Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Geno Stone's Pay Cut SPARKS Questions | Will Bengals Use the Extra Cash Wisely?

Starting point is 00:00:00 The Cincinnati Bengals have created more cap space. Gino Stone takes a pay cut and the Bengals better spend that money. You are locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. What up Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Locked on Bengals podcast. Part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. I'm Jake. Let's go along with James Rupin, your host of Lockdown.

Starting point is 00:00:35 Bengals covering the Cincinnati Bengals since 2016. You can find James work as well over at bengals talk.com. And if you're an everydayer, welcome back. We appreciate you very much. If you're not an everyday or yet, hit that subscribe button on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. Make sure you don't miss an episode. And maybe you'll even become a part of the group that makes Locked on Bengals

Starting point is 00:00:59 their first listen. We appreciate all of you who make us part of your routine. So, so very much. and the off-season program kicking off on field today, James, the first open practice of the year. Before we get there and we well get there, and Joe Burrow was, of course, absent after attending the Met Gala on Monday night. And so for the first practice, open to the media on Tuesday,

Starting point is 00:01:23 he was not present. We'll get there. But Gino Stone early on Tuesday, before I was awake, certainly, agrees to a reduced deal in exchange for, some guaranteed money james and the bengals continue to open up a little bit more cap space they do and essentially gino stone was set to make six and a half million dollars this year that cap hit uh drops down a million and a half saves the bengals another sliver so to speak and he takes the cut to stay on the team and in the process gets one plus million right around a million and a half dollars

Starting point is 00:02:01 is guaranteed. So first things first, Gino Stone is going to be on this roster. That's why he took the pay cut. He gets a little money guaranteed. He's going to be on the team. It's eerily similar to what they did with Zach Moss a few weeks ago. And the question here isn't necessarily about Gino. I think that they kind of entered this offseason open to other ideas, other possibilities, but knowing that they had a germane pratt issue hanging over their head which we'll get into and trey hendricks and all these other just question marks on defense and they probably were sick and tired of the safety turnover and maybe they saw something in gino towards the end of last year that that leads them to believe that he's going to be better and more successful so certainly we're still willing to say hey

Starting point is 00:02:51 take a pay cut to hang around to stay here and i think that's interesting too considering gino stone is going to start for this team. I don't really see the scenario unless he's just awful in camp and they signed someone else. But even then, I think Gino Stone right now pretty much write it in Penn that he's a starting safety on this team if he's healthy. And he started all 17 games last year. They're going to roll with him this year. And that's what this solidifies when it comes to their defense is that Gino Stone is going to be on the roster. And I would expect him starting week one. he and Zach Moss, like you mentioned, both taking guaranteed money in exchange for reduced money to solidify their spot on the roster. The Bengals would be very non-Bengalsy to cut guys with that much of a dead cap hit that would be left behind with guaranteed money because they're still on the hook for that money.

Starting point is 00:03:42 They're still accounting for the signing bonus that they paid those guys last year. So I agree with you 100% there, James, that those guys are essentially on the team. and just updating the cash and cap spend perspective of things here. Jermaine Pratt is still on the team. And so I'm still including him here technically in my numbers. If he wasn't on the team anymore, the cap space number will be 21.2 million, give or take, and that includes the rookies. But since he's still on the team, where the Bengals are today is roughly including rookies,

Starting point is 00:04:18 including the practice squad, which is something that they're. accounting for. Around 15 million is where I see it based on the accounting that I'm tracking. It's a little bit smaller than the number you're seeing over the cap, which is saying that the team is at 26 million. And that is not including the practice squad. That's only including the top 51 contracts on the team because it's offseason rules. And I don't think the Bengals really care about those numbers. I think the Bengals care about what the cap situation is going to be when the regular season rolls around. And that's how they. And Honestly, most teams have to consider it, but whether it's 21, assuming that Germain Pratt does indeed get cut, and he's not there as the offseason program opens and we'll get to those absences a little bit more later, or if it's $15.3 million, that's a whole lot of cab space to be talking about rolling into the season or rolling over into next season, hypothetically, that they have created for themselves or left themselves, whether that's for Trey Hendrickson.

Starting point is 00:05:20 and a deal that will increase his cap number this year to make him happy, or that's for an external free agent. That is money that the Bengals ought to spend at least half of from a cap perspective, like generously, at least half of the Bengals could spend here to improve their team one way or another. Yeah, that to me is the magical question. You weren't even up when the Gino Stone thing came out over the cap. was the one that had it and I reacted to it. One of our insiders, by the way, it was like, hey, did you see this Geno Stone thing?

Starting point is 00:05:58 And that's what tipped me off. So how about the insider and insider club tipping off us and tipping me off? And then I was like, oh, because I hadn't. It was just on over the cap. It's not like I'm checking out over the cap every morning, right? So it's one of those things now where I think everyone's mind instantly went. It was very quickly after the news got out. Not that, oh, well, Gino's bad.

Starting point is 00:06:20 Should he be back? Should he not be back? It was like, all right, well, what are they doing with the money? What are they doing with the money? Where's it going? Where's this money going to go? Don't Joe mixing us. And that's fair. Expectations were high during the offseason. I think expectations should continue to be high. And so whether they apply that and help use that to facilitate a Trey Hendrickson deal, which I think is where Gino's mind went, whether they go get maybe another safety. because, man, not taking a safety. Like we, you look at it, and I was doing it today, and I'm probably the biggest Tyson Anderson believer on the planet, but it's not like Dejan Anthony showed you much at safety last year.

Starting point is 00:07:04 And so you have Tyson who hasn't played much safety in the NFL, and Dejan Anthony, who hasn't played really any safety in the NFL, behind a guy in Jordan Battle who has a lot to prove this year, and a guy in Gino Stone who has a lot to prove this year, you just asked him to take a pay cut or you're going to probably move on from like you don't feel great about that room when you just look at it that way and even if a Jordan battle emerges and takes a huge step forward or geno stone rebounds there isn't a ton of proven depth there so i i do wonder if that you could just go out and get get a free agent safety and address it that way since they didn't draft one

Starting point is 00:07:41 what what do you think the likelihood of a julian blackman move is because I remain so unconvinced that they're going to spend that money on safety in a meaningful way. Honestly, the way this offseason is gone, I'm sitting here saying like, yeah, this team better go spend that money. That's what the standards should be, right? But I also am trying to talk myself into the possibility that they actually will spend that money. and maybe it's on the defensive interior, right, where we'll get to absence this a little bit later, but B.J. Hill is an injury that he's dealing with right now.

Starting point is 00:08:23 Don't know how severe it is. Don't know much about it. But maybe there's another spot that they need to address, or maybe there's not actually another player coming. And this is just attached to Trey Hendrickson. I mean, Gino Stone, when he was asked about it, hinted that he thought it could help keep Trey Hendrickson in Cincinnati, talked about the uncertainty that he would be back,

Starting point is 00:08:44 talked about the disappointment that he had with the way his season started and understanding why the team would approach him to ask for pay reductions. So maybe it's just tied back to Trey. But talking myself into them actually doing the thing that they should do with this money at this point is a bit of a hurdle for me the way this offseason has gone, James. It should be. And that's what's interesting. I think expectations are low because they haven't added outside.

Starting point is 00:09:14 talent that they should have already added. And do you have the whole tray thing hanging over everything? At the same time, there are still guys that can help. And whether or not they add them, now it's on them. And there's clear holes. You can't point to the draft. And there are guys that can help. And they have the resources.

Starting point is 00:09:38 So it puts the pressure back on the front office to get some of these things done. even after T and Jammar and them not being able to to handle that plus do free agency. And let's be honest here, they couldn't handle that, clearly. And so now they have the resources. So will they sign Julian Blackman? My confidence, avoid that. I'll answer your question coming up next. Today's show is brought to you by Skylight Calendar.

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Starting point is 00:11:10 Give it to me straight here. What do you think? I think he's the most likely free agent edition that the Bengals make. Now, I'm not saying it's high, but like Brandon Shurf would be kicked out there. Some of these other guys would be kicked out there.

Starting point is 00:11:26 Justin Simmons, I just, in shout out to our guy, Andre Perada, part of this is agent-based. Who is Justin Simmons's agent? Hmm. The guy that the Bengals don't have a great track record of working with.

Starting point is 00:11:45 David Mulligetta, who, yeah, they did get that Joseph Osai deal done. And Justin Simmons did mention the Bengals last month. I get that. But age, declining play, Simmons probably wants to start. A guy like Blackman, yeah, I'm sure he wants to start. And maybe he even looks at Gino Stone and says, I'm better than him.

Starting point is 00:12:05 But you come in, you're clearly the first safety off the bench worst case. It's one of the on paper worst safety rooms. in the league. I think if you stack them up, and I haven't done that. Maybe I'm dead wrong in their middle of the pack. Maybe I'm just way off on that. But it's a guy who's played deep safety. And by the way, if Gino Stone continues to just have his issues playing back there, you have another option. Right now you don't really have a true option. Another guy that, like, I may be confident Tyson Anderson. I'm not sure the Bengals would give the keys to Tyson. And so the blackman on paper from a football standpoint makes sense. And then the agent part of it, Rocky Arsenault,

Starting point is 00:12:46 his agent. Rocky Arsenal, I.T. Higgins's agent. Jamar Chase's agent. So shout out to Andre Prada for that part. I just think it makes a lot of sense. Now, does that mean it happens? I don't know, but like you were clearly confident enough in the safety market to ask Gino Stone to take a pay cut because what if he says no? You think the Bengals just keep him around? No. Probably not. That's probably not part of the plan. Yeah, even after not drafting one, they're like, hey, you're taking a pay cut, my man, which means they feel good about someone out there. And my bet would be Julian Blackburn,

Starting point is 00:13:23 a 26, almost 27-year-old that's represented by Rocky Arsenal. That's still looking for a job. I have been on the sign Julian Blackman trained since the beginning of the offseason. Back when we did our free agency preview and all those things, I like Julian Blackman as a potential target, a guy that has been an average or better safety for his NFL career. I think he's a solid player. I certainly wouldn't be opposed.

Starting point is 00:13:49 But you mentioned don't Joe Mixing it. And what you meant by that in case anyone was confused is... Oh, I bet you people are confused and thinking I'm being mean to Joe. Well, what that means is they just pocketed the money. And at the time, we're like, okay, yeah, Joe Mixon is going to take a pay cut and they're going to use that money to go make the team better. And so, like, between that bit of Bengals history and this offseason so far, it's okay let's see how they use this money you can't you can't roll over that much money just can't do it you have too many things that you need to do even now that you could do to make your team

Starting point is 00:14:28 better in a year where you really ought to be trying to make your team every year but a year you really ought to be trying to make your team as good as it can be yeah and there are so many guys like we we can't fit in that part of the show today we will do that coming up like but there are a lot of guys that can help this team and there's a lot of ways they can apply this money and there are other guys there are other levers they can pull like you mentioned pratt cordel volson by the way like like like there are guards that you could go get and then that brings stability and not the question mark that cordel volson brings going into year four where he's paid a ton because he's played a ton i do think formed up to to par i do think their plan is for cordal to be competing in training camp

Starting point is 00:15:10 at this point though because he's he's he's there he's he's out there practice I think that like his his likely outcome is win the job or then you face a tough decision in camp at the end of camp. I don't know why if they're saying Gino Paycut, Zach Moss, let's let's rework this. You wouldn't go to Cordell and do the same thing, even if you plan on him competing. You make it 3.6 million this year. That's I mean, that's more that's more than any like that's probably more than Will Hernandez gets. probably so at least close because he's coming off the injury yeah yeah like it's close like oh like who's more moving i do think that cordel will be subject to waivers in order to make that

Starting point is 00:15:59 happen because i don't think they can just renegotiate his deal i think it would have to be a cut and and resign no they can they because that happened already because of the incentives what do you mean the reason he's at 3.6 is because of the the incentives he hit from point yeah so those are those are automatically added to the contract so i don't think you can renegotiate those without i think you can just delete them we i guess we need to find out i'm pretty i'm pretty sure yeah i'm pretty sure that there was a player this year that that a team did that with and they basically said we're going to cut you or you can hang around and we're going to delete these we'll need to and i'm not using proper terms here yeah i know i know well we'll need to

Starting point is 00:16:43 look into that, I think. You mean delete is not a proper NFL cap jargon? I guess it is. Well, we'll have to look into the possibilities around Cordell as that continues to proceed because he's around right now, right? So he's there for practices this week. He's out there working.

Starting point is 00:17:04 And so for now he's certainly in a competition. A good dude that works hard, but it's just it is one of those levers that they could. cap space isn't why they're not going to be able to get trade done, for example. Yeah. Like that's just, that's not it. It would be organizational, how they view a 30-year-old, essentially. Willingness to spend the money is what it comes down to.

Starting point is 00:17:29 Like, are they willing to literally just pay trade that extra money, philosophically? The Bengals did ever practice today, James, as we record. We're recording this on Tuesday. and Joe Burrow was not present, mentioned that earlier. We'll discuss the Bengals star quarterback's presence or lack thereof so far in the offseason program in addition to the BJ Hill note that I mentioned and some other absence and injury notes from the Bengals first open practice to the media of 2025 coming up next. Today's show is brought to you by Fandall.

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Starting point is 00:19:18 working with some of the new players on the team, Lucas Patrick out there at Right Guard, working alongside of Marius Mims reportedly, not that you should read into offensive line rotations at this point in the offseason, because on the other side of Lucas Patrick, in that particular clip was Andrew Stuber, who is fighting for a practice squad spot most likely,

Starting point is 00:19:39 so it goes to show you what you can, read into the early offseason program rotations, but Lucas Patrick will be working at right guard. We'll get to some of those notes, things like that, but starting with Joe Burrow, who was not present. And James, you have some information to share about Joe Burrough's plan for the off season. Well, one, I think quarterback controversy. I mean, the other J.B. showed up. Jake Browning in the building, working hard. And so Joe, Burrow, as good as he looked at the MetGala. And I know all the ladies are talking about how good Joe Burrow looked.

Starting point is 00:20:17 Might be a little nervous. Might be on the high. No, I'm just kidding. Look, this was all part of the plan from what I heard. It's because, well, Joe has probably never been healthy enough. I'm trying to think, healthy enough to feel comfortable going to the Met Gala or a big enough star to do so. But these first few weeks of the offseason program, I think he always planned on

Starting point is 00:20:39 missing them. he was obviously in the building after they drafted Shamar Stewart, chatted with Shamar. I think that that was kind of a, all right, let me check in with the everyone, chat with Zach, talk to the staff,

Starting point is 00:20:53 training staff, all of those things, knowing that he was going to have a weekend in Miami and then go to the Metcala and all of those things. I'm not going to say that this is 100%, but I do think that there's a good chance that Joe Burrow is there next week. you know, until you show up, it's one of those things. But I don't think anyone is surprised or caught off guard by him not being there last week or not being there this week for what it's worth.

Starting point is 00:21:20 And the other part of this is the calf sleeve, which some people saw in Miami when he was at one of the events and a race and a bunch of different things, getting off a bus. There's a video of that. But the calf sleeve in general, I have no idea. So there you go. I have no clue about that. I don't think that's why he's not at the off-season program. I think that this was a pre-planned thing. Is the calf sleeve part of his new fashion?

Starting point is 00:21:47 I have no idea. But I have no clue about anything there. And I've never heard of an injury. It doesn't mean there isn't one. I just haven't heard it this off-season for what it's worth. This is not a period of time in the off-season where you typically do hear about injuries. There are no obligations for significant injury reporting at this part of the off-season. for example, BJ Hill being in a boot,

Starting point is 00:22:10 you don't have a whole lot of information about that one at this point, except he wasn't in a boot last week. So we know that. But back to Burrow here for a bit longer. If it's a precautionary thing because there's some calf tightness, I don't necessarily think that's related to your point. But fine. Like don't do anything right now.

Starting point is 00:22:32 Great. Don't push yourself at this part of the off season. I don't need you to do that. At the same time, I will say that the contingent to fans out there that we've heard from, whether it's on the Locktime Bengals Insider Group at JoinSubtext.com slash Locktown Bengals or on social media from people reaching out or people posting, it is a little bit weird that he's not there.

Starting point is 00:22:53 He is the only prominent member of the team that doesn't have some sort of dispute with the team who isn't there. And I understand that he has a social calendar here for some significant events. The Met Gala, one of the biggest events in the world every year. But I still think it's a little bit weird that Joe Burrow made that choice. Like it's a little bit, to me, it feels like something that's a little bit uncharacteristic. I also don't think it's a huge deal. I think that if he is back in the near future and he's there for all of training camp, like I'm not ringing hands over this at all.

Starting point is 00:23:31 I don't think it's a major issue. I just think it's a little bit of a weird luck. Like the optics are kind of strange when T. Higgins and Jemar Chase are there and Joe Burroughs out there. I get it. I get it. But from someone who had the ability to go and didn't go today, I'm certainly not going to be the one that is like, oh, well, Joe should have went. I didn't go. It's full disclosure.

Starting point is 00:23:56 I didn't go. I plan on going. Didn't work out. I don't think it's a big deal. I also don't think these workouts are a big deal. I don't know about the CAF thing. So I'll leave that there. But as far as worrying about Joe in the off-season program,

Starting point is 00:24:10 and I'm not saying you, I do think that people are going to say there will be people that say, oh, my God, the fame is going to his head. And what I would say is someone as obsessive as Joe, he probably looked at last year in how much he had to grind through all of the rehab, stayed in Cincinnati. He did not travel nearly as much last year because he was going through all that risk stuff.

Starting point is 00:24:32 You don't remember the backless suit? I bet sure he did some but it it certainly wasn't at that at that level and that was in the dead part of the NFL calendar dead dead I think he's like ah I you know I I can do a couple more of these things it doesn't mean he's not training I bet I bet he was training in Miami I bet he was training in in depending on how long he was in New York probably was getting get out style but no I'm I'm I'm not concerned about it. But I do think that there will be people that are. I think ideally he would be there from a football perspective, right? Like if you had everything in an ideal world, everyone's healthy, everyone's participating. But at the same time, like, I kind of agree with you. Like it's not, I don't think it's a huge issue that he's missed a couple weeks here in like the phase one, phase two part of the offseason program.

Starting point is 00:25:28 Charlie Jones didn't participate today, right? If I just dyed my hair. and walked out there in Charlie Jones is 15, how many of the reporters would have actually noticed? Like if I was just participating? I think you're a little too conspicuous. I think they would have all noticed. But yeah, I guess so.

Starting point is 00:25:52 I don't know, though. But my point is, is like, I just don't think it matters that much. No, I don't think they do it for a reason. I do. Like, I get that. but I think it's okay like as long as he's there next week now if he if he doesn't show up until OTAs the end of the month well then that's weird but a couple of things on the calendar hey Zach I'm gonna miss a couple of those things that I've

Starting point is 00:26:20 been wanting to do I've just doing rehab fine yeah these are these are workouts literally all of our our listeners are making it through so and you got a Got to not have a slow start because you have a slow start people are going to be pointing to these weeks, man. This has zeroed it. I mean, come. I know, but I can already see it.

Starting point is 00:26:43 That's all I'm saying. I can already see it. So let's move past Borough here. The other ones, you mentioned Charlie Jones didn't participate. He was out there, didn't have a jersey on. Zach Moss still not out there as he's got the neck that he's working back from Eric Hall, obviously not out there as he's going to miss a season with the knee. Trey Hendrickson not there.

Starting point is 00:27:02 because he's trying to get paid. Obviously, Jermaine Pratt, not present as the trade request is still out there. I'm surprised he's still on the team, quite frankly, as we're recording this today, Dax Hill was on the rehab field along with Cole Burgess. And B.J. Hill, I've hinted out a couple of times here, he had that walking boot on. Don't know how serious it was. He was out there walking around in the boot. He was standing in everything.

Starting point is 00:27:27 He was out there. He just had a boot on, wasn't a full participant. I will say it was encouraging to see Camp Sample out there, not on the rehab field, working back from the Achilles, running a hoop drill in one of the videos I saw shared by one of your esteemed colleagues on the beat who was at the practice, James.

Starting point is 00:27:44 So nice to see Camp Sample back out there, but BJ Hill probably the most notable and unexpected of this list of guys who is going through something at this point here in the off-season program. Yeah, I don't want to see that. That's a reminder, by the way, if the defensive line depth, hey, adds, add a guy. Hey, Maurice Hurst, Julian Blackman, like, you could start adding dudes and really upgrade this roster.

Starting point is 00:28:11 We will have to get to that this week at some point. Is Maurice Hurst really unsigned right now? That's your boy. Yeah, he's unsigned. He's had such a hard time staying healthy, but he's, when he's on the field, he's a solid player. The Bengals. Maurice Roy Hurst Jr. is an American professional. professional football defensive tackle who is a free agent according to Wikipedia.

Starting point is 00:28:33 I looked it up too. I read that same sentence. I do think they're pretty excited about their undrafted class that we'll see introduced next week for that rookie mini this week. Friday? Yeah. It's Tuesday. I would expect that to be announced Friday morning at like that undrafted class to be announced. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:28:55 Yeah, we haven't talked a ton about those undrafted guys yet, but between a little bit of a bigger budget this year, potentially, and some opportunities for, what are you laughing at? Some opportunities for guys based on who they drafted, it'll be interesting to see if any of these undrafted guys can stick this year. What are you laughing at? They're like, hey, we're not going to spend in free agencies so we can spend big in college free. Well, we're talking about a difference of like maybe like five digits of money in the in the college free agent budget like $50,000 maybe. But I think people are like, oh, look at them splurgy and free agency. And it's just college free agent. No, it's just funny in my head.

Starting point is 00:29:41 Maybe not anybody else's. This is still a team. There's splurgers. This is still a team that doesn't spend significant money on college free agents. Yeah. Fair. I just want them to spend significant money on free agents. There's the joke. We'll see what they do.

Starting point is 00:30:02 Really, really excited to see Camp sample back out there. Just going to reiterate that point, especially since they haven't added a three tech. It's a solid player, man. He's a solid player. Excited to see him in camp this year. Hopefully he can stay healthy. Tomorrow, we've got a reset to think about the Cincinnati. Bengals' offensive line with their two rookie additions, Lucas Patrick, of course,

Starting point is 00:30:27 Amarius Mims' development, Scott Peters, and the schematic changes that may come along, or maybe the technique changes that could come along with Scott Peters running that offensive line room. I'll be joined by Brandon Thorne for that conversation. That'll be your next episode here on Lockdown Bengals. Until then, thanks for listening. Ho-Day, and have a good one.

Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Geno Stone's Pay Cut SPARKS Questions | Will Bengals Use the Extra Cash Wisely?

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