Locked In with Ian Bick - I Was a Professional Shoplifter — Then Survived New York’s Prison Shock Program | Joseph Schultze

Episode Date: August 20, 2025

Joseph Schultze’s life looked nothing like the path that would eventually lead him toward prison. Growing up in Binghamton, New York, he had a loving home — but also parents battling cocaine addiction. Forced to take care of them while still a teenager, Joseph dropped out of high school and developed crippling anxiety. A car accident became the turning point that pulled him into painkillers, harder drugs, and a spiral of crime that racked up multiple larceny charges. Facing years behind bars, Joseph took a chance on New York’s infamous shock program — a grueling alternative to prison designed to break inmates down physically and mentally. #AddictionRecovery #PrisonStories #ShockProgram #OvercomingAddiction #TrueCrimePodcast #AddictionAwareness #LifeAfterPrison #RecoveryJourney Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Get 50% off the Magic Mind offer here: https://www.magicmind.com/IANB50. #magicmind #mentalwealth #mentalperformance Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Use code LOCKEDIN for 20% OFF Wooooo Energy Buy Merch: http://www.ianbick.com/shop Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction & Early Addiction 00:50 Meet Joe: Hometown and Upbringing 02:00 Parents' Punk Rock Past & Family Struggles 04:04 Childhood Stories 07:00 Parents' Arrest 09:45 Family History & Normalcy Amidst Chaos 12:26 Dreams for the Future & Sports 13:51 Struggles in School and Dropping Out 14:44 Hitting Rock Bottom in High School 17:17 The GED, New School, and Finding Purpose 18:35 Early Jobs & Anxiety Takes Over 19:37 Battling Severe Anxiety and Isolation 21:18 Emerging from Anxiety 22:26 Family Crises and New Responsibilities 23:54 Balancing Business, Love, and Parental Care 27:32 Becoming a Parent: Breaking the Cycle? 32:30 The Accident That Changed Everything 36:56 Raising a Daughter 40:40 Understanding His Parents 42:58 Losing Prescription Access 45:39 Descent Into Heroin and Selling Possessions 47:59 From Using to Dealing & Living the Fast Life 52:40 Boosting: Shoplifting to Survive 57:07 Life of Boosting: Escalation and Arrests 01:04:04 Legal Trouble: Juggling Charges and Addiction 01:11:49 The Downward Spiral: High-Speed Chases & More Crime 01:18:19 Identity Theft & First Long Jail Stint 01:26:32 Jail, Withdrawal, and Hitting Bottom 01:36:08 Back to the Streets: Meth, Cars & Escalation 01:42:17 Caught Again: The End of Bonnie & Clyde 01:44:55 State Time: Programs & Military Boot Camp 01:56:41 Shock Program: Getting Broken Down to Build Up 02:08:08 Completing Shock & The Path to Recovery 02:13:13 Staying Sober, Rebuilding Life & Family 02:20:00 Lessons Learned & Final Thoughts 02:25:52 Outro & Gratitude Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I get into a car accident where I get ejected out the back windshield, swerve to miss a deer, get ejected out the back windshield, and before you know it, I'm getting pumped with fentanyl. And I was in so much pain, but I loved the way it made me feel. Man, I was just, I became addicted to opious right there. And the doctor overprescribed a shit out of me. Joseph Schultz grew up in Binghamton, New York, in a home filled with love, but also addiction. With both parents hooked on cocaine, Joseph learned to care for the long before he was ready. After dropping out of high school and battling crippling anxiety,

a devastating car accident sent him down a dark path of painkillers, harder drugs, and a string of larceny charges. Facing prison, he took a gamble on New York's brutal shock program, a decision that would change everything. Joe, welcome to Lockton, man. Thanks so much for driving out here from Binghamton, you said, right? Yes, Binghamton, New York. What is that, a couple hours from here? Two hours and 50 something minutes. So not too far. I had a lot of friends from high school that went to Binghamton. Binghamton University is a decent size little college upstate New York.

Our south is Syracuse like probably two and a half, three hours northwest of New York City. Is that going towards like Buffalo? Yeah. Okay. You know Syracuse? Yeah, I haven't been too much. much, but... Like an hour south, so...

I think we passed through Syracuse when we go to Rochester. Mm-hmm. My family's from there. Yep, so you probably passed through Binghamton. Didn't even realize. Not even noticed it's... It's nothing much going on anymore, you know. It used to be a big, um, a big, like, industrial city with, with, like, IBM started

there. Um, used to have a bunch of factories and it just all went, went to shit. over time, went to China. Did you grow up there? Yeah, I grew up in Binghamton. Who did you grow up with? Mom, dad, siblings. Yeah, I grew up.

My mom and dad, my mom and dad were actually punk rockers. Like, they were in a punk rock band before I was born, a little bit before I was born. Their claim to fame was opening up for The Clash on a couple shows. Have you heard of The Clash? Check them out.

Punk Rock Legends, punk rock legends but um you know they uh they grew up as punk rockers and uh and you know when i came along that kind of that kind of uh stopped all their you know all their aspirations and hopes when i was born in 1984 i kind of stopped him so they had to you know raise me upstate new york my dad uh worked as a salesman for monk um rewords have your you know mark on rewards like the it's like a sears they all went out of business years ago so um yeah my my mom and dad uh you know they spoiled me growing up but we didn't have a lot of money like my dad my dad was uh he's like a slick talker slick number one salesman at markcombe

it's like department store always the number one salesman slick talker um you and And, you know, my mom and dad both had a really, really bad cocaine habit as I was growing up, really bad. And I didn't really notice as a kid in that situation, you know, something's off a little bit. But until I was older, I had aunts and uncles coming up to me when I was like 12, 13, saying, Joey, I felt so bad for you as a kid, you know. But as a kid, I had an awesome life. You know, my dad and mom were like, we're like best friends to me. But I'll give you a little story.

This will be, this will sum up my childhood. So I wanted Mortal Kombat. The day Mortal Kombat came out. 1994, I'll never forget. And my dad and mom probably had been up for, you know, however long, doing Coke. And I remember my dad, we didn't have the money. So my dad went in the Toys R Us dumpster, found some toy, returned it. and he got me Mortal Kombat.

So that just kind of sums up my childhood. But, you know, I have a little sister who's eight years younger than me. So we didn't hang out too much because, you know, eight years, you know, is a little bigger age gap. But when my dad, excuse me, when I was in Little League, my dad was the head coach. And he got arrested in a federal indictment as my little bit. League coach. At the time, I believe it was the biggest drug bust in our county's history. It was called

Operation Golden Road. And my dad gets arrested. His face wasn't on the paper. I don't remember his face being on the paper, but they listed. It was like a hundred and something person indictment. My dad was one of those. And everyone's, you know, as a kid in Little League, you're like, oh, man, it's embarrassing, you know, it's embarrassing. But, you know, it's just that's what happened, man. And he was selling drugs at that point? Well, at that time,

so my dad used to work at Monkarm Rewards. Then he got a job at a place called Frontier Cellular, which became Verizon. So at that time, late 90s, my dad was working there, he had his cocaine habit. He was

cloning phones. Like, back then you could clone cellular phones. Like, I don't know the exact, you know, exact way he did ship, but yeah, he was cloning the phones and then he traded him to these Dominicans for Coke. And they got him to conspiracy to distribute, like a kilo or two kilos. But he was all wrapped up in this thing. And these Dominican, I remember, as in the Dominican Republic, like baseball is a religion, you know. So I remember, you know, he's my little league. He would bring one of these, I remember he brought one of these dudes to practice.

He was like, he was like really good at baseball. He used to play minor league baseball. But, yeah, so, like I said, both my parents, you know, had that substance abuse issues. so did he end up serving prison time for that he he got um it was his first time he got a six months house arrest um and uh i remember when he got when he got sentenced um or leading up to the sentencing i remember um i remember my mom who's like a little bipolar she's a little out there um she got like literally every person to write a letter of support and she had like like like 60-something letters.

And had me write one, my sister write one. She went all around to like neighbors, like people. I remember her getting a stack of letter, mailing them to the judge. And I remember at the sentencing, the judge was like, oh, you got a lot of support. And you got a good family. Well, you're going to be with them a lot.

We're going to give you six months house arrest. So that was kind of cool. I hope that played some part and you know the judge deciding to give a little leniency but yeah man Did your mom have a career after the punk rock phase too? My mom

My mom is really smart After that She went back to school She was like Dean's List At Binghamton University She was like really smart But things didn't just Things didn't pan out for her

I think her bipolar started to come out around then. Later, she got a job at a movie theater, managing a movie theater. I remember as a kid going to all the movies and just hanging out for the day, going to work with her, and just hanging out for the day. The movies, I remember Juice. I remember class act with Kid and Play. and that was that was a cool experience growing up but you know their addiction as I moved into my teenage late high school years their addiction got a little out of control they they they started dabbling in opiates

painkillers oxy-contin and this is all around the time when you know you hear these the lawsuit about the the Purdue Pharma, how they pushed oxycontin with the primary care doctors to prescribe oxycontin for basically anything like my dad had hurt his back. My mom had gotten a car accident, had whiplash. So both my parents were prescribed really crazy amounts of opiates. And that's something that, you know, I dealt with later on. But yeah, that's... Do you know if your parents had good childhoods? You know, my dad didn't. My dad had mentioned, you know, once or twice growing up, that he had a little abuse.

Same with my mom. She came from a family where she didn't really know her dad. So I think, yeah, that's a great question because I think that. It's interesting because even though they were addicts, they still try to give you the best childhood they could rather than some of the other addicted parents we hear about from guests on the show where their childhood is not nearly, you know, aligns with what you're describing. Yeah, no. That's it's a little, you know, a little crazy to think about that a lot of the themes that my parents, deal with, you know, in their life, I ended up replaying. Like, it's crazy to think about.

But, no, that's, that's a good point you make. Did you feel normal? Like, did you feel like you had a normal childhood while you were living it compared to other kids? Yeah, I, you know, I was the type that could sit at any table, you know, in the lunchroom, you know and and get along with people just fine like I could I played sports which I loved baseball and football growing up and that kind of got me through I was a huge sports fan huge LA Dodgers and New Orleans Saints fan growing up like die hard like my whole room was was covered in in that in Saints

photos Saints posters Saints memorabilia Dodgers stuff but going through going through problems as they may, they still took me to a lot of sporting events. Like whenever the Dodgers or Saints would come within a five-hour radius, like they would take us. We had a great experience going to the Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. My dad would sneak us in. And like I said, he was a slick talker. So we'd never buy tickets.

That's one thing I remember. We never buy tickets somehow got us in everywhere. You know, so cool memories of that growing up. Where did you see your future going? I always dreamt up playing baseball, you know. And even going through all, you know, the struggles that my dad and mom had, you know, they bought me a batting cage. one year, put it in the backyard pitching machine.

They, you know, other than their substance abuse, which they never did drugs in front of me, ever. So I could, you know, I could say, I could say they took care of me good. It's just, you know, they would get in these arguments and in public and these, you know, maybe they're drug fuel, maybe they're not. But, you know, as time went on, my mom's mental health really started to spiral. Do you feel like you could have been loved even more by your parents if they weren't addicted to drugs, looking back on it now? Looking back on it, you know, I think they didn't discipline me enough.

I got away with anything. You know, I wasn't a bad kid, but. It's just, you know, they took, I could say yeah in a way. I could say yeah. I agree with you. What happens when you graduate high school? So my senior year high school, I'm going to school. I'm kind of struggling with grades.

And I'm not the type that goes home and does homework. I'm just barely skating through because school really didn't interest me. So I'm getting 70s, 75, 68s in all my classes because I'm not doing the assignments, but I'm going and taking the tests and passing it and barely passing everything. You know, I just didn't find school interesting. So my senior year in April, You know, I started hanging out with a group of friends who drank, smoked weed. We would go out two, three in the morning, skateboard and cause trouble.

But senior year in April, I got sick with pancreatitis. Now, mind you, I already had, like, almost close to the, absence, I guess you could get like 20 absences. And if you go over that, you know, you can't pass. But I was like 18 or something like that. And yeah, I woke up one morning with a sharp pain in my side and went to the hospital and got diagnosed with pancreatitis. And they did like a CT scan. It turns out to have like a birth defect where basically your duck that leads from your pancreas to your stomach it like splits in two or something like that and you know you can't process alcohol so i had to uh you know i had to miss like a month of school and uh i show i show back up after missing a month now mind you i already had like

the the limit as far as the absences go and the vice principal comes up to me he's like he's like what are you doing here there's no way you're gonna you're gonna be able to pass you're gonna have to go to summer school he's like even if you stayed and made up all these classes he's like there's no way you're passing so i just dropped out after that so i'm sitting home um you know slacking and my dad like halfway through summer my dad's like Joe, what are you doing? What are you going to get your GED? What are you going to do? He's like, I'll tell you what, you could say you're living with your uncle and you could go to our, like, our rival school district because I went to Main End well. You could say you're going to Johnson City,

which is like the Cross Town School. You could say you're living with your uncle and go back and get your high school diploma. So, yeah, that was a nerve-wracking experience. It's, you know, going back to a school, or going back to school, senior year, a new school where you don't know anybody. I was nervous, but I'll tell you what, today, like, I talked to more people from that senior year, more friends I've made than I made my entire K through 12 at the other school, Maine Endwell. So that was a great choice going there. You know, some of my best friends that year. And they kind of, they kind of, you know, accepted me. And because it's a nervous experience.

You imagine going to a new school. So, yeah, after that, I got a little job at the mall, slinging pretzels, the Aeneyans. And for actually a month, I think it was like maybe a little longer. you know who my co-worker was John Bones-Jones Why does that sound familiar? UFC heavyweight

Wait, really? Yeah. He was working there? He was working there. That's funny. I didn't know we worked there before. Yeah, hometown's from Endicott, so shout out Johnny Bones.

So basically, you know, working there, working to Annie Ants. What are you like 19 at this point? Yeah. working at Annie Ants. And all of a sudden, I started getting the worst anxiety attacks. Like, I don't, like, psychiatrists to this day have said, like, what happened around that time?

I have no idea. Like, I would just be sitting or driving, and my heart would race. like really like like 180 190 beats per minute because I would go to the ER during these stuff you know after this

and they couldn't find out what was wrong with me and this was the scariest you know time of my life where I kind of developed agoraphobia you know you know

like fear to leave your house because I was just afraid I was afraid if I left my house and I'm going to have one of these panic attacks I'm going to drop dead and I went through a really bad four years that basically I just stayed in the house

and that was they couldn't find out what was wrong with me I went to a psychiatrist and the very first thing she does on the first appointment is prescribe me two milligrams Xanax bars. All right? Two milligram Xanax bars, I think three or four times a day. So I got all these powerful Xanax and I'm not treating, you know, the actual anxiety. I'm just

I'm just withering away like literally I must have been like 140 pounds skin and bones pale and that way

I couldn't find out for the longest time I thought man my heart's beaten out of control there's got to be something wrong with my heart you know there's got to be something that they're missing and I'm going to heart doctors. They're hooking me up.

I'm not, there's like, there's nothing wrong with you, man. You're, you're, this is all in your head. And that's the hardest, that's the hardest thing. The hardest thing to do is convince yourself that, you know, you've got to just chill. And you've got to, you've got to, it took years, literally. So prime years of my life where I'm just not doing anything, sitting home watching TV playing video games. It's that messed up. So that was tough.

After that, you know, I met my daughter's mother. surprisingly it took that I met her and it took that for me to get over all the anxiety You thought this was your run club era Turns out it was more of a thinking about run club era

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Luckily, Jeff saved with Amazon and stocked up on antacids, ginger tea, and milk. Habinier, More like Habinier, yes. Save the Everyday with Amazon. Idi. Where'd you meet her online, or did you finally leave the house? No, my parents were selling their house, and my grandmother has a farm, which, you know,

I would stay with my grandmother weekends here and there. And the farm is located, like, by the airport. So it's a beautiful farm. My parents at the time lived in the actual city of Binghamton. And they were behind on taxes. We were going to sell the house and move out to closer to my grandmother. She was getting older at the time. So responded to a Craigslist ad.

And yeah, I met my daughter's mother from there. but um right you know that it took that me getting out and me actually having you know a purpose you know but i was a i was a dark time after i started recovering from my anxiety um my dad my dad had a overdose at the time he was prescribed percassette zanax and methadone from his prime primary care doctor, if you can believe it. So I said earlier, a huge New Orleans Saints fan. This was like 2009. I had a Saints YouTube channel.

And I would like review the games, you know, do preview videos. I called up a couple of the low round draft picks. I did phone interviews. It later got taken down because of copyright strikes. but yeah the Saints the year they won the Super Bowl 2009 the Saints play I think it was week 13 in Washington DC so you know we would always go to the Saints games when they came close I took a couple of my friends and my we had an extra ticket so I told my dad dad you want you because like I said me and my dad are like best

friends I said dad come along you know I got an extra your ticket. The night, excuse me, the day before he just gets his scripts of all three. And he's nodding the entire ride down, nodding. And you know, you nudge someone. And nod right back out. So we get to the stadium. And as we're walking in, we've got to walk a little ways to get in. There's tailgates going on, whatever. We lose my dad going into the, stadium, lost him. And I'm like, man, I'm like, man, I hope I need nothing to happen to him because he was kind of, he was kind of messed up. So we're asking security, like, where would someone go if like they got, you know, where's, where's the security, you know, pavilion? Where's a security

desk or whatever? And, you know, tell him, I'm looking for my dad, you know, he's, I said he's got a medical issue. I didn't want to tell him, you know, he's fucked up. But I tell him he's got a medical issue. And they're like, well, you better find him because there's nine hospitals within the metro area there. So I'm like, fuck, man. So the game starts. And at the time, I don't think the Cowboys Stadium opened until the next year, but at the time it was the biggest stadium in the NFL. We're looking for him the whole time. My two friends went to the seats, but I'm trying to find him, you know, the whole game. I'm worried about him. We find, I find him passed out at the security at the security desk in the fourth quarter with like five minutes left. He find him, he can't even

walk. He's so fucked up. Can't even walk. You know, we help him down. The Saints ended up winning in overtime. They won the Super Bowl that year. But, yeah, we help him in the car. You know, drive back five, six hours. Help him in bed. Sometime that night, he must have got back into his stash and took more pills. Something told my mom to check on him at five in the morning.

He was blue. He'd aspirated in his sleep. and aspirate where you choke on your on your vomit got rushed to the hospital he's uh he's got brain damage so he was never the same after that um and it kind of it kind of fucked me up that that's my best best friend my dad you know um it fucked him up so he's uh he's just he's just Whacked out after that, whacked out. Like, he,

the part of his brain that was damaged is like short-term memory. And so, from that point on, he just never really smiled anymore. Like, it really messed him up. So, you know, we could be here in this room. He'll be in the other room.

And he'll know we're in here. But he'll just take off down the street asking random people along the way, you know, you know, where's Joe? Where's Joe? He would wander. I never forget one time we're at a birthday party. And, you know, you got to keep a good eye because he'll just take off and bug out, basically. We're at a birthday party.

and where do you go? He calls me. He says, Joe, I hear Bush is rustling. Joe, help me. I said, what's go? Dad, you got to find something. I don't know where you're at.

He's like, I'm in the woods, Joe. And I'm like, well, you got to find somebody. You got to find somebody. You got to find an address. I'll come get you. You don't see anything. You don't see a store. You don't see nothing.

He said, oh, wait, I see a guy mowing his lawn, Joe. I'll ask him. I'm like, yeah, ask him. Oh, Joe, he told me to get the fuck off his property, Joe. Oh, man, you got to find something. So eventually he found his way to a grocery store. I came and picked him up. He's covered in scratches.

Covered in scratches. So that kind of, you know, he would, like, let's say I had to go somewhere. had to be with them constantly. I'd get, I'd go to spend time with my daughter's, daughter's mother, the girl I was with at the time. I'd go to, Dad, I'm going for the night, all right? You know, I'd go, I'd wake up 143 miss calls and drove my nuts, mom nuts. And around that same time, she had a, she had a stroke.

so now you know both my parents are messed up she had a stroke it affected the part of her brain speech so right now both my parents are doing good right now my dad's getting a little hard for him to get around

but both my parents they're doing they're still alive and and doing good with my mom like I was saying the part of her brain that affected speech So she's all there. It's just when she goes to say something.

She can only say like five different things. Like you could kind of, you know, make out what she means just by, you know, just by me being so familiar with her. But did you feel like there was a lot of pressure on you to this time period to take care of them? Huge amount of pressure. You know, I had, by this time I'd built up a landscape in business. I was doing good. I had like 20-something properties. I had a really good, a really good contract with a lady who owned three trailer parks,

so I would hit the vacant ones. You know, that was good. Had a couple apartment buildings, a few private place, but I had this nice little landscaping. business going but yeah there was a lot of pressure um because my my girlfriend at the time um you know she she wanted a lot of attention and uh and and but both my parents need you know they need attention you need someone to take care of them and around that same time my grandmother had got diagnosed with ALS, which Lugarik's disease, you know, for those that don't know,

where you keep all your mental abilities, but you completely wither away physically. You can't move, like your muscles just deteriorate. And, you know, that was, so I had to juggle all this with the business, and my parents, At the same time, around this time, Jamie, my girlfriend at the time, not pregnant. So I got a daughter, and I'm juggling this, you know, hectic family life. Did seeing your parents like that give you insight to say to yourself, I'm not going to do drugs, I'm not going to go down the path they did. I know it didn't turn out that way, but at the time.

Yeah, no, definitely. 100%, 100%. But as all this is going on, I get in a car accident where I get ejected out the back windshield, swerve to miss a deer, get ejected out the back windshield, and before you know it, getting pumped with fentanyl. and you know I was I was in so much pain but I loved the way it made me feel man I was just I became addicted to opiates right there and and I was prescribed you know looking looking back the doctor over prescribed the shit out of me you know gave me fentanyl patches I mean granted I had a

broken back in three spots. I had broken ribs, collarbone, shoulder blade. But, you know, I doubt, you know, after the opioid epidemic here, I doubt any doctor would give fentanyl patches, which really put my tolerance sky high. And, you know, I was kind of a functioning addict. I'd got my, I got my drugs from my doctor. And, you know, as the years went on, you know, I look at the next few years there after the car accident as like the best time because I was raising my daughter. You know, how my dad was close to me like a best friend. And my daughter, she was, you know, we did everything, everything.

You know, anything that was going on in the state, we would go, we got a minor league baseball, minor league hockey. And I remember when we went to every single game of each of those throughout the entire year. We went to wrestling. When they would come to Binghamton, you know, she met everybody, you know. And, yeah, I would look at those next, you know, the next six years. I was prescribed the fentanyl patches for about six years. So that's six years, even though, you know, it's using this substance.

I look at those six years as like some of the best time. How old are you when you got in the accident? I got in the accident, 2011. So I would have been 20. I was born at 84. So what are we looking at? What were we looking at 14 years ago? So that made 27-ish?

28? 26? Yeah, about somewhere around there. Yeah. Yeah. So that was. Yeah, 2011. Now, did you start to get in trouble with the law once you started your addiction?

No. And as time went on, I would use up my script early. Like a month prescription, I would be done with it in like three weeks at first. Then two weeks. Then, you know, I'm searching for replacement. and I'm, you know, getting introduced to the drug scene slowly, because I'm, you know, I have my few little people that I would get my fentanyl patches from because that was my, that was my go-to, obviously, because I'm prescribed them,

but I wouldn't use them as prescribed. I would never wear them. I would just chop them into little slivers and just put one in my mouth. And that's, that was lit. But, you know, looking back, there's no way in hell I should have been prescribed those for six years. Obviously, I'm milking it. Oh, I'm still in pain. but

you know looking back you know knowing that I could have stopped if I were to go to a rehab or something but I just never

I never looked at it as a bad thing I never looked at it like like this is messing with my life the whole time you know I'm building this huge tolerance did you start to see or start to understand

how your parents felt all those years now? Yeah. You know, going through the whole the whole opiate thing, you know,

if you don't have it, you're as good as, you're as good as dead. You're lying in bed, cold sweats, vomiting, diarrhea, the worst feeling

that you could possibly imagine. And, you know, I didn't have to go through withdrawals at that point, you know, because I'm being prescribed them. And I had a few people who I would buy fentanyl patches from. So I had a constant supply. So in the back of my mind, you know, I thought, you know, the day I have to detox, that's going to be tough. That's going to be tough. And that didn't come to a little later. but yeah fast forward to uh to like 2018 ish um my doctor calls me in for you know randomly because at this

point i would get my prescription over the phone i had to go once a year for an appointment um my doctor calls me in randomly because my script my script is due um but they call me in like a week before it's due and um And they're like, yeah, we have a urinalysis for you. I'm like, oh, shit. Because I've been taken, you know, other medication so I wouldn't have to go into detox. So they're like, yeah, we can't prescribe you anymore. And I'm like, my God, you can't taper me.

And they're like, no, we can't give you anything. So at this point, I'm. I'm fucked. I'm like, oh man, what the fuck am I going to do? You know, I looked into purchasing on the dark web just so I could keep this whole thing going. No luck there. I had got ripped off in a honeypot. Whatever it was back then. I forget the actual name of the... I think this was after Silk Road. I think a little after that. It was some... I don't even remember the name of the...

the market, but I ended up getting ripped off. And then slowly, the little network I had for my supply of the fentanyl patches, they started getting cut off at their prescriptions. And this is when the government's like cracking down on opiates. And, you know, a buddy of mine was like, hey, you know, I got some, I got some dope, you know. And this whole time, I knew, you know, I know what dope is. I know, I know it's going to, I know it's an opiate, but I just, I just looked at it with a, with a stigma. Like, I looked at it like, I'm never going to try dope ever. Like, I, it's not that I'm too good.

It's just like, I know what, you know, I know what path that's going to take me down. So I'm just so sick one day and I tried dope for the first time. And it was off to the races from there. You know, it became an every, it was everything that, you know, it was everything everyone made it out to be. It felt good. you know you got me got me high and uh you know slowly you know as i state i'm trying to juggle everything trying to juggle um you know work and family and then slowly you know that's when my daughter's mother noticed like something's up with you you know you there's something that something's up

a couple times she'd found shit in my pockets or I'd left it out, you know. But she doesn't use anything. Like she's a saint. She, uh, she smokes a little weed here and there, but she, uh, she wasn't having it, you know.

So, she had, uh, she told me, like, we're, you know, you keep doing this. You're jeopardizing, your daughter, you know, you jeopardizing everything. she told me numerous times she's like you're gonna you're gonna throw your life away and that's exactly what i did exactly what i she she told me you know you gotta you know you got to you know you got to get help you got to go to rehab and uh you know at the at the time you know my parents are uh you know going more and more downhill everything's spiraling around this time and you know and

that I tried, you know, dope for the first time. Started selling shit, like possessions that you wouldn't, you know, that I thought I was going to keep for my entire life. Like, I remember one day, a gold chain my grandmother gave me. Took it to the pawn shop, and I'm thinking, you know, I'm just pawning it. But, uh, but yeah, that, that, that, really that really hits home that I would do that I would do something like that but um you know as as as my addiction started spiraling more and more out of control there um I got linked up with

with a good who I consider a friend now at the time he was the plug you know and he he put me on and got me selling, selling dope and did really good for a little bit, did really good. And, you know, at the time, me and my daughter's mother were apart, you know, split up, I would see my daughter here and, you know, here and there. And, you know, still tried to always be there for, but as I started getting wrapped into selling drugs and living the fast life it's just like my priorities got so out of whack um and i remember you know when i was doing really good i remember having uh you know a shoebox under my bed with uh with a bunch of money in there but it must have been 10 000 in there and um i met this

I met this chick who was living at a hotel. She was, you know, she sold pussy on the side. But she was sexy, like, sexy, you know what I mean? And I, like, delusionally, she was an addict to. I, like, fell for this girl, right? And my buddy, who was the plug? He's like, Joe. he's like pussy's always going to be there for you man he's like you got to get money while you can

man you we're doing good we got this good thing going and i just i just stopped less and less every day and spent more time with her you know and and yeah she uh she uh she ended up getting me after a couple months of being you know being together for for that shoe box and everything i had and the next day the next day my car had overheated and and I was just trying to make it to the get

and it just killed the engine so at that point I'm you know I had that was where I was staying

and at that point I have nowhere to go I got no money I go to I ask you know my buddy who was the plan I'm like listen you got to help me here he's like I can't

I told you this whole time you're gonna fuck this up I just can't I can't you know you didn't listen to me you're gonna I told you you're gonna fuck it up so so so

people around me I'll never forget my buddy My buddy, he's like, Joe, I've never seen anybody go from here to here in a quicker amount of time. And, you know, I started IV using dope. And that's the first time I tried meth, too, was it this time. So, just like that, within a three-month period. Boom. I just went downhill quick. And that went on, you know, hopping from traphouse to traphouse for a little bit.

That went on for like six months. And as I'm, you know, couch surfing from traphouse to trap house, I'm seeing people come in and they got tons of shit. You know, they got, they got. bags full of bullshit and they're obviously trading it off um they're boosters you know i'm seeing so i tagged along with a with a uh a couple um and i sucked it at first man but as as time went on like that was such an adrenaline rush like knowing what you got to get and how you you know you got a goal you got a list the stuff. And

the goal was, obviously, to not get, to not get caught, but that became like a, like a video game. You know, and as you know, as I was spiraling more and more

out of control with drugs, I became more and more delusional because I'm not sleeping. I'm not eating. You know, that was the soul focus of my life. I started neglecting

my daughter, my parents over this time. And I always say for the first seven years in my daughter's life, best dad you could be, you know, over those next few, not so much.

Tell the audience what boosting is and kind of walk us through that what you guys were doing. So boosting basically shoplift. So I had people who nine times out of ten would also have the drugs. And they would obviously need stuff, you know, need stuff from the store. And they're going to give you half price for whatever you get. And for me, for me it started out.

small like, you know, small electronics, you know, stuff like that. But as time went on, I'm meeting more and more people who, you know, offenses type, who want to buy shit half price. I'm meeting more and more people as I'm, you know, as I'm going along here. and you know i would Walmart home depot low's target every grocery store CVS um you know there's two two ways you can go go about it you could i would like to simplify it and just get whatever you know who's got the drugs okay

okay what do you need simplify it i don't have to i could take it right to them sell it you know, I don't have to go through someone who, you know, let's say this person wants tools, for example. They're going to pay me cash, but I take the, you know, that's just an extra step. My goal is to get high as quick as possible. And, you know, without a vehicle, it became hard. I'm hitting the same, in Bhampton, I'm hitting the same stores over and over. and, you know, the clerks are recognizing me. And as time went on, that became half the battle is getting in a store, you know, undetected without being recognized.

What was your favorite store to go to? What was the easiest to shoplift from? Oh, my goodness, my favorite. probably probably Walmart I mean the stores in Binghamton Burlington T.J. Max

Walmart Target Target Supply. I love tractor supply. All the tweakers like tractor supply but anyway yeah all those stores I'd find someone with a vehicle

go out of town that was always easier because you're not recognized you hit a place for the first time come back you know as I started boosting I developed a couple

relationships where okay I want tools you know so as time went on um you know i'm going in home depot at first at first it's like stealth you know you just get one thing like a tool set three hundred dollar drill de walt drill something like that but um you know you go in you go to an aisle where you can you know cut in real quick take out the little sensor put it in a bag and you're out but um you know as time went on um that got more and more uh you know more and more gung-ho with with the boosting what was a weirdest thing on a boosting list that you had to get a door like a door from like home depot a door yeah

how do you even steal that oh just put it on the car and and walk out with it um yeah a door and and i had uh you know i had developed a little system um as time went on ubers were my best uh getaway ubers because you know exactly they're right out front at a certain time and you know that became um That became kind of my trademark Uber. And when I only had cash and didn't have access to Uber, I had, you know, the cabs too. I remember for the door I had to take a cap. With the RAM Declaration of Deals, we're pledging our allegiance to the American people with great deals on the RAM 1500.

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Ram and Hemie are registered trademarks of FCAUS LLC. So you put the whole door in a cab? Yeah. But, oh man, as time went on, you know, crazy, crazy situations with Boost. being chased. You know, I noticed, though, like, nine times out of ten, the employees there, they're just chilling. They're just there.

They don't give a shit. That's what, really, like, they don't, they can see you. And they know you're boosting, but there's always that one that wants to be Superman. And, uh, and think he's, you know, he's going to chase you out. You know, I've been chased a few times. and to rewind a little bit I started dating this chick at this time this is another girl yeah another girl yeah another girl and it's over with with the baby mama yeah over with with the baby mom over with the prostitute you know I started

dating this other chick um who basically was like my codependent you know what I mean I tried to you know. We had the same taste of music, same, she, she, like, wrestling. She was, she was, like, she was a lot younger than me, too, real amateur. And she was, like, the ultimate hot boy shit. Like, we would, I remember one time, um, I think, I think what I was planning on getting was, was as many hats as I could get for the Habibi mark. The oxby, he's like, Joey, I want the Nike. I went to Didis. He's got a whole wall full of hats at the

corner store that I got, you know. But, you know, I would charge him $10 a hat. He'd sell him for $20. So, this chick's name was Allie. So I said, we're dope sick right now.

So I say, Allie, you know, chill out, wait here, wait at the front desk. or the bench, you know, in front of the store. I'll be out two minutes, wait right here. You know, I got the whole deal lined up. So I go into Burlington, and I get all my hats ready,

getting them all lined up, ready to go. Because I would never go in a store and, you know, take shit off the shelves and have it in. I would wait to the last possible second to throw everything in the bag and get out. You know, that was what I thought was the smartest way of doing it. So you're not, as I've seen people who had, you know, gotten to a store, they see something. They like, they put it under their shirt, put it in a bag, and then they're in the store for another 20, 30 minutes.

You know, you've already, you know, that gives them time to call the cops. You know, you just want to wait until the last possible second to throw it in the bag. and get out of there, you know. And like I said, I told her to wait. I'm in the store. I'm getting everything lined up. And she comes up with an employee, comes up to me with an employee following her,

tagging her right along. And she pulls out a pair of underwear and goes, Joey, tell them I didn't steal this from here. Tell him I stole it from somewhere else. And I said, oh, my God, this bitch. I don't know you. Come on. Like messing up the whole thing.

And I started getting like picked up left and right because they'd have me on security footage doing these booths. And I said Binghamton is a small town. So I'm just, you know, I never got caught at the actual store. But I would always get picked up like when I would have. least expect it. Like I'd just be at a you know out front of the corner store or something

in town and here they just pull up and arrest me. So this is right around the time bail reform passed in New York. So all these petty larcenies at first here

they were all petty larcenies were non-qualifying offenses. So I'm getting in getting locked up, getting arraigned, getting released, and, you know, sometimes when they stop me, I have drugs on me. So I'm racking up all these charges, as I showed you the rap sheet early. He brought us paperwork. 25 pages of, you know, these petty larcenies and petty crimes,

where I'm getting arrested and just getting back out. I, you know, the arraignment schedule at the Broome County Jails 8 a.m., 8 p.m. So you get arrested at 8.3 p.m., you got to stay till 8 a.m. If you miss that 8 p.m., you're staying the night. So all these times, I'm just getting picked up and released over and over and over again for what, it was about a year, eight months to a year. and, you know, I'd get picked up on warrants because I'd never go to court over this whole time. And, you know, I'm taking care of my habit, not only my habit, but her habit. The girl I was with at the time, and in my delusional mind, you know, I'm thinking, I'm thinking, you know,

I'm just going to run this dry and do as much as I can and make as much as I can. I'm going to go on a Greyhound bus with my girlfriend. We're going to go out to Boise, Idaho. I'm going to go out to Idaho. We're going to get on the methadone clinic. We're going to get clean. We're going to, because at this time we're both wanted, keep getting arrested. The crimes kept getting more and more, more and more intense,

more and more bigger and bigger, the scores that I kept going for. You know, then it'd be at first, like I said, it became a couple items at a time from each store. Then it became whole carts. Like, I just didn't give a shit. Like, our goal was to go out to Boise, Idaho. and start fresh. This is my delusional meth-doubt,

doped-out mind thinking that everything was going to be okay. There's no rhyme or reason to it now how I could fuck my life up so bad. Like looking back, it makes no sense. But at the time, oh I'm going to do this it's going to it's going to work it's going to work but um every time I would uh every time I would get something going she would fuck it up somehow fuck it up like I'll never forget um

you know I'd I'd uh I just got an iPad MacBook and a Samsung Galaxy from stores. That was my little thing at the time, hitting the display items. They've got the retail mode on the phones, but you could get that off. You can get an AT&T. ATT would be the go-to.

You know, because you could, and if that light's not on on the phone, you can just literally take it right up to display. There's passwords you could put in to get, iPhones became a thing. And I remember I hit, you know, we were out of town. I hit a bunch of stores. I had a nice hall ready to sell, had it lined up to sell.

And I remember I told her, watch the backpack. Just watch the backpack. That's all you've got to do is watch the backpack. And backpack ended up. getting stolen. You know, we're, I'm going out, hitting, hitting licks. At the time, it's for, you know, not a lot, a few hundred bucks here and there. And getting us a little motel room, the nicest place you can get with no ID, you know, in

Binghamton. And she's just breaking windows, getting us, getting us kicked out of these places. and, you know, I stuck with her, which was, you know, crazy on my part. But as time went on, everyone, you know, everyone in the whole town knew that, you know, knew these two are basically on the run, you know. We were one step ahead of the warrant squad for a while there. just you know for what I don't know

you know I mean to keep that addiction fueling to keep everything going like I just I just you know it was so delusional I thought I thought everything would have a happy ending you know but

but yeah it was our it was our one year anniversary um and we were staying at a buddy of mine and he let us borrow the car because it's our anniversary. So she says, he said, Joey, I want to drive.

I said, you're not driving. She had proved to me before, like, she had said she could drive earlier, and I remember she's trying to start the truck and doesn't know how to do anything. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you're not driving. So she throws a fit,

and, you know, screaming in public, blah, blah, blah. I say, you know, I don't want to leave her, but she's like, if you take me to Denny's, I'll come in the car. I'm like, all right. So both of us are on the run, warrants, and we pull up to Denny's, and at the time, I didn't have, I had just, hit a lick and got everything in drugs.

Like I had only meth and dope on me. I had no cash, but she wants to go to Denny's. So I'll never forget a buddy of mine gave me an ID, you know, just to get hotel rooms and whatever. It's an ID you found, I guess. It's this kid named Kevin Roach. He looks nothing like me. Okay, and she's got this girl named Tammy Rodriguez, you know.

and we've got IDs. You know, we're ready for this Boise, Idaho thing. We're ready. And, like, literally, I'm looking at bus tickets. Because, like I said, the Warrant Squad is one step behind us. Like, wherever we were, they come, like, the next day after we leave. They're looking for us. And we're at the Denny's.

We're at the Denny's, and we order a feast. You know we're not going to pay for. We're going to dine and dash. Feast, chicken fingers, chicken fingers, dessert, breakfast sandwich, milkshake, lemonade. We order to the feast. And this goes to show you what I was dealing with with her was, you know, as the little feast dies down. And I'm making the plans, you know, we're going to do this to get out, you know, to go outside. I'm going to say I left my wallet in the car.

You're going to go first. I'm going to say, you know, I left my wallet in the car and we're just going to dip. So we're like, you know, let's get high before we do. So I give her something taking the bathroom. I got my shit. We each go in the bathroom and I'm two minutes in and out. Bing, bang, boom. But this bitch, oh my God, 10 minutes goes by.

20 minutes goes by. I'm banging. knocking at the new yo come on the waitresses are like looking at us like I got a six cents like I could kind of tell

they're like on to us here we got this bill this tab here and you're in the bathroom 10 more minutes goes by and and here I see out the window

here comes the police they pull right in I'm like oh shit so I'm like yo the cops come on come on so I say

the waitress um excuse me my cards in the car i'll be right back so as they're walking in i'm walking out and uh i just run i just run but investal new york right next to the denies it's a kfc behind that kfc's like this little

stock room shed so i dip in there it's got all the dips and cups i close the door um I hear them running by, you know, they don't know them in the stock room because the lights off. They get her, right? And, you know, I'm checking my phone.

I'm checking my phone. Two, three hours go by. And I'm thinking, oh, that should be enough time, you know. I remember falling asleep. I might have done a shot, you know, I remember. So I'm thinking, all right, it's safe to go back. I'm looking. Peek my head out.

No, there's no cops in sight. So I creep back to the car, get in the car. And as I'm pulling out, pulling out of the parking lot and get up to the stoplight in my rear view. I see it. And he's got, he lights it up. So I'm just like, fuck, he can't end like this. So I take him on this crazy, crazy high speed chase. And all of a sudden, like after five minutes, I just look in my rear view.

And the cop just turned its lights off, pulled in somewhere. And I was, I got away. He must have stopped pursuit. Later, I had come to find out that they were like, yeah, we called, the cops had told me, yeah, we called that off. 140 in a school zone. Yeah, we had to call it off. But, um, so. I'm thinking that choppers are still going to come.

I parked the car. I just get out. I'm just walking aimlessly. Checking Mold Patrol. Checking Mold Patrol. Because they, I, you know, I didn't know whether they had got Allie or not, which is her name. I didn't know whether they got or not. And I see it on there, like, you know, in the morning.

As the sun's coming up, I see it on there. And I'm like, shit. It says right on the Mold Patrol. the bail amount and it said $5,000. I'm like, fuck. Because I had previously got her out like two weeks before on like a $500 bail. I got the money and got her out. And I later come to find out the judge had made it so high because she called them a scumbag,

which is always, you know. Never a good thing. Never, but. You know, that became my mission then was to get up the five grand. I had everybody lined up. You know, I called everyone. I'm like, yo, you're going to help me out with, you know, you're going to help me out with a little, what can you spot me here?

And I got, you know, buddy told me he could spot me a thousand. And buddy told me, I, you know, I can't spot you, but I need some shit from the store. So it became my mission to get that five grand as quick as possible. And I got it. I got everything I needed. Everything. My go-to, I mean, it was like 80% success rate at one. Walmarts when I would go, I would go to the back electronics desk and say, excuse me, I'm, yeah, I just need, you know, the iPhone, can I get, can I get the, whatever iPhone it was, I think it was 12, 11 at the time.

My girlfriend's ringing up groceries at the front. Can I pay for it up there? And literally, like, they would just hand me the phone. And that's it. Oh, sorry. Under the coat and I'm out right there, a brand new iPhone. So I actually had everything ready to go, everything lined up. And I'm about to do that at Walmart. But I see an iPhone behind the electronics desk just sitting there. And I'm like, wow, this is a lot easier than my plan had been prior, you know.

A lot easier. I'm just going to wait until the cashier, you know, it's not looking. Reach back there and grab it. So, hey, I'm waiting, I'm waiting. Cashier's not leaving. So I'm like, fuck. All right. Plan B.

I go like two, three hours away. I'm like, yes, hi. I speak of electronics. Hi. I need to know how many copies of Madden you have in. Okay, sir, hold on once a head. So he goes and looks at me. Goes and look, that's my cue right there.

Go behind it, grab it. Well, what I didn't know was a loss prevention had seen me go behind. The, go behind the registered, grab it. and I'm thinking I'm home free. I get outside Walmart and I'm trying to activate the phone.

You know, I tried to get an Uber out of there. This is in Pennsylvania because that was my plan was, you know, I threw a bunch of money on Uber and did my Uber, a little Uber routine. but I couldn't get an Uber out there like the Uber I took from Binghamton to El Mira I said I you know we passed a little town called Sare which is in the middle and um you know I told them you know I'm good here we stopped halfway I said stop off here so um

I'm trying to get it you know an Uber turn it on the phone thinking I'm good and um all of a sudden I see you know know, the loss prevention lady on the phone standing outside. And she's staring at me. She starts to, she's still staring at me. And I know in my heart, I know, you know, I know what she's, I know I just got caught. I know her, I know I'm going to get caught. So, I take off, you know, walking, trying to be as cool, calm as possible.

And I hear siren in the back. And, uh, and, you know, know I just start briskly walk and get I get behind a car repair place and I hear the siren cut off and then I hear you know oh shit I hear the cop pulling up the gravel driveway and I ducked and they do they do a turnaround there they know I'm in that sex as he probably saw me um did a turnaround came out and that's when I started running for it. You know, I tried to make it across the car lot where I was. And I hear, I hear, you know, from behind me, stop. Get the fuck on the ground. Stop. And he had got out of his car and started chasing me. They stopped me. And even though I stopped and gave up, they still had their guns drawn and they beat the shit out of me those cops they beat the fuck out of me like you know the elbows and the kidneys they slam me to the ground i i was uh scraped up i'm sure if you

see the mug shot you'll see my hairs all over the place and uh you know i'm pissed so they're saying what's your name and i'm not i'm not gonna say anything i'm like you know given the I'm not saying nothing. I'm not saying one word. In my heart, I'm like, oh, fuck, this is it, huh? I'm like, they pat me down. They find, you know, they get the iPhone. I think I got a JBL Bluetooth speaker I got from there too, whatever.

You know. But pull out my wallet and they pull out this Kevin Roach ID. Remember how it said about the Kevin Rote? And they start calling me Kevin. And I shit you not, Ian. He doesn't look anything like me. So they start calling me Kevin, Kevin Roach. And I get booked into jail as Kevin Roach,

but they have old school fingerprints. This is in a small town in Pennsylvania. I remember they're red, like red ink. So I'm doing the fingerprints. They're asking me my social. a completely bullshit social, a combination of mine and my dad's, you know, social. And I remembered the date of birth. I remembered the address on there. But what I didn't remember when they're doing the intake, they got the ID and sitting right here.

And mind you, we're sitting, I'm sitting across from a police officer. And they go, eye color, and I go, brown. But then I look at the ID and it says blue. So I go, oh, brownish blue. And they didn't, like, they didn't register to them that I'm not Kevin Roach. This is, this is like 45 minutes away from Binghamton. Because if it had been in Binghamton, they would have, you know, they would have known. Every police agency in Brum County by that point had known.

So we go to arraignment. I'm charged with retail theft, possession hyperdermic, and resisting arrest, which was total bullshit. I didn't resist anything. It did kind of run, but I guess, you know, once they told me to stop, I'd stop. So I go to arraignment, and I know I have these warrants out of New York. So I'm thinking, in the back of my mind, I might get out of this. I might. So the arraignment comes, and the judge tells me my charges.

And I said in the back of my mind, I'm hoping to God. I could pull this off somehow. I might be able to. And he says, well, you are hereby remanded to the Bradford County Correctional facility in lieu of $75,000 bail. And on your warrant that you have for, it was like failure to abide by a restraining order or something, on that warrant, your bail is $15,000, for a total of 90,000. So of all places in the entire state for this ID, this dude of the other,

this ID, Kevin Roach, to have a warrant. It's the warrant in the city where I'm at, of all places. You know, as I, later on when I was in there, I thought, thank God it's not for child molestation or some crazy shit. Or murder. I mean, like, a serious charge. So, that's it. Like, at that point, you know, my friends on the outside ain't going to come up with 95,000.

90,000 or whatever. Like I'm in it for the long haul now. I'm going to go through withdrawals here. I'm going to detox, which I was terrified. But, you know, we go from the police station where they did the arraignment over the video. We go to there to the county jail. And I'm booked in. They're calling me Roach, Roach.

Everything's Roach. And this isn't that long ago. Like, this is in 20. 20, one. So, um, getting booked in. And we go in the pod.

And the very first person I saw was someone I knew from Binghamton. He goes, Joey. I go, it's Kevin. It's Kevin. So, okay, I'm in, uh, I'm in there. And, um,

yeah, that was the worst, the worst, uh, few days that, I had, you know, I was going through the worst withdrawals, you know, wondering the whole time what had happened with Allie. I didn't have, you know, any insight as to what was going on. You know, I'm detoxing. And, you know, I'd made calls, you know, trying to tell a few people like my buddy Lotto, who gave me the idea.

I'm trying to tell him. this is Kevin Roach. Remember when you remember at the such and such store when you for Idaho, remember you gave me? And like I'm trying to talk because I know the calls are recorded. So I'm trying to tell these people that, you know, that's the hardest thing in the world to try and tell someone through recorded phone call that, you know, you're in there. You know, luckily they recognized my voice and they knew, you know, I'm pretty sure they figured it out. So after a little bit, I found out, I found out, you know, how the Pennsylvania bail system worked. You know, because you don't have to put up the whole 90 or whatever. They have bail bondsmen. And I remember on day five of withdrawing in Bradford County, day five, the, I haven't knocked at the door.

Roach, someone's here for you, bail bondsman. I'm like, what? What? Could I be getting out? Like, I rushed, like, oh, I'm like, oh, at that point I'd been in bed, puke and shit and couldn't sleep. I remember hallucinating, seeing bugs on the ceiling. And they bring me down to the day room at one of the little stools is the bail bondsman. And he goes, I forget the exact name.

He said, we got people call. calling about you, huh? Some girl called me hysterically trying to get you out. And I'm like, yeah, what was her name? He's like, Shannon or something. He's like, he's like, so if I get you out, you're going to get me this money. You're going to get me this money. And I'm like, I'm just saying, you know, going along with it, because I'm thinking in the back of my mind, first chance I get I'm in under Kevin Roach very first chance I get I'm dipping you know

so he's like well um you know where the bitches at in Binghamton and I said what I can get you bitches bro I can get you

and um turns out this guy he was a former judge of Bradford County but I guess he got disbarred disbarred or whatever they call it, you know, when a judge has to, is he had a drug court. And he was telling the girls on drug court, if they want to pass drug court, he's got to, you know, they got to take care of them.

They got to do him some favors. Shit you not. So, um, he's like, well, where'd you go to high school, Kevin? But, um, you know, I told them where I went to high school, Johnson City. So I'm like He's asking me these questions Um Asking me where I'm going to be

You know what address I'm going to And all that So he's like All right I just got to finish up the paperwork I'll be back in a few to let you out Now mind you I'm not knowing what the hell

How this whole situation You know wound up Or came about But I'm rolling with it I'm thinking I'm thinking I'm getting out so I go back to myself

this is my first time up out of bed in five days and I'm like wow could I be getting out of this oh I'm thinking about when I get out I'm going to go right back I'm going to get work and I get dope the quickest where am I going to get it

and he comes back he comes back like 15 minutes later he's got somebody on faith time. I never forget. I see it. He's talking to me through the door. He goes, where did you say you went to high school again? He said, Johnson City. He goes, there's no, uh, I look through every yearbook between 2000 and 2006. He goes, there's no Kevin Roach there. He goes, did you go buy a different name, son? You went by Joseph, didn't you? And I'm like, oh shit, I'm busted. So at that time, sergeants had came on the block. And there was like two sergeants and like three extra COs in the block at the time.

And he just, he goes, you tried to get me, huh? And as he's walking away, he goes, we got an imposter. And I'm fucked. Oh, my God, my heart's sake. And, you know, they, they didn't, nothing happened, nothing that night. And next morning, I get a court, it's the Pennsylvania State Police. They're here to take me to get rearranged and charged with false ID to police officer identity theft, which was a felony in Pennsylvania. So I get, I get rearranged.

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sleep Discover more at airweave.com And yeah they the judge got me What was the outcome? How much time did they end up giving you? So

as as time went by I came to find out that that whole county the district attorney the judge they were this like embarrassed them They were pissed off by this. So I ended up, I ended up doing about five months.

This is my first time locked up for an extended period of time because I told me I would just get locked up and get right out. So I ended up doing about five months. They pled to a misdemeanor. Time served. Fine. However, you know, during this whole time, I figure, you know, I called people who found out that Allie had been locked up as well. She had been locked up at the same time as me.

And, you know, my plan was, you know, because you can't communicate through, you know, correctional facility, correctional facility. So I'm only receiving word of mouth Like from what people hear You know, there's no direct communication My whole plan the whole time was If I get out first, you know, I'm done with dope I had a I had a like a revelation man

I went through withdrawals for the first time I'm like I'm done with dope I'm never doing it again And um And my whole My whole goal was You know I'm gonna

I hope I get out first because then I could keep her on track, you know, and we can be dope free, finally, finally. But she ended up getting out before me. And like by two weeks, and I get out and I get out, and she already went back into it. And she went back into it hard. Like she, you know, had developed during the two weeks. like a heart issue she was doing meth like we both were meth and dope meth and dope speedball

and she got into that and um you know when I got out and when I saw how strung out she was after just the two weeks and of her being out like that I was like fuck man fuck well

you know my whole plans went to shit after that of staying clean because now back to it but I never did dope again. I was just doing meth, but that turned me into a month, like, just doing meth, after I had gotten out, that turned me into a demon as far as like I just became more and more. I started, you know, doing the thousands and thousands of dollars. This is where all the grand larshanies come into play. First, it was petty now. It's grand larcenies.

and he's filling carts with six six hundred dollar chainsaws and walking out the garden exit you know at lows and shit like that um and so it was right back to it after all that but i did i i thought you know okay you know i can i can get by just doing uh just doing meth you know meth's not that bad oh boy was i wrong because meth is such meth became like it's not i don't think it's the method as the not sleeping for so long like i i would be up for days days days and um you know as as time went on um those first two weeks of me not using dope but being around her when she was using dope like i i just couldn't i it was Like I saw her through a different light. Like I asked her, I remember, I got a few thousand dollars. I pay for a week at a hotel room, some trap hotel room, man. Oh my goodness.

The Endwell Motel and Endwell. This Chinese guy owns it. I say to her, I say, all right, so we got this room. You're not going to fuck shit up like you've done before. I got three rules. Don't let anybody in here when I'm not in here. don't get you know I'll

take care you I'll give you you know you're dope I'll pay for it you know um don't use so much

that you're fucked up and like don't do that and don't scream and make this room hot it's all you got to do and we'll be fine you know

that's my plan was to start selling dope again because I wasn't using so within 45 minutes broke all three of those I was like

fuck this is this is just too much so um after you know um after that i started um stealing cars and trucks um that became like i said started boosting but just got progressively more and more um more and more you know intense and going for more and more valuable stuff so um yeah she had uh she you know it just it's just weird i saw her through a different like when we were uh ripping and running together like it was like some bonnie and clyde type shit but when i got out that that first time i uh you know i It just wasn't the same as before. That year run that we had, it was like I look at back, like it was fun. But, you know, being out and seeing what dope did to her, you know what I mean,

it just messed me up. That'll bring us to when I had stolen a Honda Civic from a dealership in Binghamton. It was a nice Honda with, you know, nothing special, but it was like a 2012 Honda Civicman, had nice rims, and had the title in the glove box. And I had this guy who had run a flea market. He bought anything half price, half price. And I remember, you know, I had not having a vehicle,

and me having a vehicle, it's like day and night as to what, it opens up so many options for making money. and I'd call him, he says he needs air conditioners. So I literally would go in, fill a cart with three air conditioners at Ocean State job lot and all these, you know, get these $500 air conditioners. Take it to them, make quick bucks. And I took him some air conditioners and I'm like, hey, anybody that wants to buy a car?

and he's like, well, I don't, but my neighbor does. And he's like, he's a prince. And I go, what do you mean he's a prince? He goes, yeah, he's the prince of the country of Guam or something like that. And I'm thinking in my head like, that doesn't make sense because like Guam's a U.S. territory, you know what I mean? It doesn't make sense. But that's what he said anyway. So I'm like, yeah, this is my car.

It's just in my aunt's name. So, um. So he comes with his daughter. His daughter's going to school or whatever. The prince comes to take a look at the car. And I'm like, yeah, I just got to go have my aunt sign the title. And I couldn't bring Allie at the time because I just couldn't bring her to a deal because somehow she would fuck it up. I had her waiting around the corner of the gas station.

He said, can you write in girl handwriting this bill of sale up? You know, like the girly handwriting. can you write this bill of sale for this Honda Civic? And she wrote it up, signed the title. I'm like, here, I just went to go have my aunt signed the title for you. And he gave me five grand. So I'm, you know, I'm feeling good at that point. But it turns out that they, I guess they waited too

long to put it on the road or whatever. When he went to the DMV like two weeks later, they said, like I guess the cops came, said, you know, you're, uh, this is a stolen car. So, uh, he obviously snitched on me.

You know, I don't really, you know, I don't really blame him on that, but that got me another felony. And, um, and from there, um, You know, I'd got locked up. I got picked up outside of, outside of Sam's Club,

just rolled up on again and charged with all this. And during this time, you know, I knew I was going upstate because I'd been on five-year felony probation. I pled out to that to wipe up, not for PA. PA was separate, but for my New York, that I was originally on the run from, wrapped up everything, gave me five years felony probation.

I had violated that with this. So I knew I was going upstate. But the entire time, this is what made me officially cut ties with Allie there because didn't put any, didn't hold me down. And, you know,

my daughter's mother was just fed up with my shit. You know, I love her to death, but for me to go start this whole new life being some, you know, drugged out junkie, just running the streets, you know, getting arrested all the time. It's, yeah, you know, my parents couldn't help me, you know, so I was in there with nothing. And I was trying to get word out. Can she help me? You know what I mean? Do something. because, you know, when we were together for us to go out and for me and she was tagging along, she would help sometimes. But for us to go make $100, 10 minutes, man. Like, she can't go do that for me and put 30 of it on my books so I could have a couple soups, bro.

She left me high and dry, high and dry in there. So, so, yeah, I'm locked up. How much time did they end of it? given you? I got sentenced to this first chart, I got sent to to one to three. And that's in New York State. In New York. So

I got sent to a one to three. However, New York has this program called DTP. It used to be Willard. Have you heard of it? So it's for nonviolent drug offenders. And

it used to be military. bearing. But now it's just this cakewalk. It's like the golden ticket. If you get, if you qualify, which is nonviolent drug offenders, larcenes, fraud, theft, if you qualify, you know, you're taking that one to three and you're going to Lakeview and you're doing 90 days of intense drug, you know, 90 meetings, 90 days, no military bearing. You're smoking sigs you're chilling um so i got sentenced to that uh it has to be judicially sanctioned it used to be for parole violators so um so i get sentenced to dTP willard as it used to be called the old willard facility closed down so they moved it over to lakeview now lakeview is the home of

shock um little did i know that you know a year later i'd be going to shock because us in DTP, we see all the shock, you know, cadets going through hell, you know, having to do crazy, crazy shit. You know, we'd laugh at them. We'd just see him carrying logs. And we'd be like, ha, ha, and we'd see them, and we're doing dumb shit. And carrying logs, and I never thought. And I thought I'd be going to shock. But, you know, like I said, it's intensive.

It's a lot of meetings and stuff like that. So, you know, you could skate through. I, you know, I did the program. Like, I went above and beyond. And they have, like, you know, group leader and community rep. Like, they literally named me the community, because I went above and beyond

with all the projects. Like, I was telling you, really, with the painting and stuff like that, we had to do, like, a community meeting where every week we had to draw up a board and, you know, I drew good and went above and beyond, like, mine and my group, we blew away every other,

you know, every other group because you'd have to have your group meetings and whatever. and yeah you know i i plan to get out and um and do the right thing this time but um uh very first night um i uh i relapsed the very first night within hours of getting out on meth and it was off to off to the races again this time by myself so um i'm uh i'm going on three years now of being a deadbeat dad to my daughter and um i'm thinking you know i'm thinking i could you know i've just got to make enough enough to i what then what do you think when's when's enough enough enough you

know in my head I had this imaginary mouth that I'm going to make and I'm going to be good and I'm going to stop doing crime and I'm going to live this sober life and I got out in January and um uh you know like I said I'd read I got right back into it and um you know I go to I go to a trap house and I'm sitting at the trap house just like we are. And my buddy, who was his trap house, you know, we're talking. And this girl comes in. And she explains to us, you know, hi, nice to meet you, blah, blah, blah. She wants some dope, blah, blah, blah.

She says to my boy, she says, listen, you know, I got this rental car. You said you needed to use this rental car. Here's the only thing, though. You know, two months ago when I was sober, my dad rented it for me, but I relapsed, she says. And she says, my dad might have reported it stolen. That's the only thing. It's a Kia, K5, gorgeous, blacked out Kia, right? And I just got out.

I had nothing at the time. I'm seeing this whole situation go down. and you know my buddy gives her some drugs to borrow the car so we went out of town for a little nice boost and run whatever he drops me off and later that night he gets pulled over and you know they found some drugs in a switchblade but the supposed hot Kia that she said you know her dad said you know you better return that here i'm calling the cops

I remember fort that's stolen. Turns out it wasn't stolen. And he just got arrested. He gets arrested. And the car gets impounded. He said, they didn't say nothing about that Kia being stolen? And he's like, no, they didn't say anything. I'm like, hmm.

And I'm thinking in my head. I said, where did it get impounded to? And he said the name of the, he said the name of the auto place. and it was the auto. That's the name of it. And I know, I don't know the owner, but I know his son real well. I was locked up with him.

I do have one interaction with the owner, though. The owner of the building, when I'd worked at Annie Ann's, had dropped his credit card in the mall, and it said Terenzi Auto on it. And I called him. This is when I was, you know, fresh out of high school.

I called them. I said, hey, you dropped your credit card. He said, if you ever need anything, you know, give me a holler. Stop down the body shop, if ever need anything, thank you so much. So fast forward, however many years. I said, hey, sir, you remember me? Years ago, I returned your credit card from the mall. He's like, yeah, what's going on?

I said, listen, I kind of need a favor. There was a Kia that got impounded there. like a couple days ago. He's like, yeah? It's a rental car. I kind of needed it out. Like no questions asked type deal. He goes, well, the night tow truck driver,

Lenny, he came and picked it up. He covered it. So if you pay him $300, you can come pick it up. So I'm like, oh my God. Oh, $300 for a Kia, brand new, 2022 K-5. and it was off to the races from there, man. Like just ripping and running.

Three and O and high-speed chases with that thing just going up and down to East Coast, just going crazy with this Kia. And eventually the Kia became so hot from all that. I'd ended up getting another vehicle. And that's what got me locked up this past time. was a 2022 Silverado I had. And I, you know, meth does something to you.

Like, I could have been selling these if I would have had a chop shop or something. I was just, like, literally just parking them places. I had four vehicles parked in different towns throughout in New York and Pennsylvania. And just like... You're an addict. Yeah. I mean, meth was just, my mind, I thought everything was making sense, but it didn't make sense at all.

So, yeah, the vehicle I had had a GPS, and I would always get them on like a Friday night to think I have the whole weekend to figure everything out, you know what I mean? and yeah the cops had tracked the GPS

on the truck so so yeah I'm on parole at this point mind you and and I'm back

in cars within four months and this is when they put you in the shock program yes what is the shock program so

shock is military bearing based military bearing based treatment program it's the most intense

treatment program New York has to offer it's a they used to have it at different correctional facilities in New York they used to have it at like two or three I believe

but now it's only done at one shy it's like I said earlier I'd gotten to C-shock firsthand being a DTP program, which is like in one dorm on the whole compound of Lakeview and seeing what they had to go through. And seeing what, you know, knowing what I was about to,

let me rewind for a little bit. I got sentenced to a 23-month parole violation. So I didn't know I was going to get shock at first. sent up state from county in Elmira and Elmira Correctional is the most insane place ever four floors of

200 yards on the cell block four stories and people are throwing shit fishing everywhere you walk in and it's just loud filled with smoke you smell the wicks burning and that was that was intense like feeling like what the what have I got myself into like I had this

chance like this golden ticket with DTP Willard and now I'm back and now I'm looking at 23 months so I was there for a little bit until until I found out that I got accepted into shock because I believe you have to have three years or less on a prison sentence to get it to qualify. So basically, to your question, what is shock? So six months of the most intense military boot camp based training that you can imagine. With drone instructors, so I'm looking at 23 months and I could finish in six, I could either sit at a spot for 23 months and chill, or I can go through, because it's voluntary.

You could sign out at any point. Six months of, like I said, the most intense training. So I'd found out I was on the draft, had to Lakeview, and, you know, nerves are, are beyond beyond anything like I'm just so nervous what to expect what's going to happen and um

you know you hear stories like horror stories like they're going to come running on the bus the drill instructor it's going to come running on the bus screaming and you're going to get slapped around and you are going to be put through hell You're going to be diving in the mud. Luckily, I was in a, it was in April that I'd started. So the weather was getting nice because I feel bad for the winter.

They're outside, no matter what, at 5.30, working out. So, got shipped up to Lakeview, put in the reception dorm. There was a new platoon, the Bulldogs starting up. there are I think there's six platoons so there's Bulldogs which I was in Bulldogs, Mad Dogs

Titans Hardcore Wolfpack Shock Knights six and then there's the females but you can't you can't even you can't talk to the females

you're on the same at the same facility you can't talk to females if you even get caught looking at them like some of the punishments the journal structure will will do

if you fuck up like you know talk when you're not supposed to or do something you have to wear a sash or they'll come up with creative ways creative ways to fuck with you and like if you even look at a female you're rocking a big eyeball

like you'll have to make it yourself out of out of cardboard or something you got to hold it over your head at all times like can carry it with you everywhere and you know you're seeing all this go on you're like oh man all this you're seeing them do PT physical training all the time running in the morning you're in reception and you're hearing this all this so I'm like oh I'm about to you know go through and um all this time you're in the reception dorm on shock you're learning the ins and outs of you know what you got to to do you got to um you know you're not to use eye statements to the drill instructor your position

of attention um you learn your face and movements left face about face you always got to run every you can't walk anywhere like um like if you know you want to go out that door you're not going to cut straight across the room you're going to have to make a right angle everywhere um you're you have to, like I said, you have to, sir, when you're speaking to a drill instructor, sir, image Schultz request permission to speak with drill instructor. I can't look you in the eye. If you're a drill instructor,

position of attention, I have to look above you. It's called eyeballing if you look at drill instructor in the eye. And like little fuck-ups, like as you're learning, that's when they get you. It's hard for people to learn all this. And, you know, they're looking for people. They want people. They expect people to fuck up.

So basically, you know, you got six months ahead of you. And you're learning all the ins and outs of the program or reception as the previous platoon, which had just completed their six months, graduates. So you're going right in. And, you know, going into it, I'm like, man, I just spent three years like not taking care of myself out on the streets, ripping and running, smoking cigarettes. You're allowed to smoke and shock. You're not in a lot of commissary, though. You can't order cigarettes off commissary.

That's it. Cigarettes hygiene, whatever. No, no commissary. But in the mess hall, you could eat as much as you want. because you're doing all that physical activity, you're burning so many calories. You could say you want one scoop, two scoop, three scoop, or of that rice or potatoes or whatever they got.

Their breakfasts were actually good, like good for being locked up and having to go through the bullshit of county. But, you know, you have to, to finish all that on your plate within eight minutes. So if you get too much more than what you said,

if you still got shit on your tray and that eight minutes is up, you know, I had never done that, but I, you know, people around me, they'd have to wear it in their pocket. When had his coffee and his waffles, just put right in his pocket. You know, they dump it on your head.

the potatoes and shit like that. There's chill drill instructors that are like, you know, because they're correctional officers who just take a bid to do the drill instructor bid. So they're all correctional officers. The bid just comes with like the responsibility that you have your platoon or whatever. And, you know, you've got a, in the morning, you've got a PT or platoon. Some officers are, some are think they're, what's that movie with the drill instructor? What's the name of it?

Drill Bit Taylor? No. Oh, I can't think of the movie. It'll come to me. Stanley Kubrick movie with the Army. full metal jacket so like the drill instructor in there they think they're that with the hat pulled down they think they're they think they're uh you know full metal jacket but

as um you know as the previous you know we saw the previous baton graduate and then uh and then we were up we had a thing called um zero weeks which started on Monday morning. We went in the dorm on a Friday night, so we had that weekend, you know, to prepare for it. You know, you've got to have your uniform with creases, pants hemmed, your boots, so your second notch on your boots laces are showing.

So it's like perfect there, so they're not just, you know, bunched up around your ankle. your locker's got to be in order every morning at 5.30 you've got eight minutes to make your bed, brush your teeth, use the bathroom, do whatever in eight minutes. That's it. Not one thing can be out of place in your locker. Bed's got to be perfect with the hospital corners. The fold's got to be certain uh a certain uh you know length and um just trust me they do inspections all the time all the time so um yeah that first morning um you know we were all wonder what are we in for because you know you're going to go through it um you've got in the dorm um you've got four drill instructors

one in each corner, just putting everybody through it. You know, if somebody fucks up, one person fucks up, the whole platoon has to pay. So, so yeah, they're, you know, you had people fucking up and you're like, fuck, man, why can't you just get your shit together? Because when the whistle blows in the morning, you got to wake up with a purpose, they call it. You're screaming at the top of your lungs. It's literally screaming. everybody in the whole dorm's doing it and moving to the corner of their

cube, standing there and just waiting for further instructions. So 5.30, when the whistle blows you, ah! And you just wait there. Until further instructions. You do your count. Sir one, sir, two, sir.

Sir three. And you do the whole dorm. If anybody fucks up or doesn't say sir at the end, if they say one, sir, you know what I mean? Nope, it's not sir one. You know what I mean?

You start all over. and you pay for that. So you're paying this whole time for other people's mistakes. So, you know, you got your fuck-ups too. Like, you know, people are fucking up left and right and you're getting pissed at them. But the thing is, you know, that beginning of zero weeks

was we got to put our mattresses on our head and we're doing up downs for like three hours. that morning, that first morning. We're running around the whole compound with our mattresses. We're just at the mercy of the drill instructor. And my legs have never been as sore as they were that next day.

Because you're doing iron mics, which is basically lunges like this. If you fuck up, they're like, you know, just doing iron mics to death. And, you know, they break you down. This is what they say. you down to build you back up. And that first, you know, the first couple weeks were intense.

Like there had been times where I literally was exhausted to the point of exhaustion where I'm thinking about signing out. And there's people dropping left and right. I think it was like 54 we started out with. And people are signing out. That first two weeks, people are signing out, like, a lot. Over the next, you know, a few months, it calms down. Like, you get your core group and of who, you know, your Bluetooth. Real value shows up in reliability.

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It is, and people start, you know, people get in trouble here and there. Were you able to complete it and make it through it? Yes, yes. I didn't think I would at first. I wanted to sign out. But the thought of the thought of having to do the rest of the 23 months, which is an extra year basically,

a year and a half extra. So if I would have signed out when I wanted to, trust me, there's tons of times. Like, I remember one time, first thing in the morning, you know, the night before, somebody had somebody had

done something I forget what exactly um and we got put on a body bag which is you know you uh you're not allowed to smoke

and you know because we have green red and yellow hats and your hats take away you got to wear the brown hat and um and yeah no smoke that was the biggest thing like no smoking and they're just drilling us to death they're making us uh 5 30 in the morning we're out there crawling through the grass crawling through

the mud everybody's covered in mud they're just it's basically like zero weeks all over again because the program gets it doesn't get easier but your body gets used to it um because you get a job uh my job at first was the mess hall um and um i had wrote to get into law library like i heard they were hiring law library and myself and uh and one of my peers had got the job at the law library which is the cake walk law libraries air air conditioning this is during summer air conditioning you can smoke however many sigs you want because there's smoke breaks you know if if you're on the dorm there's smoke breaks three times a day.

You know, down the law library, it's chill. And yeah, I got the job at the law library. And, you know, I started, you know, honing some of my drawing skills. And being at law library, the officers down there were cool. They could hook us up and get shit printed out. Because in shock, you get one phone call. you know, basically a week. They completely cut you off from the outside, like your family, like you're there to fix you, you know.

Our tablets that we had while in, you know, that were issued, everyone gets issued tablets in prison, but our tablets are taken away, barely given to us, maybe once a month at first until we earn them. So, yeah, the job at the law library helped a lot, and it makes the days go. Every day is like Groundhog Day, the same thing. Like I said, 5.30, you're waking up, you're PT and you're going through an hour of all the calisthenics, like push-ups, sit-ups, lunges, squats, out in the yard. In the main yard, you have all the platoons there.

And then after that, the platoon split up and go on their runs. You know, some platoons would run longer than others. Like our platoon was kind of in the middle, but there were other platoons that would run like five laps, and each lap is a mile around the compound. So, yeah, we were doing about three laps, you know, give or take. So every day was like Groundhog Day. So then, you know, you'd eat, after all that, you'd eat chow.

go back to the dorm, get dressed. Everyone would spread out to their jobs because you have different jobs. Some people where I started in the mess hall, they've got different jobs, like porters, such and such. Everyone goes to their job. Some people got school. Like if you have, you got a lot of people that didn't get their GED or high school diploma. You got people going to finish that. And like I said, I was down the law library, so got to do a lot of artwork for the dorm.

And I was telling you like that that got me through a lot doing a lot of art. Because our dorm was completely bare. Some dorms are hooked up with a lot of artwork, a lot of murals and stuff. Our dorm when I got there was completely bare. But by the time six months was up and I graduated, did a crazy mural on the floor with a bulldog breaking through the brick. did a drill instructor bulldog one of the drill instructors um wanted a buffalo bills a giant buffalo bills logo uh in the in the in the bubble so that kind of got me through um but uh was this the experience you needed to finally get sober definitely i mean to rewind a little bit

you know to rewind a little bit before I had got arrested this particular time it was March and my daughter's birthday was March 8th and mar you know leading up to that my daughter wanted two things you know an Nintendo switch and an iPhone and you know this is her this was her 11th birthday at the time She's 12 now. But, you know, in my head, you know, at the time I'm still ripping and running, I'm still under the influence. She wanted those two things. And I'm like, okay, I can, you know, easy, easy.

I had the iPhone. I was going to get the switch. Things that are kind of hard to get, you know, like a switch is, it's on the harder side to boost. a switch. Like, I was just going to have to get money up and just buy it. You know what I mean? But this, uh,

so her birthday's coming up in a couple days. I'm going to be there for, you know, but I'm on the run again. Like I said, I'm on the run. And, um, and I had this truck and I'm an hour,

a couple hours away in Pennsylvania. And, um, I'd gone into this place which was there was a bunch of tools I'd gone in there and by the time I came out the cops had you know were parked behind one of my trucks

and I guess they towed it so I'm stranded no money no nothing in Pennsylvania three hours away from home I think it was on the 7th of March her birthday's on the 8th so I you know I'm telling her on the phone every time I talk to her she'll call me once or twice a day yeah I'll be back I'll be back I'm trying to get money up to get back but I ran out of meth and for those that don't know you run out of meth you just become lethargic like you just crash and I'm crashed I'm in a strange town I lost my transportation

and um i since i run out of meth i don't know anybody you know i'm in the strange so i'll never forget what what i hurt the most was me missing her birthday like right before i got locked up and um i said to myself this whole time um i said to myself this whole time like this is it like like people people can knock it people can you know say what they want about it but like I actually appreciated it in a way like it got me to the point where you know I was I was healthy I was in shape and you know I had a plan this I had these six months to plan everything um This is our platoon graduated in November.

We graduated, completed shock, parole to the halfway house, and I immediately started working. I got this shitty job laying up fiber class. It itched. Oh, my, it was good pain. $19 bucks an hour. So, you know, Monday through Friday, just from the halfway house,

a buddy of mine gave me a mountain bike, biking back and forth every day, two miles, to the shitty job, saving up money, and started paying off some of my fines from my, for my license. I owed like, I owed like 600,

something fines, got all my fines paid off. Slowly, like I took baby steps. And, and finally, you know, finally just stayed sober.

Like, that's the key. Like, and not jump the gun. That first night, if I could tell you this, that first night I got paroled to the halfway house,

I'm laying in bed, and I shit you. not I wanted like part of me it was like part of me wanted to go out and start seeing what I kind of trouble I get into part of me said no just stay and I was literally I was literally about to get up this time I was so close and I felt that struggle sitting in that halfway house bed sitting there I felt it I felt it and I'm just like no Joe just go to sleep. That was the first night I got out in December. So after that night, you know, the next day went out getting applications, got shitty job laying up the fiberglass. Did that for three months.

I had my license back. My credit wasn't too bad. Like it's low six hundreds, but I had $1,000. I put $1,000 on, and I had to, had to get a Kia because of the memories. So I'm officially a Kia boy. I had to get a Kia. I got a little 22 Kia Forte. I'm financing, make a payment. It's $400 a month, you know. How's your relationship with your daughter now?

Awesome. Here's the bittersweet part. She's 12, and she's getting to the point where it's like, You ever hear that song, Cats in the Cradle? Where, you know, the dad gets older. You know, just wants to hang out with the kid. But then the kid gets too busy. My daughter's getting like that.

She's, you know, getting to the age where it's like, you know, I'm hanging out with my friends, dad, you know. But, no, I talk to my daughter every day. Um, you know, I got, uh, you know, I got a little RV, a nice RV. Like, I'm talking. Like, and I see, I seen you had, uh, uh, Walt Jr. on the podcast. Yeah. Shout out to Breaking Bad. That was awesome. I seen you had Walt Jr. on the other day. That big Breaking Bad fan. Good dude. He's a good dude. Big Breaking Bad fan. I'll tell you this story. Um, so my dad, remember I told you, I told you, my dad's a little. My dad, and this is when I was selling dope, I would try and get my dad set up so I could go make a run. Every morning he would put on Breaking Bad, season one, episode one, right? And he would watch it the whole way through all day. And it's always on in the background.

So, like I know, like every episode of Breaking Bad. Season one episode one, next day puts on Breaking Bad. Season one episode one. I come and I say, Dad, why don't you put it on season two now? You've watched episode one all day. He did, he doesn't want, like, season one, episode one. He just loved episode one. He just watched season one and lets it play for the whole day. It'll end around, you know, like, you know.

That's funny. But, yeah, man, I got, I did the same thing. I put a thousand down. I figure, you know, since the halfway house was only a 90-day thing. apartments around Binghamton, like 800. But I came up with this crazy idea. Like, I always wanted a RV. And I got a 2012.

It's a beautiful. It's got everything in it, you know, everything. And moved it up at my parents' house. So I hook up off of their electric. And they need help, you know. Like I was telling you, they have both their issues. But, you know, when my daughter has the time, five minutes down the road from my daughter, my mom and dad, every weekend, we'll go for a road trip now.

Like the other, we went up to Lake Ontario. Got to stay in New York State most of the time. But, you know, we'll go, we'll go. We'll go on road trips. Just, you know, and I got money in my pocket. Legal money. I got a better job. I work for Macintosh.

Like, Macintosh is like high-end audio equipment. I work in the metal shop. It's a really, like, mundane job. It's awesome, man. But staying clean, haven't used one time since I got out. But, you know, I get to spend time with them now. they're getting older and get their healthy. I take them.

You know, I still got a great relationship with my daughter's mother, who was a saint, who during the whole time I was locked up and being selfish and fucking up, she came and started helping out my parents cleaning their house. Even though we're not together, you know, she's a saint for that. What's the lesson you want people to take away from your story? I would say a couple lessons. first, you know, it's not always as bad as you think it is. There were times when I thought, you know, I could have stopped everything and gone to rehab,

could have done it right there, but I thought, I'm too deep over my head. And in the long run, I kept getting more and more wrapped up in this lifestyle, more and more. There were times when I could have stopped throughout this whole journey. and I didn't Another would be You know If you get down You know if you get knocked down

Like I was And I'm released to the halfway house Not a dollar to my name Have patience Because You know Rome isn't built in the day You can't

You know Like I was saying That struggle of me wanting to go out and that was part of it. I want to get some money in my pocket quick. You know, and that wouldn't have, it wouldn't have, it wouldn't have ended up in a good situation. Especially now, you can't do anything now.

You can't do any crime. Everything's, there's cameras, you can't do anything, even if I wanted to. But that's the thing, like, take the help that's offered. because when I was paroled to the halfway house, they got a re-entry program in Binghamton. I don't know too much about it. I'm sure it's everywhere in New York.

I'm not sure about other states. But they did a lot. Like, they hooked it up. Like, for people, for people that were formerly incarcerated, they got released back. They hooked up so much. Like, they give you a card for, you know, the dollar general, they'll give you a gift card, they'll buy your shoes, they'll buy your phone,

they'll pay your phone bill for the first, you know, until you get self-sufficient. And that's just to the point where, you know, I never thought a year ago to the point where I, you know, be working and, you know, spending time with my daughter, spending time with my parents, like, I neglected them big time. Being a son, I was a shitty son for a few years and a shitty father for a few years, really shitty. And, you know, it could have ended up bad. Three of my closest best friends growing up all died from overdose.

They're not, within the last 10 years, three of the closest best friends. And two of my cousins all died from overdose. Literally, like, everyone who I grew up with, like, I don't, to this day, you know, I say I have a lot of associates, not very many friends. I mean, it's crazy. I could have, you know, I've, I never OD during my use of heroin.

I had come close a few times. But I'd never OD. detour I needed Narcan or anything. But not only that could have easily when going on these high-speed chases

literally like fast and the furious type shit and literally an inch here and there and that could have impacted somebody that could, you know, imagine if imagine if here comes you know out of a parking into the road as a

is a family or something like that. That's what, you know, and just the selfishness of me wanting to keep the addiction going. And, you know, just to be selfish, not thinking who I hurt, you know, not thinking who's, you know, whose truck this is, whose car that was, you know what I mean? That type of shit. to deal with that, you know, to this day, like, you know, keeps to be on a path where, you know, I know just how quick, you know, within five minutes I could have someone on the phone.

I need some ice. I need some that quick. And everything that I worked for the last six months to accomplish is just right. down the train. So I got I got two more months of parole left. I finished parole in October

and from there. It's off to the races. No, it's not. Again, I can't. To life. Oh, to life. Not to your past. Yeah, no. It's your new life now.

I mean, you know, I'd love to you know, I don't see myself at the job I'm at, you know, it's mundane like factory type work. It's a starting point. It is, it is, and it'll put some money in my pocket. It's great money, great money. So, you know, I...

Well, Joe, I appreciate you coming on the show today, man. Hey, Ian, I appreciate you having me. And what you done, what you built here, It's impressive. Mad respect to you. Mad respect, you know, having me on. And, you know, I appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. One thing, you know, my favorite episode of yours is...

What? Mad Duck. Ah, that was a great one. I love that one, too. Victor Shear. Such a good storyteller. Oh, man, he is. I want to go to Mad Duck.

It's somewhere in New York. Like, I hit him up, and it's like an... AI answering machine. It's somewhere near me. Upstate. He is out that way. He's out that way. And I want to hit up Mad Duck.

He's great, man. It's, it's, uh, he's so great. It's a, uh, it's like an AI when you hit Mad Duck. It's some AI that says, we'll get back to you. He's got his cabin in the woods. I think you could book it on Airbnb. Really? Yeah, it's on the web.

He had a link to it in the description. Shout out to Mad Duck. He's got his cabin. Victor Shear. Victor Shear. He's got his cabin in the, he's got his cabin in the, the woods he's great bro mad duck well i appreciate you brother appreciate you in