Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Is Al Golden the next Bengals defensive coordinator?

Starting point is 00:00:00 Have the Cincinnati Bengals decided on their next defensive coordinator? Let's break it down. You are Locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. What up Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Locked On Bengals podcast. I'm Jake Liskow. He's James Rapine and we are your host and we are Locked on Bengals on the Locked on podcast that we're covering your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:37 Shout out to the everydayers out there that don't miss an episode. Shout out to all of you who make us your first listen. We appreciate all of you deeply for your commitment to making us part of your daily routine. That's awesome. Today's episode is brought to you by prize picks where you can get $50 instantly with your first $5 play with promo code locked on NFL. And James with the National Championship Game in college football right around the corner, depending on when you're listening to this episode, but for us right around the corner,

Starting point is 00:01:11 the defensive coordinator for the Notre Dame Fighting Irish appears to be, certainly one of the favorites for the job, maybe the favorite for the job, maybe more than the favorite for the job at this point, James. How would you describe Al Golden and his candidacy for the Bengals defensive coordinator job at this point? Yeah, I would say it would be a shock if it's not Al Golden.

Starting point is 00:01:34 That's how I would phrase it. that's how I would categorize it. If you're on the highway, the Bengals defensive coordinator highway and you're looking at the road signs, I think every sign is pointing down the golden ticket lane or however you want to reference it. I think Al Golden is going to be the Bengals next defensive coordinator. Now, is there scenarios where that doesn't happen? Sure, fine. But I don't think that they're likely.

Starting point is 00:01:58 And so if Al Golden is the guy, obviously we would expect to hear something after the national champion. championship game. And obviously he's a familiar face. We've talked about him a bit. The Bengals are down to two guys. We knew that. And we talked about that in our last episode, Patrick Graham and Al Golden. But I do think that Al Golden is going to be the guy, which makes Monday night that much more intriguing. Because it's not just, oh, well, this is one of the finalists in my mind. It's going to be like, all right, well, let's get a look against a Notre Dame team that has the talent disadvantage. I mean, this is going to be a tough spot to be in.

Starting point is 00:02:40 And so what an opportunity, I would say, for Al Golden, assuming that he is going to be the next Bengals defensive coordinator to show everyone that's going to be watching across the country, of course, with the championship on the line, but obviously show Bengals fans as well what he can possibly bring. Yeah, and just before we get to the national championship game, and we will talk about that in terms of, Oh, what if Ohio State just goes out there and dominates with their, I don't know, 10 top 50 draft prospects.

Starting point is 00:03:09 So many guys. Versus maybe a couple guys from Notre Dame that'll get drafted on day one and day two. You know, there is a talent disparity there, like he said. Or, you know, some of the draft targets on Notre Dame's defense. We'll get to those topics. Just want to recap how we got here where there were a couple of candidates that we heard the Bengals interviewed. Patrick Graham was one of those final. list that that's where we were last time we talked to you for those of you that are everydayers

Starting point is 00:03:36 you've heard us talk about this already but there there are these familiarity factors here with the Bengals if it is indeed Al Golden as we believe that is the direction things are likely going at this point there's the Bengals bringing back a coach that has been in the building before something they've done many times throughout their history there's is this honestly this is a question for some people james is this a zach taylor hire or is this a mike brown hire that that's a topic that we can cover here a little bit as well as to where this is coming from because i have had people say all this feels like the front office forcing someone on zack i don't think that's the case but we'll talk about that a little bit here as well and the pros and cons of going with that

Starting point is 00:04:19 familiarity hire and not casting a wider net not going for the robert saulahs or dennis allen's or whatever coach out there with Matt Iber Fluse, whatever coach out there has that recent head coaching pedigree to find the next Steve Spegnolo. That's not the direction they're going here with Al Golden. Although I don't know what Al Golden's NFL head coaching prospects look like. Maybe he sees this as a step on that path. It's not one of the coaches that Mike Spagnolo has tried to be a head coach.

Starting point is 00:04:52 It didn't work out. Now he's probably going to be pigeonholed. the DC for a while. But there's a lot there to get through when we think about the familiarity and where this impetus to a direction to go with Al Golden is coming from for the team. Yeah, I would say this. I would be shocked if, how do I describe it? I got to be not careful, but I got to be selective here.

Starting point is 00:05:18 No, I think this is a Zach hire. I do. I think Zach Taylor is in on Al Golden. I think that's where it's coming from. I think that you're reasonable to question or to ask the question. And I think that fans are as well because I'm not sure he's not here anymore, whatever. I'm not sure that Zach was all in on Frank Pollock necessarily. Right.

Starting point is 00:05:43 I think that the front office knew that he was a really good offensive line coach. Zach hung with Jim Turner after a year where it felt like Jim Turner was a bus to begin with. And by the way, almost got Zach fired, I would say. And so the Bengals, not that they said, hey, this is going to be your offensive line coach, but I think they might have nudged break on Zach a little bit, maybe a little bit, right? I don't get that vibe here at all. I think it's sort of the opposite. It's like Zach is comfortable with Al Golden, has watched Al Golden probably grow a bit as a coach.

Starting point is 00:06:16 Or maybe this has been discussed for years. I think what's interesting is like from Luana Rumo to go where he was a couple of years ago, where it felt like there was a point where it felt like he was going to be the next head coach of the Arizona Cardinals. Beat up Brian Callahan became a finalist. And then it got weird and they met with Jonathan Gannon during Super Bowl week. And then suddenly, boom, Gannon gets the job. And by the way, they got fine for that. I think did they get docked the draft pick?

Starting point is 00:06:41 I know they got fine for it. But it was one of those things where Lou was a finalist. So Zach had to have a plan because it was really close to Lou being gone anyway, a couple of years. ago. And so I do wonder if that's when this started. When Zach's like, oh, well, Al, for two years was here. We know what he did. He just picked up another year of college defensive coordinator experience at Notre Dame. Well, now he's got three years. Now he's got even more time. Now he's coordinating a defense that's one of the best in the country and a big reason why the fighting Irish are playing on Monday night. And it's a tall, tall order for them against Ohio State. And we can get

Starting point is 00:07:16 into that. But regardless, a big reason why Notre Dame is here and in the national championship game is what they are getting from their defense and what they're getting from Al Golden. So I think that Zach clearly comfortable with whatever conversations he's had with Al. And that is a big factor that has led to this point where he is, without a doubt, a finalist for it. And like I said, I expect him to get the job at some point this week.

Starting point is 00:07:48 And what was a quote from Al Golden when he was on the podium ahead of the national championship game. At the end of the day, when asked about his interest in being an NFL or Bengals, D.C., specifically, this is not the time or the place. This is about the kids.

Starting point is 00:08:03 There's always time to reflect on all that after the season. That is a quote that you give when you are on your way out and you're trying to go out the right way and focus on the task ahead of you for a little bit more time. Yeah, he said, He also said all of that other stuff

Starting point is 00:08:21 will deal with that in the future. Yeah. So he didn't say, I'm not going anywhere. No. Didn't say, and by the way, I think that the Bengals and Zach really, and why it's been so quiet,

Starting point is 00:08:36 because that's been part of it, right? It's like, why is it so quiet? They want to respect that Al Golden is trying to win a national championship. He's trying to bring a national title to Notre Dame. Can you imagine if they were to upset Ohio State what that would mean

Starting point is 00:08:49 And so keeping the focus there is of the utmost importance. At the same time, as ironic as it is, Al Golden was the one entertaining the Notre Dame DC job three years ago when the Bengals were going on their Super Bowl run. That was the same. So it's funny how the tides turn, how the paths cross, and we'll see what happens on Monday night. But yeah, those quotes are pretty telling, I would say. Yeah, it's not a denial in any way, shape, or form. Not even a little bit. I do want to touch on the familiarity aspect and the pros and cons there again a little bit.

Starting point is 00:09:29 We talked about it when we were discussing the finalists in our last episode, but with the signs pointing the way they're pointing, I think that that is worth going back to. So we'll circle back to that topic of familiarity and how the Bengals conducted this search coming up next. Growing your small business in 2025 comes down to how well you can hire. And hires start with getting those best insights into your candidates that you can. And that's where LinkedIn comes in. It gives you the strongest hiring data available and helps you identify the right candidates, giving you the confidence to make the best decisions for your business. And it's a game changer when it comes to finding the right fit,

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Starting point is 00:12:09 And I thought we covered both sides of it. They're obviously upsides to the familiarity that Al Golden has was Zach Taylor and the way the Bengals run their football operations. having been involved with running that defense for a couple of years when Lou Anarimo was in charge when he was with the Bengals. That isn't all downside. And I don't mean to portray it that way, although some of our audience, I think, heard it that way. The smoothing out of the transition process there, the familiarity with some of the personnel on the team and the understanding of how they want to accomplish their goals. I think these are all things that are significant positives in Al Golden's favor. I think that the familiarity, while sometimes it leads to blind spots, and we've seen this with pretty much every NFL team when self-scouting,

Starting point is 00:12:58 when thinking about their own personnel in some way, shape, or form, you can get blind spots there, but it also means that you can understand Al Golden's strengths and weaknesses very well. You can understand what his ideas and philosophies are very well. You really know what that looks like. At the NFL level, well, he hasn't been a DC at that level. he understands, Zach Taylor will understand how Al Golden wants to go about running a defense in the NFL, even though he's coming from the college ranks, which is always a question when you're going from college DC to NFL DC. And it is a question, don't get me wrong, for Al Golden, who will not be able to go as man heavy in the NFL as he does in the college ranks, where that's a big tenant of that defense at Notre Dame.

Starting point is 00:13:39 So there are all these positives. And then, like I said, in our last show, James, There's also the, well, this is a way the Bengals have done things in the past or bringing back another coach that's been here in the past. And there are negative feelings, I think, associated with that because it hasn't always gone well for this team in the past. And it feels like maybe they're not doing their due diligence in some ways where really we don't know if that's the case. But that is certainly how I think it can very easily feel on its face. Yeah, it can. And I think the only way to truly know. unless you give the powers that be Zach Taylor and company truth serum is to get call records

Starting point is 00:14:22 and see who they talk to? I mean, I think that's such a factor. I mean, you mentioned LinkedIn and as valuable as LinkedIn is to all of our listeners and to us and to anyone that's operating a small business. You can't go there if you're Zach Taylor to get the good, bad, and indifferent on Venice Allen and if he'll be a good fit or Robert Sala or insert whoever. What I think is interesting is when we talked about those guys, obviously salary is always going to be brought up with the Bengals. But Al Golden, it's not like he's making a million bucks with Notre Dame. You know, they're going to have to pay.

Starting point is 00:15:03 I would imagine around two and a half million. Lou was reportedly around one and a half. And that's what Al's making on average per year with Notre Dame. So I would imagine at minimum he's taking the same money. Two and a half is what Golden is making at Notre Dame on average. Yeah. Yeah. And so at minimum, he's taking the same.

Starting point is 00:15:21 And so that element is interesting too, because if you're getting the Bengals powers that be to pay that, then clearly they believe in him. And they believe that he's in that realm. And so the interesting. Or the question that we'll have for Zach, assuming that out gets the job, one of the many is, well, how many conversations did you have with him about adjusting to life, getting back into the NFL and making sure that that defense translates and the adjustments and the current roster and all of those things, because all of these defensive coordinator candidates, regardless of how big

Starting point is 00:16:01 of a name they are or not, they need to maximize what the Bengals have. What's the plan for Miles Murphy? What's the plan for Daxil? What's the plan for DJ Turner and Jordan Battle? And is it going to be an overhaul? Because I think just going way back, and it goes without saying partially because they stunk when Zach got here from a roster standpoint. But I think very early on, Zach went to Mike Brown and the Bengals front office.

Starting point is 00:16:28 I'm like, hey, we got to get some guys in here. It's going to take a little time here for me. I don't have the guys. And I'm sure Lou might have felt that way. in recent years. Like, I don't have the guys. So how does the

Starting point is 00:16:46 Al Golden or any of these guys that they've talked to, how do they view this roster and this defense? I do think that that is a big question because you can't just get rid of everyone. You're going to have to maximize some of these guys to get the most out of the Bengals defense in 2025.

Starting point is 00:17:08 be a contender again. And I think that is part of Golden's track record. It's not like this is a defense for Notre Dame that's loaded with five-star talent. Like Notre Dame can recruit. Don't get me wrong. This isn't a school that has issues and is like a small school. This isn't like Cincinnati when Luke Fickle was running the team back in the day with Soss Gardner on the team.

Starting point is 00:17:27 And they're clawing their way into the college football championship. Hey now. Hey now. I'm just saying it's not like that. They're different programs. Nobody's comparing the ability for UC to recruit. to the ability for Notre Dame to recruit. What was that?

Starting point is 00:17:42 I'm not taking a swing. This is just the way the world works, man. This is just an objective analysis of Notre Dame. Sauce is the best defensive player on Notre Dame if he was there. Let's just be honest. Absolutely, which tells you about Notre Dame's defense right now. And what Al Golden is doing there. I'm just talking about the ability.

Starting point is 00:18:01 I'm not saying they're scrubs is all insane. But Sauce was not a guy that was like, you know, he wasn't the highly recruited guy. right that's how he ends up at UC he wasn't being and this is before the transfer portal stuff that exists now yeah and they did a great job it's ages ago it's ages ago yeah i mean totally different era of college football regardless the the point i'm trying to make is is that despite the ability to recruit this is a team like we said at the beginning of the show or earlier in the show Ohio State has somewhere around 10 top 50 top 60 players in this draft maybe that's a little bit high, but they have a whole lot of players that are going to be drafted on

Starting point is 00:18:42 day one, day two. Notre Dame and Dame Bruegler's mock that he just did has two. And that's both defensive players, Xavier Watts, the safety, and I think that's a big name that we'll be talking about. And Benjamin Morrison, who is the corner that could have been a first round pick, maybe still will be a first round pick, had a hip injury that took him out for the rest of the season. Two players picked at the back of the second round, 61 and 64. And Ohio State has one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, seven players in Dan's first two rounds. It's telling you a little bit of something about the talent disparity here. But Al Golden has gotten a lot out of that defense, despite having a bit of a lower pedigree of player than the Ohio states and Georgia's of the world in terms of the recruits that they've been able to bring in.

Starting point is 00:19:31 And when we talk about some of these prospects in just a minute, they're getting that from some older players too. that again, maybe have bounced around a little bit, aren't the highest pedigree players, which is an interesting bit. So we can talk about some of those draft targets to watch in the national championship game. What if Ohio State drops 50 and wrap up some of the conversation here

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Starting point is 00:20:21 your first bet. That's $300 to keep the action going. And look, I think Ohio State certainly has a lot more talent. Will they air it out? Will Al Golden's man-to-man defense hold up against those weapons on the outside? Who knows? Maybe Ohio State turtles up a bit like they did against Michigan. If they do that, that would be a recipe for disaster.

Starting point is 00:20:40 Regardless of how you think, maybe you think the buck guys are going to roll or that Al Golden's Notre Dame fighting Irish are going to find their way into a national championship, which would be just wild. If so, I mean, just what? You can get on all the action with Fandall. Visit fandle.com to join today and get started with $300 and bonus bets. That's fandul. Make this playoff season unforgettable with Fandle, an official sportsbook partner of the NFL. A couple of topics on Al Golden as we transition and think a little bit more about this national championship game. One big one that I think a lot of people are asking about that we haven't talked about so much is how much of that defense is Al Golden versus how much of that

Starting point is 00:21:21 is Freeman. That I think is a question, especially for people that have followed UC so closely. What do you think of that real quick before we keep going? I think Freeman is a great coach. You want to talk about big what-ifs and UC football history. If during that run of the college football playoff, Luke Fickle takes the Notre Dame job, that's who Notre Dame wanted. Then Freeman. Freeman is the University of Cincinnati head coach instantly. It's an instant transition. And it's just an interesting wrinkle.

Starting point is 00:21:49 How does it impact things? So Fickle obviously not loving life right now without Freeman. I think Freeman's elite. I think he's an elite recruiter. But it doesn't mean that Marcus Freeman is the only reason why this defense is good. I think that it's a mixture. And there's a reason why he targeted Al Golden, why he was going after him. You get a guy with experience as a college head coach like that.

Starting point is 00:22:13 And so I think like everything, it's a collaboration. And they're getting the most out of these guys. And we'll see if they can do it again. But no, I don't discredit. To me, both things can be true. I think Marcus Freeman's awesome for a bunch of reasons. And I think Al Golden deserves a ton of credit as well for how he's handled this defense. I think there's some synergy there.

Starting point is 00:22:35 I think that they're on the same page that they can see things the same way is how Notre Dame followers. have described it. There's some idea melding where perhaps Golden has taken some things from Freeman and been able to incorporate them philosophically into their approach on defense, which like we've talked about, very, very man-heavy defense. And that will certainly be challenged by Ohio State in the national championship game, I think. But a very man-heavy defense that I think that it'll be interesting to see how that carries into the NFL. What does Al Golden, who has a variety of influences, right? Like he's, he's been.

Starting point is 00:23:15 around the college ranks quite a bit. He's been around Luanna Rumo in the NFL. Another influence for him, as he's certainly seen the benefits of the approach that they've taken in Notre Dame and then can apply that in the NFL if that is where he ends up. Yeah, I think. And honestly, there's been rumors about the Bears. Don't be shocked one bit if Marcus Freeman starts to get some head coaching looks NFL-wise, too. He just got an extension with Notre Dame, but that doesn't mean NFL teams don't have the money.

Starting point is 00:23:43 So probably coming soon, I would say. The one other point on Golden before we talk about the players and the game specifically is that Golden was part of, and Denbrock, the two, right? Mike Denbroke. Yeah, the first time in Notre Dame history I was reading for coordinators to get four-year deals. And that's how much they were valued when they signed those extensions.

Starting point is 00:24:10 So don't be surprised that there's a buyout too, just going back to that money topic. I think we've mentioned this on the show. If there's a buyout for that contract that the Bengals won't have to pay to free Al Golden from his contractual obligations to Notre Dame. He may have an out too, you know? A little birdie said that the house is still, he's still got his house in Cincinnati. He might have an out to come back to Ohio specifically or something where you never know

Starting point is 00:24:36 how these contracts work, man. How about that? After we joked about that, I was like, there's no way. why would he still have his house in Cincinnati? Still does. Still does. Who to thunk? Obviously not me.

Starting point is 00:24:50 Let's talk about some of the draftable players in this game. On the Notre Dame side, specifically, there's a whole bunch of guys on the Ohio State side, of course. The premier names, I think, Benjamin Morrison, Xavier Moss. We've talked about them. Dame Bruegler had them at 61 and 64 in his most recent mock draft. Benjamin Morrison turning 21 pretty soon. corner had a hip injury hasn't been able to play for the rest of the season Xavier Watts will be playing in the national championship game

Starting point is 00:25:17 and then a bunch of older players that are draft eligible as well as Jack Kaiser's 24 linebacker has played pretty well Riley Mills 23 Howard Cross 23 older than 23 actually those guys but it's not just old players on that team to be clear that they're getting success with it's not just that they have 23 year old graduate students who could be second year NFL players on that team their best player on that defense might be Leonard Moore who is a true freshman, who has been incredible for that defense this year. There's a bunch of other guys, obviously, but focusing on the guys that are draft eligible,

Starting point is 00:25:51 and particularly at the top, Benjamin Morrison, who won't be playing in the game, Xavier Watts, are a couple that are standouts when you look at pre-draft rankings right now. Oh, man, people are going to be all over Xavier Watts with the ball hawking, deep safety, just element there. He's going to be the most mentioned prospect in relation to Al Golding, assuming he gets the job. Because if there's safety's been such a thing, Jake, that it's like, finally, just get this guy and go.

Starting point is 00:26:22 But yeah, it's one of the, I'm so curious how these, any of the draft eligible Notre Dame prospects play in this game, a game that they should lose, a game that could get away from them. and so will it does it how do they respond when it starts to if it does or do they jump on them early it's so many interesting things there i will say one more thing the the owl golden versus mike denbrock i was shocked that denbrock got the the the OC job given what he did at uc or didn't do um even though they were i just little things that surprised me and by the way there's a clear reason why Notre Dame is in this position and it's not the offense

Starting point is 00:27:06 even though they have a stud running back in Jeremiah Love. It's certainly the defense. Yeah. And there's a big question, I think, looming over that defense that on paper is outmatched. And that offense might even be more outmatched for Notre Dame. When you look at the talent on both sides of the ball for Ohio State, but certainly a wide receiver, if they're going to go out there and try to play man, and we talked about a couple of these corners, Leonard Moore is a great corner.

Starting point is 00:27:31 They've had a good year from Jordan Clark by most accounts that I've, seen and those guys are stepping in without Benjamin Morrison, who on paper was the best corner for them going into the season, they're going to try to play man against those guys. It's going to be tough. Xavier Votz at the back of that defense, if he is playing, you know, center field single high cover one free safety stuff,

Starting point is 00:27:54 then that'll be fun to watch for him. It could be fun tape for him. It could be very unfun taped for him as well. Ohio State on this playoff run has scored 42, 41, and then only 28 points against Texas. So they're not unstoppable. Obviously, the Michigan game where they score 10 in their recent history. And for the most part, they're scored a lot of points, this Ohio State offense.

Starting point is 00:28:16 So there's, I think, a question that is going to come up. If it does get loft-sided, it's like, ah, well, what do you mean? It's Al Golden. Look at what just happened when he had to go against Ohio State with all those NFL players on that team. Yeah, I know it's coming. It's definitely going to happen. And so hopefully I'd rather not deal with it because it's not going to impact the hire. I promise.

Starting point is 00:28:44 Like that isn't going to, it's not going to be like, oh, man, they give up 40 to Ohio State. Clearly, we've got to go into a different direction. If they don't hire Al Golden for whatever reason, it won't be that. And all signs, again, point to that. So point to them hiring him. It's funny, though. I've mentioned Tash LaPoy a few times. And he's the Oregon defensive coordinator.

Starting point is 00:29:03 And people have brought that up. Oh, did you see him against Ohio State? State, no thank you. And it's like, do you know what Ohio State is? Like, have you seen it? Like, it's just not how it works. And so, whatever. I hope it doesn't happen. But if it does, I'm going to say whatever and not completely dismiss Al Golden because they give up a bunch of points to Ohio State. So I think it is important to have this disclaimer out there long before the game starts. We're still, what, 24, were 32 hours away from the game, 31 hours away from the game. I mean, imagine letting one game change your decision to hire a coach or not.

Starting point is 00:29:43 I mean, it was, wasn't it that the Eagles hire, the Eagles, D.C., you mentioned them earlier, who went to Arizona. Jonathan Gannon. Yeah, didn't they get blown out in his last game? Well, they could not stop the Chiefs. In the Super Bowl. In the Super Bowl. Yeah. Could not stop.

Starting point is 00:30:05 Yeah. Now, part of that was the pest interference call. Yeah. Well, we... A lot of fans are seeing the Chiefs referee thing, and it has become a huge thing. How about those comments from Ryan's and from Will Anderson? And Joe Mixon. I mean, from all of them.

Starting point is 00:30:25 C.J. Stroud, too. Like, we knew going in, how it would be. It's like... Ryan's at least like use language that might prevent him from getting fined. But it wasn't subtle. Yeah, it was not subtle. Like we knew we were going up against everybody. And I mean everybody.

Starting point is 00:30:44 Yeah. Like, oh, that's an embarrassment, really, to watch at this point. But we'll be watching, of course, the national championship game with interest. By the next time we record, we'll not have seen the national championship game. That will be after we record the next episode. So we'll probably take a look at some other topics in the next episode as we wait for the rest of this news to coales and come together for the Cincinnati Bengals. But wanted to get this out there, certainly before the national championship game so you could get our perspective before watching Notre Dame take on Ohio State from a potentially different angle, even if you are an Ohio State fan, where you'll have a different bit of intrigue in this game. Until next time, that's going to do it for this episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast.

Starting point is 00:31:27 Thanks for listening. Ho-Day and have a good one.

Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Is Al Golden the next Bengals defensive coordinator?

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