Locked On ACC - Daily College Football & Basketball Podcast - How Florida State Seminoles Can Navigate ACC Settlement Proposal

Starting point is 00:00:00 Is the ACC really about to keep the band together until 2030? Let's talk about the details. You are Locked-on ACC, your daily podcast on the Atlantic Coast Conference. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. Shout out to the Everydayers, and thank you so much for making Locked-on ACC your first listen and your first watch today. We're available free wherever you get your podcast. We're free on YouTube. We're part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:35 Today's episode is brought to you by Fanduel. Place your first $5 bet and you'll get started with $200 in bonus bets guaranteed. Visit fanduel.com to get started. We figure with all the conference realignment news out there, the Pact 12 is kind of getting back together and its ACC settlement was first reported last week. Kenton Gibbs and I wanted to break down the details. Kenton and I will also be talking later on about the ACC players of the week from week four, including the guy that they might as well name the rookie of the week trophy after once this season is over.

Starting point is 00:01:10 But before we get to all that, we have the privilege of being joined here for the second time. He did so great last time we had to bring him back. Doug Rohan, aka Rohan Law, who's been following all of the ACC court dramas very, very closely. And unlike Kenton and I, he is actually a lawyer. So we appreciate when Doug can hop in with us. So first of all, Mr. Rohan, we hear all this chatter about, possible a shortening of the grant of rights to 2030, but yet another revenue model possibly being introduced that could distribute more

Starting point is 00:01:43 revenue to big brands like Florida State and Clemson. Give us the details on this, Doug. And also, are any of the details maybe being misreported? Because the game of telephone can be ugly. Well, Alex and Ken, thank you so much for having me back. We did have a great time last time. And I've appreciated the opportunity to share with your listeners and viewers, some of the details of the litigation. So yes, as you pointed out, Ross Dellinger reported

Starting point is 00:02:08 last week that there was a preliminary offer on the table. There's some discussion as to whether or not it was proposed by Florida State and Clemson or this was the ACC bringing it back up. We don't really know, and it doesn't really matter. That's really been the only bone of contention is people are trying to read behind this. Who is displaying weakness? Who is representing a stronger position. It doesn't matter. At the end of the day, a settlement has to be agreed upon by both parties. So let's chill with the trying to figure out who's proposing what and trying to figure out what this means. What it means is that one possible solution, which we did bring up on another podcast about two months ago, is that Florida State and Clemson State. This has always and only

Starting point is 00:02:53 been about money. Now, this was a proposal that was brought up at the ACC Media Days two years ago. 2022, Florida State before going scorched earth said, look, we're not completely unhappy with the ACC. We didn't have the snub at that time. We're just worried about this money gap. And so if you can figure out a way to close the money gap, then we can figure out a way to stay happy and healthy here in the ACC. So the proposal, allegedly, was for Clemson and Florida State to get more money out of the other conference members. Now, the problem there is that means all the other conference members have to agree to cut their part of the pie into a smaller piece. Now, it was a non-starter and agreed that is something that was probably unlikely to ever be the solution to this case.

Starting point is 00:03:45 So now we fast forward two years, 13 months into this litigation. ESPN is being dragged into this. ESPN has a deadline in February 2025 to decide what they want to do with ACC. conference ESPN is seeing the turmoil of the conference realignment process. And so now we have a new factor that's being added. And that is the possibility of not cutting from the other ACC members, but ESPN doing what apparently is something that we didn't expect them to do, which is be willing to pony up a little bit more money. Now, there are a lot of questions.

Starting point is 00:04:19 First off, this is a report from anonymous sources. Is it accurate or not? Who knows? We have no idea. Second, if this is the framework of a proposal, that framework as reported as ESPN puts in more money, that more money goes to those who have better viewership as opposed to performance enhancements or rewards for the performance in the playoffs. And then that also is paired with a reduction of the grant of rights from 2036 to 2030.

Starting point is 00:04:50 So that is the framework of the agreement. Without knowing how much money is going to be put into this pot, it really is incredibly speculative to talk about whether or not this is good or bad. What I will say is that what EFSU is looking at is $20 million next year versus Vanderbilt getting $50 million next year. So we have a $30 million gap already. And that amount is only going to expand as we go further down the line of the grant of rights. So just getting it reduced to 2030 is a big deal. FSU fans wanted to be out of the ACC now. FSU fans are ready to be done, but to wrap this up and land this plane, we can't get out of the ACC before 2025. Even if we announced today, we're after the August deadline,

Starting point is 00:05:41 we play 2024, we play 2025. Chances are if litigation continues, we go into 2026. So if you're telling me for some amount of money, we don't know how much, but we just have to, to stay happy from 2026 through 2027, 2028, 2029, 2030. We're only talking about four additional years and then we know we're out, or at least we know we can get out. That overall is the basic framework for something that is agreeable to both sides. We'll see what the details actually are. You know, the details of that are important. And like you said, it is majorly speculative at the moment. So let's talk about what we do now. Let's talk about what has happened, what is on ink and all that. One of the things that is most perplexing to fans and myself and, you know,

Starting point is 00:06:30 many folks here, Florida State did in fact sign and agree to the grant of rights twice before the litigation comes up. So what role do those signatures play in all this or what has made them null and void now to where there is a substantive case that, you know, judges are willing to hear? That's a very fair question, Ken. And that's something that came up at the, onset of this litigation. That's one of the few valid criticisms that come to this argument in this litigation. The problem with it is, first off, the leadership has changed. We had very weak leadership prior to Michael Alford, to President McCullough, to Mike Norvell, and to Stephen Ponder. Those are the four people now in charge of the upper echelon of Florida State. They are all very keen on saying

Starting point is 00:07:20 Florida State return to dominance. despite Mike Norville's coaching choices in the last few weeks. So with that being said, they got to win. W baby. So with that being said, they know the current status can't be sustained. And if FSU doesn't fight or if FSU fights and loses, there's no difference. There's no change. So there is contract dispute law.

Starting point is 00:07:50 There is an entire industry dedicated to, yes, I signed a piece of paper, but no, I don't think the other party is held up there under the bargain. So a contract is a two-way street. Florida State has an obligation. The ACC has an obligation. And what Florida State is trying to outline now under the new leadership, and that's why this is coming seven years later, is the ACC has not met its obligations under the contract as well. We're getting a tremendous explanation here. Doug Rohan of Rohan law. Let's talk a little bit more about what this would do from a Florida state perspective and a Clemson perspective when we come back. You guys want to keep it locked right here. We're nowhere near done yet.

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Starting point is 00:09:51 your first listen and your first watch today. We're available free wherever you're getting your podcast. We're free on YouTube. We're part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. We're talking about this reported proposed settlement that could keep Florida State and Clemson in the ACC until 2030. Another part of this, Doug, and again, I know, like you mentioned, Florida State fans, Clemson fans, like they all definitely wanted to get out sooner than 2030.

Starting point is 00:10:15 There's no question about that. But, you know, it looks like getting out sooner than 2030 would or would have. you know, costed hundreds of millions of dollars in exit fees, right? I think it would be a matter of how high, but probably not anything less than about 140 million. So, I mean, wouldn't this solution where,

Starting point is 00:10:32 yeah, you would have to wait an extra four or so years to make that extra revenue of a possible landing spot in the power two, but then you also wouldn't have to pay an exit fee in 2030 to get out. So you're, you know, the math may work out in your favor in the long run. That's all negotiable.

Starting point is 00:10:49 And again, also subject to details. A couple of the things that I would be interested, and if I was in the room sitting there talking, okay, the big 12 departures actually took place two years before the end of that grant of rights. We can't leave early because we've got a risk of having to pay through 2036, but if you reduce it to 2030, are we allowed to begin our negotiations in 2028, 29? At the very least, we can start those negotiations without the risk of tortures interference because we know it ends in 2030. So in either of those two scenarios, this is what the benefit adds.

Starting point is 00:11:27 Now, you mentioned a huge point to this. We've been stockpiling $200 million cash to try to get out of this conference. You're now telling me that if we just put in sweat equity of two more years, we get to keep that cash in our pocket. in this era of NIL and potentially House suit litigation, and that's going to be a huge advantage to the program. So yes, I think that this is something that is something that should be considered seriously. Again, the big question marks I have is, is ESPN really putting an extra money? Is that extra money really going to come to a difference of $10 to $20 million? Because that's,

Starting point is 00:12:05 that really needs to be the threshold of the difference. And where does that leave us with 2020? 28, 2029, 2030 exits. Are we negotiating no exit fee? Are we negotiating a reduction of the exit fee? We still disagree that 140 million is a reasonable exit fee. Do we leave open the possibility of still litigating that down the road? All of those moving pieces can be included in whatever their negotiations end up being. So we get that there is a lot of, a lot of, hey, there's going to be some back and forth. There's going to be some negotiation. There's going to be all of these things. And we get that you don't know exact numbers. We don't know exact numbers. But if we were to say that this iteration of settlement is reached, right? Not a settlement down the line. The current

Starting point is 00:12:54 talks that are happening, if you were to put a percentage chance to say, hey, I believe it's 40%, 80%, 100% is happening tomorrow, what would you say in terms of how likely these current talks are to be substantive and make something shake in terms of, you know, kind of ending all these court cases. We're coming up on five days now since Ross Dellenger's article was put out. Nobody has refuted the report. That is a very important data point. And that's what makes it very likely that this is the basic framework for a solution. Now, a settlement by definition, nobody gets what they wanted. Neither party is happy. It's just they're less sad than they would be as if they lost. So if you tell me that this is the basic framework and Florida State gets $7 million,

Starting point is 00:13:46 I think there's going to be some pissed off fans. If you tell me this is the agreement and the FSU gets $15 million, I think that's a lot more palatable. But again, it depends on how quickly then we can get out of the grant of rights contract because it's that new, contract, that new partnership that's going to offset what the costs and losses are. You know, I've heard some people, not me and Kenton, but like raise objections, objections to the idea that you would implement a revenue model that would reward, you know, television ratings. And I would say, like, why not? This is television money. Like what, I know people have, they're wired to think, oh, you know, college football conferences,

Starting point is 00:14:29 traditionally, everyone gets an even split. I mean, you brought up the Vanderbilt example, earlier like Vanderbilt making the same TV split as Georgia. Maybe that's just the way they've always done it, but it doesn't really make sense to me. I personally have no problem with rewarding television ratings with extra money. Well, let me start off by saying I failed to give Kenton his percentage on the last question. He wanted to tie me down. But so with nobody refuting this, I'd say we're at a 70 to 80% likelihood of this deal being done for

Starting point is 00:15:03 something similar. I've always said since my first podcast and first learning about the ESPN deadline of February 1st, I have always said this will be wrapped up before January 31st of 2025. That's where I've gone out on the limb. What the details are remains to be seen. But to your point, absolutely, it is, it makes business sense to reward those who are bringing the advertising dollars. There are some projections that the top four ACC members are responsible for 60% of the view. viewership. And even those that are below the Miami's, the North Carolina's, the Clemsons and Florida State, all of their viewership numbers are when they play one of those top four. If you look at the recent viewership graphic that was put up that showed Cal, SMU, and

Starting point is 00:15:52 Stanford, their additions, they have yet to have a game over a million viewers. And that's now in starting this year's conference play. if you don't have those top three members, top two members in the conference, nobody's watching any of the games. So yes, a disparate distribution of those resources is appropriate. But again, the difference here is ESPN adding more money to the pot. Once you agreed on equal revenue sharing for all members, yeah, it's impossible for them to say, sure, let's go ahead and take less. Take 5% of my pie to give to somebody else.

Starting point is 00:16:30 That's a hard sell. That's really well said. And we appreciate your time. Doug Rohan, if you want to check him out on X. His X account is very informative, by the way, at Rohan Law PC. You know, anytime there's a new development, Florida State versus the ACC, Clemson versus the ACC, Doug is always a really good follow. Thank you so much for taking the time and thank you for the info.

Starting point is 00:16:53 It's my pleasure, guys. You enjoy the rest of your night. Take care. Always great. Awesome stuff there. And we will continue, my friends. We're not done yet because the ACC Weekly Awards, are out and I think they might have to rename ACC

Starting point is 00:17:08 Rookie of the Week to the Eli Holstein Rookie of the Week award because he is cleaning up. We'll talk about the others as well. You want to keep it locked right here. We're not done yet on this brand new episode of Locked on ACCC. We all know Fandual is America's number one sportsbook. We've been having such a great time, the upsets, the action we've been getting on Fandual all season long.

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Starting point is 00:17:51 when you place your first $5 bet. That's Fandul.com, America's number one sports book. Huge shout out to Doug Rohan for joining us, and thank you guys so much for making Locked on ACC your first listen and your first watch today. we're available free wherever you get your podcast for your next listen.

Starting point is 00:18:13 Make sure you check out our other shows. Kenton and Grayson do an awesome job on Lockdown Wolfpack covering NC State. I host Locked on Cains covering Miami. All right. So Kenton, let's take a look at the players of the week from the ACC. Now, you know, we could probably talk all day about Cam Ward, who wins ACC quarterback of the week, 404 passing yards, three touchdowns. against USF in a dominant victory from Miami 50 to 15.

Starting point is 00:18:44 He became the first quarterback to throw for more than 300 yards and three touchdowns, the first ACC quarterback to do that, over 300 yards and three touchdowns in the first four starts of his career in the past 25 years. I think your guy, Philip Rivers, might have been the last one, or I might be off on that. It's been a long, long time since someone has started their career with a new team, the way Cam Ward is doing at Miami. You're muted. well this is a function of similarly to how we see a lot of records being broken where it's like well you're kind of playing 16 games now this is a similar function in like yeah he's starting his career in the acc but yeah is he starting his career you know it's very different than how Trevor Lawrence started different than how Sam Hartman started different than how you know a little different but what is not different or actually what is

Starting point is 00:19:41 Oh, you muted me. Yep. Were you good? Okay. I was trying to mute myself so I could cough and I muted you back. I'm trying to give him props. And the big Miami lobby is trying to shut me down. I was saying what is different is Cam Ward.

Starting point is 00:19:54 We haven't seen anything like him. He is absolutely setting the world on fire right now. And I'm excited to see how this goes in the ACC play. He has looked so phenomenal. I don't expect to jump off. And I mean that. I genuinely mean that. Anybody who knows me knows I don't like quarterback.

Starting point is 00:20:09 I don't like giving them their credit. I don't like giving him their shine. I hate to see a quarterback getting some love, but I'll tell you what, if you can watch Cam Ward play ball and say he is not deserving of that love, you're not just a hater. You don't know ball, okay?

Starting point is 00:20:23 Because that young man has been phenomenal. On this, we can agree. And I think we can also agree on the other quarterback who's been getting a ton of love this season. It's a clean sweep, Kenton, four weeks into the year. All four weeks, Eli Holstein from Pitt, has one rookie of the week.

Starting point is 00:20:39 And he also doubled up last week, one straight up quarterback of the week as well. So he accounted for five touchdowns. Now, you know, that was a dominant win against Youngstown State, not the toughest of opponents, but they put up 73 points, but it was crazy. Five touchdowns, three passing touchdowns, two rushing touchdowns, 340 yards of total offense for Holstein, completed 67% of his passes in the game. Again, like we talked about him a lot after their win against West Virginia in the backyard, all, you would never know this young man as a red shirt freshman.

Starting point is 00:21:14 Like he looks like he looks like he's been out there slinging it for years. Just as we all expected, Eli Holstein leading the undefeated pit panthers and winning awards along the way. We all saw this coming. Anybody who didn't see it coming as a liar. Because we all, I mean, what a story. What a story. This pit team has been so far.

Starting point is 00:21:35 What a story. And I'll tell you, this is a team that I'm a little bit more, Lerner. of in terms of conference play. But still, what Eli Holstein has done so far this year has been nothing short of magnificent. It has been nothing short of a young man going out there and putting it all on the line every week. And damn it, after all those comebacks,

Starting point is 00:21:55 he deserves the cruise to what. He deserves the cruise on the end with an easy one because every other time he's having a, all right, come on, boys. I'm rallying the troops. We're going to get this thing done. So much love to pit, much love to host team. What a time.

Starting point is 00:22:08 So the other award winners from this week, running back, Prashard Smith from SMU, 190 all-purpose yards. And, you know, the Mustangs put it on TCU. That was a great game. They put up 66 points in that game. The receiver of the week well-deserved Lewis Bond from Boston College scored the game-winning touchdown on a 42-yard catch-and-run. That was a huge play for Boston College to come from behind against Michigan State.

Starting point is 00:22:36 and B.C. and Pitt, I mean, and Pitt's on defeat. Like, I feel like B.C. and Pitt both have cases to be ranked right now and they're not. Absolutely. Both teams have a very strong case, and I'll say this. I know that this team doesn't deserve to be ranked, didn't anywhere near rank. And so you laid it on them boys thick. They made it clear, hey, we don't like y'all. And you know what? Since you want to run away from us, take this 66 with you. Take it on with you. Take it on with you. Go on back to Fort Worth with this 66 on your head.

Starting point is 00:23:06 But now, you know, the two that you mentioned from BC and whatnot, they are, hey, this is a week where there were lots of special performances because the receiver from Louisville was another contender for a while receiver a week that I looked at. And I'm like, he made some plays. He made some, not just the 55-yarder, but he also made some other plays that you look up and say, man, that was important. But nobody's play was more important to box.

Starting point is 00:23:30 At the end of that game, when they need one, that was not an easy catch to slow down your momentum. and make a catch where your window is closing, safety is closing in on you. In that moment, in that particular moment, man, that's the stuff of legend. He may not have to buy another drink on chestnut here. Now, another player who provided a clutch moment

Starting point is 00:23:53 may not have to buy drinks in Palo Alto anytime soon was the Stanford kicker who won specialist of the week. Emmett Kenny, who hit the, you know, it wasn't the longest kick in the world, but clutch. I mean 39-yard walk-off kick to pull off the upset on the road, hostile environment at Syracuse. That was great for Stanford and great for Kenny to win. Now, I felt like maybe they should have given some kind of an award to Elico Manor for catching that fourth down.

Starting point is 00:24:21 He didn't show up this week, but the kicker does. You know, I really and truly look at this and I say, are we done with the college kicker curse? Are we done with only talking about college kickers? because they're going to find a way to miss it. I'll tell you what. That game, very good game, very entertaining, and to see that it came down to a last second walkoff and to see this young man be Captain Cool in that moment,

Starting point is 00:24:48 in that moment where your underdog... I think they iced him before he made the kick, too. Yeah, your underdogs on the road iced, and you hit that kick. Let me tell you something. Hey, you're playing some good ball. That's a moment that you love to see. Yeah, and then also, like, when he was actually lining up for the kick, like, I, I, I, I, I, I, I all admit, I wanted to see Stanford win for two reasons.

Starting point is 00:25:12 Number one, I want to hear you taunt Jackson Holzer on the next episode of the squad. But number two, like, it's just upsets. Upsets are a good story. And, you know, and I was, like, Fran Brown iced him the first time. And then I think Fran had another time out. And so when he was lining up the second time for the kick, I thought, is he going to ice him again? And like, well, what does that do to the kicker's psyche? Because they may call a timeout right when I'm running up to kick the ball. But no time out the second time.

Starting point is 00:25:41 He made it. That was great. Other ACC players of the week this week. This is notable. Patrick Payton from Florida State wins defensive linemen of the week. And he certainly woke up. And it feels like Florida State's defensive line, who I know they lost to Memphis the previous week. But the D-line actually played pretty well.

Starting point is 00:26:01 They played really well this past week against Cal. and Pat Payton had a career high, three sacks in the game, three and a half tackles for loss in the game. So, you know, Florida State gets their first win. Pat Payton was very deserving to get ACC defensive linemen of the week. Rest in peace to Club Godzilla, also known as B King, but he used to shut off a lot of his songs with, why did y'all wake me up?

Starting point is 00:26:25 And I feel like that's what the rest of the ACC is going to be saying in terms of tackles, watching Patrick Payton, because he's showing. He's turning into that guy that we, all knew he had the potential to be at the beginning of this season. He's turning into the guy that we all expect him to be, this game playing record Supreme, this guy that, oh, if you want to get the third and long gets him, you don't need a game to get him free. You don't need to call a dog to get him free.

Starting point is 00:26:50 You just say, hey, there's a tackle. There's the quarterback. Figure it out. And by golly, he's going to figure it out more often than not. You know, he was supposed to be the catalyst and the leader that Florida State defense, especially the defensive line. He's turning into that. He's getting the credit forward because without him,

Starting point is 00:27:06 I don't believe Florida State wins that game. Yeah. The other ones didn't mention linebacker of the week, David Bailey from Stanford. The two Stanford players get the nod this week. And offensive line was Noah Josie from Virginia. They're starting left guard. He helped pave the way for Virginia's 384 rushing yards

Starting point is 00:27:26 against Coastal Carolina in that victory. So I guess like the only couple things surprised me. And I know, like, you've got 17 teams to give out, like, eight players of the week award, but I'm a little surprise nobody from Louisville and also nobody from Clemson made the cut. So I guess try harder next week, right? I have told people for quite some time and folks say that I'm detracting from the winners or hating on the winners. What NC State has put out so far this year has been so bad. They've struggled to beat cast.

Starting point is 00:27:59 That's a wonderful high school from the Midwest and the best city in America. It's the best high school in America. Don't ask me any questions about it. But in all seriousness, you know, it is a little shocking to not see Clemson guys get in, but you also have to consider they all got pulled so early, it was tough for them to rack up the stats. You know what I mean? Their defensive end, Tamaria, and I want to say number three, he was so good when he was in the game. He just wasn't in the game long.

Starting point is 00:28:27 I mean, he was whooping Big Anthony Belton like he stole something. He turned Cadillac into a Buick. real quick. So, you know, it's a situation where, hey, Clemson's guys, they balled out. If they really got aggressive and said, we're going to put a hundred on these boys. The score was 28 to zip by the end of the first quarter. Yeah, that was rough. I was watching that game. And that's when at some point I texted you just to do a wellness check.

Starting point is 00:28:54 Hey, listen, I love the pack. I love ACC football. But at the end of the day, my check ain't going to get no bigger if they're successful. I love them. I'm not that guy. It's like a fantasy football freaking out. Because while these things are important, there's more to life than this.

Starting point is 00:29:10 And I get it. I get it. I know it sounds crazy for me to say, it's easy to say that when you get whooped on about 50 bucks. But, you know, there will always be more to life. And I want you all to remember that. Listeners are blocked on ACC. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:29:22 Hey, if you get into a fight at the game, you can't listen to us and the squad. Because Jackson, I'm coming for you, brother. I'm coming. I hope you know. I hope your preparedness. But in all seriousness, you know, it was a great weekend. And those teams and those guys did play great.

Starting point is 00:29:38 Clemson had a lot of guys that played great. So did Louisville. Again, I talked about the receiver and how he, I would have given him maybe a second look for wide receiver the week. But at the end of the day, I seriously say in some of these situations, it just shakes out that you were great this week. Somebody was just the snitch great tour. I mean, what I want to see is, like, is there any, any freshman in the ACC who can

Starting point is 00:30:01 upstage Eli Holstein? one time. I just got eight more weeks to go, right? Probably, probably more than that with by weeks. We have like nine, 10 more weeks of football to go in the regular season. Can somebody, some freshmen, redshirt freshman, true freshman, just outflash Eli Holstein once because the dude is running away with this thing so far. We appreciate everyone's time so much. He is Kenton Gibbs from Lockdown Wolfpack. I am Alex Dono from Lockdowne Keynes. Big thank you to Doug Rohan, Rohan Law for joining us and explaining this proposed settlement from top to bottom. We will talk to you guys again next time on another episode of Lockdown ACCC.

Starting point is 00:30:36 We are part of the awesome lockdown podcast network. Your team every day.

Locked On ACC - Daily College Football & Basketball Podcast - How Florida State Seminoles Can Navigate ACC Settlement Proposal

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