Locked In with Ian Bick - Inmate Describes Female Chomos, Prison Fights, & Spending Time In Solitary | Ginjer Wulff Pt. 2

Episode Date: January 25, 2024

Ginjer Wulff, who made her debut on the show early last year when I was just starting out, returns to share her compelling journey within a women's prison. In this episode, we delve into topics such as the challenges faced by female inmates, the solitude of confinement, altercations, and the intriguing and often humorous tales that captivate our curiosity about life behind bars. Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Big thanks to Find A Great Attorney for sponsoring this episode. If you are injured anywhere in the country, visit https://findagreatattorney.com, a free service that can find you one of the best lawyers in your area. You focus on getting better and they’ll do the rest. First episode with Ginjer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeueW-0YLVk Buy Merch: https://lockedinbrand.com Use code lockedin at checkout to get 20% off your order Timestamps: 00:00:00 - Intro 00:03:40 -Going to prison 00:07:13 - Harsh Experience 00:10:54 - Witnessing DV and Crazy Talk 00:14:35 - Cooking 00:17:57 - Women's Hierarchy 00:21:39 - Double Banking and Shopping in Confinement 00:25:12 - Shark Foot and Other Nicknames 00:28:52 - Authentic Connections 00:32:37 - The Cultural Perception of Women Going to Prison 00:36:12 - Life in Women's Prison 00:39:53 - Life in the Shu 00:43:36 - Catching Up and the Film Industry Strike 00:47:15 - Marie Arrington's Escape 00:50:55 - Confrontation in the Dormitory Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I feel like the men have more of a hierarchy, and the women we're more like pseudo-families. So you aren't the woman shot caller? I mean. You know in your head you think you were the shit. When you see like JD Delay and you see those people. If you put a wig on him and put some pasties on him, I would be JD Delay. Yeah, exactly. That's what I'm saying?

So are you, what do they call it, female prison shot caller? Ginger Wolf, who made her debut on the show early last year when I was just starting out. returns to share her compelling journey within a woman's prison. In this episode, we delve into topics such as the challenges faced by female inmates, the solitude of confinement, altercations, and the intriguing and often humorous tales that captivate our curiosity about life behind bars. This episode is brought to you by my friends over at findagrateatorney.com. If you are injured anywhere in the country, visit findagateatorney.com.

It's a free service that can find you one of the best lawyers in your area. You focus on getting better and they'll do the rest. Huge thank you to find a great attorney.com for sponsoring another episode of Lockton with the InVic. Listen up, everyone. I just need one quick favor from you, the listeners. If you could take a quick second and screenshot your favorite episode of the Lockton with the Invick podcast and post it up on your Instagram or Snapchat stories or your Facebook wall, it would mean the absolute world and help spread our platform out to more people. Sit back, relax, and let's get ready to lock in with Ginger Wolf.

Ginger Wolf, welcome back to Locked in. You're still called the Wolf, right? Yeah. Okay, you still have the same last name. Yeah. Okay, cool. Welcome back. So this is part two, you know?

You came on the show at our old studio in April. I felt like the comments were, shut up, Meg, quit crying and show us your tits. Oh, yeah, they did call you Meg, yeah. No, they did really like your interview, though. They did enjoy it. They thought you were real authentic. and your clips did great on like TikTok and stuff. It was the girls.

What, the tits? I figure out if I jump up and down, I get a lot more for you. Well, you got them covered this episode. Yeah, if anybody says shit about my body and we're in a turtleneck next time. Y'all play with me. Sik Tick of TikTok. Oh, man. TikTok don't pay my bills, baby.

Yeah, no, no, they did like the episode, though. You know you got a lot of love for that. You got a lot of people reach out. You met Billy Johnson, my friend. You're at his wedding too out there and you met his wife, now wife, Barbara. That's my buddy. It's going to be my niece. Your niece?

Whoa, I know about that. I don't know how Billy's going to spot of that. Her mom loves me already and everything. You better ask him. You better tell him, Billy. You better tell these people. Facebook, Billy, man. No, it's cool how like the social media prison community comes together and like, you know.

I've connected with so many people. It's really cool. I actually have two more podcasts after this. Oh, fancy. Yeah. Eric sent me his book That was kind of cool So Eric Canori

He sent me his book pressure I haven't read it yet But he sent it to me Eric's a really good guy I had a really good conversation With him when he came on the show Yeah I listened to it Yeah it was a little

I listened You listen to the episode Yeah You gotta figure out who you're scoping out next Huh To connect with huh You love the prison influencers I like feeling

So I was in the 12th step community Like after I got sober right And then I did that like hardcore for three years. And then I got into this place where I had such bad physical pain that I was like ready to take myself out either with a pill or like however else because I couldn't live the way I was living. So I started doing the marijuana vape. And I kind of found myself in this weird spot where I didn't have the community, especially because we moved, right? Like I got sober in Dustin, Florida. That's where all my people are. So it was kind of nice. I feel like I was

kind of hiding online, like, going by a different name, because after intervention, so many weird people reach, like, nobody that's healthy watches fucking intervention, right? So I had so many weird people reaching out to me, and I worked really hard to not be associated with being that, you know what I mean? And there's nothing real about reality TV. I work at TV and film now, but, like, I could have told you then that a lot of the stuff that you see is a situation that presented to show the lengths that people will go to. It might not necessarily be something that actually happened, if that makes sense. So, like, I felt like after I came on the show, it was almost like a soft launch of like,

okay, like, how are people going to react to this? Because I had had a lot of people tell me I should share my story in a public setting, and I didn't want to. I never wanted someone to feel like I was trying to make money off my crime. or like I was trying to get famous off of what I did. You know what I mean? Because I had a victim. So I guess like coming on the show kind of allowed me to do like a soft launch and be like,

all right, like people don't hate me as much as I thought they would. And kind of give me a little bit of freedom, I guess. So what do you think was like the biggest misconception people had of you once you came on the show? Because I'm sure you read some of the comments of what people had to say. And comments can definitely be debilitating sometimes. So what do you, what's like the biggest? biggest misconception you wanted to clear up about your story.

I don't give a fuck about clearing it up to because people are going to argue with me regardless, bro. Okay, so the thing with the officer, that shit kills me. So why don't you just tell the whole story? I don't want to tell the whole story again, bro. I'm not crying for TikTok again. I'm not doing it.

Okay, so anyone that hasn't seen this episode or knows Ginger's backstory of why she went to prison, check out that first episode relationship with a prison guard that was like in April, I think, April or May. Crazy story. It's like literally orange. It's a new black.

Yeah. We know how much you love that show. I do love that show. But yeah, no, I wanted to give you the opportunity to like, you know, to share parts that we missed out on. Because we spent so much time on your childhood. Yeah, on the trauma. And the build up, the trauma. I was like your therapist for the day.

I got to send you a bill for that. You still are. You know, we focused on that, the addiction and everything. We didn't really focus on the prison stuff. Like, we kind of brushed through it. And that was almost like a three-hour. interview too. Yeah. So, you know, people are fascinated with the woman's prison. So, you know, why don't you like take us from the top of like when you got there, like what that was like,

you know, walking into that prison. So we all know I'm not capable of giving like a short story. That's why this is great for you. Tell us the whole prison story. So I got like, I got sentenced on a Tuesday morning and I was like the first person sentenced the judge was pissed. She already knew what she was doing with me. Um, I was not in a good frame of mind. I was still using. They kicked my bunk to go to prison like Thursday night. So I'd never been to jail.

Like when I got arrested, I bonded out immediately. I never got dressed out or anything. So I'd never had any jail experience, right? So I learned everything in prison while I was withdrawing. It was sucks. It was not fun. You know, I woke up. My first night puked all over my bunk at like midnight.

just fucking exorcist vomiting everywhere. People are looking at me like, I don't know what's wrong or her, but nobody touched her. It was just a rough first week. I ended up, they had to black box me because I wasn't classified, right? So, like, I got into prison technically Friday morning. That night, I puked all over my bunk because of the, you know, that morning for they shipped me. I brought in pills into county, you know, because I already knew I was going to prison. And I ate whatever I had when they kicked my bunk and flushed the rest.

So I had enough in me to, like, kind of function my first day. And I ended up to where, like, I was just throwing up all over the place, you know, just opiate withdrawal. I was not a thousand milligrams of oxy. Like, I was trying to die because I didn't think I was going to survive prison. And by, like, I think Wednesday morning, I was like in jail. It was like, I hate my life. It just fell off the stores. Did you guys have those like metal stools where like the cards would slide really well?

They'd have metal tables. Yeah, we had like the lunch tables. Yeah, yeah. We'd always play cards on those. And sometimes you had to put a, um, uh, the blanket down on it to play cards. So that way it didn't like, yeah. Yeah, I slid like a new, a new deck. It slid right off.

Um, and ate shit, but they took me to the infirmary and the infirmary and the infam like, puke of my guts out. The infirmary's like, your blood pressure is telling us nothing. I mean fucking kidney and liver failure. They ended up, you know, taking me to the hospital. I was in the hospital for like three days. They had to do a port in my leg. And then I just remember coming back and they stuck me in Papa Dorm, which was like culinary dorm.

And it wasn't classified or anything. They were like, go to work. This isn't what I thought was going to happen. I ended up staying at Lowell the whole time, too. I was low custody by the time they classified me. But they held me in the beginning. and because of the kidney and liver failure. I had like a high medical hold because of that.

Papa Norm was wild. Dude, like, so one of the things you asked other people that I didn't get to answer because I could shut the fuck up was the worst thing that I saw in there. Domestic violence. I had never, like, I know domestic violence is like a thing, right? I've never experienced it.

The only time of my life I regret not being a snitch was, I swear to God. I watched, I was in a room with 80 fucking women and watched one girl beat this shit out of her domestic other over and over and over all day because the officer put fucking paper up on the window because they didn't give a shit because they didn't want to be in that dorm.

And it's like a helpless feeling to be like, bro, like you want to slap your girlfriend around once or twice it's your fucking business, dude, but like you laying into her all day long just because you can't. Wait, but I thought there's rules where you can't snitch if it's like domestic violence or something.

That's not the case in prison. I mean rules you can snitch. Says who? Like, all right, if there's a child or like an innocent bus. In the street, not in prison? So that doesn't carry over to prison? No, no, no, no. You don't get involved in domestic shit.

Okay. So you didn't get involved? No, no. I felt bad. Were women intimidated by you? Yes and no. I think a lot of, I say a lot of crazy shit out of my mouth. So people didn't really know because I look one way and then I talk.

Yeah, when you start talking, you don't stop. Jeez, Louise. And I just say crazy stuff. So I think people didn't really know what to expect with me. You know, so it's always a shock. It's always a guess. You never know which personality you're going to get. Yeah.

But yeah, that was probably like the thing that I remember most about Papa Dorm was the domestic violence that I witnessed in that dorm. Why'd they call Papa Dorm? So it's the military terminology. like alpha, beta, you know. Okay. It was a experience like with your first bunk mate? Who was? I don't even remember.

Because everyone has like that one story with their first bunk mate, you know? So I didn't really have that experience. I mean, I was kind of out of it first a week, buddy. I just remember throwing up everywhere. Well, once you sobered up and whatnot, you know, when you were in that first, I guess, bunk with someone. Did you guys hit it off? Were you beefing?

So I went out to course. pretty quickly. I didn't have any real issues with anybody up until like halfway through my sentence. I tend to write things off. I tend to be goofy. You know what I mean? Like I don't, you know what I mean? Yeah, they called you Slim Shady.

Yeah. I'm too old to be beefing with another bitch, dude. What do we look like fighting? It looks stupid. You know? Like, you know what I mean? So what happened with the bunk bait? With, I didn't really have that.

Oh, you mean so the middle? Yeah. You had a bug bait? Nothing, nothing. I mean, I was in there. I went, it was in culinary for a while and that sucked. There's no... Wait, you worked in the kitchen? For just a little bit. Oh, I got a useless pass, baby. I could not wait to use that thing. What's a useless pass?

Oh, no bending, no pushing, no pulling, no standing. Oh, yeah, every time I didn't want to do shit. I just won't have my useless bath. I didn't realize you worked in the kitchen? Yeah, I did, I had quite a few jobs. Most of my jobs were privileged jobs. What was the job in the kitchen? You actually cook shit? No, I didn't. I didn't cook. I was on the line. for a little bit and I fucking hated that and I wouldn't shut up. So they moved me from there and they put me in the dining room and that was a good fit

for me because I just I would sing. Dining room is like the easiest job because you just wipe it down. It's like five minutes after each. Well, you have to mop and deal with a bunch of idiots but. On the chow line is it like orange is a new black where like you some women are not feeding other women if they're mad at them? I never witnessed that. Okay, it's not like that.

No, I never witnessed that. You were just yapping everyone in the line. Were you giving people extra portions? I learned how to, Los Policias, no santos, amigos. Los Policias are offended, they can'tar. The police are confused. They cannot count.

You're lucky you're a well-built woman, because if you were the way you are with some of these, they would have looked at you as prey. Yeah. They would have been on you. No, not me, baby. They would have been on your ass, did you? I had money, too.

I never had the experiences you had, sweetheart. I never had anybody stealing my shit. Actually, I take that back. I had one thing stolen. So, oh, I didn't tell you this, did I? Okay, so they gave, I went to medical, like, I don't know, a year into my sentence, right? And they give me a big fucking boot because I have, listen. Like a Harmon Munster boot, bro.

Listen, like, it had extra space because so I have, I need chiropractic care because of, you know, issues that I have with my neck and back. So what happens is my hip will go up and rotate and it makes my legs shorter than the other. So I kind of walk on my toe on that left side. And that's how I got my useless pass. Because I told the doctor about it. I was like, look, man, I can't stand all the... I was like, you just call me Eileen because, you know, I lean over that way. But he sent me to outward medical because he's like, I can get you special boots.

You want some special boots? Fuck yeah, I want special boots. These things suck. They send me to outside medical, which is like the men's unit. So we go to the men's unit for a day. and the doctor's like, oh, it's just a little it's just a little more.

I could just put it inside the boot. He was like, yeah, do that. He's like, but I should do what's best for you. So I was like lopsided. But they were really nice boots. Someone stole them and used them. I don't know what the fuck they used them for, but that thing could have been a weapon.

I told the, so the girl that used to beat up her girlfriend had like a crush for me and I told her baby, we can't date because you hit me. I'm picking up my big boot and I'm fucking you up and we're both going to jail. Like, you're not going to. do me like you do her. Nope, nope, nope, nope.

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how much money you're able to get for your case. Now let's get back into my interview with Ginger Wolf. That's funny. Now I know you're very passionate about like the commissary cooking show that we used to do and everything. I know and I'm still mad. I didn't get to do that. What were some of the things you used to cook? Oh, everything.

Dude, I threw dorm parties because I had... You threw a dorm party in prison? Oh, yeah. I used to steal the Sunnis from the admin building because the officers would have like these parties and like whatever and they would have leftover Sunny's barbecue. I'd walk down the fucking compound with anyone with like, put it. it out on the table. We did Thanksgiving that way. We did a lot of different stuff. So walk us through a whole party. Like, who's

cooking? What do you cook in? What's it look like? It depends. Like, you know, what are we doing? Is it for the whole dorm? Because we did some stuff like that where like, hey, it was somebody's birthday or someone was leaving or it was a holiday or I just had so much commissary and needed to get rid of some of that shit.

So we would just make a bunch of different stuff. We did a Chinese food, which was cool. It was like soy sauce and ramen, you know, staple of every meal in prison. What else? Sunflower seeds. Like a little sausage. We did tuna wraps.

Honey mustard tuna wraps. Oh, dude, I make a good honey mustard tuna wrap. I don't know about honey mustard tuna. They're really good. They're really good. I promise you. What else did I make? What was your best dish? Probably Mexican pizza. What's a Mexican pizza? So you buy the wraps and then you get a thing of hot chili and we had a hot

vealvita cheese squeeze and you get an onion. and a tomato and some lettuce from the kitchen and you use your little ID card and you cut this shit out of it. Or you get one of the officers to give you a little plastic knife and you use that too. I had like Tupperware containers

because you couldn't buy stuff like that on canteen. So anytime I could cop something like that with a lid, oh my God. A bowl with the lid and that lull was like it's a big deal. So you came in with a pretty short sentence though. Three years?

Three years, which is short compared to some of these other women with a lot of time. It felt like it was a lot for a first offense. And it felt like it was a lot for me. But what I'm getting to is that did girls find it intimidating that you came in, like taking over things? Like running these events. Like you were out there. You know, you were larger than life. Was there ramifications to that?

No. So I don't feel like I was running things. So I feel like the women and the men are very different. I feel like the men have more of a hierarchy. and the women we're more like pseudo families. So you aren't the woman shot collar? I mean. You know in your head you think you were the shit.

When you see like J.D. delay and you see those people. If you put a wig on him and put some pasties on him, I would be J.D. delay. Yeah, exactly. That's what I'm saying. So are you, what do they call it? Female prison shot caller? No. It's not a thing.

Yeah, I know. But if it was, I'm saying if it was. It's not, though. But if it was. So who made the prison shot caller thing? Men. Men did that shit. I'm saying it comes from somewhere so why can't women have the same high art?

I'm sure we could. But that's what you would be though. But that's just not what I experienced. But you would be that. That's what you want to say, man. I'm let you have it. I just, it makes sense. So to me, so listen, for real, to me, the thing with like a shot caller is like you make decisions on like who eats, who goes places, who keeps their commissary.

I wasn't, I'm not doing it. You were making decisions of who's coming the Thanksgiving feast. Yeah. And I was, hey, like, you don't want to fuck with me if you really, like, value whatever it is that you have going on. Yeah. I was never the type to, like, throw people under the bus. I was never the type to, like, be confrontational. I feel like, like, words are powerful.

Pretty good with them, usually. I don't know. I feel like two people in general get things done more, like, together than if we're constantly fighting each other. Like we're not working towards the same goal The whole prison shot caller thing is just funny though It's not though I know like I'm saying in the sense like I know like you find J.D. fascinating and stuff so He moves around a lot

He's entertaining Yeah, he's a good guy I like J.D. He's J.D. delay is one of a kind That's just like a good dude right there. Yeah. So what about like um I know like you you elaborated the last episode about um

how you made someone you left prison with like 15 grand 10 or 15 grand. Have you ever cut a check from admin? No. Okay, so I used to have to cut my family checks. Because, so like, inmate bank, the way inmate bank works is you could only have so much money in your inmate bank. And like,

after I came out of confinement, I was in AC confinement, both times I went to confinement. And the last time I actually got a DR because it was easier to just say I did it and lay down and it was to let them fucking look around into my money and stuff. But they locked my account. count for three months, bro. I couldn't shop. I mean, I was doing it anyway. Do you know what double

banking is? No, you got to explain to everyone. Okay, so double banking is when like, so when I was in prison at Lowell, you could only spend $100 a week. So if I need to spend more than $100 a week, I got to send somebody money that doesn't, doesn't shop out or doesn't get any money. And I say, hey, I'm going to give you 20 bucks in a list, and I'm going to send $100 to you, and you're going to go shop and go get my shit, and then you keep 20 for you. That way everybody wins. I had to do that a lot. Yeah, we did that in the feds, but we could spend $3.60 a month over the holidays. I think we could spend $400 or $4.20.

So, yeah, our normal load was like $400 a month. Plus, you could get, like, packages and stuff. But as far as, like, if I needed something that day and I had already hit my limit, which I usually did, I would have to send money to somebody else and have somebody else go shop and pay them off the top. Interesting. So, yeah, cutting checks was a pain in the ass, too, because so after I couldn't move, after we got told on for the cigarettes, you know, I was running cigarettes out of the admin building,

the control room. I used to walk in and out of the control room where VP was, and my Bunky's mom would drop a carton, and I would like act like the trash smell, and I didn't want it, and the officers would tell me to take it, and I would take it into the compound and go get what I wanted,

fucking spray it with a water thing, and bring it back out there. But somebody told on me because we basically had this deal around Thanksgiving with a lifer. And I really didn't want to do business with her, but I was kind of new up there. And the other girl that was up there

kind of running shit already had some deal in place. But the people that worked up front liked me. So I would get called in when the other girl wouldn't. So I basically got brought in on the hustle that was already going on, right? But we did a drop around Thanksgiving.

And I kept telling them, hey, it needs to be before Thanksgiving because inside grounds doesn't work for like two or three days. So I knew the trash wasn't going to go. So my concern was it was going to get dropped and the trash was going to get taken out or I wasn't going to make it and it was going to get full before I could get there to get down to the control room to retrieve the items, right? It was supposed to happen like the Wednesday before Thanksgiving and didn't happen or like Tuesday before Thanksgiving didn't happen. Then it was supposed to be the next day and it didn't happen. And then they did it like on Thanksgiving or the day after. And I just kept telling him, dude, I have a bad feeling about this.

Like, I don't want to do this. I went down there to go get it and trash had been called. So there was nothing there. So that means I have to go back and tell the life or hey, like, I don't give a fuck if you sent somebody money or her mom brought it. I'm telling you I went down there. There's nothing there, bro. There's nothing to get. She was convinced that I somehow smuggled the cigarettes.

fucking 400 cigarettes or whatever, 200 cigarettes, because I guess there's 20 in a pack, because a pack is worth 400 if you can get seven roll-ups out of one Newport short. I don't smoke, right? So it's all profit. So when you're doing the math that way, one pack's like 400 bucks. So you had all these people. It's like a dope drop, man. All these people are waiting for the stuff to come through, and I don't have anything for them.

But she was convinced that I somehow took it into medical, and me and my buddy that was like the wheel, orderly, stuffed them in the wheelchairs. There's a wheelchair like, she like worked on the wheelchairs and like fixed them, I guess. So she stuffed them in the wheelchair? No, she did it. That's what they thought. Yeah,

the stuff never, I'm telling you, they dropped it and inside grounds came and got it. And it went into the trash or somebody found it but it most likely went into the trash. So it was just a loss. But after that me and a girl started beefing a little bit. Does she slitter

fucking her girlfriend's throat in a homestead. And I told her, I was like, dude, like, I'm not fint to do this with you. We're either going to fucking beat the shit out of each other and go lay down because you're not going to tell people that I ripped you off because I've never done that. You know what I mean? I have a really good name. Like, even when I was down and out and I owed people money, like, hey, you're going to get yours.

It's coming. Like, I'm keeping in touch. Just be patient. Yeah. What were some of the nicknames you would hear women be called? Like, that was a big part of Orange is the New Black. like the different names. So what were like some of the names that you remember?

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and open-air freedom. Because freedom deserves the vehicle built to carry it. Jeep, there's only one. Hurry into your local dealer for the Jeep Declaration of Deals. Jeep has won more awards over its lifetime than any of the car. and their recipe branching from the Jeep Grohl or registered trademarks of XCAUS MLC. So, Bebe, that was a good friend of mine. Her name, her name was Bebe.

And, A, Bebe, A, Bebe. She was fun. There was Tyson that looked kind of like a boy. Who else? There was a lot of different nicknames for a lot of days. You know, it was a lot of different things. All right, so let's hear some more. I mean, that's all I got for right now.

You only give me two. I got to need at least two more. Ratchet, that was the name. You heard a lot of like the pseudo family. That's my brother. That's my cousin. That's my auntie. Yeah.

That's it. It's all I got. Oh, there was one girl we called Sharkfoot. Why did they call her Sharkfoot? So I like her at first, so I kind of condoned it. This is when I got into like the easy dorms. When I got into Delta dorm towards the end of my sentence, I was in all the pregnant girls.

She had a charge similar to mine. She fell asleep at the wheel. They were drunk and she killed her uncle. And her foot was severed. And they sewed her foot back on. So it lived like a shark pitter foot. And we told her at one way, we call you shark foot. Just so you fucking know.

Wow. Did you ever have like woman confessed to you about stuff? like about maybe things that were going through or crimes or cheating or anything. Yes. I don't know why I was a safe space for people. I thought it's crazy. What do you do when they share that to you?

Do you tell anyone else or you just listen? Why would I do that? Some people do that to save themselves, get themselves out of a situation. I'm never going to be in a situation where I need to use somebody else to save me. You can believe that. No, I mean, that doesn't make sense to me.

So it's hard to be vulnerable in general, right? Which is why I use humor to mask everything because it's not funny if you cry. You know, but I think that if someone is willing to open up to you and be vulnerable to you and especially tell you, hey, like, this is the charge, this is what really happened. I'm filing for an appeal. I'm scared, whatever, whatever, whatever. To me, you'd have to be a real garbage human being to go back and, like, utilize that and weaponize it.

I weaponize my character defects. I don't need to weaponize yours. You know what I mean? Like, I just don't understand people like that. I don't understand people that aren't genuine. I don't understand. Like, to me, like, so I've heard so many times people say the opposite of, like, using is sobriety. And, like, it makes sense in theory, right?

For me, the opposite of using is connection. Because when I'm using, I'm not connected to other people. And, like, part of what I love so much about my life now is, like, I have the ability to make these, like, I make lifelong bonds with people. I don't like surface level bullshit. You know what I mean? Like I want whatever type of relationship it is, a business relationship, a friendship, a friendship, an intimate relationship.

I want something that's like deep where like I really know that person and really understand them. And like, what are your goals? How can I help you? Right off of it. You know what I mean? So I guess I just don't understand the need, the want or the drive to not be authentic when it comes to other human beings. That's great.

It makes sense. They always say, like, you don't trust anyone, though, in prison, and you got to be careful with who you tell stuff to. But some of these people, like, when you take that risk and share that with them, could turn out to be, like, a lifelong friend. I have lifelong friends. I have a lot of people I still talk to. And, like, you don't I fucking talk to you?

I go through, like, a trauma spin. I'm a licensed therapist, dude. You're doing a shitty job, buddy I've been great. I'm on point. You're a good safe space. You are. But I have a lot of friends

that like I go see, I go out of the way to connect with people. You know, when I travel a lot, so anytime I'm where I know somebody is, you know, in the vicinity

that I was down with and that like, you know, I'm trying to keep up with. I always make it a point to try to get up with them. I got a couple people I'm trying to get,

come on and tell their story. A lot of the women don't want to talk about it, bro. Why do you think that is? I think it's the stigma. I think the same reason why I hid online and plate in sight, never really referenced it. Yeah, I mean, that's something I realized, too, is that the women are always concerned about how the episode will be titled. They're reading the comments, what people are going to think about them. I wonder why that is that they, that the men are okay with it and the women aren't. So think about the gender roles with men and women, right?

So like men are supposed to be dominant and aggressive and assertive. And that's appealing to the female counterpart. Whereas women, if you're too aggressive, you're too dominant, you're too assertive, you're too loud. It's like, oh. You mean like you? Yeah, yeah. Walking Red flag. No, but I also think that women in general, especially the older women think that they would never go to prison to begin with.

So they kind of feel embarrassed by it. and I've realized that some women don't necessarily own the whole truth to their story and what they did, the actions that got them into prison because of that embarrassment or feeling, whereas men are a little bit better. Not saying all women do that, but I have noticed that men surprisingly take a little bit more accountability than some women when it comes to prison and crime. I think there is also the other side of it where like a lot of the women in prison are mothers. So a lot of how could you leave your child? I didn't fucking plan on it.

That's for sure. I didn't wake up. I said I think I'm going to go to prison today because I don't got enough shit going on. You know? You didn't do that? No. I thought that's what happened. I thought that's how you ended up in prison.

It ate you. So I think a lot of it is like stigma of, oh, you're a bad mother. Oh, you're a drug addict. Oh, you're a whore. Oh, you're, you know, ad infinitum. Society has created this culture where it's okay for men. to go to prison. Right.

But not the women. Women are supposed to be soft and in the kitchen and, you know. Yeah. It's fucked up. It is fucked up. It should be okay, a comfortable space. You should do something. You should call somebody.

I feel like you reconnected. I think I'm very open. I have women on my channel. It's just like some women that do come on the channel. I don't know if they're 100% owning their past mistakes, you know? And I think the audience calls them out on that, you know, when they see things like that. I felt like people felt like, I was trying to shift blame for, like, my crime, which I'd be honest, I didn't really expect that.

I kind of threw me a little bit because I've, like, the person who burned my life to the ground was me. You know what I mean? Like, nobody else was responsible for what happened, but I can only tell my story as it happened. Plus, I was kind of processing my trauma as I was telling it to you. I don't know why I keep choosing these highly public forums to tell everybody. Because it doesn't feel public when you're sitting in here, and now it's even more. but just being in a room and you don't have other people. It's just me and the guest, you know?

This is a much better thing. Yeah, this is how it should be. This is how every podcast should be, not some open shell. Where, you know, like you hear the echo, you hear the door open, you hear this and that. This is, you're locked in, you know, locked in with Ian Bick. Like the beanie. Yeah, no, but I thought you were very honest with your story is cut and dry in the sense where there's no choice but to take accountability. It's not like a financial thing where you could say, oh, well, this or that.

That was no gray area. Yeah, yours was like pretty black or white. And, you know, you said you were under the influence of what exactly happened. And, you know, for those that are listening, check out part one to get that, you know, the entire story. I thought you did a great job, like giving the details of that and owning that, you know. But that resonates with the audience, you know. People are, people will know what someone's bullshitting about certain things, you know, and they're willing to be very vocal about it. That's why I think my platform's cool because you bring someone on,

the audience decifers whether they're telling the truth or not. I'm not sitting here judge of the person. I've just given them a space to tell their story. Wow, that's all you got for me. I just gave you a good rant right there that you look and be like I got three heads. What do I got behind me? Give me some direction. Give you direction.

I feel like we talked about a lot of stuff. We could talk about some of the people I was in there with. We didn't get to do that last time. You're in with some famous people? I was in there. So Misty Crosland. I don't know who that is. I know, you fucking don't.

Okay, so who's Misty? Who's good old Misty? Okay, so Misty. So Misty Crosland, there was a little girl went missing in the, I think it's the Putnam area in Florida. So it's like not far from where I used to live. Her name was Haley Cummings. I think she was like seven or so. But there was, it was almost very reminiscent of the Casey Anthony thing where like the whole states looking for this little girl.

And they're on this like. circle run of just bullshit information. Basically what happened was they could never find the body. They could never find out exactly what happened to her. I heard her bunkey told me what she told her of what happened. But like from a legal court standpoint, the case is not solved. She was in there. She had a lot of like pen pals.

a lot of weird supporters. I think she thought she's going to go in the YO program, and she didn't. She got punched in the face, like her first week. Yeah, how do, like, mom killers? Because I'm sure they all assume she was a killer, right? So how do they fare in a woman's prison? About as well as pedophiles. She ended up, I think, paying Robin Lungsford.

Maybe she didn't pay. I don't know for sure. I know that they had like a little click. when Robin Lungster was kind of running shit she was trying to holler at me when I was in the towel I was like brand new I was like yeah I think I'm good you look like trouble but

Misty hung out with her a lot and then she got moved because she was in Sierra Dorm which is like Lifeordorm she got a 25 year sentence and she got sentenced from I think two or three different counties like Volusia St. John's County and then I think Putnam I could be wrong but she got

25 years and they were run consecutive not concurrent So even if she won, because they were all held in like these different areas, even if she won one case, she still had to go win the other. So they knew she was guilty. Yeah, she's going to, I think she did end up getting some of it changed. Like I could be kind of fuzzy on the details. It's been a long time.

It's been a long time for like 13 years. But yeah, she had something to do with that little girl that went missing. And she's got a tattoo on her leg that says Haley on a cloud with a teddy bear holding a heart. Looks like it's going up to heaven to me. It's all. Wow. What about women, like pedophiles, traumos, were they there? Yes.

So what classifies a woman as a pedophile? Any sexual act with a child. So that's like a teacher? Did you have any like teachers there? I didn't have that. There was one weird girl that I ain't fucking like. They had to get her out of the child hall with me. Because she, her version, the couple seconds I could stand and listen to of it was that she had a boyfriend and her and the boyfriend were like,

doing sexual things to her children. As long as I needed to hear, get the fuck out of my face. You know. So what do the inmates do to her? So you don't have the, like, violence on site like you do in the men's facility with Chomos. It's more of like you're ridiculed, you're ostracized, you know, you can't sit with us, you know. You can go sit over there, girl, but you can't sit over here. You know, it's more of that type of thing.

Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. But they're not like they're not resorting to violence or anything. No. I'm telling you, the women's, we're doing stupid shit. Are there fights so?

Oh, yeah. I know you were talking about that other woman that got beat up. So why are they fighting with each other but not if someone's like a sex offender? So because a lot of them feel like, well, if you didn't directly offend me, I won't fuck with you, but I'm not going to lose my gain time. A lot of people want to go home with their kids. you know and like dude I did like

67 days the second time AC confinement sucks dude they take all your stuff to admin they go through all your shit oh I did that to me both times I wouldn't in confinement yeah it's not fun

nobody wants to do that you know what I mean like who wants to sacrifice their game time to beat up on somebody all the time so what were the times you went to solitary for the first time was the fucking rap song Wait, they put you in the shoe for that rap

song? Yes! Yes! Oh my god! I was working as the VP orderly. Can you wrap the whole song? I can. I'm not going to. I'm not doing it. It's not a rap. It's not a rift. It's supposed to be funny. I'm not doing it. Listen, I'm not doing it. No, you do a book. Give us a couple lines. You got to give us a couple of lines to put it to context.

Listen. Yeah, give us it. Which one? Because either were so many. The one that put you in solitaire. Oh, Sergeant Fogan, I only have two years. So if you want to roll, then... I'm sorry, I can't do it.

Slim Shady is an odd one right now. Oh, it was funny, though. It was pretty interesting. So they put you in the shoe for rapping. They put me in the shoe for that. Yeah. So it was actually not the song itself that got me locked. It was I wrote a letter to my oldest brother's first wife because she thought I was in prison, like, getting beat up and like it was like, you know, like Oz.

You remember that show? I never watched that. It's on the list. It's on the list. I got to watch it. You never have time to watch anything. No, I don't. I'm 24-7 busy.

I know. But yeah, she thought it was like, ah. So I was like, listen, like, it's kind of trying to make it sound like Camp Cupcake. hey, it's not the big deal. I'm fine. Like, I kind of deserve to be here. Like, with my cry over spilled milk. And I said, yeah, like, it's such a laxadaisal compound that, like, the officers call me inmate Vogan because, like, there was the song.

And I got locked for that because, like, they were officers. And they would get on, like, the loudspeaker from the tower and be, like, inmate Vogan is going to, like, EOS to her house on the hill. Like, with Sarden boat? He's like they would just say stupid shit like that all the time because it was entertaining, I guess. He was kind of like goofy and dorky and not a lot of people didn't really like him too. So I think that was what made it so funny was because I am who I am. I look like what I look like and talk like I talk.

And like I wrote a rap about following Sergeant Fogan around. So what is the shoe like from a woman's perspective? I didn't realize it was the hole So are you by yourself? Do they have bunk baits? No, you have a bunky. Okay. Is it what is it just like a small cell?

Yeah, the bunks are end to end and then there's the toilet and then the window. What are like courtesies that women use in prison? So you face the door, you know, when someone wants to change or use the restroom or take a bath because you have to bathe with a cup. Dude, they never let me out the shower.

I feel like they used to fuck with me. They'd be like, Olman, get on the door. It's like, what? You got to say, oh, Olman's on the door, no shower. The fuck. Did you have to like courtesy flush and stuff too? Yeah, that's a thing. That's a thing?

That's a thing, yeah. Okay, so how is that for a woman? What do you mean? Like, you guys just flush in between? Like, yeah, as you go, you just, same, I'm assuming the same way you guys do. How did you learn about it? Because it was weird, like I got yelled at

from my punk bait about courtesy flushing. Yeah, basically that was the same thing. It was like, so we weren't in, I was in open bay. when I first came in, I didn't have like two-man cells. So I saw other people doing that and got on really quick. I did not catch on about the bunk area. I mean, you know how I like people, don't walk through my bunk area. This is not, looks like a fucking walkway to me.

Yeah, I got cussed out a lot with that and then learning how to play spades, which is why I love to play now because I'm really good at it. I like spades. I haven't played in years, though. It's literally been almost five years now. I haven't played for a little bit of. wild. I played at the Halloween party. It was fun. Yeah. So I was like the whole acting career going and everything. I've seen you been doing like a lot of modeling. Yeah. I've done

like I think three shoots since I saw you last time. I did two commercials. I've been in like 15 different movies and like four different shows. So that's really exciting. We've been on strike for a little bit so I kind of went crazy with the Halloween stuff this year because I saw. Yeah, I saw your photos. You got like, well, how much did you spend on Halloween decorations? I don't want to say because, so listen, I joke a lot, but like, I have a lot of friends in the film community that are, like, losing their homes and, like, downsizing because we've been on strikes since March.

So unless you are working on non-sag productions, like commercials, and commercially, you might make $500 or $5,000 for, like, two hours of work. So they vary wildly. So a lot of people can survive on them. And for, like, so, like, the Super Bowl commercial that I booked, which was, like, the first job I ever booked, there was over 3,000 people that applied in only five spots. Oh, shit. That was the one where I was like, Trump grabbed the

pussy, and that's the American dream. And you got that? I did. Listen, I was so upset afterward, because I was like, I'm the girl Tourette's. This is like a non-profit PSA. This is like a Jesus commercial, which wasn't. They didn't tell us it was a Super Bowl. They didn't say anything like that. They just, you know,

hey, this is a non-profit PSA type commercial, and this is what we want you to do. So I was like mortified. I cried. Like I walked out of there. I was like, I'm going to change my hair. I'm going to change my wardrobe.

I might even try to change my name. But you actually can't do that as a felon. I paid $500 for them to tell me I can not change my first name. You know how to change your first name as a felon? I think I would have had to do it when I got married if I was going to do it. I had to try to slip it in there since I was already changing the last name, you know? Wow. Yeah.

That's fun. So do you have any fun upcoming projects coming up? Nothing that's booked yet because even though we have a tentative agreement, like some projects are rolling with the vote on it. Sag has to vote. So if it doesn't pass the vote, then we might go back to the table. Oh, back on strike? Oh, shit.

I thought everything was resolved. So projects are starting with a tentative agreement, but that it has to be like voted in because it's a union thing. So. Wow. But yes. So listen. So I think we should do next year.

year is we should do I do this Halloween thing, right? And I listen, no, I'm serious. Here we go. So we get like a lot of us out there, like, you know, 20 of us. And we do like, I don't know what to call it,

but like a gathering where we all have like many interviews with each other and like maybe we raise money for charity or something like that. Dude, I'll host it. I don't know where I'm going to be next year, wherever I end up, it's going to be big enough to host people. Well, you know, the prison TikTok community does have like these meetups every couple times a year, you know?

No idea. I had no idea. We had something at Houston and January that I went to. And then I know they did something before and they did L.A. in July, I think that they were at. I got to. But yeah. Okay. Well, I'm saying you could host something out at your castle, you know. You live in like a mansion with the three Teslas and the 10.

thousand dollars worth the Halloween and the RV $100,000 RV I forgot you have an RV So I can house like 10 people in the RV alone You can try to get me to go with this RV for months now Come to New Orleans I'll house you

I do New Orleans is on my list I'll get some seafood out there I can probably take you to set I don't know what that is like where we film set Oh okay cool so yeah you want to come out there No promises

I wanted to talk about Marie Earrington So Marie Arrington escaped from Lull. Who's Marie Arrington? She was a girl that I was in Lull with. She actually, she was sentenced and convicted for murdering her husband. She got an appellate bond because she, you know, she was on bond during an appeal because they were, I think they were getting a drop to manslaughter or something.

While she was on bond, she decided to go to the attorney's office that, the public defender's office that represented her two sons for some felony that and he got he was like 18 years old i think it was the son and the friend so i was like 18 they robbed a store no one was hurt like 60 bucks was taken he got life in prison she went up there and blew away the secretary shot her in the office killed her um or actually i don't know if it was in the office she abducted her and then then i think she shot her and ran her over with her vehicle and then they she was on the run she was on like the FBI's most wanted list for like three years and then they got her and she died at lull she died the year after i got her back. She was 80 years old.

Oh, she went on the run. No, no, no, no. So that was before. But yeah, so by the time I came in, I was in Mike dorm, which was like the lifer dorm. So I had a fight. And after my fight, they put me over there. And I was in Mike dorm for like six months behind like the three closed with all the H.O.4s. So that's what you guys called him? I don't know. It means like you can't be out of dark.

You're like a high maximum custody. We couldn't be out of dark either way. Oh, I don't know. I was minimum custody. Let me do all kind of shit. You were in a fight? I had two fights. What was that like?

So I was like midway through my sentence, right? I was working in the library and I hated this job. It was a privileged job. I kept hearing every, well, if it's a privilege, give it to somebody who wants it because I don't fucking want it. You know, I want to be outside. I want to be free. I'm not, I'm a unicorn, baby. I'm not meant to be inside the library all day, stuck in one seat, okay?

I'm meant to roam and wander. But she said something to me one day, and it pissed me off, and I got all squirrelly. I was already halfway through my sentence like, I got to do another year and a half of this shit. And the girl that I got into a fight, she was a big girl. She looked like a big old vanilla gorilla. Vigella gorilla. She was bigger than me. She was like six foot one.

She was probably like solid two four. She looked like Shrek with a wig. She was a big girl, but she was kind of like. I don't want to say this. She wasn't real aware or hip to like anything that was going on, right? Like, I don't know what she had going on upstairs, but I don't think it was a whole lot where it was way too much, right? It was one of the two.

But I got shook down. It was like my bunkies' birth, my other monkey's birthday, because, like, I slept in the middle. My buddy slept right across from me, and then the ogre slept on top. The ogre? The ogre slept on top. So you're leaving out all the good nicknames for me.

So there was this officer, Mr. Tom's. They were called him Uncle Tom, and you could kind of figure out why just from that. But he liked me. He didn't like anybody, and he would always make us sit up during count. Dude, those motherfuckers can't count at law. We'd be it count for an hour and a half, bro.

And like, if you're following the book, you know what I mean? You're supposed to technically sit on your bunk and not move. But every time Tom's would be in the dorm, no one would want to ask if we could relax. So finally I just grew some balls. I was like, Mr. Tom's. Lay down and relax one of the time to the bathroom?

And he was like, yeah. So then that became every night, Ginger, ask him. As a week as nobody else wanted to do it. So I started doing it and it became like routine. We're like, I would let everybody lay down. Well, one night we had a new officer in the dorm with Sergeant Tom. And I did it. And the officer was a dick.

He was from the main unit. and he was like, oh, so you let your inmates run your dorm? Fucking Mr. Tomp. Put me in the corner for like an hour. Oh, you were to tie up. I started peeling the paint off the wall, and he realized I was doing that, so he moved me. And then he put me by the front.

And he went to leave because we were still in count. And, you know, it was like by where the phones and stuff are when you first enter in. And he walked by, and I was like a rabid dog scratching at the window. So he's just But either way So he told me when he came back Listen, I know you're funny I know you've got like this really great personality

Sarcasm there And he's like but when there's another officer that we don't know He's like don't make me look stupid in front of my dorm I'm like all right So I went back and it was basically Hey we're not nobody do that Nobody do that the next day

this fucking dumb bitch is up on her bunk and we were already kind of like low-key beefing because she did a lot of stupid shit that brought heat so like I'm going to acknowledge it like hey

we talked about this you're still doing it like you're gonna get everybody caught up like that was before I had the cigarette hustle I had like a sewing hustle and I did a lot of creative stuff I drew art and cut up state property and make art on it and mail it home

and almost always made it too which was great. But he came in the dorm. He was not in a good mood. And he, you know, went to leave without relaxing us. And she had said before, hey, can I do it? Can I say it? No.

No, that's a me thing, baby. I don't think it's going to work for you. She says it anyway. And he looks over because she's in my bunk area. So he thinks I said it. So now he's mad. He's putting on gloves. You know, I already know what time it is.

He shook my shit down so bad. I lost so much stuff. I probably lost $200 with the contraband and was really lucky he didn't take me to confinement. I ended up getting a lot of it back because I had a friend that worked on grounds and they watched where he put it. So as soon as he walked away, they went and retrieved it for me. But it was more of like, like you're a dumb motherfucker girl. Like I just told you don't do that. I told you he said he didn't like that and you did it anyway.

And then like the next day, she had said something and I was kind of like trying to write it off because I knew I was feeling squirly. and then the next day we had a holiday and the officer that I wrote that song about was actually our sergeant during the day. It was like Memorial Day or something and I woke up in a shitty mood and I told my bunky, it's like, dude, if she says anything a day I'm gonna spark this fucking girl

and like we go into count and I don't know what she did but I was like, you're a dumb motherfucker you know that and she's who, who me? Yeah, hey, hey everybody in the dorm raise your hand if you think she's a dumb motherfucker and people are like, don't do it, don't do it. All the hands go up, and now she's embarrassed, and I'm just pissed, you know, like wanting to vent.

And she's like, oh, you want to fight about it? We can go to the bathroom. Oh, baby, we can do it right here in the middle of count. We do not have to leave anywhere. She basically walked towards me. I walked towards her. She took a swing at me. I hit her in the face until she was up against the wall.

She slid down the wall. She kicked me in my chest, which really fucking made me mad. So I stood up on the bunk and kicked her in the face. And then right around that time, the sergeant went. And I was like, we look fucking stupid. Like, people, people were shocked because, like, all the people up front of the door were like, oh, snap, they're fighting. Like, where did that come from? Because a lot of times you hear with the women, you hear the mouth.

The men, you guys are smart. You guys slide in, slide out. You know what I mean? But the women, they like to do all this rah-rah shit. And because I had never busted a grape because I never needed to, it surprised people. And then it was a running, don't give Ginger a call out anywhere because she's going to meet you. And it kind of bothered me because, like, it was so out of character for me

and it fucked my day up so bad to beat the shit out of another human beings. She had two black eyes. Like, she got a lay in. She told her she had a seizure off her top bunk. And they gave her a bottom bunk fast. And then the next day, I started to really lose it and fucking bucked on my job.

They were calling me from the tower. Like, Olin, report to the library. Nope. Not doing it. Not doing it. And then that officer on grounds pulled me to come work for him on grounds and like used it as an excuse to hang out with me all day

which was fucking weird You're literally running this prison, Ginger. I told you, you're the female prison shock calling. Because it doesn't work like I'm not running other people. I'm just, you're not running me. How about that? Nobody was running me. The concept of general.

When you're beating people up, you got power over the guards? I didn't have a choice. Like I had to do something. She gave me a call out. I didn't give her one baby. She wrote that check all on her own. She signed up for that. That's great.

The other fight girl owed me $300 for cigarettes. And I knew that was coming. Everybody told her, hey, so when they locked my accounts, I couldn't check my money. And because I had so much money in my account, right? Like when you go to scan your tag at commissary, it only shows you what you can spend that week. So if I have $10,000 in my account, but I have a maximum spend of $100, and I already spent 20 that week, my account's going to read 80. I couldn't spend any money at all. So every week it said 100.

So she had this racket where she would get on the phone and got these like Western Union numbers that were either old or something. But I had someone that was checking the numbers at first. Towards the end, I know she didn't check them. And that's what fucked me up. And that's why her tab got so high. And they were calling my name to move to the main unit, because this is after I got out of confinement

and the warden had asked me where I wanted to go and I was like, put me somewhere easy I want to get off the annex I want to get away from the heat so I got put in Delta dorm with the pregnant girls but as they were calling my name to be moved to like pack my bunk up and move I'm in the bathroom beating the shit out of this girl

because she kept lying like what killed me killed me in was she could have come to me and be like hey I fucked up there's no money coming I don't I don't know what to do but like I'll wash your laundry I'll sweep around your bunk. I let her work that shit off free

because it was never about the money. Oh, you think I'm not crazy. You think I'm not going to do shit. That's real cute, girl. Yeah, she was fucked up and nobody fucked with her after that. She had a really lonely time until they shipped her after that. That's crazy. Yeah.

You'd live some life, Ginger. You don't know the half of it, buddy. Thanks for coming on the show again, Ginger. It was a pleasure hearing some of the prison war stories from a female prison shot caller. I hate you.