that. Yeah. But again, I wasn't, I wasn't in the right frame of mind. So not until I walked out of the, with my wife and kids that I, that was rock bottom. Did you form relationships with your wife's father specifically because you kind of lacked a father figure? No, no. I never really gravitated towards, towards that. My second wife, maybe a little more, my second wife, he was very strong.

My second wife's father was very strong. and a little rough around the edges, you know. So he kind of filled that role for a little bit, I would say, yeah. Were you ever open and honest with your wives about what you had went through? No, never told them. Isn't that something? Do you think that led to the divorces? No.

No. No. Well, the second wife, I never told her. I told her that I witnessed abuse, but never told her any of the details. My first wife never mentioned the thing. Now, were you still actively drinking and using drugs throughout these relationships? Yes, yeah. Did they know about it?

They probably didn't know the extent of it. Because one time, as an example, my first wife, we had some cocaine and she was there when we were doing it just once. So she knew that we had done it, but she didn't know that it was all the time. Now, describe your drug use. Were you someone that wasn't even working and kind of just spending his last dollar on drugs? Or what was life like? No, I was actually in IT for information technology for 30-some years. So during that time, I had a pretty good job.

I was climbing the corporate ladder, doing IT, you know, doing project management and program management. So I continued to do the drugs and alcohol as I was. starting my career. Go ahead. Go ahead. And I think it stunted my career, obviously, not being totally there. So I know it slowed me down. And do you think in a way that kind of made you more depressed and lost as well?

The alcohol? Well, not advancing in your career and that kind of stems back to. No, not at that point. Later on in life, my career, something similar happened, which did, impact it, yeah. Do you feel like you lacked kind of purpose? Yeah. Yeah, I had no purpose.

I didn't know what my purpose was. I was, you know, I wasn't treating people right when you're doing drugs and alcohol and, you know, running around. You know, I apologize to so many people since. So, yeah, you don't treat people right when you're in the wrong spot. Did your mom or siblings know about your drug use at all? they knew that I got high. They smoked marijuana because I used to have it all around. But they didn't know I was – well, I probably knew I was doing some cocaine, but again, not to the level that I was.

Once you got into therapy, how long did it take you to start realizing, you know, what these, you know, root issues were and how to fix them? It took me three years from the time that I started therapy until I quit drinking. So, I mean, that was a three-year period that I was finding myself. And your question again? About how long it took you to start realizing those rude issues once you got started in therapy. Yeah, it did take the three years. But I was still pretty much. at a bad spot until I hit that three-year mark.

I was still, I had left my wife and kids, I was playing rugby, I was drinking and doing the wrong things. So, yeah, it took a long time. And this is when you were 35? 35, yeah. And you quit drinking at around 38? 38. September 12, 1998 was my birthday. I just decided to quit.

It wasn't like I, that I had to, like, do anything. It was, I was praying and I said, I need some help, and that's what came of it. I just cold turkey and never have gone back. Including the drugs, too? Yeah. Well, the cocaine. I suffered from a Lyme disease for 10 years, which I got high then, marijuana, because it kind of helps your muscles and joints and so forth.

So, yeah. Wow, so you haven't had a drink in all those years. 26 years, yeah. How does that feel, looking back on it? Well, I have to, I mean, again, if I wouldn't have, I wouldn't be here. So, yeah, it was a saving grace for sure. But now there is a, you didn't just get into public speaking right then and there when you quit, right? You kind of went through more of life and then found that.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, there's a lot more challenges to get there. Yeah, I didn't start the public speaking until, well, I worked for Accenture for 16 years after they let me go a couple years back. It hasn't been long. I was migrating people to the cloud, you know, getting companies to the cloud, Fortune 500 companies to the cloud. And now everybody's in the cloud. Now they're going AI. So they, Accenture got rid of, I don't, 30, 40,000 people and just cleaned house. to invest in AI. I thought they still need the cloud, though, no? Yeah, but everyone's already there. So there was no more people to recruit? There's no more, I shouldn't say there's no large organizations that need to move from a local environment to the cloud. They're already up there. Okay.

We moved a lot of them. I've never heard of a Centra before. Accenture, yeah, it's a consulting company, a large consulting company. How old were you when you lost your job? um, 62. Were you getting ready to retire at that point or? Wow. This is a story. Yeah. Share with us. So, um, I was getting a divorce and, um, I had to refinance the house. So we, we were in the, um, we were in the courthouse all day long. We finally came to a resolution. My wife, my ex-wife, um, she, She left.

So I came back home that night. And she was packing up things. And the agreement was that we were supposed to come together and take turns. I'll take this. You take this. And, you know, sure, that works. So I came home from wherever and she was packing up stuff. And I said, what are you doing, kleptomaniac?

And so she kept packing things up. So there was a picture of my son, say, I'm playing football that I know. wanted. So I went and grabbed that picture. And I started walking away and I walk away and I get hit from the back. I get hit again from the back. And then the third time she hits me. And I'm like bending over the couch. I have my phone in my hand. I'm trying to get a picture of this holding that picture that she's trying to get. And she's beaten, you know, beating my backup. So I just dropped the picture and I left and the cops came and took her out of the house. They arrested her for that.

They didn't arrest her. They just took her out. If it were me, you know, if it was a man that they came for, I would have been handcuffed, thrown in jail and everything else, but they peacefully just had her get her stuff and she left. That was, but what I was getting to is, so part of the agreement was that I had to refinance the house so I could give her her portion.

So I'm in a middle of refinancing. I'm approved by two of the largest mortgage companies out there. I have two approvals because I said, I'm not going to get one and then something happened. So I had two approvals. The first approval, they said there's an ancillary lot. They said there's something wrong with that. We can't do it. The other one said, no, we can't do it.

Okay. And then I lost my job. I get a phone call. I lost my job. Middle of refinancing, trying to get divorced. I lost my job. Can't get financed now. So I contacted another my local mortgage guy. And he got me financed. And I was able to pay her off to get her out of the house. I would have had to wait until I paid her to get her out of the house if she wouldn't have had attacked me and finally got out of the house. but that's how I got her out of the house. And before that, I slept on the couch for four years.

She wouldn't leave. For four years, she had cheated on me for 12 years. I didn't know. And I slept on the couch for four years. She wouldn't. I had so many different offers. I tried everything to get rid of her, but she wouldn't leave. So I slept on the couch for four years.

And not until this incident happened did I finally get out of that relationship. Why would you want to stay there? You didn't want to just go get like an apartment or something? I live on the beach. I have a beach house. It's right on the beach. So I wanted that. That's why.

And you can't leave. Once you leave, you lose your leverage. And, you know, each state's different. But Massachusetts, it's pretty tight. Have you talked to her since? We don't talk much, no. No, I see her driving around town, but that's about it. Yeah.

So that happens and then after you lose your job and you refinance the house? Yeah. So I started to try to find another job in IT, but I'm 60 years old. Nobody wants a 60 year old IT guy. So I tried for two years. I mean hundreds and hundreds of resumes and interviews and everything and always got to the end and it was like, nah. So I always wanted to do public speaking.

And so I started. I joined an organization. started developing a speech and it's taken me a year to get to where I am, but I have a good speech together now. I have a promotional video finally. So I'm finally starting my, starting to make some progress. Why did motivational speaking, public speaking, appeal to you? Because I want to help others. It's pretty easy. And I'm starting at the young adult teenager level because I think they need help. I mean, I would hate to be a teenager at this day and It's so hard with social media and the digital landscape they're dealing with.

It's out of control. Why do you think it took you losing your job and not finding another job to force you into that? Like why not chase your passion years prior if you were passionate about it? I think it's faith. Fate. It's fate. I think it's something I always wanted to do. I always had it in the back of my mind, but I couldn't do it because of the relationship I was in.

so I had to wait and yeah, they just had to wait for it. What were you studying to become a public speaker? Like what interested you and what were you doing to kind of like prepare? Because you had no background. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you came from IT. Right. I was a program manager in IT, so I did a lot of meeting facilitation and presenting, you know, slides from PowerPoint.

So I did have a lot of experience, talk. like that, but it's quite different to public speaking. But it's funny because my sister was there one time. I don't get nervous. It's funny because usually when, you know, a lot of public, a lot of people, that's their biggest fear is public speaking. But it's funny. I don't get nervous.

And I consider that because I'm prepared. You know, if you're prepared, you're not so nervous. And I would go in there with not knowing. knowing what I was going to talk about, it would be a different story. I do a lot of public speaking. I'm always nervous as shit, but I'm able to, like, push through and I do fine. Once I'm rolling, I'm good. Yeah, once you get over that home.

Yeah, but I'm always so nervous, no matter how prepared I am. Now I don't even prepare. I just wing it, and I'm pretty good with that. And I never get nervous with this. I think when I first started sitting down with people, I was nervous now. Oh, really? Yeah, I would say so because you're asking, like, I guess the bigger the platform grows more comfortable you get because then people are looking up to you in a certain way.

Right. But back then, when I first started out, you know, there wasn't, I was just a kid. Well, I'm still kind of a kid, but I was just like asking these tough questions to people have been in prison, you know, for years and years. And, you know, I didn't really know what I was doing. I was just starting out in it. And they just trusted me. And you build more confidence through that.

That's right. Now when people come in here, they're the nervous ones. And I have to assure them it just, you know, just start. again, it's just a conversation, you know, it's just, it's talking. There's not really much preparation that goes into it. Yeah, true. And I think those are the best interviews because you can kind of fish out and see where the direction it goes.

Yeah. Well, you do really well. Yeah. Thank you. Yes. So tell us about your first public speaking event and what that was like for you and where it was. Yeah, it was a high school in the Pittsburgh area. And, you know, I have my presentation has changed a lot.

Obviously, it changes all the time. But the first one was kind of cumbersome. You know, it always is the first one. Because I felt like I was talking to the kids, not with the young adults, because I was kind of just regurgitating what I remembered for my speech. Right. So it was more of a presentation than a conversation. So I think what I've learned since is you have to bring them involved, you know, make them involved and make it a conversation. them make it a conversation as opposed to that I'm talking to you.

Did the kids react well to hearing your story? And what exactly did you go over when you started it? What was the hook of it? Yeah, I talk about asking for help because I didn't. You know, never asked for help. So one of the things I talked to them about is asking for help. And then getting involved because sports saved me. And so the second thing that I talked to them about is getting involved to develop character and valuable life skills like communication skills and so forth.

And then the third thing is embracing self-discovery, taking that first step out of your comfort zone as I did. And when you do those three things, you're really taking action. And when you take action, you're building resilience. So that's kind of my story. And I use my stories to back up those. So I use the stories that we talked about, about the drugs and alcohol, about. about how football saved my life. There was also a supportive adult.

My grandmother was very influential in me still being alive. Has it been hard to reinvent yourself in kind of like this act too for yourself? I don't know if it's hard. It's different. You know, this is different from what I'm used to. I'm writing a book as we talked about. I'm also developing or having a TV series developed. for my story. So I have a producer and a director. They're writing it as we speak and they're doing

a pilot that we're going to market to Netflix and others. So it's a TV series. That's awesome. And that'll just be about your life story? Yeah. My book kind of follows my speaking engagements and kind of using that for young adults and teenagers. But the story, the movie will be more about my story about how my mother lived with a priest and she wasn't around and we lived on our own and and all the different stories that come from that. So it's going to be based more on my life than my book is more for my speaking business. Do you feel like you wasted a lot of years of your life by not asking for help? Yes, all of them, those 30. Because I really did. Those 30 years were just going through the motions. It was a shame. It was a shame. You know, I mean, walking out on your

wife and kids just, I mean, it's not easy to do, you know, that's hard to do. But if I wouldn't have, it was part of my growing, it was part of me getting to where I am. How are you able to make peace with that situation? Great question. I think I made peace with it a long time ago. to let go of that guilt. Because what I did, one of the things that kind of broke me out of the funk is I was assigned to a project in Cleveland. And so I go to, this was the night that I told my kids that I was leaving. So I go to Cleveland to the project site and it's right next to a church.

I never used to go to church. I never had any interest in church. But I went over at lunch hour a few times and ended up meeting. with the priest. So I wrote him a letter to the priest and met with him. And I kind of said, I'm going through all this change. I just left my wife and kids. You know, I'm in this dark space. And he just said, just pray. He said, just pray. What is it that you want from me right now, oh, Lord? So I left with that. A couple months later, I'm sitting at a bar, drowning my sorrows, sitting there drinking it's busy the patriots everywhere a couple bartenders a DJ playing music

behind me and I'm sitting there drinking my vodka and I say I look at this bottle of vodka behind the bar and I say what is it that you want from me right now oh lord and soon as I said that the DJ behind me said yes that is God I was like all right I didn't turn around to look at him I didn't need to I knew he was talking to me and this is part of my awakening, the three years that we talked about. And then another time I was in this busy public area by the beach. And for some reason, I was looking for a place to pray. Again, I don't always look for a place to pray, but this day, for some reason, I was looking for a place to pray.

So I said I'm in this busy coastal beach area, public area. So I said I'll just drive this coastal road to see if I can find a place to pray. So I'm driving along the road and I come down this hill and then there's this big opening at overlooking the ocean. So I pull my car down and I come walking up and there's this circular formation in the ground. It was a labyrinth. Labyrinth have been used for thousands of years as a spiritual tool for meditation and reflection. And a labyrinth has one way in and one way out.

It's a circular thing. So I started walking through. It's like a maze. So I walked to the center of the labyrinth. And in the center of the labyrinth, there's a little pile of rocks. And sticking out of this rocks is a crucifix of Jesus. And this overlooks this ocean that has a lighthouse that flashes one, four, three. The light flashes one four, I love you.

So that was, that was, so I started to get very, I don't want to say very, I became more spiritual. The book that my mother gave me two years earlier that sat on the shelf called a 101 ways to transform your life by Dr. Wayne Dyer. And I started reading that. It was a cassette tape, started listening to that. And again, all these things, these little things all added up. And that brought me to the point where I was praying and I quit drinking. So it was those times where I dropped my guard.

I broke down that wall that I was hiding behind. And then I started to get help. I started to get some therapy. I started to get some information from my mother. I started to read some information. And that's what opened up my heart and my mind. And I was able to start feeling again. Was it hard for you to open up to a therapist when you first started seeing her or him?

Yeah. Yeah. I didn't, first time ever. I didn't know what it was all about. But it's soon, you know, when you start talking about it, that's what you do. you start just throwing up what happened and just talking about it and understanding it, getting some information that it helped me. It definitely helps to talk about it.

Yeah. I think it's therapeutic, especially when guests come on and they share their stories. It goes a long way. It's very helpful. Yeah, I agree. When I got out of prison, I was very anti-therapy and I was forced to do it for a year as part of my conditions of release, like for probation. Yes.

And it took me like two months to open up to this older woman. She was in like her 80s, early 80s still working. And then I got close to her. And then, you know, I opened up and it was good and I wanted to be there. And they kind of pushed her out when COVID hit and they were like restructuring or whatever because they weren't doing really in person. Right. And I stopped going because they paired me to someone new who I didn't really know. A young guy didn't really know me.

I didn't know him. And I didn't want to go through that all of again. Yeah. Now I feel like what I do now is kind of like therapy because you're sitting and talking. and you're vulnerable and you're honest with each other throughout the conversation. I'm sure it does. Similar. Yeah, but I think anyone, you know, coming out of a situation like yours or prison or addiction or anything, you know, therapy is great or just having someone to talk to.

Yes. And that's what, like you said, how, what, what made me seek that therapy? I don't know what it was because it's hard. Like you said, it's hard to do that and to say that I have a problem. I need help. Flowing ad budget on metrics that look great. The CFO sees them. That's bullspend.

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Actual mileage and range may vary. A lot of people don't want to admit that they have a problem. They need help. Do you have friends that you were close with over the years that you were able to talk to open and honestly, or did you kind of feel like they would judge you? Yeah, I never talked to the friends about it either. I mean, it's funny because since I have been doing the public speaking and kind of telling the story,

the number of people that have come up to me and said, yeah, I was in the same type of situation. My parents were this. Yeah, I was an abusive. The people that have gone, again, it was so normal back then. It was, I think it happened much more than we know. And I'm sure there was people that were. around you, they were like, I'm so sorry you went through that and I didn't know you went through that too.

Yeah. Yeah, there were a couple people that did apologize for not knowing. But as I said, you know, I had always wondered why my family didn't do anything. But again, it was such a normal thing that everybody was doing it. That why say anything if that's what, if it's normal. What's something you wish you could tell your teenage self if you were standing right next to him? Hmm. I guess it'll be okay. it'll be okay just trust believe

have faith and everything will be okay yeah and what's a piece of advice you want people to take away from this episode this conversation your story what do you want people to learn from it exactly what we just talked about

don't be afraid to take that first step and ask for help because it does take, it does take some courage. It takes courage to say that I need help and go out and seek that help. And, you know, and just talk to somebody. If it's, as I talk to the teenagers about, just ask for help. Just reach out and ask for help. Just break down that barrier that you're hiding behind and ask for help.

Because just talking about it, as we said, that's what, that's where you start to get better. That's where you start to get better. Do you feel like you've been able to break through to teenagers? Are they willing to come up to you afterwards and talk to you? Yeah, I do. I do. I always want it to be more. You know, I always say if I can just get across to one person, that's, you know, it's worth it.

But you always want to get across to as many teenagers and many people as possible. Because I think my message is not just for teenagers or young adults. I mean, we all have to ask for help and to speak up when we need help. And there's also a whole other side of your story about a message is like reinventing yourself later in life. Yes. That's inspiring, too, to people, people that could see you go out and do something different at a later stage in life. Yes. It's interesting, you know.

Yeah, it's something similar to what we talked about earlier, the entrepreneurship, right? Yourself, I mean, you've done it a couple times. You're doing it again. And I feel the same way. I had tried to start other companies, a real estate investment company or real estate investment and property company to buy homes. I was automating the process to buy home, putting that in a flow that press a button and you can buy a home.

And actually, Quicken Loan stole that from me. Yeah, they brought me in, hey, we want to hear what you're doing. So I came in and they raped me. They took, and they're the guys building it now. Oh, man. Yeah, so there's nothing I can do about that. Signed to non-compete, but they didn't sign it. So it's like a non-compete that has no end date.

But I talked to a couple attorneys. They said they need to see more of what I was going to do of them doing it. And they're doing it. They're putting it together. Yeah, I think there's different types of entrepreneurs. Like there's the ones that go out and build multiple businesses and have like a piece in everything. And then there's like me. I'm kind of like I like what I've built.

and I like it, which is entrepreneurial, but I'm not really in a rush to go do this or do that. Like, I like my thing, you know, and I'm good at what I'm doing and I want to keep perfecting it and making it better. I was talking to someone yesterday, and it's like, you know, there's a lot of big podcasters that do podcasting and then they'll launch brands. They'll do this. They'll do that. They'll do these partnerships, but they're not doing their own editing or their own posting. So I compare myself to me where, you know, I have the show. and I could go off and do other things,

but I'm doing the editing, I'm doing the posting, and I'm building this community responding to as many comments or emails or, you know, I just feel like that's what I'm supposed to be doing and everything else will work itself out. I think you're doing well.

I appreciate it. Obviously, you are doing well with the amount of followers you have and the guest that you're bringing in. So good for you. I was, you know, I didn't know you were 29 years old. I thought you were even younger than that. My goodness, this kid, he's about 26.

Hey, I'm not bad for a 29 year old. Yeah, good for you. You know, you've overcome your challenges and you're helping others too. So I like what you're doing and when I see you go to the prisons and talk to these guards or the inmates. Is that some of the public speaking you're talking about is going in and talk to them or is there other things? Yeah, that's really all the public speaking and do. I do that and I'll do. I spoke at a, what is it, like a sober living home rehab type thing, but it's mostly

correctional facilities when someone invites me in. No one has invited me in in Connecticut, which is very odd. I do like this youth mentoring in Connecticut with like kids affected by the juvenile probation system. Okay. But, and again, they, all of their issues stem from a really shitty upbringing, like the parents or bad homes, parents divorced. Yeah.

Not one of the kids I mentor are their parents together. And the mom, in most cases, it's a single mom who has to work all day and leaves a kid at home and the kid, you know, doesn't really go to school or this and that. And I've also realized a lot has to do with culture. Like growing up, depending on the culture, you grow up in, your parents might not be able to spot who the good kids and the bad kids are to hang out with. Like my parents had a sense of, oh, that's kind of a shady person. person, you shouldn't hang out with that. And I don't think it's the same way in some cultures. I think they're more open to seeing, you know, multiple people be together and not, you know, judge someone, so to say, which you shouldn't necessarily judge someone, but you could,

a parent kind of has that feeling of, hey, this isn't a person you should be around, you know? Yeah. So I think that lacks when certain parents are a single parent and they're stuck working, you know, all day and night. So. Yeah, it's hard. I mean, The kids are on their own, right? I mean, they're on their own, like, not maybe as bad as I was, but yeah, they're on their own as well. Yeah, so I do that, and I do the correctional facility speaking when I got invited. And it's fun, and it gives hope. And I think that the coolest thing is what you go in there and you show them like, hey, you make it through.

There's a whole life with my whole message is user story, you know? Yep. And don't be discouraged about hearing the nose about working some, you know, BS job because you don't really need that, you know. I was working at Whole Foods and I worked my way up, which anyone can do if they have the drive and the determination. But the point is you don't have to get stuck like at any type of place working a minimum wage job when you have this interesting story that you could run with. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you mentioned something.

I wonder if I was one of those kids that the parents said you don't want him. Don't hang out with Paul. I was one of those kids too. I had parents of friends. And, you know, they still said that even after prison. And now what can they say? Now some of those parents watch the show. Yeah.

Good for you. Yeah, there was always a lot of haters. But when you're growing up in like a small town area, you know, they always have something to say. Yeah. Like we were saying earlier, I still get comments. People think this is my parents' basement. I've always wished we had a basement. We didn't have a basement.

It's pretty good. I know. That's what that there's this one guy that always comments, you're filming in your dad's basement right now. It's crazy. a nice basement, I'll tell you that. It's a very nice space. It's our creative space, you know. We add a little bit more each day to it. Yeah. But Paul, thanks so much for coming on the show today, man. Again, thanks for having me. I much appreciated. I enjoyed the conversation and I look forward to watching new shows. Thank you, man. You know, anyone ever tell you you, you look like Vince Vaughn a little bit?

Vince Vaughn? Yeah, the actor. No, no. You got to look them up. You look like them a little bit. He must be a good-looking guy. You are a good look. I thought you were younger than you were. You did. Thank you. I'm sure maybe some single ladies will slide in your DMs. I hope so. Well, thanks again. All right, thank you.