Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - WAKE UP! | Frustration with Cincinnati Bengals inactivity boiling over as 2025 NFL league year begins

Starting point is 00:00:00 The Cincinnati Bengals are a long, long way from Duke Tobin's stated goal of not just paying more money for the same team. Will they get better? Let's talk about it. You are Locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. What up Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast. I'm Jake Liskow. He's James Rupin, and we are.

Starting point is 00:00:35 Locked-on Bengals covering the Cincinnati Bengals on the Locked-on podcast network, your team every day. And we've certainly been more active than the Cincinnati Bengals, James, in this free agency period. That's not saying much. An episode at least every day. And I guess technically the Bengals have made a move a day, but we don't really count the last two for much.

Starting point is 00:01:00 If you're new to the show, welcome. You can subscribe anywhere you get your podcast and on YouTube. to make sure you don't miss an episode because maybe one day the Bengals will do something and you're going to want to hit that bell. So when they do, you're notified when we have our content up to let you know what they've done and how it fits and all of those important things

Starting point is 00:01:19 as the Bengals are still trying to figure out if they can improve their roster before the draft to get back into a place where you feel like the floor isn't going to drop out from under the defense in 2025. And we're still waiting for that big move. The Bengals did bring back Cam Sample, on Wednesday who I think we expected back and I'm happy to see him back, happy to see him have a chance to make the team in camp.

Starting point is 00:01:43 I think he was a solid rotational piece for this defense coming off an Achilles injury of course, but still waiting for a move. That's going to move the needle, James. And the more we wait, the more frustrating it is for, I mean, us, frankly, and certainly all the Bengals fans out there that are clamoring for the Bengals. to do something. Yeah, I thought something was going to happen on Wednesday. It obviously didn't. We waited to the very last second. It's early Thursday morning as we record it. We're recording this. And look, it's frustrating. I get it. I get why people are wondering what the hell is going on.

Starting point is 00:02:26 I understand the frustration, not just with now the internal guys, the T. Higgins is, the T. Hedgans, the T. Hedgons, the T. Hedrickson's, the Jamar Chase is. but the external guys now because Tevin Jenkins were exactly where we thought we were yesterday at this time, 24 hours ago, literally. And you're still waiting for Tevin Jenkins and maybe that gets done at some point Thursday morning. But I'm genuinely worried now, Jake,

Starting point is 00:02:57 about the how much they do in general this free agency period. Like, let's say they signed Tevin Jenkins, which would be a nice signing. Are they going to add the second guard that I think both of us agree they should add? Kevin Zitler off the board. Are they going to add the three tech that we're talking about? A lot of those guys now officially off the board, Malik Collins, Draymont Jones, Levi-on-Zeriki, like all these guys that it's like, oh, well, that guy could help your defensive front.

Starting point is 00:03:27 That guy could up your defensive front. And you look up and they're pretty much gone. And so that's where I'm wondering, like, if they only plan on adding one guard and they were going to go into the draft looking for a three tech and find that, that defensive penetrator from a pass-rest standpoint then, how much more do they have? How much more are they going to do? Because I'm not sure I see many more moves. And they haven't, it doesn't feel like they've done much. And by the way, they still haven't gotten their stars done. And so that's what's wild to me is like the, the best.

Starting point is 00:04:02 big splash, and I say that in quotes, might be Kevin Jenkins, maybe. And if it's not, then we're talking about a Brandon Scher for someone like the Will Hernandez or someone like that. And that's not a splash. It could be an upgrade, but that's not a splash. I'd be fine with those guys for what it's worth, but that wouldn't be acceptable to be the highlight move of your free agency period, at least with Kevin Jenkins. What if it's Brandon Shepard's done?

Starting point is 00:04:29 I'm getting there. I'm getting there. Yeah. If it's Kevin Jenkins, at least there's upside. At least you have a young player who's been good. He's had injury issues, sure, but he's been good when he's on the field and he can still be a part of the team for a few years. If it's Brandon Shurf or Will Hernandez and that's it, how are you better? I mean, you've improved your guard spot.

Starting point is 00:04:50 That's great. You've got to get another one. You're going to have to do it in the draft. Now that guy needs to start. Or you got Cody Ford starting or some other player on the roster that's in a competition for that. Jackson Kirkland. I mean, that's what we're talking about in competition for the other guard spot, if that's their only move, and maybe a rookie, right?

Starting point is 00:05:10 And even if they signed Kevin Jenkins, that might be the conversation we're having. Because when you look at what I'm guessing is a remaining cash spend for this year. Big question on Trey Hendrickson. But if they were to somehow get back to the table with Trey, figure it out with Jammar, figure it out with T, that's about $40 million. in new cash for those three guys. Another like 16 or so for Kevin Jenkins. Sure, you get some money back if they make a decision on Jermaine Pratt,

Starting point is 00:05:41 who's still on the roster right now. But that's about all the money that I projected them to spend in cash in 2025. So where's the other move? Are they going to outspend my expectations? Is there a pivot to some of these guys that are still out there as we're about to enter day two of official free agency, day four when these guys can sign like Julian Blackman, Asante Samuel Jr., a different position there, looking at some defensive backs, Justin Simmons, the safety, are those guys that they're interested in talking to? Is there another defensive tackle that maybe will cost a little bit less,

Starting point is 00:06:19 but maybe they think can help rush the passer? Have a hard time finding that guy on our list for agents, certainly down in tier four before you guys. Campbell it's the only guy and calaisa scampbell it's the guy I but where I'm concerned right now James is like when I look at the money yeah like it's not telling a story that there's another move coming and that is concerning right now it's it it feels like it's going to be one guard and then you're done like pretty done like that is this is supposed to be like an era defining free agency, air defining offseason, a set the tone for Joe Burrow and set the table for Joe Burrow for the back half of the decade here. And it's like, all right, well,

Starting point is 00:07:12 you can't trouble yourself to get two guards. And I don't think they will. I think it's going to be one. They couldn't trouble themselves to get a three tech, knowing that injuries happen. Who cares if the draft is good at that position? What if Walter Nolan is gone before you want to taken? What if some of these guys, what if you don't get to defensive tackle until round three? I think that's what's scary to me is they're like backing themselves into an area where, oh, well, you need an interior pass rush for sure. You could use them up on the edge. Yeah. Like, so do both. Get a veteran and go into the draft. Like this idea that, oh, well, they just need to sign one for Alex Kappa. No, they benched their left guard at the end of the year. Cody Ford is

Starting point is 00:07:58 A fine backup is not a starter. And we've seen what happens when they draft linemen. It does not usually go well unless they're freakish Amorius Mims, right? Or a center in Matt Lee, who I think we think has upside, but we haven't seen yet. Like, it's wild to me that this, like, how is this the plant? And I really do wonder, like, if you're, we can't be. be alone here, like, and I don't mean from a fan-based standpoint, I wonder if you gave truth serum to the coaches how they're feeling right now. Al Golden, I think he feels really good

Starting point is 00:08:38 about the pass rush. You think Scott Peters, who is at Georgia's Pro Day on Wednesday, you think he's feeling great about, yeah, Cordell Volton and Cody Ford and, or do you think if you said, hey, we can get you Tevin Jenkins and Brandon Scherf? How do you think he'd feel that? Because if you did that, let's say you get Taven Jenkins, you're planning on doing that anyway. And then it's like, do you have enough money for Shurf? Well, if you cut Cordell, you're saving over $3 million in cap space. Yeah. Put that towards Shurf and get Brandon Shurf in town too.

Starting point is 00:09:15 Like it makes so much sense to do that. And I really don't think they're going to, but that's the standard we should hold them to. Or what is the market for Will Hernandez if Shurf is going to be too expensive on a one-year deal? Or Shack Mason. Shaq Mason is like fine and if a rookie takes his job a rookie takes his job but another one you know and I wonder where the market is on those guys earnestly Kevin Zitler getting nine million dollars for one year is actually more money that he's made in quite a while and when you adjust for inflation maybe it's similar to what he made on the 2021 three year deal from Baltimore but that's a

Starting point is 00:09:49 sizable deal for him it's also with Tennessee Tennessee tax of winning five games next year you know and with a coach that he's familiar with and Bill Callahan, who had him in Cleveland. But the Bengals did not call Kevin Zightley. And Scott was wondering, what's left here for the Bengals to do as they're trying to help themselves get back to a championship caliber team. We'll continue that conversation coming up next.

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Starting point is 00:11:22 50% off your first year at monarchmoney.com code locked on NFL. Again, half off your first year. at monarchmarny.com. Monarchmoney.com code locked on NFL. We've talked about this offseason, much the same way we've talked about last offseason and describing the importance to the Bengals future, the importance of reestablishing something to build on around Joe Burrow, around the stars of the team. And the stars of the team being in the air certainly throws a wrench into things as we still expect the Jamar Chase deal to get done. There's questionable reporting on T. Higgins from Cameron Wolf on Wednesday that that deal was not imminent. And Trey Hendrickson doesn't sound like the Bengals are getting what they're

Starting point is 00:12:11 asking for there. Is they're hoping for resolution on that question? And that will certainly impact things from a money perspective that I talked about earlier as far as whether or not another move is coming. But I'm just struck thinking, James, about the failures that have led to this point. And you know that that me sewing meme, the tweet from 2019 about how awesome it is when you're sewing and how bad it sucks when you're reaping what you've sewed? I'm just thinking about, yeah, man, the Bengals sure sewed themselves about you got Jackson Carmen in the second round. Zach Carter in the third round. You're waiting for Dax Hill to finally find his position in permanent home and Miles Murphy to develop. And you're not getting extensions done early with your stars.

Starting point is 00:12:58 and you watch Jesse Bates become an all-pro with another team. You got T. Hendrickson requesting a trade two years and ago. You're in a second straight franchise tag situation with T. Higgins. You've missed on your free agent acquisitions to try to replace players that have left Shelton Mankins, Nick Scott, Lale, Collins, go down a list of offensive line tackle experiments that have failed. And this is where you are now where in a year where we talked going into this free agency class a lot about how difficult it was going to be to find significant improvements to your team in this free agency class because of the quality of the group of players. And there's still guys out there that can

Starting point is 00:13:36 improve the team. And we've talked about them in this episode. It just makes me think of that meme, man. Like the Bengals made all of these mistakes in team building through the draft, through free agency, through misses, through decisions on their own guys. And now we're in this spot where even with Joe Burrow on the team and the elevator that he is. And have a few pieces on the offense, certainly more than a few when you include the guys that are not necessarily on the deals they want to be on and Jamar Jason T. Higgins, and we're still in this spot, we're still wondering if they can get a defense that can get to playoff contention. That's a crazy place to be, quite frankly, and shows years of ineptitude that have led to,

Starting point is 00:14:20 again, a crucial moment that so far, this Bengals front office hasn't been up to the task for. they haven't lived up to it at all. And I wonder, I wonder what's going on in that room. You think Duke Tovin went to the combine and said the things he said thinking that they'd be here

Starting point is 00:14:40 three weeks later, a little over, what, two weeks later, a little over two weeks later. I don't think so. Maybe I'm wrong. But it's, they're not better anywhere.

Starting point is 00:14:54 Like, where are they better? they're not they're not they're banking on development right now so hard yeah like all right out golden's on a miracle worker did you watch last year like i get it it can be better and improved like the only spot they're better is that they actually have a nose tackle like that's that's it and it's like okay well that's the

Starting point is 00:15:19 that is not even the minimum like that's the obvious like it's uh it's one of those where if they're really just planning on adding a guard and that's about it and then kind of adding around the margins after that it's unacceptable and it's going to be one of these off seasons if that's what happens even if they get their stars done that if things don't go the right way in September, October, November, December, Joe Burrow is going to think about March and what happened in March and who you drafted in December. But the March factor is so huge because he's seen the drafts over the past couple of years. He doesn't want to be going

Starting point is 00:16:11 into August, banking on a young guy to be a huge factor. You just can't because there's wildcards and you just never know how it's going to play out. Hopefully you have hits. And it's a bunch of Eric Alves that come in, earn Joe's trust early. And by mid-camp, it's like Joe's face lights up when Eric Al's mentioned would be great. How realistic is that? You just don't want to be in that position. And so that's what I keep coming back to. Like, you're frustrated, I'm frustrated, we're going to be critical. I think there's some frustration within the building. But can you imagine what Joe Burroughs thinking? And he's trying to win a freaking ring. He knows how hard it is to get there. And right now they're in a much worse position to get there than they were in

Starting point is 00:17:03 December. Then they were in January. Obviously they didn't qualify for the playoffs, but just from my roster standpoint, they haven't even taken care of that what should have been the easy stuff. And the easy stuff is keeping your own guys. And the external stuff, if you're just adding a guard and that's it, just one guard, well, T.J. Slayton, Orrin, Berks, Osai, Hill, P. Ryan, Wilson, sample, and a guard, that can't be your free agency. And yet it feels like that very well could be their free agency, which is just frightening if that's the case.

Starting point is 00:17:39 Now, that's technically not paying more for the same team, but it's pretty damn close. Pretty close. It's close enough. It's close enough for it to count to me. Yeah, you've improved a guard, and that is important. Don't let my tone fool you. It is important, but that being all they do with, but the issues they had on the defensive side of the ball is simply not enough. And like I said, they're in this place or trending toward this place.

Starting point is 00:18:04 And it doesn't necessarily need to go that way, right? Like there could be a couple of other moves. There's still some guys out there that could be important rotational pieces on the team or even starters. And that's outside of the guard position where there are multiple players that fit that bill. But the way that it is trending and the concern is that they've painted themselves into this corner where they're going to have no margin for error in the draft and in development and for injury. and this team does not look like it can handle a no margin for error situation. The offense probably can, assuming that Joe and T and Jemar are on the team and they have their tackles and they have Ted,

Starting point is 00:18:51 they have all those pieces on offense. They have Mike Keseki back. But is that enough? B.J. Hill was talking in his press conference about the defense playing better at the end of the year against a bunch of bad teams, but they were playing better at the end of the year. is that is that where they are in the building are they buying that because that is worrisome you know what that is that's that's that's that's that's that's a mid 2000s bengals Carson era in in I I'll I'll trademark this now I've started saying the Carson clock it feels like we're in like

Starting point is 00:19:27 2008 of the Carson clock and Joe isn't going to be as patient as Carson was And so pretending that, oh, this change in defensive coordinator, I remember when Chuck Bresnahan was going to save the Bengals defense. And by the way, this is nothing to do with Al Golden. I think Al Golden is going to help. I think changes do matter. I do think that the coaching staff is going to be better than it was last year and just being more in sync. And great. But you still need talent.

Starting point is 00:19:59 And you can't just get that talent in the draft because you're in win now mode, not re-bubes. build retool mode. And you can retool in free agency. It's modern day NFL. Windows can open very, very quickly. And this was about the Bengals opening the window, the championship window, wide open. And they have not done that so far in free agency. We'll continue the conversation coming up next. Today's show is brought to you by Fandul. Fandul is America's number one sports book. And maybe you think James and Jake, y'all are crazy. The Bengals, they are going to make it to Santa Clara. They're going to make it to Super Bowl 60, bullish on Joe, bullish on Jamar. I'm not sure anyone's there right now. That's listening or watching. But if you are,

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Starting point is 00:21:23 I do want to talk about what the Bengals can still do in this free agency period to salvage it, because like I said, it's not over. We don't want to dunk too hard on them for something that isn't over yet. conduct on them for the failures that got them to this point. And I think I was pretty clear on that with my rant to start our previous segment, James, with all the mistakes that led to this moment, not getting some of these deals done when they had an opportunity to get them done to have so much more financial flexibility this offseason. Like if you're paying Jamar and T and T and Trey last off season,

Starting point is 00:21:52 you sure do have a lot more resources this off season to make sure you get the guys you need in the free agency class. Maybe one more upgrade that you've ruled out financially that you probably didn't have to. but that's besides the point. But the other thing that stands out to me before we talk about what they can do that may still help us to move the needle or help us perceive that the needle can move in 2025 to be more accurate is the magic that seems to happen

Starting point is 00:22:20 when we leave the house change doesn't seem to work so well anymore, man. I've been leaving my house at least once a day for a couple hours. I know you've had a couple things. Today I went to the gym and then we went to Matry just opened up a place at Summit Park in Blue Ash like where the old the old airport used to be

Starting point is 00:22:43 and dude I thought for sure we we were going to get because you were basically leaving when I was coming back home I was like all right there's definitely going to be something that happens and I was constantly looking at my phone constantly looking nothing happened. Not literally, nothing happened.

Starting point is 00:23:04 I was just stunned. And yet here we are. That's why we pushed the show. That's why we're recording so late. And now into Thursday morning, I was like, something's going to happen. Like,

Starting point is 00:23:13 there's no reason we should record early. Something will happen. Well, joke is on me, Jake, let's go. Both of us. I mean,

Starting point is 00:23:21 this is two days in a row. We've waited until late. And for what? I mean, now, again, I'm going to wake up on the West Coast here,

Starting point is 00:23:30 sometime when there's a six on the clock and not be able to fall back asleep because of the adrenaline rush and cortisol dump that's going to happen when I'm like, oh, where's seven check is signed? Surely, surely that's happened this morning, but no. And then I'll just be tired. I'm going to be tired too.

Starting point is 00:23:51 Talk about that. Oh, don't remind me. I literally fell asleep for like an hour this afternoon. Nothing happened then either. The magic is of us being. out available spurring moves, I think, is past. But Tevin Jenkins would help, help us think that the team's gotten better in a particular spot.

Starting point is 00:24:10 Kevin Jenkins would join T.J. Slayton and improving the Bengals in one specific area, a guard and nose tackle. Callais Campbell, we mentioned earlier. That would help. Julian Blackman, I mentioned earlier. I think that is a much more remote possibility, but I think that would help improve the safety position. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:24:27 Go ahead. maybe that's maybe hopefully that's where they go like i don't think that they entered free agency thinking oh well we'll upgrade safety but maybe they look at it and they say okay well if we're definitely going to address that that three tech spot the interior pass rush well let's let's at least get a safety to kind of stabilize that room so we don't have to because as of now it's like well they want a pass rush early probably too they want a safety relatively early they want to guard relatively early. Like, there's only so many early picks, Jake.

Starting point is 00:25:00 Yeah, too. To get all this. Two of them. And they had this idea for a trade with Trey Hendrickson, but then that creates another hole and that doesn't seem to come together. And we still need to see what's going to happen there, right? Like, if he's gone, then, man, I feel like the tenor gets worse. And I don't have a great feel for what's going on there.

Starting point is 00:25:26 the silence could mean, and the fact that all these teams are spent all this money, could mean that a trade return in some way, shape, or form is more likely. But just to continue on the list of things the Bengals could do to improve their team, I think a lot of it is at guard at this point and maybe finding one more edge rusher. And I mentioned Dennis Gardek yesterday from Arizona, who has been a very productive designated past. rusher there's some other guys that could come in in that role who can maybe give you something Morgan fox another one that's had pretty good pass rushing productivity from the chargers

Starting point is 00:26:07 and if they wanted to go younger and take a swing on an upside guy who would probably be a one-year prove-a-deal calave on chase on would fit that mold but in do it in the number of players that you could talk yourself into making the Bengals better in 20 years. I mean, that list is short and getting shorter, probably by the time people are listening to this episode. Yeah, it is. And that's like Joseph Tryon Chiranka, and I might have got it wrong, but Joe Tryon, former first rounder, signed with the Browns for like $4 million. Like those are the type of flyers, like just one of those guys.

Starting point is 00:26:48 Just another guy, like would have been nice. I would have preferred on the interior. I just think it's harder to find, and I know you could find it as a rookie, but it would be nice to get one more there. But adding those type of pieces can make a difference. That's why I think two guards versus one. That's probably like a $6 million different. Like it doesn't have to be a huge number. Shaq Mason maybe even less than that.

Starting point is 00:27:13 And by the way, former teammate with Ted Karras, like, I think it would make a lot of sense if they're worried about money. it's uh they can still add and it be a a very like if they if they went Campbell calais Campbell tevin Jenkins and or or will Hernandez let's say and brandon sure or shack Mason and you get two guards that you think can start plus you had a a proven defensive lineman I'd feel pretty good that isn't crazy money here. We're not asking them to go get the huge free agent that's going to command a ton of money. Like these are just solid moves that can really change

Starting point is 00:28:00 their depth in the way they can operate this for the rest of the offseason and in the draft. And that's what I want. I want unlimited flexibility. So if a safety is there at 17, you're comfortable doing it or if it's it, you know, because that's the number one player on your board or it's a pass brusher, great, or it's a guard, great, that's fine. Like, go with the best player available, and right now I think they're pretty stuck going edge slash defensive tackle with their first pick.

Starting point is 00:28:35 Maybe first two. And maybe. And that's just a really crappy position to be in. And you could easily miss doing that if you're going to force it that way, and they may have to. And they've put themselves in this position seemingly on repeat lately, where it's pretty easy to say, well, last year, it's going to be a tackle. Amarious Men's made sense at this time of year last year. Yeah. We talked about it for a long time.

Starting point is 00:29:03 We're probably going to be talking about Walter Nolan and Derek Harmon and James Pierce and Mike Green and probably some guys who are less interested in the Bengals drafting at the edge position. probably for a long time. And they're going to need a linebacker too. There's no linebackers out there that are very exciting at this point. So the list of needs still exists. And the list of guys that can make you better is getting shorter. And that doesn't mean they can't find a reclamation project and win and find that contributor that way.

Starting point is 00:29:37 But the margin for error right now feels slim. It was always slim. Don't get me wrong. It was a bad free agent group. doing nothing for two days except for bringing back your own guys on close to veteran minimum deals camp sample Marco Wilson

Starting point is 00:29:50 that's just not enough man not for the standards that we were hoping to see them hold themselves to this off season the standards that we were holding themselves holding them to this off season the standards of Joe Burroughs holding them to this off season

Starting point is 00:30:06 and they got to turn it around they do and they need to be aggressive I keep trying to hammer that part home. Aggressiveness is the difference. Aggressiveness wins. I know people that are going to feel the same exact way. Hopefully, Troy, Katie, Duke, the powers that B do.

Starting point is 00:30:27 And obviously, we're not going anywhere. We're around. Even though we went out, Jake, we were around. And we'll be back later today at some point. Win, lose, or draw. Hopefully it's a win. Hopefully there's some moves to talk about. We'll continue to stay active even if the Bengals don't,

Starting point is 00:30:48 but let's not do that again. Please. I'll believe it when I see it, though, man. You're talking about stay aggressive. You're talking about the standard you hold for them, and I'm firmly and believe it when I see it at this point. The way they're structuring contracts, the way they're spending money.

Starting point is 00:31:05 Hopefully we have something to talk about to you coming soon here on Lockhe down Bengals. Like 1993. unclear. That's going to do it for this episode of the Locked-on Bengals podcast. Until next time, thanks for listening. Who today? Have a good one.

Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - WAKE UP! | Frustration with Cincinnati Bengals inactivity boiling over as 2025 NFL league year begins

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