Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Mike Potts breaks down the Bengals' Draft | Part 2: Double Dips & Upside On Days 2 and 3

Starting point is 00:00:00 Mike Potts is back with us to talk about the rest of the Bengals draft picks 2 through 6 and everything that went into it in today's Locked on Bengals. You are Locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. What up Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Locked on Bengals podcast. Part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. We're your host, Jake Liskow and James Rupin. We've been covering the Bengals here on Locked-on Bengals since 2016. This episode brought to you by the Amazon Fire TV Stick 4K.

Starting point is 00:00:47 Check it out at Amazon.com slash fire TV locked on to learn more. And all the everydayers know that this was coming. If you missed yesterday's episode, though, make sure you go back and check out part one with Mike Potts where we talk about Shamar Stewart. we talk about trades and get into the beginning of the Bengals draft before we get into the rest of it today. If you're not in every day or yet, well, you can hit that subscribe button to make sure you don't miss an episode of Lockdown Bengals on YouTube or anywhere you get your podcast. And for those of you out there that make us your first listen, we greatly appreciate you and welcome you back as well.

Starting point is 00:01:22 And James, we've got a lot of fun stuff coming up today with Mike Potts as well. We do. Really excited to dive in essentially on five of their six picks. We talked a lot about Jamar Stewart yesterday. I thought it was really good stuff, good stuff on trade possibilities. Now, let's get to one of the most controversial picks of the draft. Demetrius Knight Jr., 49th overall. We discussed linebacker and much, much more.

Starting point is 00:01:43 So without further ado, it's time for Mike Potts, part two. Let's talk a little bit about Demetrius Knight specifically. Obviously, the first linebacker in a double dip, and I thought it was really interesting to hear Al Golden talk about the different vision for Demetrius Knight versus Barrett Carter and the, different ideas for the roles for those guys. This is obviously a player that's a little bit older coming into the league, but a guy that you feel can contribute right away.

Starting point is 00:02:10 What were your favorite traits that led to the consensus with the selection of Demetrius Knight here in the second round? I mean, his size, length, speed, physicality, and strength are all top of the charts. Yeah, I mean, again, you go through the production box maybe with Shamar, the age boxed with him and the experience at the position. There's going to be question marks on all of these guys. He is a guy that I think has way more upside than you would typically say out of a guy that age just due to some limited time on task at the position, bouncing back and forth

Starting point is 00:02:46 between quarterback and linebacker earlier in his career and his time at Georgia Tech and at NC Charlotte. So we think he's another guy with a ton of ups. side, a ton of physical ability. We're really excited about him. And our scouts had a vision for him even before Al was hired as the defensive coordinator. So then Al and our new defensive coaches coming in kind of aligning with that vision just, you know, strengthen the case for us with Demetrius Knight. So he's a guy that we were all very high on. And I think he's a guy that maybe with that age, you can view it as a positive in some ways in terms of his maturity and maybe his ability to come in and have an impact on the field and in our locker room really right away as a

Starting point is 00:03:30 rookie. Let's just stick with a double dip and go to Barrett Carter and then we can hit the offensive lineman. But you mentioned it with Dan Horde and then Al mentioned it right after the pick of just how high you guys had him, how he was certainly not a fourth round grade on your board. What stood out the most about Barrett Carter? And the double dip at linebackers probably something not a lot of people had, but it feels like both of these guys should be able to contribute right away. Yeah, like I said, I don't know that we went into the draft with specific designs of double dipping at linebacker. That's just the way that it worked out. He was a high guy right there at the top of our board in the fourth round. We weren't sure that he would be there at that selection,

Starting point is 00:04:14 like you mentioned, but there's a lot of things that like about him. Another guy was super high character and great makeup, but also a really good player. We think he has four down value. We think he's got really good ability and coverage. He's a really athletic linebacker. He's really instinctive, and he can run, and he can help there on special teams for sure as well. But we think he can carve out a rookie, or a role as a rookie on defense as a linebacker. So he's a guy that we just, we valued really highly throughout the process, got to know.

Starting point is 00:04:45 I asked our linebacker coach, Mike Hodges, to go down there and join me at Clemson at the pro day. So he got further exposure to him as well after we did a formal interview with him as at the Combine. So we felt really good about his makeup, his football intelligence, and just the evaluation of the player on tape. So we felt that the value in the fourth round was really good there with Barrett Carter. Big X is a nose question here for you, Mike. How much do the nicknames for linebackers play into you drafting them with the Dark Knight and the Tiger being the nicknames for these two guys? I don't know if that played in a ton with the nickname stuff, but he's, I mean,

Starting point is 00:05:24 We're looking at the tape on the guys. All the other stuff is add some good storylines and content and things like that. But we try to focus mainly on their makeup and what they look like on tape as a player. I appreciate you taking the serious deadpan reaction to that question. But on a serious note from an exes of those perspective, with two linebackers, Al Golden's talking about, all right, we've got an idea for where Barrett Carter is going to fit into the nickel and to maybe a three linebacker set.

Starting point is 00:05:55 We've got an idea of where Demetri's site's going to fit into the nickel and a three-four front versus a four-three front. Is there a difference from a schematic approach with Al Golden here that leads you to looking at these linebackers in a little bit of a different light to fit the schemes that you're expecting this year with the difference in role described for those guys based on the fronts and personnel packages described by Al Golden? I think there are, yeah.

Starting point is 00:06:21 I mean, every defensive coordinator and every defense coordinator and every coach is going to be a little bit different schematically. There's always going to be little tweaks that you make to the overall scheme and the defense. And then, you know, I think our coaches do a great job of playing to the player's strength. So maybe what your ideal vision is for the scheme, you just need to be adaptable and flexible and adjust to what we end up having on the roster. I wouldn't want to speak for Al in terms of his specifics on what he envisions for the scheme. but we do think that both of these linebackers that we took have a lot of versatility

Starting point is 00:06:55 and can carve out a lot of different roles for our defense. How often, Mike, when you guys were doing mock drafts and kind of forecasting what could happen in all the possibilities, and obviously this was certainly a possibility, but waiting until round three for a guard, and obviously someone that the coaches feel like is going to compete for a starting job right away and Dylan Fairchild. But getting to that point, how often did that happen? during the pre-draft process and then going into pick 81 was it as simple as hey we we have to address this this void on our offensive line as we try to protect Joe yeah it's it's no secret

Starting point is 00:07:34 that we need to protect our quarterback we need to prioritize the offensive line I think it was a strong priority for us there was a number of different positions that we wanted to address going in you know that interior of the offensive line was was at or near the top of the list for sure in almost all of our discussions leading into it. It'd be hard to say exactly how many scenarios that we had played out where we were taking an O-Lyman, whatever round, first, second, third, fourth round. Dylan's a guy that we felt the need met the value there in the third round.

Starting point is 00:08:09 He's a guy that we did a lot of work on throughout this process. We did a formal interview with him at the Combine. I asked Scott and pitch our offensive coordinator to come down with me to the Georgia Pro Day to get in, an extra set of eyes on Dylan. And then they had four offensive linemen coming out of Georgia this year. So we wanted to make sure we did our due diligence

Starting point is 00:08:29 and had a thorough evaluation to all of those guys. And then obviously for myself and then some of the other offensive guys that pitch was able to look at down there at Georgia, that was obviously a huge opportunity to evaluate some of the better players in the draft down there. So that was a huge piece of the evaluation for us. And he's a guy that we had strong conviction on. I think he's got as much upside.

Starting point is 00:08:51 as any offense alignment in this draft. He's extremely athletic, and I don't even think if you put on his tape this year, you're maybe even seeing the best of him because he was playing through a little bit of a calf injury for part of this year. But a lot of those guys, that's kind of how they operate down there at Georgia.

Starting point is 00:09:08 A lot of tough guys that are wired the right way, and they want to play through things, and those are the kind of guys that we're looking for in terms of the wiring, and you see that on his tape in terms of the way he finishes and the physicality that he plays with. He's another guy with a ton of upside who has a pretty solid floor, and he's a pretty darn good player right now. But another guy that we think can continue to get better and better.

Starting point is 00:09:32 So I'm really glad that he was there for us in the third round. He obviously wasn't able to complete his testing. Got a couple of the tests done, the jumps. How does, is this a GPS pick? Obviously not just a GPS pick, but is this a spot where you had some GPS data that helped to back up your idea of where his athleticism was without the full picture of his athletic testing at the Combiner's Pro Day. Yeah, we get GPS numbers on all of these guys, especially at a huge program like Georgia.

Starting point is 00:10:00 They do a phenomenal job. They treat the scouts great down there. And again, they've got high-level prospects every year coming out. So we've got GPS times or numbers on pretty much every guy in the draft. And then we've also got testing numbers from their strength staff. Their strength staff, some sources down there that I really trust. known for a long time. They said Dylan's the strongest guy in the whole program. That's one of if not the best program in the whole country. So he's extremely strong and he's really,

Starting point is 00:10:31 really athletic when you see him moving around on tape. And I think if he would have tested and done the full process, unfortunately he couldn't because of that calf injury that he was fighting through. But I think he would have put up some really good numbers if he did. Did you know your fire TV is also an Xbox? Turn any TV into your gaming entertainment hub with Fire TV stick 4K devices, no console required. Just grab your paired controller. Subscribe or sign into Xbox GamePast Ultimate with EA Play Included, and you're ready to go. Dive into hundreds of premium titles, including EA Sports College Football 25, Call of Duty,

Starting point is 00:11:04 and you can easily stream your favorite shows all with the Amazon Fire TV Stick 4K. It is awesome. And for someone like me who travels a lot during football season, you don't want to miss your favorite shows. You get into these hotel rooms. You still want to play video games. You can do all of those things with your Amazon Fire TV stick. And if you already have a console, while Fire TV Stick 4K device is more affordable and easier to travel with, allowing you to take you or your kids games everywhere you go, head to Amazon.com slash FireTV. Locked on to get started. Xbox GameP has ultimate subscription and compatible controller required available on select devices, including Fire TV Stick 4K, Fire TV Stick 4K max and Fire TVQ. Well, since Jake brought up nicknames, you clearly didn't take Dylan because of his nickname Pickle, which Amarius Mims came up with. Like, you clearly passed on, or at least disregarded that, right?

Starting point is 00:11:58 That couldn't have been a plus. I did hear about that. Maybe I need to take your guys advice and evaluate the nicknames a little bit more. But I did hear about all these nicknames that you guys mentioned, but maybe I need to weigh it a little bit more heavily. The pickle one is just wild. You're talking about a state champion wrestler, undefeated for two years. Yeah. I just, I wouldn't have, I wouldn't have guessed it.

Starting point is 00:12:22 Let's discuss the other offensive lineman you guys ended up with in Jalen Rivers. And what, to me, just reading about him and learning about him, you guys had a bunch of touch points with him. But obviously versatile. But I feel like there are guys that have length and don't know how to use it. It feels like he does know how to use it, which makes him a quality pass protector. Is that how you viewed him and what else stood out about him when you just evaluated him throughout this process? Yeah, he's a guy that we did a lot of work on as well. He obviously was at the Senior Bowl.

Starting point is 00:12:59 We looked at him even over the last several years because there was a chance he was going to come out for the draft last year. But you mentioned a lot of the things that we like about him. He's a huge guy, super long arms, really good pass protector, you know, unbelievable character. we had a conflict in terms of our coaches down there for the pro day. So that was a reason we ended up bringing him in on a 30 visit. We wanted to get more face-to-face time with him, you know, just to just to dial in on everything and kind of solidify it. He's the guy that we knew could have been a target for us

Starting point is 00:13:32 at a number of different levels throughout the draft. And I mean this when I say this in probably the most complimentary way that you can say it. His tape almost can be boring in terms of the past protection because he can make it look easy. It's not, you know, there's not a whole lot of highs and lows on his tape. He's a very consistent pass protector. The character you see show up on tape because he's very instinctive. He plays with good angles.

Starting point is 00:13:57 And his versatility is second to nobody in this draft class in terms of his ability to move back and forth between tackle and guard mid-game, you know, every single game, I believe, except for one this year. So that's extremely impressive. And he doesn't, you don't see him miss a beat on. his tape bouncing back in between two different positions. So he's the guy that's kind of easy to like. You watch the tape and you're asking yourself, like, you know, what's really the major

Starting point is 00:14:24 negative on this guy? Super high character, super pass protector, really good size. And, you know, at the end of the day, a guy with a versatility like that, we thought was somewhat of a no-brainer there in the fifth round. Played a lot on the left side at Miami. Is this a guy that you see as a player who shouldn't have an issue, pick up? up the right side as well? Is that part of the vision for Jalen? Yeah, he did play some on the right side earlier in his career, but you're right. Almost all of his snaps in his career were at left guard

Starting point is 00:14:53 and left tackle. He even did some snapping at center in practice at Miami and at the senior bowl he did some of it. So he's actually a guy that if you're talking about emergency situations and getting you out of game or practice reps or preseason games or whatever the case may be, He's a guy with potential to have position flex at all five on the offensive line. So the versatility is through the roof. He's another guy. Yeah, I mean, you mentioned that about the right side. We talked to him about that in terms of his comfort level on the right side throughout

Starting point is 00:15:24 our visit process and our interview process with him at the senior bowl as well. And he's got comfort there on the right side. That just happened to be where they needed him more so on the left side throughout his college career. So I wouldn't rule out anything in terms of alignment with him. Like I said, he's one of the more versatile guys that you can see. And we'll just have to have to let it shake out here in the OTAs and training camp as far as getting our best five offensive linemen out there and then filling in the depth pieces behind those guys. We'll have to call him Jalen Lapham, since he can play everywhere. Take a page out of Dave Lapham's a com.

Starting point is 00:16:00 Yep. Versatility is very valuable. No doubt. And the running back you guys got, same thing. It checks the production box, but it's certainly versatile. Caught 20 plus passes in three straight years. I had 1,500 plus yards over the past two years in each season. Lit up my University of Cincinnati Barracats.

Starting point is 00:16:19 I know Dan Hord mentioned that to you, too. And so Todge Brooks obviously had the Justin Hill tie as well. What stood out outside of the numbers? Because obviously the production is there. But when you watch him, what was the biggest takeaways of why you would be targeting him on day three? Yeah, you're right. The production is the first thing that stands out. You know, when we first go in our initial round of draft meetings, you bring up his profile and the guy ran for over 1,500 yards each of the past two years.

Starting point is 00:16:48 But then you look at his body tight, big, thick, dense build. He's got a really nice blend of quickness, lateral looseness, vision, power. He runs physical. He runs hard. And then he's really good on third down as well. He's got good ability as a pass protector. and he's got really good hands out of the backfield. So he's a guy that we thought was really well-rounded, and it was a really deep running-back draft class.

Starting point is 00:17:14 So I don't know if in every class he's a guy that is still there for us in the sixth round, but he's a guy that we had targeted for sure, and we felt fortunate that he was there that late in the draft. And that's a position that we went in with hopes to end up upgrading and targeting a running back, and he's a guy that we definitely had on our minds throughout the draft. I found it really interesting, Mike, the way the league approached the running back class. And everyone was happy to say, man, this running back class is awesome, it's deep.

Starting point is 00:17:44 And then it felt like despite that, or maybe because of that, some of the guys that ended up getting drafted got drafted a little bit later than maybe the public thought. Or I thought some of those guys would get picked. What was your reaction or what were your thoughts as you watched where some of these running backs got picked in the draft? Yeah, I think everybody was looking at the same thing, how deep the board was. and then you try to stay as patient as possible, and you're waiting for that run to start on the running backs. It happened somewhere in the mid-rounds. I don't know exactly what pick it was,

Starting point is 00:18:15 where there was a little bit of a run on those guys, and then maybe you hit a little bit of a lull, and then another run a little bit later on day three. So it's really just about evaluating all the options. Like you said, you analyze it from every different scenario, position value, needs, you know, all of the above. And, you know, it's hard to predict at times. The draft is, you know, you can't, you're not in the draft rooms of the other 31 teams.

Starting point is 00:18:41 So it's hard to say what other teams are going to do. And it only takes one team to like a player at a certain value and pull them off the board. But we're happy with the way it played out at that running back position for us. I've got one final question for you, Mike. We've talked about the players you picked. We've talked a lot about the process this year after the draft. You told us before we got started, you've been in a ton of meetings the last couple of days. This isn't just, oh, Mike's done with the draft.

Starting point is 00:19:06 He gets to, you know, go on a vacation at this time of year. Are those post-draft meetings focusing on what's the texture of the roster now? What are things that we might still need to do? Or what's the overall thrust of those meetings at this point in the year? Yeah, there's a number of things. We've still got our college free agents that we have to iron out. We've got our rookie mini camp coming up. You know, we'll bring in some tryout players and then some of our veteran players.

Starting point is 00:19:33 as well that are eligible for that mini camp. We'll get another look at those guys side by side with our rookie class and some of our tryout players. So that's some things that we need to iron out. You know, some of the contract things as well in the language and everything like that with our college free agents starting to work on the contracts with some of the draft picks as well.

Starting point is 00:19:54 And then our current veterans under contract. You know, there's some different things that we can do with their contracts, whether it's renegotiating or extending guys. you know, it's a constant dialogue and conversation with the agents and the representation for our players on our roster. And then you're looking out there what's outside of the organization as well in terms of free agents. Every time or every year after the draft, there's always players from other teams that end up getting spit out and put on waivers. And maybe those are guys that we look into that could upgrade the back of our roster. And then once teams go through their mini camps over these next couple weeks, the same thing will happen.

Starting point is 00:20:30 And so it's an ongoing process, just looking to upgrade the roster, looking through different administrative and contract type of issues, and it's something that'll continue all the way up until week one. Yeah, you guys did most recently, Zach Moss last week, I think, obviously Dax Hill this week. So it's, it hasn't slowed down. You guys have had to make some moves, I'm sure more are coming as well. So busy time. We certainly appreciate you coming on, Mike.

Starting point is 00:20:56 I appreciate you guys. Thanks for having you. Always great to have. have Mike Potts with us, James. One of my favorite podcasts we do every year. Not that every day isn't my favorite when I get to talk to you here on lockdown Bengals. So Mike Potts is always very insightful after the draft. And I honestly, I appreciate all the takeaways.

Starting point is 00:21:15 Still fascinated by the trade chart stuff from yesterday's show, that was one of my big surprises when I reflect on everything that we talked with Mike Potts about. But also, it sounds like it was a difficult draft for the Bengals to navigate. this year. That's another one of my takeaways talking to Pots here is there were tough decisions, especially early on. I think day three, maybe it got a little bit easier for them.

Starting point is 00:21:40 But my impression from the outside looking in as we were talking about things, we were texting about things as the draft was going on, James, was that there were some tough decisions this team had to make. And I think that's reflective in the way Mike was talking about some of these decisions. And it really goes back.

Starting point is 00:21:56 It's going to be broken record style. But when you have six picks and you have all of these different things you want to address, I think it's tough. I don't think, I agree with, I don't think they went into the draft thinking they were going to double-dip at linebacker. I think they thought there was a good chance at offensive line for obvious reasons. Defensive line would have probably been right there. Obviously, they only took one defensive lineman.

Starting point is 00:22:20 It's tough. The draft is tough and it's even tougher when you only have six picks and you have glaring holes on your roster. And so that is going to be a theme when it goes into next year. Maybe the offseason doesn't happen until February. Whenever that off season does happen, and we get to it, it's going to be like, all right, well, where are the glaring holes? You want some of those filled in solidly before the draft rolls around because otherwise

Starting point is 00:22:45 it makes it really hard. And that's why you look up. And there's some very clear weaknesses. We didn't have time to get into those specific with Mike. but spoiler i guarantee you the bengals would love to add a safety from a a football standpoint does it does it work from a budget standpoint and a uh a vision standpoint and all those things i don't know but you don't think they were in on safety in this draft of course they were you don't think they were in on defensive tackle this draft of course they were they were never going to

Starting point is 00:23:14 get everything that they they wanted to address and that's what makes it really really hard and again those are my words not mics but i do think that that's that was felt when we did did mock drafts. That was felt throughout this process for us. And I agree with you. I think the Bengals felt it as well. How many times when we were going through the predictions and projections and the various scenarios pre-draft that I tell you, well, if you do that, what are you given up? And that was the reality that they faced this year. I mean, I said it so many times, right? And that was just the same thing that they ended up facing in reality because they didn't get to trade back. And it sounds like that was in play at a couple times throughout this draft.

Starting point is 00:23:57 And so that's difficult. But as Mike said at the end there, the meetings are having now. And yesterday and today, as you're listening to this episode, they're thinking about veterans. They're keeping an eye on other teams. And we'll see if there are subsequent moves that can bolster the roster. They do still have cap space. They have a very full roster.

Starting point is 00:24:17 But depending on what moves they make and waiting to see what happens with Jermaine Pratt as of the time of recording this, they could have more cap space. And so they could make moves and we'll see what does come together, James. Like you said, we'll see what works and where they can align from a front office perspective and a coaching staff perspective as they want to bring guys in here. Yeah, I had to give a little disclaimer there because just because it makes sense football-wise,

Starting point is 00:24:43 you know, we could make the case for a lot of guys. Brain and Scherf makes sense football-wise, ooh, shocker, right? This guy makes sense football-wise. It was a little shocker, you know, so I had to give the little disclaimer there. Von Bell makes sense. Oh. Wait. I mean, rude.

Starting point is 00:25:00 Stop. Stop. Don't take shots on my guy, Von Bell. Why would you do that, Jake? I'm confused now. That's going to do it for this episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast. Really great stuff from Mike Potts, as always. Really appreciate the time and insight that he gives us every year.

Starting point is 00:25:15 Check out part one. Bengals process. And yeah, like James said, make sure you go back to yesterday's show. If you missed it, you made it all. the way to the end of this episode before you did it for some great conversation on Sharmar Stewart as well. Until next time, thanks for listening to this episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast. Ho-Day and have a good one.

Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Mike Potts breaks down the Bengals' Draft | Part 2: Double Dips & Upside On Days 2 and 3

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