Locked In with Ian Bick - Prison War Stories from the Most Brutal New York Prison Units | Michael 'Champ' Baker

Episode Date: May 13, 2025

Michael 'Champ' Baker shares the brutal realities of surviving in New York’s most dangerous prisons and the unwritten rules of survival. #PrisonWarStories #TrueCrime #GangWars #LifeBehindBars #JusticeSystem #SurvivalTactics #CrimeAndConsequences #HardenedCriminals Thank you to LUCY for sponsoring today’s episode: Let’s level up your nicotine routine with Lucy.  Go to HTTP://LUCY.CO/IANBICK and use promo code (IANBICK) to get 20% off your first order. Lucy has a 30-day refund policy if you change your mind.  Connect with Michael Champ Baker: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/championstyletv?igsh=MW1yNmVpamdsZ3p5aA%3D%3D&utm_source=qr https://youtube.com/@championstyletv?si=NlX9t9gFVInGoNbR" Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Buy Merch: https://convictclothing.net/collections/convict-clothing-x-ian-bick Timestamps: 00:00:00 Growing Up in New York Projects 00:08:00 Peer Pressure and Turning Point in 1995 00:16:07 Drug Trade and Control in Prison 00:23:24 Unexpected Police Encounter 00:30:58 A Sign from Above: A Life-Changing Letter 00:38:49 Taking Plea Deals: A Personal Account 00:46:04 Surviving Riker's Island: A Harrowing Experience 00:53:42 Adjusting to Life in Five Main Housing Unit 01:04:39 Surviving the Challenges in Jail 01:09:59 Life and Survival in Rikers Island 01:16:24 Therapy vs. Religion as Coping Mechanisms 01:23:37 The SoHo Spiderman Case 01:31:21 Success Story: From Inmate to College Graduate 01:38:55 Launch of Viral Magazine Featuring Nicki Minaj 01:46:39 Navigating the Music Industry: Connections and Opportunities 01:54:19 Public Apology and Regret 02:02:00 Viral Interview with Freaky Zy on Champion Style TV Powered by: Just Media House : https://www.justmediahouse.com/ Creative direction, design, assets, support by FWRD: https://www.fwrd.co Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Cut the bullspend. LinkedIn lets you target by company, job title, and more. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 on your first campaign and get a $250 credit. Go to LinkedIn.com slash campaign, Terms and conditions apply. This episode is brought to you by Redfin.

You're listening to a podcast, which means you're probably multitasking. Maybe even scrolling home listings on Redfin, saving homes without expecting to get them. But Redfin isn't just built for endless browsing. It's built to help you find and own a home. With agents who close twice as many deals, when you find the one, you've got a real shot at getting it. Get started at Redfin.com. Own the dream. episode is brought to you by Netflix. The Four Seasons is back for season two starring Tina Faye,

Will Forte, Coleman Domingo, Marco Calvani, Carrie Kenny Silver, and Erica Henningson. After a difficult year, your favorite group of friends continues their tradition of vacationing together now with a baby in tow. From the Jersey Shore to upstate New York and Italy, their getaways are sure to take unexpected turns where comedy ensues. Watch the four seasons May 28th, only on Netflix. Champ, welcome to Lockton, man. We've been talking about doing this for a while now, and I'm glad we were able to set it up. Absolutely, man.

First and foremost, thank you for the opportunity. I've been watching your show for a while now. Definitely falls in line with who I am and where I come from and what I do at this point. And you are a inspiration. Just letting you know that, you know, coming from prison, coming out here, get into it immediately, you know, going through the, the ups and downs of life and figuring it out.

You know what I mean? And now you're here in such a lovely place, big-ass platform. I love it, man. Thanks for having me. Thank you, brother. I appreciate it, man. That's what it's all about. And then plug the name of your show in at the top of this episode, too.

Yeah, so my show is called Spin the Yard. It's on YouTube under my Champion Style TV YouTube page. You can follow me on Instagram at Champion Style TV. You can follow spin dot the yard on Instagram. And that's that. Awesome. Yeah, and Facebook too, obviously under my real name, Michael Smith Baker. Okay, perfect.

And we'll have that all linked in the description of this episode for the audience, too. Did you grow up in New York? Yes. I grew up in Red Hook, Brooklyn, New York. It's the projects, conventional hood, you know, to live in in New York, It's actually called this, I think it's the biggest projects in Brooklyn, New York compared to Queensbridge in Queens, New York, which is the biggest throughout the five boroughs. I grew up there for a little while. Initially, I was living in Park Slope, Brooklyn, like me, my grandmother, my aunts, my mother, my uncle Ross.

We all lived under the same roof with my grandmother. and my mother had me when she was like 15 years old. And my mother did not want to have me, right? Because she was so young. But my grandmother is a Jehovah's Witness. She was and still is a Jehovah's Witness, and they don't believe in abortions. So basically my mom had to have me.

And she, after I was born, I was, you know, we were at the house for a while and my mom got to a point where she didn't want to live under my grandmother's rule of thumb anymore. and she moved to Red Hook. My mom was already working a good job. She had a car. She was well established for a young woman because of my grandmother.

So she moved to Red Hook projects, got her own crib, and, you know, I didn't want to be under my grandmother anymore. I wanted to be with my mother. So I think I was about four or five years old when I moved to Red Hook with my mother. And I was there for a few years, and it was like a total shift. It was like a culture shock compared to living in Park Slope. Because Park Slope was middle class neighborhood, multicultural. And I had friends there as well.

But Red Hook and Park Slope are like right next to each other. It's literally like what they call it, the Mason line or the Dixon line, Mason-Dixon line. So you literally from middle class to poor as far as neighborhoods are concerned. So started living with her. And at first I felt like everything was good. It was from my recollection, you know, playing outside in the streets and having friends from the projects. And it was this community that was there. You know, all the mothers knew each other, the kids knew each other.

Everybody looked out for each other. But then when crack hit, I would say 84, 85, 86 is when I started to see the shift as a young child. and the people who were nice and cool and family-orientated, they started to turn into like demons. You know what I mean? Doing whatever it is necessary to get to the rock. And then I started seeing, you know, a lot of violence. You know, people getting killed, people getting shot, robbed,

doors getting kicked in to get to stash houses, stuff like that. And a funny story is one time I was at my mother's house. house and some guys kicked in the door at my mother's crib. I was in the room. My mother used to do this thing when she used to have parties every night in her house because her house was like a hub for like dope boys to come cook their work and sell, you know, sell their drugs or whatever the case may be. She would cook for them. You know, I guess they would pay her to use her crib. And yeah, one day we're in the crib having a good time or whatever moving around dancing. TV on, food cooking, and there was a big, you know, bang at the door.

Again, these are projects, so it's like steel doors, but my mom wound up letting them in, and, you know, they put a shotgun to her face and pushed it in the crib. She made me run into the bedroom where I closed the door, but, you know, I was cracked and I was still looking out. And, you know, they put, you know, they hit the gun butt in my mother. These guys were ski-masked up. There's two of them. And I was peeking out the room, seeing what was going on.

And they were like, you know, where's the money? They're standing the third. So my mother wound up showing them where the money was and giving it to them. But they didn't know my mother had a mothspurred shotgun in her closet. And essentially she let them get out the house. And when they got the house, we lived on the, I think it was the second floor or first floor. And she took care of them before they. they could even get to the street from out the window.

Like, you know what I mean? So, and got the money back and everything was cool. Essentially, my grandmother, who, like I said, Jehovah Witness, square from Delaware, heard about, you know, the environment I was living in and didn't like it. And at this time, you know, I don't know the span of time, but my mom actually started using. You know, I believe she was using cocaine at first. She was drinking a lot, stuff like that. And she came to the crib and was like, I don't want him here anymore.

I'm taking him back with me. And that kind of fucked my mother up because I was her only son at the time. I have other siblings now, but I was her only son. And yeah, my grandmother came and got custody of me. And during that time, I learned a lot living in the projects, right? I learned how to scheme, right? I learned how to get away with shit. I learned how to shoplift and do different things.

My mom would send me to the store with $2. That $2 I would keep and I would steal whatever it was that she was looking for. You know, so it started off early because there were other kids doing it in the neighborhood. And essentially I went back to Park Slope with that same mentality and that attitude. And when I started going back to school at a, what was it? elementary, no, by this time, yeah, it was elementary going into junior high. I was full throttle into stealing. Whatever I can get my hands on that.

At that time, we used to, me and my peers would cut school and go to, like, right aid. And at that time, they sold cigarettes and cigars, like, right out. It wasn't behind a counter or anything like that, so you used to steal cigars. We used to take 40 ounces, put it down our sleeves, St. A's beers, stuff like that. Now, at that time, I wasn't drinking or smoking or nothing. Like, I was a real clean kid. And one day in junior high school, I was minding my business during lunch.

And I was eating my pizza. And there was a group of guys smoking and stuff like that and drinking. They were drinking 99 bananas. I'll never forget it. And they see me, you know, this light skin, cool, clean, curly head kid by himself, mine in his business. I always had the fresh gear. And they, one of them, his name is Maurice. I'm still cool with him to this day.

But he came up to me. He was like, yo, what's up, kid? You want to be down with LBF? And I'm like, what's that? He was like, it's all gang. I forgot what it stood for. And I was like, no, I don't, I don't, no, I don't want to be down with anything. So he was like, I smoked this weed.

You know what I'm saying? Take a hit of this weed. And I was like, no, I'm not taking a hit of the weed. Essentially, we go back and forth and they peer pressured me. And I wound up smoking the weed threw up all over the place. But when I say I was high as I've ever been, like this was the highest I ever been. And then they gave me 99 bananas. They said, drink this.

And I drank it. And I swear to God, that's when my life I could remember. And this was in 1996, 95, everything turned left. Like the shit that I was doing a little stealing shit, I had a little control of it. Like I didn't do it all the time or whatever. But when I got high and drunk that day, all of my worries, the worries about consequences and all of that shit went out the window. And I literally, that same day, I was like, I'm not going back home today.

I'm going to chill with these guys. We're going to cut school. We're going to go steal. We're going to steal cars. We're going to do this. We're going to fuck with the girls. This down the third. And it just took a shift from there, man, like turbo downhill.

I started a cun school. And then one day I go to school with a BB gun, right? Because I wanted to be cool. I always wanted to be accepted. That was always my problem. It was acceptance amongst my peers. And I go to school with this BB gun, but it looked just like a non.

nine millimeter. And me trying to show off for this girl, I opened my book bag and shoulder. I was like, look what I got, look what I got. And she ran and told. She ran and told immediately. And they came and basically arrested me, right? They arrested me and spelled me from the school.

And after that, bro, it was like downhill. After that, I went to another school in Manhattan, was fighting, cutting people, getting cut. Getting arrested, going to, I wasn't even going to juvenile. I was just going to family court and my grandmother come and get me out. And that was another problem too is that anytime I got in the trouble, my grandmother would get me out. She will come and say I'm his legal guardian, whatever the case may be. If there was a bail, she would bail me out.

So I would just do the same shit again because I knew my grandmother's going to help me. She's going to get me out. And that turned into more serious infractions. series crumbs. Are you guys looking for a nicotine experience that actually keeps things fresh? Enter Lucy Breakers, the 100% pure nicotine tobacco-free pouches that put you in control of your flavor. Each pouch has a built-in flavor capsule.

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off. And here's the fine print. Lucy products are only for adults of legal age and every order is age verified. Warning, this product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical. Where was your dad? Did you know anything about it? Yeah, so I didn't mean my dad till I was like 30. I'm 42 right now. Wow. So funny story about my dad. That was another turning point too. There was a time when I was in elementary school. I think I was like seven or eight. And I was a I was at my grandmother's house. I'm living with her at this time. And he called my grandmother.

I was in my room and I heard her talking to somebody. I didn't know who it was. And I just kept hearing and say, why are you lying? Why are you lying? Why do you want to talk to him? You haven't been around. This Santa third.

So anyway, she calls me in the room. She says, Michael, come here. Somebody on the phone for you. Excuse me. I get on the phone. He's like, hey, son, it's your dad. And I'm like, my dad. dad, I don't even know what a dad was at that time because I grew up around women.

My aunts, my mom's, but my uncle was always there. But I really had no concept of me having a father at that time. Hey son, how you doing? How are you holding up? Listen, I got two tickets. I mean, I have a ticket. I'm about to mail you so you can come down to Florida to see me. I'm like, all, cool.

I got mad excited. I was hype, right? So my grandmother takes the phone. me go back in the room. A few minutes later, she comes back in the room and she says, don't believe him. He's not going to do that. He's not going to send a plane ticket for you. He's a liar. He hasn't been here all this time. Now he wants to, he wants to establish a relationship with you. He's lying so you don't wait on it. I didn't believe her. I was like, no, it's my dad. I just spoke to him. You know, I'm a kid. I'm naive. And that never happened.

At 42 years old, it still hasn't happened. Right. So there was a shift there too as far as my mindset and my behavior. Because now I realize when I go to school, I see my peers with their mother and father, or just their father, whatever the case may be. And now I'm like, I'm yearning for that type of love, right? And I have no male figure to really show me the ropes. So now I'm just digging deeper into the streets to get that acceptance that's missing at home from my dad. And this now is coming from older guys that are in the streets.

So I'm doing the most to prove myself to them to fill the void for not having my father around. Years and years past, a lot of shit happened as far as me going in and out of prison. I'll get to that. But I met my father in 2013 for the first time in person. I just came home from a bid. I did six years and I came home my stepdad

who's my mother's husband right now Kevin he picked me up from jail and my cousin Chris I left Cayuga correctional facility so we go down to my great grandmother's house and Gowanus projects

and my dad is in my great grandmother's house so I didn't know how to feel at first but it like quickly the indecisiveness missing me kind of left quickly once I seen he looked just like me. It was crazy, like seeing him face to face.

What happened is in 2011, I was in Cape Vincent Correctional Facility. I was selling a lot of drugs in the jail, right? A lot of weed. And at that time, K2 had just started like making a wave. And I had a plug with outside clearance. Those are the guys that clean up and landscape outside. but they have access to go in and out of the jail and, you know, smuggle shit. So I had a couple dollars, so I invested in weed and stuff like that,

and then I had, like, people bringing it to me in the jail on a visit at first. So I'm doing my thing, I'm doing my numbers, and I'm making a lot of money, and one day I get told on, basically. Somebody tells on me I'm on a visiting floor about to get, like, three ounces of weed. and so let me give you more clarity of the story I don't want to skip over before I was in Cape Vincent I was in five points correction which is a max a facility it's a double bunk facility the whole jail at that time I was gang banging I was blood I was a East homicide brim so each there was blocks eight block nine block

10 block, 11 block. I was in 9 block. I had 9 block for all of the brims. Whether you were 5.9 brim, East Homicide, a bloodhound brim, it didn't matter. You had to report to me. So I had the drug thing on smash. Anybody who has the drugs, as you know,

basically controls the jail. And I'm doing my numbers. And there was this one kid named Carter, who was in 10 block, who was outlawed 20 brim, who kept sending messages to me saying, I got to pay them money and stuff like that to be moving work around the jail. And when I say work, I mean the drugs around the jail.

And I was like, oh, whatever. Fuck this dude or whatever, right? Then one day, I go to Laurelopery and he pulls up on me and he's like, yo, you ain't hear what I told you in the kite that I sent you? I told you, you got to pay a nut. You got to pay a tab to the other homies in the block. I was like, yo, bro, listen,

I'm taking care of the homies in my block. that's it whatever they decide to do with the work i give them and how it how it distributes that's on them you're not going to tell me what the fuck to do right so me and him got into a spat we didn't fight though a big homie a big big homie name um at that time named mel cross pulls up to the jail and he carter is under male cross so i tell mel cross because he he came to my block and we spin in the yard and i tell him what's going on And by this time, though, I'm like, I don't want to deal with this shit no more. Like, I'm done being blood.

I don't want to be gangbanging or nothing. It was too many headaches. So he was like, all. He was like, yo, you know, you've been banging for a while, you know, so you could basically honorably discharge you, you know what I'm saying? Or you can go under the motherhood, which was five, nine brim. And I was like, no, I don't want none to do with this shit no more. So I left it alone.

All right. Classification drops. they moved me to Cape Vincent, which is a medium facility. I go there, I'm doing my numbers. The kid Carter comes to the jail that I'm in now, that I had beef with over there.

So when he comes to the jail, he has a brother named Pounds there, this big brother dude named Pounds. So Carter pulls up to the jail, I get the word, I'm already established at this time. So they tell me to come to the gym. They're like,

your champ coming to the gym. pounds and Carter here, he wanted to holler at you, whatever. So I go to the gym, but I go gripped up. You know, I go with my little gym star, whatever the case may be. Because I'm like, if it's going to be something, it's going to be something because his brother was huge. And I was big too at that time. I was working out a lot.

But go to the gym, pounds like, yo, what's up with you and my brother? I heard you invited him to the Frankstand because I did. In five points, I told him to suck my dick, all type of shit, right? in a mess hole in front of everybody. So I'm like, yo, your brother know what it is. He's, you know, he's so, he pussy.

You know what I'm saying? I ain't worried about him. You know what I'm saying? What y'all going to do? Y'all going to jump me? But I had people with me. You know what I'm saying? There was a lot of cats from Long Island

that was in the jail at the time. And basically nothing happened. We'd be squashed it or whatever the case may be. Fast forward a whole year later, he comes, I'm in a mess hall house. He comes to my housing unit, the Duke Carter. When he comes in a housing unit,

He see I got the weed shit on smash. I'm getting this shit bottle loads. Everybody is high. Everybody's happy. Everybody's cool. So he comes to my cube one day. He's like, yo, chimp, I know we had beef before. You know, but I'm trying to work, man.

I need to make some bread this sounds like. I'm like, get the fuck away from me. Get the fuck out of my cube. I don't fuck with you. We squashed whatever be squashed. But I don't fuck with you. Like keep it moving. Fine.

He keeps it moving. He feels away or whatever the case may be. So now there's other cats that I'm giving. weed to or then I'm selling weed to that's going in the bathroom into the yard and smoking with them. So now I start pulling it from them. I told you I don't fuck with him. Y'all keep, you know, putting shit in his hand.

One day they called me for a visit. I'll say about two weeks later. They call me for the visit. I'm in a day room. He's in the day room early in the morning. So I'm ready for my visit or whatever the case may be. He comes, he's in the day room. He's like, yo, chint, bro.

Like, yo, again, I'm sorry, man. Being apologetic and stuff like that. And I'm like, yo, what I told you? I slapped the shit out of him. Bung, get the fuck out of my face. He was a bitch-ass nigger. Stop coming up to me, asking me for work. Ah-uh.

So he held his face and he walked off. He called me for the visit. I go on the visiting floor. I got the Vaseline in my ass. I got Vaseline behind my ears. I got Vaseline in my belly button. Because I'm about to load up. You know what I'm saying?

I go on a visit. Shorty comes and see me. Shout out to Asia. So she come with the work. The way we used to do it was we used to put it. She used to put it in, go to the vending machine, get the potato chip bags, go to the way the microwave is, like give me some wings and shit, and then she'll take the loonies and put it inside the potato chip bag.

So sitting there waiting for her. I got to scrabble, game out and stuff like that. She comes sit down. She started passing me to work. So it was condensed, like, almost like Eminems, Eminem peanuts. There's a bunch of them. So, you know, I'm swallowing some. Some I'm boofing.

You know what I'm saying? So everything's going fine, right? Then I see Carter come on the visiting floor. So I see him. I don't say nothing, obviously, but I'm like, whatever. So shorthy, look at me. She's like, what's wrong with you? I'm like, nah, bitch-ass thing.

I slapped him this morning or whatever. She was like, you need to stop doing, you need to stop being violent. If you get money, you can't be doing, get money, and being violent. And I'm like, I don't care. He's a bitch-ass nigger. I was feeling myself. So I see him at the bubble with a, you know,

the bubble is where the police sit at or whatever and watch over the visiting room floor. And I seen him talking to the officer. His back is to me. And I see the officer kind of like looking from the side of him down to where I'm at. So I'm like, nah. I know this bitch-assin-a-in-telling on me.

Right? Thinking nothing of it, hour past, two hours past. And now I'm loaded. I got everything up in the trunk. I swallowed everything. I'm good, right? So the police get up. It's two cops.

Right. I'm sitting at a table, square table, shorty sitting across from me, and there's an owl. So two cops start walking toward my direction, right? So when I see them, I'm like, mind you, I have my pants unbuckled, right? Because I was boofing. So I got my pants unbuckled when I'm sitting there. And I'm like, nah, they ain't about to run down on me. Nah, this can't be happening. So they walk, but they act like they're going to talk to somebody behind me. And they walk past me. So when they walk past me, I was like, like, but then they did a quick 360. Yo, that shit was crazy. They turned around so fast and they both grabbed me by each arm and pick me up. So now I'm struggling with them.

And as I'm struggling with them, bro, this shit was so embarrassing. My pants fall. My stay greens fall to my ankles. And Looney's just start popping out my ass, bro. It's a bloop, bloop, bloop. It's crazy. And so now, like, I'm like, fuck. And I'm like, go, go.

I'm telling you. get the fuck out of here, go. I mean, where's she going to go? You know what I mean? But I'm like, get the fuck out of here, go, go. And I'm tussling with the cops. I'm, you know, I'm pretty strong. So I get loose.

I'm grabbing loonies. I'm trying to swallow them. I'm throwing, I'm doing all kind of wild shit that don't make sense. And they wound up subduing me. Like four more cops came and they all grabbed me up, took me to the search area. They gave me to the search area. They're talking their shit. Some of them started punching me.

They basically jumped me. You know what I'm saying? They jumped me. And they was like, we're putting you in a shit room. So I don't know if you're familiar with what the shit room is, but it's basically a cell where there's no water. There's no running water in the toilet or the sink. And it's just a bunk.

It's just a bed. A metal bed, not even a mattress on that motherfucker. And they sit you in there for 72 hours until you shit. And when you shit, they take your shit and see if you have drugs in the shit. So they basically got what I was holding in my ass, right? Because at first, what I was going to do that I seen other old Thomas do was take it and swallow it. Like, shit it out and swallow it. But I was like, nah, that shit is too nasty.

I'm not swallowing with my own shit. It's not that serious. So I was just like, fuck it, man. Y'all going to do what y'all going to do. But not all of it came out. Like, once I shit it once, they got a couple of loonies. They was happy with that. So they put me in a box in a solitary confinement.

I was in there for a few weeks before I had an actual hearing. And when I went to the hearing, the captain was like, basically I'm giving you two years in solitary confinement. No lie, he gave me two years. I almost fucking passed out like two years. It's up for drugs? Like you act like I fucking stab somebody or I cut somebody. And he was like,

and I'm giving you a new charge. So this is in Jefferson County. And, excuse me, basically, he gave me two years, a new charge. So I had to go to the court. I went to court. Gratefully, the fucking judge just was like, yo, I'm just going to run this one and a half to three

because I took a plea. But I'm going to run this one and a half to three concurrently, which is six-year sentence. So I didn't have to do any extra time. But now this shit looks best. bad because I had a, what do you call it, a determinant sentence, which is a flat bid. I had a six-year flat bid, which means I had a conditional release date, which means I had an absolute date that you have to let me go, no parole board, no nothing.

So now they take away a bunch of my good time, right? So I had two years a good time, which would have let me out in four years. So he took that away, which means I got to do the whole six now. So now I'm in solitary confinement. I'm in governor, correctional facility, solitary confinement. It's double bunk. So I'm in there. I've been to the box plenty of times.

Like, again, I'm skipping over, but I've been to the blocks plenty of time, so I know how to box bid. And I've had bunkies. We've gotten into fights. You know, sometimes I've gotten, they gotten the best of me. Sometimes I got the best of them. But the police, the COs in the box, they have a certain level of respect. It's weird. the dynamic in there of guys that defend themselves right they have a certain level of respect where

they're like we know you got all this and then they look at how much time each person has like if somebody coming with 90 days they look at you like are you a bitch somebody that got two years they're like okay he's kind of gangster you know and you're fighting and stuff like that so essentially i made my way in the box where they started letting me out myself to like give out chow to other cells to clean up be a porter to do haircuts on the weekends. So that gave me extra showers. That gave me extra food.

That gave me extra access. And I was still selling drugs in the box. Anyway, they wound up taking my box job away from me because they got a new sergeant that came on that was like by the fucking book. So now I'm just in myself. I've been in there about a year. And by this time, my mind started playing tricks on me because I was in myself by myself for about six months. I didn't have a bunkey because I kept kicking them out. You don't know how fucking crazy your mind works when you are alone.

You start thinking about so much shit and then it's like your conscious or your subconscious starts speaking back to you and telling you what you should do to your physical self. And I thought I had a control of my mind because I was reading a plethora of books I was always studying. I was always right and I thought I was the sharpest nail in the coffin. And weeks would go by where I'm like walking, pacing back and forth, just talking to myself. You know, like, yo, you're a bitch-ass nigga, man. You put yourself in this position. What the fuck is wrong with you?

No, you're not. You're a great guy. You know what I mean? You're going to get out of here one day and you're going to be something. Da-da-da-da-da-law. Now, fuck that. Fuck that. Like, I literally was talking back and forth to myself like that, out loud.

And I wanted to commit suicide. There was a voice in my head that told me you need to just finish yourself. Get it over with, stop all of this pain that you're going through and go on to the afterlife. And I was like, you know what? I'm going to pray on it. You know what I mean? I wasn't really heavy into spiritual. I was heavy into spirituality, but not God, just on some laws of attraction, the universe shit.

And one day, I made the decision I was going to kill myself. So what I did, I set everything up. I set up the noose off of a vent with a, with a tie, I literally sat and tore sheets up. I asked the police for extra sheets and stuff like that to make my butt, my bunk, and I tore them into pieces and I braided them. I braided the sheets so they could be super tight. Tied them up on a vent. And I was like, after they do the count after, after, um, chow, after.

five, I'm gonna just, I'm gonna just get it over with. And I said, I'm gonna pray one more time. And it was like, it's like two o'clock in the afternoon. Get on my knees and I start praying, I'm like, God, if I'm not supposed to do this, then I need a sign. I need some type of sign, whether it's you open in this door and get me out of here, something. But if I don't get a sign, then I'm coming to meet you or the devil.

and I was waiting, child came, then they did mail call. They did mail call, I get an envelope that's like this thick. I'm like, what the fuck is this? And in return, on the return of the envelope it said, Thomas Baker.

Like, Thomas Baker? I'm like, this is my father? I'll open it up. And it was my dad. So it was probably like 22 pages, bro. him telling me his whole life in like handwritten letter and I sat there and broke down like a fucking kid y'all like that shit took everything out of me

and I read it and I took it as a sign and I was like you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna get through this shit I'm gonna get through this shit I'm gonna get out of here and then I started the affirmation shit that's when I went into I am great I am beyond this physical environment.

I am metaphysical. I can travel outside my body. Like all this different stuff. And it worked. It essentially worked. I started reading another book called The Magic by Rhonda Burns. She also wrote The Secret. And they had exercises that you would do in the book.

And one of the exercises was every morning when you get up is to write, I think it was 10 things you're grateful for. No matter where you're at, what position you're in. Just 10 things you're grateful. grateful for every day. And I would do that. I'm grateful for waking up. I'm grateful for having arms. I'm grateful for having legs. I'm grateful for being able to see this down and third. And don't you know they let me out the box six months early? Because along with that exercise, you also write, you also write what it is that you are looking to accomplish. But the way they do it, because of how

the mind works, the subconscious, you write it as if it happened already. You don't write it. You don't write it as if you want it to happen. So I would write on this day, I mean, I would write the date, which is a year later, and I'll put under the, I am not, I'm no longer in the box, I am free, I am this, I am that, I have acquired this, I acquired that, but the date is. Crack a Cayman Jack Margarita and taste your escape. It's America's number one for a reason. Kamen Jack is a premium malt beverage with flavors.

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VALU-FWIPLY7. While supplies last, selection varies by location. See Associate at Lowe's.com for details. A year from the day I wrote it. And bro, when I tell you that shit works, it fucking works. The subconscious mind knows, it doesn't know time, it has no limitation, nothing. And I wound up getting out the box six months early and going back to General Pop. And then I wound up getting my good time back and getting out in five years in like three months instead of the whole six.

What year was that when you got out? 2013 October. Was that the last time you went to prison? Oh, absolutely not. I went to prison again after that in 2015. Now that's six-year bid. What were you doing time for? Was that gang related?

No, no. That was for robbery. Robbery assault. and home invasion. I ran up in somebody house that owed me money at the time. There was a guy. At that time, I was doing a lot of wild shit, right? But I never was a real violent person.

I stayed away from that. And I wasn't like a heavy drug deal in the street. I was more so a thief. So anyway, I got into this line of work through this Italian guy I knew where it was like loan shark. parking. So I knew a lot of people in the street and I knew the drug dealers. I knew the jackboys. I knew the people that got cars. I knew everybody. So let's say you were somebody who sold drugs and let's say your plug got knocked off, right? And now you don't have no work. I knew where you

can get work from because I had multiple people on the line. So this one guy, I'm not going to say his name, he needed some work. So I was like, all right, I'm affronted to you because I knew he knows how to get money. So I affronted him to work. And time passed. I had a ledger and everything, like a business ledger and all that.

Time passes, I say about three months, and I gave him 30 days. So now I'm chilling in Parksville one day and some of my guys, and one of my guys is on the phone with him. This is when he had, well, it doesn't matter what kind of phones they had. But I'm like, yo, you're talking to such and such?

And he was like, yeah. I was like, give me the phone. I'm like, yo, what's up, bro? Where my money at? So he's like, yo, what's good, bro? Yo, my bag. You know, I thought you was giving it to me on the arm. I said, no, you know, on the shit on the arm, bro.

Like, we made a deal, bro. So I was like, where you at? He was like, nah, chill, kids. Like, you know, I got you. I got you. I'm going to get back to you when the time is right. I said, you're going to get back to me when the time is right. I said, I ain't say no more.

Hung up the phone. So I had this chick that knew a lot of people that was always out and about and very seductive and stuff like that. I was like, yo, I need to find this dude right here. You need to find him. He used to be over here. So I want you to go, you know, canvas over there and see, and, you know, ask some questions and see if you can find this dude. Long story short, the next day, she knew where he was at, where he lived, who he lived with, everything. So I called my guy.

I said, y'all need you to pull up with me somewhere. He was like, wait. I said, just pull up with me. I'm going to rent a car, a dummy car in this chick's name or whatever the case may be. I already got the alibi that we're going to be over here somewhere. Just pull up with me. I got to get some money. I got you.

So he was like, all right, fuck it. This is when fucking Magnums, the Dodge Magnums was popular. Pull up to his crib, we pull up in UPS uniforms. And I got my, you know, I got the UPS hat low and shit like that. Knock on the door. His girl opens the door. The rest is history. We run up in the house.

My man that pulled up with me was like 6-8, 300-something pounds, but I made sure he was like kind of down the steps. It was a brownstone we went into. So once she opened the door, he ran up the steps. We bow-garded our way in to the crib, tied her up. Me, we didn't harm her at all. You know, we just tied her up, put her in the corner. He was in the basement, hiding.

We beat the crap out of him. tied him up as well where's the money where's everything so basically you know after some time he tried to play it off

you know it'd be tough but after some time he he submitted and when he submitted we found $250,000 in like five bricks wow he was holding out on you yeah he was holding out

he came up you know what I'm saying he came up off of me because he didn't have shit when he came to see me he was down because his plug got not. So all the work he had was gone. So now he was just holding on the money he saved to try to buy more work. But the way he came at me was like, I don't have nothing. And I was like, all right, bro, because I heard about him. I'm like, all right, I'm, I'm going, I'm a front this to you.

So we took all of that shit and got up out of there. And I say, so at this time, I'm, that's the other thing. I was on parole at the time from a prior bid, from all of the bid before. So I go to parole and they lock me up Because he told He went to the priest and he said, he said, this guy robbed me He didn't say what he robbed me of He just said, yo, he ran up in my crib, tied me and my girl up And he no, excuse me, he said that we stole electronics

This standard third and we damaged his house So I could have fought it But I'd never, if you look at my record, I never fought anything I always took a plea because at the end of the day I know I did what I did and I don't want shit to come home me later for some shit

that I didn't do that I can get blamed for so with the law of the universe and stuff like that I always took a plea just give me the lowest amount and that's what you got

the six years for that time yeah that's what I got the six years for so what was the bid for prior to that prior to that one was all burglaries

and that was when you were a teenager or early 20s I was in my early 20s this was in that bid was from 2000, that was a short bill. It was a two and a half to five I did.

Only did two years out of that, got out on good behavior. But it was from 2003 to the end of 2005. I was in Bear Hill correctional facility the whole time in upstate New York. And that was for burglaries.

I had committed like fucking six burglaries. And, but they were all like class D felonies. So the, um, the judge was like, like, yo, we're going to give you an offer two and a half to five, well run everything concurrent because it was two and a half to five for each count.

But they, once I took the plea, they put it all together and I wound up going upstate. The bid prior to that, because I did four bids all together, four bids as an adult and one bid as a juvenile. So the bid before that was a two and a half to five as well for burglary, for robbery, for car thefts. We were running a car ring in Brooklyn where I had a plug, my Italian plug, who would send me to dealerships after they closed. And he had a line with like the woman that worked in these different spots. And it was where it was in Queens, Brooklyn, Manhattan, whatever.

And they would always keep the keys to the cars like on the tire, on the front left tire. He would say, you're going to go in there, take the cars, bring them to me, in Coney Island. They were paid me for it. So I was getting like $5,000, $6,000 a car. So I would try that. Now I started building the team. And I'm like, yo, we need to get like 10 cars tonight.

They didn't know what I was getting paid. So I would give them like $100, $200. We was all young. So they would be happy with that, but I was getting most of the bread. So I was doing the car theft shit and getting money doing that. But I was splurging it, just wasting the fucking money away.

And I wound up getting knocked because somebody told that was in the ring they got pinched for some other shit and they implicated me and a host of burglaries. They actually had it on the news that there was like

this car theft ring going on throughout the city but they didn't know who it was. So I wanted to take the heat for it. And because I'm not a snitch, I'm not going to tell anybody I just, I took the bid. And that was my first first bid

when I went to, man, There's a lot of pain on that bid, bro. A lot of pain. I need to take another sick of this real quick. And you were how old for that first bid? That first bid, I was 17. And you went to Rikers Island? Yeah.

So I went to Rikers Island in late 99, 1999. It was a different place back then. Way different. Turbo gladiator school. And I wasn't even like that. I'm going to keep it all the way 100. For all of y'all watching this, I was not that type of guy. I know people come up here and claim that they're the toughest motherfuckers in Nebraska.

That was not me. I was scared to fucking death. All right? I was out on bail. The judge remanded me because I caught another burglary charge. And I go in. So I go in on fly as fuck. I got the, at that time, polo was popping iceberg, kooji, shit like that.

So I got this polo denim suit on. I got an iceberg sweater with the fucking Snoopy on it. and I'm all blued out. So they remand me, I go in, I get on the bus, right? I get on the Rikers Island bus. And while I'm on the bus, these motherfuckers is just telling stories. Motherfuckers have been there before or they went, they were just going to court. They're going back to Rikers Island.

And I'm like, what the fuck? They're like, yeah, yo, bro, when you go in there, they're going to take all them clothes off of you, bro. I'm like, who those COs? They're like, nah, the dudes in there. They're going to take all them clothes over. You're going to take your sneakers, all of that, bro. They're going to take your commasel. they're going to take your pin number on the phone

because you don't even look like you like that. And I was like, damn, I was scared to death, bro. So I go into C-74, ARDC. The only thing I kind of had working for me at that time was that there was a CO there, rest in peace, Mr. Witherspoon. He lived in my building in Park Slope, and he worked in intake there.

And when he seen me come in, he was like, what the fuck is he basically seen me grow up? So he was like, I'm gonna, he's like going to, he's like going that cell over there. I'm gonna put you, I'm gonna try to put you in a good housing unit or whatever. There ain't no fucking good housing units and fucking right his houses, especially in the four building, you heard. So, um, I go in, so I'm in a cell by myself in the intake, but motherfuckers is like wolves. They're walking by the cell. They're like, oh, look at this motherfucker right here.

I like that jacket, you heard. Yeah, you're gonna be, you're gonna be wearing these, uh, we called them Patakis at the time. They were like the skippies, like slippers. And basically, if you wore those, it was like you were soft. So they was like, yeah, and Pataki was a governor at the time. So they called them patakis. And at that time, you could also wear your regular clothes on Rikers Island. So he was like, yeah, you're going to be wearing these Patakis in a minute, boy. Don't let me see you in traffic. Da-da-da-da. Like mad, different people are coming by and saying the same shit. And I'm like, fuck this shit is true what the fuck am i gonna do right so i'm telling miss this one i need to i need to get

on the phone man i need to call somebody ah uh so he was like all right i'm gonna give me the phone called my grandmother she was like i can't help you you fucked up she ain't say you fucked up but she's like you messed up a lot this time she says there's nothing i could do for you they're not trying to give you another bail you're gonna have to ride it out whatever i go in they put me a maud one mod one is the intake house as soon as i walk in the house it was a dorm area. It wasn't even like the A and B gates and cells, a dorm area.

As soon as I walk in, I get jumped. Like, literally, like I came in, I had my blanket with the blanket tied up with the sheets and all of that stuff in in, my cup, my toothbrush and shit like that. Walked in, dudes just jumped on me. Didn't say nothing. I just get snuffed from the side.

Boom! Get hit again. Boom! You know, so now I'm hovering on the floor. I'm covering myself up and getting kicked and stuff like that. My jacket is getting pulled off from me. My fucking, I had Air Max, Air Max 95s on. The blue ones, they're pulling that all for me. I found out later they thought I was Crip.

Because I had all the blue on. And it was a blood house basically at that intake house. So he basically beat me out my clothes. Took all my clothes off of me. So now the police, the police see what's happening. They see what's happening. They let it happen. And then after that, they give me a jumper.

And they said you're going to wear this jumper and you're going to wear these batakis. So now I'm like, what the fuck, man? Like I don't know what to do. Like I'm scared. I'm dazed. I'm confused. They didn't even let me go to the infirmary, nothing. That's your bed over there.

Go sit down. So now I'm sitting in. I'm trying to figure it out. That's the worst feeling in the world, bro. Feeling powerless, undefeated. No one to help. you like you just want to fucking give up and um i remember sitting in and uh later on that evening witherspoon came in and he he seen me he was like what happened i said you all i got jumped

out of my clothes you like the fuck well who did it i know one thing i don't do is i'm i know not to tell so he was like you know what you even got to say nothing i remember what you had on so he goes and tells another guy that's running the house that's actually running the house, you're going to give him back his shit. I'm going to make hell for y'all in this housing unit. Sure enough, the motherfuckers gave me my clothes back. But now there's a running narrative. This dude fucks with the police.

And I'm like, I didn't even tell him nothing. Like, they don't know that. I'm like, I didn't tell. I didn't tell, whatever. Next day, they moved me out of that house and they moved me to what they call three main house of pain. Move me to three main. I'm going through Maine.

It's a blood house. there's a guy there I know named Rod Diggs from Gowanus Projects. We went to school together and everything. He's the big blood in there. He's basically running the whole building though. So he's seen me, he like, oh shit, yo, what's up, Mike? Yo, how you doing?

Boom, boom. I'm like, yo, this shit is crazy. Yo, I'm trying to get up out of here, da-da-da-da. So he's like, you need to get on the phone and all that? I'm like, yeah, bro, I need to call my people's. So he made sure I got on the phone and stuff. I got, after I got off the phone, he was like, yo, listen, let me give you the run down here.

I know you from the street and everything And we're cool in the street He said, but you're on your own He said, you're going to have to figure this shit out You're going to have to fight your way To your respect. That's what I had to do. So don't look to me to help you

If motherfuckers come at you. That's on you. I was like, you serious, bro? I was like, yeah, we know each other's families and all of that. Like, you're just going fucking push me to the wayside like that. He's like, that's how it goes in here.

I'm telling you right now. Whatever. So now, that night I'm in my cell. Cell door opens out of nowhere. I was sleeping. Motherfuck is coming and jump me. Jump me. Boom, boom, boom.

They didn't take my clothes or nothing, though. I get jumped. They leave out the cell. Close it. Next, early in the morning comes. They open up the cells for breakfast. So I'll go down to get my tray for breakfast. It's Frosties.

Frosties is a big thing on Rikers Island, especially in C-74, frosted flake, cereal, and bananas and apple jelly. Huge things. So a lot of cats was getting these shit

taken. I go to the pantry to get my shit. The dude behind the window is like, oh, no, you ain't eating. Now I'm upset. I got jumped twice.

First time I got beat up by my clothes. And now you're telling me I can't eat? So Rod Diggs sees it. So he's looking like he's standing on the site. Like what you're going to do? I was like, y'all, serious?

I can't eat my food. You're not going to give me my food to eat. Police is in the bubble. They see the shit. They don't say shit. I'm like, all right. So now I go back in my cell. I'm like, yo, I'm thinking, what the fuck am I going to do?

How the fuck am I going to get out of here? So I go back in myself. I lock in. They kept me locked in until lunchtime. Now lunch. comes they open the cells, I come out. They're doing lunch and it's like a beefaroni. So I'm going to get my tray again.

This motherfucker told me I couldn't eat. Like, nah, bro, you dead. Again, Rod Dixon, what are you going to do? I was like, all right. So now the police come out, they're like, yo, Smith, clean your cell. Your cell is a mess. Go clean your cell. So out of nowhere out the blue.

Like, what the fuck? I was like, I'm trying to eat. You're telling me you go clean my fucking cell? Go clean your cell. Right now, we're going to fuck you up. All right. I go in a slot room to get the bucket, the mop, stuff like that, and I see a long wooden scrub brush.

It's like long with a handle and all of that. So I'm not thinking of this at the time. So I take it. I'm stressed. I'm walking to my cell. I start cleaning it. And then I'm like, this dude named man murder comes to my cell. And he's like, yo, give me a PIN number.

He just, like, taps me on the back, mad heart. Give me a PIN number. I said, my PIN number for what? He said, so I get on the fucking phone. Give me a fucking pin number. I said, ain't you the motherfucker that didn't let me eat? Mawrugger just cocked back and punched me dead in my fucking face. Yo, boom.

I'm like, oh, shit. No start leaking. And she said, give me your fucking PIN number. I'm like, aye, I, man. I got you. I got you, chill. So, like, write it right here. Had a pen and paper and everything ready.

So I write it. Give it to him. He spins off. Now I'm like, I've had it. I've had it up to him. I'm done now. So this motherfucker is on the phone. I come back out with everything.

I didn't even clean myself. I just come back out with everything. And he's on the phone facing the bubble and he's jerking off. He's on the phone and he's jerking off, right? And I'm like, I look at him. I look at the wooden scrub brush. Look at him. him look at the wooden scrub brush.

I look in the day room. Everybody's watching Jerry Springer. Ain't nobody paying attention. The police is not even in the bubble. I'm like, all right, fuck it. It's now and never. And I grabbed that fucking wooden scrub brush, bro.

And I went to work on that motherfucker. I let out everything on him. I broke his jaw. I broke his nose. His eye socket was damn near hanging out. When I tell you, because he wasn't expecting it, he had his fucking dick in his hand. And I hit him from behind.

Pause. So I had a pause. No ditty. No ditty. So I, um, I hit him as hard as I can with the scrubbush. And I'm talking about I held that shit with two hands, like a bat. And once I hit him once, it stumbled him. And when he went to turn around, I just kept hitting him with it.

Bang, bang, bang. So I'm hitting him. Now he on the floor. I'm kicking him in the face. That's when all the bloods. The rest of them start running out the day room. And they jumped me, right? Now the police comes.

put handcuffs on and he dragged me out the house. After that, I went to another house called Five Main. I went to intake. I went to infirmary and all of that. They didn't put me in solitary confinement. They moved me to another house called Five Main. I go up to Five Maine.

Five Maine was a little bit better. There was a big brolic dude named Charlie Rock from Harlem that ran that house. I'm talking about this had to be the biggest adolescent I ever seen in the world. Like I'm talking about like on Roids. But he was cool. He was like, he was level-headed. So when I came in the house, he was like, oh, yo, what up, son? You that kid that hit that dude man murder downstairs.

Yeah, I like that type of shit. But don't come in here with that shit, bro. We on a respect level up in this house. You understand what I'm saying? I see you still got your clothes and all that so you survived. All right, cool. I'm going to tell you like this, though. If anything happened to one of my peoples, something going to happen to you.

Straight up like that, you hurt. But that's your cell. You can't lock it. out after 11 that's only for the gangsters you ain't a gangster yet you know what I'm saying so go play your position you can have the he said you're gonna let you get on the phone and all of that we ain't taking pin numbers and all that all your commissary you good but don't try to come at none of my peoples I'm like I cool no problem going to myself I'm playing my position I'm cool I'll come out you know I'm on the phone I'm watching TV stuff like that and then one day

Besides, he wants to defend his man, man murder, the guy that I beat up downstairs. That comes into the housing unit. I'm sitting there watching TV and he blindsize me. He sucker punches me from the back. He sucker punches me from the back. I roll out the chair and I just rush him, right? I'm like blinded. So I just rush him and I scoop him.

Boom, throw him on the floor. He was like my size. I was like 130 pounds at the time. Scoop him, put him on the floor and I just, I get to work. I get to go on the work on him. basically beat the crap out of now I've changed now I've become a wolf and I'm not a sheep

because after that happened I like got up on some King Kong shit and was like who the fuck wanted who else wanted I'll fuck all you up you up ah you know I'm really filling myself now like it was crazy I just went to this fucking outrage this burst and um everybody was kind of like like quiet and still for a second like

you're so crazy man yo that motherfucker crazy yo bro that's how you do that shit bro nah nah nah nah nah out of you and yo Charlie Rock he good bro he good with us bro he can stay here he good whatever let that nigga lock out bro and that's what started happening

he started letting me lock out start using the phones more you know what I'm saying started getting people pin them and now motherfuckers is coming in and I'm running down on them that shit is crazy bro like I literally just went through this shit.

And it's like, I'll say like weeks past. You know what I'm saying? And now I'm fucking dudes are coming in. I'm sizing them up. I'm looking at them because I already got the rundown. If they're Spanish, if they black or if they white, how to navigate it. You know what I'm saying? First they come in, you do a whole like general consultation of sorts, right?

Like assessment. You know what I'm saying? Like they come in, let's say it's a white guy. usually the white guys come in and they don't stay like immediately like they'll walk through the A&B gate and they'll see what's going on they'll be like I'm not going in there so a lot of times you're not going to see a white person inside if they come in it's unfortunate to say they're either going to be doing people's clothes they're definitely getting their laundry I mean their commissary taken from them their pin numbers stuff like that there's only one white boy I ever seen coming there and hold it down

and he was like a big redneck motherfucker that wasn't even from New York that just happened to get locked up in New York and came in with that country energy and did not give a fuck and motherfuckers respect to him off the rip but a Spanish person comes in usually um if there's a Spanish group that has a level of respect and um uh agreement with like the other gang like the bloods or whatever inside of the housing unit they will let them rock but they had to be the Latin King and the other gang like the bloods or whatever inside of the housing unit they will let them rock but they had to be the Latin King. Nieta, Thrinitario, and I forgot the other one. But a lot of times they would coexist. Unless someone came from the street that had beef with a blood in the street, then it would get crazy inside the housing unit or in the jail itself. A whole war would start out that would go from house to house. So now I would start doing my assessments and start running down on people. But the way I used to run down, it was a rundown like a kind run.

run down. Like, yo, what's up, bro? You good? You need anything? You sure? You're straight? You know what I mean? No, man, I need to get on the phone or stuff like that. All right, I got you, bro. I'm gonna make sure you get on the phone. You're good. You know what I mean? Yo, yo, let me get that phone in a half an hour. You heard I need to let my man on the phone right here. I was basically manipulated. And I manipulate to the point where I would basically get everything from you. Now you're just going to share your PIN number with me. I didn't use violent means, right? At first to get what I wanted out of somebody. I would just manipulate them. And then, you know, I would give them a little some of you. You ain't got no commissary? I got some chips for you, bro. At that time, you could smoke new ports in the jail.

Like, as an adolescent, you can smoke new ports. They sold it at commissary. So I will have mad cigarettes. Yo, you want a pack of cigarettes? You go give me a pack of a year, bro. You take that shit. That's ain't about nothing, man. You're good. Yo, what time you get on the phone? All right, cool, yo, this is what you're going to do. Let me get that pin number. I'm going to get you another one. And we're going to bang out both from them.

I understand the third. So I had my ways. You know what I'm saying? But then I started getting too... I started getting like too creative with it. And now I want to start getting drugs on a visit. Right? So I'll go on a visit one time.

Had this girl come to see me and she bought me some weed. So it didn't go well. I wound up getting caught on the visiting floor with the weed at that time on Rikers Island. and now they put me in solitary confinement, which was six low at that time. That's where Ebron was at. Shout out to Ebron, you crazy motherfucker. Leroy Ebron.

Yeah, Leroy Ebron. The Bing. Yeah, the Bing. Crazy motherfucker. And there was another one called Money Will. There was another officer down there named Money Will. I don't know if he's living or not. But they take me down there.

So when I go down there, like, you know, I'm feeling myself. I already have a little reputation in general population, but I've never been in the Bing. So now going into the Bing, I'm chilling. I'm like, all right.

You know what I'm going to Bing for 90 days? Whatever. But when I walk into the A&B gate, there's this big black motherfucker name Allah from Far Rockaway. Shout out to him. I don't know if he's living or not. But I respect that dude.

He's in the day room of the Bing. Everybody else is in their cells. I'm like, what the fuck? So Ebroon and Money Will they're like, you and sell 13. Take it down to yourself. But when I come down, I got all my property with me, right?

My food, my clothes, everything. By this time, I got Koogee sweaters and pants. I got iceberg. I got polo, all types of sneakers. So when I go, to go drag my shit, the dude Allah comes out, he has ace bandages around both of his fists. Taintop on him.

This dude is brawling. I don't know how to fuck this motherfucker was an adolescent. But he came out like, yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, babe, bro. Where you going with all that? I'm going to my fucking cell. What fuck you're talking about? He's like, nah, no, you got to take your property and put it in one of these lockers. So Ebro and Money Wheel was like, yeah, you got to go put it in the locker.

So somebody from out of their cell was like, don't put your shit in the locker. He's going to take it. They're going to eat all your shit. I was like, I ain't put my shit nowhere, bro. So I drag it. he tried to snatch my shell. I'm like, get the fuck off my shell. He said, oh, you tough.

You want them tough niggas, huh? I'm like, yeah, I'm built like that. I'm tough, nigga, what? What's up? He's like, all right. Say no more. Go to myself with my shit. So dudes, I'm walking, I'm walking down the tier.

Dude's just like, oh, shit, yo. Son got away with all his shit. Alari, put the paws on him. That's crazy. Who the fuck is him? Da-da-da-da. Go on my cell. Set my cell up and all of that.

That night, they cracked myself. They cracked myself. Ebron and money will come in. They drag me out myself and let Allah beat the crap out of me. Allah beat the crap out of me, took everything out of myself, and they threw me back in myself. That's the thing I don't know if Ebron even talked about is how fucking crazy he was. Ebron was sometimes crazier than the convicts in it.

He said he would do something called the 52 pickup. Yes. What do you know what that is? From my recollection, the 52 pickup was he would put cards on the floor. And he would tell you, yo, listen, I'm going to, I'm a, let me see if I remember it right. He would put the cards. So he would put it down the tier of the, um, the Bing from, from one to 52. And he'd be like, yo, if you could pick up all of these cars in a certain amount of time,

I'm going to let you rock. If you can't pick up these cars in a certain amount of time, I'm going to fuck you up. That's how... You said this place was steps from the water. We just haven't found the steps yet. How much did we save? Enough. Enough to get lost.

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That was allowed. He was like Slick Rick. Ebron was like Slick Rick and he would have big chains on fucking gazelles or Versacee glasses, all his rings on and everything. Nobody fucked with him. you know, him on money will. Was he corrupt? I would say he was. Hell fucking, yeah.

Hell yeah, E. Bron was corrupt. Like a motherfucker, like, I don't know what he was doing, obviously, outside of the Bing. But as far as how he was with us, yeah. He was corrupt as a motherfucker. He would pick and choose who he wanted, who he liked, who he didn't like, who he wanted to get beat up, who he would put hands on, who could go on a visit, who couldn't. Like, he used to do a lot of crazy shit.

You know what I'm saying? But the way I want his respect was, so this situation happens, right? They jumped me. Took all my shit, put me back in the cell, whatever the case may be. So now I start going crazy, kicking on the door, kicking on the cell, da-da-da-da-da-da. Next day comes, I'm banging, I'm kicking again. Allah comes down. He's like, yo, what you want to do?

You want to come out and square up? Dude is like, nah, you don't want to square with him, bro. You don't want to square with him, da-da-da. I'm like, yeah, I want to fight. He was like, all right, we're going to fight the next shift. Because at 7 to 3 shift, there was like non-steadies. So, 3 to 11 come. Money will Ebron come on?

Yo, let this dude out his cell. So he let me out the cell. But Ebron is standing right in front of my cell. He opens the cell, he comes out. He's like, yo, you got an issue with the way I do things out here? You got an issue? Like, you want to fight me? I was like, I'm going to keep it real.

I was like, no, I don't want to fight. fight you. I want to fight him. You know what I'm saying? I was like, I want to fight him. He said, you sure about that? You have a better chance with me? I was like, no, I want to fight him. He said, this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to lock y'all in the day room. If you beat him up, if you come out there, if you come out of that day room as a regular person, unscathed, I'll let you come out with him. I'll let you rock. Because at that time, he used to bring him Chinese food. He used to bring that dude McDonald's. like he had fucking uh what was the Sega Dreamcast he had him playing down there and all of that this dude

it was like fucking la la la land for this guy so I was like alright fuck it like what I got to lose like I'm fucking in the cell all day so he's like I ain't no suit up basically so I'm like all right so um he let me put my um gym shorts on in a tank top or whatever go out there

so we go in a day with him he locks the door. Don't you know, this is what I didn't tell you off camera, but Ebron gives him one a stick. Like the night, the sticks that the COs walk around with. He threw a stick in it. It was like, I go to work. So,

a law grabs the stick immediately and I'm like, fuck, right? So now, I'm, like, again, I'm strategizing this shit and I'm moving around the tables. And I got them chasing me and Ebron and Money Wheels like you fucking fight. Stop fucking running like a bitch.

Fight. Another thing, not to divert too much, another thing that Ebron and them used to do, if you made a ruckus to get out and fight Allah or you disrespected them in any way, they would literally take you in a dayroom, lock the door, put your hands on the locker, and beat you with the stick like you're a fucking horse or something. I swear to God, I'm not like, ask that motherfucker. Put your hands on the fucking thing. don't look back, look forward,

and he would just smack you crazy with the stick. And it's, you know, you know them fucking sticks, man. It ain't no fucking, it ain't a bell. It hurts. It hurts. Yeah. So luckily that didn't happen to me, but I've seen it happen. But anyway, going there, I got this dude chasing me around the fucking dayroom tables and shit.

He's like, come here, I'm like, you'll fight motherfucker for I come in there and do something to you. Da-da-da-da. So I'm like, all right, fuck it. I'm like, yo, I'm trying to time this dude because he's big. And I'm like small and I'm a little agile. And he swung the stick and just missed me. So when he swung the stick and missed me, I fucking kicked him in the nuts. B'all!

Caught him. Boom, caught him good. When I caught him and I kicked him in the nuts, instead of jumping on him and continue, I was scared, I didn't know. So I'm like, I start moving around more. And I'm like, oh, this motherfucker is in pain. So I put my foot on the stick and I start kicking him in the face with my other leg. So I'm kicking him, bong, bong.

He grabs my leg Ha! Pulls me down on the ground. Now I'm on my back. Now he gets on top of me and this motherfucker start punch but one thing I give him is why I say I respect him.

He didn't punch me in my face. He could have because I was kicking him in the face. He didn't punch me in my face and nothing. He just kept hitting me in my chest. Boom. Boom. Hit me in my throat.

So he's hitting me and I grab his nuts. Now I grab his nuts. Pause. And I know it sounds crazy because Ebron did that crazy story on this platform and did all of that

but that's what I did I grabbed this dude's nuts and I squeezed him to get him up off me he got up he got up off me and I got back on top of him and now I just start

I just start commencing multiple punches all in his face everywhere I'm just swinging all wildly banging on him and then Ebron and Moneywell came in and pulled me up off him

and he was like yo you good you're good and they was like Allah you know what to do and made him put his hands on the um locker

and they beat him they beat him with the sticks I wonder if that's where he got that story from which one the nuts yeah yeah that story was way different

because he said it was in the shower yeah but I just feel like a lot of these stories are like twisted from different parts like you know like it's something

that probably happened but it's from the perspective of someone else you know That could be true too. To make it sound better. Right.

So you get out of the Bing finally at Rikers Island? Yeah, I get out of the Bing. I'm chilling. Like, at this point, everybody's like, oh, this is the dude that fought Allah. And everything was, like, smooth after that. Another thing, like, that kept people cool with me is I used to beatbox a lot.

Everybody's a rap in prison. So I used to beatbox and people rap. And so it made me cool with a lot of people outside of just, oh, this dude. put in work before. It was like, now he's talented. Like, you know, so I used to bang on the table. I used to do all kind of beats from my mouth and cats love that shit.

But, um... Do you think that experience at Rikers kind of shaped the rest of your prison stays that you, like you were talking about smuggling and drugs at the other prison stay, getting into fights, this and that? Did that all stem from that Rikers bid? Yeah. I would say that, yeah, because that's when I was first introduced to, like, that world. So being introduced to that world and seeing that there was still criminal activities going on in an environment where you're enclosed.

And me seeing people getting away with it, I was like, you know, I'll try it too. And it just, it was a continuum after that. After in the street back in the street, back in prison, I just kept doing it. What happened with your grandmother during all of these prison stays? She was there for me, bro. believe it or not my grandmother is a strong woman bro she uh she helped me down every time even to to my last bit you know she's still living in everything thank god but i feel like my grandmother's stuff is from dementia now on early uh alsumers and i feel like there was two major factors

of her life that progressed that ailment. Me going in and out of prison, because I was the love of her life. I still am. And she always helped me down. And I always felt like the attention and love that my grandmother gave to me is what she always wanted to do for her son,

who she didn't really do it for, because he went out and just did whatever he wanted to do on his own. So I felt like she gave that loving attention to me and also the fact that she didn't want my mom's raising me in a bad environment. And she wanted to prove to my mother that she could raise me better than she could, which at that time it didn't work. What happened to your mom? What was the situation?

My mom, she's great. But at that time, early on, my mom was heavy in the drug use. Um, so she's, she has gotten arrested before. She's been in and out of the system. She never did a state bit, but my mom's was heavy in the streets for a while. Like, she was known. Like, every time I got locked up, everybody knew who my mother was. It was crazy.

Oh, Ross is your mom's? Oh, man, your mom's is crazy. You know, no, no, no, so. But, um, she, she was, uh, my mom's a gangster. She, she was a gangster. I mean, she still is in my eyes. You know, even though she's cleaned, she's been cleaned for over 20-some years.

She's a devout show of witness. She lives in Texas. She's cool, great person. But at that time, yeah, she was like that. She was about her money. She was very loyal to the people that were around her. You know, she sold her drugs. She did drugs.

She beat people up. She shot people. She stabbed. people she did she did all of that shit and um she's still here you know what i'm saying but uh me and my moms have a great relationship now we're great but we were estranged for a while due to her issues with my grandmother she always felt like my grandmother enabled me to do the things that i did so for a long time there was a lot of uh tension between them two and my moms would distance herself from me a lot but when i first started going to jail my moms would be there

She would come and see me on the visits and stuff like that and send me money. But she would always tell me, don't get used to this. I'm not always going to be here doing this for you. You need to learn a hard way. My grandmother would always be there. So it was definitely an enabler to know that you have somebody that is going to be there for you no matter what, unconditionally right or wrong. Like I'll be dead to fucking wrong. She knows I'm dead to wrong.

And she'd be like, how much is it bail? okay, I can't leave my grandson in there. You know what I'm saying? Sweetest, sweetest woman in the world, man. Did they try to raise you as a Jehovah Witness too? Yeah, absolutely. I went to the kingdom halls. That's another part of my rebellion, I believe, too.

Was my grandmother forcing me to go to the kingdom hall multiple times a week, Bible studies. And shout out to them. There's no disrespect to them and what they do and what they believe. But I was already in streets. You know what I'm saying? I would do it to satisfy my grandmother. You know, and when I was younger, younger, I was into it because I didn't understand it. But as I started getting a little older and seeing what was outside of the kingdom hole and outside of the house, I was like, what's this shit?

You know what I'm saying? And once I went to Jee, because I went to juvenile first. I was in Sparford for a second. And when I went to spa off and came back, I'm like, I'm not doing that. Right? My grandmother had no control over me. You know what I'm saying? But they did try.

And for years, I would go to the Kingdom Hall. But then once I started going back and forth to prison, it's like, and start learning other shit about other religions and universal law, this, that, and the third. I'm like, I'm not dealing with that anymore. But they still, that's what they use to cope with life. I don't knock it. You know what I mean? Anybody who has like, the way I look at it is like this, right?

You believe therapy is necessary, right? If you've been through a lot of trauma in your life, right? So I feel like what my family has done as far as my mom's, my grandmother, and other women in my family who are Jehovah Witnesses, is they use that as a therapy. They use religion, being a Jehovah witness, having something to do, feeling like there's a higher power that's watching over and all the time that they can talk to, even though there's nothing talking back to them.

Bible study, this after, they enveloped themselves and become so overzealous in the religion that a lot of times they miss sight of reality, of what's really happening in real time. And the answer to everything is pray to Jehovah. But it's like, pray to Jehovah ain't going to make your feet hit the ground and go get to the money. you know what I'm saying if you they say pray and then go do the work and then you get the results of it from the prayer that you just that you just you just you just did so that that's my assessment of that from over the years like if my family would have went to therapy early on everything would be different even myself actually my grandmother tried that I'm sorry my grandmother had me seen a

a psychologist when I was younger and I was just going in and out and bugging the fuck out. She had me go see a psychologist. It didn't work though. I'm going to tell you why I didn't work. In retrospect, because I felt like she couldn't relate to me.

I felt like I couldn't sit and talk to somebody about how I really felt my pain, my traumas of the things I've seen and experienced to an older white woman. You know what I'm saying? I felt like, what are you going to tell me? You don't know anything I've been through.

You don't know none of my pain. You probably haven't walked out of your building and seen somebody shot in the head before. So how can you help me quell that trauma? That was my thinking at that time. So I just abandoned it. Like my grandmother, I went twice and that was it. Because I didn't like the way she talked to me.

I didn't like the way she made me kind of feel like less than a human being at times. So, but overall, I feel like therapy is essential in learning how to navigate life, especially if you've been through a lot of trauma or if you experienced a lot of it. Definitely. So 2013, you get out of that six-year sentence

after the almost two years in the shoe, in the box, and then you said you caught another case in 2015? Yeah. What was that for? Burglaries again. You love to steal. I loved. to still, yeah.

Yeah, EDD. You're not stealing that anymore. No, no, no. I'm doing everything the right way. Yeah, burglary rings. This one, you know, I said it was a car ring at one time. This was a burglary ring. We had a very sophisticated setup.

Again, my Italian connect. This guy always stuck with me. Oh, even after all those years had passed? He knew me since I was young. That was just like a mob guy? Yeah. Okay. Yep, out of Bay Ridge, Brooklyn.

Yeah. took a liking to me early on. So I went to school with his son. And I used to go to his house and, you know, we used to chill, you know, eat, hang out, whatever the case may be. And I was like the only black kid that used to be in that part of Brooklyn like that. But everybody took a liking to me. And he knew what his son was doing.

You know what I'm saying? A lot of times he used to send his son on missions. So it came to a point where he was like, yo, You want a job? And I'm like a job doing what? He was like, oh, something simple. It's nothing crazy. You're going to go over here and you're going to get that and you're going to bring it back over here.

You want to do it? I'm like, yeah, I don't give a fuck. I'm doing other shit anyway. He said, yeah, you might as well. You're fucking stealing candy. You're stealing fucking 40 ounces. It's fucking stupid shit. You want to make some money?

I'm like, yeah, all right. I'll do that. And I was doing that shit and I was very good at it for a time. and I would get locked up He knows I'm not going to say anything I never told after that first time In 96 when I first first got locked up

And went to Spofford He was like I could fuck with this dude He's solid Because I don't know what it is I never had an expectation of him to hold me down I didn't care I'm like oh I'm gonna go see such and such When I'll go home I'll be fine

You know what I'm saying Like everybody's stressing about what they're gonna do when they go home, be like, man, I'm gonna go home. I'm gonna go see such and such. I'm gonna be straight. And so every time I came home, y'all, Mikey, this is what's going on over here. What do you think about it? And I was always smart.

Like, don't get twisted. Like, I was never stupid. I was always really good in school. Math, reading, everything. Always smart. So when it came to the street shit, he would, like, ask me about certain shit. shit, like, even like crazy shit. Like crazy shit.

Like, what are you thinking about this? Let me tell you something, right? This guy, I did this, and then have this person over here with this and that, da-da-da-da-da. How do you think I should play this? You said, da-da-da-da-da. Why don't you just boom? And then this guy will believe this. And then this person over here was like, because I used to play chess and shit.

So I'm like, he's like, you're right. I didn't think about it that way. You know, so we had a solid relationship. and shit. You know what I'm saying? I haven't talked to him in years, but every time I came home, he had something for me to do. So the burglary re bring was like, there were spots all over the city, and he had plugs like with doorman and shit like that,

like a high-end luxury apartments and penthouses and shit. And basically, he knew, like, you know, there were safes in there, you know, a lot of jewelry, money, stuff like that and like go get it. But the setup was crazy, bro. The setup was crazy. Like we had dummies. Like we had dummies in cars in different places.

Like where there's cameras. So that way our alibos like, no, I was over here. Wait, where's the receipt? I got a receipt right here from this gas station. What are you talking about? I wasn't in Manhattan. I was in fucking Brooklyn. You know what I'm saying?

It was very sophisticated, bro. It was a team of like four of us. And we would go out. And we did this like every couple months. It wasn't like every day, every week and shit like that. Every couple of months because we'd be coming off with a lot of money. Even splitting, we still left with a nice amount of money. So there was this, and this was in the newspaper too.

There was a string of burglaries. that happened in Soho, Soho Tribeca area. And they were calling like, basically called me like the Spider-Man. Like, it's crazy, bro. They was called me Spider-Man in the newspaper. It wasn't like the Soho news or something like that. It wasn't like the major newspapers. And my lawyer came and showed it to me when I was sitting in Manhattan House.

And there was like, yo, they're trying to put 22 burglaries on you. But what happened is it wasn't just me. It was another person, too. Some Spanish guy that was running around doing Spider-Man shit because I'm like, yo, that's not even my eye. Wishing you could be there live for the big game, soaking up the atmosphere in the crowd. But too often, life gets busy.

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One of the guys I used to run out, come outside with me to get to do work, got knocked. Well, not knocked. He got arrested for beating up his girl in North Carolina. know and he wanted to get out of that because they was going to kill him in the jail so he told on me yeah wow and how much time do you get for that seven years seven years so that brings you to 2022 you got out 21 21 you got out a year early yeah was that because of COVID or you just no that was because of oh man that's another crazy story uh I got her 2021 because Albany central office

made a mistake. They made a mistake on my time computation. So what happened is I was on parole when I caught the case, right? So they gave me seven years. Seven flat. I was supposed to come home in six years. That was the mindset from the beginning.

I go in, but when I go in, bro, when I tell you I was a good dude, I got my education. Excuse me. I got my bachelor's degree in liberal from bar college bar prison initiative while I was in there I was in fish guild a whole time I didn't even bounce from jail to jail or nothing oh fish

tells near here yeah it ain't too far yeah in Beacon New York um I did get into little spats in the jail but it was nothing crazy nothing serious so the reason why when I went in on this one I tried I stayed on a straight and arrow for the most part was because of my great-grandmother my great-grandmother my great-grandmother the way while I was in prison. And she was like my overseer. She was the big homie. Like whatever she said was fucking gold.

And when she died, I was in Manhattan house in MDC in Manhattan. And I couldn't go to the funeral. And that shit fucking killed me. And I made the decision that day right after that. I said, I'm never, ever, ever coming back here again. It's fucking over. Whatever time they're going to give me, they're going to give me. They were offering me 15 to life at first.

And I was like, I'm not taking that shit. I'm not doing 15 to life. Y'all out of your fucking mind. And once I made that, it's like a switch went off. Because even when I was in Manhattan House, I'm not going to lie. I was selling drugs. I was making moves. I was getting USB fucking shits with two terabytes on it,

with movies, videos, all kind of shit for us. to watch. I was wild and I had a phone in there, everything. And, uh, but when that happened and they fucking told me, I could, I wilded out. I'm not going to lie. Like, I made the whole house turn up. Like, we fucking shut the house down. The police and everything scared to death. I was like, y'all not letting me go to my great-grandmother's funeral. All right. I'm going to show you how powerful I am. Because I, everybody was getting hired because of me. We fucking put the tables in front of the gate. We put shampoo all over the floor. So if the turtles came in.

You know, we call them turtles because of the shields they wear when they come in. But they're regular cops. They just wear that shit. They come in, they can slip all over the fucking floor that they try to throw tear gas in there. We had fucking wet towels and shit to wrap around our face. We had mattresses to battle them. Like, we was ready.

You know what I'm saying? And they didn't want to take it there. They didn't want to take it there. They wound up having some big wig come and talk to me. You know, we're sorry. We can't let you go because it's not a direct. relative of yours. It's not like your mother, your father,

your brother, your sister. It's a great-grandmother, so you can't go to the funeral. So I had to hold it down, but I did give them hell for it. You know what I'm saying? But that's when I made the decision that I was going to stay on the straight narrow.

I said, if I got to go upstate for some time, I'm going to get my education. I'm going to do something different because all I had at that time was my GED. And I got my GED on my second bid. So sure enough, some time passes after I make that decision. I start falling back from, you know, hustling and stuff like that. I passed on to somebody else.

I just wanted to be entertained and go on my visits and try to get the fuck out of here. And they wind up coming back and telling me seven years. So in my mind, I'm thinking, I'm like, I did two and a half to five once. I did two and a half a second time. Then I did six years. And now they're just offering me seven. flat, I'll be dumb not to take that shit. And I'm guilty as fuck.

Like, it's not, I never denied it. You know what I'm saying? So I'm like, all right, I'll take the seven. So when I took the seven, I get sentenced and all of that. But what I did prior to sentencing is I started going to see mental health. The mental health psychologist or whatever the case may be, because my plan was to stay in a jail close to New York. So they started giving me meds and stuff like that. I wasn't taking that shit.

But they would give me meds and stuff like that and everything is documented. So when you are on medication or you've seen a mental health therapist and stuff like that, when it's time for them to assess you to go upstate and you see an officer that does the assessment for an interview, they 99% of the time

put you in the jail closer to where you live or where you're from where you caught your case at. So that's how I ended up in Fishkill the whole time. And it was a blessing. I'm not going to lie. Going to Fishkill was a blessing for me

compared to how my other biz was because they had the bar prison initiative program in there. And so once I went in, again, I know how to bid by now, right? I know how this shit goes. And that shit was like Candyland. Like moving around. The visits was every weekend.

my girl was coming to see me. Like, I was, I was good. I had packages coming in every month. I didn't have to worry about shit. And the written exams came up. Entrance exams came up to get into the college. So I go into, I sign up for it. I go into the visiting room.

It's like 200 guys to take the entrance exam. You had to write three essays. I forgot with each thesis. this was, but I wrote the three. I think one was about James Baldwin, one was about Frederick Douglass, and the woman who started the whole feminist movement back in the days.

I forgot her name. So I'm a good writer, but I'm way better now after going to college, for real. But I wrote my essay, 500 words or whatever case may be, and I nailed it. And out of 200 people, only 16 people got into that,

cohort. I was one of the 16. Um, so they make you do an interview first. Like after they say you get the letter, oh, you've been accepted into bar, you have to do an interview. I did the interview with Max Kenner. Shout out to Max McKenna. Um, and another woman. I forgot her name. And, uh, they asked you those questions like, you know, why do you want to go to college? What are you in jail for? What do you feel like this is going to do for you? What are your plans when you get out, stuff like that? and I nailed it. And when I tell you, that shit kept me out of trouble, bro, going to college in prison.

And I advocate, like, at some point I want to go back into the prisons or policy, talk to people as far as policy and shit, because I feel like, I don't feel like I know statistically. If a man or woman gets their education in prison, they have a 99% chance of not going back to prison. The recidivist rate is, like, none. It's like 0.5%. of going back.

And that's, and it's been shown over time with anybody who went to bar, John Jay College, Mercy College, whatever, wherever you at. So I navigate through college. I do well. I do exceptionally well. I graduated with like a 3.8 GPA. And during this time, you might as well segue into me starting a successful magazine business while I was in there.

that got me a lot of fucking hate too a lot of fucking hate from people in there police and peers alike so 2018 2017 they started doing something called JPE you're familiar with that

they started giving out tablets all over the place I'm like what the fuck is this shit so I'm hype because we had cassette tapes and headphones and all of this shit so I'm like oh shit they will building the kiosk systems in each housing unit. So I'm intrigued now. I'm like, oh shit, the rest of this bit is going to be easy.

You can get emails. You can, because in the feds it was going on already. We were late. You can get emails. You can get 30 second videograms from the street. You could buy music, get books, this down and the third. So I'm like, this is cool. So at that time, they had pussy books.

And the pussy book of choice was Butman, right? John Stagliano, right? He had the shit on smash him. Larry Flint were hustler, Fox. Then you had the other, you know, girl magazines like Smooth, straight stunting, rest in peace case, Slay, different magazines like that.

But I was always infatuated in magazines because it's like a, it reminds you of what you used to get in the street if you got it in the street. So I'm sitting in, I bet I would think a lot, think a lot. And I'm saying, and I'm saying always to say

at the same time I was getting my education, so my mind is opening up more. I'm learning so much shit and now I'm becoming more of a critical thinker. So now in real life, I'm looking at things critically and I'm questioning everything and I'm coming up with solution-based answers.

So I would sit with people and I would ask them like, yo, what do you think if, what do you think that happened if you had a magazine like this that had this and it and had that and had this and it had this and it. Would you buy it?

How fucking y'all buy that shit, bro? What are you talking about? I want to stay in tune with the street. it out. All right, cool. All right. So now, Jay Pay's up and running. Shit is going. It's blasting off. Everybody's happy. And there's this magazine that comes past my desk called BBO, right? Bad bitches only. So I'm looking at the magazine. And I always been good at looking at a product and knowing how to make it better. Even though I didn't create it, I know how to make it better. So I'm looking at it. And it was the only magazine at the time that had like black and Latin porn in it. Right? And that's one thing John Sagliano kind of like

fell to the wayside where it was mostly like Brazilian but mostly white porn. And now you have more black and Latin men in prison than

anything. So I'm looking at the magazine. I'm like, oh, this shit is dope. You know what I'm saying? They finally, you know,

something to cater to us or whatever. And, but then I started noticing a lot of mistakes in the magazine. Like no page numbers, blurry images,

no table of contents, misspellings, all kind of shit. Now I'm psychoanalyzing this shit. I'm like, yo, what the fuck? And people are, we're going crazy. I'm not going to lie. Everybody's buying it. They were number one.

But I'm like, yo, whatever have we created something better than this? That's what I'm saying to myself. So I start ruminating. I start pen the paper. I start writing shit down while I'm going to school. Ideas are coming. Ideas are coming.

And being that I went in in 2015, I went upstate in 2016, but being I went in 2015, I was technologically advanced compared to a lot of my peers who had been sitting up for mad long. So I understood Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, all of that shit.

So I said, these motherfuckers is not showing what's on social media. There's no magazines that's showing what's happening on the gram, what's happening on Facebook, what the Shade Room is talking about, what gossip alert, all these things. So I was like, what if we took those things

and put in the magazine and make sure but where we got the information from the content was credited to the original source. Hmm. All right. Let me try something. I call my man in L.A.

We're no longer partners now. We since split ways. But, and I'm like, yo, I got an idea, right? And he was like, what is it? And I tell him. I'm like, yo, we start a magazine to stand in the 30. And at that time, he was like kind of falling on hard times. And I just got a little lawsuit money.

So I'm like, yo, I'm going to send you some bread. just follow my lead on this. You know what I'm saying? He was in L.A. I said, if you come to New York, just come visit me and I'm going to show you what I'm talking about.

I'm very passionate about this. A few weeks later, he came to New York to visit his family. He comes to see me on a visit. So I left the BBO magazine for him to take home with him so he can look at it

and I explained everything to him. So he was like, what you need me to do? I said, I need you to put it together. I need you to structure the business. I can't do it from here. But I have the idea. is I know exactly what you need to do to the tea.

Just listen to me. Trust me. I'm in here with the market. Fortunately, he did. And he was really, really good at putting it together. Like, the shit was the most high quality magazine I ever seen. So what we did was we took Instagram, mostly Instagram, and shit from the gossip sites and put in the magazine. I looked up the copyright laws,

we got law library access, so you can take this public information and put into content into a magazine form as long as you quote the source. So we started doing that. And then we started getting models, girls, who were willing to shoot to be in a magazine. And then I started fucking running into people in the prison

that were connected to rappers. Like everything just fell in line, bro. it was fucking crazy because, you know, that low of attraction shit. So, shit started moving, bro. When I tell you start moving, March 2018 is when, like,

we officially, like, launched. In the first magazine, we had Nikki Minaj on the cover. It was called viral. At that time, we called it gyro. Gyro, word. I came up with the name and everything. Gyro, I'm an acronym guy, so it meant get your rocks off, right?

And we had Nicky Minajoge on the cover, and it was just an entertainment magazine at first. And then I was like, yo, why don't we come up with three different types of other magazines

call it platinum, black and gold. Platinum for the white girls, black for the black girls, gold for the Latin girls. And then we take shit off of bang bros, porn hub,

West Coast productions, all these different websites, screenshot them and put them in a magazine. He was like, that's a good idea. All right, I got you. Shit started working,

off the rip. because of the quality, like we had Matt Black fucking covers. High quality, like, shit, you could slap on the coffee table. And started fucking with the competition. Then I called Kay Slay, a friend of Kay Slay, DJ K Slay, a DJ K Slay, rest of peace, was in my housing unit. And he had the biggest magazine, a straight stunt in the country. So I'll call them to ask him, can we do an ad page in a magazine, a two-page ad?

He said, yo, you know what? You're calling me from prison. like what you're doing, I'm just going to charge you $1,200. Say them more, cool. Usually he charges like five bands. All right, we do it. Shit takes off even more. Now we have a fucking,

a presence. Like, we started in New York, New York State, and that shit started going into Michigan, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, like, started going all over the place. So now we started coming up, what happened is we wound up through our trial and error,

finding out that every state can get, porn magazines, right? So we started to tailor the magazine to the individual markets. So now it's like, all right, the feds can't get pussy books. So let's give the feds, I Love Girls.

I Love Girls is just fucking hot, fucking top models. Platinum, black and gold. White girls, black girls, and Spanish girls, like in bikinis and shit like that. but looking fucking excellent. You're going to want to beat off to this in the feds.

So we came up with that. I love girls. Then we came up with foreplay. So four play, same thing, platinum black and gold, is because certain states like Michigan, you can have books showing girls naked, but no penetration. So now we got shit that we were snatching off of Twitter.

You know, Twitter's under few. cheated with the porn. So now we got, we got shit in there of girls just, you know, showing themselves, but naked. So now we got three magazines of full play, three magazines of I Love Girls. What was the other three? And then we had the viral magazine, which stood alone. And then we had I love girls. All of Girls, Four Play. Oh, then the Pussy Books, the three Pussy Books, but that was just for New York State. Still to this day. that's the only state that allows that. And the shit took off like crazy.

Now, everybody knows that I'm behind it, right? And that's my fault, though. I could have kept it quiet and never said nothing. But I was doing too much marketing research, asking too many questions, then I'm getting sample copies coming into me and I'm sharing it with people, whatever. Now, people that are connected to rapists start coming in.

So I'm like, instead of us taking interviews from the internet, why don't we start doing our own interviews? literally I would be on the phone the jail phone calling rappers and doing interviews over the phone and then we would pay somebody to transcribe it and put in the magazine and have the rapper send us some of their top photos

and put in the magazine put them on the cover of the Vibril Entertainment magazine so after the Nicki Minaj one we didn't know Nikki Minaj nothing we just put on the cover to to catch attention the magazine after that was Uncle Murder

so Uncle Murder was able to he was doing the wrap-up 20-20 he does his yearly wrap-up thing I ran into one of his friends a guy named Debo Brown that was in there everybody told him

you know this to do behind the magazine or whatever he came to me he was like yo you should have Uncle Murdo on the front this Saturday he was about to do the wrap-up drop it at the end of December boom boom it works it worked the shit went crazy he even shouted out at the end of the wrap up the magazine

and from there I started get more people. Then Benny the butcher's cousin fucking shows up in my jail. I get on the phone with Benny Bush. I interview him over the phone. Then DJ self,

then this person, that person just kept falling in line until I came home. And when I came home, I contacted all the people that I talked to on the phone. I'm like, it's me, champ. Like, nobody knew what I look like.

And that got me into the entertainment lane once I came home in 2021. Yeah. Tell us what you've been doing between, you know, getting home and to present day with the entertainment world and how you were able to rebuild your life successfully.

So when I came home, I got right to it. So I was all magazine. Anything magazine related, that's what I was about. It's called YKTV magazine now. You know the vibes. And so I would go to different events, like industry events, whatever the case may be, with a book bag with magazines on me. And I'll just talk to anybody. I'll talk to anybody like, hey, my name is champ. I've had, I'll interview this person, I interviewed that person. This is before I really, really had an understanding of podcasting, right? I was podcasting from prison, essentially, for prisoners through a magazine. So I started connecting with people and it's funny because it all started with Benny the butcher. I'm not going to lie. Shout out to him, BSF, all of them brothers from Buffalo. Because as soon as

came home, I called him. I hit him up on Instagram. It was like, yo, I'm home, bro. Boom, boom, boom. He was like, yo, I'm doing the show in Long Island. Pull up. I pull up to Long Island. I meet up with him face to face.

He showed me mad love. I run into somebody else I know named Neek Bucks, another rapper that I knew from Harlem from back in the days. So now, yo, what you doing, champ? Da-da-da-da. Yo, I got this magazine, boom, boom. And that was it, bro. After that, like, you know, I'm taking pictures with these people.

I'm posting on the gram, people looking like who's this guy, then it just, it kept going after that. Now, I'm, I'm getting people's phone numbers and contacts, and then I'm getting the word on where different events and stuff is happening. Who's doing studio sessions over here and over there? And I'm pulling up. I literally didn't sleep like the first year and a half that I was home. I was outside so much marketing and promoting. So, that's how it started. I started getting into these loops. I met my man shampoo. Shout out to shampoo. YMVS Entertainment Media.

He moved me around. He works with Smoke Champs in Norrie at Drink Champs. I bumped into another guy that I was introduced to named Dren Starr, who was one of the head Brandon Bassist for Duce. He shows me a lot of love,

show me the ropes on a lot of things. He actually is supposed to be, supposed to come on your show. Oh, really? Yeah, Dren Star. Yeah. I'm going to show you a picture of him after. It was a while ago.

Why didn't he come on? I think I got caught up If something happened But I'm gonna show you a picture But I talked to him earlier today And he was like I was supposed to go to a while ago, bro I gotta make it happen

But shout out to him He showed me a lot He works with Rock Nation He showed me the ropes My man Michi showed me a lot of the ropes Shout out to him My man fresh from Lomaine Show me the ropes a lot

Um Miche the DJ No no no he's not a DJ No he's just a what you call a connector Okay Great connector music industry. My man Fresh from Lomain, shout out to him.

And then there's a bunch of other people that I don't fuck with anymore. So I'm not going to even name them. That, you know, they put me in different places and connected me to people as well. But our relationship's sour because they had bad intentions. So that's how I got in the loop of things now. Fast forward, I meet a lady named Char Newell. She's a life coach, right? I meet her through my uncle Kirk

Excuse me And he introduces me to her I forgot what it was about Oh I know what it was My uncle Kirk wanted me to interview her And his friend Dury They had some like health jock event thing going on And he said it'd be dope to interview them

So anyway I interviewed them Everything went well And Shaw Newell me and her were talking And she was like, you know I like what you do And you got this magazine thing and it's dope I want to introduce you to somebody. And I'm like, cool.

She's like, Math Hoffa. And I'm like, who's Math Hoffa? And she was like, you don't know who Math Hoff is? He's a battle rap. I said, oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've heard of him before. Yeah, from the battle rap world and stuff. She's like, yeah, he has a popular podcast,

and I think you and him should talk. I'm like, all right, cool, fuck it. So now I start looking into the shit. I'm like, oh, shit. This guy really got motion. You know what I'm saying? So she puts on us on a three-way call, and we spoke for a little while,

And I told him, you know, what I'm doing, what I had going on and my hunger for, you know, wanting to be, you know, bigger than what I am or whatever. So he was like, all, cool, you know, take my number, this, that and the third. So I took his number. Time passes. My man Drenstar invites me to Made in America Festival in Philly. So there's like a whole Ducey section that they have.

And I'm in the Ducey section with some people. Like, you know, I'm feeling like I'm getting somewhere. And still on magazine time. magazines in my book bag, stuff like that. And Math Hoffa pulls up with his whole team. So I'm like, oh shit, this is the guy I've been talking to on the phone, you know. So he pulls up and we start talking. He was on live.

And I'm like, yo, Math, what's up? I'm champ, da, da, da. He was like, world, oh shit. And he got off live and we sat and chopped it off like an hour. And he was like, yo, come by the shop on Tuesday. The barbershop. I'm like, all, cool. You know, give me the address.

So at that time, things had escalated so much in my life in the positive way I was actually managing a multimedia center in Harlem called Exodus Productions. So I was doing pretty well. And he said, come by the shop on Tuesday. Why not to find out the shop was two blocks away from the studio that I managed? So sure enough, I go to a Tuesday, not knowing what to expect. It's what I've seen online. I go with a camera and I have my book bag with my magazine. magazines and shit and Tony Ayo and Uncle Murders in there.

And that's the interview that went viral with Tony Ayo. Like it went crazy. And I was actually there for that. That was my first time ever being in a podcast setting of something that went viral. And like Tony Ayo Minch said my name a few times. And it was crazy. It was fucking amazing. And from there, because I put so much working outside and met so many people and works with so many artists.

math started to see that I knew a lot of people that were coming on his show so after 208 you on Uncle Murder you had Crooked Eye and Joello Ortiz I knew Joel Ortiz so he's seen me oh shit champ what's up you when you came home you know and then after that it was Al Bial I know I'll be out and then now he's like yo sitting in the chair because at first I was just sitting on the sideline he's like you're sitting in the chair I'm like all right I sat in the chin the rest was history now I'm right now I'm right now I'm right now

I'm working in his institution. I'm helping to get guests. I'm cleaning the shop. I'm doing a lot of different things. You know what I mean? Compared to the other co-hosts. And I want to say this. Like, I made a lot of mistakes on this platform.

I'm not going to lie. We did have a lot of issues. Some on my end. Some on his end. And I did a lot of things that did. I did things that didn't call for me to react the way I did to him. Right? apologized online before about it. But I give it all to communication, lack of communication

on my side as well, because there were things that I would see that I was feeling and I never communicated it to him as a man like, yo, bro, I'm not this right here, I'm not feeling that. So instead of communicating it, I let it fester and stay inside and then I would act out in other ways. And then acting out in other ways, I kept things from him. There's certain things and tell him that was going on. And that made for a bad relationship business-wise, right? So we came to a head in January of last year where we just finished doing like a crazy epic,

I'll be out interview. And he came to me and was like, yo, I'm not paying you for this episode. And I was like, why not? And he was like, because you didn't bring any advertisers, any advertisement dollars to this episode. And I'm like, when we started doing that, we had a back and forth for whatever

and I made up my mind right there I was like yo I'm leaving the show I'm not coming back right in retrospect I understood where he was coming from as far as that's concerned but it was like bad timing like we could have talked outside the shop

one on one and you gave me the lay the land like yo listen moving forward this is what we're going to do all of us I felt you just came to me and came at me with that personally because some other shit happened and you were still holding on to that So I wound up leaving the show

In all of last year Before I get into that One thing I will say is that I'm grateful For the opportunity that that man gave me Because there's a million other people He could have had in that barbershop And sat in that shit that were way more experienced than me And he didn't

He chose me because I came through a credible source And I executed, I did a phenomenal job While I was there And I've been to places and seen things that I probably wouldn't have seen on my own. I've been in the BET Awards. I was on the fucking red carpet. I've been to drink champs being interviewed by Norrie.

Like, I've been to some places. You know what I'm saying? So I'm forever grateful to him for that and more. But all of last year, most of last year, like we had this crazy spat online back and forth where he was talking crazy about me. talking crazy about him. And I feel like on my end, I crossed the line because I got his family involved.

And I started talking about his girl. And I told his co-host, Gatt Taylor, in December when we talk, I said, yo, when I go on a platform that's big, I'm going to let this be known. And I was wrong for doing that. I was wrong for putting his business with his girl out there online. He didn't deserve that. And I apologize for that. And that led to him doing an interview with somebody who was an enemy of mine that tried to put, like, dirt on my name. And that didn't do well for me.

It had me stress. It had me depressed, deep anxiety and stuff like that. But I understand why he did it. I have total understanding of why he did it's because of what I did. And when you involve family, it's no turning back. Like all doors are over. for you to get the smoke. So I get it.

But we haven't spoke, and I'm fine with that. I'm just making sure that I, on my end, I'm letting him know how remorseful and how I regret making that decision to put him and his girls' information online through Tasha K. I shouldn't have done that. It was wrong.

And obviously, I would never do something like that against anyone. But at the time, it was a lot of emotions involved, a lot of back and forth, and I was being King Petty. So, you know, we left on those terms. We still haven't talked, like I said, but we'll see what happens in the future.

So I sincerely apologize to everybody on a math hofer's podcast, including Mathafer, your family, and anyone who has been hurt by anything that I've said or have done over the past year in relation to your platform and your co-host. What's the life lesson you want people to take away? from your story today? Perseverance. Perseverance.

For me to go through all the stuff that I went through, going in and out of prison for such a long time to still be here at 42 years old and have this level of success and experience the things that I have, it was perseverance. No matter where you are in life, no matter what you're going through,

you can, as long as you can wake up in the morning and your feet hit the ground, you have an opportunity to do something different. that's the biggest thing for me um another thing i would say is to if you have a passion for something do that shit don't think twice about it it's easier said than done because we got bills to pay at the end of the day that's reality right but when you have a passion for something and you're actually good at it the money comes that shit just it just it's gonna come i don't care with nobody you says we've seen it happen with some of the most successful people out here in the world they were down down bad some homeless look at rocky for example right

rocky fucking sold i mean uh sebester solom he sold his fucking dog right in order to get his script written for rocky one and he was down and fucking out but he was so passionate and had this burning desire in this script of this story that he was able to he sold his dog which he wound up getting back later right got the script done was able to get it to the studios

and it got picked up and he hadn't looked back since what I want people to realize is that you're going to go through the shit you are going to go through the mud but that is part of the trial and error of life life is the same thing as gardening it is no fucking different

You have a seed, you have the dirt, you put the seed inside of the dirt, and you tend to that shit. It's the same thing with your thoughts and your passion of what you are naturally born to do. You have to tend to it. You have to constantly study. You have to constantly put the energy, time, and effort into that thing, into the seed, into your thoughts, into your emotions, and into that thing in order for it to grow. in order for it to grow and to give you the things that you need. When we tend to a seed and it grows into a flower, a tomato tree, a lemon tree or whatever, what do we do? We're able to take that and use it to sustain ourselves in some way.

It's the same thing with building a platform. When you look at you, you've built a platform, you planted a seed. I know you said it was kind of like it just came out of nowhere. But you were working somewhere. Somewhere in your being, you wanted to be bigger than what you were. You wanted to get into something that was outside of a regular nine to five that you liked doing. So what did you start doing? You said, you know what?

I got a phone. TikTok is free. Let me just start telling my story. And in telling your story, you planted a seed. You planted a fucking seed. and by you telling your story, all the people watching your story are tending to that seed that you planted.

And look at what it's grown to now and look at where it's going. Now it's a big oak tree. It's not going anywhere. It's fucking solid in the earth, right? Yeah. So that's the main thing that I say is like, focus on your passion.

I can't say it enough, bro. And that's what I'm doing now. It took me some time. I went through a lot of bumps in my road. A lot. Crazy shit. I ain't even talk. about but that's for another time um but i'm still here i started my own platform in january of this

year i woke up in fucking december and i said fuck that fuck that shit i'm starting my own shit and i'm going to be fucking successful it's going to take off and i'm going to be bigger than i ever was but i can never forget how i got there and it was through those mistakes and those those lessons that I learned. So keep working. Stay on your passion. Stay on your grind. Don't give up.

I don't care if you broke. I don't care if you homeless, it don't matter. Keep fucking going. If you, if you one of them homeless people that sing in the train station, you have a talent, your environment has,

that's another thing, bro. People don't understand that their environments have everything they need. You don't have to have a dollar in your pocket. You just need to meet the right person. I realized I read a book by Malcolm Caldwell called The Outliers. And he did a study of all, like a lot of successful people.

And a lot of times they just got to where they needed to go through relationships. So me, me, and you, who knows where I'll go from here? From being on your platform and then what you have to offer as a person. As long as we keep a solid relationship. This is part of the environment. You welcome me into your environment. it's the same thing vice versa so that's what i did like even with starting my own um platform i didn't actively go out searching for people to help me it just happened because i put my mind to it i said i'm

going to start a platform this is what it's going to be called here's my logo here's my demographic this is how much money i'm going to put into it okay i know i got to get a viographer i got to get a space that shit just came and i have a great team and this shit is about to take off i got a viral interview that's going crazy right now with Freaky Ziki from Dipset. Make sure y'all check that shit out on Champion's Style TV on YouTube. Awesome. Well, Chan, thank you so much for coming today, brother. Thank you.

I appreciate you, I appreciate you, man. Love the energy. Love the storytelling. And, you know, we'll have all your links to your stuff in the description in this episode. Thank you, man. Appreciate that. Appreciate you. Salute, Kay.