Locked In with Ian Bick - How I Survived Massachusetts’ Brutal Juvenile Detention System | Michael Bishop

Episode Date: February 4, 2026

Michael Bishop grew up surrounded by emotional trauma, bullying, homelessness, and instability, moving in and out of the foster care system while dealing with serious issues at home. Fighting became a way to survive, and that anger eventually led to him being locked inside Massachusetts juvenile detention centers for nearly two years. In this episode, Michael shares a firsthand account of life inside youth detention, including physical abuse by guards and the long-term impact of being punished instead of protected. This conversation exposes the harsh realities of the juvenile justice system and how a broken upbringing and systemic failures shaped the course of his life. _____________________________________________ #JuvenileDetention #PrisonStories #JusticeSystem #SurvivorStory #TrueCrimePodcast #Massachusetts #LifeBehindBars #lockedin _____________________________________________ Thank you to PRIZEPICKS & GOLD DROP SELTZERS for sponsoring this episode: PRIZEPICKS: Visit https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/IANBICK and use code IANBICK and get $50 in lineups when you play your first $5 lineup! _____________________________________________ GOLD DROP: Head to https://www.thedryoak.com/ and use promo code LOCKEDIN at checkout for 10% off your order. _____________________________________________ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ _____________________________________________ Shop Locked In Merch: http://www.ianbick.com/shop _____________________________________________ Timestamps: 00:00 Brutal Beginnings Inside Juvenile Detention 00:40 Childhood Trauma, Homelessness & Foster Care 01:05 Meet Mike: His Story Begins 02:24 Growing Up With Instability & Family Struggles 05:04 Homelessness, Loss & a Broken Family System 08:26 Bullying, New Schools & Feeling Like an Outsider 13:13 Gifted Programs, Mental Health & Acting Out 16:32 Rebellion, Police Encounters & the CHINS Program 23:00 School Fights, Suspensions & Falling Behind 27:27 DSS Group Homes & Foster Care 33:02 Foster Homes, School Incidents & Authority Clashes 40:54 Probation, Drug Tests & Escalating Legal Trouble 46:26 Alternative School, Metal Detectors & Physical Restraints 53:46 Probation Chaos, Failed Drug Tests & Court Dates 56:14 Sentenced to Juvenile Detention 01:01:14 Intake & Assessment Unit: Fear, Isolation & First Restraints 01:11:51 Westborough Secure Unit: Abuse, Trauma & Turning 18 01:20:05 Staff Abuse, Manipulation & Surviving the System 01:31:01 Developing Narcolepsy While Locked Up 01:39:27 Violence, Corruption & Hard Lessons Learned 01:46:03 Other Kids’ Stories: System Failure on Repeat 01:53:37 The Final Straw: Restraint, Investigation & Consequences 02:02:02 Transferred to a New Facility: A Glimmer of Hope 02:08:11 Release From Juvie, Recovery & Life After Lockup 02:13:29 Mental Health, Healing & Breaking the Cycle 02:16:49 Final Thoughts: Advice for At-Risk Youth Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I had a full head of hair at that time, and he grabbed me by my hair and slammed my head into the floor like two, three times. And it hurt, but I still wouldn't let go. And he grabbed my head again, slammed it into the floor a good like two, three times. You know, I started to kind of like, woo, you know, I'm like out of it, you know? He slammed like another like two, three times, total like seven to nine times. By then, bro, I was seeing stars. like all these pants. I like all the pants. They got me to cuff up. I think I passed out for a minute and a pool of like, pull of my tears, bro. Like, I was crying. I was bawling. In this episode,

you're going to hear what it's really like growing up with trauma, homelessness, and the foster care system and how that path can lead straight into juvenile detention. Michael Bishop breaks down the abuse, violence, and physical punishment he experienced inside Massachusetts youth facilities, including what guards were doing behind closed doors and how surviving that system, changed him for life. Mike, welcome to Lockton. Thanks for coming and your first podcast interview ever. It is.

I think those are always the best ones when someone hasn't done a show before. It's like more organic and like I guess less unscripted and just I don't know. I enjoyed them a lot. For sure. I kind of like always wanted to tell my story. But then just like, like I said, I showed you the feelings long. that I've been keeping for like 20 years. Your handwriting's impeccable.

Yeah. I think each one it took me something like a month to fill up or something like that. Like I said, there's more. When I was, you know, swapped and moved and stuff, the other ones were destroyed, I'm assuming. They did not make it with me.

These I actually had to smuggle out in between stacks of clothes. They're in like visits. And yeah, that's how I got those. And just so the audience knows these feelings logs you're talking about are like those black and white composition books that you have. Yeah. That you brought, which is relatable to a lot of guys leave in prison. They always leave with their notes or their journals and whatnot.

I still have mine in my office from way back when. Yeah. We were required to write in them. But of course, you know, I wrote a lot, just everything. Does it feel, I guess, uncomfortable bringing up something from so long ago, like, to have to think about it, something that you put probably to the side for a long time? No, because if you know me, you know that I'm very, I'm like an open book. So I've, I tell a lot of people that, like, I was in, like, Jew v. Jovee for two years when I was younger.

And, you know, some people, I guess are, like, just kind of shock. to like, oh, whoa. But most of the time, the reaction is, like, the way you are, I couldn't tell. So it just comes as, like, surprise, like, really? Like, I can't see it. You know what I mean? And, of course, I don't want to go into the whole thing with just, like, random people, you know? But, I mean, Julie was a wild ride.

Like, I used to, like, beg them to, like, send me to adult. But, yeah. Where'd you grow up? So, I grew up. I was born in Fitchburg, Massachusetts. And so I basically grew up between Fitchburg and Lemmester. When I was younger, it was just me and my brother. And my mom, my dad, about around the time, like, I was in fourth grade,

is when, like, I started to really be, like, in tune to things. I realized my mom was not smoking only cigarettes. She was also smoking weed. But I didn't know it as weed at the time. I didn't, you know, I just, I knew there was something else going on. Has a funny smell of weed. That's it.

My dad, for all intents of purposes, I'll call my dad. He had a bad drinking problem, like really bad. He would like spend a lot of our money. My mom wasn't working. But no matter what we really couldn't tell. I know my brother, I ask him about stuff, he doesn't remember much. But he was spending a lot of the money, but my mom was still making sure we had good Christmases.

Like when we walked out Christmas morning, it was like, it was like packed. Like, you just couldn't tell. So, but we, we did go homeless. And I do remember that. When we went homeless, like, two months, three months? It was in the summertime. How old are you? It was a summer in between fourth grade and fifth grade.

And I was actually taken out of fourth grade, like a week early, I think. And what it was actually, my mom, my mom's kind of a G. I'm not even going to lie. My mom knew that, like, it was DSS at the time, Department of Social Services. Now it's Department of Children and Families. But basically, she kind of had, like, the sixth sense that, like, DSS was going to get called. So she pulled us out of school, like, a week early. And I remember telling the kids that, like, where are you going?

I'm, like, I'm leaving, you know? Like, I have no idea, but I'm leaving. And so, yeah. Yeah, I guess what I found out from my best friend later on in the later on years is I guess like that's like the next day we moved out. DCF had showed up to take us, me and my brother, but we went out there. So we're already camping. We just went, it was done the summer. So we just went camping for a couple months.

Lake Denison and Winch in the Mass. And like I said, like my mom made it. fun so that it wasn't like so like traumatizing only in later years that i look back and say well i remember this this and this and like damn it was kind of like crazy like i don't remember um a lot of fights between my mom my dad but i did find out later on like there were hell of fights between my mom and my dad and um so i don't remember him actually being there a lot when we were homeless like i'm assuming he was like working And according to my mom, he was working, getting caught on the job drinking, getting fired.

She was like, don't even come back until you got another job. So, yeah, it's just kind of like that. I do remember this one crazy rainstorm that I really thought, like, the tarps and stuff, everything was going to come pouring down or whatever. And I asked my mom, I was like, are we homeless? And she looked down on me. And I don't know why, but she looked down on me. She was like, she was like, why would you say this?

that. And she like gave me a little smack. You know what I mean? And I just never said anything about it after that. She, um, she figured out how to how to finangle those little like stove things, how to like make, she could like make cakes. She could bake anything she wanted in those, like birthday cakes, brownies. Uh, we had blueberry pancakes way more times than I could count. And there was fresh, uh, blueberry bushes all the way around the lake. Um, so yeah, there was that. And then a woman that used to own her thrift shop, she's now since passed away, I think. I always swore if I ever won like the lottery or something, I would hook that place up, you know? But she helped us get back on her feet.

So I started fifth grade normally right at the beginning of the year. And that was the change from Fitchburg to Lemester, Massachusetts, just right next to each other. And fifth grade, I started. to notice fights between my parents. My dad had, I woke up one night there was a big fight and he had, I could see them kind of like I was sleeping in the living for some reason. And I looked over and I could see like them kind of next to each other. But I couldn't really see anything. And I'm pretty sure I kind of just like went right back to sleep.

But I found out later on that. he had actually held a knife to my mom's neck and wanted to kill her. And she kind of was like, what are you going to tell the kids when they wake up? And he backed off. And then soon after that, she had actually thrown all of his clothes out like the front window on the, you know, to the main street, whatever. And threw him out. And my, uh, me and my, uh, me and my. brother had started playing with this kid out back there was a big like dirt dirt patch whatever

started playing matchbox cars with this kid um this kid named josh you know and um because you know we wanted to go sleep over josh's house and stuff my mom had to meet you know his dad and uh his dad was actually a single single dad so um that's how my mom my stepdad met and then so josh our friend became stepbrother josh um which now i don't know because consider like stepbrother just like he's my brother you know um so it was still a little rocky um it was like because like i said i didn't really know a lot of the a lot of the bad stuff was going on with uh with my dad um his name was barry you know i didn't know a lot of the stuff was going on with him um until later on you know after the fact so to me it's like that transition wasn't like

really just like clear cut like that because now he get kicked out now i'm going to go i got to go see him every weekend um and then who's this guy this guy's just like going to come in and like try to like be my dad you know what i mean like i'm not cool with that who would be cool with that so um but he did do he did do cool stuff um i don't i don't know if uh if my mom would really want me to throw all of her business out there but like like I said

my mom my mom was a dream my mom went through some shit you know and like um soon after him just being my mom's boyfriend

um there was a lady that lived upstairs from us and like her son had showed primarily my brother some like

like a, like a porn omag or something like that. My mom caught wind of this. So she ends up telling this lady, you need to watch a kid. He's like showing my kid bad stuff. And this woman was like, was like, I don't care what you have to say. And I remember my mom, my mom punched that lady. And her whole cheek just went like boom, boom, boom. I just remember her whole cheek just went, blah.

And I was like, damn. she actually went to jail for 30 days for that. So my stepdad had to watch us for like 30 days. And so, it was, like I said, it was still rocked, we still mouthed off to my stepdad.

You know, what kid doesn't mouth out to stepdad or stepmom or whatever, you know? And, but then when I started to hit like 14 and I was being very difficult. and I was seeing like therapists um one therapist tried to tell my mom that I had an antisocial personality disorder

and my mom was like no way so she got a second opinion and the other guy said no but he does have ODD and so that stands for oppositional defiance disorder um just basically

you don't like authority. But he did say, he did say that he doesn't have it full on because, like, all of my teachers always love me all through school. They were just always, like, Mike is always a pleasure to have in class. Just don't understand why he can't just keep his mouth shut in between classes, you know? And I was, I was in, like, gifted classes and stuff, you know, like honors and stuff.

So I think the summer between the summer between 8th grade and high school, I was offered to be part of the Upward Brown program. And we had moved into like a nice apartment. I think my sister had already been born at that time. And I had always gotten bullied in grade school. first grade all the way to like eighth grade I got bullied it was it was really bad in lemison because I was that new kid like fifth grade you know and then um so I was this upward bound program basically what that meant was you could actually go to college during the summer in between

you know when everybody else having their their summer break you would go to college and by the time you graduate high school you would have like the equivalent of like an associate's degree already in addition to your diploma. But because I got bullied a lot, I was like, if kids my own age bullied me, what are kids older than you're going to do? I was terrified. So the day of the orientation, I like ran away. Wishing you could be there live for the big game, soaking up the atmosphere in the crowd.

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See associate or Lowe's.com for details. Like ran away. And we lived in a primarily Spanish neighborhood. And we were like one of the only white families there. and if I still bump into the Spanish kids from the old neighborhood today, they're always like, hey, poppy, what's up, man? Hey, yo, you remember that one time your mom tried to run you over with the van? And that's not actually what was happening.

My mom was in the van trying to chase me down to drag me to disorientation because she knew she's like he can put this on like resumes and stuff when he's older. And so, so yeah, but to anybody from the outside looking in, it looked like she was like crazy and trying to run me over with that van, but that's not what was happening. And she's going to be happy that I clarified that, by the way. So, because she gets, I've told her this story a couple times and like she gets, she gets hell of pissed off.

Show like, oh my God, why do you tell people that? I can't believe you tell me. And I'm like, no, mom, I don't tell people that. That's what they saw. That's their perspective. And so, so yeah. So I was, so I was, I had this, this oppositional defiance disorder. And I'm being really defiant.

And my mom, you know, tries to, you know, ground me to my room and stuff. And I'm like, I'm not going. I'm not, you know, I'm not staying in my room. And so she, this was a thing in Massachusetts that you could go down to the courthouse. I can't remember. I think one of the police officers told my mom about this. But, because we had, I'm not even going to lie to you. Like, it sounds so trashy, but, like, we had the police at my house all the time, like,

trying to mediate fights between, like, me and my mom. And, um, so you could feel. file this thing um called a child a chins a chins services it stands for child

and need of services chins and basically it puts you like if it was today i would like question like the legality on it because like you don't actually have to commit a charge to be on this and um you basically

you get a juvie probation officer and this woman her name is Karen Gray I have a really good memory like I said I've been playing the story in my head it's just like you know I've had a lot of time to think about this and so this woman Karen Gray she would always threaten to like lock me up if I'm not like listening to my mom and stuff and then if you do good you know whatever you um you get take off the child that needed services and then your parents got to wait like your parents could wait two weeks and then they could refile again and put you back on um so it was like really chaotic um

and same time i'm like i started dating this girl and um stopped really going like with Barry, you know, my dad, on the weekends. It was very, like, infrequent. And it became clear that he had other priorities. His priority was more, like, women. Like, he really was obsessed with, I don't know, I guess, like, what. like what sex he could get out of any relationship or whatever. So I stopped really going with him, started just going, you know, seeing my girlfriend on the weekends instead.

And in high school I was doing, I was doing pretty good. Just to clarify, I never went to that orientation. I actually missed out on that. It's like one of my biggest, like, life regrets is that I never. ever went to that, to that upward bound thing. And like, there's like no proof that I ever was like even invited, I don't think, you know, but like I was, you know. And, um, freshman year kind of went off without like a hitch, you know, like you're new. You're just trying to figure it out. You know, like, it's a bigger school. So like now the bullies that were there in like eighth

grade are not like right there in your face anymore, you know, like they're all over the school because, you know, they're mixed up too, you know? And then, um, but sophomore year, my mom had, uh, had bought me a weight bench and I had thinned out. I was actually only 180 pounds in like high school, like 175 180 pounds. And so I was pretty quick. Um, she bought me this weight bench and I, uh, started lifting weights and then Got into a couple fights, you know, came out to Victor and was like, okay. So like, I'm not getting bullied no more, you know? And sophomore, I had a couple suspensions.

But junior year, I was taking robotics. and I was taking robotics and then a couple general classes, whatever, like math, you know, stuff like that. But I was like almost never in class because in between classes, my mom always said she was like,

if you take the first punch, then you get double the ground. If you, if they hit first and it's self-defense, I'm still going to ground you. But it's not going to be as bad, you know? So I got really good at getting the other person to take the first swing or the first punch. You know, I got these short Tyrannosaurus wrecks arm. So I'm almost like guaranteed to have to like eat that first punch. you know and um so yeah so um the school got really tired of my shit and even my teachers were like so dumbfounded they're like he's he's like great in class but when he's out there we don't have any

control of him in the hallway he's just running his mouth having other people running their mouth to him and he's just, he's fighting. The big game is almost here, and there's no better way to cash in during America's biggest sporting event than prize picks, where it always feels good to be right. This week, prize picks has a special

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in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup. Prize Picks, it's good to be right. Just to give you like a specific instance history class, I was sitting in history class. The bell was about to ring. And I just had this funny feeling that something was about to go down down the hallway. And I told my friend, I was like, hey, I'm about to bounce down down to the other side of school. Because I don't know, I just, I'm going to go check up all my brother, you know? And, yeah. ended up a, you know, the teacher was like, wait, Mike, where are you going? Come on, don't.

You're going to get in trouble. And I was like, no, deuses. And I start coming down the hallway. And I literally, like, as the break in the people, you know, like, this, like, just happens to be like a break in the people real quick. And I see this kid, like, bump my brother. And I was like, oh, hell no, like, the kid starts, you know, raising his fist to my brother. I literally shove people. out of the way. My friend actually ended up coming with me. We were shoving people out of the way. And he was about to strike my brother. He actually ends up turning around. I had shoved this kid. And like he like went through like a group of like people like knocked a couple of them down. Slid on the ground, got back up. It's like a movie. You know, like. And, um, you know, that's just like one

instance. Like even though I didn't throw a punch, as soon as he started coming at me, teacher snatched him up. teacher snatched me up. He gets like two days, you know, just for like, you know, bump my brother or whatever. I get hit off with 10 days because the school was just so sick of my shit. It was like, what, like a progressive discipline thing. So in this whole time, you know, I'm able to like earn my way off of this chins thing. And then I get I get it put back on. You know, so at one point, my uncle even took me in for like a couple weeks because me and my mom couldn't stand each other.

And even my girlfriend's mom took me in for a couple weeks. And I had accumulated 63 days suspended junior year out of 180. So over one-third. I was still passing with B's and Cs. my teachers really love me so um there was a thing in the handbook like you have to get if you got an 100% you actually got a 60% because your punishment of doing work while you're suspended you know doing the work that you miss while you're suspended is you only get 60% of like what it is you know and so um so i was but they they were like hey you know um um um

we'll just take off like 15, 20%, you know, so I was still passing with bees and Cs. And then, um, somewhere in there, I, um, somewhere in there,

DSS actually did get involved. And, I don't remember the exact point where they got involved, but I know I had been arrested a couple times. don't really remember the specifics on that. I remember, I think when I was 14, I went to the Leahy Center in Worcester, which is detention. I think I had, like, I think I'd, like, kicked my mom or something.

Or, like, there was a, there was, like, a scuffle between, like, me and my mom, my stepdad, and they were, like, he shoved me. They were, like, boom, okay, you know. And then, like, the charge ended up, like, getting dismissed, but I still did, like, two weeks in the Leahy Center. I don't remember too much about it, but, um, like, I wasn't a little scared. I'm not going to lie. Like, but like not like super scared, you know? Um, and then somewhere after one of the court dates, uh, DSS got involved. And part of my beef with like the system is, and like, in like hindsight, at the time, it didn't.

seem crazy. Like, it was still, um, it was still a time when like this, this DSS lady, she comes in and she smoked cigarettes with my parents, like at, at the table, you know, in the house, like, it was just allowed, you know? And, um, I remember she sat down in, right off the jump. She was like, uh, I'm Rhonda Rogers, the, what does she say? The Wicked Witch of DSS. What a name. Introducing the new best skin ever ultra-slim precision concealer from Sephora Collection. It's full coverage with a matte finish and perfect for any look, whether you're building it up for a full glam moment or targeting correction for a more natural vibe.

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Please drink responsibly. Camin Jack beverage company, Chicago, Illinois. That was her introduction to the family, that she's supposed to help, mind you. to be honest I've tried to like Google this lady See where she's at now Like is she still working with kids or whatever And I can't find nothing on her

Ronda Rogers Like She had like that heavy smokers like raspy voice Like And she terrified the shit out of us I'm not even gonna lie Like And like she just like

I don't know You knew like she meant business You know And um Pretty much They kind of like threatened my mom. And at the time, my little brother was born too. So there's a, I'm the oldest of five. So, um, technically four that came out of my mom, but five total siblings, you know,

because my step, my stepbrother, you know. So basically my sister and my brother were like babies. They were young, you know? And so, um, they pretty much threatened my mom. They were like, if you don't like agree to like have him like removed out of the house, then we'll just take all your kids. So pretty much it was like, um, my mom like had to agree to it. I mean,

what are you going to do at that point? Like I don't really hold anything against my mom for, for doing that. Um, and, uh, I remember one time we got into a big fight. and it must have been like a Friday or Saturday.

And they said anytime we're here to help, you know, you can call us and we'll find a bed for him to go for the night. And so that you guys can calm down. Eliminates the cops being here and stuff like that, you know, keeps everybody safe, you know. And so my mom called and said, I need a bed for him. And they were like, all right, no problem. but we need to find a bed for him. And so my mom would be like, oh, okay.

And just like assumed that that bed would still be found. And I think it was Monday. They like show up and, hey, we're here to take Mike. And mom's like, wait, no. Like, we're getting along now. Like, you guys waited too long. To me and my mom, like, we get in big fights, but the next day it would be all good.

You know, to a degree or whatever, you know? and um so yeah so basically my mom was like no like he's not he's not he's not going and they were like yeah like we said before is like we're either taking him or we're taking all your kids because the are the volatile arguments between you guys is like not safe or whatever you know so i just was forced to like go with this guy and then they placed you in this they placed me in the spot in Worcester. I want to say it was like the key program. Coincidentally, it's the same place that you go.

Like if you get picked up by the cops and you're a juvenile, like after like 10 p.m., you go to this key program and like it's just an overnight thing. And then the next day you would get moved to that Leahy Center place in Worcester. And so I did still go to like the key program for like the night and then I went to a group home that was co-ed Horizon House which honestly I didn't mind because the staff, Fitchburg State College, or now it's Fitchburg State University, my bed. They is like right around the corner. So the kids that

are in school for in college for like psychology and stuff, they were the staff. They were the staff members. So, um, we got, they took us out on the weekends. They get like, obviously some sort of like spending money, like through the state or whatever. And then we take like, sometimes they break us up like boys and girls, boys we want to go play like arcade and the girls want to like, I don't know, go to the movies or something, you know. And, um, so I actually didn't mind that at all, but like, I didn't like do the best. I did get in a couple fights there. Um, I just stopped taking anybody's shit, you know, really, like, you know? And then, for whatever reason, I don't really, I don't really remember why,

but I was actually going to get placed into a foster home rather than go back to my mom's house. And the foster home I got was just me and the woman. Her name was Tina. and uh Tina had like an older son that like lived in like Philadelphia um so like he wasn't around

it was just me and Tina and then she would always say like she would like work and stuff and then obviously I'm in school it's pretty cool but it wasn't like um I don't really feel like we bonded that much kind of sort of thing like even when I wasn't in school like

I was outside and like playing with like the neighborhood kids and stuff and going down to the park shooting hoops you know whatever and um one day came home and she had picked up another foster kid um a girl jacky um so i had a foster sister and uh soon after that was when i was living in the foster home as I approach the end of junior year. And actually, yeah, I think sometimes when I was suspended, while I was, like, in the foster thing, since Tina works, I think I would just go to, like, Horizon House,

and we would deliver the meals on wheels to, like, people, like, you know, and that's what we did. It was, like, our, like, busy work while anybody's, like, suspended or whatever, whatever and um so yeah so third the last day of school junior year um like i said i was in robotics does like a giant chain to lock up all like um i like the components and stuff like the resistors and all that expensive stuff and i was there to like wear this chain around my neck for like the day and um they were going to give me like like i don't know five bucks i don't know i have no idea it was it was some denomination of money

that was very insignificant not worth it but um heavy chain we're talking like a really thick chain with like couple padlocks on it you know whatever and um went into went into english class uh mr finner's class and this kid who had been picking on me since like seventh grade and I'll be honest Like He was one of those He was one of those kids that it was like I'm not going to take his shit

But like I'm not really sure if I put hands on him If I'm going to win the fight or not You know I did get really good at like Obviously if somebody is like You know six feet tall And looks like got a lot of reach

I'm like I'm gonna hold off running my mouth to him Or you know Unless it's really worth it, you know? So one day this kid was just saying some shit and, you know, it's like, it's like, uh, oops my phone is mean, um, it's like, it's almost like it plays off in like slow-mo, right? I'm looking around the room, all the kids are laughing. It's triggering me. Like, it's pissing me the fuck off. I'm not even gonna lie. And then, um, when I looked over and,

and the teacher, Mr. Finner, he was one of those, like, young teacher, uh, Like young teachers, like he had to be like 24, 25 or something. Like he would sit up on like the desks and like read Shakespeare and all the girls were like, oh my God, Mr. Finner and you know, like. And he was always cool. But like when I saw all the kids laughing and I looked over and I saw Mr. Finner and laughing too, like I'm being bullied. He's laughing.

I'm like, all right. These guys think everything is fucking funny. So like, let's show him what's fucking funny. I fucking got up so quick for my desk I shoved like desks out of the way that were empty you know I went over to this kid I had taken this chain off around my neck and like literally like held it up to him

and was like back the fuck up and he stopped laughing immediately he was like whoa whoa whoa you're crazy you're crazy man you know and um so uh mr finner he stops laughing he's like all right both of you guys get out and go to your dean's offices. But like this kid was like,

and, you know, shout out to Paul Singh, you know. He was like, I'm like, all right, he might not be the type that's going to go and actually sit on his dean's bench. And because I was traded, he wasn't, we had different deans. So I was like, all right. And I did, you know, like I said, I mostly obeyed teachers and stuff. It's just really my mom that I didn't get along with a lot. and the kids, you know, and some of the kids.

But as far as adults and authority goes, I largely listen, you know, like, you know, unless, you know, you were my parents. So I go and I actually sit on this bench and I'm waiting there and I don't grasp the severity that what I just did was assault with either a dangerous or deadly weapon. And I'm sitting there already starting to think of my story and I'm like, this thing had two big padlocks on it. I intentionally did not hit this kid with it because I didn't want to, I didn't want kill him. I just wanted him to leave me the hell alone, you know? So I sit on the bench and maybe

like for like half a period. And I can see the dean's his, um, his door shut. So I said, well, shit, you know, you're not in an, like, he's got an office off the trade room, but it's not like an actual office you walk into. So like, who's going to know if I got up off of this bench just went to my next class? Nobody. So that's what I'm going to do. Um, so I, um, so I, I got up and I went to the next class. And there was a couple of kids in the next class that were in, you know, in the other class. And they were like, how did you not get like in trouble for that? And I was like, I mean, they just said they let me slide because it's the end of the year.

So, I mean, they just don't want to, don't want to jam me up over it. Like maybe like 10 minutes later, the school resource officer. Officer Kramer, who actually passed away like two weeks ago, actually. So RIP to Officer Kramer. School resource officer, I think the principal, and the principal never did anything. It was always the deans. So like the principal, a couple of the deans,

they all came to the class to get me. It was like, you know, we need Mr. Bishop, you know. And I made some sort of common, like, all right, guys, like, I guess my reign's over. you know and um i just left and then originally officer kramer i don't know why the hell he lied to me but he was like no you're not going to be arrested um i'm just going to transport you know like obviously you're getting suspended and possibly expelled um but i i'm going to bring you to your house to go um see your parents and see what your parents have to say about this but because you're getting

in my car i just need you to like I need to like pat you down and stuff real quick. And as he's patting me down, he reaches and grabs my arms and you're like, oh yeah, by the way, you're under arrest. So yeah, so like I said, assault with a dangerous or deadly weapon. And so from there, I went to the Leahy Center. I lost my spot in my foster home. And my foster sister actually borrowed my G-Unit T-shirt that I really liked. And, I mean, she got to keep that.

And so, yeah, so I went to the Leahy Center and I did 30 days there. Um, so at the time I'm, like, 16, about to turn 17. And that would be 2004. Um, so like July of 2000, June, June, June, June 2004 to July 2004. That was, that was like the 30 days that didn't lay here. They let me go. Um, back to my house after that. Um, I lost my spot in the, in the fog.

in the foster home, but DSS still did not want to let go with me. Me and my mom actually came to like an understanding was like, how helpful is DSS? Not very helpful at all if they're just going to show up when like we don't even need them to show up. And so we actually kind of teamed up a little bit. And the next time I went to court, both me and my mom were like, we're like, yeah, we want these fuck heads out of here. You know, like we're tired of Rhonda Rogers, you know, bullshit, you know? and so um and the judge was like all right yeah totally agree

and the thing is is that um so that that probation officer that I was seen because then then they did so they got rid of the DSS but now I committed a charge now I'm on actual juvie probation I'm still gonna keep seeing the same lady that I was seeing for the chin stuff

she already knows me like the back of her hand like she's known since I was 14 you know So, um, so yeah, so I, uh, let me say high school expelled me. Um, but because, I'm assuming because, like, I wasn't on a class and stuff. They were willing to like, um, send me to an alternative school. If you do good there. And I hated that they said, like, if you do good there, because like, I never ended up doing good. It's like, if you do good there, then we'll let you back. into high school and like i'll be honest i kind of already knew like what time it was like you're going to send me to like now an alternative school in milbury massachusetts so it's on the

other side of worcester um with a bunch of angry kids all in one school and like this is going to go good i was like yeah no i'm i'm too smart to think that that's going to go solid like so like kids were asking me like i was um i still went to a couple lemmester high football high football games. I'm not sure if I was even supposed to go or not because I was like expelled. Hey, but to be fair, most of us hop the fence. You know what I mean? And kids were always asking me, they're like, oh, when are you going to come back? When are you going to come back? And I'm like, yeah, I don't know. Like, I might come back, but probably not. It's not likely. And so, so I go to this alternative school. And, um,

I, um, I did okay at first. And I had regular meetings with Lemme Sir High, the principal and stuff like that. Um, and, uh, I still wasn't, like, they kept saying, like, you need to, I thought at first they said, like, maybe you got to go for like a month. And then they were like, well, you know, to make sure it's like not like a fluke or anything let's have them go for you know another another extra two months and then at that point that's kind of take me to like december and like i said i just i was like if i'm already going to be there to december i was like these guys maybe just stringing me along whatever at the same time um kids is starting to like run their mouth at the school to me and uh it's kind of like city by city um i know some of the

the other, some of the other guys that have been on the show, you know, I think what? When you go to, I think it's when you go to feds, it's by like state. What the, who you run with? Yeah. Yeah. Feds is by state. I mean, I guess on the, it depends on which area in the feds. I don't know if every federal facility is like that, but at least the ones I was in, it was by state or the lower facility ones. This episode is brought to you by Gold Drop Seltors. And this, this is one I actually drink. I'm sober, but I still like having something in my hand that feels like part of the moment, not an afterthought. Gold drop fits perfectly. Gold drop seltzers are clean, crisp, and refreshing. No alcohol, no heavy sugar, no weird aftertaste, just a solid

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This school was like similar in the sense that like, even if I was beefing with this kid from my town, well now we're in the school, now we're on the same side, you know? And so yeah, I got it to a couple fights with some kids from other cities. And I found out the hard way that staff can actually. go hands-on. They don't actually warn you about that before you go to the school. Or maybe I didn't read all the fine print or something. Like, I know you went through a metal detector at this school

and that was not normal for me because I know Lemme'ser High never had no metal detector or whatever, you know? And, you know, times weren't as crazy as like now where I think a lot of the high schools are like metal detectors and stuff. But, um, but yeah. So, um, I found out the hard way that the staff could put hands on. And I remember I, this kid had really, like, pissed me off. And I'm not going to lie, like, I said some crazy shit to him. Um, and, uh, I ended up, like, walking away and I punched a locker. And the staff was like, hey, you can't do that. That's self-abusive. And I'm like, I don't give a fuck. Like, I'll do it again. Like, boom, I hit the locker again. He grabs my arm.

Like I said, I was a lot smaller than I am now. I literally shook this guy around and, like, flipped him over my back. He hit the lockers upside down. And then a bunch of, like, staff, teachers. Pretty sure all the teachers at that school were, like, train or restrain, you know, just in case. And, like, they just popped out. They took me down, like, in a heartbeat. Because of that, um, they said, um,

basically, you know, we're gonna suspend you. At this school, like, what would get you, like, a fist fight at a regular high school, we get you 10 days. A fist fight at this school, we get you only, like, three. And for this, they were, like, no, you're out for 10 days. I think, actually, I might have said, I might have said I was going to, like, kill the other kid.

And for that, they were like, oh, now you need to be evaluated. at the hospital, you know, whatever, like, make sure you're, like, good to go. You're not, like, going to harm yourself or others or whatever. And, but they were, like, in addition to that, yeah, you can't come back until, you know, something, something. We're going to talk to your probation officer. Well, around that time, my probation officer that I knew for the longest time and, like,

had a pretty decent, like, rapport with. she ended up moving away to like south carolina um and like i get nosy as fuck i'm not gonna lie and like with google and stuff like that i try to look her up too to see like is she still working with kids like because she was a great juvie probation officer like fair you know whatever and i can't find anything on her either like i have no idea like whatever happened to karen gray you know and um uh but she was solid and um so her supervisor of takes over. And, like, her supervisor, you know, for lack of better words, she's a complete bitch. And, um, she didn't not care how long that like me and Karen knew each other. Um, she,

not that she seemed like she was out to get me, I guess, because, you know, that's, it's kind of wrong to just assume that people are just out to get you. But like, she, I guess, just didn't have a high tolerance for like anything. but she told me that I had to check in to probation after school she called the school and told them to let me know whatever that I had to check into probation afterwards by the time my bus gets back to my city

you know to Lemison it's like 3.30 p.m. you know check in with her and she says yeah you gotta go take her I'm gonna send you around the corner to go take a random drug test I was like, for what? She's like, well, because you're on probation, you get drug tested. I was like, Karen never drug tested me. And she's like, yeah, well, she should have been.

And I was like, no, no, because Karen already knew that, like, drugs ain't my thing. Knock people out is my thing. Like, and to this day, I've still never smoked weed. So she was like, you still got to take the drug test. and I was pleaded with her up and down. I don't use drugs. It's not my thing. And so I was like, I don't have to piss.

And she was like, you got to go try. And hurry up because dude leaves at four. It's already like 3.40. I'm like trying to drink water and stuff. Ultimately, I couldn't go to the bathroom that day. She's like, you violated. I was like, she said, oh, no, she said you failed. And I'm like, well, no, I didn't fail because I didn't piss.

She's like, doesn't matter. still counts as fail. I was like, that's bullshit. She's like, you can't talk to me like that. You know, like, she's like, yeah, let's see what the judge has say about all this. So I already got a strike on me because I'm now suspended, potentially expelled from the alternative school. And then I'm on the outs with the new probation officer now. And with a quote-unquote failed drug test, right?

And me and my mom just happened to get an argument the night before court. And the judge, shout out to Judge Perez. He actually recently got a, when I say recently, I'm saying recently because I only recently discovered it. But I actually think it was a couple years back. He got a street named after him in Worcester because he did so much like he was always a really fair judge. he always had like the best interests of the kids at heart and stuff like that he was i think like one of the

first puerto rican um like judges in like central central mass or whatever so he got a street named after him um and whistler and he's i think he works as like a public defender now or something like that so anyways um judge Perez uh went to go see judge Perez again And he always asked your parents, like, what do you want to do with him? And my mom would always say, like, oh, I want him home, you know? Like, we didn't get along a couple days ago, but like, now we're good. We're all fine. And this one day, we, you know, he asked probation.

Of course, she's saying all the shit in the world about me. And then asking the school people, they're saying all the shit in the world about me, asked my mom, what do you want to do with him? And she goes, I don't want him back. I was 17 and a half. And so, um, uh, he asked me. He's like, what do you want to do? And I was like, I was pissed. I'm not going to lie. It was the argument that I got in with my mom must have been like really bad because I was like, I don't want to be at home either. And, um, he said, well, you know where you're going to go, right? And I said, yeah, lock up. And he was like, yeah like I'm committing you to your 18th birthday and I said okay I'm 17 a half like who cares

I'll literally eat the next six months if I have to like it is what it is he was like he was like all right good luck with that so bam smacks his gavel I turn around to my mom and like I was a little shit I really was a little shit if I'm going to take full responsibility for like my actions Like, you know, I was a prick, you know? Like, there were times when I was a prick, and these were one of those times that, like, I just, I don't know, you know, and I turned around on my mom, and I was like, and I was like, fuck you. And I told the judge, I was like, I was like, you know what, Judge Perez? Fuck you, too.

And that's how I went out to courtroom. And, um, so from there, you, um, so from there, now I'm, now I'm award of the state. right? So, uh, this episode is brought to you by Redfin. You're listening to a podcast, which means you're probably multitasking, maybe even scrolling home listings on Redfin,

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1-800-545-9-9. So my 18th birthday. And first, they send you to an assessment unit. They don't send you to Leahy because that's detention. I'm sentenced, you know, so just to clarify that. And then, so I go to this Hadley Assessment Unit. And I've actually, in the past couple days, been, like, looking this up because um hadley assessment unit was on like the third floor of a building and because i don't actually

see the path of how to get there because i'm in a paddy wagon right where i remember hadley assessment being there's like some discrepancy there and it really it bugs the fuck out of me i'm not even going to lie to you like hadley was like the third floor of a building and Um, and the other day when I looked up Hadley Assessment Unit, Massachusetts, D.Y.S. It brought me to the Leahy Center building. And that's like, I tried to look up to see, like, it was it ever somewhere else? And, and I can't find out where Hadley Assessment Unit was, but, like, it was not in the Leahy Center building before. It was a totally separate building.

and I only know that because it was like the Leahy Center was like I think at that time was pretty newly built it's like right next to UMass and Worcester and um this Hadley assessment unit um I had seen a couple ghosts on this unit

and so I know it was like a brick building had a Leahy Center is not a brick building so like I'm just he'll confused about where the fuck this place was. But um but so anyways um so you go to this hadley assessment unit and of course same thing like everything else to like if you do good and it's like I swear if they tell me that I'm not doing good you know like um like in a weird way and it's like if they if they preface it with those words if you do good I'm not going to do good and they were like yeah if you do good, then based on what your charge is, you know, the assault with the dangerous weapon,

it's all about, like, what your original charge was. Which I couldn't really understand that because, like, I didn't get here because of my charge. I got here because I got in a couple fights at the alternative school. You know what I mean? And, like, so I just didn't understand any of that. And they're like, well, your original charge. you're really only supposed to do like three to four months in juvie and then if there's any time left over until you turn 18 you would do it out in the community you'd be on like probation so um i i was just really pissed off and um i was pretty sure that the staff could put hands on on on that unit but i wasn't completely sure that sure because I didn't see no other kids get restrained there.

And I remember they told me they said, for whatever reason, I think I swore. He said no swearing, you know, and I'm like, I'll say whatever the fuck I want, you know. That saw some of the stuff happening, you know. And like, so the staff says, you know, go sit on the hallway. It's a long-ass hallway.

So it's, um, It's a really, really long. The unit is a really, really long hallway. So it's got residential on one side. Then, like, kind of like a TV room. Then, like, the main room where, like, the elevator would be to go down. Like, there's also some stairs to go up or down or whatever.

But we were on the third floor and the fourth floor wasn't used. Like, I remember when we went out to, like, the rec yard, there was like a huge lock around like this gate to go up to the fourth floor this is before computers like right before like computers and like all records were like computerized so like I guess they use the fourth floor for stashing records you know box and box of records and so um so yeah the unit's this big long hallway so they tell me go sit at the the end of the hallway so I go sit and I'm I'm in this chair, you know, those are, I don't know, those, like, plastic chairs.

It's kind of almost like this, but, like, you know, they're plastic, if you know what I'm talking about. Um, and I'm sitting there for, like, the longest time. And there's no clocks. You can't see, like, how long it is or whatever. And, like, I started to turn around like, hey, like, can I get up now? Like, this is crazy. This is like, you know, it's been so long. It's the staff's like, yo, shut the hell up.

You know? And I was like, yo, you can't find. fucking talk to us like that. He's like, I can talk to you how the fuck I want. Turn the hell around and shut the hell up. And I was like, all right. And I'm sitting there for a minute. And my blood is boiling.

And I'm like, hell no. This guy isn't talking to me like this. And I'm just sitting there and like, fuck this shit. Yo, I get up. I grab the plastic chair. I throw it down the hallway.

It's just like, boom, boom, boom, boom. This staff comes around for. the desk short guy bugs i don't remember his his real name but everybody called him bugs he comes around and before i even knew anything he was he was short like me quick before i even knew anything this guy literally was

um what is that horizontal to the ground and he clothes lined me with his entire body i hit the ground and like got back and like and kind of like whoa what the fuck just happened and realize I'm fucking clothesline. They, you know, roll me over, they cuff me, they haul me off to the time out room. And I'm like, you guys can fucking go hands on too?

And they're like, yeah. So it's like, okay. Like, whatever. I had no hard feelings towards bugs. Which is like really crazy. Like this guy, like, assaulted me. But like, I still got no hard feelings towards him. You know, he was always a cool stuff.

And I think like the next day he was like, Hey man, you know, it's just it's all business, you know, it's just, you know, no hard feelings, you know, whatever. It's like, yeah, whatever, man, like props to you for, like, fucking going horizontal to the goddamn floor and, like, and, uh, so, um, so, yeah, so on that, on that unit, though, um, I don't remember, I don't remember too much about the kids on that unit, actually. Um, um, very insignificant stuff. I might have seen a couple kids here and there that like I had seen over the years I like maybe the Leahy Center and stuff like that

and so I remember this it's cool to like go into the ghost story stuff yeah yeah all right and so the staff are going around and they're doing like these two minute checks on the third shift so they basically they go door to door

and they shine like a flash into your room and I just making sure you're like still breathing I like they do it so quick though I'm like do they actually stand there and make sure like you still breathe or not because it almost seems like they're just like cool and then on to the next one you know but one night I was sleeping on my stomach and these rooms are actually kind of big and don't really got like a whole lot in them like against the wall it would be like the metal like like a bed where they would put like a a mat on you know and um i was sleeping on my stomach and i ended up like waking up in the middle of the night kind of like lifting my head up off

off my off my hands or whatever kind of like looked over and there was like a giant light like in my face like right here and i could see the shape of like somebody on the other side of light and I was like, what are you guys doing? Like, I put my head back down. I went back to sleep. And I woke up in the morning and I saw bugs and was like, hey, man, like, who came in my room last night? Like, for what? And he was like, the logbook never said that anybody went in your room.

And I was like, he's like, are you sure the staff weren't just doing like the two minute checks? And I was like, I would know the difference between like a flashlight way over there. It's like, it's a good like. I don't know, eight, nine, ten feet, whatever. I would know the difference between that and versus the light like right in my face. And he was like, yeah, no, no, man. And I got the feeling that maybe you wanted to say a little more, but he didn't. He held off.

And then there was another night. I had woke up in the middle of the night. And I saw it was like this like black, blackish blue, like, like smoke, like kind of like in the middle of my room. And it kind of like came up. And like real quick, just the upper half of like a woman in like a Victorian dress. And I was like, oh shoot, it kind of like blinked a couple times. Smoke goes away, whatever.

And I'm like, okay. So, um, so again I kind of was like, yo bugs, what's going on here, man? Level with me. and he's like all right when I were really supposed to like tell you kids about this

so he's like I've seen some shit um here you know and uh he was like there was one time I was working overnight shift and I was on the residential side he's like I heard

like desks being thrown around on like the school side so he's like so I ran down there to, you know, like, thinking, like, I don't know, did a kid get out of a room or something? Say they were using the bathroom or not use the bathroom? Like, you know, I don't know. It's like, I went down there. I'm right outside the room.

I hear the desks in this room being thrown around. He's like, I unlocked the door. I go in. All the desks are fine. He said that he walked out of the room. He started walking away. He starts hearing the desks being thrown around again. So he opens the door real quick, goes back in.

All the desks are perfectly fine, except now the little, like, spinny fan in the corner is, like, just, like, going, like, back and forth. You know, and he was, like, yeah, I was out of there after that. And then he said, there was another time he went out to his truck on the overnight. And he heard a little girl, this building was all boys. So he heard a little girl calling his name. I don't know his last name, but his first name was Tommy. So it's like the girl's voice going like, Tommy, Tommy. He's like he looked up in the fourth floor, which is locked.

There's records up there only. Looked up in the window. I'm getting like goosebumps. He looked up in the window and he saw the like a little girl like looking at him. from the fourth floor window. And so I'm like, all right. And he's like, yeah. And the truth is, that's how I know this.

That's how I know Hadley assessment can't be the Leahy building because he goes, yeah, the first floor of this place used to be a morgue back in the day. So I was like, oh, okay. That's creepy. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. So yeah.

So kind of like gave a little validation of like what I saw. whatever, you know. And then all the kids are issued a staff advocate. And he's basically like supposed to be, and I say he, there was actually a couple females, regular female staff or whatever. But my staff advocate was coincidentally, this big black guy named Tyrone.

And very soft-spoken, like Tyrone. mad cool he wears like the timbs boots and stuff he's like mad cool guy and um but he works third shift so i don't really see him that much you know and um there was one day i had got restrained really bad um it's it's one of the it's one of the first restraints in which i felt like the staff kind of took it too far and um granted i could run my mouth a lot. Kind of like doesn't really give you the right to like abuse me though. And I am at the time still underage.

So the staff had like, uh, it like twisted my arm a lot and, you know, slam my head like into the floor a couple times, you know, whatever. Nothing that's going to like leave a mark or anything like that. But it was like, he fucked me up, you know, like.

And then like, I said, when you get restrained and you get cut, you get cuffed, you get hauled off to the timeout room and, you know, left there until you're calm enough to come back out, you know? You typically don't spend an overnight in the time our room. At that time, I think I had logged a good, a good like five or six restraints. And so he puts me, so they put me in the timeout room. They give me one of those like blue gymnastics mats. And like I said, no blankets, no pillows because like you're really not supposed to spend

overnight in this room. And I'm laying on the mat. I'm curled up on the mat and, you know, and like kind of almost like the fetal position, you know, facing the wall. And I'm like fading in and out of sleep. And I hear heavy like boots coming down the hallway. I'm thinking it's Tyrone with his damn tin boots, you know?

And then there, the boots are in my room. and but the door never opened and that was the first thing that like clicked for me was like wait a minute hold up and they're like approaching my mat I'm still facing the wall and I'm kind of like what's going on

stops right behind my mat and I hear this voice it says like and I was like ball in my eyes out I was like really upset about that restraint and said you're going through a tough time right now. Don't worry, things will get better. Something to that effect.

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Terms apply. Learn more at go.m.x slash graphite. Who the fuck said that? So like, kind of like roll over and I see like that thing. the cliche, like light blue outline of like a boy, like maybe like my own age, like 15, 16 years old. He walks down like kind of towards the left side of my room. He goes over to the door.

The doors are like these giant metal doors with like, because they're not behind bars in juvie, you know, whatever. Not at that time anyways, you know, and I'm pretty sure they still aren't in Massachusetts. In Florida they are though, where I'm at in Naples, Florida, which I don't agree with, which is why I don't apply.

But anyways, they, so yeah, so he goes over and he's, like, looking out this window, almost the same way, like, the staff would say, hey, stop hanging on your door.

That was us, like, looking and trying to, like, you know, be nosy, see who's coming down the hallway and stuff. He was doing, like, this kind of, like, same thing. I'm scared of chilless. I can't move, like,

asleep, paralysis type thing if you know what that is. And so I manage like, I kind of like, hey, he turns around, looks at me. And then he's kind of like looking, whatever. And then like I blinked my eyes a couple times, gone. So I was like, holy fuck. And that was the first. And I think to this day, the only.

full complete full body like apparition i've ever like seen you know and so of course i go like talk to bugs about it and stuff and he's just like tired of my ghost stories and shit so he's just you know he's like yeah this place is fucked you know like we've established this already of course you've seen some shit now i've seen some shit you've seen some shit um so yeah so yeah so So soon after that, you're only on an assessment unit for a certain amount of time. Because of the X amount of restraints, like I said, I think I logged like five or six restraints. Maybe it was like four. Either way, I didn't shine, like they said.

You know, you have to shine on this unit. So like, so we have like a staffing meeting and they tell me, all right, you're actually going to a secure unit. your charge normally does not warrant somebody going to a secure unit off the bat but your actions on the unit and getting restrained and just not conforming is getting you sent to a locked unit so I'm like

okay like when I still age out when I'm turning 18 so like whatever the fuck you guys want to throw at me is going to end in a couple months anyways because you're on that you're on that assessment unit for like, you're like two months. And I had gone in January, January 25th, 2005.

A couple days ago was actually 20 years to the day. Wow. And I didn't actually realize that until the 26th, too. I was like, wait a minute, it's been 20 years as of yesterday. So it had to have been like March, April, maybe, that maybe May, that I get moved to this, like, main unit that I was on, Westboro Secure Treatment. And so you go to, so when you go to Westboro Secure Treatment,

right off the bat, the staff are like bragging, this is the worst unit in Central Mass. like welcome and it was uh one unit i believe also like on the third floor of a building um it's right next to chauncey lake it's another brick building uh choncy lake um and westborough Massachusetts. Third floor again. This unit is kind of like almost like an L shape. It's like a residential

and one and then like kind of like a TV room and then you got the school side, you know? And right off the bat for whatever reason. I'm just, I'm not trying to hear any of the staff shit. like nothing like they said it's the worst unit and I'm like cool well I'm the worst kid so like perfect match made in heaven you know and um the unit I have um I have a conflicted feeling on the unit um I thought about a lot uh because in some ways they did they did cool stuff you know like you're there long term you like you have to earn levels

to get out, that's the only way to get out. If you don't earn your levels, like, you don't get out. You have to age out, you know? Or so I thought, you know? I think I logged a couple restraints before I had turned 18. So I was turned 18 August of 2005. I'd logged a couple restraints. I don't think it was like anything like super major.

But the big shift for me was When my 18th birthday was approaching And I was like, you guys have to let me out And they were like, we don't gotta do shit And I was like, how, it's illegal Which is like one instance of me Like be one of those people that's like Pretending like I know all the laws and stuff

It's like I see YouTube videos of those people all the time But, yeah, I'm like, no, you can't do that. It's illegal. And they were like, yeah, no, no, it's not. So you want your cake an hour later? And I was like, fuck you guys, you know? I was like, all right, let's see. Got until midnight.

Let me out. I'll sue you guys, you know, whatever I said to these guys. And I'm like, all right. And sure enough, midnight came and went. And the next morning I was like, no, I'm for real, for real. like you guys got to let me out this bitch like I'm now 18 and a day like and they were like no

like paperwork was already filed to extend you past your 18th birthday and I was like no that's like that's not a thing and they were like yeah it is like and so technically if they file the paperwork to extend you until your 19th birthday,

by midnight on your birthday, you get issued a court date. That court day could be two months. Like my court date, it was two months from that date. So, like, if you were to get released at that court day, you just did two months, the first two months of your adult life, you just did for no good reason if you do get out that day. And which is, like, kind of fucked.

like and so um anyways they uh like i ended getting restrained that day um i i tweaked and obviously got restrained and pretty much after their restraint they were like you know you want your cake they did get me a cake everybody sings happy birthday it's like it's like 30 uh 30 kids there all ranging in age from like i think the youngest i think was this kid frankie he was like he was like was in like 13 and turned 14 or he was like 14 he was like he was like the youngest and most kids got out 17 most did not turn 18 while they were there um and um so they gave me the cake and stuff and like i said so they did they did cool things like they they celebrated your birthday um the food was cool um that's where i gained pretty much all my weight

and I never lost it. You could get like seconds, thirds, whatever. And, you have to see a, everybody gets, there was three clinicians.

You either get, uh, Corey Lee, that was mine. She's actually still practicing, think like, family, family therapy in Worcester.

Um, So like shout out to her. The other guy, Eric, I'm not sure what he's doing. What's his last name? Peterson. That's like the name that's like coming to me now. Peterson. I don't know.

But the clinical director is woman Sue. You know, I got no other words for this lady. But like, but like I, you know, if Sue ever watch her. is this, you're still a bitch. That's literally how I remember it. There was, you know, I'll get into it in a couple of minutes, but there was times when I told this straight up, like, abuse is happening in the last unit and she looked at me and was like, that doesn't happen here.

And, like, smiled like in your face about it. And every single time she did that, I wanted to wipe that fucking smile right off her fucking face because I lived it. I knew what was going on in that unit. And I turned 18 while I was there. So, like, I'm observing. I'm not a dumb fucking kid. Like, I'm in honest class and stuff like that.

Like, pretty much after my birthday came and went, it was like, all right. These guys won't play games. Let's play games. All right. I've always been that kid even in high school. Like I explained, I got real good at getting the other kid to take the first swing. It's like, so I knew how to.

skirt that line and like get a reaction from you if like i needed to you know you want to play psychological game then i'll play it right back with you and so um i pretty much started you know just they'd be like oh uh you bet your fingernails that's hygiene points i'm like fuck your points i don't cash in points when i leave here and like i would always like some of the kids would call me like uh like a preacher, you know what I mean? And like, even some of the staff would call me like a preacher or whatever. Because like I would just go off on these tangents and be like, yo, fuck your points. I don't catch them out when I get out of here.

Like these kids all might like obey your point system, but like I don't obey your point system. Like I do what the fuck I want. And so there was this one time that I did, I bit my finger in. else and the staff, Nate. I do know staff last names. I do know staff last names. I don't think I want to blast last names up in here except for that lady Suzanne Burke because, you know, I'm pretty sure she knew there was abuse going on

in that unit. And I don't know. Like, so, yeah, so, you know, Nate's like, yo, I'm going to take your points for hygiene points. I'm like, fuck your points. and he's like, what was that? I was like, fuck your points, bro. And he's like, he's like step up.

TV room is full. Like, it's all the kids are in there. And so I step up, I got a pencil and like, I don't need no like false accusations against me or whatever. So I literally step up with the pencil and I got it, you know? And I'm like stepping up with a pencil. When you're in there, they like try to, it's not like prison

it's like at least at that time anyways I don't know about nowadays in like 2025 but like the kids don't really got like a prison mentality where like they're trying to they always they do make you like give up

like your plastic your plastic wear and it's always like oh because you know you could you could sharpen it turn into a shank or whatever you know like but none of the kids are doing that

um and And same with the pens. They give you like bendy pens and stuff. And it's like, none of the kids were trying to like stab anybody with like a pen or anything like that. And so,

but even still, I stepped up with this pencil. Like, yo, I got a pencil. And Nate's like, all right, put it in my hand.

And I was like, just take it. And he was like, no, put it in my hand. And that was just like, some of the stuff that the staff did. It was like,

just like a control thing. It's like, you could very well just take this pencil out of my hand. and for like to protect your own safety right quote unquote but like it's not it's not even about your safety it's about control and that's how i know you know like and that proves it because like you would have just secured the pencil so now i don't have a weapon you know what i mean and so um so i'm like i'm like no take it he won't so i'll throw it across the room was like yo go fetch he snatched me up by the back of my neck he brings me out of the pencil he bends me over the pencil

he's like bishop pick it up now and i was like no fuck you he's like pick it up now i'm like no fuck you he like rips me up he like shoves me out the the tv room door or whatever and he's like one for the hallway all of a sudden they they uh they twisted the blinds on the tv room so nobody can see in or out and I'm like alright some shit's about to go down so I go and I sit in like this little cubby or whatever and it's like where the phones are

and I'm sitting there and it's two staff because of what they said to me I'm not going to throw the names out there but they come up on either side of me and they're literally like yo your girlfriend sends you letters we got our address

how would you feel if we ran a trainer her this weekend. My girlfriend's a minor. These are two dudes who are like in the 30s. So I'm, I ball my fists. Like unball your fists right now. What the fuck you're going to do? And as soon as I turn around to go swing, they had already tipped my chair back and jumped on top of me, cuffed me, dragged me off to my room. So, and then, you know, you go in your room and then, uh, there's no cameras, you know, in the rooms because you're juveniles like most of the kids are juveniles i have turned 18 i'm not sure like the legality's like are they allowed to like now beat me because i'm 18 or because i'm in a juvenile unit do i still count as a juvenile until i get out of year like i'm not sure how any of that

works but um for all intents and purposes they mostly still like kind of treating me like a juvenile almost sort of thing um even though i really had technically turned 18 and um so So, let's see, there was, and then, oh, yeah, so then when you, when you go to the room, typically, you know, if you calm down, they'll uncuff you, they'll sit you up against the wall, whatever, you know. And then you're on program restriction. You got to do so much time in the hallway and whatever. And somewhere around, I remember when I was sitting in the hallway, and whatever. I remember when I was sitting in the hallway, it's like white walls, white lights, everything, you know, just like white everything.

And I start to realize, like, if I close my eyes long enough, I go to sleep no matter what. And the staff hated that shit because they wanted you to be like alert and aware of like how long you're sitting in the chair and like, so it's a punishment. You know, it's not just sleepy time, you know? And they would come by. They would kick my chair. tell me to wake up, make me splash water on my face. And no matter what, I would just go right the fuck back to sleep.

And so my narcolepsy, I have narcolepsy. Do you know what that is? No, what is it? So you can randomly fall asleep. I can drive perfectly fine, drove here just fine. But like if I'm the passenger in a car and actually, all my co-workers found this out when we just went to a company party

a couple weeks back I had to ride in the front which I didn't really want to ride in the front because I already knew what was going to happen you're driving from Naples on on one side of Florida to Fort Laude

on the other side I just knew it was inevitable if I'm the passenger in a car don't count on me to be your hype man I'm falling asleep because it's a good trait to have Yeah, see, everybody says that. So it's got its pros and cons, right? And I totally started like, started like falling asleep as storm during that during that work trip, whatever.

And I, you know, I was like kind of embarrassed by it. But yeah, so anyways, but I don't know that narcolepsy is developing. I just, I'm thinking my body's developing a response to the trauma that I'm experiencing here. And like, something's going on. And at the same time, what I didn't bring, I know I brought my feelings logs, but my dreams started changing. And they started getting really more like vivid and stuff. And they got so vivid and started playing all like movies that I felt compelled to like write them down. And I have 63 pages of dreams dated just like my journals.

And with diagrams and. everything of like, you know, like, it's the craziest thing. And, um, uh, part of narcolepsy is, um, there's a little bit of like hallucination with it or the can be, um, not all the time, but I remember like being in juvie. And, um, like, if you've ever played like Grand Theft Auto, like, any of the Grand The thwartos but at that time was like grand theft auto three grandthot of vice city the little helicopters that would come when you get three stars and like you know the shine of the bright white lights you know whatever so it's kind of like that my whole room would fill up with like

giant white lights so i think like i'm in the process of waking up and thinking that like it looks like my room is like completely bathed in like a white light and that there's helicopters outside my window like, I don't know, trying to get me for whatever. And I actually would get up out of bed to go over to look outside the window and then, you know, you blink a couple times. The room turns black. And you're like, bro, what the fuck am I doing? And I just get back in bed.

Similar stuff to like to that or whatever. But yeah, so this whole time I don't realize that narcolepsy is developing. but um i just know that like i can i can go to sleep anytime i want to uh even you know when you're on program restriction they'll take your mat out so you like they'll take your mad out of your room so that you only have like your metal bed frame and i'm just like no problem guys and i um my girlfriend had actually given me like uh like i want to say it was i think it was my sweater and she sprayed it down with her perfume or whatever so that like I would have it and like because you wear your own clothes when you're on this unit and um I would use that as like my pillow you know

whatever and I could just go to sleep I need no sheets or anything like that and like staff were just kind of annoyed but it's almost like little they can do they already took away all my shit they can't take away my sweater too you know just just because I take it off I mean I suppose I guess they really could do whatever they wanted to but um but yeah so yeah so So, yeah, so my narcolepsy is developing. It's just further pissing off the staff, you know, and like I would go into like these giants, they would do these giant staffing meetings.

And I always thought they were largely boring because they're like, oh, congratulations to this person. You earn your levels. You get to leave. Oh, congratulations to this person. You know, you earn your level. You earn the right to play PlayStation 2, you know, whatever. and for me it was always like

you know Mike didn't earn shit so like I don't know I always thought they were born and I would just like fall asleep you know and they thought I was being rude but I could not control that shit and so they did try to give me meds

while I was there and it's all the meds you see on TV now that they're like you can sue for this shit like Seraquil, Risperidol, xiprexa, they tried lithium for a minute. I'm trying to think what else.

There's so many different ones. As soon as I turned 18, I used to always tell my mom, like, if you, they can't, they wouldn't force you to take the meds, but if you didn't take the meds, they kind of painted a picture like you're combative. So as soon as I turned 18,

I was like, all right, I can sign that I don't want to take this anymore. They made me, in addition to the narcolepsy, they made me feel like a zombie. I'm literally just too tired to fight with the stuff, you know? So, yeah, so there was another restraint that happened one day. Same guy, Nate, got into him. I was running my mouth through the door or something, and he actually ended up open the door. you know like you know say it's my face you know and so i still told me said okay okay tough guy you know like come out come out of your room real quick i came out and um he told me to do something

whatever either way i ran my mouth to him and ended up with me being like slammed on the floor and then like if like your jawbone if you like where to like take your thumb like press like right here picture like somebody's full body weight on that jawbone, blood curdling scream. And it was in the middle of the hallway, which there were no cameras in the rooms, but there was one camera at the end of the hallway and one at the other side of the hallway, like, you know, facing each other or whatever, you know. And blood curdling scream. Like, I screamed like a little bitch.

I'm not even going to lie. Like, I was crying. And, like, like, like, Like, finally he got off. And I was like, yo, I fucking got your job. Like, your job is toast. You just did that on camera. Like, fuck you.

I can't wait. Like, I hope you have fun paying all your bills. Like, I was talking mad shit to him. Like, yo, I hope your fucking wife leaves you. Like, you know what I mean? Because you can't pay the bills. And he's like, he was from Ghana. So he's like, okay, Bishop, we'll see about that.

I said, all right. Put in a complaint. Cameras weren't working that day. Yo, some bullshit. Some bullshit. And so, like, it's crazy to think that, like, some of the staff would taunt you just because they could. And, you know, I'm actually, I'm glad I remember it. You had a guy on here a while back.

And I know you responded to a couple of my comments, but I commented his video, like, heavily. Every now and then I have somebody still respond to, like, my comment or whatever. because I was like, yo, I can't wait until I go on there and I was already like approved to like come on and stuff like that. And I was like, I can't wait to go on there and tell my side because like this was the kind of staff member that I fucking hated. This guy. Oh, the juvenile detention guard? Juvenile detention guard. I think it's like the only one you had or whatever.

And he was like bragging about like eating the kid, like taking the kid's snacks and like eat them right in front of them and stuff. Yeah, it's interesting. And he was just like bragging about. To be honest, then I only. I almost could not finish that video. I had to watch that video in like three installments because I watched a little bit and was like, I can't finish this shit.

But I think at the ending, he turns out good. Like he sees his actions in the past. Maybe I'll have to go back and watch it. Yeah, I think people, because there was a lot of comments like yours, but I think you see his evolution throughout it. Maybe I'll have to go back and like watch it again. This is a couple of the people that have been on that like definitely deserve.

like honorable mentions for sure and that's going off in a little bit of a tangent here is like i almost was like not i wanted to tell my story but not sure if i was worthy enough to come on here and tell my story because it's like i've only been a juvie i have gone to uh to adulger jail a couple times you know here and there you know maybe i'll get into that too but um but definitely not the most hardcore person that's been on the show you know like rikers island Prison Guard, like, when you search your videos, I just, I tell people about your channel all time. And just the other day, I was, I was like, look, if you, if you search, you can search them

by his most popular videos, you know, like, um, and, uh, Rikers Island Prison Guard, he's like number two, I think, most popular. Yeah. Like, that was a solid interview. And another one that really sticks out, I don't, like, I don't know why this one just stuck out to me, but it was, um, it was the older gentleman who had like, he had, uh, killed the guy who had like who had like touched when he was younger oh yeah Clark fredericks that's one of my favorite episodes yeah incredible episodes he only got like three years for and like almost

got off scoffrey and it was like and he was such a nice guy too and like yeah that i mean i believe everyone has a story i mean you were definitely impacted by your childhood and your parents and that led you into the criminal justice system so for sure you know i think that's insightful in that aspect yeah so how long do you end up doing uh at juvie do you get out when you're 19 do they extend it what does that look like yeah so um so um there was uh i was getting restrained so much that um it got to the point where one day i was like melting off and uh they had sent me out to the hallway and then i ended up being like fuck this i'm not sitting in the chair i'm going down in my room any other kid that would do like a movement violation or whatever

uh they would get dropped in heartbeat the staff just were like so tired of it they in like um and uh before um where was i going with that um before i get into that because that was that's like the final restraint but um there was uh there was one time when i was like one with one of the staff members uh jack and i like jack jack was cool he never like did any like crazy child abuse and shit. So, um, we're talking.

And we got on subject to ghost one time. And I told them about the apparition that I had seen at the other unit. And, um, so I kind of was like, yo, uh, yo, uh, yo, you believe in ghosts. He was like, nah. And, um, so he's like, do you? I was like, yeah. You know, so I told my thing. And it's like, face turns like white.

It looks like he was going to cry. I'm like, what's going on, bro? And he's like, he's like, yo, I try to stop it. So what are you talking about? He was like, I was in charge of that unit. And a kid had successfully committed suicide. And I was like, no, dude. No, no, no, no.

Because I'm in a different unit, different sitting. You know what I mean? Like, what's the chances, you know? And he's like, yeah, I can't tell you how he did it. But yeah, he definitely committed suicide or whatever. And yeah, so that was actually just really weird. And so, yeah, I'm trying to think of, uh, yes. So one major turning point was, uh, was of course turning 18.

But another major turning point, um, I shouldn't like, I say turning point is like, something that like convinced me that like, this place is fucked. Um, was we got this, we got this kid in. And like, by the way, like, for all the issues that I had with all the kids, and like high school and stuff like that i had zero issues with the kids when i was at this unit like i might have had an argument here and there whatever but never fist fought like any of the kids and um so we got this one kid his name was uh was Elijah and he had like he had like hornrose or whatever very soft-spoken kid to the point that it's like why you here you know what i mean

and he was like he was oh uh um I always did like try to do like an impression of him. I'm gonna, I'll spare you guys that. But yeah, just very soft-spoken kid. And, um,

you know, like says please and thank you, you know, whatever. Um, a lot of the kids did, you know, um, without having to be like forced to,

whatever. And, um, he, uh, a lot of the, a lot, like, a lot of the kids would,

would come to me and say like, hey man, why don't you just, just like, why don't you just like, uh, do the program? And I'm like, no, dude, you can't, like, see, like, what's going on here. And, you know, like, if somebody doesn't do anything about it or, like, stand up to these guys, then, like, nothing's going to change, you know? And even the staff are, like, do the right thing, do the right thing, you know? And, uh, meanwhile, you know, other staff that are, like abusing kids to like just look right past it you know um i saw a couple other restraints um

but yeah so uh so yeah this kid elijah he comes in and um he just kind of like did his time never had an issue with the staff never really raised his voice and um he every couple of months you you had like a staff meeting where they like decided you know like are you going to be like extending another three months, six months, whatever like that. And he comes in and he went into his, he had a staff meeting coming up. His like, his last staffing meeting. Never really had any issues. Kind of was like dabbing us all up.

Like, hey guys, going into my last staff meeting, you know, wish me luck. You know, I'm going to find out, you know, my release date. And like, that. bitch Suzanne um i i can i know how she did me dirty like you know and and you know like and just that that smile just like irks me man and uh still to this day 20 years later and um he went in there i guess and they pretty much told him they were like yeah you did everything you needed to do but we feel like you're being fake with treatment so um we're going to extend you six months to see how you handle it. He came out of that staffing meeting, swinging, he got restrained and stuff like that.

And, you know, pretty much the way the staff acted was like, see, we told you that he had an underlying anger problem. It's like, if you push anybody to their limit, like, they're going to react. I don't care who you are. Everybody's got a limit. And like, one thing I learned, like, as an adult is like if you really think about it, everybody's only like one bad day away from going postal. So like, I mean, I kind of stopped giving people like the finger, like, you know, driving and stuff. Somebody cuts me off. Give him the finger. Because I saw a YouTube thing a couple weeks back that it was like, you know, dude beeped at somebody.

And over a beep, somebody fired five shots into his car and killed him. You know, it's like, yeah. So like, anyways, it's like everybody's got a breaking point basically is what I'm getting at. and so yeah so I don't really think this kid had an anger problem or anything and um so after I saw that I was like this place is fucked like I'm not I'm not cool anything going down here you know um some of the staff could be real cool like um uh there was there was one staff I watched him go from staff to assistant director Tim. I still talked to Tim.

Talked Tim like two weeks ago. And so anyways, there was a, yeah, so one of the final, one of the final, the final, the final, the final restraint. And I'm trying to think to know other restraints that are really were like honorable mentions. But yeah, so the final restraint. So it was like, I go out to the hallway. I'm running my mouth. They sent me out to the hallway. And I'm going to say, like, Rich, you know?

His staff's name was Rich. And me and Rich, shout out to Rich. We do still talk to, like, this day. Which is kind of weird. And I know there's some apprehension on his side, too, even if he won't say it. We do have some conversations where it's, like, like, you know, he, uh, he mentions like good, you know, like good stories from like when I was,

when I was in there. And, um, but yeah, so anyway, so rich, uh, he took away my feelings log. And so like, that was like my outlet. And I kind of was like, I'm not just sitting in this cubby and doing nothing. Um, so I'm fucking going to my room. And he was like, no, you're not, don't move, you know? And like, I'm going. You can either fall. me there, stay here, like, I don't, I don't care, you know? So I go to my room and, uh, I'm kind of like yelling like, yo, give me back my feelings log, which I know, which I know sounds like kind of crazy, you know, like, damn, you're just like yelling about, like, your feelings long.

And, um, so, uh, I ended up punching the wall, putting a little, like, dent and, like, the wall, whatever. He came in and he's like, you need to sit down. And I was like, I'm not sitting down. He's like, yeah, take a seat in the corner right now. You know, like, he wanted to, like, empty my room out of all my stuff or whatever. Um, and put me back on, like, program restriction.

And, um, so I was like, I'm not a fucking dog. I'm not sitting in the corner. And he, um, he, like, he pushed me back onto my bed. And he rolled me off the bed. And, and called for backup. And as I rolled off the bed, he was wearing those like, like, like, echo sweatpants.

And I had, like, grabbed the whole of the pants as I was, like, going down to the floor. And, you know, I just heard him like a rip. So he's pretty much like, and I got them, like, underneath me, you know, like this. he's pretty much forced Like he can't go anywhere Other than like I'm lying face down He's kind of like kneeling by my head

Like Yo guys I can't move He's got my pants And I had a full head of hair At that time And he grabbed me by my hair And slam my head into the floor Like two three times

And it hurt But I still wouldn't let go And he grabbed my head my head again slammed it into the floor a good like two three times and um you know i started to kind of like woo you know i'm like out of it you know he slammed like another like two three times total like seven to nine times by then bro i was seeing stars i had to like all those pants i let go with the pants they got me to cuff up and then um they um they um they uh you know once i i i think i think i passed out for a minute and uh in a in a pool of like

you know i'm not even gonna lie like pull my tears bro like i was crying i was bawling and um and so i calmed down and then they're like all right you can sit up so i sat up and they um oh no sorry while i was laying there I don't know why I did this, but after he had stopped slam my head and they cuffed me up or whatever, I had slammed my own head into the floor again, like once, twice maybe. And they immediately put a pillow underneath my head. And then they were all like hush, hush, oh, the director's coming down the hallway, you know, like, and I could hear them out in the hallway.

They'll like tell him, oh, yeah, yeah, he slams his own head into the floor. Like, and the truth is they did the first, like, seven and nine times. I might have done the last one or two times until they put a pillow underneath my head. So most of the damage was done by this got rich. And so anyway, so then calm down. and they sit you up. And then when they sat me up, I did notice that there was like just a little bit of blood like on the pillow. On the pillow, whatever.

And like my head hurts, but I can't feel because I'm still coughed. I'm sitting up against the wall, you know? And then I'm demanding to see Tim, who had, like I said, I got promoted to assistant director. So Tim comes in. He's like, what's going on? I told him, hey, man, I want an investigation done. You know, like, this shit's crazy.

Like, you know, I can feel my head is like on fire right now. And he's like, yeah, you got a good, like, golf ball size, like, bump on your head. And I was like, yo, this is rich. He's like, all right, I'm going to put an investigation in, you know, whatever. And also, like, I'd have. hate to do this, see, to backtrack. When other, when, when, there was one staff, Rocky, he had noticed, I had a really good relationship with Rocky.

He had noticed some of like a bad restraint that like, you know, where they were like a little abusive, you know? And when I was telling him one time, I was like, I was like, hey man, like, would you go to bat for me? And he was like, honestly. if he's like if nothing comes of like an investigation or whatever I still got to work with these guys and pay bills and feed my family so like no I can't I can't say anything for you

and that was that was kind of crazy he almost looked like he had tears in his eyes and so yeah so anyways I initially investigate an actual official investigation on this last this last restraint and the staff all gathered, whatever staff had participated in, I only really remember, like, rich participating, but there was definitely other staff.

And they all stood, like, right in front of me. It was like, yo, what are we going to say to get our story straight to this lady that's sitting in the conference room or whatever they brought an outside investigator in? And so I went in, I answered some of the ladies. these questions or whatever, you know, and then they all went in, like, one by one, answer the questions, and ultimately nothing came without investigation, obviously. And so, uh, Rich one day is, rich could be really cool.

But then, like, he had these days where he was just, he was an asshole. And, um, and so he literally, like, walked by. I was, I had already earned my way into, like, the school side to do my school side work. Rich comes by my desk and goes, so Mr. Bishop, nothing came to that investigation. How unfortunate. And he's smiling about it.

And I'm like, I'm like, all right, Rich, I say, here, come here real quick. Got something to tell you. He's like, what's going on? I said, listen, you pull any more like dirty restraints, child abuse and shit,

whatever you want to call it. I mean, I call it child abuse and shit, technically I was 18. So like I said, I don't really know like how anybody views that or whatever, but do any crazy crazy shit, I'm going to turn this fucking unit into a war zone. Like I had it like up to here with the staff. It was like literally like a psychological thing where like I started to wonder like am I never going home? And you know, when they extended me, when they when they had put in the paperwork for my 18th birthday, they had extended me until my 19th birthday.

And so, and they can keep doing that right up until you're 21. So like all that plays into, you know, just like, yo, am I never going home? And I used to beg them to send me to adult jail. At least you do your time and you get out. None of these bullshit at staff meetings where they're just going to extend you for three months to, like, see how you handle it. And like, because they want a fucking toy with you. And then it's like they play stupid games and then they win stupid prizes where, you know, and, oh, wow. why are the kids like so angry you know what i mean i just don't get it you know like because of the

shit you guys put us through but then they would do it's almost like they would do this shit but they'd really back in because then like we celebrated christmas they got us all nice winter jackets for christmas they were going to play kickball with us they would play basketball with us and then the the next day they're fucking got me handcuffed on the ground face down and they're like nudging me just in their face with the with their boots and shit like just not hard enough to leave a mark but hard enough to like fuck you up you're just a kid you know what I mean and so uh so yeah I told him I would I would fucking turn the unit to a war zone and I don't know how dead ass serious I was about that but I did I did think about it was like

I could just write a letter to my girlfriend to tell I'm not coming home for a while and and fucking just raise hell in this unit until something happens somebody realizes they're wrong or whatever you know the other kids were asking me like how the how the fuck did you get this golf ball size bump on your head and I'm like fucking rich and they were like no shit you know like we know you know and um you know uh rich now does not work for dy s uh he like retired or whatever, but, you know, to be frank to Rich is like, you probably should never had that job. Like, some of the staff should have never been working with kids.

They, uh, rich ended up taking my threat really seriously. And he went and told the director, whoever, whoever he told. and one day I had I had earned my way to be back in the school side which the school there didn't it's like all standardized it's not hold my attention at all I largely just talked in class because

the work they gave me I completed in like five minutes and then it's like talking to the kids helping the kids with their work you know um which the staff are like stop talking to the kids you know what I mean

it's like all right so I got to stand here like I got to sit here and just like twiddle my thumbs or whatever you know um they even like they even banned me from having a dictionary because I'd read the dictionary and use all the big words against the staff is that that's the kind of shit like I did you know and so um so yeah anyways I'm sitting in the school side and then they were like uh you wanted in the staffing room and I was like I don't have a staffing meeting though and they were like just shut your mouth and get down to the staffing room. So I go into the staffing room

slash conference room and they got the blind like before I even walk in there already got the blinds pulled. You know, they got the blinds twisted so you can't see in her out. I go in and they got like two dudes on one wall,

two dudes against another wall, two dudes against another wall, two dudes against this wall. Suzanne is fucking sitting at the head of the tape. like she always is. They got staff sitting across from me. Staff sitting next to me. Like, yo, have a seat.

I sit down. They're passing me a paper because I did. A couple of the kids did say that they would assist me if I wanted to fuck some shit up. So they passed me a paper and they said, you know, tell us the names of who's. going to help you quote unquote turn the unit into a war zone. And I was like, I'm not, I'm not telling you guys shit.

You guys can have the paper back. They were like, well, you know, we believe the threat to be credible. I said it's very fucking credible. Like, and as long as you guys don't do, like, as long as you guys change your ways and stop like pulling this child abuse shit that you guys do, you know, like, then you guys got nothing to worry about. As long as you guys are obeying, like, the law and stuff like that and, like, doing, you know, not doing shit you guys aren't supposed to do. Like, I'm tired of the bullshit.

And they're like, no, no, seriously, you know, they slide me the paper again. I'm like, and I, like, flew it across the table at him. Like, yo, I'm not telling you nothing. Change your waist. And they were like, all right, you're moving your unit in five minutes. I was like, what? You guys told me the day I got here, there was no way to get off the unit. unless I conformed and obeyed you guys and whatever, whatever.

And you're telling me this is all it took to get off the unit. I was like, all right, I'm going to go pack my shit. And they were like, no, you ain't packing nothing. Stay sitting down. We got you. And that's where I lost the rest of the feelings logs. So I still tried to stand up. They slam me against the wall.

They cuffed me. They shackle me. And I was like, all right, fuck it. You guys want to do this the highway? So do I. I let all my body weights sink down. And I made them one staff, one staff, one staff, one staff, to take me out the building. And so, yes, they threw me in the paddy wagon or whatever on the floor, you know, still cuffs, still shackled.

They brought me to another unit, another locked unit. it was a graft and secure treatment. And when I got out of the paddy wagon and started walking in the doors of grafted secure treatment, I had my fist balled. I was like, if staff want to go, we can go. It's go time, you know? And the staff over there, I want to say his name was Mario.

The crazy thing is, I don't really remember the staff last names on the second on technically the third unit right because you go to hadley assessment westboro secure grass secure i don't remember the staff last names on that on that last unit even though they were they were like so good to the kids because they were so good to the kids i didn't have you know what i mean um so so yeah the maria he pats me on the shoulder he says he says hey man like we've we've heard how they treat kids over there we don't get down like that here. We restrain if you need to be restrained, but we're not, you know, we're not just, you know, we don't come to work, you know, because we had a bad day and now we want to,

you know, mess with the kids to get a rise out of you or anything like that. And, um, and he was right. And, uh, on that unit, I started earning levels, you know, um, started earning, I, uh, I earned a day pass to, like, to, like, go home and, like, finally see some, like, some, like, fresh air and stuff. And, uh, I, uh, right before I left, they told me you have enough credits to graduate. Um, with an actual diploma, not a GED. And, uh, they just said, you know, you're going to leave before we're able to, like, give a graduation. Because they wouldn't give a graduation for one kid. They wait until a couple of them, I completed GEDs or diplomas.

And they would do that. and so yeah within uh total i was um i'm almost skipping ahead here uh total at that point i had done was it was about a year in like in like nine 10 months when i turned when they extended me from 19 technically my my court date was when i was 19 in like two months so then they extend you for one year. So it's technically to when, to when you're 19, you know, from 18 and two months to when you're 19 and two months. And then when I, my, I did get into a couple restraints on that, on that last unit. Nothing significant. Staff pretty much followed all protocols. They weren't like aggressive to the point like you thought they had something against you,

whatever. And even still, my caseworker, Liz, she had still submitted the paperwork to extend me from 19 and two months to extend me past my 20th birthday. And so I had to go to court one last time, see Judge Perez. And he's like, and you know, Liz is like, yeah, you know, he got a couple restraints. he's danger to the community.

And he was like, how many times was he restrained at the other place? He clocked like almost like a weekly basis of at least one restraint a week. You know, like, how many restraints he'd get at this place? She's like two or three. And he's like, all right.

So one restraint a month versus one restraint a week. And didn't you say he had enough credits to graduate high school with like a diploma? She's like, yeah? And he's like, yeah, no, I'm not holding him any longer. We're doing him a disservice if we hold him any longer. There's no way he's bright. He was like, Mr. Bishop, I'm going to tell you one thing, sink or swim.

I said, all right, I appreciate it, Your Honor, you know. Sorry for swearing at you, you know, last time I saw you, you know. And so, yeah, they started prepping from my release or whatever. and then October 26th, I was released, October 26, 2006, I was released. And as I was going home, my dad, Barry, he got a phone call from Liz. She was like, are you ready to have him out? And he was like, what do, like, what do you mean? And she's like, yeah, well, are you, are you ready?

Like, you got, you got like a, like, a good home for him to and stuff. He's like, he's, he's already with me. We've already signed him out. We got all his stuff. And she, and she was like, what? That wasn't supposed to happen until tomorrow. And, uh, so I took the phone. And I said, I said, yeah, I'm.

I'm gone. She's like, I don't suppose you want to, you want to go back for the rest of the day. I said, hell no. And she was like, all right, good luck, Mr. Bishop. You know, it's like, all right, deuce is, you know. It's, uh, Juvie was, was a wild ride. Um, my clinician, um, Corey Lee that I, that I got to work with. She, I, I credit her a lot with helping me realize, like, it's okay to, like, explain. your feelings and like maybe because of her i kind of was already like a talker before her but like maybe because of her i like she killed it she she she bored a lot of people in my life by teaching

me out of express feelings because i just talk you know what i mean um but you know i'm i'm all about like expressing feelings and and uh i largely like credit her with that um as far as juvie goes I've I've Googled a lot of the staff I know I know Nate for sure has been arrested for impersonated police officer kicking in somebody's door to get his friend's TV back and like these are the people saying like yo do the right thing it's like you're out here being a criminal

he's a felon I'm not you know actually no I think I think the disposition of that case is he was he ended up not not being a felon but he was arrested for it though anyways regardless and based on how he acted, say what you want, but he's guilty as fuck. I just know there's ways to, like, plead down charges and stuff like that.

And, okay, I wasn't convicted of that, but yeah, you fucking did it, bro. And so, so, yeah, so, um, the dreams about Juvie, um, didn't stop until I was, like, 24. Vivid dreams. actually my my ex-wife when I when I got with her I credit her a lot with helping me work through my feelings about Juvie like I couldn't talk about Juvie without like crying and stuff like that and just being like really pissed off and I mean I found out at 21 that Barry wasn't my real dad like it's just been it's just been a wild ride but basically the main thing that I can take from all of it is like mental health, right?

And when I look back on like the issues that I had with like my mom, my stepdad when I was like growing up, it's just like, it's crazy because it just really wasn't that serious. Now that they're really like an old age, my mom actually got me this sweater for for Christmas. I used to I used to wear. I actually, I was conflicted. Which sweater do I wear for the interview? Do I wear my assholes live for everyone?

That's like a shock. People see it and they're like, oh my God. You know, like it's like edgy, you know? Do I wear that because it gives me like a little bit like more like street cred? Or do I wear the one that like, you know, on the back it says like, you know, I'm a son of God and whatever, whatever. Because, you know, I've recently started like going to church and stuff like that and really just starting to think about stuff. and I ultimately decided to wear this one, you know, just because, you know, like, um, the assholes, like, live for everyone just doesn't portray, like, what I'm going for anymore.

Um, mental health is like, is like a bitch. And, like, I think about how my mom parentsed me when I was younger, there's a direct correlation to how she parentsed me versus how she was raised. and then so like from the stories I heard about my grandfather, you know, through all the therapy sessions that I've done over the years and stuff, which mind you, I haven't seen a therapist since I left Juvie at all.

Through all the therapy sessions, like stuff that I've heard is like, my mom definitely did way better with us kids, even with all the stuff, you know, like, that like we went through and we argued about and stuff like that she's done way better than what her parents did with her. And it's just, but there's still some things that I know my mom struggles with that she'll never like stop struggling with,

like in terms of like her views on like her parents and stuff. Of course she like loves her parents or whatever. But basically like if I could tell, if I could tell what like major life lesson that I've learned through all of it is like you should get like mental health help um before it's like too late you know what I mean like I just so happened to like be really in tune with stuff and when I went to Juvie I knew like I didn't really like belong there kind of sort of thing like I did but I didn't um and I only say that because like when I was home from suspensions,

like I'm watching the history channel. You know, like I'm not trying to involve myself in gangs and stuff like that. And largely right after I got out of Juvie, it's like, you know, I got busted a couple of times for driving a suspended license, you know what I mean? Things like that. But nothing like super major, you know,

just because I kind of realized through Juvie is like there's a thing that's worth fighting for and there's like this stuff that's like not worth fighting for, you know? and um just uh that was that was kind of the mental health help that i needed but there's been a lot of like kids that i looked up that i was that i was locked up with and that's why it's crazy so tomorrow i'm supposed to go to one of the locked units in worcester and go talk to the kids and like just calling a spade of spade is like i haven't done anything super fantastic with my life i haven't gotten like a Nobel Peace Prize or anything like that.

I'm currently just a branch manager of a financial institution. You know, we cash checks, we do loans. That's something. You're not in prison. You're not an addiction, you know? You're alive. That's good. Yeah.

I mean, but it's just like, it's like I see other guys you have in your show and like, you know, they got, they got, I mean, maybe, maybe there's still time, but like, they got books. I think Rikers Island guy was like. like in the process of talking to Netflix about doing like a show or something. I mean, a lot of that is smoke and mirrors, you know, like you got to realize a lot of people with books do self-publish and it's a grind to push the books, you know? And it's not everything is what it appears to be, you know? Right. TV shows take forever to develop.

I mean, even with my platform, I don't have a book or I don't have a movie or a TV deal or anything like that, you know, so. Right. I think not everything that you see on social media or what people. people say is necessarily what's going on, you know? There's plenty of people that are still struggling behind the scenes or, or it just, or envying someone else. So don't compare yourself to others in that sense, you know? You're doing great. Yeah. So, but Mike, I appreciate you coming on the show, man. I appreciate you have me here. Yeah, I'm so glad you were able to let this

off your chest and, you know, you could tell with a guest when they have so much to say and it makes me feel good that I'm able to give them the opportunity to be able to say that. Like I said, you're the first podcast I've done. And, you know, the first time I've ever been able to, like, get my story out there. And I mean, my story is out there to the world now. So, I mean, I appreciate it. I really do. I appreciate you, man. You did great. And don't beat yourself up. Nah, I won't.