Locked On ACC - Daily College Football & Basketball Podcast - ACC Claims They Have "No Incentive, Less Than Zero Percent," To Settle With FSU and Clemson

Starting point is 00:00:00 An ACC source told Action Network's Brett McMurphy, quote, there's no incentive for the ACC to settle their cases with Florida State and Clemson. He added less than zero percent. Could that really be true? You are locked on ACC, your daily podcast on the Atlantic Coast Conference. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. Well, the ACC meetings are wrapping up today at Amelia Island. in North Florida. And if I could use one word to describe these past three days, the word I would

Starting point is 00:00:41 choose to use is awkward. I am Alex Dono, host of Lockdown Caines. He's Kenton Gibbs, host of Lockdown Wolfpack. We are Locked on ACC. Thank you so much for making Lockdown ACC your first listen and your first watch today. We're available free, Rev you get your podcast. We're free on YouTube. We're part of the Lockdown Podcast Network. Your team every day. Today's episode is brought to you by Fandul. Make every moment more. Right now, new customers get $150. in bonus bets with any winning $5 bet. That's $150 with any winning $5 bet. Visit fanduel.com slash locked on to get started.

Starting point is 00:01:16 All right. So, you know, Kent, it's so strange. Like we know Florida State is obviously suing the ACC to exit the conference. They have declared in legal documents that they no longer consider themselves a member and they're leaving. Yet the Florida State Athletic Director had this remarked yesterday about how, like, oh, he and the university president have never actually declared that they're leaving, which they have. There's a lot of this weird posturing going on. We'll circle back to that. But so you get this statement. And Brett McMurphy, he's one of the media members of Action Network.

Starting point is 00:01:49 He's covering the ACC meetings in person, providing a lot of good content, comprehensive content. And he was told from the ACC side, there's no incentive for the ACC to settle less than zero percent. Now, first of all, I didn't get straight A's in math, but I don't. make less than zero percent is an actual probability. That's number one. And then number two is, I look at it as posturing Kenton because, like, you can't say that there's zero percent or less than zero incentive to settle. Maybe they don't feel like there is at this very moment. But obviously, if you reach a point where you think you might lose in court, that would give you incentive to settle. Like, I can't say on either side there's less than zero. I feel like Benoit Block right now

Starting point is 00:02:35 For those of you who are not familiar with the series Knives Out, with the movie series Knives Out, and the last movie Glass Onion, there was a principle where the antagonist was doing things that was objectively stupid. And Benoit Blanc said, oh, my God, it's so stupid. And one of the other characters said, it's so simple, it's brilliant.

Starting point is 00:02:56 And he said, no, it's just dumb. Let's start here with the less than 0% thing. Dono, it's crazy. because imagine if somebody on a certain show, maybe for a network that told people be locked in with locked on perhaps, we're to tell people, a settlement really doesn't seem likely here because, again, both sides are fighting for a level of survival that we are not. It's kind of unprecedented a little bit because the conference as a whole goes up in smoke folds if they let you out for too cheap. and these teams can no longer compete on the highest level in their estimate if they don't go and get more money. This is not a battle of, well, you know, it all shucks.

Starting point is 00:03:46 If we could just keep you around a little bit longer, all shucks, if we could just leave the conference a little bit earlier, this is a major battle for survival, number one. And number two, as I've said before, I look at this thing and I say to myself, it doesn't make sense for a settlement to be reached right now, but even as you look towards the future, it makes less and less sense to think about a settlement because by the time that one of these sides sees a settlement as the right option, it's going to be too late.

Starting point is 00:04:16 The other side is already going to be like a bitter ex-partner and say, hey, uh-uh, you got to see this too, brother. You got to, you antagonize me and say, come outside long enough. Now I'm outside, whooping on your head. ain't no stop now. Ain't no take a break now. No, you're going to get this woman until I'm done,

Starting point is 00:04:36 until I'm finished putting belts behind from a legal sense. So I see where the no incentive to sell it is. And I'm glad that other people with bigger platforms who folks consider to be smarter than us are now repeating the same things that we've been saying for months. I just think, though, it's probably a lot of posturing. And by the way, later on this episode, we are going to talk about the level of participation.

Starting point is 00:05:00 at the spring meetings with Florida State and Clemson, despite the fact that they're suing the conference. So it's like kind of weird. You're discussing all the future agendas and the businesses of the conference that those two schools do not want to be in going forward. I do want to talk about what has been a proposed, I don't know if you could say solution, but a proposed outcome to the ACC's role in conference realignment

Starting point is 00:05:24 that actually would involve a huge change, but not one that would involve Florida. State and Clemson actually leaving. And I know a lot of FSU and Clemson fans will hate this idea, but I do want to talk about it. But yeah, so the other thing that's why I can't really take anything that Jim Phillips is saying or Michael Alford, the athletic director at Florida State, I can't really take what they're saying at the spring meeting seriously because I am firmly of the mind that actions speak louder than words.

Starting point is 00:05:57 Right. And I mentioned comments that were made by Alford, the Florida State Athletic Director. He was asked how long an exit from the ACC might take. Like, he was asked this question by a reporter covering the ACC spring meetings. And his response was, this is from, by the way, Brett McMurphy's report on Action Network. His response was, if you go back to the president, myself, we've never come out and said, hey, we want to leave the conference, Alford said. we have not notified the lead we are leaving. And then McMurphy writes, well, actually they have in FSU's

Starting point is 00:06:30 December lawsuit versus the ACC buried on page 32 of the 38 page complaint. Item number 151 says, Florida State be deemed to have issued its formal notice of withdrawal from the ACC under section 1.4.5 of the ACC Constitution effective August 14th, 2023. So actually they have declared that they want to leave. And then there's, you know, when I hear some of the things that Jim Phillips, the ACC commissioner is saying at these spring meetings, like it reminds me of, oh, was it Sheriff Bar Brady in South Park? Okay, people, nothing to see here.

Starting point is 00:07:07 Or Kevin Bacon in Animal House. Like everyone remain calm when he is talking about this look-in provision with ESPN, where they're kind of reviewing that TV contract before February 2025 when ESPN could technically decide to leave the deal or redo the deal. And Jim Phillips is like, oh, yeah, you know, this is just standard thing. We're all looking inside. Everything's great. It's like I have a hard time believing that on face value either.

Starting point is 00:07:34 So, you know, there definitely is some concern. Now, I'm with you, Kenton, that my gloom and doom level on the future of the ACC, I'm not at the level of, hey, this whole thing is going to collapse by June 30th. I think it's going to take a little bit longer than that. But this conference right now is absolutely in an existential crisis. And I cannot believe the ACC Commissioner when he says otherwise, nor can I believe the Florida State Athletic Director when he claims they've never actually notified the ACC they want to leave. A lot of people are lying.

Starting point is 00:08:05 A lot of people are just saying stuff. And I judge these situations by actions, not by words. You know, Donald, I went to NC State for communications. did, I worked for every student publication that we had, okay? And in learning a lot of the things that I did, one of the biggest things I learned is that people lie a lot, a lot. Like, that's not, you know, and coming from Detroit, you got a certain level of honesty because there's a level of, hey, if you try to play with me like I'm crazy, you, there's something that's going to happen to you in a physical realm. Now, I want to, I want to say,

Starting point is 00:08:46 this. In learning what I've learned in NC State, I learned that you have to say alleged and all that good stuff, except when something's proven and on tape. Both of these people are doing a Twitter word or a therapy word that's used way too often. Both parties are gaslighting us into trying to make us believe something. For those of you who don't know what gaslight is, that is when somebody intentionally tries to make you believe in a reality that does not exist or tries to get you to doubt your existence in things as they exist in the current reality we live it. How the hell can you sue somebody to leave and say, oh, I never said I was leaving. If my wife serves me with divorce papers, I'm not going to sit up here and listen to her.

Starting point is 00:09:33 She's like, I never said this marriage was beyond repair. I just sent you papers that said I never want to see you again. That was my lawyer. I had nothing to do with that. Let my lawyer be tripping. You know, I said I was a little unhappy. Next thing you know, she's sending a paperwork. By the way, that exact scenario actually happened to Miami Dolphins receiver Tyree

Starting point is 00:09:54 Hill who, like, served his wife with papers and then was like, oh, there's nothing. I'm not getting divorced. And again, and again, we have to say allege when we don't know what happened. But Jim Phillips, everything is fine, nothing to see here. This is standard procedure. To whom? To whom? How many people have been in a situation where there's a contract restructuring up and they are at risk of losing their two top dogs? This is not by any stretch of the imagination. Oh, hunky doy, nothing to see here. Everything's fine. We're fine. You're fine. I'm fine. We're all fine. Again, folks, a lot of people misuse this word, but this is what gaslighting means. We are being deceived to believe a reality that is not here.

Starting point is 00:10:41 where folks are playing with us like we're stupid when again we sat here and watched the board of trustees meeting i don't know how much of it don't know how much of it don't watch i watch way too much of that florida state board of trustees meeting before the lawsuit way too much okay i'm gonna be honest but i was very enthralled by this i was like where is the two-tiles speed but oh no it's live i have to watch this in real time so you know this is this is foolishness these folks again people will piss on your leg and tell you is raining if you let them. But we're not going to let him get away with this, okay? The same way we're not going to let Arbery get away with that, I'd never look at a teenage girl twice line. When we saw them do it more than twice in public, we got to stop letting these people

Starting point is 00:11:22 lie to us like this. Call out Florida State, call out Phillips, call out everybody that's lying and trying to play with us like we cannot see like we don't have two good eyes, two good ears, and even if you don't have both, get somebody to translate it for you. Read some braille on what's happening. I promise you, you'll find out exactly what's going. well i i want to discuss uh when we come back an idea and i i'm not clever enough to have actually come up with this but we actually if you rewind to about a year ago seems seven schools within the acc were exploring a situation where maybe it would still be an acc but a much different acc with you know a higher amount of revenue being shared uh is could there be uh could there possibly

Starting point is 00:12:10 be a situation where Florida State and Clemson get at least some of what they want without joining the power to. And again, I know a lot of Florida State and Clemson fans are not going to want to hear this. And we'll talk about the likelihood of something like this happening when we come back. You want to keep it locked right here. Alex Dono from locked on Keynes. Kenton Gibbs from Locked on Wolfpack. We are locked on ACC. And I already know you're keeping it locked to Fanduel. Guys, these playoffs have me captivated, and I'm wagering on things left and right on America's number one sports book because it's winner take all time in the NBA and NHL and Fandul.

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Starting point is 00:13:10 Thank you so much for making this episode of Locked on ACC, your first listen and your first watch today. Are you watching Fox Sports or ESPN on your TV all day? Have to turn down the volume

Starting point is 00:13:19 with all that shouting? Make the switch to Locked on Sports Today. A free 24-7 sports streaming channel program for you every day to bring you the biggest stories without all the screaming.

Starting point is 00:13:29 Locked on Sports Today brings you can't miss analysis, opinions, and news. Streaming 24-7 on YouTube or the free Amazon Fire TV channels app, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. Alex Dono alongside Kent and Gibbs, locked on ACC, by the way, it's available. Wherever you get your podcasts free, and it's available free on YouTube.

Starting point is 00:13:48 So here's an interesting scenario that's been brought up, Ross Dellinger of Yahoo Sports, who's also covering the ACCC spring meetings in Amelia Island in Florida. you know, he's bringing up, you know, the likely exits of Florida State and Clemson, who we've covered ad nauseum or suing the ACC, they're trying to break the grant of rights and get out. And Deliger writes, but where exactly will they go and whom North Carolina maybe will follow them out the door? He says these are questions without easy answers. He points out it is unlikely that any SEC or Big Ten school will agree to accept a reduction in their TV distribution to add. any school. For the SEC, that is especially so given its footprint. The league already owns a

Starting point is 00:14:36 foothold in South Carolina and in Florida. Also, the SEC programs in those states would likely make a fuss if they haven't already after inviting into the league their arch rivals like Texas A&M's reaction to the SEC inviting Texas. But all out a footnote, it's worth pointing out that even though Texas A&M fought for Texas not to come, it still happens. So you can fight sometimes, you know, you don't really have control over that. He writes, in order for the Big Ten and SEC to expand, they likely need more money from their television partners a lot more than a hundred million a year. That's primarily Fox for the Big Ten and ESPN for the SEC. He says there's one problem with this. There is, quote, there isn't as much money in the market as there once was,

Starting point is 00:15:18 said a conference official. And what of the Big 12? I guess we'll skip over that because no one wants to hear about the Big 12 right now. But he goes on to say that, hey, administrators from seven schools, that was the magnificent seven from last year. FSU, Clemson, UNC, Miami, NC State, Virginia, and Virginia Tech met multiple times last spring over the matter in what was described as a serious endeavor. It fizzled over legal fears, mostly from university presidents and councils. So the maneuver idea there would be Kenton. And again, this fizzled last year, I don't know if there'd be any interest in revisiting this.

Starting point is 00:15:59 think the move there would be basically these ACC teams trying to find a majority to disband the conference and then they form their own league maybe trimming some of the fat from, you know, the schools that are currently in the ACC that don't bring in that type of revenue. I mentioned that Magnificent Seven. Maybe they would add somebody like Duke to that equation to bring in an eighth team. Obviously, Duke has a lot of brand value. And, you know, you cut a new TV deal where it might be similar than the current ACC money, but you're splitting it up amongst eight schools instead of 17 schools. I wonder if that could be a viable option because as Dellinger mentioned,

Starting point is 00:16:40 you know, I know a lot of folks have already said, hey, guys don't even worry about this. Like the Big Ten, they definitely want Florida State and Clemson. Delinger did point out that any further expansion on those conferences would require every school within those conferences to take a smaller piece of the pie. Well, let's call Rosie O'Donnell and Tom Hanks because it looked like they're forming the league of their own. No, but in all seriousness, this is not,

Starting point is 00:17:04 this is not to be taking all that serious because, again, you have to find eight schools that are willing to do this. And let's, let's be very serious about what's happening right now, right? And I think actually with adding SMU Cal and Stanford, you would have to find now more than eight schools because once they officially enter and you need a majority, you would need nine out of 17, eight out of 17 would no longer be enough.

Starting point is 00:17:32 Okay. So you need nine schools to go along with this, right? Those nine schools, or let's say you get nine or ten on board, the nine or ten on board would have to include Florida State and Clemson, correct? Yeah, fair. Now, let's be smart about this, boys and girls. the same sauce that's good for the geese is good for the gander, correct? That's what I've always learned.

Starting point is 00:18:00 Now, the same thing that's keeping Florida State and Clemson in court is the grant of rights. It means, hey, this is not a leave whenever you want type of deal. This ain't at-will employment. This is a big deal. This is, we're talking millions being wrapped up in a contract. It works both ways. you can't just the same way that

Starting point is 00:18:24 these teams can't leave the conference the conference can't leave these teams and more importantly if you're looking at these teams and saying well you're going to find nine and all of them want to move around those other seven wouldn't be a little afraid

Starting point is 00:18:41 a little fearful of hey when we dissolve you all have to stay in this room y'all can't dissolve and then go out and run to that mansion over there, you got to stay in this house. Why would they stay in the house? Why would they, when they see this proverbial mansion right across the street that they can go to? It wouldn't. These teams who are saying, oh, yeah, we're going to make a league of our own just without,

Starting point is 00:19:09 listen, I get it. You know, if you can't make the pie bigger, you want to cut down on the miles that are eating from the pie. I understand, I understand. But just be very wary that kicking certain people or giving certain people the opportunity to leave the table means you're also giving certain people the opportunity to run with the pie. And you don't get that size pie again. So, you know, this is, it's, it's really good in theory. But this is one of those things that when you put it up to the stress test of reality, it doesn't quite, it's not quite up to snuff. It really isn't. Yeah, especially when like the more that I think about this. Like if if Florida State and Clemson and you know,

Starting point is 00:19:56 UNC, maybe Miami were to become free agents like especially Florida State and Clemson given given the revenue, like you can't tell me the power to would really say, no thanks. Like we don't want any of those teams. Like, and again, like I know Delinger brings up the whole piece of the pie thing and the TV money, but at the same time, like I could see and I don't know if this happens five years, 10 years, 15 years sooner than that. At some point, I think you're basically going to see some version of the power to kick the NCAA to the curb, regulate themselves, cut their own TV deals, do their own playoff. And that's going to involve those leagues eventually expanding to basically

Starting point is 00:20:37 become, instead of two, like two, you know, divisions, it's going to be more like NFL conferences, like two, two mega powers on each side that are going to do their own thing. And so I think eventually a lot of these power brands that are currently in the ACC are going to find a home over there. It's just going to depend on how long because I don't think this sort of expansion and that sort of revolution is going to happen overnight. I think it is going to take some time. But I think that's the direction we're moving in where the power too basically becomes the NCAA for football. And, you know, they do their super league thing that we've talked about where, you know, they are going to have collective bargaining. At some point, I think we're going to get to that.

Starting point is 00:21:15 Yeah, no, I thought I would just agree. My biggest thing about it, is this. I think that I think we're headed towards the singularity where again, college football separates from the NCAA altogether. And the only difference in what I see happening or what you see happening is I believe that at some point in time, the money will get so tight and they'll want such big deals that it's going to make more sense for football to dis-a. We need to go to the table together. You know, I hate to reference play other apes, but even go back to the go back to the ones from, what was it, about 10 years ago or so, apes together strong.

Starting point is 00:21:54 Like that's what the principle is going to be here. Everybody's going to look around and say, hey, y'all are fighting for scraps in your deal, you're fighting for scraps. Let's tell these people, if you want college football, you've got to take all of college football, and you've got to pay a pretty penny for it. And that'll, you know, that'll be a much easier negotiation. And, hey, our conference wants to negotiate. Our conference was to negotiate.

Starting point is 00:22:17 our group of five conference was to negotiate. Help us out. So what that we just took in, you know, whatever school from Millen Nowhere's bill that has like 10,000 kids there, we've won enough to now be a group of five teams. So I think it'll be a much easier thing where, again, they're moving towards a singularity and all that. And that's going to be the restructuring that we see,

Starting point is 00:22:39 more so than the ACC imploding and trying to negotiate on its own based on the magnificent seven. because again, the most magnificent two of the Magnificent Seven will be gone. They'll be gone in the win. If you give them the opportunity, they'll sit there and say, oh, yeah, of course. By handshake and we love you guys, we'll be here forever. But do you remember when it was that, what was the alliance, they called it, where it was the Big Ten, the Pac-12?

Starting point is 00:23:09 In the Pac-12. Who was the, it was just the Big Ten and the Pac-C? Right. Okay, the ACC was in it, too. I thought so. So how long did that last? Where are the best pack 12 teams at now? Yeah, for all the Big Ten.

Starting point is 00:23:24 That was some alliance. All of that hands shaking and oh, yeah, we're going to be good to you. We'll take care of you. Put it on ink. If you don't put it in writing that this is specifically the deal, it's not going to matter. And so, objectively speaking, if you give Florida State and Clems the opportunity to leave, unless they have it on ink, like, hey, we are agreeing to become the magnificent nine or divine nine or whatever you want to call actually no divine nine is already taken yoke to the good news but that's neither here nor there if you are deciding hey we want to be the nine that are going to break this thing apart unless you can get florida state clemson to write on a dotted line hey we're sticking around with these seven schools which by the way i don't know if y'all know this but clemson and florida state are not showing a great track record of honoring deals they signed you're not going to you're not going to you're not going to you're not

Starting point is 00:24:14 going to keep them in that in that grouping so you know that that restructuring with around less team same pie it's it's extremely so uh the acc spring meetings are wrapping up today uh i guess they wrapped up yesterday how involved were clemson and florida state in everything that transpired my friends you want to keep it locked right here on this brand new episode of locked on acc thank you for making locked on acc your first listen and your first watch day. If you're watching us on YouTube, make sure you smash that thumbs up button, hit that like button and subscribe. Make sure you subscribe to the audio version, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast, we're right there for you. So, you know, earlier this week, Kent, and people,

Starting point is 00:25:01 and I had been wondering this myself, you know, when you have some of these different seminars and side meetings that are happening at the ACC spring meetings, like, you know, are Florida state and, like, are they allowed into all those, you know, all those seminars when, you know, they've basically already declared that they're out of the conference. Well, you also have to think about the other side of it. If the ACC were to exclude them from anything, Florida State and Clemson lawyers could use that against them. And that would be, you know, a powerful, a powerful area to build on when it comes to these lawsuits. So, yeah, sources from Florida State and Clemson said earlier this week, Kenton, they were involved in all the discussions. I'm sure

Starting point is 00:25:44 everything was very awkward. You also have Bubba Cunningham. the North Carolina athletic director walking around after being, you know, called out by his own board of trustees earlier this week. And there are questions about North Carolina, wanted to get out of the ACC. But it's all just big, one big dysfunctional happy family. And Florida State and Clemson, Kenton were fully involved in all the meetings. And there were meetings that don't, you know, don't pertain to, you know, all these issues in the lawsuits. Like I think another, another big area that the ACC has to be concerned about is once this House versus NCAA, settlement,

Starting point is 00:26:17 settlement goes through, and they're going to be required to share revenue with their student athletes. Again, when your revenue gap below the power two, which was described by Michael Alford, the athletic director at Florida State, is around 40 million. Like ACC schools are getting 40 million less annually than SEC

Starting point is 00:26:38 and Big Ten schools are. You still have to come up with close to 30 million just to revenue share with your athletes starting in a couple of years. So that's another issue the ACC has to figure out. You know, I don't like country music very much. It's my least favorite genre of music. But to quote Johnny Cash here, who I do love, absolutely. I fell into a burning ring of fire.

Starting point is 00:27:01 I went down, down, down, and the flames got higher. That is what is currently going on with the ACC here in many regards. FSU and Clemsons' participation is something that's unavoidable. You can't cut them out because, like you said, legally, their lawyers will be looking at you. Oh, thank you for the gift. They're going to start playing the Golden Girls theme song. Thank you for being a friend.

Starting point is 00:27:23 We've traveled down this road and back again. Let's go back to the Leon County Courthouse. Let's go back to the Mecklenburg County Courthouse. Whichever County they're in South Carolina, let's go back to Aval 2 because, boy, we need some money up out of you. The reality of this thing is they have to include Florida State in the realm of they are. And, you know, you're right.

Starting point is 00:27:44 Right. It is a big dysfunctional family. It's no different than most other families when you think about it from that aspect. But this is something unique because there are tens of millions of dollars on the line. And really hundreds of millions of dollars on the line. Let's not say tens. Let's be honest about there. There are hundreds of millions of dollars in line. And that, you know, when the money gets funny, things get real strange. Okay. And that's that's what's happening here for a lot of folks. Obviously for Florida State and Clemson, just in that revenue. sharing model alone. And I think the most interesting thing here is how do you keep up with the 40 million less? But who's backstopping that additional revenue that's supposed to be coming in? Because I know that the settlement is the NCAA is going to pay it at first. But what happens when the NCAA is like no longer in the picture, when we move towards that singularity where it's like you said, the big two are like, hey, we can regulate ourselves and all that. And we already know, based on what we've already seen from the ACC capitulating and bending the knee, which some teams in ACC can learn how to do, we would be seeing here like, hey, at the end of the day, the ACC is going to do whatever they can to get along with whatever the power, the big two of the power for want. So you're absolutely left in a situation where you're kind of asking yourself, where is that money coming from to add in that 17.

Starting point is 00:29:14 to 22 million for the revenue sharing. What's going on with that? Well, we'll continue this discussion on Friday's episode. We'll take another look back at the ACC spring meetings and where we go next. And there are definitely some more details from North Carolina has become a soap opera with all these trustees and the interim chancellor is talking and Bubba Cunningham. The athletic director is going around. You know, he's under a lot of scrutiny. So we'll get more into that on Friday.

Starting point is 00:29:43 He's Kenton Gibbs from Lockdown Wolfpack. Follow him on X at TGIF underscore Kenton. I'm Alex Dono from Lockdown Caines. Follow me at Alex Dono. And we'll talk to you guys again next time on another episode of Lockdown ACC, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network. Your team every day.

Locked On ACC - Daily College Football & Basketball Podcast - ACC Claims They Have "No Incentive, Less Than Zero Percent," To Settle With FSU and Clemson

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