Locked On ACC - Daily College Football & Basketball Podcast - SHOWDOWN: How Will ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips Handle CFP and House Questions? | ACC Kickoff

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

ACC football takes center stage as media days approach. What burning questions await Commissioner Jim Phillips?Host Alex Donno and former NC State defensive lineman Kenton Gibbs break down the hot topics surrounding ACC Kickoff. They analyze the potential impact of NIL executive orders, debate college athlete employment status, and discuss the fairness of College Football Playoff expansion for the conference. The duo also preview upcoming coach interviews, including Miami's Mario Cristobal and NC State's Dave Doeren, while examining WNBA player compensation issues.Tune in for expert insights on the ACC's fight for relevance in the ever-changing landscape of college athletics.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!GametimeToday's episode is brought to you by Gametime. Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONCOLLEGE for $20 off your first purchase. Terms and conditions apply.Monarch MoneyTake control of your finances with Monarch Money. Use code LOCKEDONCOLLEGE at www.monarchmoney.com/lockedoncollege for 50% off your first year.FanDuelRight now, new customers can get ONE HUNDRED FIFTY DOLLARS in BONUS BETS when your first FIVE DOLLAR BET WINS! Download the app or head to FANDUEL.COM to get started. Bet with FanDuel—Official Partner of the NBA.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Locked on ACC is live from ACC kickoff media days. We are going to hear from Commissioner Phillips for the first time since the House settlement and since the executive order on NIL. You are Locked on ACC, your daily podcast on the Atlantic Coast Conference. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. Shout out to the everydayers and thank you so much for making Locked on ACC. Your first listen and your first watch, we're in the same screen for the first. We are.

He is Kenton Gibbs from Lockdown Wolfpack, former NC State defensive lineman. I am Alex Dono from Lockdown Caines, and today's episode is brought to you by Game Time. Download the GameTime app, create your account and use code Locked on College for $20 off your first purchase. On this episode, we've got a lot of former ACC women's basketball players in the WNBA, wearing those pay us, what you owe us, t-shirts. I would say this is a crossroads now in women's sports. Before we get to that, Kenton, it's all about ACC football. That's why we're here in Charlotte, ACC kickoff.

And we got the commissioners forum tomorrow. And Jim Phillips, I think, has up to an hour. He may need to use about 90 minutes tomorrow with all that's going on in college sports right now. All that's going on in college sports, all is going on in the ACC. I mean, what part, what moving part of college sports, college football, any ACC, is not worth discussion right now. Yeah. This is a big time year.

You talk about a crossword for women's sports. There's a crossword for ACC football as well. Crossroads is whooping my behind right now. But it's a crossroads for that as well. I mean, we are at a pivotal point here, and there are so many different directions for where his address could go. I sure know I got some questions for the man. Well, the first thing, I noticed something from Big 12 media days

where there were a lot of proponents within that conference for actually open to the idea of branding student athletes as employees in the future, which I was surprised by that. Because generally in the college sports world, you know, SEC and otherwise we'll find out how Jim Phillips and the ACC feels about it. There's this strong push to kind of, and yeah, players are getting paid for the first time ever over the last five years. And now you've got revenue sharing. So checks will be cut directly by universities.

But they are still being branded as student athletes, non-employees, where in the Big 12, there seemed to be some openness to actually having these guys be employees, maybe collectively bargain in the future. I just wonder how the ACC's going to feel about all that. Well, to me, this is why I say the ACC is at a crossroads for a bunch of different reasons. This is a pivotal moment. And I think Jim Phillips has to come out very clearly on the side of, hey, these are employees and not student athletes. And why do I say that?

Because to me, the only path to saving college sports is collective bargaining. You do not collectively bargain with non-employees. That doesn't exist. I've been doing recruiting. I've been doing HR for almost a decade now. And I can tell you, you don't even do that with contract. Actually, correct me if I'm wrong. I think, and not to say that there's a direct parallel to college sports,

but I think in like the film and entertainment industry, with like the writers guilds and some of the like SAG. I don't know. And again, I don't know if that's going to directly correlate to college sports. I think it is possible to collectively bargain without being an employee, but it's murky waters we're getting into. But the difference there is, they have unions. There's the SAG union. There's no players union. So if these players can become

unionized while under the umbrella of student athlete, that's possible. But remember, that's what Northwestern sued about all those years ago, the ability to unionize. So for me, I think that if they can unionize, fine, but I think that the more clear, the direction that leaves out all of the opakness and all of the murky waters is saying, hey, you all are definitively employees, okay? You all are defendably employees. Let's sit on at the bargaining table. Let's figure this thing out, as opposed to still trying to hold on to this archaic term that was invented to deny a young man with a serious brain injury, workers' compensation. When you get into the history of it, you want to even further separate yourself from the name student athlete. But even if we're

just talking today current, you know, situation, I think it's clear you have to. Again, that's Jim Phillips. You're up against it already. Let's just be out. honest, right? You're not on the side of this thing that you're in the big two per se in terms of Big Ten SEC. You have to do all you can to save your conference and give your conference the best look possible because I think it'd be a black eye to be one of, if not the only power for commissioner to say, well, I'm not sure about all this employee thing. I think that they still need to be student athletes. And then, of course, part of, we spoke on our last episode on Friday about the executive order that, you know, Donald Trump is reportedly,

going to sign, which would do a lot of things, or at least try to do a lot of things when it comes to NIL reform. And I think part of it is very well intentioned. Like when you want to regulate shady agents, you want to create more regulation to who can represent players to protect players' interests, you know, the idea of having uniform policies across states, certain states have laws that are more favorable to NIL and others. I know what you and I are a little concerned about is we don't have the direct details on what this would look like, but the potential of basically putting a cap on possible NIL earnings, right? Because in our eyes, it's kind of hard to really define, hey, is there a maximum that a player

should be allowed to make in a free market? But then I think the big question we have to ask ourselves is, with this executive order, would it be a bigger benefit to the universities and to the NCAA or would it be a bigger benefit to the athletes themselves? And I think the answer is absolutely a bigger benefit to the universities and to the NCAA. When you talk about limiting the money, when you talk about, hey, we don't have to pay too much. I think that concerns us a little bit from the athlete's side. Absolutely. And I want to talk about something that you said here because you talked about yesterday the idea that is good intention and you bought it back today.

As my mom will say, I know you're watching this. Hey, Mom, the road to hell is paper. with good intentions. With all due respect, I don't think that this is something where the executive branch of the United States is actively undermining these players, or actively saying we want to hurt these players. I don't think that that's what's happening at all, but what I do see is the potential for great harm to come out of something that may not be intended for that. And so that's kind of my concern here. And you talk about who has the power. We look at what's happening with the NFL draft, NBA draft and all that, and how people are talking about, oh, players are less grateful than they've ever been and all that.

Well, yes, because they have economic power and freedom to say, hey, I am not going to be taking advantage of in certain types of ways. So to everything, almost everything in life, there is good and there is bad. There is a balance. There is kind of a bell curve where it's like, you don't have enough or something. Okay, you got to write them up. We went too much, too far. I'm not sure where we are on that bell curve, to be honest, because I know. know that we're in a place where we need more regulations and more guidelines around NIL and all that.

I understand that fully with that. I'm not sure if we're at a point where we can properly put those in from the executive branch down, if you get what I'm saying. I'm not sure that I ever want politics and politicians to be involved in this ever. You talk about uniformity across states. The reason I love that idea and that aspect of the executive order is because it eliminates the politicians in it. If you create, hey, this is what it is across the board, guess what? No senator, no mayor, no governor can get in there and muck things up.

You know, we don't have to worry about Congress getting involved. It is just between the players and their universities. I'm worried that this may create the space for an overreach that, like we said, could potentially kneecap players financially. I'll tell you, the other big issue that I think is going to be presented to Jim Phillips tomorrow, and I hope it's one of the first questions that gets asked to him. maybe Kenton can squeeze one of these in for the commission is about the college football playoff, right? Because, yeah, I know that there's so much going on legally, the House settlement, which, you know, by and large, the conference commissioner seemed very happy and very relieved that

that has passed. But what about the CFP? Because yet, the ACC reportedly is going to get a couple of guaranteed bids, but half the guaranteed bids of the SEC, the Big Ten. And there's also the matter of how big is the playoff going to get 14 16 where does it stop where should it stop you want to keep it locked right here we're only getting started we're live on location in charlotte at the uh what is this the hilton charlotte uptown yeah that's not home baby acc media days keep it locked right here to lock on acc uh folks i know you're already keeping it locked to game time this is the only ticket app the kent gips and i use because we're getting the best deals we're getting the best features and we've all been there k g

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Thank you for making Lockdown ACC your first listen. Make sure for your next listen, you check out our other shows. Kenton, of course, and Grayson Boone, host Locked on Wolfpack. So NC State Day is Thursday, correct? Yes, sir. It's the last day. They're keeping us around here until the last day. Now, what are you going to ask Dave Doran?

What's the burning question? I mean, you know, it's always tough asking Doran questions. Because every time I ask them a question, you may know this. a lot of people may not out there listening. He always says, hey, Gibbs, how you doing? Hey, I'm doing a job right now, Dave. I'm doing a job. I'm doing something important. You played for him, so you got a special bond. Absolutely. That's my guy. But I think that the biggest question would be, how do you bounce back after a disappointed last year? You know, you spent all that money in an I L, and that's one of the reasons that I tell NC State fans all the time. The money is there,

the effort is there. The execution just wasn't last year. You know, you see Grace McCall go down with an injury early in the season multiple times. Then freshman CJ Bailey has to step in. The kid was slow dancing at prom a few months before the season starts. And now he's your starting quarterback. You know, you're always going to be in a tough situation when you think I've got a multiple-time conference player at a year coming in and then he gets hurt. So kind of how do you bounce back from a year where expectations were so high?

Obviously this year, the expectations are in the basement. And, you know, it's not that same type of thing. But how do you keep team morale up from year to year with such a thing happening? Yeah. So Kenton hosts Locked on Wolfpack. I host Locked on Cains. And so, like, where should I start with Mario Cristobal? Because I got my list for him, right?

I mean, I want to ask him what Carson Beck has been up to for the last couple of months because he wasn't cleared to throw during spring football. Yep. I want to ask him about that defense because, like, you know, and you've got your great question for Dave Doran about how do you, you know, manage your season and expectations. Like the expectations at Miami are super high. Always. But they've got to fix the defense that cost them an ACC championship game appearance last year. I mean, to say that that defense costs them an ACC championship appearance is low ball of it. Because I think that that costs them a playoff appearance.

I think it costs them an AC championship appearance. And let's just be honest with the way things shook out, potentially a spot in the national championship. Let's just be very honest about that, right? If you've got Cam Ward firing at his highest clip and then the defense, that's at least serviceable next to him, you were going to be okay. But, you know, if I were you, the question I would want to ask, to Mario Cristobal is just very simply, what does it take to put it all together? On paper, everything is there. On paper, everything is there for Miami.

You talk about continuity. You talk about being the best in the trenches. Yes, you have to replace an all-time receiver in terms of Xavier Estrepo. Absolutely. Yes, you have to replace the number one pick at quarterback. But guess what? You've got the potential two guys who are potential number one picks in Ruben Hurricane Bain.

Francis Miley, no. You got two of them now. And they're going to be their biggest, best, most mature selves before they head off to go play on Sundays. So my question is with all that talent, you know, how do you pull it together to finally have that season where Miami not only goes to the ACC championship game? They're not only back here in Charlotte, but they're walking away with some rings. Yeah, no, it's for sure. And I'm also, I'm really excited to get to talk with Carson Beck tomorrow because, you know, since he wasn't fully healthy during spring, Miami did not make him available to the media. because that's common, you know this.

When a player is injured, they don't talk to the press, so this will be my first opportunity. But let's get back to Commissioner Phillips because, all right, a few months ago, you and I really scrutinized something he said about putting the interests of the greater good of college sports over maybe the ACC's interests, when it comes to this college football playoff compromise, right? The compromise, I should say, that word's kicking my butt now. You get four automatic bids for the SEC and four for the Big Ten and only two auto bids for the ACC and the Big 12. And so, you know, we were critical.

And listen, I'm open to the idea that maybe we were unfair. Maybe we took them out of context a little bit. So maybe he'll have an opportunity to clarify that tomorrow. But, you know, giving off this impression that, like, you're settling for less for your own conference when, in my view, your job as the commissioner is to fight for your own conference, even if you're. needs may be a little bit unreasonable to the others. You fight for your interests over the interests of the greater good. I feel like that's part of the job description. That's how you start a bargain, right?

So that's something that Coach Phillips, I would imagine, it's going to be, or not Coach Commissioner Phillips, is going to be asked to clarify tomorrow. Well, see, you don't know Jim Phillips like I know Jim Phillips, because he's going to hit you with the politician answer. Well, what's best for college football overall is what's best for the ACC. That's good. You got me there.

That's what he's going to say. You got me in a corner. But guess what? But guess what? You're a thousand percent right, Donno. That is. And to be honest, I don't think that he was criticized enough for that. Because I think that that's part, like you said, it's part and parcel of the gig.

But let's go beyond that. We don't want anybody doing a bare mental. I don't want the leader of my conference doing just enough for me to say, you know what? He did fight for the conference that one time. I want a your mark that's always talking about how good we are and how we're being sold short all time. I want that. I want a Sanky that even when I'm at the top of the mountain, I want more. Yeah, I got 10 cookies, but I want your two cookies. Give it on here. Come on down with it. You know what I mean? I deeply enjoy those types of personalities. Jim Phillips is not that type of

personality. But even beyond being that type of personality, just from a standpoint of what he's good at, the cerebral thing, the political thing, you should have thought to yourself, maybe it's not the best thing for me to say in a conference that is already being perceived as behind to say, I'm doing what's best for everybody, not just what's best for my people. Because I'm sorry, brother. But if you draw a circle around the whole world, you're going to forget about the circle you should have drawn around your family. And let's be honest, the ACC is a family

that feels a little neglected right now. Well, and one of the reasons why I'd like him to clarify the comment was it's possible that you and I and thousands of others took the comment literally when it was not meant to be. Because I think the way that

Greg Sankey, the SEC commissioner, took it was, Philip in saying, I've got to put, you know, the greater good before my own needs was his way of saying, how come the SEC and the Big Ten aren't doing that? That it was tongue and cheek. So, again, I don't know because when you read those words on a page, even when you watch the video clip of it, you know, it might have been a subtle jab. I initially took the comment literally, but I'd love to hear that comment clarified because

I don't think Greg Sankey took it literally. I think he took it as a shot. But you know what? That's what I mean by for all of Greg Sankey's faults. That's one thing that I would never give him or that I'll never take a shot at him for. He is somebody that's always looking like, how is it going to affect the SEC? You're right. How are my boys going to be handled out of it?

He doesn't give a rats behind about nobody else. He just doesn't. He doesn't care about the Big Ten. He doesn't care about the Big Twelve. But honestly, that's how he should be. If you're doing the budgeting for the Donald household, you don't think, well, what is Kenton need? Well, we're good friends. So you're fourth, after I get through me, wife and my son, you're fourth on the list.

And I appreciate it. I appreciate the consideration. But do you see how he said it's him, wife, child, first? You know, that's what it is. You got to draw that circle around your family. And right now, the ACC field's a little left out because that, Sankey can take it however he wants it. And you know what? Maybe we have interpreted it incorrectly.

And he did mean, hey, they're not looking out for, you know, the nation's best interest and college football's best interest. They're looking out for their own. If he did mean that, that is the one way that I will say, my fault, OG, I'm sorry. And if he did mean it that way, I kind of like it. Because it's a little saucy. Yeah, but that's the thing.

Jim Phillips has never been a saucy guy. You know what? No, last year, now the ACC ended up, I think, entering into a pretty bad settlement. But you remember last year when he was talking about the lawsuit? Yeah, he did. He was sought out that they ended up kind of giving everything to Florida State and Clemson that they wanted.

But at least when he talked about it was a little saucy. Well, you know, I'm going to tell you this much. If you're going to walk it back like that, don't even put the sauce on there. Just give me dry rub. Don't give me the sauce to strip it away at the end. What's going on there? Dry rub. You know, it's a, I will say this.

Jim Phillips did get saucy then. I'm not sure if he's being saucy now. And maybe my character, my character assessment of Jim Phillips is off, which then the framing of how I see things he says off. But I truly believe that he's that guy that just tries to be, oh, I just don't want to hurt anybody. I just don't want to do wrong by anybody, which is like, hey, buddy, I'm sorry to tell you, but in your quest to not do wrong by anybody else, you're doing wrong by Miami, by NC State, by Boston College, Cal, Clemson, Duke, all of the ACCC. That's who gets done wrong

when you're not fighting for your guys. Yeah, and so, you know, for those, and obviously, we got a lot of our listeners and viewers who are, you know, big time ACC followers. You've probably seen Jim Phillips press conferences before. So this is one of those, if you know, you know, type of things. I wonder if we're going to get seminar gym or saucy gym. It's like sometimes you get seminar gym where it's like, gosh, he's been on the podium for an hour. I feel like I've been here for four hours or like I was at the commissioner's forum last year.

I was thoroughly entertained when he's talking about the lawsuits stuff. I'm like, man, I can watch this for a couple more hours. It's like the Avengers. I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what. Every time we get an appearance from saucy gym, I'm excited. I'm excited because his default is seminar gym. Yeah.

And with all due respect, if that's going to come out, give us the blankets, give us some pillows, and we'll just kick our feet up on Press Road. You know, Miami's the first team after them. Yeah, they are. We can give you some time to get rested and, you know, get ready for your guys to come on out there because I'll tell you, Saucy Gym is the only gym we want to see. Right now, we don't need somebody that's going to be, I get it, being measured is important in these turbulent times, but we also need somebody that can be that salesman, that can be that motivator, that can get folks riled up to say, you know what, I'm fighting for the ACC.

What are you doing? Yeah. So, like, from tomorrow, early morning, I'm just going to be, like, kind of shadowing Mario Cristobal. And the reason why is because if there is any Cuban coffee to be found in Charlotte, it's going to find its way to wherever Mario Cristobal is. He's like, he's got a gravitational pull because people know, you know, he lives on, and I'm a big fan of strong coffee.

I love the Cuban Cafesito. I just spent like six weeks in Italy. I was drinking espressoes, like three times a day over there. Right, right. So if there is any collada, any cafe Cubano in this entire state of North Carolina, it's going to find its way to Mario Cristobal. And I'm going to be begging for a couple of drops of that tomorrow. Well, we may have to check on your blood pressure for the that misses and the kids.

But, no, you know, Mario Cristobal is going to be very exciting as always. I don't think he has a political side to him. I don't think he has that boring. No. You could ask him about the most mundane thing. And his personality will bleed out. But the funny thing about Christobal is like, he gives you coach-speak answers, but in like a really eloquent way.

Yeah. Like it's like, and by the way, Bill Belichick is going to be here this week. I think Thursday is the same day. So like, okay, so it's a bill. And I think Bill does it on purpose because like people, I'm not in Belichick's inner circle, obviously. But I've heard people say over the years like, yeah, I've got a good friend who used to be on the New England Patriots beat, you know, and Belichick was there, of course.

And like, behind the scenes like Bill really engaged. aging, really talkative, entertaining, but he does this thing. And we'll see if it carries over to UNC where Belichick's on the potent. Like he tries to be as mundane as possible. It doesn't really. So like Mario Cristobal is never going to give you like an answer to a question that might get him or his program in trouble. And he's very polished and very careful with what he says. But he's also like, you know, I guess I guess it's all the Cuban coffee.

Like it's he'll give you like, you know, like a political answer, but in an entertaining way, which I can appreciate it. Absolutely. Absolutely. And don't worry, locked on ACC Nation. Donno was on the Belichick intersankton, but he was replaced, speculation as he was replaced by Ms. Hudson. We're not going to get into that. You think she's going to be

here? I don't. I don't think she's going to be here. I highly doubt. You know, I really do look at that situation. I'm glad it's not a main focal point of talking anymore. But I think we've all hit the point with it, including his camp and her camp, where it's like, it's just too much. You know, We haven't played a snapp of football.

We haven't kicked off yet for the season. And we're already talking about is he on the outs with the administrator. So I really do think of all the teams that you talk about, hey, you're in a very precarious situation here. I think they're in one of the more precarious. I think the only team I would have them beat is the Cal Golden Bears because, you know, that internal power struggle thing that we've been hearing about, there's no way to, quote,

there's no way to kind of calm those rumors, you know, nicely. You know what I mean? Like, if we ask Wilcox, what's going on there? What is the talk around town with potentially having, potentially having, you know, Rivera take over more power or take a more active role? What does he say that calms people down, right? Like if he's aggressive and he's like, there's none of that going on here, that's nonsense. Now you sound intimidated. If he sounds very calm, hey, whatever happens happens, now it sounds like that's an open admission that I'm afraid of this thing.

I think he'll probably just, he'll be calm, but he'll be like, oh, no, we have a great relationship. You know, we work together. It's the only thing you can say. I mean, whether you believe him or not, it's up to you. Yeah. Yeah. So there's lots of very interesting storylines coming on in here. And I'm going to tell you, I can't wait to get my hands on those ponies.

I can't wait to talk to SMU. Yeah. I wasn't here last year for their first ever. But I'm even more excited to be here for this year. As they're coming up tomorrow as well. I am super excited to chat with them because I want to know, how do you follow this out? You go from 11 wins conference championship game in the American Athletic Conference, and then you go to 10 wins, conference championship game in the ACC and playoff appearance.

How do you even follow that? Yeah, he's like the last like three years he's been arguably the most successful coach in college football, just, you know, based on the situation and the talent level. So here's what we're looking at, by the way, for tomorrow and the three days or the two days that follow Tuesday. So on Tuesday, Commissioner's Forum with Jim Phillips, we discussed some of the things that may come up there. Miami, SMU, Stanford, Cal, and Virginia. That's all on Tuesday. Wednesday, Florida State, Louisville, Syracuse, Pitt, Georgia Tech, Wake Forest.

And then Thursday will be the final day out here with six teams. Boston College, Virginia Tech, Clemson, conference favorites, Duke, North Carolina, and NC State. So, okay, outside of the teams, of course, ACC, we cover all the teams, but we also, you know, we locked on Keynes and locked on Wolfpack, outside of the teams we specifically cover, who are you looking forward

most to seeing this week? Oh, it's definitely SMU. Yeah. Definitely SMU. You know what's so interesting. SMU was coming off 11 wins, bought a quarterback to ACCC Media Days last year. That quarterback ended up getting replaced.

Preston Stone, yeah. So the question, obviously, for Kevin Jennings, how do you not end up in a similar situation? How do you? Is it like the Madden Curse showing up here? You know? And even beyond that, even beyond that, is that a positive or negative for you as a quarterback to feel like, hey, I can be replaced.

An all-conference guy was replaced by me. That's right. I could be replaced. I've got to be on my piece of cues. Is it, you know, does it add some uneasiness? Or are you that type of competitor that's like, I love it. I love waking up in the morning knowing it's either hunt or be hunted. You know, it's either kill or be killed.

I love, I would love to know that answer from Kevin Jennings. Yeah, the other team that I'm looking forward to seeing is Florida State because, I mean, it's night and day from the situation a year, like a year ago. Yeah. They came in here defending conference champs. You know, almost unanimous media picks to repeat as conference champs and get to the college football playoff and all that. And, you know, Florida, I get it.

Like the Florida state players last year, they're all, you know, wearing their fine Italian suits and they're walking around like they own the place. Yeah. So it's like it's a much different scenario. You come in here after two and ten. And obviously, you know, Tommy Castiano's who's going to be, was on a different team last year. He, he ran the ACC by himself, by himself. And so it's going to be a much different tone because and not saying that they weren't, you know, because I talked to all the Florida state players last year and they, they handled the media great. But it's like, you know, they had a different swag last year coming off at 13 and O than what they're going to have this

year. And of course, there's going to be a lot of questions about what the hell happened last year and what are you going to do to make sure that doesn't happen again? Absolutely. And you talk about box office when he gets in front of a mic, Thomas Castellanos. Yeah. You know, does he always say the right thing? Does he say a thing that's not going to piss somebody off? Absolutely not. But is he going to say something that's going to be clippable? That's going to be, you know, that's going to draw headlines. It's going to draw attention. It's for sure a thing. But like you said, it could not be more polar opposite situations. Conference champs, two and ten.

Yeah. You know, and even beyond that, you talked about fine Italian suits. For those of you who don't know, Dono is from Italy. You know, that's where his bloodline runs. I couldn't even afford one of those Italian suits. You talk about an Italian suit. He knows an Italian suit or two. Okay? So he knows.

But in all seriousness, you do kind of have those questions of how do you bounce back? You have been to the highest of highs, then immediately followed by the loss of lows at a program that has historically, their lowest of lows is what, five, six wins, maybe four. And you get two? Yeah, they hadn't been that bad since like the early 70s, which is, and then that,

that was before Florida State was Florida State. That's before your lifetime, Donald. Yes. You know what I mean? You weren't even a lot. You know, now you got a mortgage and a kid. Yeah. That's, that's where you're at with this thing.

So it's a very interesting situation that Florida State is in. And even beyond Thomas Costalanos, how do the rest of the guys kind of handle this moment? How does Norval handle it? Because Norval's never been in this situation. Norvelle has never seen a team regress this much while he's been a head coach. Yeah. So we have that to look forward to. Let's talk a little women's basketball on the other side because you got former

ACC players in the WNBA. And you talk about generating headlines. Those pay us what you owe us T-shirts. Even if you don't follow women's basketball, it is shown up on all of your social media timelines. Everyone's got an opinion about it. You want to keep it locked right here. We're not done yet on Locked on ECC.

So, Kenton, this is a tough story for me to cover because I've got like the capitalist angel on one shoulder and like the like just, you know, let's call a spade a spade on the other shoulder. Right. So like, all right, so the WNBA, and I feel like the league, the last couple of years has been hotter than it's ever been. Absolutely. Caitlin Clark, the polarization that comes with that angel Reese and a little perceived feud that they've had. Like I've watched more WNBA games the past two years and probably the previous 20 years combined. You know, obviously the revenues are going up. But then, you know, all the accountants will rightfully point out that the league has never been profitable.

I think they were 50 million in the in the red last year. They're subsidized by the NBA. Right. And so I guess like some people would say, hold on, they're wearing pay us what you owe as T-shirts. Well, you know, they owe the NBA 50 million. and their indebted pay us what you always been on the other side. Like, you know, that's not the way, you know, if you have a business that's not making money, that doesn't mean you don't pay your employee.

Exactly. And guess what? The NBA, the WNBA, nobody would watch it if not for the players, if not for the storylines they create. So I'm not going to pretend that WNBA players have no value. They absolutely do. And I think eventually the league is going to become profitable. So, you know, we're really at a crossroads now, Kenton, including a bunch of former ACCC players in that league. And, you know, will it get to a point?

Like, could there be a strike or a lockout? Like, where do you think we're going with this? Well, they're currently in the process of negotiating the new CBA. And here's the thing I want people to recognize. It's not about whether or not the league is profitable. Because, Donno, you know, I've been working in startup environments for the last five years. Right. Most startups are not profitable.

Yeah. But if you see the numbers we throw to some of those engineers, it makes me think I'm major in the wrong thing. You know, but in all seriousness, you look at this situation and you talk about their revenue split. I believe they earn somewhere between six and nine percent. Yeah, it's like 8 percent I saw somewhere, yeah, as opposed to 50 in the NBA. Right. Like that's, that's a very different situation. Yeah.

You know what I mean? And at the end of the day, it's not about whether or not the league is profitable as a whole for this reason and this reason only. There, if you look at where the NBA was in their 30th season, which the WMBA is at, they weren't profitable either. Oh, I didn't know that. Should Magic Johnson have not gotten paid? Do you think that Magic Johnson?

Did he owe the NBA 50 million? They didn't know what I'm saying? There was a situation where, objectively speaking, the game's on tape delays, right? You got to stay up until 1 a.m. to watch your team playing whatnot. But people would have thought it was preposterous. If you say, oh, that Larry Bird character, don't pay him.

Why would you pay him? Why would you give him a split of whatever revenue you're earning there or whatever the case may be? It's, to me, it is objectively absurd on his face to say, hey, we're not making money. Therefore, our labor force does not deserve something near an equitable split in terms of the revenue. I'm not saying that they need the same contracts as the NBA. I'm not saying that. That is ludicrous.

That's madness. I mean, some would argue NBA players don't even deserve the contracts. Hey, it ain't my job to watch another man. Same. Yeah, right. They're my job. But what I will say is they deserve a split that is, more fair because again they're going out there putting their bodies on the line and sometimes having

to play year round and go over to you know Russia and all these places that are war torrent sometimes Russia doesn't let you go back hey you know what I'm saying you know what I'm saying so you know if these players are having to go to all these different countries in order to kind of make a make ends meet why should we not want to compensate them more fairly yeah why should we not want to say hey you all deserve this money so that you don't have to start an unrival to make enough money to live and be all right. And so many people say, oh, well, you're making,

you know, the best of you make $200,000. Well, yes, but basketball is your career is but this long. Your ability to play at the top level is this long, okay? We're not seeing 15, 20-year all-stars. The WMBA, even if we talk about them in comparison to men's sports,

the careers are still relatively short. The league is so small, the talent is so great that the minute you start dropping off, oh, don't worry, baby. You bought a year or two away from being off a roster. So, you know, I think that this is, we're at a point where who does the WMBA want to be? For all of the talk of equitable treatment, for all of the causes that they take on socially in terms of equity, who do you want to be in terms of pay equity? That's well said.

Well, we're here. We're going to be, I'll be here for about the next two days. Kenton's going to be here the whole week in Charlotte. And J.J. Jackson from Lockdown Blue Devils, he's going to be. out here so we'll connect with him tomorrow and the next day and guys make sure you smash that like button subscribe to locked on acc subscribe to the audio version apple podcast spotify wherever you get your pods and full full gauntlet tomorrow kenton with the commissioners forum uh with miami smu stanford cal virginia haven't uh haven't run into any of the miami or virginia contingent

yet we have seen around around the hotel we've seen some folks from uh from stanford and cal Have you seen any SMU walking around? I haven't seen them either, right? I haven't seen the SMU. But like I said, I want to see some SMU. I want to see some SMU. Free Sherwood blood, okay? He was just ahead of the game.

Maybe he'll be here. Free him. His daughter graduated from Virginia. Oh, no way. Yeah, his daughter's a U. He'll be here with the UVA. You know what I mean? Hey, Priam, free to guys.

We'll talk to you again next time on another episode of Lockdown ACC. We're part of the awesome Lockdown Podcast Network. Your team, every day.