Locked In with Ian Bick - Inside the Violent Gang Life That Led Me to Years in Prison | Justin Kline

Episode Date: May 28, 2025

Justin Kline describes the violent lifestyle that led him to prison, the dangers inside, and how he eventually got out. #TrueCrime #JusticeSystem #CrimeAndPunishment #SurvivorStory #LawEnforcement #Redemption #HardTime #lifelessons Connect with Justin Kline: Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/19szKRyWHt/?mibextid=wwXIfr Youtube: https://www.youtube.comjustafelon100/ Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://convictclothing.net/collections/convict-clothing-x-ian-bick Timestamps: 00:00:00 Overcoming Adversity and Inspiring Change 00:05:10 Growing Up in a Large Family in Philadelphia Suburbs 00:10:32 Transition from School Days to Street Life 00:15:42 Reflecting on Personal Transformation 00:21:14 Life Inside Juvenile Detention: Abuse and Impact 00:26:19 Life After the Streets: A Personal Journey 00:31:30 Lessons from Prison Experience 00:36:21 Prison Politics and the Struggle for Respect 00:41:13 Survival and Conflict in Prison 00:46:10 Navigating Prison Challenges and Personal Growth 00:51:10 Turning Point: Life After Prison 00:56:34 A Violent Encounter and Its Aftermath 01:01:27 Overcoming Addiction and Making Amends 01:06:29 Reflections on Past Choices and Mindset 01:11:39 Turning Points: Overcoming Doubts and Strengthening Relationships Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Bad advice? You talking to me? Kayak, got that right. Justin, welcome to Lockton, man. You came from Philly today, right? Pennsylvania. Outside of Philly, yeah. Okay. Awesome. Well, thanks for making in the snow, man. Thanks for having me, yeah. I wasn't going to let anything stop me from coming. You a ass if I wanted to reschedule. No, fuck that. Excuse my language. We're going, bro. Hey, I had to offer it, though. I don't want anyone to get really driving the snow. I would have walked here from Philly. But it didn't turn out to be that bad, the snow. Did you guys get a lot out there?

Nah, slippery. It was like, sleet raining when we left. So we're getting soaked. And I'm like, man, I want to mess up my hat or this or that. I'm like, got to be on camera, you know. Yeah, well, thank you for coming. Shout out to your family that's watching this episode, you know, that made the trip with you to be here. And you're fresh out, man. You got out in November. November, yeah.

You got a good P.L. letting you travel. Mine was not letting me travel that quick. Yeah, he works with people with mental health disorders, which I struggle with. And so he's like very accommodating. I've been doing what's right. I've been, you know, reporting everything. So, you know, he was cool with me. I told him like, this is very important to me because I have a positive message at the end

of all the adversity to get out there. And I need to get it out there. And this is what's going to help me do it. So, yeah, I have a lot of guys that come from Pennsylvania. Yeah, Pennsylvania and New Jersey, Massachusetts, New York, like the tri-state area. Pennsylvania guys always have the best stories in Massachusetts. Really? What jail stories or what? Just everything. I don't know. I guess because there's like those, it's very drug, very addiction fueled in Pennsylvania, too, I think out of all those.

Bad, high murder rate, chilly. It's definitely bad. I've had some prison guards. I was talking to your step. Dad? My mom's boyfriend. Okay. Yeah.

About some of the guards that used to work there at Uniford or whatever the name of the place is. Graterford. Greatford. Yeah. So I had some guards there. You were there? Oh.

I was some jail. So you might know him, Smitty. Was he working a visit, a visit room intake? I don't know. He worked just in the jail in general. That was my, there wasn't my home jail, but you come through there. You go there on rent, like when you're going for court and all that. So I've been there.

I've had fun there. I think he worked in the kitchen, too, at one point. His last gig there. I might not know. He retired, I think, at 2020. Okay. Or 2019. But he was there for like 15 years, I think.

He did it. The best jail, PA. Really? His best jail, PA. Now, before we get started more in death into this, I want you to plug your podcast, everything you got going on now to promote that. Just a felon, Maine.

I'm taking what I've learned from prison, the adversity that I overcame in the mindset that I was able to adapt, struggling through years of prison. And I'm trying to bring them teachings to the masses, specifically the children, because I was a traumatized kid and I see where that led to my criminal thinking, my criminal mentality and the need to be accepted and violence was my way of being accepted. So I think I can

save children like years of of, of, of hardship that are going through traumatic situations, bullying and this and that from having to go through what I went through. You know what I mean? So that's my passion. I'm going to give the gray. I'm going to give the stories, but I want a positive outtake from it all because I was that traumatized kid. And people should care about this issue because, because children's, mental health is not taking serious. And these kids are going through some shit, bro. They're hurting themselves.

They're killing because they have no confidence. They're bullied. That's my message. And that's what I'm coming with. I love that, man. And we'll have the links to everything in the description of this episode for people to check out. Like and subscribe. Definitely.

You know what? I give you credit, man. It takes a lot for people to get something going. So, you know, recently home from prison. I've planned it with my friend Vaughan, a childhood friend, very supportive. He helped me do it. He's like, man, you got to. mess it even when I didn't believe in myself. And this is the first time I came out with this,

this mentality. It's just like the greatest high ever. It's like I can accomplish anything. I don't have nothing right now. Live with my mother with no car. Nothing. I have $70 in my cash yet. Most of it I borrowed. You know what I mean? But I'm going to make it because I don't have a choice. I don't have a choice anymore. I'm behind on life. I have no choice but to get it. I'm going get it. And that's it. And when you have that feeling that you can take on the world and you're able to peel apart the layers of your mentality and apply it to everyday life, it's like nothing can stop you. Nothing. Yeah.

And I mean, we've all been there, you know? So don't ever feel discouraged because, you know, where you're sitting now, what I have now, I was where you were, you know, just a few years ago when I got out and I had to work for four years. Right. You're ahead of me in a sense because I was negative with restitution and I worked at a nine to five and I had no vision. You at least have a vision for a business and what you want to do and a plan to get there. really have any of that. And, you know, when I started this, I was driving Uber. I had an

only fans. I was hustling, you know. I was delivered DoorDash. You got a business, mindset. You ran a nightclub. You just applied it differently. People can learn from this. You got people in the streets of Phillyenolian dollar blocks, like professional CEOs of billion dollar companies. They apply that to something positive. They're going to be great. Look what you accomplished with your business mindset. When you applied it to something, it's, it's, It's same game, different product. You know what I mean? Hard work goes a long way, man.

Yeah, so that's what I'm preaching, man. I'm trying. I'm telling people now because everybody sees the success stories, right? But they rarely see their journey. I'm that journey. Watch me. Where do you grow up? West Country Hocken, suburbs of Philadelphia, small town, you know. So, yeah.

Who do you grow up with? Seven kids, both of my parents, seven of us, kind of a small household. We had enough, but, you know, not too many extras. We were held down. And that caused a lot of issues in school because at school we went to. People had a little bit more money, so you get picked on. You're looked at as like, you know, the peons and, you know, and that started a whole thing.

And, you know, but, yeah. So there were seven kids or just five plus your parents? Seven kids. And then my parents, yeah, one house, one bathroom. Five of us slept in one room. My two sisters slept in a room upstairs near my parents. and yeah. All the same mom and dad?

All the same mom and dad, yeah. And what did your parents do for work? My dad did construction. My mom had a few jobs here and there and was a hell of a freaking mother. She did whatever was necessary. Working, also taking care of house. And my mother's like an amazing woman.

That's how a woman should be, but it's like impossible to be like that anymore. It's like I don't know how you do that. I admire the women because of them struggling. I see why I have female friends that are holding down households with even just a couple kids and just blows my mind. how much work they do just to come in the house before you can sit down.

I'm thinking you could just come in and sit down. I come in over and saying, you're doing this and that, feeding the kids and dog, da-da-da-da. That's crazy. My mom did that with seven kids. You know what I mean? I can't say my father was always that supportive because he, bipolar back and forth. And that sets you up to have your own issues. And, you know, mom's holding it down, though.

And, you know, that was inspiration to me. I think it shaped a lot of the ways, a lot of my characteristics to this day. What was the age group with your siblings? My brother's a year older to me is Kenny, there's me, Kenny's like a year older, Shane's a couple years younger Everybody's kind of close We're at like

30 to 38 right now So like eight year differential That's not bad that you guys are all kind of close in age Yeah, yeah, we're all close now pretty much And a few family disputes and all that But you know we're all like we're close man What past did they end up taking? Did they end up in prison too?

Man, so they started all off a couple of them doing wrong, but I think when I went for my first state bid when I was 18, like, they all got their shit straight. So if that alone was the only positive outcome of me going to prison, that's okay. Because I'm proud of all my brothers and sisters. Like, I aspire to be like them in some sort of way. You know, I'm trying to achieve the world. But however, what they're doing is so admirable. Like, you came from where I came from. We came from the same place. We've experienced some of the same things, a little different childhoods with, with, with, maybe a acceptability in society in school, you know, school settings, but they took a different

path, man, I'm proud of them. Like I'm proud of it. Look, I'm like, you got a house, you got a car, you got a family. That's the American dream. That's the American dream. When you're in prison, you know, that's what you dream about. It's just being able to have the basics, a family, a house, you know, stuff like that. Like, that's like to me, it's like, and sometimes it seems so far away, but it's, you know, obviously it's in reach. They did it. I can do that. I can do more. I could do, you know. Did you ever wonder why you? Like when you're sitting in prison, they're all, you know, having success and everything,

do you ever realize or think about why your path went the way it did? Yeah. Like, I've overthought and analyzed and assessed and addressed my thinking. But going up to prison up until like this last time, even most of this bit, it was always like it was somebody else's fault. When you think like, why me, you're blaming your adversity on something you have no control over. When you realize that it's really internal that you have some type of contribution or whatever the fuck you're doing, you know,

that's when you can start making changes that are going to benefit you in your, and that's where I just started getting to. So, you know, yes, I've had that for like my whole bit, like, why me, I don't deserve this. I was going to college. I was working full time. Why do I got to go back to jail?

You broke somebody's face. I broke somebody's face, man. You can't, you can't expect and not go to jail don't care what you're doing. You broke somebody's, you know, and this is a violate, and it got me sent back, but I'm still blaming it on other people. I hit that, man.

I did that, you know, the worst stuff that I did, you know, to go to prison. And so I just started recently taking accountability, man. And that's helped me a lot. How would people describe you as a kid or in middle school, high school? Loyal. I had a lot of heart. I didn't fit in. I was probably a little weird. I think we evolved in a little weird.

Yeah. So I was just trying to fit in, man. And I feel like the first time I felt accepted was when I actually hurt somebody in the school. and that set the precedence that violence was okay in my mind because that's your way to acceptability. Then you hit the streets and you take that with you and you know and that's kind of where that led and I realized that. But it was because of how I was looked at or how I thought I was looked. I was chasing my identity like I was trying to find it anywhere I could when I was younger. And it took violence for me to find that incorrect mentality, personality at the time. Do you feel like you had a lot of anger in you as a kid?

Yeah, well, I try not to encourage that. Yeah, man. Yeah, I was out because I was, I was, like I said, I was, like I said, it was, food, I was picked on, and I couldn't do anything. I was soft, man. You know, I was soft. And for years, I thought about seeing these kids now. Like, yeah, look at me now, because I've run into him.

I had, uh, not to get too good. I'm not glorifying my pace, but I called a case for a stabbing, right? Bad one. I seen somebody in county used to be in school with. This dude was like this to me in, in, uh, in school. But then we, you know, now we're growing up. We're in county. He read the newspaper articles about my case.

And he's like this to me. I'm like this. He's like, hey, he's like, what we call, I don't want to say the word dick riding, but it's like you're, You're dick ride. Like you're like, like you're being Joe. It's a Philly slang.

I don't know if people understand. You're like you being overly. You know what I mean? Because you know that now you know that I'm somebody or I got something in me or, you know, somebody. And it's just like I had a little slight satisfaction because this is somebody. Oh,

you should have hung out with us when we were kids. That's what he said. We should hung out. No, I didn't get along with you guys because I was weird. But now you see that I'm, you know, who I am now and now they want to be your friend.

Now they want to be cool because they fear you. What's something you wish you directed your anger towards back then, looking back on it now. Some type of passion, like fitness, I love fitness now. That's what I study upstate. Hours, hours, hours, referencing, cross-reference. I wish it was that. But I'm not made it to pay if I took because it made me who I am to the character

that developed far exceeds anything that would have developed if I had never went to prison. You know what I mean? But if I had somebody that knows what I know now to instill some type of passion and play off of that pain, turn your pain into passion, I have a YouTube video off of that, turn pain into passion, then it would have set me on a whole different course. And that's what I'm trying to bring to the youth, turn that pain into some type of passion. Give them something to be passionate about. Fitness is a major one.

And it leaves a social acceptability as well, which is important as a child. You know what I mean? Did you play sports or have any, you know, hobbies or anything in high school? Yeah, well, not for school, but for like, what does that call? Like just after school. Yeah, yeah. Football, baseball. I did do wrestling one year for school.

I tried out for baseball, but then when I made it, I, you know, I started smoking weed in, so I was lazy. I'm like, man, I'm not doing that. I made the team. I'm like, yeah, I don't want to. I just wanted to be in the streets. I'm carrying guns and, you know, like I'm doing all this crazy stuff that, you know, that's what I wanted to do at that time. I just wanted to live in the streets because that was cool to me. That's what I was good at hurting people. I was good at hurting people. So you do what you're good at, unfortunately. What was your first entryway into the street life? How old were you? What happened? fuck if I know. Man, first instant, I've done so much stuff, man. I honestly do not know. Maybe maybe the smoking weed, you know, carrying my first gun, I think, was 15, maybe 14, but which is kind of a

late age around my area. You know what I mean? Not my direct area, but like Philly. And you're from the suburbs, but you're putting yourself in the hood and you have friends from there just because of whatever glorification exists in your mind for that setting. And then obviously if you're in there, you know, you've got the things that come along with, the shootings and the guns and violence and worse, you know, so. Why do you think you needed a gun at that age? I don't know if I needed it. I just, can I say this?

I was just ready to, oh, man, I don't want to use these. When I was younger, I just, I was ready to kill, man, on demand because I was hurt so bad. I was willing to take it to any extent necessary or even when it wasn't necessary just to prove a point, just to prove a point. there was an incident that I can't speak on too much. I had a salt off shotgun, right? And I used to, so I used to have a hoodie, right? And I have a duffel bag.

And I had it unzipped and I had the salt off in that bag. And then we had back in Philly area, the Woolwiches. The Woolwiches were with the fur hat, the fur around the hood. And then I put that over. And I'd always carry my shotgun, man. And there's so many close calls I had with this before I called my first bit. I'm so lucky. Some could have landed you there forever.

You know what I mean? That just, I happen to get locked up. And then another situation, I almost robbed some undercovers that were on the block because they didn't look right because they're white. And the blocks, nobody's white on the block. And they ended up raiding a house down the street. I was wrong. I came. Oh, my God.

I'm so glad I didn't, man. Oh, you almost forgot the gun on me? Yes. I come down on the block, right? So we had an incident with somebody. I had words with somebody around the block. They go and tell people, I'm coming to the block with guns or whatever. People knew me to be crazy back then.

But this wasn't even a true fact. So when I heard that, like, yo, they're waiting for you down here. don't come down. I'm like, what? Sault off. Go down to the block. The blocks cleared off by then. And I've seen these two white guys sitting on the, I mean, I'm white, but there's no white people in this specific couple blocks. And I just seen them sitting there and I'm looking like, fucking I'm a robin. And I'm like, wait, wait, wait, no. Something told me no. I walked away half hour later. I found that they raided the house down the street. So I was very fortunate. I was very fortunate. Actually, when I went to state hospital, I think for the first time I had that salt.

off in my room and my dad happened to go in and grab it fortunately because when I got out of the out of the state hospital my P.O. raided the room with some so that would have been extra time I did on my first bid, which was, you know, long enough five years, but long enough still. Did your parents know that, you know, a change in behavior? Did your family, did your siblings, did they witness a change of behavior in you young and try to, you know, nip in the butt or get you some help? I think so. I mean, my mom used to pat-search me on the way out of the house. So I'd have to get my gun to my one brother that I trust her and my one sister. I won't name who you guys know who you are. Thank you for holding me down, but you encourage negative

behavior. You should feel like shit. No, don't. You're my riders. I love you guys. But so they would have to, they would throw it. So I go my mom pastures me, all right, do it. Do you. Throw a gun out real quick. Put it in. For all daylight suburbs, man. It's not the hood. Like we're in a suburbs, man. I go carry my gun and think I'm cool and then go do whatever I was doing. And well, I can't speak on it. Yeah, but, well, I can say no dates, but I had to go back one time, yo, throw it in the river, throw it in the river, you know, but, yeah, yeah, it's, I mean, it's funny now because it's like, I can't believe, like, you know, but that's, that's the mindset I was in, man. Yeah, you can't believe you're that type of person looking back on it.

I mean, it made me who I am today, so, like, you know, you have regrets, of course, people that, I can't say have hurt anybody innocent one time by accident, but that was from, like, PTSD, and that was my latest case. but nobody was innocent, man. I wasn't out there victimizing people. These were people that were victimizing people. I was victimizing victimizers. So I have trouble regretting that.

That doesn't justify my actions. However, they're not innocent, man. You know, they got what they got for doing what they're doing, you know, and they're hurting people too or we're hurting people. That's, you know. Were you going to school regularly? Were you taking that seriously? What was high school like?

Yeah, I mean, I did good. So we grew up in Catholic school up until like fifth grade And we went to public and that's like I said We didn't fit in we didn't have the nice clothes Like our jeans were My mom would cut like jeans and she would cut them in the shorts Because we couldn't always have for seven kids There's a lot of people to feed you know to put new clothes

You know and so that started a lot of shit coming from there But as far as like so that made it hard And then I'm not getting fitting in so trying to pay attention in class And fall they just go too quick and I'll get frustrated like fuck it But then when I started smoking weed originally I just go to class and go to sleep, started getting Fs, went to alternative programs, stepped my grades up, but it kept you at a certain level of education. I wasn't able to advance like I would have otherwise. And then alternative schools only, then I got kicked out and then went to this

school and got kicked out and, you know, and then went to Glenn Mills, juvenile, but them alternative schools don't teach you that advanced because most of the students are behind. USAA knows dynamic duos can save the day, like superheroes and sidekicks or auto and home insurance. With USAA, you can bundle your auto and home and save up to 10%. Tap the banner to learn more and get a quote at usaa.com slash bundle. Restrictions apply. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task,

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Sign up for your $1 per month trial at Shopify.com slash special offer. I'm finding learning. What was your career aspirations? What do you want to be when you grew up? When I was a kid. Yeah, or in high school or if you were even thinking about that. I'm not really sure.

I didn't really have to. Culinary arts was part of one. And then that was a big one for a while. Then when I went to jail, turned into personal training fitness. I got good at it when I got knowledgeable. You know, and I was like, damn, this is how I can help people and build a career. It's great.

You know, so that's what my passion developed into. And that's what my aspirations. I say were because I have a different direction. I'm kind of trying to take. I will use that, you know, I'll definitely implement it. But there's, I think there's a better way I can make a reach and help people. Tell us about your first case. First time you ever got arrested.

All right. So first case, man. trying to think without incriminating anybody because what they thought they got, this was not the actual case. The case they gave me was attempted burglary, right? Somebody had told him my cousin and they were on the surveillance camera

you could tell her tattoos. I went to go take care of this person. Long story short, I was on Zanis, so I'm not really functional. I remember one of my siblings said, you don't go do a mission when you're on Zanis, man. right apartment building wrong apartment i don't remember if i tried getting in or not they thought it was attempted burglary it was going to be worse you know what i mean i got locked up they gave me like

this thing where you can ard you get out you'll get away from your record just don't catch another case uh not even a month later i catch an assault with my brother my cousin uh big dude's like seven foot i think my brother knocked him out with the first hit but we we hurt this dude bid uh he was he was medevacked out life support i believe and all that and then because i had that case on top of the other one, I went upstate for that. So it was kind of cut by on two to four years. I called a case in jail later on, and I'm doing five years maxing everything out.

But my brother and my cousin got away with like probation. But because I had that on top of that, they sent me upstate for it. And that was the juvenile place. Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot about that. Okay, so that wasn't my first case. Juvenile was, we broke into a bar at night.

Me and someone else, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, I can't speak on because I don't think they, but me and somebody else, I took my mask off. I was on camera. I bit my part and, you know, and then I did Glenn Mills 10 months, I think. Bad place, man. Why break into a bar? What was the logic behind that?

So the person I was with, they're just like, bro, this bar, I checked it. The doors open, bro. We could just go get some free alcohol. I'm a kid. I'm like, all right, why not? I can't go buy it. Let's go take it, man. Donors were cool to because I don't think they made me pay for the restitution for

like broken window or whatever. And, yeah, free alcohol. Why not? Like, you're a kid. You know what I mean? So did those 10 months in that juvenile detention center kind of make you worse than what you were change you affect your thinking in a negative way? Yeah, because they were oppressing us. They were beating the fuck out of us, man.

I have to use that word because they were beating the shit out of people. I got jumped by staff, well, beat up by staff three days in for, I was being a wise ass, but like they whipped my ass like a groaning me and stopped me out and all. There was this dude there, right, that went truant. That means he left, right? So, so rumors are circulate. Oh, no, that wasn't the case. This other dude, he told his caseworker from outside Glenn Mills that, you know, what's going on.

They're beating us, right? So we heard stories about what they did this dude as retaliation for that. They're like, yo, his head's out to here and there. And you're like, you know, of course they're exaggerating because nobody's face can be out to here, here. When I seen this kid, he looked like the elephant, man. His face was out to hear. That stories about that place are real, man.

And I have a lot of anger and resentment against them people because they oppressed us. They're kids. So of course it made me hate authority figures more. It made me more violent and maybe just want to like screw everybody. Like I was on, it kind of sent me on a rampage. You know what I mean? And then you have the little bit of, oh, I was locked up now. So you're a little bit cool.

You know what I mean? So you're struggling with that on top of it along with all the mental health symptoms and issues that they just exasperated or induced into your mind. You know what I mean? So, yeah, man, it was the worst thing that could have probably happened to me. Why didn't you get, like, probation or some type of rehabilitation program for that first charge? I don't know. I don't know.

I mean, 10 months seems a little bit extreme for a teenager that just broke into a place. Yeah, I never thought it. Nobody was there. It was at night. So I don't think that's not considered. It might have been considered. They have certain rules with burglaries, whether it's considered violent or not. I don't know if that might have been because I think that gave me my extra strike on the refelt later on in my.

my criminal career, but I don't know. I never thought of that. I don't know. When you get out of juvenile detention, do they put you right back in high school? Or are you expelled from it? So I graduated from there. I actually got my... So this is like your 17?

18. 18. And that was your very first charge. Yeah. I had an assault before that, but I think I dropped or something like that. Like a high school fight? Yeah, like punching something to school. Something like that.

I don't remember it. But yeah, that was my actual first. I don't think that one's on my record. This one was, you know, was. So you graduated. from there right from the juvenile detention. Yeah, and then left like a couple weeks after, like I graduated right before.

Besides them, whooping kids' asses and all that crazy shit, it was a good place, food, learning, you know, education, sports and all. So it looks like picturesque, but it's like, it's dark. Were you hanging around like a bad group of people? Yeah, I mean, my friends are with me today. They were a little bit of streets, not as much as I was, but they were more positive, but they were still, you know, on the streets. We still handle stuff.

We had to handle. We're still doing certain stuff. There's certain, I don't know if it was considered a riot. We had little stuff on the street, you know, but separate from them, like my core group of friends, which, like I said, are still here. And I love all of them for being there, the ones that are. Yeah, I have my separate group because that's what you're doing stuff. You see people that are into what you're into or into what you're trying to get into.

And you, you know, they're doing all the cool stuff, the shootings and this and that and drop all crazy stuff and you just want to be there like yeah i can do this like because this is how you can contribute yourself when you're a child or i was a child i wasn't able to contribute myself so i see where all this comes into play you know what i mean and like i said that's why i constantly think about because you got to take your thinking back to that childhood to know why you think today like you do addressing it the issues at the core the root of the problem so you get out what's your mindset are you trying to find a job yeah that first time from juvenile detention uh no i was in the streets. Yeah, I thought you'd met first time I was yeah, no, no, I was, I didn't care. I was right

to it, man. My, my oldest brother had just got in the streets while I was there. He wasn't before then. He got his self right on my first state bid. But my first, the only juvenile bid I did, my first actual bid, that's when, like, I come home and now he's doing all this. He's selling drugs. He's in the streets. He's, you know, carrying guns now. Like, like, I'm like, all right, let's let's go do it, man. And, you know, that led to whatever. And you're living at home at that point? Yeah. I've never lived on my own yet. I've always been in jail. It's embarrassing, but I have to live my reality, man. I have yet to live on my own except when I had a single cell up state Z code, you know, and that's when I only lived. I haven't done it by myself. I don't know how yet. I'm learning. How much time passed between you getting out from juvenile detention for you catching your first, you know, adult charge? Two weeks. Two weeks. That's all it was? Two weeks, man. Instantly. Ready to, I mean, I could say because it didn't happen. I was charged. I was charged. I was ready to take somebody's life over nothing, over nothing, nothing.

They had nothing to do with me, telling on somebody that has told on other people. You know what I mean? Like, and I didn't realize at the time, but it's family. Everybody says my loyalty, like, because it was misplaced. It was just like, if it was family, I'm riding for him. I didn't care. I was willing to go to any. I don't even know if he knows that that was my intention to go there.

And when he told me, I went there, went two days, I staked it out, got chased off by some ladies one time. They probably know what I was doing the second time. Somebody called the cops and, and bam, I was arrested. And they just thought I was just trying to break in. What I'm going to say? No, I'm here to take something. No, I can't, you know what I mean? Yeah, I'm not going to say that.

No, whatever. Like, no, I didn't do it. And did they catch you with a gun? No, I just had a knife on me. That's my, my, uh. Your go too. Yeah, it was. But there wasn't as many cameras back then.

Now there's always cameras. But fortunately, I'm not in the street life anymore. What year was this? 2005. Because I got down 2005, 2005, 2005, 2005, went upstate in 2006, but I was in and out of county. And this guy had nothing to do with you. It was just someone else that... He was on camera.

He was a CI, so his video footage was his tattoos and that's hell. But he wasn't jamming you up or anything. No, he's jamming my cousin up and I went to take care of it myself, unprompted. That's kind of how it was, man. So your cousin was in the streets too? Yeah, yeah, to a degree. Yeah, not like I was. He's a little more, you know, on the bullshit as far as, like, getting high and all that.

And I was more on the shit on the other end, you know. selling certain drugs, but mostly just violence. I was more violent. It was never really a drug dealer. Just done it periodically. It was violence was my thing. Do you feel like you had something to prove to someone? Yeah, the world.

Yeah. Yeah. And I carried that thing in the day. Just like I said, a more positive mirror. Yeah, because I never fit in growing up. And I didn't realize that maybe I did then,

but it was just like I always had to prove myself. Like, no, I'm not that soft kid with no, you know, from childhood. I'm not him no more. I'm not that kid that you're going to, bully. I'm not that kid you're going to push around and how do you do that? You, you take control, you know, um, you become the aggressor and that's where I was at. How did your parents react to getting jammed up that quickly after just getting out? I mean, they probably thought it was regular.

I don't know. Uh, my dad tended to always think everything was like the system's fault. And I did for, for a period as well, but I don't know if it was that, you know, it was just like, obviously my mother was upset with me with that because she came up, the police told her to juvenile, told her to come to the station with her and they showed me the video of me and I denied it and then and it was like all right yes because it was clear I took my man so I'm like fuck and she's just like she might smack me or something or something like that like you know kick your ass something you know I know she's disappointed but when I actually went I know everybody was like crying you know because that's hard every time I went you know pretty much and you know to me it was just it ended up becoming normal

were your parents together or did they get a divorce at some point uh they were together they've um there was some separation at time uh My mother didn't live under the best conditions with my father, we'll say, without, you know, he's pissed now. So a lot of things that I'm not proud of for him as my father. You know what I mean? So, but my mother was struggling to, to hold us down. She stayed for us where I think she would have left long before that. And that takes a lot of strength, man.

But women do not stay in abusive relationships. Just leave. Do whatever you need to. Leave. Don't, don't do it. It's going to be worse for the children. It's going to be worse for the children. my mom did what she thought was best

and I'm glad everything happened like it did but it's hard especially when your kids are like no you know they don't want you going with nobody else and I told her out you know I support you you want to go with someone and we had that talk when he was still alive and you know what I mean and not all my brothers and sisters felt that way like no I want her to stay with you know she dealt with some shit man

that's not cool and so they were separate but they were together and you know how that goes with with the relationship so technically they're together but kind of not and you know Do you think that had a big effect on your mentality, the anger? Yeah, yeah. You didn't know what kind of day you're going to get with my father.

You didn't know if he's going to beat us. Although I got it the least out of everybody, I think I was his favorite. But, you know, we still got it. There was still times he hit us with the bat and the legs, not full throttle, but, you know, a nice little beat our ass for nothing or, you know, or just flip. If he beat us, her mom hugged us and then he would beat us worse because she was, what's that called coddling or whatever?

It's called nurturing us. And I think as a man, I grew up to seek that nurturing in women. You just don't find nobody ever adds up to your mother, man, because it was another. But we were kind of deprived of not because of my mother. She always wanted to give it to us. But my father felt some type of way because he was just a jealous person, whether her attention was to us or to anything besides him. You know? And 100% that shaped a lot of my thinking.

So do you feel like your violent tendencies came directly from your dad? I mean, he had violent outbursts, not directly, but it played a part. That, and like I said, the bullying from childhood, I think was a lot, and just anger. It's because you don't know how to express yourself, man, what are you going to do? You're a kid. You don't know any better. You're growing up with anger, so you're holding everything in. You don't know how to let it out. And when you finally do, when it's with these or with not, you know, that's where all the extra shit comes in. What about addiction? Did you struggle with that all yourself? Not in my earlier years. I don't like to talk about this before I went to prison my last time.

It is a part of my life now. I had about a year, or less than a year, but about up to a year of, struggling with addiction. Prison helped me from that. And, you know, a lot of bullshit came from that because it fucks you're thinking up. But you're seeking, like, you have so much hurt and pain from prison. Like, you're seeking to make up for that

in the most, you know, extreme way because you're deprived all these years. People are grown up now. They're not out there fucking partying. I'm out there coming from prison trying to make up for lost time. And that ended up being the route I took. And, you know, it's...

Like I said, there's a lot of regrets for that but I can't I can't I I don't wish to take back anything I've been through me because it made me who I gave me a broader just understanding and and it just it just opened my mind up to like you know it just gave me a whole bunch of insight into myself as a person it's like I said you can't address the behavior you got to address the thinking behind a bear what is positive or negative you do that you'll take over the fucking world man you know what I mean tell us about your first person sentence after you got caught, you said you did some time in County and then you made it to prison. So like I said, I got two to four. They said boot came eligible. You'd be on six months. Long story short, I get into all the shit. I catch a case with, I'm upstate a month man.

Got my face cut. Well, yeah, I was upstate a month and camp. I came from grades for three weeks. One week in Camp Hill. I ended up getting into some shit. It was like, it was gang related. Another gang member. I thought I checked him and all that and it's like, uh, it doesn't work like down in prison. Was it, you know, I'm turning

my back to him like on some cocky shit. Like, yeah, you're nobody end up coming. It was like an inch from my, uh, inch from, that's a scar right? Yeah, that's the scar. And what did you do? Come up behind you? Yeah, is he just come up real quick and he he tried running down with a cop. So I'm waiting patiently. I don't want to draw and go right to the hole, right? So I'm like, damn, I didn't know he cut me originally. So he's down there near the cops. I'm waiting from to come back up the stairs. He got me on the way up the stairs. I'm like this. I'm like, damn, thank you got me. And I touch it again. When you're cut, you're not supposed to touch it. I didn't know at the time. I'm fresh upstate who's cutting each other's

faces on the street. You know what I mean? So it's all it's all guns and you know. Why can't you touch it? Well, when you touch it, it spreads it open. That's when it bust. So if somebody can get cut, it won't even look like. That's why usually upstate, like if they arrange a hit, one person cuts, the next person comes up and hits them to split it because you want to make a scene. You want people to see the blood. It's very messy. It's not that it hurts. You don't even feel it. You know what I mean? Another time I got cut across here, must have hit it with the wrong. It was a ride up my other jail. We can get into that. If you were... Was he aiming for your neck and missed? I don't know. I dip back a little bit.

I mean, you know, they're known for cutting faces that specific gang, so I don't know, but it was close, man. I did back a little bit and it got me right on the you know, got me right on the edge of my chin, so. When you get caught like that, do you feel like you're going to die? Nah, no, it was just like I was pissed like this motherfucker.

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turns where comedy ensues watch the four seasons may 28th only on netflix just and i just went on him and you know and then we both got grabbed now i'm in i'm in handcuffs they put a pillowcase here and just my face is just leaking when i first came on the block dudes were like you know i'm spitting certain stuff like claiming whatever I was claiming at the time and all that. And he was like, yo, don't do that. They sent the last guy out here

and da-da-da-da. Man, fuck that. I'm talking shit, man. I'm cocky. I'm coming up as a white guy. I'm not from Philly. I'm not from Philly. So I'm not going up there

like certain people from North Philly. They're going to go up there are going to know 10 dudes from the rip. They have support. They have commas. I'm coming up by myself. I'm the minority now. You know what I mean?

So you don't have anybody. You have to prove a point. You have to make a point. Either you're victimizing or you're a victim. And, you know, I guess on that time, I was more close to a victim because, you know, should handle. But I learned after that, started carrying a razor blade in my mouth. I'd eat with it. The razors back then, there was, you know, the little disposal ones.

There's two of them. One of them used to be a little bigger and one used to do smaller. The bigger one would hurt because they'll cut your mouth when you're in there. But I just put the razor right in here. I said, I'm going to get 10 of these motherfuckers now. You got me once. I'm getting 10 of you. Like I was on a war pit after that.

It set me off. I don't care anymore. I go home when I went to go home. I said fuck that boot camp Fuck parole You know and I just I would literally right here I went through a whole riot

In my other jail Halsdale With a razor in my mouth I forgot I had it in there To the end of the ride Because guys got knives I'm not pulling out a fucking razor You know what I mean That's not gonna help me

And we're outnumbered frigging Like 10 to 1 or something Like I don't know if I'm exaggerating there But there's a lot of them There's like 13 of busers It was like 60 at M 50 at M something like that When you all the times

You're in prison Would you run with a gang Or an association or anything? I did at first Left And then I started dealing with one that was closer to my area group, fraternity. I don't call it a gang. But yeah, because I grew up associated with one thing out of disloyalty.

Me putting in work, I put in work in every jails. I got kicked out of three jails my first time upstate from the rip. You know, the gang stuff, then riot and stabbing. You know, I was going crazy and it was all putting in work for people mostly that I was. And then what would happen is because, you know, me being white, they started getting envious. At first you come up way and they're like, oh, you're not going to ride. And then they see how you get it in and that you're standing toe to toe to toe with anybody and you're dropping a dime. You're ready to, you know, stab or fight or whatever. Now they start getting envious because people

start talking about you and not them. And that happened after our riot. And the people we went against, which was one main group and some of another, I'm purposely not saying names. It doesn't matter. It's not relevant. Group A, B, and C, you know. Group B and C were bigging me up. Like the only one we respect out of you guys is the white guy wasn't with all white guys at the time. You know what I mean? And our state is not like racially segregated. It doesn't go like that. You fit in with who you fit in with.

Most of the white guys in our state, unfortunately, are disgusting pedophiles and shit like that. Or if you're a white guy in upstate, like you're stigmatized from the rip. So you've got to show differently paperwork first. And then, you know, the rest is just all in action. Did you like prison politics? Like, where you did that hype you up? Did you want to go off, do you send off missions, all of this kind of stuff?

Oh, yeah, I've just done that right before I last. Like you lived for it, yeah, because you were doing it on the street, you know. Yeah, yeah, that's when you were actually get to, get to be the one that, that pull certain strings or can orchestrate certain things. Like, that's a powerful position. Sometimes you've got to utilize that. I was in a situation right before I came home and I'm like, I don't want to get myself, go crack that dude in head with a lock he violated, you know,

so go crack him in the head with a lock impulsive. But he deserved it. He stole, you know, whatever. deserve that man like I said I'm not glorifying it but you know prison this is why nobody wants to go to prison but going back to prison is like trying to change my mindset I'm like I know it's going bring me back to a place of violence wanting to be violent being aggressive even though it was more mild this time I think I got in one fight upstate but I said an example so nobody else wanted to fuck with me people knew you they respected you know what I mean but it's a great feeling when I just

told someone this the other day right at first you know dudes walked by you I'm a white guy so people automatically assume you're like a lot of the other white guys that are soft upsets state you know what i mean it's not like the feds this is different these are different type of different groups of white guys i make white guys from cali and all that they're you know they're they're they're they're little different than a lot of dudes and but you know so some of the other dudes other races they'll walk by giving you no you know just a little look but then the very next day complete change of attitude you know someone told him something about you because then it's like yo hey sees what's what's what's up oh you oh tattoos and did it now they want to talk to you

about all this shit but the other day you just walked by me with an eye that almost made me put my fucking hands on you. You know what I mean? That's, I'm not going to lots of good feeling because I came from a place of being bullied. But I don't respect that because that tells me if I was a soft white guy that you would have just approached me however and you want to show me that same respect. To me, that, that's signs of an oppressor. I don't like that. That's the people that I'm at most vulnerable to do something to. Do you feel like you fit in in prison? Like those were your people that was, you thrived off of that environment. Yeah. And that's hard because you're trying to adapt to society now. Prison is where I survived. The politics in prison is how I survived.

That's what I learned. And in trying to adjust to society, which is way different with way more disrespect in society than in prison. People think prison is where you're getting into. No, I deal with way more, I had dealt with way disrespect on a street that I wouldn't have took him, but you have to have to have. Because these are people that don't know better. The people's society look so much down, so down on people that have been to prison are usually the pieces of shit in society that won't hold the door for you and old lady or help her wear the bags or. You know, she's trying to shovel her sidewalker just like, whatever. You know, but these are the people to look down on us, like, you know what I mean? And so that type of disrespect and lack of morals, you don't really have in prison. You get it here now because there's more young dudes. But so, you know, you're trying to balance that. So I'm dealing with worse than what I dealt in prison to certain degrees.

But I got to handle it in a way different manner. I can't use violence. Although, trust me, sometimes you think your head, I wish I could smack this mouth. You know, but you can't. And in jail, that's something that somebody would have got stabbed for, closing the door on somebody's face or something. if they're not a child molester son, that's, that's disrespectful, man. And that's just part of the politics, man. It's part of the politics, respect.

And you earn that with violence in prison, no other way. There's no other way to earn respect in prison besides violence. Do you think, did you ever think about how your parents, your family felt, you know, maybe coming to visit you, you got a scar on your face, you're talking about prison politics, which they have no idea about, you're all hype. Yeah. You feel good. They're looking at you like you might be becoming a monster.

How did that make you feel? Well, they were more scared. Like, when I got my face cut, like, you got your what? Before they found I actually got my face cut, somebody had heard from the street because the jails are connected to, uh, jows are connected to, uh, jails are connected to, to, to, to the street, you know, but they heard that I got my throat cut. They thought I died. Somebody told him that I was killed and they were upset. And then in the beginning, like, I'm telling the stories that are happening in jail. Yeah, this dude got stabbed and da-da-da.

At the end, it's just normal. And plus, you don't want to worry. I'm dude just got stabbed and we're like I'm on the phone like nothing happened like dude's getting stabbed there yeah we might be locked down in a minute no just some shit happened this dude got his whole freaking neck stabbed or whatever blood you know and so at the end it was different in beginning to end but I know that I know that hurt on me crying on visits and all that that's rough that's rough knowing that you're hurt and your family they're worried about you they don't know how you're surviving and they're what you're doing or what's what's being done

and you don't know you know what I mean they just know what either they've seen on TV or what we tell them so I try I would try to keep them at calm you know even when I was at threat of of of being seriously hurt or hurting somebody else seriously you're not always top dog there sometimes you're vulnerable too and you got to take that on head to head like I'm not backing down I'm not hiding I'm going a yard I'm going you know wherever and I'm a strap up too and that's just where I was at and I live that way for years and I know it put a stress because I'm you got to my you got to understand I'm going to to the hole for stab is I'm my brother came up for a surprise visit and I had just stabbed somebody. I was under investigation. And he's like,

damn, bro, now his girlfriend came up to drove all this way to see me. A couple hours, right? Whatever. You can only get a visit from immediate family in the whole through glass. I'm like, bro, you got to tell me next time you're coming up because if I'm about to do something, I would have held off. He's like, you should have just, I'm not just, oh, if something has to be handled, you handle it. You don't hold off, but maybe I could have waited a day. Another visit. I'm sharpening one of my knives. I get a surprise visit from my brothers. I got all this shit out. I'm like, oh, I've got to give it to my, you put this up, my cellie puts it up. They end up finding the rock

we're using to sharpen it, which doesn't work good for, I should have used it. The wall works better. The rocks don't work. Like, we were just trying some, but these things were hard to sharpen me. It took a lot of hours, bro.

How were you guys making knives in there? I know you said you had razors, but the actual knives. Oh, man, I said I wouldn't do it. But all right, I'm a, all right, so in that specific, let's see, most of mine I got from other people, you got two types of main weapons in jazz knives,

which are shaped like a knife and ice pick. That's two, That's how they're classified ice pick or not. I had both. Ice picks are better for getting through clothes wintertime, but people are scared of them because they cause internal bleeding. It's more likely that they're going to die from it.

My stabbing in my, I know he was with an ice pick in the neck and here. But it takes like 10 minutes as that. So there's that. And then the knives. The nyes I got myself, ice picks was always from someone else off the fence or whatever.

Sometimes you find them. Now, where I got my nyes from in one jail was the library. So if you ever, you don't have any bookshelf here, If you go to a library and you know they got the long stack of books And they have a metal stain It's like in a shape of a C

Like to hold up the books To hold up the books It goes on and it's there So they didn't make you go through the metal detector In this jail or it didn't work in the library It's like they fucked up My boy put me on We're just bringing them back

We're just bringing them back to sharp We don't even sharpen them yet Now these are like These are like thick It's like that You gotta break this top off Like I said it's a C And then it's thick metal

It took me maybe 40 hours, 30 hours To sharpen each one Like not even you know And the first day we grabbed before he sharpened They're like untie your sheets on your bed I'm like oh shake down We're trying to throw it out the door slot

It's like the extra pieces It's like, oh fuck Trying to throw a shit Doo he's like yo Give me the shit hurry up rotor coming Finally get it out there like fuck it We stashed the other ones into the wall Because it was the we had

Oh never mind never mind never mind I can't say that I can't see it They didn't find that The one they did find So we still had them in a cell like months later When we end up getting caught For a whack Because somebody told on us

too much telling out these. They only found the ice pick and we had that inside of a toothpaste container but I told my the person that my cell at the time like bro I don't put in this one. There's a specific way to do it so they don't notice

you need one kind is different than the other and I just leave that there but I don't want to give no hints I know CEOs are going to be watching this man I don't want to give no hints sorry guys like Hey everyone gives up the game man Yeah do you think about now What would have happened if you just

lived a regular prison lifestyle like sat your ass down in the corner you know did your time stayed quiet not got into these prison antics because it is possible to do you know it's uh you don't have to do what you did man you wanted to do what you did and took take part in that you know i never actually thought it at me i i don't know like i know people that like there's a lot of brilliant people in prison there's a lot of intelligent people in prison like i was talking to with Matt and like people are running million dollar blocks on the street. Like if you applied it to some positive, you'll be a beast. So if I would have applied myself in prison more, like I studied a lot.

Because my philosophy is always this. You lose so much going into prison. You got to leave with something you didn't go in with. What can you leave with? Not property. Knowledge, wisdom. You're coming from adversity. Take something from it.

So if I would have dedicated more time to study, I would have been an expert or whatever I chose to study. There's dudes that are paralegals that didn't know shit about law that just from studying in prison. So I think it would have been more like that. But however, I still don't take because I wouldn't have had this mindset. I had to go through all that, the bullshit. I had to be on both sides of it to get to the mindset. I'm at now and it's an unstoppable mindset.

And it's the best feeling in the world when you have nothing but everything. You know what I mean? And that's how I feel. I'm prepared for anything because of my mindset because of what I went through. So let me ask you something. If you go back to prison, God forbid tomorrow, how is that experience going to be different than the past ones? I'm gonna be honest. I would love to say I'm going in there positive

because of recent revelations and certain stuff and certain people come and turning against me for something that's not even relevant. I would probably hurt a lot more people because I'm not taking no shit. First, first wrong eye. And I hate to say that because where I am as a person

and this is not a level, we want to take it in the streets right now. But in prison, I know, because if not, I'm being more of a victim now because people are going to view you as weak. You know what I mean? You're not viewing me as weak. As soon as you claim,

because now you're a threat to me on some level. So I approach threats head on, you know. So unfortunately, it wouldn't be a good thing. So I got to try my hardest not to go back. And my mindset makes me confident in that, but you're always scared of a slip up, man, because you can win a thousand battles in your life a day, right? Nobody sees that.

They only see that one time you fuck up and slip back into your old behavior. You know what I mean? So that's always a possibility. It does scare me, even when you're not doing nothing wrong. I hear cop cars. I'm like, shit, are they coming from me? I didn't do nothing.

I'm tripping. but it's scary. It gets my heart racing every time I see them. So knowing that, does that give you enough motivation do you think to keep you from not going back there? Yeah, I sure and the fuck hope so, man. I believe so, but, you know, the past is, it's hard. I'm trying to get out of a pessimistic mindset. I watch motivational videos and they say pessimists are right more often than optimist,

so it's easy to be pessimistic. But optimists are way more successful. You know what I mean? So pessimists are, yeah, they're right, but optimists believe they did better than they did, so they keep doing good. So that's what my mindset. I'm trying to keep optimism. I'm not trying to think pessimistically, but anything is possible. You know what I mean? And I'm trying to prepare myself because I'm doing everything right. My medication, I got on right. I got my weed card, right. Not doing illegal. Not, you know what I mean? Even the medication I knew would help me. I didn't go get

illegal. I just did it the right way. Let my PO know. I'm, you know, I'm trying to do stuff right. I'm trying to get a legit job. I had a few ways I could have made money that was in the streets that I almost went there because it's, like I said, same game, different product. And I had to realize that, oh, well, it's not drugs, it's not this, it's not violence, it's not, but it's, no, it's still that. You know what I mean? I don't got to say, it's still that. It's still under the umbrella of criminal behavior and criminal thinking.

And I said, fuck that, bro. I'll stay here broke until I can get a job. And that's it. Fuck it. I don't care. But also with that mindset, you got to be careful because there's situations that you wouldn't tolerate in prison that are considered disrespect that would pop off to something violence that happened every day in the world you could be at a Starbucks man someone could look at

you the wrong way it caught you in line and your your first response might be i got to stab this guy because you just i just got disrespected no not no more though yes you're right for for like when i first came home my first bit with a positive mindset um just i didn't change my thinking like i thought everybody was like looking at me staring at i'm like ready to weird because i was socially anxious i couldn't go to the counter to pay for my own shit you know what i mean but at the same time I'm ready to go at anybody heads up because I was I was I was passive until I became aggressive. I had to learn that assertiveness. But I say that to say I handle situations better out here. In prison, it's different. If I don't approach that this way, you know, going in, then people are

going to come at me. You're going to have more problems than you would if you just make an example of the first couple people. You know what I mean? Unfortunately, you know, that's why I'm trying not to put myself, I can, to the best of my building, controlling the people places and things around me because I know what type of events trigger me. Whenever, situation happens or almost happen where I stab somebody in jail or I almost stab somebody in jail. Look back to when I got in my later years like what can I have done to prevent this from happening or almost happening in the future. If I know this is a triggering event, you know what I mean? Something like that I just got take on because I can't give up my life. I feel like too many people rely on me.

I still got people that are stuck behind them walls that got nobody. There's people that are kids that went throughout what I went through to think they got no hope. You know what I mean? I can be that hope for them. I can be that helping hand. I have to build something that I can help so I can help people. So I have my own feet to stand on so I can lift other people up as well. And that's more important than my pride with somebody saying something or bumping me in it. I'll say, excuse me. I'll let them think I'm weak. You know what I mean? As long as it's not an immediate threat to me, any children, women, or anybody, you know, anybody vulnerable, you know, as long as it's not an oppressive situation involving somebody innocent, I can handle it, man. I know I can handle it.

I have handled it. I've handled worse recently. And I was proud of myself. I didn't react 100% like I wish I did. However, it didn't go to the extent that it would of years ago. You thought this was your run club era. Turns out it was more of a thinking about run club era. The good news? Someone's marathon training is about to start. Sell your workout gear on Deepop. Just snap a few photos and we'll take care of the rest. They get their race day fit and you get a payout for trying. Someone on Deepop wants what you've got. Start selling now. Deepop where Taste recognizes taste.

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South Pacific. Book now at Vigeeairways.com or contact your local travel agents. Conditions apply. So it would have been a drastic difference. So you got out of prison after the two to four. I'm assuming you probably did all four because of here. I did five because I caught a case in prison. I got, I caught extra keys. I got, I got, this wasn't even a stab was just the knife. I was about the ice pick. It was like, this dude would have probably died. So it was some duties. This, this is crazy. This is part of prison politics. The reason that we were going to stab this dude for is because he looked at my friend. let that sit. He looked at him. You know what I mean? You get this all the time.

You just looked at it for a second too long and you're with a group that is considered what we call ops. Like, you know, they're on the opposite side. And that's what it was. I got it the morning of it and fucking C.O's going through my stuff. I got in my kitchen, wait down my bed just finished sharpening because they're about to use it. And I'm not going to hide it. They're like, you got anything in here? I'm like, nope, tattoo needle drops on a bed. It's like, doong. They're like, holy shit, cuff me up. But security wanted me to tell or take a case. I took a case six months to a year. I maxed it out. Extra year. Did five years.

And then that was that. How old were you when you got out? 24. You were 24. Didn't even know how to drive yet. So what happens after that? Do you go look for a job? Are you trying to get your life back on track?

Yeah. Online college, personal training, learned a lot. Working at a trash place. Shitty pay, $100 a day, 13 hour to ease. But I'm beast lifting like 40 tons of trash a day. Doing good. You know what I mean? And then slipping up one day, I go to a bar, not drinking.

It was a work night, which I didn't like to go out. I went out with an exit at the time. and then this dude kind of violated I didn't take it well and then I end up hitting him and I broke his chin in two places John three he needed a reconstructive surgery

it was one hit though but I still thought I was like innocent because like you're sending me back for they gave me aggravated a soul originally turned to a simple I end up doing one to two for that I maxed that out but yeah but everything else I was pretty good but I that was criminal mentality

I didn't get it out it still institutionalized because this is how I would have reacted in prison, and I was still reacting that way. Did your mom stay supportive throughout these times? Always. My whole family. My whole family.

Do you feel like you needed a little bit more tough love on you? I don't think anybody could have done anything externally to change it because it was like, if you tell me one thing, the reason I even hit that dude is because after he, like, I felt violated the bartender looked at me. He's like, you're not telling me what to do. Boom. And I just blasted this dude.

He was a big dude. to I sat him down. The ER surgeon said there was no way the damage was done with a fist. I hurt, I hit this dude hard. I'm working out. I'm working in trash. I'm strong.

Like I dismantled this dude's face. His jaw was just hanging. Like it was bad. He pops right back up. I couldn't believe I wasn't even ready because I knew he was going down. He must have been high or something. There's no way you just pop back up

with a hit like that. No way, man. But yeah, that was like 30,000. Fortunately, he didn't file for restitution because I would have to pee him. Now, every case you had going through this, you always had a public defundation. defender or a paid attorney?

No, I don't think I ever had a public defender. Wasted money on paid attorneys every time. And I don't think they did anything except what a public defender would have done. I don't think they gave me any better deal. Who would pay for it? Your family or yourself? So what was the first time was I think money I had saved from a restaurant, from a restaurant I was at.

My boss put it up out of money I saved, I believe. And then I think my girlfriend finished paying it off. my second bid My second bid might have been a public defender Then the last one was a girlfriend That she did a lot for I told her not to and she spent like her and her mother You know thank you

Tina and Diana Diana's past Unfortunately But um Did a lot for me man And I didn't have no money then I'm like yo don't don't do this shit That's when I was facing my case for a stab

And this guy almost died and all They gave me I took it for robbery A serious bodily injury But they gave me aggravated soul all that stuff. I just chose that charge because I thought it looked better on paper. But yeah, that was the case she put up the money for it. Like, I was facing a lot of time. But, uh, and I ended up getting... That was your last case?

Last number. I ended up violating with another case, which is simple assault. But that was my last, my last number, LW, 7080. I think I got my state. Oh, they give you a new number every time you go in. Uh, new case. New case. Yeah. Okay. That's your case number. That's my inmate number. Yeah. That's my, every, every new case, you get a new number. This is my last one. This is my last one. Okay. Do you have kids throughout this? No, I didn't.

Some fake pregnancies. There's a silver lining there. Yeah. No, there's a lot of people that have lived your life that have, you know, two, three kids. It could be worse. You know, you got to think about that. Yeah. I see what they goes through.

Not saying having kids is bad, but it's just imagine being where you're at now with two or three kids out there. Yeah. Yeah. And there's people in them situations and don't have the support system that I had. I have a great support system. I don't know what I would do without them. Like, especially my mother, my sister, like my whole family, you know what I mean?

But I was able to come home to a house and this and that. No real responsibilities, even though it feels like you have every responsibility in the world. You know what I mean? So. So that the next case after that other one you were telling us about in your 20s, so you caught that one at 24 or 25? Yeah, at the bar.

Yeah, at the bar, 24, 26. Two years. That was uneventful BIV. that was bullshit jail. So that's pretty pretty uneventful. Then the next one was a stabbing. All right.

Tell us about that. Just come home. No money. My cousin lines up a lick. I didn't know at the time he's getting high. Whatever this dude's supposed to have some drugs,

some money, whatever. Let's rob him. Take the money. Long story short, I go pick him up. He hands me a gun. The guns. I'm like, bro,

this is light. What's it? You're going to get us killed, man. This dude's fucking Egyptian. He's from over there. He's not going to just give this shit up, bro.

No, no. He don't care. gun. I'm in, give me the knife, bro. Give me the knife. Last minute. I'm like, give me the knife, bro. I remember I stopped to see my home before I picked up my cousin. I borrowed my girlfriend's car. I got gloves on. He's like, bro, what are you about to do? He knows me from back in the day and I just smile.

He's like, bro, be safe. Go pick up my cousin. We go. He has his girl with him. You never bring a girl to us. I mean, there's some riding girls out there, but so we get in. He gets in it, and my cousin gets in the passenger, I get in the backseat across from the dude. And then I got the knife here. I think I had the gun here, even though it was empty. I don't know what the fuck i'm just hoping he just gives it up i don't want to hurt this dude yo give it up he don't want to

give it up blah blah blah listen brown want to hurt you he don't give it up i just start stabbing him back so he had a lot of defense i aimed for his neck but because he was like this and he he grabbed the knife from somewhere he's trying to stab me i'm hitting all here the one that almost killed him was i i believe i hit a r in his arm so it was a lot of blood at the scene when i stabbed or used to stab when i was in my violent years i give the whole knife so it was the whole knife i have a few stabbings. No and not new. But the ones I got called for and ones I won't speak of. But that was the only time that I actually seemed like blood because the blood don't stay on the knife. Like it's stainless steel. But this is the only time I see blood on. So I know it was bad.

My cousin chase him like, bro, come on, we're out. Fortunately, the way they found this dude and saved his life is when he left the scene, he's losing a lot of blood. They had to put eight bags of blood back in this dude. But he sideswiped a whole bunch of vehicles. And they called in hitting runs and they found him slumped over in his out front of his house and they were able to medevac him out and save his life and then uh yeah so do you ever think about how lucky you are that no one died yeah because it was a dumb situation like it wasn't it wasn't meant for that but like i think back like why did you do that because that's what i would have done in prison you you challenged me i told you to do some you didn't do it you challenged me and i have to react

in the most severely violent way as possible and that was well not even thinking, trying to stab you in the neck. Like, bro, what? Like, what is wrong with you, bro? Like, but that's where I was at. That's where I was at. And it took a long time to get out of that. Because, like I said, after everything we already spoke about,

this sets you up, predisposes you to this type of thinking. Like, you know, so this is how you handle stuff. So what they ended up charging you with that attempted murder? No, they didn't give me a attempt. They gave me aggravated soul robbery with serious bodily injury and some other underlying charges. In the end, I was able to take a deal. I got to choose between aggravated soul.

and robbery SBI, serious bodily injury. I thought robbery would look better because, oh, it's not aggravated assault. I thought it would look better on your record. But robbery, I think, is considered, like, what they call a crime of, what do they call? But premeditated a lot? No, it's like a...

Not passion. It's like a theft. Like any type of theft, it doesn't look good. They don't want you working around money now because you got a robbery. You can't work at any regular story. Right. So certain jobs when I hire you because you have right,

it makes you look like a thief, which I'm not. But you took that deal, right? Yeah, I did because I thought it would look better But I could have took aggravated So he was like my lawyer's like the same thing Four and a half to nine I was fortunate This dude went in there It was like yeah I was selling him drugs

And it helped me a lot Then during a trial he got locked up For selling drugs again So you're not looking at this guy Like he was selling drugs So I chose him because it's like bro You're killing people Like I don't care what happens to you

I don't feel bad for it Like I shouldn't have done it But I don't feel bad for it You're killing people every day man That's why they didn't give you attempted murder Maybe maybe I don't know But mind you Although I was naming for the net

act they don't know that they just know what he's telling he don't tell me he's trying you know so his his marks are down here because he's like i said they're defensive he's here trying to stab so i'm trying to his neck but i'm getting all here you know so maybe it didn't look like i was there you know and it's not like oh i'm going to kill this dude i'm just you refuse and i just that's where i stab in the neck or try to you know how much uh time did you serve for that originally about five years i made parole my second time surprisingly you know surprisingly but uh then i violate it's six months violation with leaving a halfway house something dumb

left a halfway house to help somebody with another staffing no actually something positive was a girl that was on Facebook and she was like in the streets and she was like she was like I'm tired of being on streets by myself she was in Philly she said she got raped three times and I just want somebody I'm like listen I'm in a halfway house I'm trying to find someone if not I will leave and I'll help you

and my father was terminally ill at the time unfortunately he made it past that he didn't make it past this last bit but I went to try to help her didn't work out but I gave this woman my word and I told her like I don't have nothing but I can come there and try to make sure you're safe and that didn't turn out good but you know I got there and you know I tried to show support and all that and they sent me back I'm okay with that I went for doing something good I'm fine with that I've never been able to do that I've been in prison a lot of times I can't say yo one was for a good reason fuck it like all right I take that I wish I would

have been able to help her and she would have listened a little or you know trusted me a little more or you know whatever it was but you know the intentions were good But how does it make you feel that even though you did good intentions, you lost time that could have been spent with your dad? Everything's a learning experience, man. You know, at that time, I was also fighting the year addiction I told you about. So it stopped. They put a six-month hold on that. Now, I did continue when I got back out to a degree and then I went back to jail, prison.

And, you know, that was my last case that I just came home from. So, you know, I don't regret. I can't regret anything. I was blessed with time with my family, my father. father who, like I said, is pay a sense. And what I was blessed with, I have to accept. You know, this is how life goes. How do you make amends with the people you hurt? Trying to help now. Like, I've a pilot. I'm trying to find two specific people, three specific people from childhood that I said something to because I still live with certain

traumas of what was done and said to me from childhood. And I know specific people I said, one comment to, one comment, bro, in high school. And two other people I used to kind of like at times bullied. I was bullied. I wasn't the person at booed. I always sat with the girl that sat by herself or tried to help people, but I don't know why, maybe because of my pain and going through what I went through these two specific kids, and I don't know their name. That's not okay with me. That's not okay with me because they could have some type of fucked up thinking nowadays because of that. You know what I mean? Like me, I have fucked up thinking because of what came from my childhood. Things I've went through, things people put me through. So I'm trying to make amends in that way,

reach out just to let you know I see you. I remember this was not my new. It wasn't frivolous to me. I know that I hurt you, whether physical or just mentally. And that's not okay with me. So I try to reach out that way. I spoke to certain exes that I've hurt, not physically, but mentally. I went through some shit. I went from a good dude in relationship to a piece of shit that was hurt. Hurt and women back. And now I'm just a good dude now. And I'm confident saying that. So I reach back to these people like, listen, I just want to let you know you didn't deserve that. I wasn't in the right state of mind. I had a fucked up way of thinking.

You know what I mean? So that's very important to me, making amends. What the people deserve. The dude I stabbed on. I mean, bro, you're selling drugs, bro. All right. Like, go ask somebody else for sorry, man. I don't regret that.

I just wasn't justified in doing it, but it was justified to happen to him. You know what I mean? If that makes sense. I shouldn't have been the one to do it, but you deserved it, bro. But the people that were unjustifiably hurt, you know, I regret.

My last case was I committed myself to a state hospital. I was getting paranoid. I thought this, this, this, he was a psych tech. It was a male. I don't hurt women, even if I'm paranoid. You know what I mean? When I get paranoid, I tend to think people around me, innocent people, women and children, are in danger or myself. And I was in that mindset and I committed myself to a state hospital. I told him this. They mishandled me. This guy comes up and, and just certain things he did make me paranoid. He was holding his keys and his knuckles, try making a joke about it, because I was scared of state. That's how they beat you. They put the keys in her knuckles and big ass keys and he punched you in the head i seen it a million times man

i seen a million times it set me off and i almost took this dude's life because i not not out of malice it wasn't out of malice man i thought they're going to attack me now end up choking my remember the minute i let him go because i was still halfway there and because after he passed out i was going to keep going because i didn't want him to wake up and hurt me i had to take him out and i almost took this man's life and he's an innocent person that's not okay but i need to find a way to reach out to him because because he's a victim. I can't just reach out. I got to find a way out to reach out to him. But listen, it wasn't out of malice. It wasn't because it was, I misread the situation because of the trauma and undiagnosed, but PTSD, which I think I have triggered me.

Certain things triggered me to think I was in danger and I just reacted. I didn't think. I didn't think this through. Oh, I'm going to. No, I see an opportunity because I thought you're trying. And I, you know, and that's when I did my lane. And I was made at the system for that for years. But I still put myself in that position. There's certain things I could have done to put me in a healthier state of mind to not get to that point of paranoia and and and uh violence unjustified violence you know do you feel like the system was too easy on you gave you too many chances i mean you've done a lot of violent acts but have only you know gotten a couple years four years you know what if do you think about if you like that first time you got like say oh 10 or 12 years at one bid that

would have been enough to change you you know i think i was fortunate in the time i've gotten but i don't think that would have changed anything i might have been worse man that first bit I almost messed up. So my stabbing in that first bid, like that's when I was wild. If that was longer, I was about to stab a CO that day. My attention got directed to somebody else

that done something else. I was ready to stab because he got me kicked out of a program over nothing. I was going to stab him in his neck that day. That was my plan. I told my homie to kick me out his program. I'm stabbing in his fucking neck. Unfortunately, like I said,

I'm not trying to glorify this, but this is where I was at. And if I had more time and it wasn't the case, I know for a fact, there's a lot of things. Like I still restrain myself to a degree because that's something you're getting a lot of time for. You're getting more time.

A lot of people don't realize you know, but you can get more time in jail. You can get street charges and extend your sentence. And that would have gave me a lot more. So if they gave me a lot more to begin with, I would have been doing, say they gave me 10 years, 5, you know, whatever. I think I would end up doing like 20, man, because of the mindset I was in.

Everything happened like it was supposed to happen. I'm fortunate. But yeah, I think I was more on the fortunate end with, because some of my crimes could have, I could have gotten a lot, especially that stabbing, man. If it didn't play out the way it played and him going in and being honest,

like saying, like, well, at least partially honest, saying I was just, I would have probably got, because I know dudes they got a lot of time for that type of shit, you know what I mean? Or if I would hit him in his neck, you know, so. But no, man, it's, it happened, I think, optimally for me

to be who I am today, man. Since getting out, have you been able to make and meet new people that are not involved in street life? that are, you know, like participating, hardworking, you know, citizens that you could surround yourself with? Yeah, absolutely. I don't trust people too much. I don't trust people's intentions for the most part. J.L. makes you causes. But I'm getting better. I'm pushing my boundaries a little bit at a time. It's hard. It's hard because what

scares me or makes me nervous is not the people that are killing people. I know plenty of murderers on and off the street. You know what I mean? It's it's upstained citizens, bro. I might, if I didn't know who you were, I might look at you. twice walking by me because this is what I don't have experience with. I don't have experience with the day-to-day people. And to me in my mind, which I'm fighting now is, man, they're the most efficient killers. That's what I'm thinking because you're always thinking on that level. Like I said, it's not that severe anymore, but I don't try to see a shadow going past my door. I'm looking. People are like, no, you're cool. I know. You don't understand because we used to set people up like this. You know what I mean? So now I'm thinking that about everybody.

You send unsuspecting people when you want to take somebody out in an effective manner. What's unsuspecting to me is people that look a certain way that are supposed to be upstanding citizens so I get nervous around them. I don't know how to take them. People in jail and people in the hood and, you know, them type of killers, they, or them type of people, they move a certain way and you can see it on them.

So you know how to react. You know how to maneuver around it. Maneuver comfortably. I don't know how to maneuver in this society. I'm learning. What are some of the consequences from living this violent, you know, criminal-filled life that you're dealing with now? being out you've been out a few months now what's the aftermath there's always fear of revenge to a degree

not that i'm i'm scared but there's i've done some stuff to some people in prison that are very close to where i'm living now i've embarrassing people um people don't take light to a white guy getting out on them whether it's with your fist or whether it's with weapons you know what i mean and there's people in my direct area or close to my direct area so that's part of it i haven't anything they haven't necessarily had anything directly come to me from that area. Maybe, maybe not. I'm not sure. You can't always see where stuff comes.

That and just trying to acclimate, man. Because like I said, when you live at certain extremes, you're always thinking to a damn extremes to some degree. Something minor might happen. Something falls. You're just thinking something fell. I'm thinking someone just broke in with a fucking gun ready to put bags over our heads. You know what I mean?

We're driving in a car. Maybe you're looking to see her. That's why I can't get nowhere because I don't pay attention to that. I'm making sure the people in front of us don't stop their car get out and shoot the car up you know what i mean i'm getting better at this uh but that's that's all the effects of the lifestyle i've lived and then you hear the cops and you're thinking they're coming back for something you know that might be forever ago you don't know so you're always paranoid to a degree and that's what i'm struggling with that's what i struggle with me and it's one of my biggest

one of my biggest uh challenges now to overcome what about um working relationships have there been any consequences from your actions in the past that have affected those things in your life now that you're dealing with and working through? You're saying like in a job like is that as far as finding a job and also you know dating you know some people might search your name or look you up or you know be intimidated by that. So now you see I got the justice felon shirt right so I used to walk on my head down man because I was so like I thought everybody just knew your philin. It looked like tats and da-da-da-da I'm walking the middle of street I want to walk nobody's private I don't one of thinking anything menacingly of me. I think I have any type of nefarious intentions.

You know what I mean? So now I took it as like, man, fuck it, bro. I'm a felon. I'm a felon. I'm a felon. All right. But let me show you that felons can be positive members of society. So I'm opening on my front. Listen, this, that and that. But I'm a hard worker. I'm caring. I help people when I'm able to help people. And I have a lot to offer. And I still can get job recommendations from like any of my previous bosses because I'm usually the hardest work in person there. You know what I mean? I want to change the narrative. I want to change the stigma behind felons.

Like, that's me. But yes, you still deal with that because certain people just don't want to hire felons. Why take a chance with somebody with a felony? When you can just hire somebody that doesn't. You know what I mean? But yeah, so, so, yeah. What's a relationship with your family now? It's good.

I think they're proud of me, man. Like, because it took me a while to get here. Like, they've always been supportive. They've always been loving. I always been caring, but now I hope that I, and I believe that I put some belief in them, because I don't, I don't hold it against them that, uh, they would probably have thought that I would have been on my way back to jail coming out because, because of how I was coming out every other time. But now I think I changed them. I think they're like, yo, now I see it.

Like, this is what my homie Vaughn used to tell me in jail because we'd have our visits and we talk about doing our podcast and reaching people and what we wanted to do. And he's like, bro, I believe you got it. And I didn't even believe myself then. And he's like, you know, some people, they're not, because, because look where you at before. Like, and I get that. Like, there was jokes like, oh, well, he'll be back. We'll just leave money on the phone because he'll, but I get it because it's not,

they don't take a light. Lightly, no, trust me. But you got to make a light of harsh situation. But now it's like, I think they see, they're like, all right, like this, this is the one that I knew was in there. This is, this is him. He can do this. So I think my relationship got better because they all believe me.

They're all proud of me. They're all willing to help me in whatever way I'm needed. Now I'm learning to ask for help a little bit more, which is very hard to do. I've never done that. But I've always. failed so I have to try something different and this is uncomfortable but that's what builds up resiliency you have to be uncomfortable and now it's getting comfortable you know what I mean and now I'm learning to do things on my own instead of trying to get other people to do it I ask for helping the beginning and

so that has strengthened our relationships mine and my families I believe what's your plan to stay on track like what's your plan to make sure someone looks at you the wrong way you don't react to that in a negative way. Because it's deeper to me. I feel like, and I was hesitant to even come out here and try to do my podcast and speak out because it puts you on front street. Any bullshit you have from your past is going to come out. And I said, you know what? I feel like I'm, I feel like I'm doing injustice to the people I believe I can help. So if I go and I'm, I'm, I let my pride get in a way, I could be stealing what I look at as the life of children because I honestly believe I can save a whole bunch of lives and change a whole bunch of mindsets in youth because I know where my thinking started.

And I'm that kid. I wish I had someone like me that knows what I know that could have talked to me then and do this. So if I react in a situation like that, I'm taking that from that kid. That kid that maybe was like me and I might be their survival story, I might be the one that they look at like, damn, he made it. I can make it. He's been through what I've been through.

And I tell people this as well. They're going through. I just want to give up. I just want to give up. No, don't do that because there's another girl. There's another boy like you that's a kid or another wife that's being abused that doesn't think they can make it. And you're their survival story. I got to be that survival story.

I got to be that success story. I got to show my passion where it developed and instilled in these kids to give them that passion as a youth to dedicate themselves to something, their energy, their hurt, their pain. If not, then I'm, I'm, what am I? I just wasted a lot of time in prison to go back for somebody staring at me. guess what somebody else is going to stare at you in prison too somebody else is going to do this somebody else is going to do that it's not going to you have to pick your battles you have to we always say upstate no picks no fuck that bro that's stupid you got to have picks you will never leave jail you will give up your life so now i got picks you can look at me i'm going to look away i'm going to try to all right and then you know whatever

whatever i need to do that that's fine you could be the bigger man now if they want to see me in the ring or something you can do that we can do it with contracts and all that whatever we can do that legally if you want to do F is to that degree, step in the ring we could do. But if it's not, you know, I'm cool, man. It's not enough for me to give up what I want to do. There's a greater purpose. People told me for years, you got to work on yourself first before you help other people. Well, helping other people is me working on myself. They were right. I had more work to do, but I need this, this greater purpose. And that's enough motivation to not do some dumb shit, man. That's what stopped me from doing the little stuff when I first got out to make a couple thousand

like a couple thousand hours right now would be everything you know what i mean but i thought it's like how am i going to get on here in podcasts and try to speak positivity like i'm doing stuff right and do that that be hypocritical i'm a genuine and sincere person i say what i mean you know what i mean and i preach what i feel i don't hide i am who i am so i can't be that person that's going to be up here saying yo do this and do that and don't go this route and i'm sitting there in the background doing it because at the end of the day i have to look at myself in the mirror and i know what i've done and what i haven't done people around me don't so i need to be able to stare at myself in her mirror and know that what message I'm bringing is is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is

you wish you could tell your teenage self. Like, if you could say I'm next to him before you ever got into trouble, what, what would that advice be now that you have all these years behind you? Man, it's so hard because it's such a delicate situation. Don't give up, man. Don't give up. You can become great as something. Even if you don't know what that something is, whatever you dedicate yourself to, and I talk to say this to my nieces and, nephews and they're I talk too much and did it but I don't care because one of them seeds might oh you like boxing you know keep keep to that I'm trying to instill that drive in them I just wish somebody had could have done that to me give me something to be passionate about my thing is fitness right

so let's take the let's take that non-athletic kids in school that are scared to go to gym that are that are getting bullied because they don't fit in let's teach them the basics of fitness and give them something to be good at they they don't want to do it because they don't think they can do it so show them that they can do it and then start showing that they can get good at it And then they're going to become more comfortable and social settings because now they've got something to be proud of. This is such a simplistic answer to a complicated problem because it could not completely, you know,

obliterate like bullying and all that, which like that was the main thing I dealt with. But, you know, it will help. Because because think about it, when I was in cloud, was out of shape. I couldn't, oh, Jim's stupid. No, I just didn't, I wasn't good at it. Not the athletic ones that comes naturally to.

Let's get the kids that aren't good at these things. Let's teach you the basics. after school program or something separate from the athletes, bro. Now you're good at that. Now you can, now you've got confidence. You're something you can distill passion. Something you can dedicate yourself to. Take your mind because you're going to find a source of acceptance one way or another.

Whether it's pro-social or antisocial. You want the positive, obviously. You don't want the negative mindset. So that comes with giving them somewhere to direct that pain and turn it into passion, direct that towards that. Whatever it is, doesn't have to be that. It could be anything. It could be music, whatever.

Music, sports. whatever books chess club i don't care something me something tick-tac-toe if there's a league for that there's got a league for everything man one of these new things i don't know but and it got technology to become brilliant at anything it's everything just show them that they can do it i did chess club in middle school you look like you did chess club oh it was only a couple days i was like this is not for me did you try are you good you look good no no i'm not good i said i'll get made of seen my dad's good yeah yeah i play a little bit i played a little bit in prison just the past of time i'd much rather sit down for a game of monopoly

Yeah, I was Pinnacle Yeah, I love Spades But I got snuck and counting on Pinnacle Yeah Because I never got into Pinnacle I didn't like it Love it Spades man, you're playing Spade In the fed you did?

Come on me I used to walk to the dice Come on 4, 5, 6 yeah Were you allowed to have dice You had to sneak them You had to sneak them Oh yeah

Yeah, yeah But people would take them from the Monopoly boards And stuff You wouldn't get in trouble if you had them Yeah, that's how we did Monopoly Did you ever see dudes Do you ever see them out of toilet paper rolls

In the whole Maybe but we had real dice Yeah, you didn't need to That was like county thing Yeah it was pretty interesting Austin, thanks so much for coming on the show today, man. I appreciate it, man. Yeah, you did great, man.

This is your first interview? Yeah, first time being interviewed. Well, technically, my podcast, I got a few, but. Yeah, well, you're first time being interviewed yourself, man. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I appreciate it, man. Yeah, congratulations on getting out, man, starting your podcast. And, you know, like we said, if you're ever in this area and want to use our other studio,

feel free. You'll have some interviews. You can interview me one day. Yes, that would be awesome. Yeah, yeah. You got to come in my pockets. Just a felon, man. But I'm more than that.

I'm more than that, man. Love it, man. Yeah, and you already got merch, man. It took me a year to get merch and you're already out here four months in with merch. That's awesome, man. I'm proud of you, man. You know, keep doing your thing and, you know, just stay on the path, you know, that's so important. That's all I can do, man.

Thank you for having me. Just a fellow man. I need you to subscribe me. I need you to subscribe to my channel for me, man. Dude, I don't really use YouTube like that. No? No, I don't really, like, I've never really been like that. Like, that's why I was so intimidated to start YouTube.

I started on TikTok and stuff. I don't know anything about YouTube. The only time I would use YouTube growing up is, when my friend would show me something or like I needed to figure out how to do something how to do this, how to assemble this. That's what I'm learning. Yeah, now I did you watch YouTube?

Yo, do you know how to do this? Yo, just go on YouTube. Yeah, I'll watch like motivational videos back in the day and stuff or like some music videos, but I never used it the way my viewers who watch my content use it. Right.

So that's what it is. And I just don't have the time to sit there and watch stuff but I'm getting better at subscribing to people and everything like that. I'm studying all day. I'm watching video on how to, I'm studying. Yeah,

it takes time, man. I learn every day. I learn as you go, you know. What we were doing in the beginning is not what I'm doing now. You just learn, you grow, and you get a little bit better each time, you know. You look at when I first started editing my own videos, it's a night and day difference to what it is now. And it took a while to get there. Mine out on edit it right now.

So it's just like there's like two minutes of that. But, yeah. I always tell the people that I first started that we talked to would give advice to. I was like, you're in a better spot than I was because I didn't have anyone showing me this. You know, I had to learn it all on my own. and then you know you ask people and you make it better and trial by error and and you get there. And you have a business mindset, man. And you have a team, man.

You're going to get them, man. You just stay on the right track, you know, listen to your mom. Listen to my mom. And stay there until you're ready to roll, you know. I will, man. I lived on my parents for a few years, you know, until I was on my feet. And it's part of the grind and you'll appreciate it when it's all said and done. Living with my mother.

So, I'll be your credit. To me, man, that's more respectful than saying. you stab someone in prison or when you talk to someone, you know? Yeah, no, real, yeah. Yeah, it goes a long way. But I appreciate you, man, you know, stay in touch and safe travels back. Thank you, man. Appreciate you.

Awesome. Live loyal.