Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - BENGALS SQUAD SHOW: Joe Burrow PLAYING on Sunday?! Ja'Marr Chase SUSPENDED for Sunday's game

Episode Date: November 21, 2025

Joe Burrow may PLAY on Sunday after being a full participant in practice on Wednesday. What can the Bengals and their fans expect if Burrow returns from a Grade 3 turf toe injury, and can he be the SPARK the Bengals need? Bengals star wide receiver Ja'Marr Chase, though, is suspended for Sunday's game against the New England Patriots after SPITTING on Steelers cornerback Jalen Ramsey. Do the Bengals have enough weapons on offense to score points against the New England Patriots? Do the Bengals' defensive players just not care? Plus, previewing Sunday's game against the New England Patriots. Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! Peloton Let yourself run, lift, flex, and push forward. Explore the new Peloton Cross Training Tread+ today at https://www.onepeloton.com. PrizePicks Download the PrizePicks app today and use code LOCKEDONNFL to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup. Click Here: https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/LO... Gametime Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime. FanDuel Right now, new customers can bet just FIVE dollars and if your bet wins—you’ll get THREE HUNDRED dollars in bonus bets to use across the app. FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

I'm Alex Frank, and if Joe Burrow is going to return on Sunday, all I ask is that the Bengals, please handle their franchise quarterback better than the team that plays right behind me in downtown Cincinnati, handle their superstar. And, well, he's not going to have Jamar Chase. So if Burrow does return, it will be a bit more of an uphill battle than it already was. Hey, protect him, but we need a spark. Yes, we do. Today, it's the Bengals Squad, everything Cincinnati Bengals every week.

Breaking down all the big hits and game-changing plays from the Queen City, the way only the Lockdown Podcast Network can. From the jungle to the playoffs, the Bengals Squad show starts now. And welcome to Bengals Squad right here on the Lockdown Bengals YouTube channel and the lockdown podcast network, now the number one sports podcast network in America and the world, your team every day. I'm Alex Frank on Twitter at Frankie underscore Natty. Jake Lisco at Jake Lisco on Twitter.

Art Valero at Coach Ard Valero on Twitter, 45-year coaching veteran. We are a supplement to lockdown Bengals, a twice a week long-form conversational show on the Cincinnati Bengals. Today's episode of Bengals Squad is brought to you by GameTime right now to download the GameTime app, create an account, and use code locked on NFL for $20 off your first purchase. Plenty happening around the Cincinnati Bengals. This week, Joe Borough is taking reps, first team reps, consecutive days in practice.

Unfortunately, if he does play on Sunday, as Jake, you alluded to in the cold open, he will be without his number one weapon, pun intended, in more ways than one. Jake, I'll turn to you first. Will he or won't he? Will Joe Burrow play on Sunday against the New England Patriots? Can't rule it out, which feels crazy. I'm not going to make a bold prediction. Those who have been following me long enough

know that I am not in the prediction game. I don't see the point of it, frankly. But the information that we have is that Zach Taylor hasn't said no. And Joe Burrow has practiced for two straight days. He went full on Wednesday. I was just looking to see if we had an injury report yet. For Thursday, I haven't seen one. But he practiced again with the ones,

according to reporters who were at the practice. they were kicked out, which is only to see, like, the indie stuff and the stretching at the beginning of practice. So it's not like we know yet if he did a full practice on Thursday as of, what, 4.03 p.m. as we're chatting here on the Bengal Squad show. But the fact that he continued to work with the ones working with Ted Karris when reporters were present, T. Higgins, saying he wouldn't be surprised if Joe's going to play, that he looked excellent in practice. sure feels like there's a lot of momentum toward Joe Burrow really pushing to return to action this week. And it takes me back to his comments when he spoke with the media for the first time since he had the injury. And he said, I will see how the team does. It could be earlier in the window.

It could be later in the window. And at the time, it was like, well, maybe he means if they lose the games, he'll shut it down. And he won't risk re-injuring the toe. In retrospect, it appears that he meant, if they lose, maybe I'll push this thing and try to get back sooner to give ourselves a shot here. I'm going to hit the wrong button there. Art, I'm going to turn to you. That's a great point there, Jake, about because the Bengals are not three and seven. If there's any hope that they're going to make the playoffs, I think they may have to win out. Art, I'll turn to you. If you're a coach, and you've coached many star players in your coaching career, Cardinal Cadillac Williams, Joe Girovicious, just to name a few. But if you have a star player on your team returning from the kind of injury that Burroughs is standing in week to, gray three turf toe, but yet he's ahead of schedule.

factor in being three and seven, not really being in the thick of the playoff race. How should the Bengals coaching staff be handling Joe Burrow, in this case, factoring in everything we know about him and him wanting to play? How would you handle this if you were on the Bengals coaching staff? Well, I think it goes as the season goes. Up until last week, you know, Joe Flacco had done a very good job offensively. They put themselves in a position to win. All of a sudden, now they can't do anything about the other side of the ball.

So now you have your star player coming back, who we don't know because we're not at practice. He might have participated in seven on seven, no pass for us. Might have participated in 11 on 11. Team, no pass for us, basically. They're always going to pull out the quarterback. Has he had to scramble? Has he had to move around? Can he step up in the pocket?

If it was me, I'd say, you know what, let's give it another week. Let's keep evaluating them. And as long as Joe Flacko is healthy and good to go, let's go with Joe Flackle. Joe Flacco has been very good, minus last week against Pittsburgh. But when you have a guy like Joe Burrow, who we know who he is at this point in his career, he's been to a Super Bowl, he's been to two AFC championships, he's had MVP caliber seasons in three of his five seasons that he has played. Unfortunately, there are only the three full seasons he's played in his career.

this season also will not be a full season. This is for both of you. I want to hear from both of you. Jake, you've obviously been around Joe Burrow and this team being on the Daily Bengals beat. Or you have watched Joe Burrow from afar. But what you see from Joe Burrow, how commendable is it that, A, he's this far ahead of schedule in his rehab. And B, even though the Bengals are three and seven, and this season hasn't gone at all that they expected, he still wants to play and be out on that field.

for himself, this team, and the city of Cincinnati. Yeah, we talked about this in our last episode of the week on lockdown Bengals. And we might have to do another episode of Lockdown Bengals between James and myself this week. If there's suddenly an announcement on Friday or Saturday that Joe Burrow is going to start. But if you put yourself in the mindset of Joe Burrow here, Joe Burrow, elite competitor, wants more than anything to win, wants more than anything to be playing meaningful football in the winter. So if you're Joe Burrow and you're looking at your chances here, and you're pretty confident in yourself.

You know I'm one of the best, if not the best, to do what I do in the world. And what I do happens to be the most important position in sports and is most correlated with winning across every sport. And if I'm that good, I think, if I'm Joe Burrow, I can win the rest of the games. Of course I do. Of course I think I'm going to go out there and run the table when I return. I've done it before.

I've won a bunch of games down the stretch. Of course I can do it again. I don't know how honest that is about his defense and the struggles that they've had on the other side of the ball, as I alluded to earlier. But if you're burrow and you want to give yourself a shot to get to the playoffs, it does kind of need to start this week because the Bengals lost to the Jets, because the Bengals lost to the Bears, because the Bengals couldn't figure out a way to beat the Steelers last week and get that A.S. FC North win. Realistically, if you want to give yourself a shot, it kind of has to start this week. The other side of this is,

I wonder how far ahead of schedule Joe Burrow really is. I think this is a fascinating case study to review if the details ever do emerge around what his rehab has looked like and what treatments he's gone through. 63 days or whatever it is removed from this turf toe surgery to return to play in the NFL. is pretty insane. I had my own physical therapy appointment this morning for an injury that I'm dealing with and talked to my physio about it. I've asked him about it a few times just because he's a medical

expert and has the ability to talk about this stuff from a position of expertise. And he was also shocked. So we'll be very interesting to see if he does return this week how he's moving. It'll be interesting to find out what kind of protection he has in that shoe. And I'll be fascinated if he does return this week. They've just learned about the protocol that's gotten him to a point where he feels like he can go back out there without a severe risk of re-injury, which I hope is the case because I do think that that risk of re-injury is a scary thing. How much Jake, I'll get to you are here in just in just a minute, but Jake, going back to the timeline that Joe Borough was out, one and seven record, it very well could have been three and five. They have just gotten one stop

against the Jets and or the Bears. How much do you think about that? And if they had just won, even just won one of those games, in the AFC not being as strong as it is, how much do you think about that? Like they are at the absolute rock bottom, if they are even going to even attempt to get back into this thing. Yeah, I think that if they had won at least one game,

maybe it would have required two wins, then I think that he's taken the extra days. I do wonder what the benefit of, the extra days is other than you can get maybe a little bit more of a look at him in practice. But with the Thursday night game next week, I don't know how much they're doing in the way of full speed practice anyway between Sunday and Thursday of road trip to Baltimore after this game against the Patriots. So I don't know how much more you really learn in that week.

I don't know how much healing happens in those four days, but that's what I would be thinking about. I do wonder how much thought there is from the front office from the coaching staff. the medical staff about potential intervention if it's necessary. I don't know that it is. We're speculating about the status of that toe because we simply don't have the information. And, Ard, you coached offensive line.

You coached along the defensive line, positions of toughness where guys are banged up every week with just the full contact on every single play. How commendable is it to an offensive line and a defensive line that the quarterback, who's protected at all costs, is doing everything. he can to play even in the dire circumstances that the Bengals are in right now. Oh, I'm telling you, he, you know, we've talked about in past segments about, you know, the team needing leadership. I guarantee you they see him every day rehabbing. They see him at practice. He's probably been in every meeting. He is actually there.

And the only time he's not there and he's probably out on the field watching him at times. but he's got a support staff around him. And, you know, like we talked about, that it's astronomically good, you know, and we talked about it, I think, last week was, you know what, he's a coach's kid. He's a gym rat. He's a guy that it's about competition. It's about getting out there. And, you know, arguably, he is the best on the planet when healthy and on the field.

Now, that concerns me that, you know what, sometimes that lead dog now, you got to pull the reins back on him a little bit just so he doesn't affect himself and put himself in harm's way. And so I'm pretty sure it's going to be a very, very good discussion about, you know, is he might dress this week and be the three and then go about it and then they'll reevaluate. because even though he went about his business, he'll still throw seven on seven next week. He'll still be a part of team. He'll be a part of all the walkthroughs. But I think probably what a great coming out party for him on Thanksgiving Day. And that's like, I mean, you got everybody in the country watching. And so you want to be at your best.

and you're playing a divisional rival and your team is going hopefully is up for the task and so it'll all make it good. I tweeted this earlier Thursday as we record this live. That was kind of interesting the way I said that, that when Joe Burrow plays, it's better for all parties involved because he is a premier quarterback. And talking about the Bengals and hosting this show, co-hosting with you guys, it is better when Joe Burrow is. playing because you know the performances, you know what to expect week in and week out. I feel like we haven't even talked about Joe Burrow a lot on this show because he's been injured, which is interesting because everything with the Cincinnati Bengals begins and ends with Joe Burrow. Art will turn to you again. From afar, watching Joe Burrow, what stands out

to you about his play on the field, but also his mental makeup as an NFL quarterback? Oh, I'm telling you what. His toughness? mental and physical toughness is, you know, one of the quintessential quarterbacks in the league. He wants to be there. He wants to throw. He loves to compete. He loves to challenge guys. Not afraid of doing that. That's what makes him, you know, arguably one of the best that's out there because he does do that. Now, he's not as big as the Josh Allen's, so Josh Allen can take a few more hits. And he doesn't have the supporting cast, I'm talking about up front in the backfield, with protection him.

So he's had to do a lot of things on the move. And so I think he, you know, he is one of those guys that you put, that his care about where he's at, what the organization is giving him, what the city of Cincinnati is giving him. You know, he's an Ohio kid. you know, he's got an amount of pride in him that he didn't want to let anybody down. And that's the great thing about it. Jake, I'm sure you've been around him before.

Is what Art saying from his view congruent to what you've seen from coming to training camp and covering Joe Burrow? I mean, the guy, I think, is a top-tier competitor. And I think that comes out in everything he does the way he prepares himself, the mentality he approaches a game with. I think we've seen throughout his career going back to LSU, the toughness that he has. And he's had some unfortunate injuries that you can't play through. You can't play through an ACL.

You can't play through turf toe. But the things that he can play through, he has played through. And sometimes to his detriment, I think that the thing that I'm interested to see if Joe Burrow does return this week. And I'm hearing a lot of hesitancy from art in terms of bringing him back this week. And I want to revisit that just for a second. But if he does come back this week or even if he comes back next week against Baltimore, we've seen Joe Burrow is notoriously a slow starter. And there have been different reasons for this throughout his career,

whether it's a calf injury or an appendectomy that he had to have during training camp or a COVID rookie season or coming off the ACL. There's always been reasons. This year, there wasn't so much a reason for it other than that they had to play the Browns. And the Browns tend to have the Bengals number, especially in Cleveland, where that Brown's defense always performs significantly better with the advantage of of crowd noise and offenses going on a silent count, just a big advantage for Miles Garrett in that pass rush.

But it wasn't the fast to start for Joe this year in either of the games that we saw him in. I wonder, I know this is mid-season, we've never seen him return from a multi-game absence in season. I wonder if you would have to deal with that slow start as well. And if the whole idea is that they need to win out starting this week, can they afford that, especially in a game? where Jamar Chase will be missing.

I did want to ask you one follow-up question because, of course, you've got the long coaching tenure. Have you had a player coming back from this specific injury, a severe turf toe injury that required a surgical intervention? I think that it's not super common as far as what I could find that the turf toe requires surgery. And so I was wondering if you had firsthand experience. You know what? I've been a part of a lot of guys that have had turf toe.

And without the surgery, it's troublesome enough. You know, they build up their shoes. They do things for them where they don't injure it any further. But they're a step slow. You know, they're not quite as fluid as they were before. So that's where my hesitancy comes in. And, you know, you have one of the best on the planet. What are the risk rewards?

Yeah. One week. We're talking one week. It's a big week. It's time the rest of that football team. Those other 52 get themselves cranks. up because you know what you don't want to put that kid in harm's way he is the Cincinnati Bengals and just another unique injury in Joe Burroughs young career if he does return on

Sunday against the New England Patriots he will not have his number one pun intended on the field. Jamar chase has been suspended should he remain a team captain and that's not just talking about this season we will get into that conversation next right here on bangles squad This episode of Bangal Squad is brought to you by Price Picks. You and I make decisions every day. But when it comes to Price Picks, being right, excuse me, can get you paid. Don't miss any of the excitement of this sports season, whether you're following the NFL, NBA, or if you're like me, both.

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first $5 lineup. Price Picks, it's good to be right. Don't forget to check out Lockdown, Monday with Jake and James Rupin as they break down Sunday's game against the New England Patriots. Jake and James co-host Lockdown Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast, part of the lockdown podcast network. Now the number one sports podcast network in America and the World Bengals squad. If you're new to this show, happy to have you with us. It's a twice a week long-form conversational supplement show to lockdown Bengals hosted by me, Alex Frank, alongside Jake Lisco, and our Valero during the week. hopefully James will be able to join us midweek during the season.

Hopefully when we get to the off season, he's a big draft guy, by the way, so that will be fun to have him on. Mike Santagana will join me and Art immediately following every Bengals game on our Bengals squad post-game shows. All right, Jamar Chase has been suspended. I don't think any of us are shocked by that, given his actions on Sunday, spinning in the face of Jalen Ramsey. He appealed his suspension.

It was upheld. Jake and Ard, what does this mean for the Bengals offense? But more importantly, and Art, you talked about this on Sunday. What does it mean for Chase as a leader and a captain on this Bengals team? And here's the thing that I'm wondering. If the Bengals do make a coaching change, if they move on from Zach Taylor, the new regime that comes in, does Chase still automatically retain his captaincy next season? It depends on how the new regime hypothetically runs.

I believe that they are player voted for the Cincinnati Bengals. And I don't think that there will be much of a change in Jamar Chase, the status from this year to the next. I did want to get to a couple of things real quick as I'm watching the Twitter feed live as we're recording here. And we're live streaming as well for those of you that are with us. You may have seen this, but Joe Burrow again goes full on Thursday. So listed as a full participant in practice on Thursday.

and Joe Flacco once again limited dealing with the AC joint sprain in that shoulder. So another day that Burroughs listed full when reporters were there again, he was observed taking staffs with Ted Carrey's while Flacco was working with Lucas Patrick, who's backing up Ted Harris at center, working with his own calf injury that he's been dealing with all season, really. And just to put a bow in that conversation, I know you asked me about to Mark Chase, but with this news, I just wanted to make sure we hit it since we're live. The other thing to keep in mind, I mentioned that Thursday game the following week, and I think it was Joe Reedy, who's covered this team on and off for a long time,

made a good point that since that practice week leading into Thursday night football game is light, this could be just preparation to get them ready for Thursday night next week, because this is the time when they're doing a regular week of practice, regular team drills, regular 7-on-7-11-on-11 work. And this is it for the heavy work. Friday is going to be a lighter day, more of a walk-through day for this team. That's how Zach Taylor's always done it. And that's what they'll do leading into that Thursday night game too.

So this could be this Wednesday- Thursday period where Burroughs gone full both days. There's a lot of smoke and a lot of speculation that he well returned against the New England Patriots. But it could be. It's always possible that this is the best preparation opportunity for Joe for the, for the the game in week 13 against the Ravens. So it's always possible just to throw that out there. But it's certainly a downer, I guess, for lack of a better word, that Jamar Chase won't be there this week.

Regardless of who's playing quarterback, just how important he is to the offense in a game where you probably are going to have to match pace with one of the better offenses in the NFL, with one of the worst defenses in the NFL, looks like it's going to be a game that requires a shootout. And not having Jamar Chase obviously makes that job harder. But as far as his long-term status as a leader of the football team,

I think Zach Taylor succinctly discussed this with the media on Monday that, yeah, it's a mistake. Players make mistakes. This is the most severe injury ever, or sorry, most severe penalty ever handed out by the NFL for a spitting incident. There is a long history, unfortunately, of spitting incidents in the NFL. By far, the biggest financial penalty in the first full game suspension, technically ever, where Jalen Carter was retroactive.

suspended earlier this year, setting the precedent for Jamar Chase. The NFL decided, ah, you miss that game. That'll be your suspension. Time served. Jamar Chase, of course, now the unfortunate recipient of that full game suspension and losing out on, I think, like, 10 times as much money as the next biggest fine for this sort of thing because he misses a game check. Art, you touched on this a lot on our Sunday show.

Jamar Chase is kind of staying in his lane, lack thereof. now that he's been suspended, having seen the video that our good friend from Fox 19 here in Cincinnati, Austin Brinsky tweeted out, he was at Pittsburgh, caught the spitting incident live on his camera. When Chase now is suspended, what does that say to you about where the season is gone, Chase's leadership, his captaincy, and where that stands as we go into a very tumultuous week for the Cincinnati Bengals? Well, I tell you what, I think it goes back to OTAs and mini-camp and then to training camp. I think those words that come out of Zach Taylor's mouth of how we're going to respond, what the rules are of this football team. And then when he announced the captains that were probably, and I'd say 100%, they were voted by the team, you know, that wasn't necessarily.

a popularity vote. They really felt that. But I think with Jamar's comments about staying in his own lane, you knew right away his frustration level was outstanding, even though offensively

they were playing well. His ability to prepare for the game and to go about his business, he was all in, full speed going, but you could see the frustration growing. And then when it happened on Sunday, it's like, okay, that's where you want. And basically him and the Karras are the only captains on the field at the time.

And he gets frustrated and goes off and does what he does. I think it goes. And like I talked about earlier, it goes back to what Zach Taylor told the team, how we are going to respond. So I I think the onus right now is on what does Zach Taylor do? I heard him Monday. I heard that very short postgame interview, and I heard him on Monday in his regular interview, telling how great Jamar Chase is. There's no doubt he's great. He's a great player, great human, great person.

Okay, what are you going to do about it? You just brush it under the rug? He got 52 other eyes in there that are watching him and watching what he's. does. Now, if they take that away, not permanently, but you have to earn it back, because that is a earned position to be a captain on football team. And if the team's got any guts about them, they'll agree with and say, hey, you know what, take it away for a couple weeks. He'll come back, light it up against Baltimore. Shoot, here you go. You're a captain again. Because you handled yourself the right way.

And before you lose that locker room, you've got to realize that the eyes are on the head coach. And what he does and what he's done to the disciplinary part of it. I like that you went that direction with Zach Taylor. Because this is after Logan Wilson was traded after he was benched. And again, I agree with him defending Jamar Chase. He's a star player who acted way out of line. Selfishly. Yes, correct, very selfishly.

This also isn't the first time he's done something. Not spitting, but he has had outbursts and unsportsman-like conduct penalties on the field before. So now you're a team that's sitting at three and seven. This was a point that was brought up on Cincinnati Sports Talk. Mo Eager brought this up on ESPN, 1530 in Cincinnati earlier this week. This is the first time where Jamar Chase, as far back as I can remember, his college career and his career with the Bengals, has not been winning, has not been on a winning team.

Now, Ari, what John Gruden was the head coach of the Buccaneers. 2002, you guys win the Super Bowl. You're on top of the world. Next two years, kind of lean. get back to the playoffs until 2005. 2006, you guys were only four and 12. You went back to the playoffs in 2007. But when you're going through lean years, after you've built something that seemed really good as far as locker room culture, how hard is it for a head coach and his messaging to get across to the players, especially in a situation like this? Well, you know what? One one comment

that John always used to make. He said that every doctor, got a leash. The good ones got a little longer leash. All right. But with that being said, and that's true. You know, your great players, you want to see them play. You're going to give them the benefit of the doubt. But I think the things that probably happened was this week, Jamar came in to a team meeting and apologized. You don't, he apologized to his teammates, right, which is part of it, which is part of, you know, saying, I'm not special, even though he is, one of you. And it would have been great at that time. And you never know. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors, whether he gave it up for a week. Let me earn it back. Let me show you

what kind of character I have. Or that might already been done. But that's why I say, and I, believe me, you guys have realized that over the last week and a half, I don't dog coaches. But this is not about dog and a coach. This is the environment that you create. And this is how you build your team. There are rules. There are things you do when you walk through those doors. When you represent, you put that tiger striped helmet on,

there are things we operate with. And if they haven't been done, then that's a mistake by the coaching staff early. And you all have to be on the same page. and you want the players to be because the players play, which is awesome. But the coach is coach. And you've got to coach discipline. You got to coach, you know, effort.

You got to coach caring. You got to coach it all to try to get them out of this funk that they are in. And I tell you what, just that little bit would go a long way, a long way. Jake, you've been in training camp the last several years. Has that tailored to you? become a little arrogant, so rigid in what he did in his first few seasons that he thinks it's going to continue to work. Has that come across to you about Zach Taylor when you've been here at training camp preparing for this season? I think there have been small differences every year.

I think they've been pretty open to change. I don't think there is a significant amount of arrogance to Zach Taylor. I think if you were going to point to an area where you could make that argument in the first place. You can say, well, maybe he should have given up play calling in a couple of instances to focus on all the things in terms of game day administration that a head coach is required to do that seem to sometimes be issues for the Bengals, as far as getting plays in in a timely fashion, especially in moments where there's some uncertainty, for example, like the chains move or don't move when you expect them to move, and Zach Taylor's calling a first and 10 play, but actually it's third and one. And then they have to scramble to fix their

their play call and then end up having to take some time out. So like there are some things like that that have been frustrating that I think are reasonable enough arguments to say that maybe some of these division of labor changes should happen. But I think that Taylor generally speaking has been a very adaptable coach in his time with Cincinnati. I think that is one of his general strengths. And I don't necessarily think that he's one of the best coaches in the NFL at this point.

I think it's kind of hard to make that argument. But I think that his ability to adapt. and change things over time and openness to information and ability to try to learn from mistakes. Sometimes it takes longer than we want. But I think he's relatively good at those things. I wouldn't say that there's a ton of arrogance when it comes to Zach Taylor in really any way, shape, or form. It goes back to a point that I've made continuously about Zach Taylor and this Bengals team and the last three Bengals teams, truthfully, since the AFC championship run in 2022.

Good organizations continue to do what makes them good. But also, they have to evolve. You look at what the Eagles, the Rams, the Chiefs, even the 49ers, despite being 0 and 3 in the Super Bowl since 2012. Those organizations have evolved over time. The Bengals, unfortunately, have not, and it is now led to where they are right now at 3 and 7. Speaking of not evolving, speaking of

leadership. Speaking of long leashes, for some reason, Gino Stone has way too long of a leash. We're going to get into, I see Archie perked up there. We're going to get into why that is because the Bengals defense doesn't have any leaders. And is there truth to the accusation that they just don't care? We'll discuss this strong claim. Next on Bengals Squad. This episode of Bengals Squad is brought to you by game time. The NFL season is back. And honestly, there's nothing better. than being in the stadium surrounded by fans cheering on your team, even when they're three and seven.

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Arnold, turn to you first. Is it easy or hard to tell if players are playing like they don't care? Very easy. very easy and the bad thing about that is they are subject to injury when they're not um we always use to say you know what you look at it especially when teams are struggling who's give a crap meter is up or down or is it just hovering and you know what i did a deep dive into the defensive side of the ball this past week, just studying it. And the amount of mistackles, the amount of, I'll give you a very clear example,

the last touchdown that Pittsburgh had, linebackers out in the flat, his head's on the wrong side, and he bangs the running back as he goes into the end zone and where he could have tackled him. You know, granted, games over, doesn't. the whole deal. Is football, do you love football or do you like football and what it gives you? That's where you start to question that. And talking about the one young man that, I mean, it's very hard to see how hard you are going

and how hard you are playing. I watched Miles Murphy a lot last week. and I see him his energy was great. I mean, he had speed. He was running into the football. He was doing it. And there were a lot of members of that team that were. But then there were other guys that you didn't see,

their urgency to get there wasn't quite the same. And you really questioned that. I know it's being pointed out, you know, in their position meetings. I know it's been pointed out in probably, and hopefully the team meeting. that that's not what we do. That's not who we are.

And if we always used to say this, that if someone shows you who they are, you need to believe them because they're not lying to you. And it is a physical game with physical people. And you can, I mean, you as a coach said, well, you know what, you kind of walk through at this point. Why?

I don't know. That's up to you. And again, you either can't. or you won't. And it basically comes down to that. And then people have to make the decision after that, whether they still want you around or whether it's time to, hey, let's try somebody else.

Can it be any worse? We don't know. Can it be any worse than Gino Stone? Jake Liscoe, like, should Dejohn Anthony, should Tyson Anderson, should somebody besides Gino Stone be starting at that position for the Cincinnati Bengals? I mean, you might as well try something, right? Hard to make an argument to the contrary at this point.

I don't know what Gino Stone's doing to remain on the field. I think that there is some lack of belief in the alternatives, which is an indictment on the front office or the front office and the coaching staff not being on the same page, as far as the front office, perhaps liking some of the depth options, more than the coaching staff does. Maybe Dejan Anthony is the answer as he, I think, was full for the second straight day trying to come back from the IR himself. but you're talking about a late day three pick at this point.

So it's not like you're talking about some excellent alternatives or veterans that have been around and are now backups late in their careers, but at least they're going to be in the right place at the right time. I hear Art saying that there are players on this defense, you know, that the canter won't. And it's certainly one of those two things for a lot of these guys. You dove into the tape this week are the very first touchdown of the game. You referenced the last touchdown of the game. The one that got me the most as I was rewatching things.

And even as I was watching live was, the first touchdown of the game is just fast to the flat. And Barrett Carter reacts on that play, as if there's play action, there's nothing resembling a play action fake. He takes a step up like there's play action. And it's not like there's a wash. Like the way that he ends up behind the runner,

there's hesitation when he gets to the point where he starts to break down. He's taking a bad angle. But it looks like he's trying to get through mesh. like trying to get through traffic on a mesh play, and instead he's just late to the flat. That sort of thing is what gets me in the Cantor Woh. There's some won't, I think, on this defense, and that's its own problem.

But there's also some, the game is moving too fast and I'm drowning. And I don't think I can right now if I'm talking about some of these guys. And that play was particularly emblematic to me of what we've seen from the green dot on this defense, the rookie linebacker Barrett Carter. But it's not like it was just him. I mean, you had the veteran Oren Burks on a super, you know, fresh off a Super Bowl run missing tackles himself. I thought it was a little bit better for Demetrius Knight this week in a smaller role.

But when you have that combination of some guys that won't and some guys that can't or apparently can't at the moment anyway, I think you get some of what we're seeing now. I really struggle with that first touchdown, though. What were your thoughts as you watched 49 on that first touchdown where, It looks like, like I said, it looks like he's reacting to play action that's not even close to present on that play. Well, he did have that deer in the headlights look a little bit. And I think that especially with those young kids, it has not slowed down enough for them. Even though they're playing and even though they're practicing, practice speed, game speed, two totally different things.

And, you know, it looked like it. And I only threw, I threw the one out on the goal line only because I wanted to share the love. as a linebacker and not a secondary guy. So it's that way all the way around. But there are some kids that are playing extremely hard, hustled under the ball, doing all those things. But, you know, as I watched all the run plays, there are a lot of those linebackers and safeties

that are not a part of the run fit. They're out of position. They jump a gap. They do some, and now that's big plays. And now the bad thing about it is they're going against the Penns-First Steelers, which a quarterback can't. run. Oh, he's 40-some years old. Now they've got Lamar Jackson staring them in the face.

Now you've got not only the runoffbacks, you've got that quarterback who can also run. You better be on it because he is still one of the most dangerous guys out there. You know, even with injury, he could be. And when it comes to guys that just simply can't make plays, the guys that won't make plays and Ard you alluded to it earlier, you can clearly see it with guys like Gino Stone. I mean, you can, Jake, you remember this. You go back last year to the Thursday night game at Baltimore where he doesn't even attempt to tackle Tyler and Wallace on that catch and run 84-yard touchdown where he literally caught the ball just at the first down marker, deep in the Ravens zone territory, and then just race down the sideline where all you have to do is

literally shove him out of bounds and you make the Ravens run another play or several more. But with the guys that can't, like Barrett Carter. And this goes back to where the Bengals on defense And this, again, is the message that has been sent by Zach Taylor and the organization, where they traded away Logan Wilson, who was more than just a really good player. You can, I mean, we can talk about if he wasn't that great this season, fine. But at the end of the day, he had played really good football at several points in his career, including in 2021 of the playoffs, including in 2022 and 23, for that matter. But you trade him away.

So now all of a sudden, where a guy like Barrett Carter is struggling or Demetrius Knight or name me, Shamar Stewart, name me anybody. There's no one in that film room, and I've had this conversation with several people this week, and I've thought about this too. There's no one in that meeting room to say, hey, this isn't right. This is what you should be doing.

Or you had turnover on your defenses in Tampa Bay. But, and I'm about to name some of the greatest defensive players of this century, when you had guys like Derek Brooks or Warren Sapp, or John Lynch, or Ronde Barber, Spoiler alert, fun fact, they're all four Hall of Famers, pro football Hall of Famers. How important was it to have those guys in the room for younger defensive players to learn from and say, this is how you play defense? It won us a Super Bowl.

It can win us a Super Bowl again. How important is it to have those guys in the room? Oh, it is so valuable. I'm telling you what, not only you have to worry about the defense, you didn't have to worry about the locker room in general. And I can tell you, there's some crazy stories about when Keish is. Sean was in our locker room and Warren were in our locker room. And they used to, and my office was literally right across from the locker room. So I heard it all.

And those guys kept it clean. They taught each new member, each new member that came on into that team structure, how to respond, how to behave, how to work, how to do, watch film, everything. And it was invaluable. That's why leadership is so important. I do know this, that they would have, there was a code that was established in the D-Ly meeting room. And between Warren and Anthony McFarland, Booger McFarland, everybody knows he hasn't, Greg Spires, Simeon Rice, there was a way they conducted themselves. And then you didn't have to look very far.

was right next door was Derek Brooks, Shilden Coralz, Al Singleton, they held themselves to a standard. And then in the back edge, between Ronde, Brian, Kelly, you know, whomever was at the free,

Dexter Jackson, Dwight, you know, Dwight and John Lynch, leadership, because they had been through the tough times. They knew it. And so you didn't have to worry about it. And those veterans, and I think I talked about a little bit after the game, why get rid of a Logan trading?

When you're young guys, you leave no older player to teach them how to watch film, to how to take notes. Those things are invaluable. And it's really, it's disappointing that all those veterans, because we talked about it last week. Hey, on offense, your two big veterans or two of your five, I guess, leaders were on IR. They're not playing. They're not even practicing. And so it's kind of hard for them to bring it out of everybody else and tell them, hey, this is what we do.

This is who we are. Jake, when you were at training camp this summer, and obviously Sam Hubbard retired back in the spring, Trey Hendrickson was in a contractor dispute then. he's injured now. Could you sense in the locker room a lack of leadership when it comes to this defense with all the young guys that still need development or haven't been developed? Could you sense that when you were here? I think there was definitely a question as to who was going to be the next generation of leaders. And I think that that question has persisted into the season. I think that question existed a little bit last year too. But yeah, I think that since they lost much of that

core and Duke Tobin admitted to holding on to them too long in the first place. But since they lost a lot of that Super Bowl defensive core, the DJ readers, the Jesse Bates, the Mike Hilton's, the, like you said, Sam Hubbard, who was the leader in that locker room. Since those guys left, yeah, there's a void and they're trying to figure out who that next generation of leader is going to be. But as we've discussed, what makes it hard is you not only have to be one of the guys that does everything the right way, you also have to be one of the guys that does everything the right way. you also have to be producing.

You also have to be one of the better players on your team. For the most part, to earn that kind of respect from your teammates, you look at who the Bengals captains have been over the last several years. They've all been guys that have earned that respect from their teammates, and it's a combination of leadership ability and football ability. And right now, the Bengals just don't have those guys, and that's been the same story, unfortunately, all season luck. Look, you bet on development, you bet on the draft.

if you weren't going to re-sign Jesse Bates, which at the time, I try to justify it as, okay, that's going to be money towards Joe Burrow, Chimar Chase, and T. Higgins. And yes, all three of those guys have their long-term extensions, and that's great. But if you're going to rely on the turnover to the next generation of leaders, you better be able to draft and develop. And unfortunately, argue, go back to it earlier. The can't and won't, the love of the game,

just guys that like football and what it gives them. Unfortunately, this generation is not what is Jake, you were just alluding to Mike Hilton, who came, when he came over from Pittsburgh, Jake, I'm sure you remember this. He had that whole system of fines where if he caught a guy loaf in or if they dropped the interception,

they would have to put a fine in the bucket during training camp. But that's secondary, Chris Collinsworth in the Super Bowl on NBC called it Second Chance You, because you thought about other guys like Eli Apple kind of revived himself. Chinobe Abusee. Chinobe Muzier and Mike Hilton per pro football focus were the NFL's top rated corner duo. And now it's like everywhere on this defense, there are holes. And then the leaders, one's gone, one's injured, one's retired. And again, it just goes back to the development.

We got one segment left here coming up on Bengals squad. So my watch says 4-49 on this Thursday, November 20th, 2025. But the New England Patriots, I think they turned back the clock a little bit to 2003, 2004, a little bit. Breaking news, they're coming to Cincinnati this week to play the Bengals. They're nine and two. They've won eight straight games. So how have they gotten back to the AFC? The top of it so quickly, Art will explain what the film shows.

And Jake will tell us what is the biggest concern for this game, even with Joe Borough playing. And if that could cause this game to get out of hand. We'll discuss that next right here on Bengals Squad. Sunday after the Bengals take on the Patriots, join me, Art and Mike Santagina live for Bengals Postgame show right here on the locked on Bengals YouTube channel that Monday morning. Check out James and Jake Liscoe as they break down Sunday's game with the Bengals playing next Thursday on Thanksgiving night.

Stay tuned for more details on when Bengals squad will be airing live on the lockdown Bengals YouTube channel. Back to this edition of the show, the New England Patriots, 9 and 2 tied for the best record in It did not take them long to get back to the top of the AFC. Or what stands out about the Patriots, particularly when you watch second year quarterback MVP caliber, Drake May. Does this Patriots team resemble the great teams of the 2000s and the 2010s when you watch them on film? You know what really does. They have a system on offense that they know is proven.

And they just plug this young man into. and they've got a play caller who has a great feel for his team. And so he's not asking them to do things that they cannot do, but that they can do, but to execute. And that each drive, you know, is as important as a scoring drive. And we need to get points. And that's the on offense. You know, and they've got some good player.

I mean, that left tackle, that young kid is, he is going to be around for a long, long, long time. And, you know, call it about evaluation, call it whatever they did. But they've assembled a pretty good football team. And where there were holes, they put it together. Now, on the defensive side of the ball, they've got great momentum. They are hustling to the ball. They are flying around. They have lit their hair on fire.

And they're causing a wreck. wherever they have. And you know what? They've got momentum on their side. And so they've kind of settled into their identity where a lot of teams that are still trying to search for that identity. Who are we? And those are the teams that are struggling where all of a sudden, and I think a lot of that we talked about it right after the game. Hey, Mike Brable, he knows the Patriot way. And he knows what was in that building. And you have to remember, before he came in, It was only a one year turnaround. So a lot of those guys that are in that building remember the Patriot way of how Bill had it before he was let go.

So it's like, okay, I just took a shower. Well, now what I do, I dry off. There are manners of which they go and how they prepare that is exactly the same as what they used to do when they had success. And that didn't change. So your 2005 book and yours, Team, Jake, I'll get. you in just a second. Your 2005 team played against the Patriots in week 15. I won't mention the final score. I'm sure you don't like remembering that game. It was a Saturday afternoon game. It was on Fox. It was a nationally televised game. When you were preparing for that game and you

saw Mike Vrable, then a Patriots linebacker on film, your first thought was what? Wow. Is he long? Because you've got to remember him and Willie McGinnis were the same outside linebackers. And they were extremely long, hard for tight ends, hard for tackles, hard for backs, because their arm length was so long, hard to get into it. And then as you watched him, he was always talking, not chirping, but talking to one of the other players. So you had not only a great leader, you had additionally another coach in the middle of the action. you know, making sure that run fits were right, making sure that everybody were on cue.

Now, once the offensive got down, you didn't want him on it, because he was a tight end on the goal line, and he always scored. It was like, wow, you talk about benefit to a program? Is this guy that's not, I mean, he's unwilling to sit out? He wants to play. And I think that was part of Mike's building.

up and you know what, I guarantee you the Titans wish they had him back. I don't blame them. I don't blame they do. You've mentioned several times. You mentioned last week on Sunday and today, how much this Patriots team takes after Mike Vrable, both the head coach and the player. He understands the Patriot way. Jake, when you watch the New England Patriots, they won last Thursday night against the Jets,

28 to 14. They've won eight straight games. They have a win over the Buffalo Bills on Sunday night football back in week five. What concerns you the most about the Patriots where this game, even with Joe Burrow, it could get really out of hand on Sunday. I just don't have much faith that the defense is going to be able to stop Drake May and the weapons. I mean, they go deep and Drake May is making them look good. Drake May has some Joe Burrow in him in terms of the way that he is able to escape pressure in the pocket, keep his eyes downfield and be a playmaker on second reaction plays.

And while I like a couple of the players in the secondary, the safeties, well, Not very safe back there. In this one, the Patriots, the most vertical offense, I think, in the NFL, maybe outside of Seattle and San Darnold. The further that Drake May pushes a ball down field, the more successful the Patriots have been. And Stefan Diggs in the slot going to be a great matchup for Daxhill, a great challenge, I should say, for Daxhill. Kachshon Booty contributing to Mario Douglas contributing.

You go up and down this roster. They're too deep at tight end that can contribute. Trayvion Henderson's figuring some things out. They'll go fullback. they'll go 12 personnel, they'll go 11 personnel, very personal diverse, just a significant challenge to me for this Bengals defense. And we've seen this Bengals defense give it up to much, much worse offenses this year. I don't see how or why that changes this week. Would love to be wrong about that and see them figure something out against this offense that I think is significantly better.

But the one thing I would say is this is, I believe, the last time I looked, the highest overrunner in the league this week, according to the vagus books. not that that necessarily means anything, but the Patriot defense, despite being, I think, the second best scoring defense in the AFC, maybe a little bit overrated. And I think that they'll probably still give the Bengals problems the way this season is going. Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying this to talk a bunch of smack. But here are the quality wins for the Patriots this year against teams that I think are like reasonably sniffing the playoffs. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers in Tampa, good win, 2823.

And you go back to that Bill's game in Buffalo. Again, two great wins in Buffalo, 23 to 20. Outside of that, they've played the Raiders, the dolphins, the Steelers, the Panthers, the Saints, the Titans, the Browns, the Falcons, and the Jets. Out of those teams, that's eight teams. That's seven of the worst teams in the NFL. The Bengals might make it eight this week and the Steelers, who are not a good offense. They gave up 21 points and a loss of the Steelers back in week three, and they haven't lost

since. They haven't lost since, and they do have a couple of good wins in there. Don't get me wrong, that Bill's win, that Buccaneers win, both of those on the road, good wins. But forgive me for not being too impressed by an early season victory over the Panthers, a victory over the Saints, the Titans, the Browns, and the Falcons, and the Jets. All right. Maybe couldn't win those games, but a halfway decent team certainly could and the Patriots half. You know what, though, that is not their fault.

No, I'm not blaming them for it. I'm just saying. got a losing, they had a losing team that that's where the NFL's scheduling came into play. All you can do is play the team. All you can do is play the team across. You know what? You got to win the ones you're supposed to win and you at least split the ones you shouldn't win and you got yourself a good football team. And they seem to be tying it together. No doubt. You can only play the teams across from you. I'm just saying that I would give the Bengals a better shot at moving the ball and being a little bit more consistent on offense. than some of these other teams that the Patriots have given up only 206 points this year playing against

because those are some really bad offense and some really bad quarterbacks, some really bad situations that have been on the other side of this Patriots defense this year. Even without Jemar Chase, there are still enough weapons on this offense to move the ball. And Joe Flacco understands that being going to be starting. By the way, when Joe Burrow has played in games without Jemar Chase, his record is three and one. I was back in that 22 season, Smasha P. Ryan, Renn, one of the likes of those guys. When I look at this Patriots defense, Robert Spillane, Christian Ellis, Marcus Jones, Christian Gonzalez, Carlton Davis, Harold Landry, Milton Williams. A lot of guys are that they went after in free agency.

And I remember being in Tampa, Florida in the spring when I was at a Yankee spring training game. And I kept getting notifications, the Patriots signed Milton Williams, the Patriots signed Carlton Davis, the Patriots signed this. And I kept thinking to myself, this is exactly who the Patriots are. They don't care if other people say, oh, well, what's this sign you going to do? Well, you know what's going to do? It's going to beef up the trenches. It's going to beef up areas where they know they have to be better. And so far this season, it has been, the results have been there.

Were you shocked when the Patriots made the moves in free agency that they did? Was I shocked? No, you're building a team around a rookie quarterback. The Bengals said the same thing. If you have a rookie quarterback contract, you go make splashes in free agency. What's surprising is a level of play, and this is where you certainly credit the New England Patriots defensive coaching staff. Robert Spillane having a career season for them at linebacker,

Jalen Hawkins having a career season for the Patriots of safety. And even with Milton Williams on IR, and that's their big fish signing in free agency, you're getting Corey Durdin, who I guarantee you most of our listeners have not heard of, taking this massive step, highest pass rush win rate on the New England Patriots, this guy coming off the bench spelling Milton Williams, who's on the IR. And he's been on three teams in three years. So I've drafted a free agent has bounced around the NFL and suddenly has been a really good pass rusher for this New England Patriots defense.

So you certainly credit the coaching staff there for getting the most out of some of these guys. And putting together a competent group on that side of the field has had an opportunity to build confidence all season one. Are you surprised that these were the moves they made in the offseason? Because it's clearly led them to the back to back to the top of the AFC in just one season. Oh, no. You know, that's kind of been the Patriots way of doing things.

You know, they built up a lot of draft equity, you know, through all the deals that they'd made in the past. So they knew they were going to go out and get some young kids. But where are the holes? Where do you always need? What can we do to be competitive? And then they would go sign those free agents. And they really did a good job of each year evaluating their own people to say, well, you know what? Because that's the way that Belichick did it was he was not.

never had emotional ties to his veterans. He would cut them loose before he'd sign him to a multi-year contract and let them fall apart someplace else where he would find a junior sale, bring him in, let him play a year, great leader, had one year left in him, do it, survive with it, Cory Dillon, there's another one. Somebody else is garbage. Bring him in, let him flourish, And he was only one year oriented because he knew that what was important now was today. It's a great point. And I'm looking at the Patriots coaching staff right now and some of the names that are on there. You just understand why they have been so good this year turnaround. It's because of the veteran coaches on the staff.

Mike Rable, Josh McDaniels, Terrell Williams, their defensive coordinator, or Doug Morel and their offensive line coach, Ben McAdoo even, is a senior defensive assistant. He's been around for a long time. So you understand why the Patriots are where they are right now. There is veteran leadership on that team for as young as it still is. Real quick, Jake and our, let's get some score predictions. Jake, I know you're not in the predicting, but as you can give one if you want, you can also say what you think this game comes down to. Score predictions or what this game comes down to on Sunday.

Jake will start with you. Yeah, I mean, I again, I'm not going to do predictions, but I'll say that I think the Bengals' best path to victory in this game probably once again comes down to can the defense steal a couple because I once again, and they exceeded my expectations in the first half. against the Steelers did this defense and the pressure they got to Aaron Rogers really disrupting things for that Steelers offense. But again, I think it's a different beast this week with the Patriots at every single

spot on this Patriots offense. I think better than maybe 10 out of 11 spots on that Steelers offense. So a bigger challenge for the defense this week. And so to me, it's can they steal some possessions? Can they manage to cobble together some takeaways? Because that is the most unpredictable thing in football. that is the thing that can turn a game on its head. And I think that that is probably what the Bengals need to have a shot in this one.

R. What do you think? I totally agree with what Jake says. The one thing that is secure the football, win the turnover battle, go out there and play for 60 minutes, hard physical football, and score one more point than they do. And that's all you have to do because there are no ugly wins. A win is a win, and you can learn from that. You're learning a hell of a lot more from winning games than you are from, you know,

from losing them. So whoever scores one more point, we'll win it. Yeah, it's that simple. The problem for me is, gentlemen, I just can't get out of my head the vision of Trayvion Henderson shredding this defense. I mean, that's literally where I think this game is going to come down to. Drake May is he may only throw 25 passes in this game. I guarantee he completes at least 20 of them because the Patriots are just going to be systematic with their offense with Josh McDaniels.

I mean, with 10 days to prepare for this Bengals defense, I don't even want to. It's going to get, I think it's going to get real ugly, even if Joe Borough plays. I'm going to go 41, 27 because, I mean, I just, again, it's just I don't have much faith in this defense. So with that, let's on a quick. fun note here. Favorite week 12 game that isn't the Bengals versus the Patriots in the end of that would require me to have looked at the schedule outside of Bengals Patriots. And my job is to cover the Cincinnati Bengals and I have no idea who else is playing this week. Sorry, Alex. Oh, that's okay. That's okay. Argue Buccaneers are playing the Rams on Sunday

night football. That could be a very big game. I'm going Pittsburgh, Chicago. That is going to be a very interesting game, two teams that don't have a lot of, you know, flashy talent, but that have a lot of really good things that they do well on both sides of the ball. That'll be a very interesting matchup. Jake Lisco is at Jake Liscoe on Twitter. Art Valero is at Coach Art Valero on Twitter. I'm on Twitter of Frankie underscore Nadi. Don't forget tomorrow morning to check out Bengals, Lockdown Bengals, excuse me, with Jake and James or Pianas Day preview Sunday skim against the New England Patriots, Jake and James co-host Lockdown Bengals,

your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network. Now the number one sports podcast network in America and the world. Then check out Lockdown NFL for your second listener or watch. Again, Bengals squad is the supplement to lockdown Bengals, a twice a week long-form conversational show on the Bengals hosted by me, Alex Frank, alongside Jake Liscoe and Arifilera during the week. Hopefully James will be able to join us midweek during the season. Then once we have the offseason.

Mike Santag and I will join me and Art immediately following. every Bengals game. If you're in Cincinnati this week, the Bearcats take on, take the Hardwood tomorrow night, Friday to take on the number six Louisville Cardinals, Heritage Bank Center downtown right behind me, actually. Senior a night for football Saturday nights, the Bearcats host number 11, BYU. Check out Jeff Carr, and Lockdown Bearcats for All Things, Bearcats, and he also co-host Locked on Reds with Stephen Offen Baker. Art, you and I are back with Mike's antagonist Sunday afternoon,

immediately following the Bengals and the Patriots for a live post-game show, Jake, you're with James. and Monday morning as you guys will break down the Bengals and the Patriots on lockdown Bengals. For Jake Lisco at Jake Lisco and Art Valero at Coach Arvallero. I'm Alex Frank at Frankie underscore Natty. Thanks for listening to this edition of Bengals Squad or watching this edition of Bengals Squad. It is part of lockdown Bengals and the lockdown podcast network. Now the number one sports podcast network in America and the world.

Have a great Thursday night and a great start to your weekend. We'll talk to you Sunday afternoon right here on Bengals Squad.