Locked In with Ian Bick - NYPD Crime Detective Tells All: Corrupt Cops, Working 9/11 & The Real Dangers of NYC Subways

Episode Date: September 12, 2024

Steven Gates, a seasoned NYPD detective, as he shares some of the wildest stories from his years on the job. From working during the tragic events of 9/11 to facing the daily dangers of the NYC subways, Steven pulls back the curtain on what it's really like to be an officer in one of the toughest cities in the world. #NYPDDetective #9/11Stories #NYCSubways #LawEnforcement #PoliceStories #RealLifeCrime #NYCSubwaySafety #TopDetective #InsideNYPD #WildPoliceStories Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Thank you to our sponsors this week: My Bookie: Go to https://www.mybookie.ag/landings/mbszn/?affid=8927 and use promo code LOCKEDIN to sign up for free and double your first deposit up to $2,000 plus a $10 Casino Chip. Connect with Steve Gates: https://www.facebook.com/steven.gates.staystrong?mibextid=LQQJ4d Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://lockedinbrand.com Use code lockedin at checkout to get 20% off your order Timestamps: 00:00:00 - Interview with former law enforcement officer 00:06:18 - Family Legacy of Cops 00:12:29 - The Impact of Childhood Environment on Parenting Styles 00:18:57 - Perception of Police Behavior 00:25:06 - Initiations for Gang Membership 00:32:00 - Becoming a Detective in Law Enforcement 00:38:19 - Investigating Felonies and Misdemeanors in Law Enforcement 00:45:01 - Saying Goodbye to a Friend 00:51:40 - Community Involvement and Mafia Members 00:58:08 - Temptations of Police Work 01:04:31 - Attempting to Detain a Naked Man 01:10:47 - Police Targeted Shootings 01:17:15 - Community Policing and Human Interaction 01:23:53 - Struggles of the Criminal Justice System 01:30:06 - The Consequences of Criminal Convictions 01:36:21 - Confrontation Over Racial Slur 01:42:29 - Embracing Diversity in Guest Platform and Podcasts Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Shop Wayfair's Memorial Day clearance now through May 25th. Wayfair, every style, every home. Stephen, welcome to Lockton, man. Absolute pleasure to have you on the show. The audience and I love former law enforcement officials on the show. I think it's great, especially with the former inmate law enforcement officer perspective. Well, thanks for having me. It's quite an honor to be here.

We have to follow me for quite some time. This is like, you know, pinch myself type moment. Yeah. I appreciate it, man. I'm glad you reached out. I remember when you, I think you emailed me and I shot it to my My brother right away, I was like, we need him on the show. Oh, wow.

Because you were a cop during those, like, early, you know, days. A whole different world. It's not anything like what it was now, policing. And even in New York City, what is it, the largest police force in it? Pretty much, yeah. I mean, I think Los Angeles Sheriff's Department has the largest sheriff's department in the world, like Homicide Bureau, the population in Los Angeles. But New York City, I mean, yeah, we're averaging since maybe my dad was a cop in the 70s, 30,000 police.

you know, like law enforcement, people with the title law enforcement, I mean, because we have civilians that are called PAAs, police administrative aid. I don't know if they throw them in there. But we average 30-something to 36,000 police officers and then when a PD. And those aides are the ones to do the phones and the comms.

Pretty much the phones, you know, PAAs do the paperwork if your car was stolen. I don't think is different now, but when you come in to make a police report, you know, physically yourself walking, and say, hey, my car was stolen or I have a crime to report, they will sit you down and take

the report with you. And then it gets signed off by a supervisor to make sure it's an actual crime. So if there's a question, they'll go to a supervisor and say, hey, is this actually a crime? You know, some people, like a lost license plate. It used to be if your rear license plate was missing, it was a crime, criminal, petty larceny. But now, then they made it, no, it's lost property. So someone can steal your plate and get around for a while and it's not a crime. Then eventually, years later, it had to be.

two plates for it to be a crime missing. In New York, we have two plates, right? So one plate, it was just lost property. And then, you know, people were using that one plate to commit crimes and said, they said, we have to make it a crime now. So they would go to a supervisor and say, did it change. So they still answer to a supervisor, sergeant, not a police officer. They answer to a sergeant and their civilians.

But they do a lot of police work, you know, just stuff that they don't want to pay cop salary to do. This episode is sponsored by my bookie, an online sports. book with live betting. Get started today by going to my bookie. Dot website slash locked in and using promo code locked in to sign up for free and double your first deposit up to $2,000. Plus, yes, there's a plus a $10 casino chip. With football season just starting, there is no better time to sign up for my bookie.

More details to come later in this episode. No, those civilians, was it like that when you were first in the force? Because I feel like that's more of a newer thing in these bigger cities. They are almost like essentially as important. I mean, I want to compare it to the military like everyone says, well, the guy in boots on the ground is the real hero. And the guy handed out the equipment is not. But, you know, if it wasn't for the equipment guy,

the guy going out in the field isn't going to be equipped correctly. So the PAAs could like, I think they're like unsung heroes. It was like the work that I've seen them do. You know, they can do police work themselves. I mean, I've had them when, like, you're a rookie, they would, like, the sergeant wouldn't help you, although he's supposed to. And the old school mentality was like, don't bother the sergeant, even the training sergeant. But the PAA would be quick, all depends on the precinct size. We had a great precinct.

The PAAs would actually teach us how to do vouchers, how to do proper police work and stuff, police paperwork and reports. So, yeah, it was like that. And again, even in the days of my dad, there was, there's not as many in the 60s, 70s compared to now. There's a lot more PAAs. Because they don't get the salary of police officers does. So they replaced a lot of police officers that were doing civilian work. And it's like, you know, well, you're paying a cop $60,000, let's say. Rather than you could pay a PA 30, almost half to do the same work.

You know, you're not arresting people. It's clerical stuff. So they've been around a long time and they are essential to the police department. I think, again, and I think that they're underwere. appreciated. They deal with a lot of stuff with, you know, angry complainants coming in, you know, victims of crimes. They could be very nasty to them. And I've seen PAAs be very nasty too. To me, I'm including myself, we'd have arguments like, you know, but most of the time, we were like, we've developed friendships with them. You know, they were like one of us, you know,

we would go after work and drink together and, you know, become friends. That's great. Some guys even married PAAs and vice versa. Yeah, there's a lot of like those co-relationships say in any division, but I think it's been more put out there now in the police force when you see like the crazy news stories. Well, like with that female cop, when you see stories like that, it kind of brings it even more to light. Well, especially more to light when you know them. Yeah.

So, like, I see the newspaper. I won't say names. I'm like, oh, my God, I wasn't catting with that guy. What was he thinking? It's like, you know, I mean, it's cameras today. You know, everybody, it's just like, you know, your Facebook, if your phone's not locked and, you know, I'm not condoning this behavior, but if you choose to do, you know, to do certain things other than what you're supposed to do, you might not want to post it on Facebook. Oh, there's so many.

I mean, a lot of people got fired in the wake of Trump's assassination attempt with the things people were saying. And I'm looking at these people. I'm like, why would you write that on Facebook? I know. I know. Like, no matter what your political views are, you shouldn't be writing that. No, especially like you said, like their teachers, they're like big shots, like, you know, people who like, I'm quite a few I've seen like in. mentioned like the board of ed like to me like you know teachers like we were kids were like they were like

gods like they were old women and elderly men they hit you like i went to private public school and i still got hit i deserved it but you know you can't be saying that stuff and with you know on your facebook your job is the board of ed and you're like like you said trashing somebody and being unprofessional you know like saying violent things and like you don't think that's going to come back to you or you just shouldn't do it or take off that you work for the board of ed or the police department, you know, as your employment so people can't come after you, I guess. I don't know. Yeah.

Did you grow up in New York City? Yes, born and raised in Brooklyn. In Brooklyn? Yeah. My dad, I think, was born and raised in Brooklyn, too. Really? What parts? I don't know.

I'm not good with my location. Brooklyn's a big place, man. Fourth largest city in the world. I mean, it's big. Yeah. That's a big. And your dad was a cop at the time in Brooklyn growing up? Yeah.

He became a police officer in 1966. And he worked in the 80 precinct, which no longer existed. In fact, it only existed. for about two years or three years after he left. He had gotten shot and got moved up to, through someone he met that had like pity for him in a way, like, oh my God, you was shot. You know, would you like to get out of that place

and go to like a unit? He's like, well, I'd always like to be an ESU cop, emergency services. And he got it because he was shot. I mean, that's how it worked back then. It's who you know. He didn't know anybody, but he got shot. So a few years later, the Ato was, it's still there at a building much,

I think a child abuse squad, is there or the special victims is there. Every movie filmed, you'll see the beginning. It's on Washington and St. John's in Brooklyn, and they filmed tons of police shows and movies. They used that building. It's been around, like, you know, way before 1966. The fact, all the pre-sent numbers are still on top.

The 80, the numbers that just don't exist anymore. Like, anything with a 105 is Queens. So that's not Queens. That's Brooklyn. So when I saw it, when I was in street crime, I said, oh, my God, I didn't realize it when I went to street crime that, that was the 80. And I'm like, Dad, I'm at your old precinct. It had split up to the 8179, Bedstuy, pretty much Bedstile or Brownsville, took over those two numbers.

So the prison ended, he ended up in ESU and then retired at 1986 as a detective. Did you guys ever serve in the force together or was there too big of a gap? But my brother did. And I said to him, it's funny you say that because it's not too long ago. I said, Rob, do you ever meet, like, you ever hook up with dad while you work in, like, in uniform? He's like, yeah, I came out of the train. He worked on Canal Street. He was a transit cop, my brother.

There was a homicide there. My father was in crime scene at the time, you know, taking pictures, and he comes up by the train. There's my father in his suit and tie. And he wasn't in uniform, which is what he wanted, you know, what you want, you want. He's like, what, I was like, that had to be, like, what a moment.

Because for me, I got to see my brother in uniform. We were able to hang out and actually work together. And we would stand, I was like, my brother's a lieutenant, like, you know, like, that's a great rank, you know. And at the time, I wasn't even a detective. I was a cop. So your brother's, you know, White Shield,

to a lieutenant and he's got the same last name and then he's got a sense of humor and then he put us all on a roster some parade or something and everyone afterwards are like your brother needs to like be on every freaking parade he's the coolest boss and I'm like he's just like that generally he didn't take care of you guys because he's my brother but we we had a lot of moments in uniform together which which was probably just as good as good as you know being with my dad were you the only siblings you and your brother did you have more my brother's 10 years older than me And I have a sister who's 10 months, where Irish twins. Did she become a cop?

No, but she could have. She took the test. Even to this day, my dad said it, she was sharp. My sister was tall. She was 5'7. You know, it was a high requirement, but no longer. So she would have got that. It used to be 5'8, I believe.

I don't know what year they stopped at. So she wouldn't have made it. But when she took the test, they had changed that. And she's super goofy and silly, but very intelligent. And she would make a great cop, yeah. But she chose restaurant management, and she went to college for us. But we just spoke the other day, and she says,

damn, I should have did it. I should have did it. I said, Daddy says the same thing. We say Daddy. Daddy says the same thing. Should have did it. What did your mom think about you and your brother becoming cops and your dad as a cop too?

Not happy with me. Yeah, I can imagine. If I tell you, Ian, my mother has twin brothers. They were both cops. I was a sergeant. One of them was married to a cop. My uncle Jimmy was a sergeant. He had passed away a few years back.

So her two brothers were cops. Her sister-in-law was cop. Her husband, my father. And we have a couple of, I mean, there was at the time when I became a police officer, 1992, of Pride, it was about 16 of my family members that were on the police department. Some of Nassau, but mostly, so my mom, we just, it was just like, you know, it was cop family and firemen. And I'm like, mom, I'm next. She's like, no, you're not going to be rich being a cop. I'm like, I don't want to be rich.

So she says, go into computers. And she was right, because in the early 80s, that's where, like, I could have been the next Steve Jobs, right? No, I didn't have that intelligence level at all. But not by any stress of the imagination. She was not happy with me. I was the baby. As my brother said, you know, you don't want the baby becoming a cop. She just felt that had more potential, which now she says she feels bad saying because the police department, there is so much potential.

You can make a decent salary, you know, and be successful and learn a lot. She just thought I was at the time, you know, I was better than that. I think she just didn't. Maybe she was afraid. I don't know. My mom was hard to read when I was young. Did you know growing up that you were going to fall on your dad's lots-ups in high school? Or was it sooner?

Way before that. I was six, seven years old, and he used to have extra patches. And I remember my mom used to safety pin one on my arm. and I had a real metal, like a die-cast metal cap gun. They've taken them away since. Thank God. This thing was as real as my dad's 30. It weighed.

The cylinder popped out. You put the old. I mean, this is 1979. I love cap guns. Ian, this was the best. You could probably find this somewhere, no orange plugs. And my father caught me with it one day. He goes, you're going to get yourself killed him.

And he's right. He probably saved my lie. I wouldn't have pointed it at a cop or anybody. But on the street, Avenue, you and Gravesend, you pull a gun out, you know, someone else might shoot you. So I used to run around my house and play cop, my friends, cops and robbers, but I used to look at that patch and I'm like, that's what I want to do. Like ultimately, I had other thoughts.

I want to be a vet. I want to be a painter. I want to be an artist, you know, when you're that young, right, there's a lot of career things. But in my soul, I knew that I was, that's what I wanted to do. Was your dad strict as being a cop and raising kids in New York City, or did he give you freedom? Nah, you would think so, right? cop with that paramilitary attitude. My dad

grew up very poor. He was raised by my grandma. He was one of six. Four brothers, my father and his youngest sister. My grandmother raised him on her own. He has every excuse to be a bitter man. The way he would tell me he

used to put linoleum on the bottom of his sneakers. He would look for it like in the garbage. He grew up poor. And he became very successful late in age. But he was abused as a child verbally, even physically by his father. He was just a mean, my grandfather, he has since passed away. I want to speak ill or dead, but he was a very nasty man. And my dad became the complete opposite person. And so did all his brothers, my uncles, and his sister.

They're just beautiful, warm people. I'm like, you can't tell me the way you grew up with such anger and, you know, visceral anger in their house that you guys are all so happy and turned out to be such warm people. So to answer your question is, no, he wasn't. But when he was, when it was time to put his foot down, like when I stole the car, yeah, he used to just bite his lip. And like that meant the hand. And you would quiver, quiver.

He was such a tough man. But he was so beautiful in his heart. It was kind of hard. Like, is he really going to hit me? And then, yeah, I got, I got smacked. But not strict. You know, I can look back now. And I'm like, he was more like, son, sit down.

Let me explain to you why I did this rather than. just because I told you so type things. And that did happen, but he was not strict. He killed me with knowledge. He killed me with wisdom as to why I shouldn't do, excuse me, what I was doing. You know, I mean, riding graffiti, drive around and stolen cars. He could read the kids that were bad that I hung out with. And he would like, you know, enough rope.

Literally, he let me fall down plenty. I think I was raised the best, you know, in my generation or I had the greatest, I still, he's still alive. I think I have the greatest father in the world because he was strict when he needed to be but he was more loving than my mother was scarier at times than my dad she'd be the one waiting up but her legs crossed the cigarette you know you know what time you're supposed to be home 11 o'clock i she goes and don't give me the shit that your watch don't work you know been there i think that's a great way to parent that's how my parents raised me that's how i plan on raising

my kids one day um i mean and your dad had every reason to not be like that with his childhood and he came out better because you hear just from the stories that are shared on the store on the show, a lot of those individuals come from those kind of families and it doesn't turn out that way. No. It turns negative very quickly at a young age. And it wasn't until, I mean, my dad and I, best friend. He's the best friend in the world that I have.

Going back years ago, like when I first bought my home, 20 years ago, when I first bought my home, he was helping me build it. And he started just telling me stories that I'd never asked them because I was a young kid. I can't last what my father was doing. We were 18, 17. We were out, running around. Durant graffiti, getting in trouble. Your father doesn't become your hero.

I think, for me anyway, until I got older. And he just told me stories about, like, the abuse. He got sent to camp with one pair of socks, and he was cleaning them in the pond. I don't know where he went. Maybe he was sending upstate. He's like, Steve, you don't know how. So, like, I would buy him sneakers for Christmas,

and he would like, it was the Holy Grail because he just appreciated everything that he got because he did not have it as a child. And he had every excuse to be a nasty, abusive person. I mean, think about it. He was one of six. Not one of them became that statistic, because it's there.

Like you said, I have friends that are not happy people because they were raised like my dad was poor, abusive father, abusive mom, and they've gotten themselves to trouble in jail. Statistically, you know, single moms or children of single moms, 70% of criminals come from that family, you know, atmosphere. And my father was pretty much that guy. My grandfather was gone. He was binging, drunk.

He was a nasty man. Grandma was, my mom, his mom, my grandmother was never home, work three jobs, brought home food for mother-of-ha jobs instead of money so the kids can eat like bread and chicken. So my family and as far as my dad has every right to be that statistical, angry, bitter, abusive man. And not one of them are. His uncles, his brothers, my uncles and my aunt just one of them had passed away. My uncle Tommy was a fireman. But funniest man, I haven't met my life.

And they just were the nice, you like, wait, you came from an abused poor household and park slope 1950, 1940. Yeah, no, I don't believe that. Not for one minute. Did your dad's parenting style rub off on the way you ultimately would end up policing the streets? 100%. That kind of style, that old school method, which if you applied that method now, another officer would tell on you for not following the rules. Yeah, which, you know, there should be a little bit more leeway or a little bit, you know,

of a second chance within reason. You don't see that, you know, all the time. No, I mean, and you talk to, I don't, my friends have some. coming on a job and you don't want to say to them hurt their feelings but because it's all over Facebook everybody's friends and like my son will never be i mean nassoe county suffolk up you know state troopers is different but nypd absolutely not it's just a terrible job in today's atmosphere like you know every john or every 10 years you'll hear like cops say oh the job is shot like you'll always hear that and but guys like no no it's really shot now and uh you know i said to to the to my

son and I you know and he knows these my son watches at tick talk and he'll ask me you know like dad you know what's going on i try to explain to them i'm like well you're only seeing half the video it's so not fair of the treatment so these guys and gals that are coming out now are being like i don't know how well they're being trained um maybe they're being trained well but then they get out and they realize they have to see the stuff that you and i and people see cops are getting fired and arrested for taking police action and and and some of them could they be abusive oh Hell yeah. Some cops can be heavy-handed. Absolutely. And let them get what they deserve.

You know, you're allowed to make a complaint and maybe they can get fired. And I don't want to wear that same uniform that a guy that's an abusive piece of garbage cop. They're out there. But that's like 99% of the police department. It's like 0.1% of the police department that cops are actually corrupt. The guy just pulls you over and he's mean. There's a reason why he's mean. You know, maybe, you know, he pulled over 15 cars.

that day and you're mouthing off and somebody films him cursing but they didn't get the first five minutes when you were given the finger to the cop and not pulling over for 50 miles. You know, just, yeah, I'm just going to make this cop chase me. These kids are getting away with it and the cops are getting like written up and getting suspended. They don't want to take

police action. Yeah, when I'm on TikTok and I just think like I saw this one TikTok where these cops were just doing their job, a female cop boarding a boat, she was on Marine Patrol that day. And these kids are just automatically pulling out the phone, recording it right in their face.

Like, I feel like that's aggressive. And I understand that you do need to record in some settings because of what's going on. And it's right right. Yeah, and you're right. But I think there needs to be a peaceful way of doing it. Maybe saying, hey, do you mind if I record or just something putting it on audio, but to hold the camera in the face, knowing you're on camera and try to instigate. Yeah.

And then that part of it goes viral. Just that part. I think that's unfair. Yeah, it is unfair. And I don't remember. I don't know why for the life of me they're allowing it. Maybe they change it. but I don't remember what year it was,

but you were allowed to harass a cop, you know, freedom of speech. You can curse at a cop, you know. The things that I've been told, you know, and we just with thick skin, you have to be. If not, this is not for you. You know, but sometimes you'd see that person a few days later without all their friends. And you might say, where's your big mouth now? How about I take off my gun belt and shield? Because that's what you're going to say next.

You're only tough with that gun. Well, no, not really because all this gun and shield does is give me a paycheck. but let's shoot a fair one we'll have it watched and I'm old school you win we shake hands I win we shake hands right we need to agree and you're not going to come after me and sue me because you still you may knock me out I don't know but you're not so tough

anymore but now these kids pull that out and it's like it is like kryptonite it works like for me I'd probably be like oh shit like I'm gonna get fired you know like just giving this doing my job and that's really like they're handcuffing these cops and that's why Ian like is it the 70s and 60s and 80s

like it used to be no but statistically it is like they do Comstap period 28 days so if you had seven robberies let's say January 1st to January 31st you had seven robberies this year compared to two thousand twenty three when it was one so you know do the math so you're up hundreds of percent so yeah it is up it may not sound like a lot you know only like 10 more robberies or 12 more robberies compared to last year but it's happening every month it's it's climbing up I hope that it I don't really think it'll get to be the way it was in the 70s when Times Square was nuts.

You know what I mean? You know, it's just, I don't think it'll get to that point, but it's really, you know, and it's violent, like the subways are just terrible right now. And that's where it was in the 70s. Subways were the worst place in Times Square to be. As a young teenager trying to ride the trains, maybe we're going to have fun. Women were getting raped in hallways. The heroin epidemic, Lower East Side, Alphabet City was crazy.

All cleaned up, but there's tremendous amount of crime that's, you. The statistics are going up, and that's just what they're telling you. There's a lot that's not being reported. So was the subways like it is now where you'd hear about like the random stabbings or someone just randomly getting pushed or untargeted shootings? Was it like that then or was it more targeted? I would say probably, I wasn't, see, the police department is now and had since in the early night has been changed in as far as divisions were concerned,

but they were also separate police departments in that of themselves. housing police, transit police, and the city, we called it the city, NYPD. Now we all wear the same patch, like used to be different uniforms, so everyone wears the same patch. But so statistically speaking, when I was a child, I remember, when I was a young man, I remember as a cop, I'm sorry, I'm going back around. When I was a cop, I didn't cover the trains. But you heard about it because, you know, it would be on the news or it would be like come up as like a message on our, we call it a finest message to come up, you know, robbery pattern and a train. And so it was, I wouldn't say targeted. To answer you a question, they have to bore on you for the past 30 seconds is it probably was random, I think.

It was just, you know, sitting on the train, you know, on your headphones or when, you know, what was big was when the iPods came out. You know, MP3 players. You have the iPod. The iPod. Crime went up tremendously right when I came out. Because no one's paying attention. No, they would robbing him like, you know, on the train. So it was targeted.

It wasn't target. It was random, but targeted when you see your target, right? But today, you just got, I think a lot of these criminals or alleged criminals, I see these videos and they're just mentally unstable. And, you know, many years ago, one of our great mayors unopened all that close to hospitals, that mental institutions. And so a lot of these people actually feel bad for roaming the streets and they have mental illness and they're not being treated.

And there, you know, I think that's a good majority of them that's on the trains, they're homeless. If you grow up in a city, have half a brain, you could spot someone that's a danger to you, you know, and you could try to change cause, which is illegal, unless it's an emergency. So that's the random attacks I'm seeing. I'm looking at the videos, and you could just tell by the actions that are people that are screaming, that they're angry. They're not just your average criminal.

I think they're mentally unstable, and they need help. And that's who's committing a lot of these assaults on the trains. That's probably my opinion from what I'm seeing. Yeah, do you think that if you lined up all the guys that, At least in that time period when you were on the job that got caught for these types of things, do you think the common denominator was a mental health issue? No, no, it's definitely more of a mental issue now than ever. Back then, you had gangs, pooper kids running the trains, graffiti artists.

Graffiti artists weren't generally violent ones at all. In fact, unless they run into another crew, they had beef with, and they would just fight amongst themselves. But graffiti artists, they were focused on just with the marker, just bomb hitting the trains, and just keep it moving. They wouldn't stop and think, oh, you know what, maybe I can grab this pocketbook or this kid's gold chain. I mean, some of them were criminals. Some of the graffiti artists had grew up, but with some of the bad kids, in and out of prison.

Most of them were not. Most of them were just, like, kind of artists in a way. Just want to get the name out there. And that was their goal. But back, you know, to answer your question, the end is that they were gangs looking for to rob kids. It was really big after school kids with their book bags now, with the iPads. So it's just a bunch of gangs just going out. initiation, you know, maybe it's initiation to rob someone in order for you to get into a gang.

That's always a thing and always will be a thing. But, you know, they used to call them random attacks. They're not random anymore. You know, they're happening a lot. And again, it was, I think it's more of a mental issue now and it was when I was a policeman. All right, here's the deal. I know a lot of you remember how sports betting kept us going during those long prison stretches, especially when football season kicked off.

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locked in to sign up for free and double your first deposit up to $2,000 plus a $10 casino chip. That's MyBooky. Dot website slash locked in and use promo code locked in to sign up for free and double your first deposit up to $2,000 plus a $10 casino chip. Big thanks to MyBooky for sponsoring this episode and let's get back into it with Stephen Gates. I read an article that they're looking to install body scanners into the subways. Do you think that'll be effective? Absolutely, like the airport, I guess it's, you know, a better safe than sorry, but people got to go to work, man. I mean, you know, people have got to hustle and bustle to sit there and be, you know, X-ray to get on the train.

The other day, I took the train myself every week. I take the train to go uptown for physical therapy on my knee. And I saw the photos and the videos of the suspects that are or perpetrators that are assaulting, these young innocent, mostly women, I think, and men. They're like tall, dark, you can't really tell the race, right? But they're like tall, dark older men, older young men. Like big guys, you know, just beating a heck out of people, slapping women. And the cops are there pulling random people, right?

And here's this like 70-year-old woman, like all four for two if she was an inch. Blonde hair, blue eyes, certainly does not match the description of the person I'm seeing on the news, whether that be, you know, all the news stations, the ones that the people call liberal or conservative, and they're showing the same video. And it's like 15 incidents. It's either the same guy or people, or it looks like a male. They kind of have similar characteristics,

height, the clothing they're wearing. Why are we stopping, you know, Jane Q Public, who's 70 years old that just wants to go home? You know, it's either late for work now or she just wants to get home after nine hours of work to train. and she doesn't fit that. She's not the suspect's description. And you're going through her pocketbook.

For what? These suspects are smacking people. What are you looking for in her pocketbook? You know, some of them are stabbing. But do we really want to be so politically correct and stop elderly people? If they focused on, you know, looking at and putting a lot of undercovers

of plainclothes offices at these train stations and just observe and see. And cops are sharp. They'll pick up on a guy or girl. By the way they're dressed, the time of day it happens on night. Focus on that.

The medical detectives, I think, would be a great thing, but it was just, everyone would be late for work. Yeah, I think body language is huge. Tremendous. Like, when I'm in a public place,

I'm always kind of like looking around, I'm looking at exits, I'm looking at the people that are around me, especially when people, like, come up to interact with me. I'm just like kind of seeing who's around, and you can get a vibe for someone. Yeah, as you should be.

You know, that's a trait or a talent, a lot of people don't have. It doesn't make them a bad person, but, you know, typical cops, like, you know, retired cops, we always sit with our, with our, facing the door because we want to see who's coming in, who's coming out, and want to protect your family. And it's something my dad did.

It's like, watched him do it. Then I became a cop. I did it. Cops usually sit while on, duty, off duty, all the way in the back of the diner or restaurant. You'll see them. So it's like instinctual to want to know what's going on around you at all times, especially on the subway in New York City right now.

It's pretty hot crime. Yeah. I mean, and people ask. like how I'm okay with just people coming in here like that have went to prison. I'm like, well, one, if they took the time to apply and come on the show, but two, like you can sense how they are when they come in.

Most people either bring a gift or they're just like, you could tell they're nervous. Right, right. Just to be and sit down because they've never done this before. Right. It's the professionals, even some professionals, like lawyers are nervous and former law enforcement, but then they, you know, get comfortable.

Yeah, but you could tell. And if they have that nervous energy walking in, then you know you're going to be okay. Right. You can kind of get that. You got my nervous energy when I came in there, right? No, you're a straight shooter, old school type cop, you know. But it also helps, I always say, like, there's not a big team, like, running the cameras,

and it's just me and you in a room, you know, so it makes it easier and it's comfortable. Yeah, but, though. So when you join the force, how old are you? 20. And did you have, like, your plan in mind of, I'm going to be this by this age, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this? Yeah, sure. I wanted to be a detective in the worst way.

My dad became emergency service. Those are the guys that when the cops need help, they call them. Like, you're pinned down, you know, barricaded, emotionally disturbed person. You know, someone climbing the bridge. Special Operations Division guys, like, they're, like, highly trained. ESU was like, you know, like the ESU and corrections, they call them the Ninja Turtles. They dress up with all the, so it's the equivalent of what most people would look at is SWAT. Okay.

So my dad was an ESU cop. So everyone kept saying, you're going to be like your dad. I'm like, yeah. But no, I don't know if I want to. I'm not afraid of heights. I couldn't wait to climb bridges or something that I did want to do. But I said, no, I want to definitely go more like the detective route, like, than be that cop. Because that's just what I, I don't know.

I just was in my heart, like I was going to, but I didn't know when it was going to happen. So my plan was to become a detective before I retire. That was my plan. I didn't foresee when I would say, you know what, maybe you have five years I'll do it. because it doesn't work that way. You know, things pop up. There's opening here. Narcotics is looking for people

and you'll put in for it, but you're still on probation or you don't have enough time. They usually, back then, they would require a certain amount of arrest. You know, like you would want a guy that's got 400 felony arrest, working for you,

and then a guy who's got two. Because what experience does he have? And you're going to be in a very dangerous job. Narcotics is extremely dangerous. As far as units are concerned, you know, anti-crime, street crime. You're chasing guys with guns. pulling over people for, you know, having no seatbelt on. That's not what you're doing.

If your goal is to be an active cop and be a detective in that type of, you know, career path, you want to be a guy that's wanting to move up, you want to get the medals, you want to really lock, you want to take guns off the street. You know, it's, you want the guy that at least, you know, if you're going to work, if you're a supervisor and you're going to interview a cop, you want the cop that's got all those arrests. And maybe, you know, he's in a precinct where It's not as busy. He doesn't have the opportunity to make many arrests. Well, what type of arrest were they?

Were they gun arrest? Did you take, you know, we call them biscuits, toys, gats. Did you ever take one off the guy's waistband? Nah, I kind of just gave tickets to guys that ride bicycles and sidewalks. Like, no, I don't want you to work for me. No offense, but this is not the place for you. So my goal was to be a detective, a homicide detective, but I knew that there was going to be some years in between that.

Maybe I'll change my mind, but still like in the back of the heads. Like, no, you stick with the detective. route. It took me about eight years, nine years to become a detective. Is that normal? My time was average. I did it the way it was supposed to be done as far as there's like a career path within the precinct. So you're on patrol and you do a couple of years like on foot. Maybe they stick you on a detail, you know, for this like the six six old prison has a sum of detail. I got sent there. It was great. Came back and it's very hard to get a seat in the

police car with being that young on the job or not having that much time. It used to take some guys five years. For me, it was like two and a half, just didn't have demand power. So I got lucky enough to jump into a seat. So we had a steady sector in Red Hook projects, my partner, Billy and I. And we were very active. Like uniform cops are actually like, you know, getting out, we don't tossing people, you know, with reasonable suspicion.

They knew we were out there. They knew we were doing hard work. And, you know, they'd be an opening for conditions unit, which is basically. basically quality of life. So it would be like patrol conditions, then SNU, S-N-E-U, a special street narcotics enforcement unit. And it's not about matter of, it's not about how long you're in these units for,

but maybe how much you're doing, how much you're getting done. Then the next is anti-crime. And then after that, it's like, that's when you put in for the detective bureau. And the goal for me was to be detective in that same prison I was at for so many years because I knew all the bad guys.

And they all knew me. and my partners, you know, and we had a good relationship with them with these young kids, guys and men, women, they just kind of, some hated your guts, yeah. Most of them would respect you if they get to know you. And so when you're a detective in the precinct you worked at, it's much easier when you get a robbery case

when someone throws a nickname at you. Like, yeah, I know who robbed me, man. His name is, you know, his name is Supreme. You're like, all right, I already know him, do a photo array. And like, yep, that's him. So you know the nicknames. You know the kids.

You know the guys that are starting trouble. So it makes that job more fun and easier for you. So did you do specific type of cases or was it more broad, like robberies or shootings, that type of thing? Well, I started out in a robbery unit. Right before I went into a robbery unit, it was called the RIP program, a robbery investigation program, and they turned out of a different precinct. But it was Commissioner Bernard Carrick that brought that back when I was an anti-crime. He goes, I want to bring back the robbery units.

So it was called the RAM, robbery apprehension module. So went from RIP to RAM. A lot of acronyms. NYPD has more acronyms in the entire, I'll pay you, I'll pay the studio, I'll pay your rental if I'm wrong. So I was in the RAM program and they give you 18 months. And you have 18 months to prove yourself. If you haven't done what's required of you, and that is simply making an arrest, solving cases, conducting lineups, wearing a shirt and tie every day if that was required.

Look in shop. you know, you're commanding officer at this 16th month, he gets a phone call. Hey, how's he doing? He sucks. Get rid of him. He's doing great. Keep him. You get your shield, 18 months.

And then when you get your shield, you could stay, right? Because it's an amazing tool robbery program because you're doing like real investigations. Like you're doing lineups. You're interviewing people. It's a violent crime. And if you could learn, I think that's a great stepping tool, a stepping stone to getting into the actual detect. squad where you're covering and what you had acts is murder, you know, homicide. But sometimes a simple of crime is like identity death, which is simple enough meaning

not violent, you know. So it runs a gamut like from, but it's mostly felonies. Like detectives do not, and as far as priests and detective units, PDUs, they call them. They do not investigate any misdemeanor unless it's domestic violence or a perpetrator is named during an assault, you know, and got away, you'll go out and get that person. But pretty much you're investigating like any felony, grand loss and he's, something. and took a pocketbook off someone walking down the street, you know, to a stabbing or a shooting.

Yeah, I mean, it was just, you know, a little bit of everything. Salt and Pepper, it was good. What year was this when you finally became a detective? I went into the detective bureau as what they call it White Shield. This is a regular police shield. At June 2001, and then two, three months later, 9-11 happened. So I was assigned to the morgue, the pile,

and the landfill. And why? Because a lot of people don't know this, but it was said that the World Trade Center September 11th attack was the largest crime scene

in the entire world in history. So they wanted detectives there because that's what detectives do. We preserve and we investigate crime scenes. So that's the largest crime scenes. So on the perimeter there was cops doing security, white shields, you know, from the precincts.

But detectives too, I did patrol, I did security. But then we would send, to the morgue and you know because every body part that we they found that was brought to us is evidence and so there's a chain of command right so it had to be given to a detective not just you know it had to be detectives that's what detectives do and you know off off went the evidence into different parts of the the morgue you know dental cat scan x-ray DNA or whatever it was they can do to identify the body part that was given to be it a bone this big or a

or torso, which I had for like six hours in my possession, going through all the different parts of the morgue. Did they make a makeshift morgue? They did, yeah. They was at the morgue, at the ground zero, I think along, I don't know, I'm familiar with the streets. But yeah, they did. They had trucks, too, that were refrigerated,

and so the body parts were getting put on there. Then eventually, there was a lot of body parts. And so they were, like, you know, overwhelmed. I don't know if they flew up doctors from all over the world to help. but the makeshift morgue was there for a long. So, yeah, and it was operational. And then the real morgue was the one, I should say, the brick and mortar,

you know, original morgue was the one at, you know, 30th Street and First Avenue. But NYU, I think, or Bellevue, I think I forget. That was the, where the original morgue was. That's where I was assigned to. What was going to your mind, seeing all these body parts coming in, working on that and knowing just like the atmosphere

and the world and then surrounding of what had just happened? You know, I We didn't know what the heck we were doing As far as just doing what we were told to do Because the end result was like, you know And it's because your mind was occupied with You know, I'm working 12 hours I'm not home

My family's not seeing me I just got married so I didn't even The honeymoon My wife and I got married August 24th went away It came back 9-11 happened So we didn't even have the beginning of their marriage bliss and the new home didn't exist didn't happen. And so right off to the morgue we went.

So I was preoccupied with a lot. And then like you go into soldier mode. You go into, you know, you have to shut down. You have to put that barrier up. Otherwise, you're not going to survive, you know. And you're given, I was given a foot, a head. And it's just, you just carry it around. And a lot of times what you were thinking of is like, wow, this really sucks.

But maybe now someone can have closure. So that was going through my mind. Like, so you felt important. You felt like this. This is not what we're supposed to be doing as detectives, but here we are doing it. And we're like soldiers, we're told to do it and we do it and we did it. And we were a part of that unfortunate day. But I think in the end, it was mentally exhausting.

You started to get, they're giving you 12 hours shifts, you know, and you don't really eat right. You're not sleeping. So that plays a role into your mental state, you know, your mental state while being handled. a body part of a woman's head and it's just, you know, you start finding comedy in this stuff later on because it's the only way cops and firemen in particular

had to know how to cope with you know, seeing such malevolence, you know what I mean? And it's, but you felt good after it was old. You're like, okay, man, I took care of that poor woman and I made sure that that body part of that woman or man was safe with me and now their family could rest.

But there was a lot going to do our mind because there was some days where you're like I just want to go home I've seen enough today I've seen enough body parts I'm done you know it just it really isn't for most people like myself would catch up me for years later but you felt important you were sad um fortunately for me silver lining I guess was Jimmy Riches was a fireman who was killed graduated the police academy with him 1993 we graduated um huge family great great people. My dad happened to be very good friends with his father. He was a fireman. When a policeman or a fireman were found, like there would be a bell and we'd all come out,

we'd drop whatever we were doing. I mean, not literally, you know, but if we had a body pot, and we'd salute just like you would see them when they found them in the pile. Everyone would stand in attention salute. And I see Jimmy's father. And I was like, oh my God. Now Jimmy and I weren't best of friends, but we were friends. We drank together. We hung out together. then he later went to FD, we call it Flight Department. But he kept in touch with the circle I did. And we knew that it was just a matter of time before we found out who we lost as friends

that were cops and firemen. It was cops right away because there weren't as many, obviously. He was fine and he was like, oh my God, this guy was there. Oh, Steve, you're not going to believe it. It was just like, you know, a few guys you knew, you know. It was like, it was crazy. But I was on, I was crying. So it was such an honor to be there that his body was intact.

He was in uniform, you know, because, I mean, you don't, you don't, you know, wants to see their child or brother like that anyway. I don't want to describe what the body looked like, but it was better the way he was found than the way other people were, which were in pieces and, you know, just horrible. So I went up to Mr. Riches and I think he was James. I said, Mr. Riches, I'm Bobby Gates's son. He goes, Stephen, how are you? I said, what can I do? I couldn't even answer him. I said, can I help you? He goes, Steve, what can you do? And I hugged him and I remember him saying, here he is with his son, right, with his two other,

three other sons stand there. I think it was at least two of them crying and he said to me, tell you dad, I said hi. You know, like these little things you just don't forget and salute and off Jimmy went to be properly

put together, you know, so to speak and for the funeral home. So I got to say goodbye to a friend. I mean, all of that madness I got to say goodbye to a friend. Not a close. America's first pledge was freedom.

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GLP-1 pill for weight loss. Go to row.com slash journey to see if you qualify. 14 to 20% average weight loss in one year in non-diabetics with obesity or overweight with a weight-related medical condition versus 2.2% to 3.1% in placebo-R. RX only. To stay informed about serious side effects, go to row.com slash safety. I was a friend, but a friend, a brother, maybe even, you know. Do you remember where you were at the day that it happened?

Yeah, yeah. I was driving down Ocean Parkway dropping my wife off at the train. And the police cars, I live in Brooklyn, so you're here in police cars all day. An ambulance is fire trucks. But I said to my wife, like, after like 20 minutes, it's like a 45 minute ride, maybe even less, somewhere in between that. I said, what's what all the fire trucks like? It just hasn't, she's like, you know, I noticed that too. like it just hasn't stopped.

I was about seven miles from my house to dropping off at, so it was like a 14 mile drive. So we're halfway. And I'm like, it just hasn't stopped. And I look up and I see like the smoke by the time I got to 9th Street like in like 4th Avenue. Because I think it's a hill, I believe. And so you're able to see the Twin Towers. I see the smoke.

I go, oh, some idiot must have crashed into, you know, like a small plane. What it was like an updick in the air conditioning. a fight because it was black smoke and looked like chemicals. Drop off at the train at 9, around 9 o'clock or a little bit earlier because I forget what time the towers were hit. Well, obviously the first one was hit. By the time I got

to my precinct, which was a few blocks, we found the spot. We were watching it. I see the plane hit the towel the second time. And my partner, Patty, at the time, very sharp guy. Like, we just were just like two. Like, we really just didn't get it. Like, and we, I had worked really sharp guys and they were just like, what the

hell? And Pat says, we're on under attack dude. I'm like, no, really? Why? He's like, we better suit up. Here's a funny part, right? You always got to find humorous. None of us could fit in our uniform. We were, you know, like, overweight. Within just a year of me, a few months, I was an anti-crime for so many years.

I didn't wear a uniform for like five years. And I'm like, I was like, I can't fit. So I'm trying to put our uniforms on. The sergeant comes out. There was no radio because that's where we have most of our towers, you know, on the Twin Towers other than one police plaza. So our communications were down. Oh, they were in the towers?

On top, you know, like the Twin Towers has those radios. So that knocked out all police communication? For a while, yeah, they had the backups. There's backups, you know, that generators maybe, and they have other locations that are secret because it just didn't last that long. They came on, but we didn't know what the F to do. And we were frustrated because my precinct 7-6 is right above, literally like a few blocks away from the Brooker Battery Tunnel.

That goes right through the Twin Towers. And it was a parking lot. We couldn't get there. And we're running around because I was a cop when the World Trade Center was attacked. I believe February 23rd of 2008, 1992. 1992. 1999. It's like graduated January of Academy.

So it was February 28th, a Wednesday. And we were like, you know, like I was 20 years old. Like let's go like, you know, get those damn terrorists or whoever it was. And it was like, no, it's, they got it. So now we were like frustrated. Like we can't, here we are again. And it was so many years later in uniform that didn't fit. but we wanted to get down there in the worst way

because we felt useless sitting in that office, waiting for, you know, orders. And then some of us just actually just left. Like, Sarge, we're leaving. You can't leave, boss, no disrespect. I got to go down there. Well, you know, call me when you get there. There was no cell phone service.

We couldn't get there. We were trying to get through the tunnel. And their TBTA cops, they, I guess they supersede us. It's their property. But they would have led us through. We were in uniform, but they were like, guys, man, just go. don't go there.

Just there's nothing you could do. And so we came back. You know, we walked back, you know, drove back on where we were able to drive. So, yeah, I remember exactly where I was. It was Ocean Parkway with my wife, ready to drop off the train. First tower. Second tower was when I got to the precinct. And then I watched them fall down.

And the precinct is above Hick Street and to BQE. And you could always feel the ground shaken, which is because all the 18-wheelers and heavy trucks drive on Hick Street when there's traffic on the BQA. And they're heavy. And the precincts right there. It would rumble. So we felt the rumbling.

And I'm like, that's not the trucks on Hick Street because it was a parking lot. There was no traffic moving. So we're like, we all run up to the roof and we saw it come down. So I,

because the rumbling I thought was the truck for a second coming up to the street. But we're like, no, it's a parking lot. Nobody's driving. And then the rumble, we could feel

because the Twaints and towers is right across the East River. You could like throw a rock at it if you had Darrell Strawberry's arm. So we felt it. We felt it. I mean, it went right through the water. And then the smoke was like just we couldn't see literally eight inches in front of our face. That day and then the coming days after did all like major crime from like gangs and any

mob related stuff stopped completely. So they all respected what was going on. It was amazing. Oh. And it was like if nobody would. died on September 11th. Maybe they could do this every so many months. Like just an explosion that scares people.

Nobody gets hurt. And just fake news and say, yeah, 8,000 people kill it. That sounds crazy, I know. But it worked. What I mean by working is everybody was devastated. You know, so what the terrorists did work for them. But in a way, I mean, everyone just came together. So many beautiful and horrible things happened that day.

but one of them was that there was no even the criminals has my point meaning it worked you know for us as far as the good that might have come out of this is that there was like nobody killing each other for like months there was no crime was nothing going on even the criminals would see us and like literally they would wave to us like a guy that would shoot at me last week

was like you know they just the respect it was amazing I'm like wow I guess something came out good it came out of this that's really what I'm trying to say something the silver lining it was tiny It was tiny, but it was something that we were like shocked about, quite taken back. But it was like it took a terrorist attack, 2,000 people, you know, 3,000 later for them to be friendly to us and not commit crimes. Yeah, were any of those like higher level, like gang members or mafia members helping out in the community, like doing like food drives or anything during this time? I didn't see it where I worked, but I know for a fact that, I mean, we could talk about like Models came down. Dick's sporting goods, like all those stores

came down with equipment like boots and gloves and stuff like that. So there was a lot of that. There was a lot of volunteer like Red Cross type people and them too, them as well, that were at the website given eye wash, you know, giving people like equipment.

But as far as the neighbor's concern and like the donations and food, I didn't see it. If I knew the mafia was involved, I don't know. They could have been. Were they still? present in 2001?

Yeah, yeah. Not quite like the 80s and 90s, but they were there. Yeah, where I worked, yeah. Was the killing still going on or did that ultimately stop? That stopped. Yeah. If it happened, it wasn't reported. But as far as us getting in a case, it was just dead body and wrapped up in

a trunk, it was like, no. There was no mob hits. Even going on later in the early 2000s? No, I came back slowly. I know there was some, you know, some murders regarding the mafia. And I wasn't in organized crime, which is OSID, organized crime investigation division, to know more about what the mobs. I would follow the news and what I would hear on the streets where I work.

Because I worked in Red Hook, Carol Gardens, which is a breeding ground, much like it's like the Howard Beach of Brooklyn. You know, it was all mafia, like Court Street and it was just all mobsters. How do you feel about like the corrupt cops from your time period that are now doing interviews talking about all their times? I'm sure you've seen them. Yeah, Michael Dowd. I'm an old-school guy. I have to respect the guy because he didn't rat. I'm big with that ratting.

Volpey with the plunger, I probably would rat out of a cop that did that. That's disgusting, right? But, you know, we want to talk about what do you rat when don't you rat? He's a stand-up guy in a way that he didn't rat as far as, like, the blue wall of silence. A lot of people don't like, like, the bad guys don't like that. It's like, well, you do it too. But what we're doing is we're making sure our partner's not getting fired because maybe he went a little bit too much on the,

maybe he's hit the perpetrator too hard. He'll get over it. What you guys are doing is shoot and killing people, right? But yet you hate rats that will rat you out, but you hate that we don't give each other up. But our stuff is minor. I mean, you know, that plunger incident is super, I hope to God it never happens again.

But, you know, sometimes even then it's hard for a cop to even believe that something like that happens. To this day, I still say myself, that really didn't happen. What is the plunger into it? When Abelahima was shoved, the officer's last name was Volpe, worked in the 7-0 precinct. And the perpetrator, well, they arrest him for assault and in the bathroom in the 7-0 precinct. He was found guilty to cop, so it's not alleged. He shoved the plunger up Abba's butt.

And for what? Because he didn't like that he was resisting arrest. He was a loud mouth. He was intoxicated. He was disrespectful to the cop. but you just don't do that man like ever like you know that was a but cops were like that didn't happen this guy's making this up like there's no cop and guys knew him you know volpe and his father was a detective and he was a well-known his father's well-known guy he was like the art police like he had

he had an he was like an artist he had an eye for art like if his art was stolen he actually went and would be of identify if there was a real Mona Lisa or not like he was like the only detective in the world that he could do that so his family was known so like now he just know Justin Volpe. There's no way he would have done that. And then he admitted it. Yeah, because like, and then another cop came forward

because there wasn't as many police officers in that bathroom as they allegedly had said so. Originally it said so. There might have been one other cop, and I think he went to prison too. So if I were to see that now, I would be like, you're calling up internal affairs right now,

and I'm going to stay here while you get locked up. I'm not going to be. You're going to rat yourself out. But, Michael Volpe, I'm sorry, Michael Dowd, I don't condone. anything what he did because

he wasn't just shaking guys down or taking money like in the 50s and 40s where the cops were meeting up with the gangsters at the card games and they were getting an envelope and it went to the captain. I was like everybody was happy. Like I probably had done the same shit too in 1950. Fuck you. I'm not dealing drugs. I'm not hurting anybody.

I'm not putting guns and cocaine on the street. Dowd pushed it. Like he is the thing like he was a perp with a shield. I have to agree with that. You know, he was like putting cocaine. He was selling drugs. So he was adding to the dangerous of the streets of being a civilian, which comes first and yourself. You want to take money from a gambling store to show, get money from the local bodega,

get free cigarettes, really go right ahead. But what he did was like, is it forgivable? Yeah, I kind of figure, why not? You know, he's changed man. He seems a little kooky sometimes, in my opinion, on podcast. And there was a guy who worked at his friends and said, hey, he's a bit of a sociopath. I'm like, who isn't? I mean, this poor guy.

like did his time. He was in 12 years in prison as a police officer. Did he deserve it? Yeah, maybe he did. But now he's born again as far as his attitude. You know, I don't know if he is born again Christian, but he goes to the police academies and teaches guys, don't do what I did.

So he's like, he's, you know, he's making his bones with being a better man and maybe spreading that to other guys so they don't do to make the same mistake he did. Do you think it's harder to do what he did as, you know, the years went on? towards the end of your career? Do you think there was more of that happening, or was it harder to do?

It's way harder to do. I mean, I've come across money in the 90s when I was on patrol. Like I said, we were searching guys because we had probable cause, at least reasonable sufficient. And I'd pull that like $600. That's like what I made in like a month as a cop or every two. In 1992, we were making like $300 a week. Like, you could stop these guys every week and they'll have that.

Was I tempted? Absolutely. Well, who wouldn't be tempted when the bad guy is making more money than you and it's right in your hand. I wasn't like that. I wasn't born and raised like that and I was not that cop right back in his pocket. I'd say to him, bro, I just put that. Yeah, that's in your pocket, man. I got you.

Thank you. What do you do for a living? Construction. Good. I need a sheet rock guy. What are you doing Saturday? So the temptation is there. Any cop that tells you, you know, they were never tempted at least once or twice.

They're lying to you. But I didn't do it. And I never worked with a cop that did it. and if you try it to do it these days I see cops getting fired and you know on the news and stuff and you're like you're such an idiot there was a cop that robbed us

the bank in his precinct while on his lunch break you look at that up I don't remember what precent was but he put his sweatshirt over he's like you know I mean he took his stuff off but he had his dress blues on

or his cargo pants and he goes to the teller that casts his check every so many times he'll go into the bank and she's like you know Johnny what are you doing he's like give me all the money guys just go to, you know, with the note, on his lunch break, like, you're going to have those,

you're going to have those incidents. There's going to be cops that just slipped through the cracks, didn't pass the psychology test, like, you know, or didn't, their background fingerprints didn't come back. They were warranted in Florida for a carjacking, which, by the way, happened. They were doing the rush hiring. There wasn't enough cops. Nobody wanted the job. I forget what years it was.

But when these guys are doing this stuff now, I'm like, you know, You got to laugh and say, you're big dope. Like there's 4,000 cameras. Everybody's got a video. What are you doing? You know, you're stealing, you know, trying to rob a bank or you're shaking a guy down. There's people got dash cams. I don't condone the behavior.

But if you're going to do it, like, really, now's not the time. This ain't 1987 no more, bro. Or even 1990 or 2000. What do you think was like the funniest case you ever worked where someone like maybe got caught in a funny way or something like that? Oh, there's so many. Well, it's something I did, actually. I don't know if it's really, I can give you two quick ones, but one of them was the cops have a sick sense of humor, like sick.

Not borderline psychotic, but maybe they do. I don't know. But we all can be in one room and say something nuts and we'll all laugh. And then we're like, we just laughed at like one of the sickest, edgy jokes you could ever tell. Well, when you're faced with violence and malevolence and just hatred, it's like it's your only line of defense. So we do crazy things too. So when you, as a rookie, most of the time when you're a rookie, you're the one that gets stuck on a DOA, dead on arrival. Most of the time, and thank God it's never a child.

You know, the majority, it's usually someone elderly that passed on, like, we call natural causes, you know, heart attack or they had diabetes at all age, and they just, you would respond. They'd be like 20 medications on the table. You're like, all right, no one killed this person, although you would check for gunshot wounds or stab wounds. And you'd call the doctor, and a doctor would release the body to the morgue, to the, to the, funeral home. But while you're there, it can be a stinky eight hours, you know, a horribly smelly eight hours. We used to burn coffee, old time. I said burn coffee or put coffee grinds in a, in a pan, in a kitchen. And that smell takes away anything. And I mean, I've had some smelly ones. But this particular case, and I, because of my dad and my brother, I had an early talent, if so I was told

of how to have a good sense of humor as a cop. And, uh, So I go to this D-OA in the confines of the 7-6 priest. I don't quite remember the address. And the body was removed. So technically, once the body is removed, the rest of the tour is yours. You'll go back to the priest and sage, you know, they'll... So it could work for you where, you know,

they'll make you want to go home, take a little lost time, or maybe you want to go on a footpost and, you know, go chase some bad guys. Or you get stuck in a hospital and the hospitalized prison, which sucks. So it's so boring. So it's kind of like, do I leave?

And so the body left, and it was right towards the next shift because it was there for a while I should say I'm sorry so the next shift the cop's got to relieve me face to face so the body was removed and the cop that came in

and say Steve you know so-and-so's out here he's parking the car I said no problem I said dude get me that white sheet over there and I lay down on the couch the body was in the bed I was not going to lay on the bed you know so I put the sheet over me

and laid back on the couch and there was no cell phones man this would have been great but the cop who was driving was the old-time alley great guy I had since passed away unfortunately but he was just probably one of the funniest guys never smiled but you knew he was cracking up so he knew what I was doing he just let me have

I mean he was like go ahead go have at it so I'm laying there in his alley so the body's right there he just got he didn't know I was a young kid so he just got to wait for the funeral home to show up they're gonna pull the body out to the funeral home so I'm sitting there he leaves and then it's just the two of them just

getting the paperwork ready and Ali goes you know you might want to just keep an eye on and I hear this and I fucking sit up with the sheet on and the cop

made a B-line so fast out of that apartment Ali Badergill never really laughed much he was a serious guy he was hysterical laughing I made that guy laugh I knew what I did was funny

but that cop shit his pants he ran tight actually went out I felt so bad because really like you think a dead body he's going to sit up, but he fell for it. It worked. And that was probably one of the funniest moments

I ever had. Like, as a rookie just starting out, I'm like, this is the best job ever. That's funny. Yeah, it was funny. But the other one is people, we talk about mostly just third persons and why cops shoot guys with knives, right? They want us to shoot in a hand with T.J. Hooker, they think, you know, it's almost impossible.

Even if you're a pistol expert, you know, a rifle a rifleman and marksmen. They hit a moving target, especially under duress, especially if the cops are in a circular, because then you have crossfire. And it happens. Guys are like surrounding, you know,

this guy with a machete, screaming. And this happened to me. And they want doctors to show up. And, you know, unless you're going to shoot a guy with a tranquilizer, you know, it's not going to happen.

Or you're not going to talk him down. He's gone. He, it's mostly he, because that's who I dealt with what it was meant. They're at that point now where that's what 911 is for because maybe an average guy

might be able to handle himself or he's not afraid. Someone's called me because they're terrified. This guy's got a machete. He's six foot four. He's naked head to toe. Okay? And let's just say he was excited in a certain way.

And it was like another arm. And he's just swinging around with all kinds of stuff. And we're like, this guy gets a whole of us. What is going to happen? We're trying to grab him. He's got baby oil and Vaseline all over his face. We couldn't grab him once we got the machete. One of the guy is Nicestek actually got the machete out.

We're chasing this naked man. 6 foot 4, 300 pounds, with a raging erection, and he's now he's heading towards the monkey bars with kids. You can't make this stuff up. And we're like, well, if we tackle him, like, we're just going to slide off him. And he's got Vaseline on every part of his body.

I don't know. And now we just start laughing because, you know, it was getting, like, is anybody, is this a fake? Are we being set up? And so the realistic thing is that we could have easily have killed him because we told him to drop that machete many times.

Most of the time, cops are able to do that. They just don't show that on the news. They're able to disarm a man verbally. Unfortunately, the violence happens, the anger, the mental illness that this person is suffering from, is just not enough time for even ESU, like when my dad was to come and net him, tase him, water cannon him, you know, wrap him up with, you know, they're called a shepherd's crook, you know, you can put him up against the wall, like, all that stuff is not effective. It's great when it's right there. And at the time, cops did not carry tasers, only sergeants did.

but now everybody has them. So now they use them. I mean, they work sometimes. You know, mace works sometimes. It's better now than the mace I had was a cop because it turns out the mace we had. If there was a vicious dog, dogs don't have tear ducks, at least pit bulls.

That was the common dog that the drug deals had. And you'd mace it and they would just shake it off so that they came out with a more powerful mace into the 2000. And I've used it once on a guy. I mean, he was as big as a truck and he put him right down to his knees. he wouldn't put his arms behind his

he was a U-Haul truck he stole it I'm like, listen just put your hands my back bro, it's over I know he wasn't running this guy was as big as an elephant could not run I said just put your hands 14 pair of cuffs later

but he wouldn't do it I said I'm gonna mace you bro it's kind of hurt he's like go ahead I dare you I'm like really why are you making me do this like I hit him with it snot

I'm sorry and I actually hugged him I fell bad for mine I told you he's in a cell up man I shouldn't listen to you I go you think when a police officer tells you there's something legally you probably should do it

that's my advice you for the future, I said to him, I'm never doing this again. And it's not, we're still coming out of his nose. It works. But we would chase to this naked man, mason and him wasn't working, throwing rocks at him. We were just, the helicopter was up. He was naked, full of body oil. And finally, ESU was able to get there.

And they had come with like Velcrofts straps and, I don't know, a blanket. I don't even remember they tackled him. But it was like 20 of us at this point. Because the guy was throwing us off like fly. It's just not going to say. They're powerful men. man, when they're strong on the mental duress, they have that strength. You know, they go into like a psychosis.

And people are like, well, why do they shoot them? It's like, well, there's a machete in a schoolyard, 15 kids. You want to wait for the doctor to show up? They want to wait for the psychologist to come here and talk them out of, you know, wanting to kill people. He doesn't know what he's doing. I actually feel bad for people like that. I do.

Years ago, I'd say, F him, he deserved it. Now I look at him and say, you know, he needs help. He needs medication. Why isn't it there for him? Why is it some poor cop now has to live with that for the rest of his life And he had to take it on a man's life It sucks to do that it really does And now you see it more in the news like the guy that burned himself in front of the Trump trial

Oh my God You see it all the instances you're describing You see it now actually on TV and on TikTok and on social media Because people have cell phones Yeah, it's just immediately ready available to the film yeah Which makes you think this stuff has always been there It's just where the world necessarily hasn't changed what changes the showcasing of it.

Yes. But this has gone on since, you know, forever in a way. So it kind of makes you think about what was the actual root to this. This wasn't just created yesterday because of some politician in office or something. This was created years and years ago. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's like, is it evolution? And we're still evolving.

I think it's like, well, did we get any better? Like, you ever see that meme? It's like the, from the museum of natural history, right, starts, with like the ape or the bonobo and then it turns into man and is it is it mean that a guy says he turns around he goes go back we fuck this up like man like we did we just ruin everything like men does but so yeah like this has been going on forever like you know all these these these the violence the mostly they used to be called psychos on the radio when i first became a police officer it says you can't say psycho no more it's now edp emotionally disturbed person because

it's not politically correct. And like that's when I started seeing like the weakness of the focus of what's really important and hurting someone's feeling or actually saving the guy's life regardless of what you're going to call him over police radio. It's not unannounced on a podcast, right? It's not on YouTube. It's a police radio, which yes, people have scanners, can hear that. But like we're going to start arguing over what we call. Is it a cruel word?

Yeah. But is this really like an important thing rather than just get this? I mean, that poor sergeant, lieutenant, he tagered a guy and the guy fell off. He probably shouldn't have done it, I think, for what I understand is it wasn't right. But I don't know what the outcome was, but he tased it at EDP. And he was like on the top of a security gate in a store or like a fire escape. And he fell to his death. But I think what he later found out that he had a weapon or he was threatening to do something.

And the only action they could take was to safely get him off there. the zap might he would have just jumped to his feet do I think I don't want a Monday quarterback I wasn't there but I saw it on the news I'm like that does not look good like you're tasing a guy that you know he's going to fall 12 feet maybe to his head crack his head open but the fact is that there have been things cops have done mistakenly not thinking and out and they've been punished as right as they should you know you shouldn't be one around dealing drugs as a policeman you know again perp with a badge I I would it's dishonorable

for me to put on that same uniform as the guy that's doing like, you know, criminal stuff. Were cops being targeted like they are now in the streets that you read about back then? I mean, as far as, when you say targeted, because of the hatred of them now,

like the BLM riots and stuff like that. I would say more like the targeted shootings. Like there's a lot of officer involved, or a lot of officer-related shootings where people have sought them out and directly shot at them. This is the 70s. all over again. I say that because in the 70s

the BLA were doing that. They would just in fact there's quite a few pleaded and forgive me for not remember their names but there's a couple of cops too in particular where the back doors of a van opened up and they rifled them killed the two cops. And it was a rare thing for two cops to die at the same time. It was always one.

You know, never heard more than one. Fiamen usually die in multiple because they stick together in a fire. You know, for room collapses, they're stuck and unfortunately they perish. But for cops to die in multiples, it was very rare. So the BLM, they, you know, this is talking to the rate,

you know, the interwebs, you know, it's the new, it's the modern day BLA, Black Liberation Army. And Roman, Louis, Lewis, I'm sorry, it's Louis Ramos and then the Asian cop. I forget his name.

I think his Lou, he was killed. To two cops that was shot, executed in Bedstai, sitting there to protect the neighborhood. and they were killed by that. And they were targeted. And then, like, it just kept happening after that, you know, where cops were getting shot in partners, like, you know, duplicates, two at once.

And, yeah, it was like the 70s. They were targeting actual targeting cop. Because when they were arrested, they had, like, manifestos, what they called, their internet, they got their whole of their accounts, and they had stuff written down. So they were, like, outright hunting cops. Yeah, that's something else. Enjoy every day like it's the weekend at Treasure Island with special rates of only $79 midweek.

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RX only go to row.com slash safety for serious side effects and boxed warning associated with GLP-1s. It hasn't happened to the 70s. And dying in Paris, too. It's so odd. It just doesn't happen. Why do you think that was? Like, did you guys ever look into the psychology of these, you know, suspects? Yeah, the psychology of it is, from what I read is that is, is the media, the, the media sucks. It's just, they're pumping out the bad parts that you see of a police, you know,

interaction that looks violent on, which it does. And it is. on somebody's phone and the buildup of it, of the cops of this, cops are racist, cops of that, it's social media and it just grows. And then everyone or someone who has maybe even thought about doing it, killing a cop, is now going to do it because they're seeing so much of it, you know, TikTok, Facebook.

They can't get away from it. Friends are texting them, Joe, Matt, you, I know you wanted to do it, just check this out. Here's a video of a cop beating up a, you know, 12-year-old kid. Now that 12 year old kid happens to be 6-2 And he just took a swipe at the cop with a knife They don't tell you that part They don't show you that part

But it happens, I guarantee you it happens But the majority of the people I think in this world It actually like cops and are good people I really do But it's that small percentage And that's all it takes And they're getting a hold of all this hatred

Through social media and the news And then yeah I think it just pisses them off And they go out And they have their reasons Maybe they were they saw their father get arrested and get beat up unnecessarily by police officer and maybe they have their reasons

to hate the police or at least hate the police officers that did them wrong, but to hate everybody, like we could always go back of foot we say that. Dude, don't hate the actions of one cop, you know, and hate all the cops because of the bad actions of one. But they seem to do that with the police. Like, everybody else gets away with it, but the cops.

Yeah, you know. I feel like New York City has been doing in recent times a great job of community policing with having a lot of officers in groups on the street. and you see the interaction on social media where, you know, officers are talking to, like, tourists or they're talking to whoever just on the street casually, being human, having a conversation and having that access.

The keyword is human. It's, you know, like, God, it's like people say to me, like a lot of times it's like girls I dated, women dated, and later on my wife's friends, well, they would ask Tony, like my wife's name is Tony. Are you afraid that, you know, of Steve and not coming home? She's like, I really don't think about it. It's like, we're freaking human.

man. It's like we took this job most of us because we really wanted to do something. We wanted to be a cop because our fathers, our grandfathers, we saw it on TV. Whatever it was, you're putting on that uniform, you're risking your life. And to do a job that a lot of people

want to do it because they see it on movies, but maybe after they've done it for two weeks, and it's happened. Like, I've had people, when I was in academy, we had people drop out second day. They couldn't take me and yelled at it. It was like, it was like boot camp, not quite like the Marine Corps. No way. near it, but screaming and cursing,

and spitting in your face, and I'm sitting at 20 years old taking it. Be it where people left two days later, this ain't for me. You know, so, give them somewhat the benefit of the doubt that they're really trying to do a good job, or maybe they just want to do what's expected of them, to bear minimal, but they're a target.

When was the last time you heard someone wanting to kill nurses for no reason, you know, or, you know, I mean, we pick any non-law enforcement category. You know, law, police, business and I said this is ugly business. It's not pretty at all.

So the video you saw the cop hand homeless man's shoes or helps the elderly woman cross the street. That happens every fucking day. I've done it myself. Maybe not so much the shoes, but stopped in the rain. Got it, grabbed an umbrella. Man, let me help you cross the street. Help someone

change their flat tire. I don't want to be a sexist, but it was always a woman. Didn't know how to jack up a car. I pull over. Billy, pull over this woman. And we get over, we got it. You know, I've seen guys that I've worked with done it dozens of times. They just don't show that. They don't, you know, you don't see that.

So we're human. We want nothing more than for people to come up to us and say, hi, thank you. Thank you for your service. We're not requiring it, but when you do it, when they do it, like you smile. And then it's happened to me. I was like, you have a nice smile.

You should do that more often. I'm like, we're not used to that. We're not used to people saying, thank you. Oh, hello, because we're like staunch, cold, and we're afraid, maybe. You know, or maybe we're just on alert, like you're in a bad neighborhood or a high crime neighborhood. And a woman going by just mumbles. Thank you so much.

Appreciate it. And you're like, you're welcome. Like, you know, you're going to get beat up for saying hello to us. So that's why people say cops look mean and look angry. You'd be surprised. You go up to them and say, hey, man, thanks for your service. And that smile cracks and you're like just made their day. So the humor interaction, the community policing is tremendous.

It's a great thing that the police department had come up with is to bridge that gap with the community. because the lack of communication and the social media stuff is destroying the relationship between what the police should have and maybe already do have. It's a little bit of both. And I think if you have that

and you have good public relations, announcements, police officers go to schools and to inner city schools where most kids are victims of crime because of victims of abuse or become criminals statistically. Go to those schools and talk to them and tell them,

this is what you do when a cop stop. you. If you're 1,000% right, still put your arms up. Please do it. Cops are trigger happy. Not true. It's not true at all. Is it possible that there have been in the past and will be cops that may look to want to kill? Sure. You know, you know, they're human. They might have squeezed through that psychology test and they're just nuts. And now they, this is what they, this is how they were able to express themselves, you know, hurt somebody. It's to legally own a gun. I can do it. I can become a cop. I'm a social pet. I'll beat the, uh, I'll beat the, uh, this is how they're able to express themselves. You know, hurt somebody. It's to legally own a gun. I can do it. I can become a cop. I'll be the, I'll be I'll beat the psychology test. I know how to answer it. And actually, no, they were psycho with a gun. It's there, absolutely. But it's like barely exists. But when it does, it's like,

it's like, well, you know what? There was something wrong with the guy. He doesn't represent 99.9% of the cops that are out there. You know, he snuck through. He squeezed in, got by the investigation. We don't want that guy with us, a girl. We don't want, we don't want. Get rid of them.

They belong in jail. They need help. Now, as a detective out of your suspects, how many would you say have a record? These ones that are that are committing maybe a serious crime. Is it a first-time offender or is it normally a history? Sometimes, yeah. But there's almost always a history when the perpetrator is older.

I mean, that just makes sense, right? But you'd be surprised. I had a particular suspect that he had a very distinguished description. He was a male black, but he was very nice. not, although we've had them, cases, them, where albinos, very rarely. So everybody knows the albino in the neighborhood in Red Hook Project. He had a nickname. And everyone's like, have you seen so-and-so-late?

We all know who he was. If he committed, God forbid he committed a crime, he was getting caught. Everyone knows his nickname. And everyone knows he's the only albino African-American or male black in Red Hook. So, but this one particular case, kid was 18, 17 years old. and he called the Chinese food delivery like a dope because call ID comes up and when they arrived he beats them up, takes the food and the money

I call the number he answers here's the funny part I locked him up two nights before for a robbery didn't recognize the number I had no reason to but I recognize his voice I'm like hey is this so-and-so yeah I'm like dude you were in my cell two days ago you just beat up the Chinese guy and took it and he hangs up the phone so I do a subpoena on the phone came back to his father

knocking a door, you're under arrest for robbery. You know, he had a history for murder twice. He killed two people when he was 14 and 15. And got out. Murder, yeah. He was able to get self-defense. He killed him. We know he killed him.

I wasn't a detective at the time. I was a police officer. I remember that. I'm like, you killed those two, and he did. And he beat it. He was a sharp kid. He won. He did not get convicted for murder.

He was able to, his mom was there, a grandma. No, he had the gun. the knife, my grandson, he had a good story. He was a slick, a slick, smart, sharp street kid. Well, you know, I was interviewing a criminal defense attorney who had a client that won, like, two separate murder cases. And he says, all that does is propels them because then they feel invincible. Yeah. And also on the flip side that no prosecutor wants to go up against, unless it's like a refuted, like, crime boss where they're really after them. But someone in a small city, like in Connecticut, that's beaten two murder cases.

Yeah. Are they really going after the person on the third one? It's tough. You don't want to be the prosecutor that loses like that. It's like, you know, and that's, well, thank God there's no statute of limitations. Oh, I'm sorry. Well, on murder, yeah. And you can't be tried for the same crime twice, but for murder you can,

as long as it's been an acquittal or a hung jury or something like that. You can keep going after. I don't think an acquittal because then they're not guilty. They're not guilty, right? But a hung jury. Yeah, a hung jury. You can keep retrying the case. Yes.

I should know better, right? I'm tired 12 years now, so to my view, anyone watching my apologies, it's been a long time. But so this kid, like I said, he was 17 or 18, we locked up, beat two murders, and he had the most probably beautiful eyes ever seen him. Like, you could see through a hazel,

and that's how everybody knew him is, so-and-so with the hazel eyes. And I say, oh, so it's like, we all know who this guy is. So I said to him, dude, you need to, have masks and stuff. Like, everybody knows who you are.

And guess what happens? He never shows up at his court date. I get a phone call from Nassau County Detective Squad. Homicide Bureau, Homicide, you know, he goes, Detective Gates, are you looking for so-and-so? Yeah, he goes, he's at the morgue. No, I'm sorry. He's in my office because I had another open robbery on him.

He pulled another Chinese food delivery after I arrested him. This is what he did. He was picked out of a lineup because of his eyes and it was, we had the fair lineup, you know, but we had to call ID with his name this time. It's a long story, but we were able to prove the case. He got indicted, but you can indict a ham sandwich, whatever. After he got indicted, he flew to Freeport, Long Island.

Apparently, he was a passenger in a cab and didn't want to pay for his fare. So he puts the gun, a gun, to the back and the head of the port cab driver. The cab driver says, fuck, you have slams the gas pedal into a tree. The gun caught into the... perpetrator I was looking for, he said that's what made the gun go off. That, you know, the crash. So he killed the driver, knocked unconscious. So it comes over as a police accident, as an accident.

So the police respond to a car collision. And they get there and this guy with his brain's blown out and an unconscious dude because the gun fell on the seat. The cops like, what the hell is, you know, this guy's unconscious. And this guy's brains are like all over the windshield. And he's like, oh, he must have, maybe there's another guy. eventually got the gun underneath the seat where it landed. He came to, you know, in handcuffs,

and they're like, it was a dash camera in the car. It was a camera inside the car. What the whole thing? Because a cabs, a lot of cabs, they don't now as much as they should because they're available and they're cheap. Amazon practically gives them away. This particular guy had the video camera.

So he goes, if you want to add the chart, I said, now I go, I'm just going to close my case out. He says he's going to go to prison for life. He's done. So that was his third murder. But that's what makes people not have faith in the criminal justice system when they have that. And I know a big topic in New York was letting people out on bail from Rikers and then going out there and then that one guy that did all the slashing with the knife. On the subway too, right?

Yeah. There's multiple cases ever since. And I think that was around your time period where they passed those bail laws. No, I was retired. I mean, that's as recently. I've been retired 12 years from now. No, if they, if there was, I mean, Brooklyn was wishy-washy, Brooklyn District Attorneys. And it's not the people that are actually work.

Some of them were great attorneys, great district attorneys. It's the chief district, it's the, you know, the actual DA himself that was like, no, this isn't enough, but that's not enough. Or, you know, I was told when I made my, like, second gun arrest, they didn't indict the guy. I mean, had it in his waistband. And when I pulled the car over, he threw it under the seat. And I recovered it. And he was like, ah, you know, I carry, like, he actually. confessed, he said I had made statements,

but he wasn't Mirandized yet. He's like, I carry for protection, but that's called spontaneous utterance. If you spit something out, it's usually admissible. So they threw it out. They didn't even let it go before a true bill, indictment. I said to the district attorney,

I won't say her name. I go, why didn't you at least try? She said, they don't believe you. They don't believe cops in general. 70% of gun cases get thrown out in Brooklyn because they think the cops actually plant the firearm on the bad guy. No, that just doesn't happen

because you give a guy a bad, loaded gun, he's going to shoot drugs? Did cops plan drugs? Oh, yeah, absolutely. And, you know, for years before I became a cop, probably when I was a cop. But nobody I knew had done it. I've never done it. But I've heard of guys that have worked with that got locked up for it. You're like, wow, I never thought that he wasn't that type of guy.

So I did know guys have done it and gotten locked up for it and fired. But you're not putting a real gun on the suspect. You're not doing it. First of all, you can't even afford it. They cost out. Street guns cost a lot of money. No serial numbers or they graved out. And I had to have nothing better to do than to go buy a gun and put on a bad guy for what?

Am I going to get a medal out of this? Yeah, if I wanted one. But that just doesn't happen. It just doesn't, you know, a gun, no. So they don't believe you. And it's like you feel like, well, my models will not do police work. But when they did get indicted and true bill, bail was high and they were in. They would get a decent amount of time or at least a year or two probation if it's first time.

offense, which this particular case the guy was. It was never been locked up. He was carrying for protection. I actually felt bad locking him up. But what brought the attention to him was he was doing burnouts in the middle of a right across street from the school yard and almost lost

control of that went into the school yard. So I was an anti-crime. We just were going to yell at him. Hey, Aho, what are you doing? There's kids here. And then he, the gun and I said, oh shit, we had a cold word, hot lunch. We got that from anti-crime. I'm sorry. Street crime. And I'm not giving that up because everybody knows that now.

It's all over the internet. Otherwise, I wouldn't have said it. The perps know. They all know. I've seen it on YouTube. I see on TikTok. They say, if a cop yells out lunch, there's something bad in the car. So I gave my code word to my partner.

He was like, just dragged them out. We took the gun. Probably one of the nicest guys ever arrested. And he was like, hey, man, you know, I'm a mechanic. And I dropped the test drive these cars in Red Hook. I can get killed. I'm like, well, you almost took out a whole school yard full of kids doing your burnouts. And I was just going to yell at you.

I don't write tickets. And when anti-crime, we don't write tickets. Anyway, if we were, it would be like a quality of life ticket. Someone pissing the street or drinking and something like that. And even that was rare. We were just looking for guns and robberies and burglaries, violent crimes. That's what we were looking for. This dope was spinning around and had a gun on him.

He got a year probation. So, I mean, you know, he wasn't that guy. But this whole no bail stuff is new, you know, for me. But it's, it's, I shake my head at it. So we don't know about sexual predators. too. And sexual abuse, you know, pedophiles, whatever was the, you know, people who

gentlemen, my dad's a gentleman, men who sexually abuse young children, boys or girls, are not getting freaking bail. I don't, I, it's since, I, well, they're getting bail. They're getting bail, you know, but it's like, they're getting released like right away. But they're getting small sentences. They're getting bail, small sentences. You know, it's when

they're not picked up federally. The feds will rail them because they have the mandatory minimums. Okay. But like I know, I I think it's all the guys you meet in president's minimum five years in the feds for the sex ones. That's just like the internet one. I think it's a mandatory minimum five years. But I read like the local news of some of these guys that plead out or guilty like these business guys or anyone in their middle age. They got less time than me.

Yeah, I know. I know. It's fucking sick. Look, are you kidding me? Like 18 months, 30 months. I know. That's local. Yeah.

That's ridiculous for a local court. And then they'll get out. lower. Like my... Good behavior. Yeah. Like a friend of mine knows someone that's in for sexual assault. He got 24 months, so he'll do a year.

Mm-hmm. I don't understand that in state court. Yeah. Is he having a rough time in prison? Yeah, because it's a state, you know, you're in a higher security prison. Right. And you're scarred for life by having that on your records, registering as a sex offender. But come on.

I know. You're going to give all these other people a higher sentence and these people are doing that. It's very unjust. I think on the state level is one of the most. unjust because it's not fair and consistent across the board. Definitely not consistent. And that's what baffles me too is like you know so many people and like, well, why this guy get 36 months and like, well, you know, and even, let's just say even they were

even they were like doing the same things throughout the years. And then for whatever reason, the judge, I don't know, and poses a less sentence. But, you know, there might be some contributing factors, but just exactly what you said. It's like, you know, like those are like like the one crime that you don't want to ever be accused of or have your children around. Is someone who's a convicted or at least someone who was well convicted, registered pedophile? Like

a guy grabbing a woman's ass it's just as bad as far as sex. It's a sex abuse misdemeanor. Like that's how they start. And I know that because I've taken courses and say, oh, you know, you smack a girl's ass and it's not a big deal. But a lot of these convicted rapists will tell you.

That's how they started. They would start off a touchy feeling on the train, grab it. You don't do that. That's a crime and they work their way I don't want to be around those people. Those are the ones that should be in prison when found convicted and should have to register. And if I'm not mistaken, believe it or not, there's like three levels, right? Of like if you go on family watchdog.com, if that might be one of the websites, you could see what registered sex offenders are in and around your neighborhood. And like, you would be sicken by how many people are actually living around you that are registered.

Maybe like low profile, again, guy who just smacks. And I don't want to put like it's not important or because I have a daughter, okay? I wouldn't want anyone touching my daughter's butt, you know, especially a criminal. So the three levels, like level one, two, three being or one being, I forget which one it was, vice versa. But the person with the most violent rape history that's registered, that's supposedly registered, does not have to be. They're registered, but you're not allowed to see that person. The one person you do want to know about is protected by the state law government that he's been a, arrested. He did his time. He is registered, but it's not public information. Yeah, but you know,

it's not even just the touching. It's like I'm at the gym the other day and I'm on the bench and there's there's a hot, attractive female walking towards me and there's this older gentleman in front of me who pauses what he's doing and I'm lifting looking. Like, I'm looking in his direction, but he thinks I'm looking at me. Right. He turns his whole head to look at her walk by and he's like trying to give me the thumbs up like going up and down. Like that's just like creepy. That's just like crazy. be in and there's no need for that. You know, that's just, and she's a young, she's probably 18. Yeah, probably all to be her grandfather.

I know. I have a daughter, so I get it. That's what these guys are doing, though. And they're setting the example for that. That's not okay. You know, it's funny. Like, I remember when I first joined Jack Lane, all right? That's, I'm aging myself.

I was 18. And like, I was just, yeah, I was a single guy. I was into, I'm into women, right? I'm not, so I'm going to tell you that I do, at 18, have, I had a girlfriend. the point I'm trying to make is when I went to the gym, I did not look at the women. I didn't. I looked at the weights. I looked at the guys that maybe I was doing it.

Hey, can you help me? And for years, I was like that. And now I hear these kids talk like, yeah, I'm joining this gym. Like, I'm like, are you going in a workout? You're just going to check out women. You know, like, it's funny the amount of- I would never try to hit on a girl out of gym unless she initiated. Right.

I mean, that's the whole thing. That's like at their job or just let them flirt with you, if anything. You know, be nice. But it just, yeah, I get weird. I feel weird when like my friends are like talking about. Yeah. Yeah, like at a girl or anything walking about it. Yeah.

I don't get that. You know, it's just because that's how I feel like when people are doing that to me when they recognize me or something. It's the same effect. So imagine yourself in your shoes, in their shoes, vice versa, if you're doing that to someone. So I'm very like self-conscious more than ever of the people like around me and what we're doing or anything like that.

Yeah, because you were raised. right probably. I mean, you know what I mean? It's like... Yeah, and I also do, I know in today's world you say something out in public if that gets picked up, you know, or anything. So I keep very... Just keep your mouth shut. You head down and that's it, right? Yeah, like I get annoyed when my... Like, some

people say the R word or any type of word, like in public, you really don't know who's listening. And that's not even a word I use, but just like individuals in general that are around that say that, you know? I catch my kids saying the all word too. Like, I'm like, you don't stop. You know, stop saying that stuff. And, well,

dad everybody you're not everybody you know we can talk for hours about being a parent but it's uh it's funny because like it's even more now it's like oh my god you said to edward or this and that but yeah say it now on an into you'll if you go for a job interview besides the fact that's the most disgusting word in the word in the world i think you know and or any racial term for that matter you know jewish Hispanic i don't never liked any of those racial terms for you know those races in particular because some of my best friends are different races and are of those races. And I have, I'm actually, I've recently found out that I'm Spanish. So I'm like, I don't wonder why I was sensitive to not like in the S word, right?

So I teach my kids and I said, well, you know what? This is why you should do it. One, because it's effing wrong. Two, you get caught. Your friend's filming you. It's out there and you're done. And you may go for that job interview and they're going to run your name and they're going to say you yelling out the N-word.

You think you're being funny. You ain't getting that job, kid. I don't care what college degree you have. You're not getting that job. Yeah, people get canceled very quickly. Yep. I think some cancellations are silly, but if you're saying something like that, that's totally different.

Yeah. Like that crazy woman in New York City that went off on that poor guy. Oh, my God. I know. Yeah, that was Karen, that's what they are. Cairns. Like, I used to work out Whole Foods in the deli, and some of them just get so, like, you're cursing someone out over some deli meat.

Yeah, yeah. It's ridiculous. Yeah, you're being rude and feeling entitled. It's, you know, and people deserve that, like, there was a quick one. It was a woman, the woman that was so nice and peaceful and professional, and she had a, like, you know, a portfolio booklet in a hand of some sort of pad. And a black woman, and she's talking to this white woman who's, like,

by her door and a house. Apparently, it's a, it's a HOA dispute. The black woman was someone, a resident, the white woman was a resident but she was on the board and the black woman says you know whatever her name was Mary I've been emailing you we've had meetings whatever the problem was they were not fixing it and she's like I pay my

HR fees like everybody else and she was nothing but nice standing on the curb nowhere was not a pro I mean this woman was really a sweet woman someone you would expect to be your neighbor yourself a nice person or you'd want as a neighbor he had patience because the white woman

was getting very angry this was handled blah, blah, now they start right. And what does the woman, the white woman say? She drops the N-word. And I'm like, I didn't expect this. I was just some YouTube video. I'm like, this woman just, these are the people I can't stand.

They're still keeping this shit alive. And this black woman was not, she did not have it. She says, oh, no, you didn't. And the woman said, yes, I did. Get off my property. You and this and that. And I'm like, I'm like yelling at the woman. Fucking get her.

And she did. She dragged this like a cave woman. man, dragged this, the white woman by her hair, all across the concrete, smacking her, say it again, and good for her. Because these women were in their 40s, like, you know, late 40s, like, you fucking know better than to say that word, being filmed. Like, you deserve every bit of smack that you got because, first of all, what you said was wrong.

Second of all, you were that ignorant, not knowing, knowing you were being filmed and did it. Because she'll turn around and try to say she was assaulted. Yeah, you are. you absolutely were. I'm glad you were. You deserved every bit of that smack and drag across concrete. I hate that word, Ian, I hate it. It's not allowed in my house. What advice would you give to a up-and-coming law enforcement officer? Hide. Yeah, someone that's in their mind in high school or college and wants to get into it and follow

your footsteps. What would you say to them? That's a fair question. Study, well, you already have the college requirements to become a sergeant. So my first word of advice specifically NYPD has become a boss. It's always been a boss's job and it probably always will be. Rank a lieutenant. We used to be like some of the guys that I know that have just recently retired or their sons are coming on, which they're always telling them they're crazy.

They still say lieutenant is like the best job because you kind of, the captain yells at you as a lieutenant and you yell at the sergeant and the sergeant has to yell at the cops. The lieutenant really is like that safe bumper car. You know, it just rolls right over him. The sergeant gets the brunt of the ship. because then he's got to make sure it's taken care of. And then he just reports to the lieutenant.

But the sergeant messes up that it makes the lieutenant look bad. But that's a rarity. So sergeants generally do what is expected of them. It's a great rank. That's why I tell them my advice is, you know, become a sergeant as fast as you possibly can. Usually when you're a sergeant, you might do a little bit of time on the street. But for the most time, it's, for the most part, when you become a supervisor, your career can go. in much better, faster ways than maybe a white shield or a detective.

Because you're a boss, and there's not a lot of them. There's a lot less bosses than there are cops and detectives naturally. So you could move on with your career a lot faster. You get closer to lieutenant and then you become a lieutenant. So at least become a sergeant. Guys want to go where the money is. You want to have a nice pension, right? You're going to work your ass off.

You're going to lose your hair. You might, unfortunately, develop acid reflux disease. you know, being a cop is just not certainly you're going to see like in a health magazine. You're not going to see like, hey, you want to be a police officer? Yeah, well, you know, you'll have the greatest health for 20 years. No, you're absolutely not. But you can't take care of yourself nowadays, right?

There's a lot of, no, health food, places. You can definitely eat a lot better these days. So do that. Become a sergeant. Get inside. Again, a lot of guys are old. And I speak, and I say guys, because most of my friends were men and the police officers. But women, too.

They want to make sure their pension is nice, so they want to work a lot of overtime. But unfortunately, a lot of the overtime is in the street, putting your hands on people. And they don't want to get jammed up. So my advice would be like, find a nice unit inside that offers a decent amount of overtime. And if you could do that, become a supervisor, make your way up to lieutenant and then just sail out. Don't go past lieutenant because after that, being a captain is like they don't even take overtime. They take it in time, which is okay because if they build up enough time, take a retire two years early and still collect the check on the couch.

Yeah. Right? If that's what you want to do. But I say, you know, get the credits for a lieutenant, which I think might be a bachelor's, I think. So become a lieutenant. Definitely become a sergeant right away. I think you have five years. You have to have five years on.

That's what I remember. So the many of you hit that five years, take that test. Get promoted. Find a spot that has a decent amount of overtime that's inside. You do not want to be on the streets until it gets better. If it does, then go out there and have at it, man. but until then hide Stephen,

thank you so much, man, for, you know, reaching out and being willing to come on the show and talk about your experiences. Absolute great conversation and, you know, keep in touch and looking forward

to doing one of your Facebook lives when you get that up and rolling again. Yeah, you'd be the first one I'm inviting. Thanks for having, man. This is great. It's been a pleasure and like I said, I told you, like,

it's an honor to be, you know, amongst people like yourself because of what you've done and letting people be heard. That's just me. I mean, I've seen so many of your guests and your varieties of spice of life, right?

The diversity that you have is what attracted me to your podcast. And, you know, it's more of an honor for me to be here than I've been in some. I'd rather hang out here and go to the White House, man. And I'm not saying I'm either right wing or left wing, but, you know, who wouldn't want to go to the White House? Like, you know, back in the days. Let's say the president that you love so much invited to your White House, right? I'd rather be with Ian Beck, man, having a good time. Thank you, man.

I mean, yeah, this is, we made it a cool experience. It's something cool. We're building like this unique studio. And, you know, it's cool. And the reach is awesome that you know it's not like some podcast where there's barely any viewership. This is like the real legitimate thing. And it's going out to, you know, thousands of people.

Yeah. That's why I was just, like I said, it's an honor to be here because of the platform and the diversity of people you have is like, you know, you just open your arms to anybody, you know, like, and everybody to say, you know, we're not just going to listen to these people. We're going to listen to this guy who's been in prison, this guy who's a cold officer, a nurse, doctor, you know, whatever. You just have a great diversified, you know, guest platform and podcast. And I love it, man. So thank you for having me.