Locked In with Ian Bick - Retired Cop Exposes the Most Dangerous Calls in Policing | Kenneth Teets

Episode Date: September 3, 2025

Kenneth Teets is a retired New Jersey police sergeant who turned a childhood stutter—and years of being picked on—into a 20+ year career in law enforcement. Growing up with a cop for a dad, Kenneth set out to follow in his father’s footsteps, spending decades on patrol before earning his stripes as a sergeant. In this candid interview, he breaks down the biggest misconceptions about police, the toughest challenges of policing today, and the most dangerous calls he ever responded to—plus the lessons the job teaches you that civilians never see. #PoliceStories #LawEnforcement #CopLife #FirstResponders #PoliceTraining #PoliceSergeant #NewJersey #OvercomingAdversity Hosted, Executive Produced & Edited By Ian Bick: https://www.instagram.com/ian_bick/?hl=en https://ianbick.com/ Presented by Tyson 2.0 & Wooooo Energy: https://tyson20.com/ https://woooooenergy.com/ Use code LOCKEDIN for 20% OFF Wooooo Energy Buy Merch: http://www.ianbick.com/shop Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction and Overview 00:25 Growing Up in New Jersey 02:58 Family Background and Early Struggles 05:55 Childhood Challenges and Bullying 11:10 Living With a Stutter 19:36 Turning Point: Finding Inspiration 23:32 Seeking Help and the Speech Class 29:36 Overcoming Stuttering: Techniques and Practice 33:00 The Long Road to Becoming a Cop 38:40 Breaking Through Barriers 44:11 Starting the Law Enforcement Career 52:52 The Realities of Police Work 56:36 Balancing Work and Family Life 01:05:05 Reflections on Policing Today 01:09:12 Making Arrests: First and Last 01:11:57 Challenges and Lessons in Community Policing 01:17:59 The Importance of Communication 01:23:00 Biggest Misconceptions About Cops 01:25:26 Biggest Life Lessons From the Job 01:28:03 Final Thoughts and Farewell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Ken Teets grew up in New Jersey, the son of a cop and a kid mocked for a stutter, then turned that struggle into a 20-plus year career, finishing as a sergeant. In this new episode, he breaks down the biggest misconceptions, the toughest challenges, what it's really like to be. be a cop today, the most dangerous calls he's faced, and the lessons the job taught him. Ken, welcome to Lock In. Thanks so much for coming. I'm glad we can make this happen. Thank you for having me, man. This is such an honor. Yeah, and thanks to Clark for connecting us. And thanks for recommending Clark. I know he had already booked a Kabad, but you'd put it at his ear too. Yeah, I'm listening to you all the time. And I'm like, know who would be awesome on that is Clark. So I saw him at a deli and I'm like, hey Clark, do you know who would be the best podcast for you? I'm like, this guy who does lockup,

or I'm sorry, locked in. And his name is Ian Bick. And I'm like, I listen to him all the time. And he's letting me go on and on and on and all of a sudden he goes, Kenny, I'm doing his show in June. I'm like, oh, my God, that's awesome. So, you know, to be here too, it's such an honor. And then when he was here, he said, I got the perfect person for you too. Because he's like, Hey, do you do law enforcement? I said, yeah, we love law enforcement episodes, cops, anyone, you know, any realm of that. And he's like, well, I got the perfect guy that's a big fan. I think we might even have talked on the phone that day or he texted us. I forgot how that happened. But yeah, it was so cool, man. I'm glad we can make this happen. Yes, thank you. And it's interesting, you know, that you are someone from law enforcement that's retired that loves watching prison type stories. I really do. Don't know why, but I'm like hooked on them. You know, just the aspect of, you know, being like locked up and, you know, just a way that they live the normal life, but it's not a normal life to us, but it's a normal life to them. And it's just so fascinating on how they get away with stuff and, you know, just, yeah, it's just cool. Where'd you grow up? Where are you from?

A small town in New Jersey. It's about two hours away from here. It's called Newton. It's the county seat. We have the hospital. We have the courthouse. We used to have a jail, but they no longer have that. So it's like around 8,500 people. So it's the county seat of Sussis County up in northwest New Jersey by, you know, I live the next town away from Clark. And we know. and now away from New York, 45 minutes away from Pennsylvania. What was your upbringing like? Well, it was pretty, I mean, I don't want to talk bad about my parents because it was a different time. This was the 70s and 80s, but I was the third child. And I always had two older brothers. And they were much older than me, so I was the youngest one. It was, I mean, somewhat unsupervised, I would say.

I mean, my parents cared for me, but were they around all the time? Were they supportive? No, they were either working or doing other stuff. What did your parents do for work? My father was a police officer. He was a lieutenant in the town I grew up in and still live in. And my mom was a nurse, so she worked, shift worked. Did your brothers go into policing, too?

No. My older brother, I really have never talked to. He never lived with us. I never got that concept, but he lived with my grandparents. So my middle brother, he was the opposite of going into law enforcement. He died when he was 22. He was a partier. He was a black belt.

He liked to fight. He loved to do his drugs. He actually got arrested when my father was working one day because a drug dealer or somebody owed him money that he bought off him for drugs. And he decided to go into the diner that he worked at 1 o'clock in the afternoon in the main town street and beat him up and throw him through a window. And next thing you know, he's getting arrested. when my dad is at his office, you know, doing paperwork. So I didn't want to follow in his footsteps. So I did the opposite.

Did that cause a lot of rift in the family, your brother's behavior? See, it may have, but my father was like, he wasn't home. He was either working or he was also a volunteer fireman. And at that time, all the firemen stayed at the firehouse because they had a bar there real cheap beer. So he was like, you know, drinking. and either working or at the firehouse, come home late. So he never said anything about it. It was just my brother Bobby being Bobby.

And then when he was 22, he was doing 120 on his motorcycle and crashed into her curb. And he since passed away. So I learned a lot from him. He was a big supporter of mine. I mean, it helped having a brother as a black belt and who has known to fight. So through my childhood, you know, he was there for me. But other than that, my older brother, Billy, I haven't talked to. What was your childhood like?

Did you get picked on? Oh, I got picked on. So at the age of five, I started to stutter. And nobody knew why. so until I saw a doctor when I was 18. So my speech started getting bad. When I was in like fourth or fifth grade, it took me five minutes to get one sentence out.

I had such a bad stutter. And going through school in my childhood, I was picked on, I was bullied. I didn't say a word. It's funny because the students bullied me, but I think the worst bullies were the teachers. They didn't have the, you know, Hib back then or counselors or so different times. And I'm going to keep saying that. It was different times in the 70s and 80s.

But, yeah, the teachers were ruthless to me. And they also made fun of me. And it was just my upbringing was a lot of. not the best. Did you feel unsupported by your dad because he was so busy? Yes. So it's funny because with my childhood, I blame my mom, but I don't blame my dad. And I know that doesn't make sense because my mom was actually somewhat there, but my dad was never there because he was always, you know, so busy, but I blame my mom. So I really don't blame my dad because I looked up to him. And And so it's funny because I wanted to be a cop at the age of five.

And I still remember him walking through the door. And he was 6'4 foot 4 and about 290. And he was built. And he was a well-respected police officer in town. And when he walked through a door, if they were doing something wrong, they stopped because it was a mountain of a man. So the first time I remember seeing him in uniform, that was the first time. I'm like, I want to be a cop because I want to be respected. I want to, you know, be like my father.

So, and with me having the speech problem, a lot of people said I couldn't do it. And going through school, you know, nobody gave me a chance. So it's funny because, like, my fifth grade was probably my turning point of my life. My fifth grade was the worst year of my school. The teacher was worse of a bully than my fellow classmates. And he used to do stuff to me mentally that, you know, he would probably get fired for today. Like, fine example, he used to, as a kid, we used to go around in our textbooks, and each read a paragraph.

So I'm sitting there, and I always sat in the back of the class because I never wanted to get called on. So I used to count the people, and I used to count the paragraphs and hoping it was a short, easy paragraph because I knew it was going to take a while for me to say. So, and he could have easily, you know, prevented that,

but he purposely, you know, tried to, my opinion, you know, to get me upset and stuff like that. And so there was that. And I remember one time, this is when the videos cameras, the V-H-V-S-H tapes, the big ones just came out.

So we had to actually introduce ourselves and we had to do like a short, vegetation on a book. Now, the hardest part about being a stutterer is saying your name. You used to hate when you had like substitute teachers because you had to go around and say in your name. And it was many times I just got up and left because I felt so sick to my stomach because I knew it was coming to my turn. And being a stutterer, I think the worst name that you can have is Ken or Kenny, Keith, because it was the K. And there was no sounding out decay.

So it would be like five minutes for me to say Kenny, you know, or Ken. So that was horrifying and also reading out loud and especially being in front of a video. So when I learned about it, I was sick for a month. I'm like, I'm going to do this. So I was into pro wrestling. And I used to watch pro wrestling all the time. And it's not because they were wrestlers that helped, but they were people that I always imagined to be.

They were big. They were hawky. They were, and they had to get a gap. So here was a kid that couldn't speak. And then you had somebody like Rick Flair or, rowdy, rowdy piper who's in front of a microphone, just not even script and just speak in their mind and, you know, abliving everything. So I always looked up to them.

So I actually bought a pro wrestling book and I was going to talk about. So I'm like, you know what? Maybe I can do this. Maybe I can do this. So I remember like being in front of a camera and like ready, set action. And it was like everybody was looking at me like the dare and a headlight. look. And there was nothing coming out, nothing. And I'm like, and the teacher sat there and laughed. And that was my breaking point. And after that, I just sat in the background and never said a word.

And that was my fifth grade. So, and also with me having a stuttering, a stutter, they never had a speech teacher in my public school because I do believe I was one of the first ones that ever stuttered. So in second grade, they really didn't know what to do with me. And one good thing my mom did was they wanted to classify me as being slow. Now, I wasn't slow. I just couldn't talk. I had a bad stutter. So she actually stuck up for me on that. But what they did was it happened that, In that December, I broke my leg. So they used that as an excuse, which I found out years later, for me to stay back. Because everybody said, I'm going to outgrow my stutter.

He's going to outgrow this. He's going to outgrow this. So they were hoping if they held me back, then they didn't have to classify me. Then hopefully my speech will get better and I'd be approved as a student, which never happened. So moving forward, they tried to, like, had me go to some type of speech class. And I found out the one time was the cafeteria lady. Okay. Now, I knew what was for lunch.

So I was pretty happy when it was pizza day, the square pizzas. All right. So, and here I am with the cafeteria lady, and she stopped into, you know, flip the cookies. So by the fifth grade, I really gave up by myself. So in my school, I went to a middle school with our school is like we have a grammar school. It recently changed, but we had a middle school, then we had a elementary school, a middle school, and then a high school. And the fifth, now the sixth through the eighth, went to the middle school. And when I was in eighth grade, they hired a true speech teacher.

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Unfortunately, by that time, I already gave up. On myself, I gave up on my everything I gave up on. So I'm sitting there having a staring contest with my speech teacher for 43 minutes for two months straight. I think I won, by the way. Okay. I think she got frustrated a couple of times and looked away. So after like the second month, she goes, you can leave my class.

So I basically got kicked out of speech class. because I didn't say a word. I just shrugged my shoulders because, you know, and I got up and there's a flight of stairs. I walked down the flight of stairs. I was going down the hallway, but I still remember what she said. She goes, if you ever want to change,

you can come back and I will help you. And I shrugged my shoulders and I just walked away. Then I went to high school. and in high school was painful because with high school where I went to school, you had the people from my town and then you had the two other towns, Andover in Green Township that went to the Newton High School. So here I had, I already knew what the students that I went to school with since Kid and Norton knew of me.

And they knew that I stuttered in, you know, now I had two more large groups of people that are going to find out that I stuttered and that, you know, I didn't talk. And I'm like, great, I'm going to be bullied even more. So I went to high school and I remained in the background. I didn't speak. I didn't say anything. And I had a routine. and my routine was because my grud, so my crutch that I had was I ate a lot because I think that helped my pain.

So starting in middle school all the way through high school, I would leave school and I would walk down the road to my house from my house to this place called Newton Pizza. and they had pizza and subs. They had the best subs, by the way. So I used to go in there and they knew what I wanted. They knew I wanted the number one sub. This was every day. So I got a big sub, brought it home, ate, went right to sleep.

There's no sense of doing my homework because I knew they weren't going to check it. I knew they didn't care. And I knew that they weren't going to call on me the next day on any other questions. So I just got my hoagie and went home and went to sleep. And I did this up until probably my senior year. And then ironically, across from Newton Pizza was a video store. And I have never been in a video store because in order to rent a video, you have to say your name and you have to, you know,

your address and all that, and I never wanted to do that. But for some reason, something made me go in, and it was a Friday night, and something made me go into it. And I went into there, and I saw the poster of Rocky, which I saw that you have out in the law, and we started talking about it. And just looking at Rocky, something sparked me. So I wrote down my name, my address. I gave the money and I brought home the movie and that night I watched Rocky me and my dog Frito and something sparked in me because I really didn't watch the movie Rocky as a boxing movie for some unknown reason I was Rocky Balboa and if you watch Rocky he had the ability He had to talent, but they never gave him a chance.

They thought he was a bum. They thought he was a two-bit fighter. And Apollo Creed comes around and he needs a fight and he wants a Cinderella story. But yet, you know, he was using it also as a joke too. And he picked Sylvester Salooner. He picked Rocky, Rocky Balboa, to fight. And he wasn't a joke. and he went and he fought he could do it.

He did do it. And what really got me was round 14. Because round 14 is probably the best round in any boxing movie. Because he got knocked down. He got back up. And it was one point where Apollo goes, is looking at it. I'm like, what are you doing? How are you doing this?

And that sparked me. And I'm like, so I finished watching the movie. And the next day I got. up and I had a pair of sweatpants great just like Rocky Bell so I turned him up like he did the only thing I didn't do is I didn't have the raw egg I couldn't stomach that so then I started to run well really walk run walk run and I used to do that every day but I still got my hoagie but I used to run every day and then I noticed that I started to lose weight and I'm like I'm kind of liking this. And then I got a pair of dumbbells and I'm starting lifting weights and I started getting

big arms. I'm like, man, I'm really looking good. But still, no social life, no friends, nothing. So I just looked good for me. But I was okay. So because I started to feel well. So with me being a stutterer, I also have OCD. And I used to do the same route where I ran all the time. So I'm running around and I'm going down the block, and there was an accident. So they had the road shut down, which I ran every single day. So now I'm sweating because I have to go down this road. So it also split. There was a flat way or there was a hill.

And I'm like, I want to take the hill. And it just happened to be right by the school, a middle school, where I got kicked out of my speech. class. So I started running up the hill, and this is where I believe everything happens for a reason. Something made me stop. And I, it's just like the movie Forrest Gump, where he runs and then he just stops. He's like, I'm done now. Well, it was like that. I started running and then I stopped. And in my mind, I said, if I can change the way I look on the outside, why can't I change what I feel on the inside? Why can't I change my stutter? So I go down the parking lot into the walkway

of the middle school. And ironically, the speech teacher is walking out. And I'm like, this is too unreal. So first thing I did, was I apologize to her, and I said, I want to change. So she brought me in, and she gave me a book by his name is Dr. Martin Swartz. It's called Sutter No More. And she goes, read this. The doctor's information is right in the book. So I took the book, and I ran home. There was two issues with this. I have never read a book in my entire life back then. Very few cents, too. And I never used the telephone. The only time I used the telephone is I knew at 3 o'clock my mom was going to call because she was at work. So I moved the couch to the phone. That's when we had the phone on the

wall, the dial with a long cord. I pushed the couch and I actually stood on the arm of the couch, waiting for that phone call to happen. Once the phone call happened, I picked up the phone, I landed on the ground, and that's when I said, hello, and hung up the phone. That's the only words that I said on the telephone until I was 18 years old. So now I have a book that I won't read, and I have a name and a phone number of a doctor that I really want his help, but I refuse to call on the phone. So I wrote him a letter. And I wish I had that letter today. I really do because we hung up in my house. So like three months later, I get a letter in the mail and it's from the National Stuttering Center, which he was a doctor of. And he said, or they said, we have open

classes and one was just happened to be by my spring break of school. So although it costs like $4,000. And at that time, I was a dishwasher because what a perfect job for a stutterer that doesn't talk and who doesn't want to be around people, be a dishwasher in a restaurant. So I worked at a restaurant. It was called Memories. It just happened to be down my road. So in the boss there, short Italian guy, his name is Gary Curtis. He reminds me of Joe Pesci. He's from the Bronx and just Italian guy. So I must have took the letter and I thought I had in my jacket, but I go down to work and in the kitchen we had a like a table and this is how old I am you could smoke in the kitchen in the restaurant at a time so I put my coat in the on top of the chair now I'm not sure if I

had the letter out or the letter fell on the ground or he just saw the letter in my pocket so he must have came in sometime and saw that letter. And he opened it up and he read it. And he must have put it back. So that Friday, I go for my paycheck and it was $4,000 in my paycheck. He wanted to pay for my class. So I go, Gary, you can't do this. He goes, no, I want to. You are a very loyal employee. So I want to do this for you. So I sent the paperwork in and that about a month later, I hopped a Lakeland bus and with a book bag and I went to New York City and I must have been like a homeless guy searching for Third in Lexington because I'm from New Jersey going into New York City with these big buildings and I'm like, where's Third in Lexington? That's where the hotel

was. So I walked down, I found the hotel. I checked in and spent nine days there. I think on the fourth day, though, I think they had to call my parents to tell them where I was, even though I was 18, because I think the conversation is like, everybody was dropped off by parents or loved ones and, you know, they have points of contacts and this guy just walked in with a duffel bag like, you know, Rambo, you know, And so they actually called my parents and told them where I was. So nine days I sat there. And I met the doctor. His name is Dr. Martin Swartz.

He owned three or he had three offices to my understanding. One was in New York, Houston, and Los Angeles. And two of his clients were Captain Kangaroo and Mr. Rogers. So he was a well-known doctor. And when we sat in there, it was me and nine other people that stuttered. Now, I really have never heard another person stutter. So that was the first time I heard another person stutter because I was the only one in my town that stuttered. So, which was very frustrated.

I'm like, come on, get the words out. Come on, let's go. But this doctor was very arrogant, self-centered prick. And he walked in and he basically, told us he was the best. He was going to make us better. He's going to teach us how to talk. And if you don't want to be here, don't be here. He will throw you out. He already got your money because there's other people that want to learn. So he set the bar right off. And during that nine days, that was the first time I ever ordered anything from a restaurant that I want.

wanted. Every time I went to a restaurant, I always got a hamburger. Hopefully, they asked if I wanted cheese with that or if I wanted french fries. Because if that never, they never asked me that, I never got it because I could never say french fries or I could never say cheese. Hamburgers, the ages were the easiest for me to say. So the first time that I ordered steak at a restaurant, I was like a kid in a candy store. I think I ordered two. So I was like so happy. So I was like so But he had us call like restaurants and ask what the special of the day was. So the first time they used the telephone, not in a normal conversation, but the first time I ever used telephone was during my speech class till. I would call restaurants or we would ask for directions.

But I think the most impact was we had to walk around Manhattan during happy hour in the front of the restaurant. with a big button that says, ask me a question. I'm a stutterer. So you have all these drunks come out and ask me these word-asked questions and we had to answer them. So I did the nine days and, you know, he really didn't teach us. He was the airflow technique. And the airflow technique is to prevent the trigger of the vocal cords from locking up before you speak. So he's preventing the stuttering. So what happens is when a normal person speaks, the vocal cords flutter. And you let the air out, you talk.

Mine at the age of five just locked up. And when I try to talk, it's like having a door frame that's stuck. and you pull on a doorknob and you're trying to force the door open and it's going like this. Well, that's the stutter. So what he taught us is

before we talk, you let air out and that opens the vocal cords and that will allow you to have the fluency with speaking. So at first it was very noticeable, especially going to a restaurant and, you know, having a hot waitress

come in and you're like, like like a creep oh I'm sorry um you're allowed to swear on this okay you're good so I'm like um but and that was before

you had like you know any type of cell phone so they gave us like a big like countdown and you said it for like one minute two minute three minute and then it would vibrate and then that would remind you to take a breath. And that's how he did it. And then like every 30 seconds and then every 20 seconds. So when I left there, I had the technique and I had the skills and I had the

knowledge on how to talk again. Now it was just up to me to practice those, which I did every single day. I would wake up and all throughout the day I would practice, practice, practice. And then through the years I got to know or I got the, you know, learning of the, you know, how to have the airflow technique where I didn't stutter as much. Do you think if you never did that class, you never would have became a cop? Never. It gave you the confidence you needed? Confidence. He gave me the confidence. It gave me the ability to speak. and ironically when I got hired, they all said that, you know, the academy, because they sent, at that time, they sent all the police office to the State Police Academy in New Jersey.

So I went to the New Jersey State Police Academy, but it was the Municipal Academy. There was the State Police Academy, and then they had the State Police Memorial Academy. me. So they sent me there and everybody's like, oh, it's so bad, it's so bad. And it was, don't get me wrong, because they knew everything about me. So I went in there and they knew I stuttered and they were giving me the heads up. So what I did was I actually called the doctor and said, listen, can I go back for a refresher? I don't want to go for the full class, but can I go back for a refresher? And I went back for seven days a month before I went to the academy because I was so determined

not to have them break me at the academy because that's their job. Their job is to break you. And I was so determined not to, so I actually went to the class again. How old are you when you joined the academy? I got hired as a cop at 28. Now, I took to test three times. And my issue or my problem of getting hired was I grew up in a small town. My dad was a police officer.

Everybody knew everybody. And they all knew me as Bill's son. The kid just stuttered. So it didn't matter that I went to the speech class. It didn't matter that I worked my ass off for, you know, 24 hours a day learning how to talk again, they didn't see that. It was the reputation. And once you have a reputation formed, it's so hard to get rid of it, especially through negative people. They're always going to have, or you're going to always have that reputation with them, no matter what, if you changed

or not. So I had the reputation of being a reputation of being a stutterer, even though I think I changed. And in fact, I know I changed. But like every time I took the test, it seemed like they didn't even entertain it. And I scored very high on a test. And I look at it this way for a kid that they wanted to classify in second grade being very high where they can hire you on a test of a police deport. it wasn't so bad, but they kept on skipping over me.

And I didn't know why. I'm like, I don't know why. Well, I found out that there were some negative people that, you know, said, you know, he can't do it. He stutters. But they really didn't know me. So the third time that they bypassed me. And I knew I was not getting. any help. Now, most of the time, if you have a father or relative in law enforcement, it's called

a hook, you're going to get on. I mean, New York City, it's brothers and cousins and fathers and sons and major police departments. You have, you know, fathers and sons, but my father, I think, felt the same way that everybody else did. He's not going to be able to do the job because he stutters, not realizing that. I went to this class and I changed. So he wasn't any help. I was by myself trying to get hired as a cop that I always wanted to be. So I took a final test.

It was my third test. And I didn't get hired. And that was my breaking point because they didn't even tell me. It was a Sunday. we had a local paper. My cousin, who I lived with, always got, it was called New Jersey Herald. Always got to New Jersey Herald. And I wake up and I'm looking at the front page and I see a guy being sworn in.

And I'm like, it was mind-blowing with me. And it broke me. So I'm sitting there and I broke down. And I remember I'm leaning against the wall and I slid down the wall. And I was next to my stereo system. And I don't know if you remember those big stereo systems with the big speakers, with the equalizers. And, well, it had a six CD changer in it.

And something, again, everything happens for a reason. Something made me hit play. As it's finding the CD, I'm looking at a knife four feet away from me on the counter. And I'm like, I'm done. I'm done. I hit the lowest as I have ever hit. I'm never going to live my dream. Nobody's going to realize that I worked my ass off to change, not to stutter anymore,

or to control my stutter. And I'm going to kill myself because there was a knife. And it was a big steak knife. and it was four feet away from me and I'm looking at it and I'm like frying and all of a sudden this song comes on. And not sure if you heard of this group. USAA knows dynamic duos can save the day like superheroes and sidekicks or auto and home insurance. With USAA, you can bundle your auto and home and save up to 10%. Tap the banner to learn more and get a quote at USAA.com slash bundle.

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Visit Purina.com slash Beneful to Shop Now. They're from New Jersey. It's called Trickster. Trichters in 80s, 90s band. And there's a song called On and On. And again, this was a six CD changer. And one of my friends just happened to leave that CD in my CD player. And this song comes on. It's called On and On.

And it's something to, since I was a young boy, I always knew I wanted to be. Everybody had doubts, but I knew I believed. And when that song comes on, it hit me. And that song, every word, word for word that they played was what I was feeling. And that song, if it wasn't for that song, I know I want to be talking to you right now. because I would have ended it. I looked away from the knife. I got back up and said, you know what?

I'm going to do something about this. So the next day, I go down to the police station. And I asked to talk to the captain. His name is John Thomas Sula. And my father then recently retired, but worked with John, actually hired him, hired him as a police officer, and was his training officer. He knew my family.

He knew me well. And I'm like, I want to be a police officer. I have no more chances. This is the last list that I'm on because of my age. Can I prove you wrong and allow me to be a dispatcher? Now, a dispatcher is the hardest job that you can do in any type of law enforcement. Because you are the first one that the victims, that the, the, The actors that anybody deals with is on the phone with the dispatcher.

And they tell you where to go. They tell police officers what to do, where to go. So they have to, it's the most important job. And he's looking at me. Like everybody else is Kenny. Now, he knows me as Bill's son. You know, little Kenny that had to stutter. I'm like, Captain, I changed.

I will do it for free just to prove you wrong. And he's looking at me. He's like, you know what? You don't have to prove me wrong. You don't have to do it for free. I'm going to hire you as a part-time dispatcher. Meantime, I was a paid fireman. And you ask any cop, if you want to be a cop or a fireman, everybody wants to be a fireman.

I was the opposite. I had the opportunity to become a paid fireman because my mom worked as a earth at the health clinic knew the fire chief and that was during Desert Storm. So they were hiring temporary firefighters because the reservists were shipping out. So I got the chance to be a fireman because what good job that you have where you can't talk is a fireman. So, but I didn't want to be. I want to be a cop. So I started out as a part-time dispatcher. And I pretty. And I pretty, proved a lot of people wrong, but nobody would to admit to it. So when they were going to hire me, I had a lot of people doubting me, a lot of people

writing letters to the chief, you know, my life's at risk, you know, you can't hire this guy. Now, they didn't know me. They just knew the reputation that I had five, six, seven years ago. So they gave me the opportunity to become a. part-time dispatcher, and I do that well. So now they're hiring a full-time dispatcher. So I go to the captain, I'm like, listen, I will quit my fire department job to become a full-time

dispatcher just to prove you even more that I want to do this job. I want to be a police officer. So I resign from a party department. I've become a full-time police dispatcher a year later. I prove a lot of people wrong. A lot of people still don't admit I proved them wrong, but I know I did. And the captain, John Thomas Sulla, was the only guy at that time that ever gave me a chance. So when I give my speeches now, I'm like, you always have that one coach, you always have that one teacher, that one person that would give you a chance in life.

while mine was at the age of 28, and that was John Thomas Suler. He was the only one that gave me a chance and fought for me, and it seemed to work. Do you think a big part of the reason why you wanted to become a cop, too, aside from looking up to your dad, was because people bullied you and you kind of wanted to flip the rolls? It's not so much that they bullied me. I just wanted to be the bigger guy, because, they everybody doubted me and I'm sure that part might be true you know that you know I'm being bullied so you know I want to be wearing like a badge and a gun to prove people wrong so that was part of it but most of it was because I always wanted to be somebody and I think a police officer was somebody and I wanted to be like my dad that was big and strong so I always wanted to be somebody which growing up I wasn't so yeah was the job what you expected it to be yes um I loved a job um

and I met a lot of great people and I done a lot of great people and I done a lot of lot of good things in my career. But I also met some bad people. And I also had some of my coworkers that were against me that, you know, I didn't like fit their image as a cop. I wasn't well-educated. I was street smart. And this is where I think I got along well with the public. because I didn't learn like my knowledge from books. I learned my knowledge from growing up, hard life. So I think I got along with a lot of the people that I dealt with because I can relate to them. Okay?

I wasn't one that had a four-year master's degree. or college degree, I barely passed high school and I had to earn a job. So I wasn't going to do anything to ruin it because it took me so long to be a police officer. Do you feel like you finally got that stamp of approval from your dad once you got in? Unfortunately, my father passed away before I came to a police officer, but he did have the chance to hear me as a dispatcher. So yes. It's funny because when he got sick

because he actually passed away from leukemia and he really didn't talk about it, but I knew because he always had the scanner on and he knew when I was working and he knew when I was off. So he had a chance to hear me on the radio. So I'm sure that was, you know, I'm sure that made him happy before he passed away. Was there a call as a dispatcher?

you'll never forget. Not as a dispatcher, as a police officer there was, but as it, actually I stand corrected. Probably my first house fire, because here I am getting a 911 call from a woman that's screaming, her house is on fire and her kids are inside. And I'm like with the dare and a headlight look, okay, so then I think about it and I'm like, okay, get your children out of the house. I want to call the fart department. Don't go back in there. Is there any pets?

And, you know, what I'm trained to say. And then I called the fart department out. But calling the fire department out was like kind of like rocky because I was also a volunteer fireman. So I knew that aspect of the job, but here I am the voice on the other side. And I'm sending the whole fart department to this woman that needs help. And it was a little shaky. I'm not going to lie, but I got through it. And then once that happened, it's all like, you know, I started going into it.

And I think I did it really well as a first time. What about as a cop? What was that first time? Calling a judge. when you call so when I got hired now it's all computerized so when I got hired you had to type out an affidavit then you had to call on a recorded line a judge now you just call the prosecutor who calls the judge but at that time you had to call the judge so I'm typing up the affidavit and now I have to call the judge on a recorded line and now I'm

thinking to myself, this attorney that this guy is going to get is going to hear everything I say and he's going to like, you know, pull me apart. So I go in the other room when nobody sees me and I am bouncing off the wall. And I'm like calling the judge. I'm like, hello judge. Now it's two o'clock in the morning and some judges don't like to be woken up at two o'clock in the morning. And I'm calling the judge and I'm bouncing off the wall and I'm getting words out by smacking my head by throwing myself into, you know, the wall. But it worked out. And ironically, I found out that the judge was to prosecute when my dad was a cop.

So afterwards, he's like, Kenny? And I'm like, sir, he goes. Bilsson. I'm like, yeah, you know. So after that, calling him, it was like calling a family friend. So it wasn't as bad as my first time. But I remember the first time as when I called the judge was like, you know, probably the most because you're trying to put somebody in jail. You're trying to take somebody's liberty away from this him or her.

So you have to do everything right, knowing that you're going to go to trial most likely. And they're going to, you know, record everything that you say. So that was pretty much my first time that I remember. Like, my God, this is real. What was your unit? What were you assigned to? I was assigned as a patrol. I did that for 23 years.

But along with that, I was also, it's called the emergency management coordinator, which wasn't part of the police department, but it was in a sense. So I was also the emergency management coordinator. But my daily assignment was road patrol. So I wasn't a detective. I knew that I would never become a detective because that was, you know, the next step up. And I knew that, you know, I was just happy being a patrolman because that's what I wanted to be. And I knew I always wanted to be one.

So I was happy doing that. And then two years before I retired, I actually became a sergeant. And that was a story, too, because when I eventually became number one on the list as a sergeant, my administration actually didn't want me as a sergeant. And I don't know why they still, you know, some people still had their negative thoughts about me. So when my name was brought up, the administration went up to see into town. manager who ultimately does all the hiring and firing and they're like we don't want Kenny as a you know as a sergeant well the town manager goes well that's my decision and i think he earned his

right and you know he did everything he had to do to become a sergeant so i'm making him a sergeant so it took one guy that had full confidence in me to get me hired and then it took another one one Tom Russo, the town manager, to have his confidence in me to become a sergeant. So I actually retired as a sergeant. What were some of the hard aspects of the job over your career? Holidays, weekends, nights, trying to manage that. So we had my wife's nephew. move in when he was four, to have him have a better life and better surroundings and better schooling.

So he moved in when he was four. And just trying to be involved in his life in sports and also working the road shift work. And at that time, you worked weekend nights or afternoons, then eventually towards the last 10 years, they shift our shifts to six to six. So you either work nights or days. So the hard aspect of being a police officer is probably the lifestyle. Because you're not getting enough sleep. You're not getting the proper nutrition. You know, when I first started, the only thing that was open was Dunkin' Donuts.

And this is why the cops have a myth about. you know, always having a donut. Well, we didn't have 7-Elevens back then. All you had to do is just go to Dunkin' Donuts. And the only thing they served at 3 o'clock was they were good. Don't get me wrong. It's fresh donuts and coffee. So that was the hardest aspect is trying to get the lifestyle, you know,

I wanted to be involved in my nephew's life, especially his sporting events, because I never had that opportunity. And the one thing that I regret is I never. went out for a sport. When I was in fifth grade, I tried wrestling, but the coach wasn't very too nice to me, and I was fat and out of shape. Then I tried freshman football, and it's hard to run around when you have a gut just big, and you're out of shape. So I never got into the sporting, the sports, which I always wanted to, but I always wanted to be a part of a team. I knew, and I always wanted to join the Coast Guard because I always wanted to join the military,

but the Coast Guard seemed to be like law enforcement aspect of it. But I knew with my speech, they would never accept me. So that was a long, lost dream. So when my nephew came along in my life, I'm like, I want to follow him in his sports career. So I was always involved in that. and, you know, taking off and switching shifts, sometimes my wife, who was my biggest supporter. I met my wife before I came a cop,

and she has always been on by my side, Michelle. So just, you know, trying to get to sports and having him go to camps and spending time with my wife and then working, that was kind of hard. But I managed. I managed. He did really well and I'm still married if we're going to be married in 25 years next year. So it did okay.

What do you think about policing today in today's world? Policing is hard today. But it's also easier. The reason why I say that is because like with the videos, videos don't lie. So if you're not a corrupt cop or if you're not saying anything or doing anything bad, you're going to be okay because everything's recorded. You go on a call, you're being recorded. So if you treat people with respect, they can't use that against you.

So policing today and with the report writing with word perfect, God, I wish I had that because some of my police reports and my sergeants, I still apologize to them because I'm sure that some of my reports were really bad. But they, you know, with the word perfect and the, you know, report writing skills, if you ask me, I think policing today is easier because of the technology. And report, what makes like a good report compared to, you know, now with technology versus back then? Spelling, grammar, you know, just in sequence, you know, or you just hit a button and they switch the words around. So I say the programs that they have to write. And there are special reports or there is special programs out for police officers to write police reports. Probably use chat GPT too for a report.

So, I mean, you have that keywords that the prosecutor is looking for to. prosecute. So we didn't have that back then. So I want to say policing is probably easier today than it was when I first started. What's it like to make your first arrest, like as a brand new cop to actually like put the handcuffs on, someone, go through that whole thing? What's that like? It was a high, honestly, because with me, I waited that long. And then you go to six months in the academy and you're beaten down and you're built back up and you leave the academy like you're Superman and you go out on patrol and you have a uniform, you have a badge and you're ready to make the arrest. And once you make the arrest, you're like, okay, it was like, you know, a rookie

starting his first football game. You know, you're on the field while your first arrest is like, okay, I did it, you know. And then after that, you learn that There's a lot of paperwork to go along with it. And you're like, eh, maybe, you know, I'll back off on this guy, you know, because of the paperwork. What about your last arrest? What's that feeling like making that last arrest? And is that something like that you always think about because it's your last arrest?

Yes, my last arrest was a foot chase. And we pull up. And all of a sudden, there was a female, and she bucks. and the two much younger officers are like, should we chase her? I'm like, yeah, chase her. Meanwhile, I'm in the car going down the road as she's running, and they get her, and I'm like, don't put the cuffs on her.

I go up, but I put the cuffs on her because I knew that was my last arrest. So I'm like, okay, you know, we're done. But it was a sweet career. I made a lot of friends, you know, when I retired, tired and I walked out was like winning the Super Bowl because I knew what I wanted to be ever since I was a kid and a lot of kids want to be like, you know, football players. They wanted to be baseball players. So no, I knew I wanted to be a cop. And it took me a while to do it and I definitely earned to be a police officer. And I think that's why I was respected a lot by a lot of my town

residents and the people that I arrested, they all respected me because I always treated them with respect because that's one thing that my father did. My father was a big guy, but he always respected. So, but it's funny because at my start of the career, I arrested like sons of people that my father arrested their fathers. Towards the end of the career, I'm arresting their grandsons. So it was like my father arrested their grandfather. I arrested their fathers. Now I'm arresting their sons. And I'm like, okay, maybe it is time to get out now. So they're 18 now. What does that tell you about the criminal justice system when you see that? Lack of supervision. kids are having kids and a lot of it is parent supervision.

There's a lot of programs out there. There's a lot of help. But a lot of people don't want help. Now, the town that I live in, okay, I mean, we have our crime. We're our county seat. We're busy. But it's not like Newark. It's not like Jersey City.

So we see the same people. we deal with the same people, the same families, whereas in the bigger cities, I'm sure they deal with the same families, but they also see a lot more. I think today in our town, they're starting to see a lot more besides the same families. But as I was policing, it seemed like we were dealing with the same people and the same relatives. what helped me is with my nephew going through youth sports and high school sports. I was always around him and I was always helping coaching. While I was coaching kids that a week ago I arrested their fathers. So that taught me a huge lesson.

And I remember my second arrest or third arrest was a drug bust, and I'm going through the woods, and I arrested this guy. And a week later, I'm helping the tee ball coach, and I'm talking to the first baseman, little kid, and I'm looking over, and I'm like, uh-oh. and it's the son of the guy I just arrested for, you know, a drug raid. So he comes over to me and he goes, Tietz, I respect you. He goes, what happens on this field is this field? What happens on the outside of this field? That's all problem. And that has always stuck to me.

And I always try to treat people with so much respect because you never know when you're going to meet them or you never know who their family members are. So half of my nephew's football team in high school, I knew all the kids through their parents. And I mean, I'm in the stands with them and we're having a good time. Then I'm working on a Saturday night and I'm yelling at them. You know, so taught me a lesson. You never know who you're going to deal with. You said this place was steps from the water.

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And a lot of people ended by suicide by cop. So we walk in, it was me and my sergeant, and this guy had a knife out. And he was about three feet away from me, and he was pointing. So now I have my gun out. And that time I'm like, okay, the shit's getting real. And ultimately, through the challenges of my life, I have the gift of gab. And I can talk to anybody.

So ironically, I used to work for the government as a firefighter with the Army. So I kind of used that because he was in the Army. even though I wasn't in the Army, I still worked for the Army. So we had that little rapport. So then we start talking about, you know, the hours, and we start talking about the Army fire trucks. And he was on the Farty Department at one time in Iraq. So we start talking about that.

And next thing you know, he's pouring the knife away from me, away from him, and he chops the knife. The second time was my first unattended death was a, I should say, my first death notification, which is probably the most, domestics are the most dangerous calls because even though the man or woman may call the cops and want help at that particular time, When they know that they're going or their better half are going away in handcuffs, that may be their mail ticket, that then they have regret. So you don't know what they're going to do. So that's the most dangerous call.

If you ask me, it's domestic. The second dangerous call is a notification. So I had a car accident, and it was at 2.30 in the morning. It was on a dark road by us. and it was a young kid that was 21 years old. And his father was a police officer down in the city, but in the 60s he was a police officer for our town, Newton. So when we had to make notification,

the, my chief was making a notification, which was John Thomasola. he needed a uniform guy with him. So he goes, Kenny, come with me. Now, I'm young. I'm new. So we get in a police car.

We go to their house. It was out of town. And ironically, when my brother died, my mother did not go to work because she knew something was going to happen. She didn't know what? because I was walking out for school and I'm like, how come you're not at work? I don't know. Something's going to happen.

15 minutes later, my brother dies on the motorcycle. So when we went to this house, now it's 5 o'clock in the morning, we see the kitchen light on. And there's a woman sitting at the table. So we knocked on the door. and she answers it, and I'm not going to say the name because they're local people. So let's say it's George. The mother goes, it's George Jr. It's George Jr.

And my chief who knows her goes, yes, it's George Jr. He's dead. He's dead. So then the father's name was, let's say, George. So now she's screaming, George, oh no, George, help me, George, help me George. So now you have two people in the house. The husband is upstairs in bed who's a, he was either retired or just about to retire a police officer in the city.

So now the mother's running through. the living room now going upstairs. So now the chief pushing me because I got the uniform to go chase her because she's yelling, help, help, help, Larry help me. So when I turned a corner, the guy, the husband, George was on the stairs, had a gun pointed right at us, thinking that his wife was in trouble. And once he saw us and he saw the chief, he's like, same thing. Let's say George. It goes, it's George. And it was the same thing like my mom, because my mom knew it was Bobby. So that was the second scariest incident that I

had because I didn't know what to expect my first notification. I learned a lot from that. And that was probably the roughest that I had to do with death notifications. Those kind of calls like the knife and the notifications and even domestics. How do you keep your composure and you're cool in that? Because we do see online some cops that don't. And they're obviously the minority of those situations where they end badly. But in a situation like that, how did the good cops handle their composure? Video cameras.

So you only see a few of them. because right now everything's being miced. You didn't have that back in the 80s. So I'm sure incidents happened differently back then where there was no video cameras. But what helped me was everything was being recorded. In my career, I only had like six months without any recording devices on me. So I didn't know any better.

And it was funny because when I started my career six months later, they had the mobile vision in the police car with the body mic. And the old timers were against it. So I didn't know any better. Then when the body camera came out, our age group, whereas most of them were against it. This is all crap, you know. This is going to ruin us.

We can't be police officers anymore. Now these new cops, they don't know any better. They know that everything is being recorded. So, and then not only are you being recorded, everybody's house is being recorded now. Everybody has ring cameras. Everybody has cameras. So answer your question is you have no choice

because you have to keep your composure because you're being recorded. And with me, I worked too hard, too long to ruin what I gained. And I wasn't going to let somebody that was having a bad day ruin my life. And that's what, as a cop, you have to think about. You have your family. So they're having a bad day. And they're trying to torque you up.

Don't get me wrong. They're trying to get you to the point where you're going to cross that line. and it's going to get them out of trouble. So I want to say it's the video cameras are helping tremendously. Please not to cross that line. Yeah. I mean, in some situations, though, I look at that guy that shot the woman with the pot of water. He was, that was on video.

I know. And I can't explain it. Yeah. I watched that video and you sit back and you're like, you don't know what he was thinking. You don't. I mean, hot water

being thrown at you. That doesn't trust a fire. But I guess it also goes to the character of the cop too. Like he never should have been hired too. So it's two things. You have the video and then you have the actual hiring. Like in any job, if you hire the wrong person.

And it's funny because when, and it's not only my town, It's everywhere. When you got hired, you had to live in the town. You had to take the service service test. You had to score within probably the top three. There was 16 to 20 people on that list.

You had to live in town. It took me 10 years to get hired, as I told my story. Now they're advertising to be a state trooper on the parkway. you had never, ever in the last 20 years ever seen advertisements to be a state trooper, especially on the parkway. Now they're going to colleges saying, do you want to be a trooper? Do you want to be a police officer? So the job is much easier to, it's much easier to get hired as a police officer today

because nobody wants to be a police officer. So I'm sure, especially when you're hiring 20, 25 out of clip, because these bigger cities, the retirement rate is so high, they're all leaving. You have to fill the position. I'm sure that the background checks are not as hard as it was when I got hired. So that could be, you know, part of the reason, because it does frustrate me that it took me. that it took me so long, and now you having people right out of college, next thing you know, they're 21, 22 years old, and they have two years on in the police department. Meanwhile, I was 28 years old going through the academy, you know, one of the old guys, you know.

So, yeah, so I'm going to say it's probably, it's getting hired so easily is part of the issues. and my nephew who's in the Coast Guard now, I see a lot of him, lack of people skills. They can't communicate. I'm trying to have a conversation with my nephew, and it's like... Pulling teeth. Do you have to look on your phone to say what to say?

I mean, honestly, it's like these kids today, and I want to call them kids because I'm 54 years old. I know I don't look that old. Thank you. It's like you can't have a conversation with them. And I'm sure the police officers are the same way. When I got out in 23, that was like we had some younger officers, but I knew them. I mean, they were much closer age to my nephew than to me.

So I can have a communication with them. I can have communication, but with today's police officers being so young, if they don't have, like, their phone with them, I don't think they can have a conversation. And I personally see that again with my nephew. It's like, can you sit down and talk to me? You know, and I'm sure that that's going to be an issue where the technology. today because being a police officer is 90% communication. You got to learn how to talk to these people. You got to relate to people.

You're going into houses where you're making a lot of money as a police officer. And that's where I was very fortunate. If you would have asked me if I retired, if I would retire at the amount of money that I did when I was 20 years old, I would have said, you're nuts. I am very fortunate. And these police officers are making a lot of money and they're young kids. And they're going into houses that they're, both of their parents are not making as much money as you are at 23 years old. So they're going to look at you a lot differently.

and you better learn how to communicate. And I think that's what a lot of the law enforcement today is lacking is the communication and how to talk to people because you've got to relate to a lot of people. You got to relate to people that grew up with nothing that don't respect police officers. And now you're going into a house

where this could be a major incident and you've got to talk your way out and you've got to talk them or the people involved down. And I think that's where I lucked out because through my years of suffering, because I did suffer as a I did suffer as a kid and have to earn that job. I learned how to talk to people. And I knew a lot of people and I could relate to a lot of people. and I could relate to a lot of people, okay? Like, I grew up eating SpaghettiOs with crackers, which, did you have that in jail, by the way?

I don't think we had actual spaghetti else. We had ramen noodles. Yes, yes. I saw the fish upstairs. The macro, we had that yet. That's the one thing I wanted to see. I'm like, okay, where's the mackerel? I just wanted to see the mackerel on the shelf, you know.

But, yeah, so I grew up with SpaghettiOs. and rich crackers and smashing the wrist crackers and, you know, shaking them up. So I can relate to a lot of these people and some of these kids that get out of high school and go to a four-year university and they're given everything by their parents. And now they're going into houses that are dirty and that, you know, these people don't have a pot to piss in. You better learn how to relate to some of these people really quickly or else they're going to push you around, especially not having any type of communication skills. So that's the one thing that I think I had and I can hold my head high is I never had a major incident with anyone because it helped growing up in the same town that you live in. and I truly believe you should live in the same town where you are a police officer.

Because it will treat you, it will make you a better police officer, because now you're treating the people that you live among. You're going to the store and you're seeing these people that you dealt with the night before. With me, I grew up in the same town. I went to high school. I went to the same schools. And now I actually live in the same town. that I was a cop, that my father was a cop that I was raised in.

I still live in town. And I think that's very important because you're part of the community. If you live a half hour away, well, honestly, what do you care about the community? You have a job. You're getting paid. You're there for 12 hours and then you leave. Well, if you lived in town, you would care more. unfortunately they don't have that requirements anymore because it's so hard to hire police officers

that now you basically can live anywhere of the state of New Jersey and travel to work and I just think that's wrong what do you think it's the biggest misconception about cops besides the donuts um most misconception that that We're all the same because we're not the same. Okay. There are some people that went to college that was walking through the campus and saw, hey, do you want to be a police officer? They make really good money.

Okay. Sign your name up. And next thing you know, you're a state trooper or you're a town or city cop. Then there's other people that want to be police officers that have always wanted to be police officers that earned their position and that wants to help out the community, that wants to be a part of the community, like walking through the schools and saying hi. And like when my nephew was going through the school systems, okay, I got to know all the students because I walked through the schools because I was part of the community.

Now these people are not part of the community. So we're not all the same. We all just don't wear the badge to be, you know, arresting people. We want to help people. You know, we're not out to give tickets. Do we have to pull cars over? Yes. But there is a law on making a quota.

There's no such thing as a quota. Job performance, yes. So you have to do have to pull a lot. over course because that's your job. Your job is to pull over. It's not your job to write tickets. So not all cops are here to write tickets. Are there some cops that live by it?

Yes. Do they get thrilled by it? Yes. But not all of us do. So not all of the cops are like mean or just there to ruin people's. lights. Are there some cops that have that chip on our shoulders? I'm sure there is. Have I meant some? Yes. Do I agree with them? No. And this is why I'm out. Transport your senses with Sol de Janeiro's limited edition perfume mist collection. At

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They're giving speeches, and I'm like, not all cops are the same. With over 20 years on the job, what do you think is the number one life lesson that you took away from your career and want to share with the audience today? Treat people with respect. because you never know when you're going to see them in the future.

And I have witnessed that so many times. I have been to sports events where, again, I have dealt with people that Thursday night, and next thing you know, I'm in the stands with them on a Friday night at a football game. And we're sitting right next to each other having a good time. Everybody has bad days. Not everybody has a badge who could get away with stuff. And that happens. And not everybody's the same.

Everybody has bad days. Everybody messes up. And it just happened that people get caught. A lot of people don't. So I take it, treat people with respect, because you never know when you're going to see them. And if I didn't do that, I want to be here talking to you because I like to talk, as you can tell, because I never had the opportunity to. But I think I'm well liked.

I got nominated in my high school Hall of Fame back in 2018 because of the work that I have done with, you know, the youth. in my speech and, you know, just being part of the community as a positive person. And so I think that goes a long way if you're a positive person and you treat people with respect. You never know when, like, let's say that when I was a police officer and you just like interviewed Clark. let's say that I pulled over Clark and he was in his, you know, bad days. If I wasn't, you know, the person I am, I might have gave him a ticket. I may have gave him a hard time.

And 10 years later, I wouldn't be here because he's the reason why I'm here. So if I didn't treat him with respect, you never know where the future would have brought me. And not that I have dealt with Clark. I haven't. I met him after he got out where we came really good friends, but I'm just saying as an example. So you treat people with respect to you as you never know when you're going to meet with them in the future. I know I keep repeating myself on that. You're good.

Well, absolutely. And thanks, Ken, for coming on the show today. I really appreciate chatting with you and you're coming out here today. Thank you. And what an honor. This is definitely a thrill being on your podcast and I listen to it all the time. And I'm willing to tell everybody to keep listening. And I want to thank you.

Yeah, always, man. You always got a friend here. Thank you, man.