Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Cordell Volson's injury exposes the Bengals' depth issue at guard | Plus, defense holding back?

Starting point is 00:00:00 Cordell Volson is out for the year and the Bengals need at guard is just underlined by Cordell's impending absence. You are locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. What on Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Locked on Bengals podcast. Part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. I'm Jake, let's go. He's James Rapina. We've been covering your Cincinnati.

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Starting point is 00:01:02 routine and get a shout out from us at the beginning of every episode. Shout out to you. every day and all of you who make us your first listen. James, as the Bengals reconvened after their second preseason game for a practice on Wednesday, Zach Taylor addressed to media. We got a lot of injury updates. We got to see participation. It was a very light practice on Wednesday.

Starting point is 00:01:26 And there's this recurring theme that the defense is holding back. And we're going to touch on that a little bit later in the show. But we start with the news that I think the Bengals, have known for a few days now, at least, that Cordell-Voson very likely out for the year he needs surgery to fix whatever went wrong with his shoulder when he injured it in practice last week. Well, it sucks. It sucks. It's awful news. It's awful news for Cordell. It's awful news for the Bengals. And he was having a good camp. He really was. And at one point last week, it was like, ah, well, could 67 be the guy that's sneaking into the starting?

Starting point is 00:02:05 lineup. And I think that that would have been at least a discussion. And instead, you have a season ending injury. It's a contract year for Cordell. It's a year where I know personally he was hoping to prove himself. And no, we haven't talked a ton about him on this pod recently. But you're talking about a fourth round pick who made 48 starts, appeared in 50 out of a possible 51 regular season games in his first three seasons. That's a pretty darn good fourth round pick. And you might say, ah, well, he didn't develop the way you hoped, fine. But he has helped.

Starting point is 00:02:47 Might not have developed and hit what some hoped. And maybe he's not going to be a 10-year vet for the Bengals. But, yeah, it's just, it's unfortunate. And it really exposes the need there because you're talking about someone who was getting regular reps at both left and right guard. someone that you could feel comfortable with on game day if he needed to go in there, whether he was starting or not, you're comfortable with 67 going out there. And so to lose him for the season, it is a significant loss.

Starting point is 00:03:16 There's no doubt. It's part of football. I'm not saying they can't overcome it. Of course they can. But it is a significant loss. And it shouldn't be just glossed over because it's Cordell Wilson because I think some will do that. But it's going to impact things for sure. I think that it goes hand in hand with the Reisner.

Starting point is 00:03:34 visit, it reinforces the need to get Reisner onto the roster because of Risner is on the roster and he's competing to start a right guard and beats out Lucas Patrick for that job hypothetically. In that hypothetical world, Lucas Patrick is a backup with Jalen Rivers and maybe Matt Lee sticks at center and then you actually feel reasonable about your interior offensive line depth. Cody Ford can be your swing tackle in that scenario. He doesn't have to be the first guy off the bench at every single position. And then there's less of a role for Cordell-Vosson, hypothetically, if Jalen Rivers is

Starting point is 00:04:09 progressing the way they want him to, if Lucas Patrick kicks back to be the first guy off the bench at a number of interior positions. But that's not the case right now and kind of underlines where they are in terms of interior depth. Everyone is pleased with what Dylan Fairchild has done as a rookie this preseason. There's no real concerns about Ted Karris. Maybe we'll get to see some Matt Lee in this third preseason game and we'll feel better about backup center. But with Lucas Patrick dealing with some sort of injury, it sounds like it's not as as severe as it might have been as they feared it was, said Zach Taylor on Wednesday, referring to the injury that Patrick sustained on Monday night.

Starting point is 00:04:48 And with Cody Ford still not practicing, that means Jalen Rivers, which was the ones in a very light practice on Wednesday. And behind him is question mark, question mark, question mark. is maybe Jackson Kirkland is maybe Andrew Stuber, but there's really a lack of depth at that point and they're very banged up at the position, which while I don't know that I would have been, you know, thrilled if Cordell had won a starting job,

Starting point is 00:05:20 it tells you about where they were with that room in general that they were potentially considering letting him enter that battle. And that battle has been severely derailed all summer by guys that have just been too injured to compete fully. And that's a huge factor of this is the health. You're right. Lucas Patrick has been nicked up multiple times now. Cordell Volson, the thing that he did best was stay durable

Starting point is 00:05:45 and be able to play through the pain and play through nicks and knacks and all these different things that come with being an offensive lineman. And that's why he was 50 out of 51 games, 48 starts out of possible 51 games. It's one of those things where, and this is why we've been harping for the everydayers or if you're new. We've talked about guard a ton this offseason. Why?

Starting point is 00:06:12 Because injuries are going to happen. And so if you're starting, if your best option, let's say is Lucas Patrick, or your best option is Cordell Wilson, or your best option is Cody Ford. Well, if that's your best option, well, that guy is going to get. nicked up and dinged they're hurt or his backup is and so your depth is going to really get tested it's going to get thin quick in the floor of your your offensive line is going to get much lower and that's it that's one of these where like i i don't really think there's a scenario where cordel volson was a pro bowler this year right but does the floor drop a bit without having someone that you

Starting point is 00:06:51 that knows what not just what to do but how to be available every single week and play at a reasonable level with Joe Burrow knows how to react when Joe Burrow goes off script, for example, which is something that we didn't see from Lucas Patrick the other night. Like little things like that go a long way when you're on the road in Buffalo in December and you need to get a win and you have a guard injury. And so, yeah, they have to. We were already on this before we knew for sure that Cordell was out for the season. you and I were both on the same page. It felt sort of significant.

Starting point is 00:07:26 I asked Zach about it because he went through all these injuries on Wednesday and we didn't get to Cordell yet. I'm like, ah, that's probably because he's not one of the minor ones. But they have to add now. They have to. And it doesn't honestly, one, they probably know that. But two, if it isn't Dalton Reisner, then it's got to be someone that you think you can play in a game.

Starting point is 00:07:48 That's what they need. And that's what they lost with Cornell Volson going out for the year. And it wouldn't necessarily be such a bad injury if they had gotten the deal done with Reisner. Then I would still feel fine about their interior depth, assuming Lucas Patrick was going to be healthy in a reasonable time frame. Cody Ford is day-to-day. It sounds like they're not worried about Cody Ford by the time the regular season rolls around. Then we'd be talking about tackle, and we'd be talking about looking for waiver claims as swing tackle, because right now Cody Ford is really the only option.

Starting point is 00:08:23 And I mean, we've talked about this many times on this podcast over the last couple of years. I think hypothetically, Cody Ford being a backup in multiple positions is fine. I think that I would rather have somebody else a little bit better in the tackle role specifically. And we haven't really talked a ton about the swing tackle spot because of the turmoil at guard and the injuries of guard and the performance issues at guard. and the plans to try all these different things, a guard throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. And then eventually we get the riser visit, and then he leaves time without a deal.

Starting point is 00:09:01 So we'll see how that shakes out. We've also talked about numerous other guard options. Shaq Mason, a James Rapine favorite. We talked about potentially the trade outlets. Bring them in. Shack attack. Jake, shack attack. Let's go.

Starting point is 00:09:17 Whatever. I'm not moved by it, but sure, like it's probably better than what they have for depth, right? So do literally anything remains the ask at the guard position to try to shore it up. As right now, behind the starters, which for now, I guess includes Lucas Patrick. It's Cody Ford and a bunch of question marks. And that's even if we'll leave a little bit in Jaylon Rivers. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:09:44 Yeah. And that's still a question mark. Like what you have to say, it's one thing to be like, oh, well, yeah, Jaylen Rivers. It's a whole other thing to be like, all right, well, Lucas, Patrick, or Jalen Rivers, go block Miles Garrett, week one. I mean, yeah, the difference is that Jalen Rivers right now is in a backup role and not like Cordell Voson thrust into a starting job right away, right? Sure. And that's totally fine with Jalen Rivers making the team and in going there. But yeah, it's, it's on, I'm uneasy. And hopefully the Bengals are uneasy enough to get a deal done, whether it is with Dalton Reisner. It still could be. Or someone,

Starting point is 00:10:20 else to bolster their offensive line. We'll cover the other injury updates. There's a lot of injuries to get to. We also have to get to the defense because they're just holding back, Jake. They're just holding back that coming up next. Oh yeah, that's me laughing. And this is brought to you, this video is brought to you by Fandul. Where Fandle, it's America's number one sportsbook. In August 26th, well, it's officially Fandle Futures Day. That's soon. It's really soon, less than a week away, a brand new holiday for football fans who live, for bold predictions and preseason hunches for just 24 hours. Fandall is giving you deals on NFL season predictions.

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Starting point is 00:11:16 well, then maybe those Super Bowl odds you feel a little bit better about them on Fandall. Visit the Fandall app today and start planning your future. Betts now because Futures Day is one day and one day only. Fandel, play your game. Whether or not they get a Shaq Mason in here, Dalton Reisner in here, Jake, they need to figure out the defensive issues. The issues that are pretty glaring. And yet everyone's like, oh, I feel pretty comfortable,

Starting point is 00:11:46 Zach Taylor saying how confident he is in the first team defense. They won't play against the Indianapolis Colts. Starters aren't going to play, which is fine. I do not want them to play the first. team defense against the Indianapolis Colts. That's a waste of everybody's time. But they've gotten gashed on the run a ton. They've given up four runs of 20 plus yards on what?

Starting point is 00:12:09 On four drives? I don't know. It's something crazy. It's too much. And yet they're like, yeah, we just haven't put all of our stuff in yet. We're just not using all of our stuff. You're buying this, you're buying this narrative that they're selling that, ah, the scheme, once we show our identity, things are going to get better.

Starting point is 00:12:28 Are you worried? Because I'm thinking about Joe Flacco, handed it off that Dylan Samson 52 times in week one, and Dylan Samson having a career day in his debut. Is that his name? Dylan Samson? I thought it was. From Tennessee? Is his name Dylan?

Starting point is 00:12:45 Yeah, Dylan Samson. All right. It's 20 years old. Am I buying it? A little bit, but not entirely. And we've talked about this a little bit. But the reason it's coming back up today is because it was numerous coaches and players talking about this on Wednesday. Because it was asked.

Starting point is 00:13:03 And Zach Taylor, Dan Horde directly asked Zach Taylor, like, hey, is it? Because you have a new DC and your defensive scheme has changed, are you holding back like even more than normal? And Zach's like, oh, yeah, of course. Like, as if it was the most matter of fact thing in the world that of course they're holding back more than they even normal. normally would in a preseason game. So that's the first bit that it was discussed on Wednesday. And then there's a video out there, Logan Wilson is locker after the practice. He's like, yeah, we're using maybe like 10, 15% of the playbook right now.

Starting point is 00:13:40 Yeah. Which sounds like a really, really small part of the playbook. He's like, yeah, we're just out there trying to get our fundamentals down. And we're, we're, yeah, I know. And we're, we've had. some good reps to learn from. And like, maybe the Browns are going to do some of these sorts of things to us in week one or whatever it is or Jacksonville is going to do some of these things to us

Starting point is 00:14:02 in week too. And, you know, you hear both sides of that, obviously. And then even the rookies from Mar Stewart's like, yeah, we're going to surprise people. We're not showing a whole lot. We have a lot of tricks up our sleeve, essentially. And so there's this recurring theme on Wednesday of guys from Zach Taylor to guys playing on the defense that are saying this. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:14:25 And then Logan's talking about working on the fundamentals. And I'm like, yeah, you got to work on those fundamentals, getting off blocks, getting guys into the right position and in the run fit. I don't know how much those things are scheme-based. I do think that there's like a game planning element here where like if they're truly going out there with 10 to 15 percent, they're like, okay, we're going to put Tampa 2, we're going to run cover 1, we're going to run cover 3. We're not going to disguise as much. We'll keep some of our twists and games on the defensive front.

Starting point is 00:14:54 front, but we're really going to keep it quite simple. You're not really game planning at that point. And nobody's really game planning for the preseason. So I think that can make a difference. But I also am not buying that like suddenly everything is going to be fine because the issues that we're seeing aren't we're running cover two and we're getting hit with a bunch of hole shots between the safety and the flat defender and teams just going to that time and time again because we're just running cover too.

Starting point is 00:15:21 Like it's not that simple. it's they are needing that fundamental work that Logan Wilson's talking about and we're not seeing that at a high level in the limited sample we've seen from the defense so there's probably a kernel of truth to it James but I'm not buying that that is the explanation for everything that we've seen from the defense no no and by the way it doesn't matter it doesn't matter it's preseason it's practice preseason games are practice in front of a lot of people in a game setting. It doesn't matter. No one's going to care if you get it fixed, but damn it better be fixed. That's what really matters. I don't care if they give up a thousand

Starting point is 00:16:02 yards in preseason. It really doesn't matter. This third preseason game, no one's going to care because none of the starters are playing. Fine. It's no different. In reality, it's no more meaningful or meaningless than any of the other preseason games. As long as you get out of them healthy, fine, but you better learn from whatever the hell was going on. Because the way to beat the Bengals, the easiest way, the quickest way, is to not let Joe Burrow touch the ball. So if you can just run it and run it and run it and run it and run it and you're getting explosive plays on it as well, that's tough.

Starting point is 00:16:40 And so, yeah, hopefully they're just not showing anything, but they also have to learn from it because technique-wise was not there. that like there's i don't need to keep talking about the jordan battle play but that that's one example in it's not just jordan battle there's multiple times you know that play keeps coming up because it's very obvious but like it's issues outside of those plays that are much more concerning to me than that individual rep as well like it's not just that that one's just very noticeable sure well it's the ones that are leading to these big runs become big runs when they should be three-yard runs or a worst 10 yard runs correct where it's like all right well it's on an explosive run

Starting point is 00:17:24 or not an explosive play it's an explosive run where it gets them a first down not puts them in position for a touchdown that's it i mean jaden daniels didn't even have to throw the ball the other day and so they have to figure it out so it really at the heart of it it doesn't matter it doesn't matter if it's because they're showing stuff or not but it better be fixed on september 7th So who cares? Like, I get it. You want to hold back. But guess what?

Starting point is 00:17:53 Everyone's going to see everything you do on September 7th. And then the whole league has that film. So it's not, I get it. You want to catch Cleveland off guard a little bit. Fine. But it better work. It better work. It doesn't matter how, but it better.

Starting point is 00:18:08 So that's ultimately what it comes down to. And like, like, Logan, he talked today. And there's plenty of people that are like, oh, is 55 washes? I don't care if he looks washed. in the preseason. But he better not look washed on September 7th. That's when it matters. By the way,

Starting point is 00:18:22 Chase Brown had an insane catch on Logan in the end zone today. I don't know if you saw. Dan Horde got a really good video of it. I don't know if he's posted it yet. I've not seen it yet. Okay. I don't think Logan is the biggest problem on the defense right now. I don't think any of the starters have looked particularly good.

Starting point is 00:18:39 But I don't think Logan is, and people are looking at him because this idea is out there that maybe he's lost at him. has. Maybe we get to the regular season and it gets exposed, but I'm not really at that point yet. I think that a lot of things have gone wrong and it's not just Logan. I think Logan knows what he's doing. He's in the right place for the most part or is trying to be in the right place and things around him are not happening that are making him maybe look a little bit worse. But well, again, we'll see when the game start counting and all this stuff matters, like you said. But the issues

Starting point is 00:19:16 are having with just massive holes in the running game. Like you got to stop the run to have fun, a saying that I heard this week, an old football adage that I had not heard before. And we've heard this team talk about it. Like you want to get into past rushing situations, you got to stop the run. And until you can stop the run, teams are just going to run it on you. And you're going to have to deal with that. So they do have to find a way to be better.

Starting point is 00:19:46 that phase of the game. And we'll see if the schematic and game planning advantage that they've been holding back for these preseason games shows up and matters to start this season because we're going to be talking about fast starts again. And that narrative is going to come back as we lead into that week one game here real fast. Speaking of fast starts, a bunch of guys progressing, making the way back onto the practice field that would be beneficial to have. have if the Bengals are to get off to a fast start in 2025. We'll get into all those injury updates to finish the show next. Today's show is brought to you by Monarch Money. Most people can't name all of their financial accounts or even what they're worth, whether it's 401K's properties or

Starting point is 00:20:32 investments. And when you don't have the full picture, you can end up leaving money on the table. That's why Monarch Money exists. It's an all-in-one personal finance tool that helps bring your entire financial life together in one clean, easy-to-use interface on your laptop or on your phone. You can take it with you on the go. It's football season. It's busy. Well, Monarch does all the heavy lifting for you. You can link all of your accounts in minutes, see clear data visuals, get smart categorization of spending. You finally feel control of your money without ever touching a spreadsheet. Once Trey's deal is done, well, guess what? He should get Monarch money already. So you can keep all of those nice things in order. Maybe the Bengals should get it, Jake, so then they can have the

Starting point is 00:21:16 the tray allotment in one, and then you have the Joe and then the Jamar, and then don't let financial opportunities slip through the cracks with Monarch Money. Use code locked on NFL at Monarchmoney.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year at Monarchmoney.com with code locked on NFL. Mentory injury updates, James. A big one that we talked about earlier, Cordell Wilson out for the year, but a lot of outside of that progress for the most part. A couple guys considered day-to-day, Andrei Yoseva shouldn't practice, Drew Sample, came out of the game a little nicked up.

Starting point is 00:21:53 Zach Taylor said that he's day-to-day right now, said that he, along with Mike Keseki, Miles Moore, if he could play this weekend if they needed them. Obviously, they won't play. The starters will not be playing. But what were your big takeaways as you listen to the many, many injury updates outside of Cordell? You spent enough time on Cornell in the guard spot. Yeah, well, I think it's great that Mike Kassiki's progressing. I watched him catch a few passes from Joe Burrow for the first time in a while. And it was a walk-through practice.

Starting point is 00:22:22 It was not a real practice, but still a progress for Mike Gassicki to see him out there. Jermaine Burton was out there. So that's pretty noteworthy just to have him back in the mix. I would expect him to play on Saturday. I would also expect Matt Lee to play. He was out there. He's ramping up. You hinted at it earlier.

Starting point is 00:22:41 And I think ready to go. And it's, it's, It's important. I think it's important for him because he just hasn't played a lot of football. And so getting him ready to go with the regular season looming is important because I do think he's going to be center two. I don't think that's necessarily a battle. Seth McLaughlin got in briefly the other day. Maybe it becomes one. But no, I expect Matt Lee to start on Saturday and hopefully take a big step forward so he's game ready for week one. Yeah, he hasn't been able to do team drills really throughout. the entire preseason throughout all of training camps.

Starting point is 00:23:18 So if he's going to be able to play, and that is indeed the plan, hopefully it works out that way, and he's back out there at full strength. And then we'll see if it does turn into a bit of a competition in game three or not. It is an opportunity for them to get him and Seth McLachlan a lot of snaps if those guys are available to do so.

Starting point is 00:23:36 But we still saw a ton of Andrew Rame in preseason week two, and I don't think he's in competition for anything. So whether or not a competition emerges, on Saturday. We'll see, but it is very positive news to hear that Matt Lee has a chance to play this weekend.

Starting point is 00:23:56 Outside of that, mentioned Lucas Patrick's injury, not as severe as they thought during the game. They're worried about him in that day-to-day bucket. Dax Hill, Zach Taylor very pleased with where Dax is, has no concerns about him being ready for week one. Looks like that Leon Hall role might be in store for Dax.

Starting point is 00:24:12 That'll be something very interesting for those of us that are really into how these guys are being used to watch in week one. You mentioned Jermaine Burton back at practice, BJ Hill getting into 11 on 11s. That was a plan according to Zach Taylor. He ramps up for the regular season a little bit. Cody Ford is still day-to-day.

Starting point is 00:24:31 You mentioned him still dealing with an injury. Gino Stone, sounds like he's working his way back as well, and they're not anticipating any of these things going into week one. So outside of Cordell-Voson, right now it seems like they're in pretty good shape heading into week one from a health perspective James like if these guys progress as expected

Starting point is 00:24:53 and then very soon the big question much louder than these injury questions is there's nothing necessarily pressing outside of guard which is pressing from an injury perspective that they're going to have to address is going to be the Trey Hendrickson situation not that we planned on talking about Trey Hendrickson But very soon, Joe said the last week or two going into week one is when this will pick up.

Starting point is 00:25:21 That's going to be the story that is going to be all eyes because we keep having these trade reports. Today it's Wednesday, it's the Raiders, supposedly being quote unquote front runners, which implies that there's a race, which I'm not so sure there is. But we continue to have these trade reports and sounds like things are still at an impasse. So that'll be something that is going to hopefully have to change. here pretty soon. Yeah, it doesn't feel imminent. Anything can happen?

Starting point is 00:25:49 I would be stunned, not stunned because of all the rumblings, but I'd be surprised if they trade him. Because even though Mike doesn't run most things now, like day-to-day-wise, Mike Brown would absolutely have to sign off on a Trey Hendrickson trade. And good luck convincing him that that's going to make them better this year. I get it. Oh, well, then why don't you pay him?

Starting point is 00:26:10 Like, we get all the arguments. I get that. but yeah, I think that's the hang up. Maybe it gets solved. Maybe that happens and they trade him. But I see Trey Hendrickson on the sideline on Monday night football talking with Duke Tobin. I see Trey Hendrickson. I walked back from practice and it's Jamar, it's T.

Starting point is 00:26:29 Trey Hendrickson's 10 feet from me as we're walking back. Like it feels like it should get done. If they're that close on everything else, like it's just a matter of when, I hope. And as we record this, you're talking 17 days, or 18 days, excuse me, 18 days from the opener. And so giving him at least a full week of practice, you want to talk about Matt Lee not getting football time? Train hasn't gotten any football time. And even if he's training as hard as he can, it would be nice to get him some football time.

Starting point is 00:26:59 So I hope the deadline in their minds is Saturday, honestly, but it doesn't feel like that's the case. there have been many deadlines that we've hoped for that have passed between the risiner deadlines here get it done yeah and that was a couple days ago too came and get it done get it done no come back there's still a chance but like you said having him leave the building it's not ideal as of the time of recording dalton riser's still out there we haven't seen anything about his visit reportedly with seattle that was supposed to be next haven't haven't seen any updates there I have not checked his wife's TikTok account to see if she has potentially provided an update.

Starting point is 00:27:42 So not sure about that one. But as of this recording, we don't have anything to share on Progress with Dalton Reisner. Is there anything else from this practice? Mentioned that BJ Ho is back out there. Still Wilson and Knight at linebacker, so it doesn't sound like there's much of a competition opening up for that linebacker spot. We talked about that a little bit yesterday. And Zach Taylor did give Demetrius Knight a little bit of a vote of confidence during his during his pre-practice presser on Wednesday.

Starting point is 00:28:10 Secondary still Dax, Cam Taylor Britt, Josh Newton, Jordan, Battle, Gino Stone. So no real changes there. I think that's about it. Do you have anything else? Yeah, DJ was still nicked up, I believe. DJ Turner. Still considered dated.

Starting point is 00:28:24 Yeah, that is one injury that we hadn't gotten to. So good call there. We're expecting to see a lot of Desmond Ritter and the customary final game of the preseason look at the Bengals' fourth quarterback. Which is the point? Peyton Thorne. there you go i didn't think you know it i didn't think you know it jake he's number 10 for those

Starting point is 00:28:41 that don't know patent thorne i was getting there went to aubrick so went to michigan state about patent thorne we we know limited bits of the lore anyway we've got another practice that doesn't sound like it's going to be a walk there should be a bit more of a full practice on thursday afternoon a later practice so we'll be with you then after the bengals practice on Thursday, then it'll be preseason finale time, cut down time, projecting the 53-man roster time. And those are the exciting bits left we have as training camp is wrapping up. Until then, next time. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast. Ho-Day and have a good one.

Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Cordell Volson's injury exposes the Bengals' depth issue at guard | Plus, defense holding back?

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