Locked In with Ian Bick - I Was Sent to Prison — Then Found Out I Was Pregnant | Amanda Tarver

Episode Date: February 11, 2026

Amanda Tarver opens up about one of the most shocking chapters of her life, discovering she was pregnant just weeks after self-surrendering to federal prison, navigating pregnancy and childbirth behind bars, and the emotional reality of giving birth while incarcerated. In this conversation with Ian Bick, Amanda breaks down how her decisions led to federal prison time, the trauma and resilience of motherhood inside the prison system, and how that experience inspired her and her husband to start 300 Letters, a nonprofit supporting families impacted by incarceration and helping break the cycle of trauma. _____________________________________________ #PregnantInPrison #GaveBirthInPrison #PrisonStory #TrueCrimePodcast #PrisonLife #InmateStories #LifeAfterPrison #lockedinwithianbick _____________________________________________ Connect with Amanda Tarver: Website: https://300letters.org/ Instagram & Tiktok: @IAMLEGENDFITNESS @300LETTERS @TRUTHBYAMANDA _____________________________________________ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ _____________________________________________ Shop Locked In Merch: http://www.ianbick.com/shop _____________________________________________ Timestamps: 00:00 Amanda’s Story: Pregnancy, Prison & Survival 00:54 Childhood, Family Instability & Constant Moving 02:58 Parents’ Relationship & Early Trauma 06:42 Strict vs. Lenient Parenting & Control 08:34 Money, Independence & Teen Responsibilities 09:25 School Behavior & Early Warning Signs 09:55 Never Imagining Prison as a Teen 10:34 Family History of Incarceration 11:02 Growing Up Cuban in Miami 11:58 Early Adulthood & First Pregnancy 13:32 Motherhood, Independence & College Life 14:04 Family Reaction to Becoming Pregnant 15:44 Navigating Complicated Family Dynamics 17:51 Meeting Legend Tarver & Falling in Love 20:54 Discovering the Drug Operation 22:59 Getting Involved & Sending Money 25:02 Normalizing Crime & Ignoring Red Flags 28:10 Consequences, Arrest & Federal Indictment 32:44 Detention Center, Court Dates & Legal Process 41:11 First Days in Prison & Culture Shock 47:46 Pregnant in Prison: Fear, Stress & Reality 52:26 Taking a Plea Deal & Self-Surrender 58:09 Adjusting to Prison & Finding Support 01:03:20 Pregnancy Programs & Giving Birth While Incarcerated 01:08:32 Motherhood in Prison: Nutrition & Daily Life 01:15:13 Family Impact & Reentry Challenges 01:19:08 Halfway House & Reuniting With My Kids 01:27:16 Talking to Children About Prison 01:34:32 Finding Purpose After Prison 01:38:28 Starting 300 Letters & Giving Back 01:44:22 Breaking the Cycle & Empowering Others 01:46:03 Final Advice to My Younger Self Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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this whole thing. But that's exactly the opposite of what happened. I was like, absolutely don't know what the fuck you're talking about. You guys are feds. You do your job. I don't know where you're coming to me. What was it like in that detention center? You've never been arrested before. You've never even stepped foot in a jail. What's that like for you? It, that is wild. My guest today found out she was pregnant just weeks after surrendering to federal prison and then gave birth while incarcerated. In this episode, Amanda Tarver walks us through how she ended up behind bars.

What pregnancy and childbirth are really like in prison? The moment she held her baby and how that experience changed her life forever. Where'd you grow up, Amanda? I grew up in Miami, in L.A., back and forth, like my whole entire childhood. My mom was born in Illinois. My dad was born in New York. My grandparents were part of like the Cuban exile from Cuba to Jersey. And then my mom's family ended up in Illinois. And so they had me in L.A. Okay. And how long did you spend in L.A.? Oh, not long. I don't even know how they both ended up there. They met like when my mom was in high school. And then I was their love child, very toxic relationship. My mom had me at 18. My dad was 20. They were like the only Cubans where they were where there were more Cubans in their area. in L.A., but he said he saw my mom and he was, like, obsessed. And then they had me within, like, six months of knowing each other. So when they broke up for the first time, I was like one and a half. And my mom, you know, did the whole, I'm going to Miami because her aunt lived here.

So she brought us down to Miami. And that was, that's when all this, the story begins. Did your dad end up coming back to Miami and they got back together? My dad chased her to Miami. That's a good man. A good man. He was like, you're not taking my daughter. They had a very tumultuous relationship. They were young. They also come from very tough upbrings, you know, coming from Cuba, being in survival mode, their parents. So he flew over to Miami and she got pregnant with my sister, like in one of those back and force, but they were just so unstable here. And he was so young, you know, starting out his life. My mom had already kind of

started her life. She got a really, really good job here in insurance and health insurance. So she had no intention of moving back to California. So he tried to stay, but he couldn't. It was just like he was getting in trouble. He got arrested for domestic violence. It was just too much going on. And he really loved his daughters a lot. But it wasn't healthy for him. So he moved back to L.A., got back on track. You know, he got with my stepmom. Then they had my other sister. So it was me, my mom and my grandma, like, you know, the girls. The girls stayed in Miami. And then it was yeah, it was rough because I really loved my dad. Like I always wanted to be with him. So it was a little rough, but they tried to make it work as far as co-parenting. Now, you had told me you had a few other

sisters as well, family of girls. Was that with different fathers then? So my younger sister, it's directly under me, were four and a half years, that she was born in the midst of my dad coming back and forth. So my mom got pregnant of her at 22. She had me at 18. And, and she was, and, And she got pregnant on her. Yep, at 22. And my dad left. So it was me, my mom, and my sister alone. And so we're from the same dad.

Then my dad goes to California. He establishes his life with my stepmom. He gets her pregnant with another sister, which is Christina. She's in Cali. All girls. All girls. Poor guy. And he is the strictest man you will meet.

Like my pants had to be longer than my fingertips, no tank tops. When I was wearing a hoodie, like, what do you? have like four fingers. No spaghetti straps were allowed. It was crazy. Yeah. And it got worse as we got older, especially me because I'm the oldest one. And then my mom remarried, well, she didn't remarried. She just one of her most stable relationships with me growing up was with my sister, my younger sister. She's 19. She's in L.S.C. right now. I'm super proud of her. So she's from a different dad. Do you ever think about how life would have been if you stayed in L.A. and grew up there? Do you think it would have been different or not really?

I think it would have been extremely different. Like my mom and my dad's side of the family live in L.A. All my cousins. My dad's family is very family-oriented. You know, my grandparents, my aunts, my uncles. But I didn't have the privilege of being raised with my cousins and my aunts and my uncles. Like my uncle Roberts married to my aunt, Laura, you know, forever. And that was such a healthy thing to like no one.

recognized as an adult. When I was younger, I didn't grow up seeing that. And all of my cousins are doing so well. They went to universities. You know, they had, you know, they were just on a different trajectory. Whereas to my life completely felt unstable. It felt like I was like catching up constantly. It felt like I was starting over every couple of years. So I don't have like childhood friends. I don't have, you know, I didn't really have a vision for my future. I, I, I was always really smart and gifted classes, advanced classes, but nothing was nurturing that side of me. So when I was 12, it's like, well, when I was eight is the first time I went to California by myself in an airplane at eight years old. And my dad picked me up and that's when like your parents were able to get

you at the gate. And so like I was so happy seeing him. Then I had to go back and I would cry. And then at 11 or 12, I had to, my mom was like, well, I've had you enough. This is when you're getting your attitude. You know, that's when our girls, like, we start just, with our puberty and she sent me to California. She's like, your dad could deal with you for a little while. So I was like, okay. So I go to my dad, but I was a guest there. Like, my sisters lived there because my stepmom had a daughter of her own.

So I had two sisters there and I would be there and I would be a yes. So they were like, have to make space for me. I had to share a room. I had to like have a room that was like an extra room. And then after that, my mom would feel bad and be like, okay, come back now for eighth grade. And I was like, okay, I'll go back. And then midway through the year, no, this is, I can't. Like, go back to your dad.

So in middle school, I probably went to like four or five different schools. High school, I went to like six of them. So it was rough. I definitely would have had a different life if I just had stability. Now that strictness you were describing earlier, do you think that impacted your decisions later on in life? Yeah, my dad and my mom were polar opposites. Like my mom grew us up.

She had a very, she had a very abusive childhood. She was abused by like every man in her life from the age of five. So the way she parented was not really parenting. It was more like as long as I can pay everything, I'm going to work my ass off. And as long as I can pay everything for my daughters, then I'm doing good because she also was raised, sharing a room with four of her siblings. Like it was very hard on her. So she gave us a lot of freedom because she.

She was just focused on her personal journey. She had me at 18. So she was like an older sister. We could wear whatever we want. Friends could come over. I could sleep over Friends' house. It was just very different. My dad, he decided to settle down with my stepmom.

He was like, okay, I need to create my life, focus on our career and having that financial stability. So he was with my stepmom for like 20 years. So he was very, very strict when I would get there. I loved my dad. We got along very well. But it was really hard for me to like have to shift the way I dressed. Like everything, everything.

He would literally go to my luggage when I got to California, throw out everything. Like clothes that my mom would buy me from Burdines, you know, baby fat, echo red, all the designer shit that I loved. He would just be like, absolutely not. Like, we're going to Mervyn's and we're going to get you the latest trends at Mervyn's. And I would fucking cry. I'd be like, oh, my God. Like, why are you like this? So it was hard because they were completely opposites.

He tried to be the really, really strict dad. And she was like the cool sister. How are you financially with your mom in your teenage years? My mom was good because my mom, she was a hustler. She worked in health insurance. She elevated really young in her positions in her corporate jobs when we were young. So she was always like the woman that was independent. We lived like in nice condos and nice townhomes.

She didn't cook for us. Never. I can't remember like when my mom did a home cook meal. We would eat out all the time. Like fast food and eating out was our thing. She would just buy whatever we wanted. She felt like that was kind of like her form of love. Just buy what you need and make sure you guys have everything and don't need for anything

from anyone. That was her mindset. So but as far as like talking about college, our future, talking about careers. choices as a woman and like having those conversations we didn't really have that in your teenage years do you ever get in trouble how are you as a kid no i never got in trouble i had attitude yeah you were good in school too you were saying i was super good in school i never got in trouble i was um no i was i was chill like i think i was a good kid i mean yeah had an attitude problem for sure i still have it to those day, but I think that's just like, that's just my personality. Do you think teenage you would

have ever envisioned yourself in prison? Absolutely not. No way. I was completely never in trouble. Yeah, I like, I would have altercations with girls and stuff because that's just what happens, you know, in L.A., the girls didn't like me when I would shift. And then when I come back to Miami, like, It was always like the new girl, you know, the new girl. So she always gets the attention. So I would have those type of issues, but no, never any issues with anybody. My teachers always loved me. I was always a good student, a good person.

I would consider myself. So, yeah, no. That was a Cuban in you. That was a Cuban in the fighting. Oh, for sure. My dad, my grandpa was a fighter in Cuba too. Really? And I did karate my whole entire upbringing.

Yeah. And he actually went to prison because he accidentally killed someone fighting in a match. And in Cuba, they sentenced him to prison time. Wow. Yeah. So he was in prison when my mom was little. And that's like when she came, her mom came to America. So she didn't really have her dad either.

And he was incarcerated for like a good 10 years. Wow. Crazy, right? Was it interesting hearing about the whole Cuban aspect during, what is it, geography or in school? Not really because Miami, everyone's Cuban, like growing up. Now it's very diverse. Yeah, it's very culturally diverse. And we don't make up a lot of the Latinos in America, but in Miami we're concentrated.

Like they expect you to be Cuban in Miami. When you go to Miami, you're going to be spoken to in Spanish. Okay. Like first, before they speak to you in English, like you have to know Spanish. Yeah. It's crazy. I guess here when we were learning about it, just there's a bunch of white people in the room learning about the Cuban missile crisis and stuff.

Yep. So it's different for us. It's different. But like all of my friends are, their parents are. their parents were born in Cuba. Mine were, I'm third generation, but like a lot of my friends, their parents were born in Cuba, you know, so it's very like new and real to us. It's like you're still living. Feels like every product claims real protein these days. But real doesn't start on a label. It starts at the source. Like real California milk from California farm families,

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certified medical assistant. I knew I wanted to be in the, in the medical field. I got pregnant of him really young and I was in a really abusive verbally and physically abusive relationship at that age after I got pregnant is when that started to come out. So it was crazy because I didn't know how to deal with it. And since I got pregnant so young, my mom was like, well, I had you at 18. You need to figure it out. Like you're not going to have my help. And so when I got pregnant, I was like, what do I do? But I just always remember wanting to be a mom. And And I think it's because I really didn't have like that motherly figure and love. And it's like, I think two things happen to you, right?

When you're raised, you either want to do exactly what your parents are or you automatically are, you know, you do, you raise your children, how your parents raised you, or you want to do the exact opposite. And that's exactly what happened to me. I just always remember wanting to be a mom and wanting to give my sons all the love. And I always wanted sons. That's why I say sons. Like I knew I was going to only have boys.

I never know if I have a girl, but just giving my kids all the love and, like, the stability and, like, the support that I didn't have. And so, yeah, I didn't. I was a medical assistant by the time I was 19. By the time I was 21, I was a licensed anesthetician, medical assistant, a laser technician, because I was already working in that field. And then I was just, yeah, I was just working really hard. I wanted to go back to school. I wanted to be a PA. But by the time I was 23, I was indicted, so years changed.

How did your mom react to the young pregnancy? And was she more helpful than most parents because she went through that exact same thing? No, the complete opposite. Like, oh, you're pregnant? Okay, well, I went through it. She had no empathy. Like, she knows what she went through. And she was only 36 when I got pregnant.

So it's not like something, a distant memory for her. You know, my son's 17 right now. and and she was like, well, I went through it and I figured it out. So you got to figure it out. Like, don't count on me. You can't live with me. You know, she was never, my kids, I can count the times my kids have seen my mom. Like they don't, they, it took my youngest, who's 10 right now.

It took him to like seven or eight to kind of understand that that, oh, that's my grandma too. Like your mom is my grandma because they just call her your mom. So. What do you think that change was with your mom? seems during your upbringing very supportive go-getter wanting to best. She was a go-getter, but not really supportive. Like, she wanted the best for her. Um, um, she was a supporter financially, not emotionally, not mentally, you know? She, she was, she was like a sister, like, an older sister. Like, could you imagine, like, being raised with like your older, well,

you're, are you the oldest? Yeah. Okay. So, yeah, I figure it's like just your older sibling raising you. where they're not going to really tell you what to do when you do something wrong they're going to use it against you because they are your parent so they use that power but it was never like guiding towards you guides you towards good decisions to make and always just worried about like the financials in life which also stems from her upbringing you know she was very very she lived in poverty when she was younger so she said when she was 15 she would take her sister's ID that was was older than her. She was like two years older than her and to work because she wanted to work. She wanted to make money. So I think that's always what what drove her was like the money, money,

money, money. And so yeah, she didn't have that compassion for me. She's like, I did it. I worked my ass off with two girls. You just have to figure it out. What about your dad? My dad, super strict, super piss. My dad is not, he's very machismo, very Cuban. He's better now. you get older and like those things kind of like you have more emotional intelligence but he was pissed so what my dad does is he doesn't talk to you he cuts you off so i didn't talk to my dad for a couple of years and that's crazy because he went through the same thing it's almost like oh yeah it's super that's how you know and i feel like that's very alive in the in the latin culture too like when you even talk about prison and jail a lot of latinos they don't talk about it's like

oh this happened in our family we won't bring it up We don't bring up our dirt. We handle it as a family and that's it. And not me. I chose to like do the complete opposite where it was like healing out loud is actually what's going to change the generations after me. It was going to change it for my kids. So I thought I just kind of have learned these things about my parents growing up. I forgave my dad when I got home from prison because none of my parents spoke to me while I was in prison. And that was really rough. Like not having any of your parents come visit you and care about your son because my oldest son, he was six when I went in. So they weren't there for him at all.

Legends mom was. And then, you know, that was hard for me. But I had to make a decision for myself to kind of forgive them for that because people deal with their own shit, their own way. They deal with their own trauma, their own way. They're just people at the end of the day. So I think me learning that has given me a lot of peace in my life. Now, tell us about meeting legend. And for the audience, if you haven't seen the episode that came out right before this one, you have to go see it because Amanda's story aligns with her husband legend. And it's so cool that we have them back to back. Definitely a first for the show.

That's so cool. We're your first couple that was together before prison, during prison, and after prison. Yeah, and that had a baby in prison with that same person. And had a baby. Exactly. It's crazy. I thought it was interesting when he told me that you guys could see each other on the same yard. Because what are the chances? I could see him. Yeah. Yeah. But normally they split people up, not even like you guys got very lucky to go to Florida. We got so blessed. And when I tell you, even in those darkest moments, I felt God's presence with me all the time.

And it's so crazy because like that, that moment in life, that time, you definitely feel like the most disconnected. I feel like prison is the closest thing to death, right? Like everyone forgets about you. People don't think about you. You kind of, you're just out of. the face of the earth and whatever, whoever's there for you really, which is your family and your close friends, they're the ones who are going to stay connected. But it was crazy because I went to Coleman Camp and then when he got sentenced, they sentenced him to the low

and I was like, what are the odds, right? Like, what are the odds? But I'm sorry, I have like a hair hanging around. So yeah, meeting legend tells us about the first day. So meeting legend is crazy. So I had my oldest son. So when I met Legend, Dorian, which is my oldest son, was three. And so I was, what, 22 at the time, right? He was about to be four. He had like 22 at the time. I was working really, really hard. I worked with the cosmetic surgeon. That surgeon I worked with from when I was 19, when I finished medical assistant school, and he comes a big play into my prison sentence because he's actually the only person I put money on my books. And he would put racks. So he really took care of us.

So I meet Legend. We go one of my friends, she was in a really bad breakup. Like she found out her boyfriend was cheating on her. It was a Wednesday. I worked in surgery. I worked in the OR room. So I would never go out during the week. I was a mom, didn't go out throughout the week, would go out on the weekends and not

during the week because I had to be in the surgery room so early. And she was like, can you please come out with me? like I just found out my boyfriend who cheated on me like I'm just in not in a good place let's go out let's have a drink let's have a drink I'm like fine it was college night in coconut grove and so we're walking and two guys are walking towards us like we had already had a couple of the drinks we had been there already probably like 45 minutes an hour and um two guys are walking towards us and she knew Alfredo which is legend's best friend she knew him and so they just like looked at each other start flirting start talking. I don't know what they had going on before that. So they just go off. And me and Legend are just

standing there. They were like, hey, what's up? But we started talking and it was crazy because he had the same shoes on that I had just bought my son like a week prior. And I was like, hey, I just bought those for my son, Dory. And he's like, oh, shit. And then we were just talking. And it felt like we just picked up a conversation that we had that we were already had. Like, we were just picking up on an old conversation. We automatically clicked. And I won't say, it's like love at first sight even though I think that's what it was like it was just like two people reconnecting again from like a past life and so we hit hit it off we're talking and it actually gets crazy because I had back then I don't think we had iPhones yeah or maybe I had like the iPhone one

I don't know this is like 2012 um and my my son's dad definitely had some type of like he called and maybe I answered in my phone, like with my in my pocket. I don't know what, but he shows up to where we were at. And I, we were drunk already. Legend and I, we were already drunk. We were talking. We were hanging out. He bought me a rose. We were just talking. And I had a very, very toxic relationship with my son's father because he was all I had. Remember, my parents weren't supportive of my pregnancy. So we had to like make shit work out. And he pulls up to, right to where we are. And I'm like, oh my goodness. But when I'm drunk, I'm funny and super sweet. It's so funny. I'm like, oh, my gosh, my baby daddy's here. I got to go. He's like, what?

And he's looking around. And I'm like, let me go get in the car. But then I get in the car. I'm like, wait, why am I getting in the car? Why are you here? I'm like, I'm not leaving with you. I'm leaving with my friend. I get out of the car. I go with my friend. I look at a ledge. I'm like, bye. Bye. Bye. And he's looking at me, like, so confused. I'm like, who cares? I'll never see him again. And a week later, I'm talking about this, like, with my mom. Because me and my mom were still kind of talking at that time. And I'm like, I met this guy. We had great conversation. And super embarrassing. Jose showed up. And I'm super embarrassed. But who cares, Mom? I'll never meet him again. And when I'm telling her the story, he messages me on Facebook. He's like, hey, are you good? Are you okay? And I was like, yeah, I'm perfectly fine. Like, that's very normal for me. That's very normal for that to happen at me. And that's it.

We never stopped talking then. Like, we literally just stayed. A lot of drama happened for sure, but we never, we stayed connected. Wishing you could be there live for the big game, soaking up the atmosphere in the crowd. But too often, life gets busy. Or the price holds you back. Price Line is here to help you make it happen. With millions of deals on flights, hotels, and rental cars, you can go see the game live.

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No. Because he said he tried to hide it from you. Like, he tried to hide his operation from me, but I everyone sells drugs in Miami especially at that age where I like 21 22 everyone sold drugs Miami is a is a very very party city so like everyone sold weed everyone had something going on I think that's just always been like the culture in Miami so I won't say like oh yeah he's a drug dealer he was in college he told him he's like oh I'm in FIU I do rap music legend had his rap music group. He was doing performances like at clubs and shit. So I'm thinking, you know, he's

getting paid for these performances. Like, I'm not really thinking too much into it. And if he's selling drugs, like I'm not, it was very normal. Like all the guys I knew were selling some type of something or hustling. So it wasn't like a straight shot of a conversation. Now, do you think you were drawn to him because it's the opposite of maybe what your dad would have wanted? Probably, for sure. I, no, I can't say, I don't even know what my dad would have wanted. Like, I think my dad would have wanted me to never have a boyfriend in my life. So anything you've done would have been. Yeah, anything I done is not good enough.

Like, it's not acceptable. No, what happened is like, legend and I, we clicked instantly. I liked how manly he was, but how chill he was. I liked how he was very collected. and like he was a provider always. And maybe those are things about himself that he didn't really know because they were just forced out of him. But I was a, I'm a nurturer too.

Like I've always nurtured and loved the people around me. I wanted to be a mom at such a young age. So we just kind of like we're the oldest in our families. We have younger siblings. Like that hustle mentality, but still very much present and nurturing, was there for him. And I love that. And I definitely didn't have that with my son's father. Like it was our relationship wasn't a real relationship.

Like he, he was probably like a person that was undiagnosed bipolar. He had a lot of anger issues. And I found this out after like I got pregnant, you know, for the most part. That's like when his true colors came out. He hit me in the stomach when I was pregnant at 17, which is very like, I remember that vividly. And I was just like, whoa, being a young girl, I didn't even know what to do. and expressing these things to my mom and stuff, she didn't have any, she didn't have any space for me. She's like, well, you shouldn't have gotten pregnant.

So I, our relationship was terrible. Like, we just kind of shared an apartment together so that we could both be present because I was going to school and working. And he was not. So he would be in charge of picking up my son from daycare. I would take him to school in the morning and he would pick him up. And then we would be home, you know, at the end of the day. So I never connected with him like that. Like, Legend, our connection was really friends first, you know.

So, and I had never experienced that before. Tell us about that first conversation where it was official that you knew that he was dealing drugs and how he explained it to you. So Ledger was acting real fishy, right? But he was, he was a man hoe. Like, he was a hoe. He won't admit it, but he was. So he had all the girls. So I think what happened was like he was being very secretive and I'm not secretive.

I'm an open book. Like I'm going to tell you everything on my day. I don't hide anything. I'm just like that. So he was being very secretive. And one night we were supposed to go out. And I was, he canceled on me. And I'm like, why are you canceling me?

Like, what are you doing? I'm already dressed. I have a babysitter for my son. Like, what is going on? He's like, oh, I just have shit to do. And I'm like, what do you mean you have shit to do? like what do you have to do what what is going on so he's like just come to my house just come to my house so i come over and he's packing up the mollies in that thing what is it called i don't know like with a pill

packer oh like a vacuum sealer no it's not a vacuum sealer like you put all the molly mdma powder in it and then it and then it encapsules yeah it puts the capsules i don't know the name but yeah that thing so he's like this is what i have to do i'm putting a whole bunch of mollies i have to make all, I have to make all these mollies. And I'm like, okay, I'll just help you do it. Like, I'll just hang out with you. Let's have a drink. And it wasn't a shocker to me because Molly and ecstasy, like my best friend was in college, like she was in college at the time at FAU for FIU, sorry, for pharmacy. And she was partying every fucking weekend. Like every weekend, we were at space. We were doing stuff, you know, partying, drinking, going out. So I didn't see it as a crazy thing.

but that's kind of how it happened and I was like okay I was so busy also we didn't live together I worked every day Monday through Saturday I had a son like that was part of his life too he provided for his family I knew he was the one paying the rent back then rent was really cheap his rent wasn't compared to like everybody else's Miami was really cheap back then it was super underrated and I wish for those prices come back but he was like paying I would see he his mom and his brother and everyone on the weekends come into the room and be like, legend, can I have money for my nails? Legend, I'm going out with my friends, his brother.

Like, can I have money? And he was always, of course, of course. Like, he took care of his family. So he was in college too. So I was like, this is something I know he's trying to not do, but he has to do it right now. It's kind of like his only option. Now, if it was, say, meth or cocaine, would you have a different reaction to it? No, I don't know about meth.

like that's not a Miami thing like that's kind of that's kind of like crazy outrageous for us we don't I don't even that's not in our realm so yeah definitely would have had a very different reaction to that because when you think about ecstasy and molly you're not thinking that people are being harmed and dying from it there has been incidences absolutely um but that's not the common narrative with a party drug right so yeah absolutely absolutely absolutely Absolutely. I would have 100% had a different reaction to that. Now, did you ever do anything more than just help him in that situation? No. I was like that situation and he was there and I feel like it kind of like opened up our relationship so like he would be transparent for me.

But no, like I said, I was so busy. All I did ever was said money through Western Union. And how far along in your relationship does that happen? A little while later. I would say I would say probably when we're, I don't know, day. waiting for like six, seven, eight months, something around there. And it was very casual, too. Like, hey, babe, can you send this money to me to this number through Western Union? I would literally do it on my lunch break. The feds have the video of me and my lunch break sending money through Western Union on the Publix, which is a supermarket.

You don't know what public says. I know what public says. Yeah, we don't have a public sub. Have you had a public sub? No, no, I haven't. All right. When you come to Miami, you're going to have a public sub. I like, what's had other Ralphs?

Rouse was from Cali. That's just Cali. We don't have Rouse. Yeah, I love Rouse too. But they have Publix in California, don't they? No. Oh, they don't? No, Publix is a Florida store.

Wow. There's all these stores that are just like, our state only. It's state only. Yeah, yeah. So they even have footage of me in public, sending the money through Western Union with my best employee friend.

Like we worked together. I'm like, we would go have lunch. I'm like, oh shit, I have to send this money through Western Union really quick. Will you come with me? Yeah, of course. Cool. Here you go.

And I think I still have a ban on Western Union to this day. They banned you for this? Oh, they banned me from. Western Union. Well, no one uses Western Union anyways. Who the fuck you? Well, actually, just to send money to inmates. That's got to be the only thing that's keeping Western Union alive. Alive. A hundred percent. What is it, eight or 12 bucks per transaction? Pro transaction. Yeah. So that's what I was doing. And then eventually Legend and I started like spending more time always at his house, even with Dorian. Um, so he sometimes like a package

would be shipped to my old apartment. And, and like the, the package of Molly. And, And that was it. Like I would give him a box or he would go get it. That part was like very like I wouldn't really have much. I would leave it in the mailbox for a few days. One of us would pick it up whenever. And that was it. It was not like a big thing because it was not frequently, you know.

He would sell that brick of molly for so much money. He wasn't doing this every week. You know, it was like every other month or, you know. Did you know what the transfer? for his or four what he was giving you the money for yeah yeah yeah I knew what it was for for sure and were you okay with him bringing drugs say into the house with your son around um so we didn't live with him so we didn't live with legend until we got indicted so dorian and I had our own apartment and for the most part we would sleep over and stuff but legend never had like drugs in the house like he would

get these bricks of molly and immediately get rid of them the only thing he ever had had in the house was cash. So it's not like it was around us. It's not like he was doing transactions, going in and out of the house, meeting up people. It was like one and done deals. And they were never done when me and Dorian were around. Like I don't even know who these deals were happening with because it was never in front of us. So I never thought about like drugs being around my son because they never were visibly in the house. Like at the times we were there. It just didn't happen. And we had our own apartment too, you know? So it was like, I didn't really. think about it. I was just so, so busy with my son and work. And then Legend and I would spend

most of our time on the weekends together when I would alternate on my son's dad, like the weekends that we would spend. So it was, it was a short period of time. Like, it wasn't very, you know, thought of. Did Legend pay you? He said he didn't. No, but I would just take a couple hundred dollars. Do you feel undercompensated for the amount of money he was making? No, he took care. Like, if I needed him and pay my rent he would pay it he would always take care of us buy me everything buy me clothes buy me stuff uh eating everything like i didn't need i i wouldn't spend my money on anything so had i do i tell him all the fucking time like you should have bought me bags you should have bought me shoes you should have bought me yeah but i was so like i told you like working so hard i was never a very um i'm not like a

very superficial person. So we would have fun. We would go out. We would do stuff. And that was good enough for me. But I should have, like now I'm like, you should have bought me a whole bunch of shit because we would have still had him. He bought me goals. He bought me a gold necklace. Like, you know, cute stuff, but not fucking, yeah. At that period of time. Bad boyfriend. At that period of time, did you know you were going to marry him? Absolutely not. The one thing in my life that I always wanted to be was a mom. I never saw any healthy marriages, any healthy relationships. My mom was always had like a different guy around for, you know, long periods of times. I grew up with different men in my home. My first stepdad, my dad beat his ass when I was like

four or five. I saw that when I was like, I saw my dad beat his ass. And I always felt like, yeah, that's my dad. Because my mom should be with my dad. I always wanted my dad around. And then after him, it was another stepdad that lived with us and then a boyfriend in between. And so, like, I never saw healthy marriages or relationships that I looked up to. I was always annoyed. And these guys would, like, try to buy me off with cash. You're like, hey, I'm going to take your mom now. Do you want?

And, oh, I have 30 bucks for you. I'm like, give me that money. Like, I don't know, I don't know what you have. Like, I just didn't care about marriage or relationships like that. And my mom, too, like, we would go out. And she would say, don't call me mom. Like when we were to the mall, when I was like 12, 13, like, don't call me mom. Like, act like I'm your sister.

Oh, yeah. So I just didn't see healthy unions and relationships in my life. So I just wanted to be a mom for sure. Never been to seeing him and be like, my husband. He was a mess. It's interesting that he said the same thing about you in the sense where he didn't know he was going to marry you either. Yeah, it's crazy. I think we were meant to walk this journey.

I think our lives, our upbrings were so different, yet so the same. So many aspects of our lives were just interlinked, I think. And like, we were going to the same thing, just in a different environment, just in a different socioeconomic environment completely, just a different upbringing. But I always like, I don't know. You know how some people struggle with drugs, but because they're homeless, you can tell. And then others, because they have money, you can't see the trauma and the pain, you know? Like you kind of hide it off as like, oh, they're doing good.

They're functioning, but they're really, really struggling. And they have really, like, I think that's kind of the same thing. My household was not well at all. But because we can disguise it with good clothes and a good car and at home, my mom, that's like what she was able to do. But my mom would get mad at me at like 10 years old and mad for like dropping something or mad for like talking back, but like, I should have had an abortion. And imagine two little girls hearing that we're 10 and we're like, what's an abortion?

Like, what does that mean? Me and my sister, like, she's six, I'm 10 and my mom screaming that at us. So it was, it was rough, you know. So I didn't think of her as a wife or like a, I just didn't have that exposure. When you were taking the money to Western Union and when the drugs are getting shipped to your house, Do you ever think about the consequences of it when you're in the moment like that? Not in the moment. I definitely didn't think that I had a significant role in anything.

I definitely felt like I was just like the girlfriend, the help. You get me? Like I didn't think about it too much. It was like really quick. You do those things in a matter of an instance, right? So I think that I, and I, to be honest, I don't, I can't tell you exactly how I felt at that moment or exactly like what my thoughts were at that moment. But I definitely didn't think prison indictments, feds. I was tone deaf

to the system. I had no idea what the justice system was. I had no idea. I've never even had any interactions with a police officer or anything like that. I don't even think I had a speeding ticket at that time, like parking ticket maybe. But so no, I, it's not something that happened. And like it's not a thought that would pop up in my mind should have for sure. It did down the line. Like when, you know, when we went to Bimini and then we got we got pulled aside coming back from that day, coming back from a day trip to Bimini. Legend was already being looked at. He had friends that were being looked at. And I think what happened was it's like, okay, those guys were already being looked at. They were already in a mess. Legend had the rap group Btm. And he had a lot of people affiliated. And that would use. use that title to like act like they were cool because Legend had money. He was handsome. He

had girls around him all the time, you know. So they would want to be affiliated with that. And so they would use the tag, BTM for everything. But these were guys that he wasn't even doing business with, wasn't friends with like acquaintances, people, friends of friends of friends that he knew. And so like when those people got in trouble for some crazy shit that happened in a club, it was like a death. I don't remember exactly what happened. legend's name was I kind of on it, his rap name. And that's when I think they started looking into legend, but legend and I were legend and I. You know, like what was going on with us, his Molly situation was his Molly situation.

He wasn't doing business with anybody. And I think what they wanted to do was kind of like build this whole case and this whole RICO act. And that's not what it was. And so I kind of fell in the traps of it because they're like, oh, if we start with the girlfriend, She sent out money. We start with her. She's going to snitch. But I'm like the most loyal girl you'll ever fucking meet.

And even though Legend and I were boyfriend and girlfriend at the time, we were very close. We did have our shit, though. We're young. Like Legends, he never had a man figure, a father figure in his home, a marriage to look up to. He wasn't the best boyfriend. Like, you know, we had our shit going on. But we were, he was a best boyfriend. He just had, you know, other stuff.

on. We were very busy. Like he was in his path. And I think that they were going to get to me and say, okay, this is how we'll, this is how we'll approach this situation with the girlfriend. She's going to, she's going to fall. Like if we talk to her and we tell her she's going to get in trouble with everything that's going on, she will, she'll tell. She'll snitch. And this will be our way in and we can re-coact this whole thing. But that's exactly the opposite of what happened. I was like, absolutely don't know what the fuck you're talking about you guys are feds you do your job i don't know why you're coming to me they took our phone when we got back from bimini and i had a wire transfer name and number in my notes in my phone because it was the same one from western union so i had it in my notes

he had a chinese name never was going to remember that name so i had it in my notes i didn't even think about it at the time they're like if you don't give us to your phone we were going to arrest you and my son i had to pick him up the next day because he was with his dad i was like i can't fucking be arrested. Of course, take my phone. Like, that was crazy to me. So they bring back my phone to my job. I think like five days later, they go to my job and they bring back my phone and I'm on lunch break. And they're like, look, we went through your phone. We know everything. We know everything, everything. Just cooperate with us and you'll be fine. You'll have full immunity. At this point, I don't even know what fucking immunity means. I'm like, what are you guys talking about? And I'm,

I can't connect the dots because I'm not thinking that a wire transfer, you know, Western Union number can put me in any type of position to be in trouble. Excuse me. So, um, so they bring back the phone. That happens. They're like, and don't tell legend. I'm like, okay, literally race home to tell legend. I was like, the feds went to my job.

They gave me their car. They said that they have everything on us, everything on you, and that I have to cooperate with them to tell them. They went dead silent for like six months. we didn't hear anything i even found a new job legend had already like he was already not doing his molly transactions like that like it just you know um i got a new job i was i was like excited for you know for my person like my professional and my personal growth legend i weren't even living together yet were on i slept over that weekend that day my son me and his mom for some reason

and I can't tell you why. I think this is just like God, we were all in the same car that day. And I don't know why. That's like a very rare scenario. And the feds pull up behind us when I'm on my way to my new job that I just got. They pull up behind us and they take me out. They handcuff me on the hood of the car. My son's in the back seat.

And they separate Legend and I. They go to the house. They fucking flip that house inside out to find nothing, to find absolutely nothing. and they take us to the questioning, like to the, to the jail to question us. They interrogate me for like seven, eight hours. He was like, I don't understand what your deal is. I interrogate guys with fucking tattoos all over their face and they crack instantly. Like, what's your issue?

Just tell, who cares? Legend has a whole bunch of girls in his phone. Like, he talks to other girls. You guys are, like, trying to get to me. And I was like, I don't know what you want. me to say, I don't know what fucking legend does. I don't know. The money I sent is for merch. Legend is a rapper and sells T-shirts and CDs from, he gets it from China. That's what I sent money for. And they're like, oh, just fucking take her. Just take her after like seven hours.

I'm like, take me where? And they took me to the federal detention center. And legend, they let go. Because legend, since my money, my name was on the money transfers, and I didn't cooperate. Cain and Jack Margarita and taste your escape. It's America's number one for a reason. Kamen Jack is a premium malt beverage with flavors. Please drink responsibly. Kaman Jack beverage company, Chicago, Illinois. This episode is brought to you by Subaru.

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That's how I got in trouble first. Wow. Yeah. What was it like in that detention center? You've never been arrested before. You've never even stepped foot in a jail. You know, what's that like for you? Ian, that is wild.

I get there. The detention center is you walk in. It's like a whole, their stairs. going up to all the units, you know, to all the rooms, to all the cells. I was terrified. I was like, what is happening? Like, I'm just walking there and I see everyone just staring at me. But then I see a whole bunch of like women and girls that look very normal, you know, like whatever normal looks like, but it's, it doesn't look like a jail. Like people in there are like playing and eating and like playing dominoes and cars.

and like knitting and shit. I'm like, what is going on here? So I remember talking to a few of the women there. One had been there for months and she was getting sentenced. She had just gotten sentenced to 10 years for weed. And she was showing me the pictures of her kids. And like she was just so, I was like, what did you do? She like, I had my husband and I had like weed plants.

We were growing in our home. And now my kids are with my parents. and it was just like really wild. I was like, what the fuck? 10 years? Like 10 years her kids will grow up without her. And she was, she worked like in the medical field too. So I was like, whoa, like too many similarities like between all of us, you know?

And majority of the girls were there because of their boss or their boyfriend or like a male figure in their lives. So that was like tormenting me because I was like, what the fuck Amanda? like you shouldn't have you know had anything to do anything um but i remember having a conversation with one of the women too she's like Amanda you're here you're in a detent a federal detention center you're going to get some prison time and i said no i'm not no i'm not she's like you are if you're already here and you're already indicted you're there's no way around it you're going to get prison time like that's just what happened in the feds maybe it's a year maybe it's two years maybe it's five years but you're getting time and i remember those three days were the longest three

days of my life. Like, I had so much anxiety. I didn't understand how I was there and legend wasn't that was fucking with me those couple of days. I was like, what the fuck? And I would look out the window and I would see the sun and the day was so beautiful and you're in downtown and I'm like, what is going on? Like, it felt very surreal. Like, I felt like I was in the fucking twilight zone. And what were the final charges that you got indicted on? I got a possession of a controlled substance with the intent. to distribute. Even though they never caught me with anything, they never, I think they interceded a package. Like, they interceded it, but none of us have physically touched that package.

They never caught us with anything, nowhere. Never seen us with it, never caught us with it, nothing. How long were you in that detention center before you got bail? Three days. Now, that first night when your head hits a pillow, what are you thinking? Are you mad at legend, or are you mad at yourself? I'm not mad at legend or me. Like, I'm not mad. I'm not mad. I'm like really confused, like really stressed out. My son is so little. It's just a fucking crazy situation. I feel like I'm more like just really, really confused.

Legends mom knew about everything that was going on. So I kind of in my mind was like when I would ask her, like, what was going on? And like for her feedback, everyone was giving me like this toxic positivity. I like to call it. Like nothing's going to happen to you, Amanda. This has happened to people before. It's MDMA. It's nothing.

Like you're going to be fine. Nothing's going to happen to you. And I'm very much not that way. Like I will tell you sometimes because of my life, I feel like I've been negative in some situations, but I'm very realistic majority. So I'm like, what are you guys talking? So it's hard to have the conversations with anybody to see what was going to happen or how should we go about it.

That was affecting me a lot. And then my job, I was like, you know, I got a really good job. I think I was getting paid like $30 an hour in 2013, 2014, you know. I was so young and I had been working towards that so long since I was 18 years old in that field. So I lost that job and I was just kind of heartbroken, you know. I felt like like I didn't have that awareness that I needed. And I feel like that also stemmed from the way I grew up, like just starting over looking for like that stability. you know, kind of like legend needed me to do something that we had such a good relationship

and friendship that I was like, okay, yeah, of course I'll do it, not thinking about it. And I wasn't raised with like being aware of our situations and our decisions, how they can ultimately impact your life. Like it was never about my future, never about my life, never about like the trajectory of my life. It was always like the now. Like you're here in California now. You're here in Miami now.

This is what you got to do now. And I think that's how that played out for me in that situation too. Like what was your first call with your parents like? Oh so oh actually my mom had to bond me out. Oh she actually bonded you. She had to she had to bond me out. She had to fill because it was it wasn't a money bond. It was the non-serative.

Yeah. It was that. So only my mom could do that. So she had to do it. She's like I don't know what's going on. My mom was in the middle of transitioning to a Jehovah's Witness at that time. Plot twist. Plot twist.

So, she was not fully there. Has she had been fully there, she would have not bonded me out. So she was like having this, this battle with herself, like about bonding me out or not because she don't want to sign for me. And I'm like, mom, am I a flight risk? Like, what do you mean? What are you talking about? How is this even a question for you? Like, what are you saying?

And it was because she was like in the middle of her religion really, really heavy. So she did it. I got, thank God I got indicted at the time I did. And she did it though. And then, yeah, from there, I was on pretrial probation for three to four months before I got sentenced. Now, did you know you were going to take a plea deal right away? Or did you think about fighting it? Did you get a paid attorney?

So we got a paid attorney. Legend and I got a paid attorney, two attorneys that were in the same firm. I think that was a bad idea. legend already was on probation when he got in trouble or house arrest probation. Yeah, probation when this was happening. So they kind of like my case wasn't their main focus because it was like there's already points. They, you know, they already got you in trouble.

You're going to go to prison. There's no point to take this to trial because then you'll get more time. And the attorneys kept on insisting like no trial, no trial. It's a point system. it's a mandatory minimum. Like, don't take this trial. You're going to have to do time. Amanda, you're doing 24 months.

Like, that's what it is. Point say that, all that. And at the time that I got sentenced, no one in my family knew that this was going on. And for some, I got character statements from like my boss, character statements from people I worked with, people I knew professionals. But my mom and dad didn't know.

I thought that I wasn't going to go to prison, even though the attorneys were like, yeah, you are. That was their suggestion. Like, whatever I get. whatever happens happens, you know, in the courtroom. And I remember when I got sentenced, she, the judge was like, you have all these character statements, like you have a good job. You're a mom. You should have known better. And because you should have known better, I'm going to make an example out of you. And that's literally what she said to me. And I just

remember 24 months, I felt like that was the end of the world. Like I just felt like I was going to lose everything. My son was going to be without his mom for two years. It was. It was, was eating me up inside. I just started crying like in the courtroom and I had nobody there with me. Not one person. The federal agents were there. And I was just like so, so hardbroken, like so upset. But it's what happened. And, and then I get, so they sentenced me to self-surrender date for February. And my son's biological dad dies in January. So that was really hard because I had to involve him and like, okay, I'm going to be gone for this amount of time. You're going to have to be really, really involved in our son's life. I had even, after I got sentenced, I spoke to my dad

and I told him what happened. He said he would pick up my son for this summer and he would keep him for the summer. And then he would bring him back to Miami so that he can be with his dad and legend's mom. Because we, at that time, when we, that indictment started, then we're like, okay, we're going to all live together to make life, you know, easier and and trying to figure this out together. And so his dad got into a four-wheeler accident, like a month before I had to self-surrender. And then my dad never picked him up. And then my mom said she was going to visit him. She never visited him. Never visited me. My dad, I finally talked to him like right before I went in and I told him I can add his email. And I sent him an email. He never wrote back. So, yeah. So it was

legend's mom taking care of Dorian and then I get to prison and like two weeks later I'm like running the track and I start getting a cramp on my stomach I'm a fit girl I've always been working out and I go to and I hadn't got in my peer kid and I thought that was really weird and I do a pregnancy test and the nurse was like do you want to see the pregnancy test I'm like no why would I want to see it and it was positive so like all these things were just like back to back to back his dad dies, I self-surrender. And then two weeks later, I found out I'm pregnant in prison with my second son. I'm like, this is, this is not like, I'm, I don't know what's going to happen here.

Now, do you think they threw the book at you because they hadn't charged legend yet? Yeah. And they were, they were just making an example out of you. Because at 24 months for your role, when there's no other person charged yet, seems, you know. I absolutely think so. I absolutely think so. I think because they hadn't physically caught anything. I think the feds wanted a bigger case.

And I feel like that was their goal. Their goal was to have this big case, this big recoactive case, and that's not what happened. And then I was like the martyr now for the entire group, for everybody in the hood, for everybody that like anyone that legend knew. Like, oh, if she got in trouble in trouble, everyone's going to get in trouble. And like, yeah, I had to like, I'm the one who had to take it for the team. And it also goes to show how the prosecutors are definitely in cahoots what the judge is. Oh, 100%. Yeah.

It doesn't seem like the judge gave or carried a fair sentence in this situation. No, I don't think so too. But the prosecutor, he was just, I remember him perfectly. He was an ass. He was, he didn't not care, like about me being a mom or that my son's dad died. And then, because I was brought to them right before sentencing. because he died in January. And they're like, can this, you know, can she have like probation or house arrest or something?

Her son's father passed away. And he was like, no, no, she did what she did. Now, going into prison, did you plan to stay with Legend? Not knowing you were pregnant yet or anything, did you go in that day thinking, I'm going to stay with this guy, the full cup two years? Yeah. I mean, we had been together for two years at the time. Dorian was staying with them.

Yeah, we definitely went through a lot those six months. I feel like we learned a lot. We always wanted something different for our lives, like, together, you know, just as, I mean, separately. Like, we always wanted to have a life that was fruitful and, like, abundant and a good life where, you know, we made good money and had a good future and, you know, just a good life. And I think that's what we thought we were both working towards, you know. Like I felt like I was the supportive girlfriend. I saw what he did for his family, how good he was with his family. And I was the young mom that was like, you know, nurturing and working really, really hard.

So when Dorian's dad died and his mom without hesitation was like, I'll stay with him. And legend loved Dorian so much. There were kindred spirits from the moment they met. Like that was Daddy Legend always from the moment. the moment they met, he always wanted to be with him. And his, his biological dad would get pissed because he would be at home, like, with his dad on the weekends and do push-ups and wake up and do push-ups. He's like, oh, because Daddy Legend does push-ups, I want to do push-ups. And, like, that he was picking up a lot of his good values. Like, yeah, he sold drugs, but Legend had

had great values, very family, very loyal, you know, he was, he took care of himself. And I was the same. So I think it was never, we were going to try. Like, we were going to, do everything we could to try. Tell us about day one in prison, self-surrendering that whole experience. So when I self-surrender, they take my photo, they bring me into medical, but they don't do anything that day. They just, like, change my clothes, put my belongings away. And it was a Sunday. It was a Sunday. That's why it was a Sunday. Because we had played it up as a Orlando trip, went to Islands of Adventure. So I get there, and I'm in shock because, first of all, when you self-surrender, you're walking into a camp.

There's no bars. It's a camp. Like, you see all of these units. It looks like a college campus. You're just very, it's a mind, like a mind game. It's like, why am I bringing myself here and have to stay here for the next two years? Like, how is this possible when you can just walk off of this camp? So it felt really, like, it just felt really, like confusing, draining.

So then I go into my unit. and my unit at the time was F2 and I go into my unit and my bunk. So in the units in the camp, it's like they're not separated. Every unit is just a whole bunch of small cubbies, but everyone on the top bunk can see each other like all across the unit. So there's no doors. So I get into my, I get into my first, that's my situation, my first bunkie and she's there with another girl.

And they were very nice. Like, hi. Like, normal. And I just went to the top bunk and I just cried in my pillow for like hours and I just fell asleep. And when I woke up, there was all types of stuff on top of my locker. Like all types of hygiene and food and snacks. And I was like, wow, for prison.

Like, these people are really like nice. And that made me really emotional too. and I watched oranges in new black before I went in. So I don't know if that was good or bad, but I did it. So I watched every single episode. So my first impression was like, well, I can't believe I'm here. But then everyone was like me, you know? Like I see myself in every woman, every conversation I had.

Every woman was a mom and a woman and made a mistake. And majority of them that I knew had kind of been unaware of like, what they were doing at the moment and the time that they were doing it. But the thing that affected me always the most was like all of these women are moms where all of our kids are like somewhere else right now. And that tormented me the whole time. And then so one day I'm running, I'm running the track. I was doing a lot of exercise those first couple of weeks because just walking,

running, working out, going to the, I didn't have a job yet. You have to have a job. But I didn't get assigned to any job yet. So I'm just walking around doing a lot of exercise. And I start feeling weird and a little nauseous and I go to the medical and it's a Sunday again. And that's when I find out I'm pregnant with LJ. And then now I'm the only girl in the entire prison out of 500 women that's pregnant. So all these women were so incredible to me.

They would cook for me. They would bring me stuff from the kitchen. They would cook like I knew the chef for our line, like our line cook. She would make me extra food, so they took care of me. Would you say you were the youngest in that facility? One of them. I was like the youngest friend in my group. Yeah.

All the girls, all the women were older than me, for sure. Early 30s, late 20s. I was 24. I turned 25 there. And then 26, right when I got home. Like that same month, yeah. What would you say was the biggest difference between orange is the new black and where you were at? The cold.

The cold for sure. Everything was like spot on. Contraband, too. We didn't have cell phones. Girls, I don't think are very, very, I don't, even in the women's prison, because with our organization with 300 letters, we go into a women's prison. We do a workshop. And it's really to help them with a mindset there while we're here, while you're there, how to interact with one another. It's a state prison too.

so it's a very different dynamic and also how to understand the things that they've gone through in life their traumas their experiences and how it's shaped this shape them up until this moment you know that's what we do with them and none of the women there have cell phones i don't think they would tell me but it's like when they get released they also go through our organization for like healing hearts and the reentry and family therapy and stuff like that one of our programs called healing hearts and i've asked them and they're like no none of the girls we don't have cell phones It's not, I think it's just a risk that we think about our children. And I think that's one risk that none of us are, are, like, willing to take.

Definitely not. I didn't know anyone with a cell phone. Now, when you're pregnant in prison, does the diet really differ for you? Makeup, though, yes, actually. Yeah, the contraband, they would get makeup. Yeah, the hair dye we could buy on commissary. You're kind of giving me, like, memories, flashbacks now. Commissary, you could buy hair dye, but, like, makeup.

eye shadow, lip gloss for visit. What else? A lot of arts and craft stuff that like whatever we couldn't get, they would get smuggled. And so yeah. So now the diet, is there anything you can't eat on commissary or the prison line food because you're pregnant? So at that time, there's no pregnancy guidelines for women. So when I wanted doubles, literally I told one of the guards, I was like, can I get another, you know, can I get a seconds? And he was like, no. I was like, what? I'm pregnant. No, you're not. And I don't care. and I was so emotional. I literally cried. I was like, whoa, how is it going to tell me I can't get more food? But there was no guidelines for pregnancy in prison. There was no special diet. There was not like,

okay, an extra milk and I don't drink milk. I'm lactose intolerant. So that didn't work for me. So no, there was nothing that had to do related to my food. But because I had less than five years and because I'm a first time offender, I was eligible for the mint program that was in Tallahassee where I can. can go where I was six months pregnant and then have give birth in a hospital or a normal hospital, not chain, not handcuffed, stay with the baby for three months in that program and then go back to the prison to finish my time. That food and that sleeping conditions in that mint program that is meant for pregnant women was worse than the prison. Wow. So that was in the hospital or that was like a halfway house? I had the baby and it was a halfway house. Okay. So like the yoga mats,

were the beds. If we would try to pile them on, it was a warehouse and five open beds, five cribs. There was three of us there. One baby was crying. They were all crying. Every day, a box cereal for breakfast with a milk and a bologna sandwich or turkey for lunch every single day. For dinner, you would get one hot meal. The thing about there is that you could do your groceries. So you had to have money. If you were a person that was in this position and your family couldn't support you financially with money, it was going to be impossible for you to have first a healthy term pregnancy, recovery, post-pregnancy, because there was nothing to eat there. Nothing.

Nothing. You had to buy stuff that you can put in a microwave from the grocery store or order food all the time. Now the baby's food, can you order for that or how does that work? Yeah. So the baby, I actually was breastfeeding and you can only have them for three months. So the milk is the formula. That's all you could give them at that time.

little age, just milk. So you could get their formula and they would do that through like some other program that was local in Tallahassee where you could get, but the formulas they were give were like formulas that are known for to being not good formulas and just more cost efficient and have had recalls in back in the day. So it was nothing about health for you or your child was in mind in this program. I was in shock. I was in shock. I felt very very. very violated in this program too because the people that were running this program were just like a halfway house were you in a halfway house yeah so you know that the people that work in the front desk of the halfway house are not COs even though COs are not better but they really don't have any

awareness training emotional intelligence when it comes to incarceration to you it's just like whoever applied for this job can work in the front and there were some very sketchy perverted men that worked in this program in Tallahassee they would i remember one time waking up and there was a man looking over that worked in the front desk he was doing the check because they had to do the count for us at the same times as a prison like okay just count them and go into the rooms in the middle of the night and make sure that they're there mind you there was no entrance to this warehouse like you would have to have left through the front gate i mean the front door and i remember waking up one day and there's a man just staring at me while i'm like holding my baby and we're sleeping and i can feel

someone staring at me in the middle of the night and I look he's like oh just doing check and I was so uncomfortable I was like I was very emotionally all over the place because I was also postpartum just had a baby and I couldn't believe that these were the people that were like running this program they were not we were not humans you're just a person that had a kid you're a felon you're a prisoner. They don't know anything about the system either because they're operating in a halfway house and it's like whoever could work there, work there. And they were all operating in like that power trip position. Like the women that were there were terrible. Also didn't care about you giving birth or, you know, having a baby with you. They were very,

very invasive. They would go through your stuff, ruin all your babies clothes to try to find contraband, move everything around, flip your bed that you just made. Flip your baby. Baby's crib, bed, you know, the Mac. This episode is brought to you by Redfin. You're listening to a podcast, which means you're probably multitasking. Maybe even scrolling home listings on Redfin, saving homes without expecting to get them. But Redfin isn't just built for endless browsing. It's built to help you find and own a home.

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Ask your doctor about Ebbglis. And visit ebbglis.com or call 1800 lilyRX or 1-800 545-99. 7-9. And there was only three of us. Like, that wasn't necessary, you know. So how does it work? Do you leave the camp and go straight to the hospital when you're about to get birth or do you go to this facility first? You go to the facility first for a month. And so you're there with no baby. Yeah. What is there to do? Nothing. Is there a TV? There's one TV. At that time, there was four girls. There's one TV. And that's it. Do you get a cell phone or? No. There's a phone inside of the room. You cannot have a cell phone.

There's a phone inside of the room that you can use to call your family. So, of course, some people were abusing that phone for hours on end, but whatever. Like, that's what was definitely going to happen. And that's it. You had 45 minutes of outside time twice a day. Now, what about visits? Could you get visits here? Yeah, you could get visits on the weekends.

But I was now in Tallahassee. My family's in Miami. And so my visit didn't come until I had the baby. Now, was legend arrested by this point? Yeah. He went to prison when I was three months pregnant. How did you feel when you found out he got arrested? I felt like there was just no hope for us.

I felt really, really sad because now Dorian didn't have anybody. He didn't have me. He didn't have legend. He didn't have his dad. He didn't have his grandparents. That was tormenting me. I felt like the one normalcy that he didn't have. had was legend to be with him and, you know, take him to school and, and be that, that type of

parent figure that he needed. Um, I also was, was really in a hard place because I'm pregnant and I'm pregnant with legend's baby. And now I don't know how long he's going to be incarcerated for. I don't know what his sentence is going to look like. I didn't know if they were going to do the, the current, the concurrent charges for like the probation and what was currently going on. So it was hard. It was really stressful. I lost a lot of weight even during my pregnancy. I dealt with like major anxiety after my pregnancy and depression. I had gotten to the skinniest I had ever gotten because I was just like always anxious and like thinking about the future and thinking about what was going to happen. So I was I was really sad. He got to see me twice before he went in and that

never happened. People would tell me he's not going to get approved. You guys are in the same case. you're just here by, you know, he's, he's indicted right now. And let me tell you that I don't know how, but he got to see me the weekend before his, like before he had to go into prison before he went to the detention center, he got to see me that weekend for the last time. So he saw me pregnant, but my belly was so small, like four months. And, uh, I, like, we both needed that to, like, keep going forward, you know. Now, when you leave that, um, halfway house type pregnancy, home to go to the hospital. How long are you in the hospital for after you get birth? Three days.

That's, is that normal? Yeah, yeah, that's standard. Yeah, that's standard. Yeah, that's standard. And my mother-in-law, my sister took a greyhound. I got induced, meaning like, I told the doctor, like, can you make sure that I go into labor around my due date, like inducing me so that I can, my contractions can come earlier. That way I can have somebody here with me when I give birth. I don't want to give birth alone. And he said, okay, I'll do. that for you even though he's like I don't suggest it because you would go into labor alone you're a healthy girl you already have a son but okay we'll do it so I told them look I'm getting induced this day

um so you guys come over here take the grand hand and be with me they both get there with wine in their bag my sister and my mother-in-law are hilarious and when they're together they're worse because they're like two of the same they're just funny and like they're just funny and and wild they're wild just to put it like that and they're like oh we're working I'm like, are you guys crazy? I'm in federal custody. Why did you bring wine in here? Like, why would you do that? Get out. And I kicked them both out. And they went to go drink wine, like, outside of the, outside of the hospital room. And I'm very like, by the book. I'm like, get the fuck out of here, guys. You're going to get me in trouble. Were there guards there or was that a furlough? No, there was no guards. It was a furlough.

So who brings you to there, like a bus or Uber? So there was this person, Ms. Lawson. She was like the program overseer. And when I went into labor, she had to come to pick me up from the halfway house, take me to the hospital. She dropped me off. She said, all right, I'll be back when you get discharged. I was like, okay.

That's actually pretty good. It was really good. There's a lot of women that don't get that opportunity. That was the best, best thing. That program only exists. in Miami, I mean in Tallahassee, sorry, and in Washington. So in the entire nation, can you imagine the amount of women that the incarceration for women has gone up, what, like 700, 800% in the last 20, 30 years?

And first of all, there was no guidelines. There was no programs. There's only that program in Tallahassee, the one in Washington. So many women, I hear about so many women that find out they're pregnant when they get to jail or when they're in jail. or in prison and there's no other solution but to treat them so inhumane. So I did get super blessed that that existed and that I qualified for it at the time. But a lot of people across the nation that don't get incarcerated in Florida or Washington

wouldn't be able to financially, mentally with the family, with the furlough, the transportation, go to a program in Tallahassee or Washington to have their baby. So that to me always had to change. That was something I felt deeply in my core while I was there. I was like, this has to change for women. They have to honor like the fact that we're her women in some capacity. Like I know we're in trouble right now. And yes, that's that's the consequences that happen for, you know, decisions that you can make.

But the fact of the matter is that we're still human and other things still happen and women's needs are very different for men. And still now there's like even with reentry and with programs and with, you know, just. any opportunities for women, they don't exist for women that are in the system. So that's something that I would write about while I was in that program. I would literally journal about it, send it to Legend, like all the things that were wrong in that program, how the women were just mishandled and not cared for at all. And ultimately, they're babies. Now, were you in Legend able to communicate with each other while he was in prison?

We didn't have correspondence. So we were never given correspondence until I got to that program. program. So I talked to the director of that program and she was a hard ass. Like she did not have any compassion for women. She would only show up like once a month to that program in Tallahassee. She was never there. So one day we kind of went head to head and she's like one day I want to see you pull up to this program and I know you're, I know, I know how you are. She's like I can tell it by through your personality that one day you're going to pull up here. You're going to be in your bends or you're going to be in some and you're just going to show. And you're just going to

show me and because I fought for the correspondence while we were there and I was like do you understand that we my son's father just passed away he's his father I just had his baby you need to approve this like it doesn't even make sense our family connection our family is relying on this you know like our we need this and she approved it while I was there but before then legend's mom would she would I would send her the letter she would repackage it put legend's address sent it to him and we would do that And then we had the email. So she would just copy and paste on. I'd be like, do not read anything.

She would copy and paste the emails. And that's how we would communicate. And then I had a brilliant idea of like on Sundays, you call your mom's phone. I'll call your sister's phone. Just put the phones upside down under a pillow so we can talk for like a couple of minutes. And it worked. You're a big rule breaker. That would have got you in trouble in prison.

That would have absolutely gotten you in trouble. But I was okay with that. Like the fact that I, that was after I had the baby and had to go back to prison. And I was like, I need to have some type of communication with him. I need to hear his voice. Like, I was not in a good headspace at all, leaving my child and going back to the prison. And now my mother-in-law had both kids. I was a disaster. Yeah. How long are you in that facility for before you have to give up the baby and go back to prison? Three months. You can stay with them up to three months. And then you have to, your family has to pick up the baby and take you back to the prison.

And now if you didn't have your mother-in-law, the child would have went into the system. Yeah, into the system. Absolutely. If you don't have a trusted family, your friend or a family member to pick up your child, definitely. We wouldn't have into a foster care system. Now, at that point, where are you thinking your relationship with legend is going to go? I think it's going to go well. We're writing to each other constantly. We're giving each other, you know, the reassurance. Like, we're talking about our future together. I think everything that we've accomplished up to date has been through. those letters that we wrote. Like, we literally even say it all the time. We have to start writing against each other because we, our brain is so powerful. And like when we were in the midst of that, we just decided to like focus on what we were going to do afterwards. And that shift happened to both of us. Like, yeah, I was really upset that I was in prison and I was heartbroken. And like, you know, but I do see where I messed up. Like the accountability lived in both of us so strongly. Like that conviction lived in both of us so strongly during the time of incarceration that we were like, you know, we need to do so much after this.

Like this is just a stepping zone to like what's really in store for us. So let's figure it out together. And so from that moment, we were hand in hand. Legend and I were hand in hand with our letters with with the support we would give each other. He would tell me what he wanted to do professionally. I would tell him what I wanted to do, like how we wanted our kids to be raised, how the future that we wanted for them. We're like, we never want them to think that they have to do something because it's the only way to survive. Like, we want to make sure that we ingrained in them that they are responsible for creating the life that they want and that they will have that in us, that stability in us.

They will have parents that believe in them. And that's what we did. Like, we started that from prison. And we definitely are like still in the midst of that. But we never looked back from there. It was, it was adversity for us was a blessing. So you get back to the prison. What's it like experiencing prison now not pregnant?

Bad. Because you spent your first half of prison pregnant. It was bad. It was worse. Not because I wasn't pregnant anymore. And, you know, all my girls were there. But I was anxious. Like I was anxious all day.

I couldn't sit still. I was running from the computer room to the gym to the track. I felt like a huge piece of me was missing. I was counting down the minutes, counting down the time. The time was doing me. I was not doing anything. And you know, when you're in prison, depending on how much time you have, you can do courses or like certifications. Because I had less than 24 months, my counselor was like, you can't do a personal training certification. You're not allowed to because of the time you have. There's a lot of stipulations when it comes to like education and certifications and all that stuff. So I had I would just read and read on my own and like write and work out and work out and teach a workout class. I worked out three hours a day because I had so much anxiety and it was it was eating me up. Like I wouldn't eat. I would overwork out and that's what I did for four months. Was there any mental health therapy at all? No, at all. You would talk to your counselor. I remember one time walking into that counselor and looking

at him and I was like in tears. He's like, you don't cry in prison. Like, I don't care to see your tears. Like, counselors are not counselors in prison. They're not counselors in prison. He's like, I don't care what you're crying about. And you're in prison. Don't cry. No one wants to see your tears.

I was like, okay, but is there someone that I can talk to? Like, I, you know, I'm postpartum. Like, I'm just not feeling good. I just want to know a little bit more of, like, what I can do during my time here, you know? And he was like, no, like, figure it out. You're going to be home soon anyway. So just figure it out. And that was rough.

So at that time, I really didn't know I was dealing with, like, anxiety and depression. I didn't know. I was just postpartum. My hormones were all over the place. And the only way to deal with it was working out. I taught, like, two classes, workout classes after dinner. And I ran every day and participated in all the workout stuff. Like, it helped me.

We had the VHS or the CD tape of P90X and insanity. So we would do like classes with the TV. So I had the Jillian Michaels one in the program in Tallahassee. So after I had LJ immediately after I was cleared to do work out, it was like two or three weeks, I would put the Jillian and Michael's one be in the living room crazy, like doing all the workouts and the girls would be so pissed like Amanda. I'm like, do the workout with me. I'm like, do the workout with me.

It was like an hour long. So yeah, you brought that up. Do you feel like that prison had all the, I'd say, medical. necessities for women for a day-to-day basis? No. The medical necessities, you mean like... Like basic hygiene? Well, like our basic hygiene?

You had to... It was more like commissary base. Like, it was available, but you had to pay for it, you know? Everything you had to buy it from the commissary. They wouldn't give you anything? Yeah, they would have, but then when they would run out, it would take a little while to restock stuff. So I think that was the issue.

So like for men, toilet paper is big and it's kind of like rationed out. You only get like two rolls every couple weeks or once a month. For women, is that the same thing with like tampons or pads? With tampons and pads, yeah. That's what I'm saying. Like that one it would go. It was like you had to wait until they restocked it on their time. So everyone's cycle isn't on the same cycle.

So that and I feel like everyone would also ration out their own portions. And they would just like take as much, you know, like when COVID happened, and everyone was buying the toilet paper from every store. Same thing. Like everyone would just grab everything and hoard it. And how many would they give you? I think it was in the bathrooms per unit. And I think you would have to grab.

Remember, I didn't have my, I didn't have my period. I didn't have my period for most. So I can't remember. It's only had my period for like three months after. So I can't remember exactly because it's not like it wasn't my entire experience there. Now, is that quality significantly less? Different. Oh, yeah.

That's why it's like you're forced to buy what's on commissary because what you're using is not good quality and not comfortable for a woman. So it's going to force you to buy what you need. What was your biggest pregnancy craving when you were in prison? Pickles. Pickles? Oh, so luckily they had the pickles at the commissary. Well, I think I was craving them because they were there. So I would just eat that all the time.

The pickle in the pouch? The pickle in the pouch. Everyone's like, Amanda, you're so roast. But I used to that juice is actually pretty good. You put in some rice or something, too. And you can use it for, yeah. I would eat pickles every day and pop tarts in the morning. Every day I would eat a pop tart in the morning and make like my coffee, the kifie coffee,

and then hot chocolate, mix it up, and then drink that every morning. I was like, you drink caffeine. I'm like, every day. I drink caffeine every day every day. I'm Cuban. I drink caffeine every day of my life two times a day. So it was necessary. Now out of 24 months, how much time do you actually serve inside?

18. And do you go to a halfway house? I go to a halfway house, which was also. Another experience, you know, halfway houses were not very known for women either. So it was like a certain allocated beds to the women. Mostly guys worked there, these young guys. It was creepy. But yeah, I did like a month and a halfway house.

Could your child come to the halfway house or no? They would. They would come. My mother-in-in-law would bring Dorian and the baby to the halfway house on the weekend. That was rough. I wish, I think because when your family has, like, access to you and you're already in Miami and they see they're not in prison. Like, that's when the responsibilities started to, like, come. I never had that time to, like, kind of reset, you know,

like as soon as I got back home and it was in a halfway house, I was in mom mode. So the sacrifices were meant for me to take, you know, the, like, whatever, to pick up your kid when you can. Like, it's the responsibilities of me, motherhood were there as soon as I got home. And And then like that was hard. That was hard because I was a single mom with two babies. I never had time to process like the whole prison thing. What, what just happened? It was just like, okay, you're back home.

Forget it and go, you know, continue. Do you feel like your baby had to get over it? Do you feel like your baby had detached from you at all? A little bit. Not detached, but it was like he was used to now sleeping with my mother-in-law. would put him in the bed. That's not something I would have done. He was super spoiled with like his pacifier. I wouldn't have given him that pacifier. It became a huge, like a huge thing. It was, it was like some things that were done, but I didn't want to speak on him because I was grateful

that he was with his grandma, you know, so little things like that that everybody would have. But he wasn't detached. It was more, more like certain habits that were just formed that I think I wouldn't, well, I know I wouldn't have created. Was Dorian old enough to comprehend what was going on? Dorian would visit me in the jail and the prison, Afulman. Dorian would see me there and he, everyone was in green. So he kind of like, he knew how to read though, but he wouldn't really say anything. He was still little and very loving and like he just wanted to hang out with mommy.

And we would draw and hang out and eat and just do all the stuff that you can do a visitation. But then when he got bigger and I got home, like I kind of had to talk to him about the entire prison thing. Because I didn't want him to think I left him or, you know, I chose to be there. That was very, very important for me to let him know. And I told him, you know, I made a mistake and that's why I was there. And I had to go through the fact that he lost his dad right before I left too. And his dad was in his life. you know, he would see his dad regularly.

So those are conversations I had to have with him. And I think that's like what set the tone also for us to understand the importance of family and like the importance of like, yeah, you went to prison. I went to prison. It is an individual experience. But everyone's affected by it, especially our kids and how they perceive it. And like, you know, ensuring that they don't experience the type of same things that we've experienced is very important to be transparent with them.

And I think that's what he was nine when I got back home. We just, right when I got home, we celebrated his nine birthday a couple months later. So it was important for me to, to reiterate to him that it's not something that I wanted to be in. And from that moment on, we just decided legend and I to heal out loud with them. So, and like understand that, that whole process with them because we had to break it apart and digest it too. Like it affected a lot of our lives. his reentry, my reentry were completely different. He had support of the family. I didn't. I came home and I was a single mom. How did his mom take my incarceration? You know, she took care of the kids.

She was also the one in charge of visitation, moving us around, you know, having to adapt and change her whole life. So we had to honor that too. And like, that's kind of something we had to figure out together. So even when I had these conversations with parents in our programs, like 300, letters, it's always so important for me to reiterate to them that transparency is one of the biggest foundations, one of the biggest pillars in ensuring that your children have the ability to like to understand what happened and not lie to them. Because then they have questions later, right? And then they have anger and then they feel like everything was a lie. And so, yeah, I had this with him because he had he had gone through so much and he was a different little guy when I got

back he was like a little man and that that was hard for me because I was like he was a baby when I left him like he had baby tendencies the way he would speak and then I remember one visitation he wanted to see me and he went with a tie and like a suit he's like no I want to see my mom in a tie and a button up and I was like who is this little man why did he want to dress in a in a whole button of in a tie. And it's because he felt like he was a little a man, you know, like he had, he was, he had responsibilities. And yeah. And so, yeah. What was it like to be on the opposite end, and visit legend in prison? Because you got to experience both sides of it. Yeah. And that was something that no one thought was going to happen. I knew couples that were married before prison. And then

they weren't able to go visit afterwards. It wasn't allowed. Like, you're not supposed to be a felon and go back into the prison, especially within such a short window. So my PO approved it. He said, I'll, I'll go and bring it again in front of the judge and get it approved. And I was like, really? He's like, yeah, it's important because I see, I see how hard you're working and, like, what you're doing for your kids. It's important that you take them to see their dad. And I just felt like that was a blessing. Like, thank you, God. And so within a month, I was approved. It was. hard waking up at four in the morning because you know it's a four hour drive bringing the little one seven eight months old he was he my little one was probably the worst baby that you have probably

ever experienced the cutest and the worst he would throw his pacifier his bottle i would have to pull off on the side of the road on the way to Orlando to get his bottle off of the back seat the other one was sleeping it was hard and then when we would get there we'd have to sit there and go through the whole process of getting checked and the baby's crying and he's huge. My son was huge. And so it was hard. But being on that side and seeing legend, I know what he felt. I know what he felt.

So I was like, I was happy to be there and just like spend time with him, laugh. We would crack up. That's one thing that we always do. We're always like cracking up in the midst of everything making crazy jokes, like funny jokes. And our sons were so happy to see him. And then sometimes I would go alone and we would just talk about a lot of things and like our future and stuff. And yeah, it felt weird for sure. Like being back in a prison so close to the time that had just been released.

It was very triggering. Sometimes I'm like, what if they don't freaking let me out? Like, what if they keep me here? But we did that for a few months for like six, seven months until that Jen got home. Do you think that I know it was hard to begin with, but do you think it would be even harder to give birth if that was your first child? rather than your second? Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

I had two really bad pregnancies. So my first pregnancy was young and not enjoyable, you know, because also like in a bad relationship, an abusive relationship, trying to figure out the path for my life. So I feel like both of my pregnancies were very challenging, you know. But I kind of already had not a good experience with my pregnancies before. So I wasn't expecting, like with this pregnancy, I wasn't expecting anything. Like I, and thankfully, I had easy pregnancies.

I wasn't nauseous. I wasn't sick. You know, I had my cravings. I couldn't get what I wanted. But sure, I was healthy and able and, like, didn't have any of that morning sickness. I knew it was a boy because my pregnancy was exactly how it was with Dorian. I knew it. I knew it because it was the same way.

But had that been my first pregnancy? yeah, that would have felt, that would have, that would have been bad. But because I had not the so best first pregnancy, it was like, it was like, okay, like I can do this. I can do this. I thought about my options, though. When I found out it was pregnant, I was like, are there like options because I felt so guilty already having a son? And then finding out I'm pregnant in prison, I didn't know if I was going to do it. And I was under so much stress.

I didn't know if I was even going to have a full term pregnancy. But it was like God gave me this little gift at the perfect time. So I wouldn't do it alone. And it just paved out the way for everything else I was to follow because he was the backbone, our little glue to our family. Like LJ is the glue to the family for sure. And it was because Legend and I were intended to be together, all of us four together to do what we're doing today. To do like we've helped over 700 families, you know, through our story and showing. hope and like restoration and accountability and like that there is more to one mess up in your life.

Like people get divorced all the time. People lose jobs. They have to rebuild their identity all over from scratch. And that's the same thing with making a mistake. The only difference is that our mistake is out for you to see. Our skeletons are out of the closet for everyone to see. So to instill that hope and like other parents that are wanting the same things, you know, they're taking that step. Like 300 letters. I don't know if you know. too much about it, but we were voluntary, like it's a volunteer, voluntary, sorry. So parents are applying to this program because they want to, the support in strengthening their family foundation. They want the support and how to like repair communication, repair relationships. They're looking

for something in reentry that's going to help them as a parent, you know, as as just a as a human again. And that's what we do. And so it's crazy. like the amount of people that that want to just go forward from that. But society doesn't make you think that. When you think of someone that's been in jail or prison, you think of a bad person or like they were supposed to be there because they did the crime and now they have to do the time. Well, sure, in a lot of cases, absolutely. Like a lot of people do need to go to prison.

A lot of people do need a timeout. Like a lot of people do need to like, you know, understand their actions. and a lot of people need to be incarcerated, some for a lifetime. That's very, very real. But a lot of people just made a bad decision in their lives. Majority of them, I would say, and all the ones that I've met and come across, it's been that way. First time offenders. All the moms I met were first time offenders. And they were in prison. And they all had children. And I think that that's a huge, huge sign of like how our country it just doesn't care, you know, how this industry, this prison industry is just so beneficial for our country, that none of that matters. Like, none of your whole pieces, none of your whole elements of your life, like who you really are matter when you make a mistake that's front and center.

When did you decide to start the foundation? We started the foundation in 2020. And how long after was that from when you got released? I got released in 2016. So a few years. Yeah, and it was hard. I used to go to work and cry. And I used to get there and people would ask me like, where were you for that year?

And I didn't know how to answer. I had a lot of shame, a lot of guilt. I didn't know really how to tell people where I was. I went back to my old job, actually. The job with the doctor that I had, he rehired me immediately. No questions asked, which is a blessing that doesn't really happen in a lot of scenarios. But I was unhappy. I felt like all this stuff happened, you know, all these things happened.

all these, these very, very huge, huge events happen in my life. And now I'm just like back to where I started. That was something that I couldn't, you know, like I couldn't shake off. And I just remember how the women were treated, how majority of us were first time offenders, how all of us had these mandatory minimums, how all of us were moms and all of our children were minors. One of my friends, her son tried to commit suicide because her, both of his parents were incarcerated and both got 10 years. And when his parents left, she, you know, her mom told her,

like, he's in the hospital. He tried to take his life because his parents aren't here, you know, he was 16 at the time. And that never left me. Like, I, I couldn't understand how all these families could just be torn apart for majority what were like white collar property offenses. The girlfriend. I call mine the girlfriend sentence, the girlfriend charge. I know so many people that have the girlfriend sentence, you know? And, um, and I'm sure there's a lot of ways to kind of, there's, there is a lot of ways to help us understand the decisions that we made, you know, but there is a story before this experience. Like there is an upbringing. There is a whole, a whole person that is now going through this. So, um, the fact that that was never looked at was

crazy to me, how we don't see people for people. We just see them for that one thing. We don't see them for their whole entire, you know, their whole entire being who they truly are to the core and what they've done aside from that one mistake, you know. So when we started at the foundation, it was actually legend. Legend had got back home. He got into fitness. He was like really big into fitness. He felt like that was going to be his way to be a provider and that was going to give him the platform that he needed to also. He had a bachelor's. He graduated while we were indicted with his bachelor's degree. So he walked that stage and we were both. like I was indicted. He was walking that stage and we knew what was coming, but he was able to

be the first college graduate in his family. And that was a huge like, wow, what a contradicting experience, right? Like he's walking the stage, getting his bachelor's degree, but we're indicted. And I remember he got back home and he was doing so good in the gym and everyone knew that he was that he had been to prison. Everyone knew. That's how he got the job. And no one knew that I had ever been in prison. That was like, and women with incarceration, women were prison, it's like, what did you do? There's a huge stigma. When you hear about a woman being in prison, it's like, oh, she must be crazy. That's just a stigma. When you hear about a man that's gone to prison and you see that he's doing well, you're like, oh, look at him, the underdog. He killed it. He's like, he's him. And that's not

for women. Women, it's like, what did she do? Is she crazy? She doesn't care about her kids. She doesn't care about her family. She definitely is not a good mother. It's a lot of judgment. So he had gotten a DM from one of his friends that was not a friend. Well, she is a friend, but she was a gym member. And there was an opportunity at Univision. It's the largest Spanish network in the world. Have you heard of it? Univision.

Oh, Univision. Yeah, Univision and Telemundo. So Univision, they had an opportunity for anyone that had been justice impacted in Florida, Nevada, or California to sign up to the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative as a journalist. and she sent it to him. He's like, well, I don't think I would be able to do this because it was like the pay was pretty much nothing, but the platform was major. He's like, I don't think I would be able to do this, but I'm going to share it with my wife.

And she was like, but you have to be incarcerated. You have to have been formally incarcerated. He's like, yeah, she's formally incarcerated. So he sends it to me and I look at it and I look at it. And I'm like, being a criminal justice journalist and doing this journalism initiative, it was a fellowship doing this would would help me kind of understand like the bigger picture and help me kind of get a grip on like the questions I've had my to like the questions that I've been asking myself for so long and that unhappiness I felt a huge void after prison

a huge void I felt like my self-esteem was on the floor I didn't feel good as a woman as a mother Yeah, I was making an income, but to me, that wasn't, that wasn't like my purpose. And it wasn't, it wasn't, I didn't want my sons to just see me come back and like, like work and then do nothing. Like we did, you know, there was more to it. I felt like I had a responsibility. And so I went and I did the interviews with Univision and they hired me for the one in Florida, the position in Florida. And then COVID hit. But I was able to work in the network and learn a lot about all the organizations all across the U.S.

what they were doing for families, how they were treating reentry. I would interview them and I would give them the platform. I did a story. Actually, it's called, it's called locked. Hold on. The story I did, because it's locked in. Oh, yeah, I was reading it. I saw that on your Instagram.

You saw it? You saw that? I forgot the title right now. It's like locked in or something locked out. Locked in, but locked out. Yeah, because a lot of people were coming back home in the midst of COVID. And I was like, how about all the. parents, I can't see their kids because of the pandemic. How about all the people that are coming back home and they're not even able to get a job? They're not able. The halfway houses were pretty, the halfway house completely changed after that, after the pandemic. So they're coming in, they're coming back home, but they don't have any resources to them. So I was interviewing organizations all across the nation because I had the platform. And I started to see the same thing with every organization. Yes.

they were helping the individual. Yes, it was limited resources for women, but no, it wasn't about the family. It was about the individual that, you know, was incarcerated. And I always felt like my kids were the ones, my oldest son was the one that felt this impact the most. My mother-in-law, you know, she felt this impact the most. And so I went on, like, Legend and I would just brainstorm and we had time during this time, too. It was a pandemic of like what we would have needed as a family when we got back home. Like, what would have been good for us? And I remember, coming back home having to put little one in daycare. I didn't even feel comfortable with putting him in daycare, but I had to work. And I was financially like drowning. I had to, I just got back home

from work. I didn't have, from prison. I didn't have any money. I was responsible for commissary now because, oh, you're home now. Guess who has to pay commissary for legend. Nobody else. Now was my responsibility to put the money on the phone, the commissary, the travel. Like now I had to pick up all the pieces and scrounge around. So we sat there with a therapist and we figured out what would be helpful for the family as a unit and what would strengthen that family. Because the top three reasons that people go back to prison are what? Family, emotional, financial. The support systems are not there. We, you know, a lot of people have burned bridges. They need to mend those relationships. The support system wasn't there prior to prison. And that's a lot of times, it's the same

common denominators. You know, a lot of times people don't have a good, household when they went to prison in the first place. So I felt we felt like if we could tackle all three, the recidivism rates would drop. And people, families would have a higher likelihood of succeeding together alongside one another by building that strong foundation, having a higher success rate as a family, and lower chance of our children becoming another statistic. Because they say one and six children that have incarcerated parents are six times more likely to end up incarcerated themselves. And that's a statistic that I was like, we're breaking.

We're going to be generational changers. Like, this is not happening in our home. And that platform gave me the ability to learn, you know, to really expand my mind on how people are affected in this as a, you know, like what services exist, but really how the communities are affected as a whole too. And I saw that from that national level, you know, and that was a really, really big, cool blessing. And that's when we started with 300 letters. We thought it was going to be like a T-shirt where actually I brought you a T-shirt. Actually, you have to open it. I got two?

Yep. Oh, cool. Is this one different or is this the same one? This is different. Okay, cool. So we thought it was going to be like a T-shirt brand where we can empower people that have gone through something in life, adversity, like something that has. Oh, it is different. It's different.

You guys didn't lie to me. We would never. Oh, this is what he was wearing yesterday. Yeah, the generational healer. Oh, okay, cool. This is awesome. Yeah. Oh, I like the fire on the back too.

Thank you very much. Now I got two shirts. Yeah, all the work that you do, bring people together, talk about their story that's healing the generations to come. You know, you give them that platform. Thank you. So it's a blessing. But yeah, we, we, what was I telling you?

That we started with the T-shirts. Like we thought we were just making empowering t-shirts, but I was like, this is not enough for families like ours. Like we have the highest incarceration rates in the world, you know? 90% of incarcerated men are fathers. 80% of the incarcerated women are the primary caregivers to their children prior to going to prison. So when a mom goes to prison, where do children end up? Not with dad. They don't.

They end up like with a family member, an distant family member, grandma. you don't know the conversations. Our 300 Heroes program is mostly made up of grandmothers caring for justice-impacted children because the moms incarcerated. And that's really, really heavy work. You know, this is a new experience for them. They don't know how to handle the fact that their child is in prison and now they're caring for children that they probably weren't caring for before then.

So we wanted to make sure that we were able to. to create something that was going to create change in our communities, like create impact in the lives of the people that needed the most that were so outcasted, you know, because our dirt's out for everyone to see, like, we're, you know, we're the second class citizen, but we're not. And if we give each other, if we empower each other, like we do now, we empower each other through our work and our vocal and sharing our stories out loud, we'll empower the next family to do so. And then they can have create now the different opportunity to get out of survival with their families and create now a different pathway, built on accountability, on strength,

on resilience for themselves and their kids. And that's what we're doing every day. And I think it's like the most, I think that's what I was called to do. That's definitely my purpose in life. And so when I think about that, you know, being in prison, I know that it had a reason for me. And it's all about our perspective because we can go through shitty things and we can victimize ourselves, right? And be like, oh, you know, if legend hadn't have told me to do that and if everyone told me it was going to be okay, I wouldn't be here. And I'm just going to focus on myself and be selfish and just focus on working and, and, you know, I'm going to be a single mom. And that's it. But no, I looked at it. And I was like, God has a calling. Like, there's something that I learned here and I learned it in the

midst of it and I felt that like I felt those changes in me during that time like I felt like now was my responsibility to not allow any of of those feelings of like you have to do something because you have to do it like that that happened to me while it was incarcerated like now you have to take a hold on your life and you have to decide how you want to go from here that's exactly what we want to give to the families we work with. Like, yeah, this has happened and it's, it's not easy to rebuild from. And you're going to go through hurdles, but we can, we can prepare and we can work on these hurdles together. Like, you've got a team. You actually have someone that's in your corner now. And that's, that's what I, that's what that was for. If you could sit

across your 22-year-old self that was in that interrogation room that day, what would you say to her if you were like the fly on the wall? I would tell her, I would tell her, you got this. Like, there's nothing that she could have done differently. She did what she was supposed to be to be so where she is now. That moments, those moments, like they shaped Amanda for the Amanda today. I wouldn't be such a badass. And I wouldn't be here with you if I did anything differently. Like, I wouldn't.

And so she did what she was supposed to do for sure. Amanda, thank you for coming on the show today. Thanks for having me. This was so much fun. You did great. And Legend did great too. You're the best. You guys are the best. I love your guys' energy and your attitude and everything you guys got going on.

Thanks, Ian. And when you come to Miami, you know, you have family. Definitely. You show me the good Cuban food. Oh, and I'll make you Cuban coffee.