Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Wild Card round provokes another round of "what ifs?" and lessons learned for the Bengals, and what about Mike Zimmer?

Episode Date: January 13, 2025

The Wild Card round of the NFL playoffs was an exercise in mostly lopsided games. It was hard to watch without thinking that the Cincinnati Bengals could have done some damage if they had done their jobs better early in the season. Jake Liscow and James Rapien break down the "what ifs" and the obvious lessons the Bengals can learn from this year's Wild Card round. Plus, the Dallas Cowboys are set to turn over their coaching staff, and that means Mike Zimmer will be available, so the guys break down whether he should be considered for the DC job. Join the Locked On Bengals Insider Community! https://joinsubtext.com/lockedonbengalsFind and follow Locked On Bengals on your favorite podcast platforms:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/locked-on-bengals-daily-podcast-on-the-cincinnati-bengals/id1159723162Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7AObc0lh0WmQl5fJVgtajsGoogle Podcasts: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vbG9ja2Vkb25iZW5nYWxz?sa=X&ved=0CAYQrrcFahcKEwio_sXtj8nuAhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQAgStitcher: https://www.stitcher.com/show/locked-on-bengalsSupport Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!Turbo TaxReady for stress-free taxes and the most money back, guaranteed? Head over to TurboTax.com today and get matched with your Expert—who’s ready to take your taxes off your plate, so you can focus on your day.LinkedInLinkedIn Jobs helps you find the qualified candidates you want to talk to, faster. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.com/LOCKEDONNFL. Terms and conditions apply.PrizePicksDownload the app and use code lockedonnfl to win $50 instantly when you play $5. You don't even need to win to receive your $50 bonus, it's guaranteed! Prizepicks. Run Your Game.Click Here: https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/LOCKEDONNFLGametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off your first purchase. Terms Apply. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime.FanDuelYou can start the season with a big return on FanDuel. New customers can place a FIVE DOLLAR bet and you’ll get started with TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS in BONUS BETS - if you win your first FIVE DOLLAR BET ! Visit FANDUEL.COM to get started. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

With the wild card round of the 2024 AFC playoffs in the books, let's talk about the what-ifs and lessons learned after watching a weekend of disappointing games. You are Locked-on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. What up, Bengals fans, and welcome to another episode of the Locked-on Bengals podcast. I'm your host, Jake Liskow. He's your host, James Rupin. We are Locked-on, Ben-Bengals.

on the lockdown podcast network, covering your team every day on YouTube and everywhere you get your podcast. Welcome back to all of you that make lockdown Bengals part of your everyday routine, especially those of you who make us your first listen. We appreciate all of you who don't miss an episode more than we can say. And welcome in to everyone who is listening or watching Locked on Bengals for the first time. If you're doing that and you're looking to stay up to date on all things Bengals throughout this DC search and this crucial offseason that will be pivotal with all the more. money the Bengals have to spend in a very important draft, as they all are coming up,

while you're in the right place and you can subscribe to make sure you don't miss an episode. Today's episode brought to you by Game Time, where you can save $20 on your first purchase of tickets using promo code locked on NFL. James, let's dive into the wildcard weekend that was. We saw disappointing, lot-sided games throughout the AFC. We saw the bills blow out the Broncos, the Ravens in a game. that wasn't close against the Steelers who backed into the playoffs and the Texans, and probably the biggest surprise of the weekend with a very lopsided victory over the Chargers

in which Justin Herbert had a terrible game. And watching those games, it was hard not to think about, the Bengals had a chance to do some damage here if they had just gotten in. Yeah, the Bengals are probably, if flaws in all, I think they're the fourth best team in the AFC. I really do. I think they're better than the Steelers. I think they're certainly better than the Chargers,

even though they lost of the Chargers. They beat the Steelers. So Pittsburgh fans go argue with the Wall, beat them last week. And they were able to handle business against the Broncos. And don't try to sell me on the Texans. I mean, Jake Liscoe at quarterback probably beats the Houston Texans. They were left for dead in that first half.

It was awful. They were dreadful. And everyone remembers, the end after four interceptions and that last drive where Joe Mixon's running the ball. The Houston Texans stink. And so lucky Kansas City gets to play Houston. And yeah, Rex Ryan called that a buy for the Chargers. I think it's a buy for the Chiefs this week. Hopefully the Texans prove me wrong. I don't expect that. So I think four of those seven teams are pretty not just flawed, but kind of bad, kind of bad. And it's certainly something that I think a lot of Bengals fans, I'm sure a lot of Bengals

players, coaches, even non-coaches, some of the guys that are no longer on the staff, I know I was thinking about it on Saturday and Sunday, like, man, what if, what if they had just gotten in, you know, it's, they are clearly better than some of these teams that made the playoffs. But when you don't handle business, I'm not blaming anyone else but them. When you don't handle your business, it doesn't matter if you're better. It matters what your record is. And so it's twofold there.

It's like, ugh. what if they had just found a way to win one more game? The same time, they got to win one more game, and they have no one to blame but the team in the mirror. Yeah, there are obviously many individual plays and players and moments that we've talked about throughout the season. And that's part of the what if, too, right? The game that we've been playing with the season all along,

it's just refreshed. The scab torn off. I think it reopens the wound a little bit when you watch some of these games, and you see these teams that don't seem to belong in the playoffs. And maybe, you know, if the Bengals sneak in as a seven-seventh seed, maybe the Bills boat race to Bengals too, right? I think that Joe Burroughs' offense is doing a whole lot more

than the Bo Nix offense did against the Bills. Maybe the Bengals defense doesn't hold up to the bills, just like the Broncos defense, which is a good defense, didn't hold up to the bills in Josh Allen, 31 to 7 in that game. Sure. But there are opportunities throughout this season for us to say then, What if the defense was just average?

And instead of one of the worst in the NFL too often? What if they could play a complete game against the Chargers, against the Ravens, where they played one half of stopping football in those games, and it just wasn't enough? Or if the offense had been able to capitalize on those halves where the defense did do enough and the lack of complimentary football all year, what if the Bengals had gotten a little bit more complimentary football? And it managed to be a six-seat or a five-seat. and had an opportunity to play one of these teams that they either have had close games with already this year in the Chargers and the Ravens. And both of those games, they had opportunities to win or even if they had managed to beat the Chargers in that game and also beat the Ravens in one of those two games.

And then maybe you're talking about an AFC champion team, their AFC North champion team and a whole game. And they're close to it, right? And they're just, they didn't do it. And so it just reopens those what-if questions in a big way. for me when I watched a lot of these AFC games this weekend. Yeah, I mean, if they had won two, let's say Patriots Chiefs.

Well, now we're talking about, our Patriots Chargers. We're talking about going to Houston. And I can promise you the result wouldn't have been what that result was. I mean, that was just awful. That's a Justin Herbert meltdown right there. And Burrough doesn't melt down. He's never melted down.

Not like that. You mentioned and not like that on the big stage. You mentioned the possibility of the bills blowing out the Bengals. The Bengals haven't gotten blown out this year. There's one time against the Eagles. That's it. And even when it almost got away from them against the Steelers, they rallied and had a shot there.

And so it is. It's a bunch of what-ifs. In a season full of what-ifs, a wild card round of the playoffs happens. And I would pick that, let's say the Bengals got together right now and played in the Walmart party. lot against these other teams like Travis Kelsey mentioned. And they had to play the Chargers. I picked the Bengals. And they had to play. I'll throw the Texans in there. I would pick

the Bengals. And they had to play the Steelers of Broncos. They just beat those teams in the past couple of weeks. If you don't like it, whatever, I would still pick the Bengals. And that's, that's what's infuriating about this team is you didn't have to play your best ball in September. You just had to play ball in September. You just had to get two wins in September. And we're having a different conversation and you're having a shot at it. And also the other thing that I think is really important to hammer home here, this idea that the bills would have loved and would have rather. And I got on a Twitter debate. Who was it? It was with one of those former chiefs linemen. I forget his name. That's always on Twitter. But I got into a debate last week like,

yeah, the bills wouldn't have wanted to see the Bengals. Of course, they would much rather see the Denver Broncos. That point is. proven. A lot of people listening, watching, shared that, I believe, shared that view. It's not like I was original in that take. I think that that point was hammered home and proven, for sure. Yeah, it was one of the Schwartz's. I'm sure. Yeah, one of the Schwartz's, yes. There was a big narrative last week, of course, that Joe Burrow and the playoffs would have been a lot of fun. Absolutely true. And then there's this counter narrative that is nobody's scared of the Bengals. This team can't beat anybody that's won a game. And meanwhile, there's a bunch of people calling the Ravens,

the hottest team in football right now. And the Ravens have beaten the Giants, the Steelers, the Texans, and the Browns to be the hottest team in football going into the playoffs. And so I don't know how you can separate those two things. If you're calling the Ravens is the hottest team of football, you're saying nobody should be afraid of the Bengals. And you're citing the quality of the teams, the Bengals have beaten in their win streak to finish the season. but somehow the Ravens win streak is better, I guess because it included the Steelers who were technically a playoff team

and the Texans who just won a playoff game, both of whom Texans, I would argue, are relatively fraudulent as far as the true contender conversation goes. And you know this about me, Jayes. My threshold for quote unquote good NFL team is like the best four teams in the NFL.

Yeah. So, you know, I don't think that they're necessarily a bunch of good teams left in the playoffs when we look at it. So a lot of what, that you can talk about that way, but that's part of what the Bengals have to take away from this season. You don't want to be in the situation where you're looking at the wild card round

and you're thinking, man, we could have won that game. You never want to be there again. And so you have to look in the mirror and not only self-scout, but also take away some lessons from these teams that had success in the playoffs. On both sides, the AFC and NFC, obviously the focus on the AFC, where I would expect the Bills and the Ravens and the Chargers and the Texans, I would expect all those teams to be around. Despite what I think about some of those teams this year,

they're probably in the playoff conversation again next year, probably more of what you have to deal with. So when you're thinking about your future, you also always, every year, I think, can take away lessons from these playoff games. And we'll continue to watch this throughout the playoffs. Let's talk about some of those lessons the Bengals can take away coming up next. This is a message from sponsor Intuit TurboTax. Taxes was waiting and wondering, wondering, and worrying if you were going to get any money back. And then waiting,

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Only available with TurboTax Live full service. Real-time updates only in iOS mobile app. See guaranteed details at turbotax.com slash guarantees. James, you're watching Wildcard weekend. What were your biggest takeaways? Were there themes that you notice? I'll talk about some of the things I notice as well. I'm going to talk about Joe Brady at some point here too

because I think the bills and Joe Brady are a little bit fascinating to discuss here, especially as it pertains to Joe Burroughs specifically. But as you watch these games on the whole, what were some of the big takeaways from you that could be lessons learned for the Cincinnati Bengals as they think about 2025? Do you think Lamar Jackson is going to win MVP? I do think Lamar Jackson is heavily favored to win MVP. If not, it'll be Josh Allen.

right those yeah i mean the all pro voting always lines up with the MVP okay no the reason i'm bringing it up is because both of those teams ran the crap out of the ball and really leaned on the run game the ravens ran it 15 straight times against the rough and tough steelers that have this identity the steelers rough and tough not true soft and not tough good lord anyways i don't want to hear that when your division rival runs it through you 15 straight times that's what lamar and the ravens did with Derek Henry. And it worked. Obviously it worked.

They're racking up 300 rushing yards. Meanwhile, the bills, it was kind of, it was kind of Bengals-esque. They were moving the ball consistently. And they had to settle for field goals in the red zone. We've seen that from the Bengals at times. And Josh Allen makes this wild throw, the Ty Johnson, who makes the best catch probably of the playoffs, we'll see, but certainly of the first round, the wild card round. And that breaks the game open a bit.

But they were relying on the run game as well. And they have. I mean, James Cook, I think, finished with 16 touchdowns. But the thing that I think relates to the Bengals, we know Joe's awesome. We know Jamar and hopefully T. Awesome. Chase Brown has taken a step. You hope he takes another step. But it is nice.

When things get stagnant or you're getting stopped in the red zone or you're trying to put a game away. Or maybe you're trying to start by not letting Lamar and the Ravens take control of the game. it's nice to have a run game to lean on at times. And I think the Bills and the Ravens, and even the Chiefs, which we didn't see this weekend, but we'll see them this coming week, they can lean on the run game.

Throw Houston in there as well. They did. And that weird, wacky, wild game, they were able to lean on the run down the stretch. Yeah, it's not that we're advocating, and I don't think this is your point,

and I'll let you clarify it, that the Bengals take the ball out of Joe Burroughs hands. Nobody is asking for that, especially James Rapine. If you've ever listened to this show before, You know that that is not what James is saying. But you look at the results, and we're recording this before the Rams have played the Vikings. That game moved to Monday night.

So we have five wildcard games in the books. Four out of the five wildcard victors ran the ball more than they threw the ball. And most of those significantly so. The Eagles ran the ball 34 times to 21 passes for Jalen Hertz. Jalen Hertz was sacked a couple of times. I'm sure he scrambled a couple of times. But you get the idea. That's a significant split.

But the closest was the Texans who ran the ball just one more time, which includes kneel downs. So they probably had not including kneel downs. I think there were kneel downs in that game. More passing attempts and rushing attempts would technically finish with more rushes and passes. Another one that's very close. But in exception, the commanders have 35 attempts to 33 rushes. The Ravens, though, 50 rushes in that game to 21 passes for Lamar Jackson. The bills, 26 passes for Josh Allen, 44 rushes for the team, including eight Josh Allen rushes,

and the Ravens had, of course, 15 Lamar Jackson rushes sprinkled in there. So the point here is, while those quarterbacks pass the ball really well, Josh Allen's passing line is awesome in this game. And his contributions as a runner were critical. Lamar Jackson's impact as a runner, obviously critical. His passing line, hyper-efficient, 16 for 21, two touchdowns, 175. But, and we've talked about this plenty, this isn't something new, this isn't novel, this is throughout the history of football, you have to be able to run the ball to finish games, especially in the playoffs. And we saw a lot of these teams have a lot of success with that, including the Texans in a big way where you talk about the Ravens running the ball down the Steelers.

So it's a Texans able to finish off that game with a significant running drive featuring a lot of Joe Mixing that a lot of Bengals fans are very aware of and are talking about. And so what the Bengals can take away from this, especially the Bills example is where I want to go next, is that even though you have that guy at quarterback, as you started this segment, a couple of MVP candidates there with the biggest split of significantly more running plays than passing plays for those teams in these playoffs, you have to be able to run the ball the way the NFL is going right now.

It needs to be something you're competent at, to be a complete offense. You need to be at least competent. And that's not exactly where the Bengals are right now. They're very inconsistent with it. And when the defense knows it's coming, the Bengals are getting like two yards of pop. They're not running the ball to finish games this year,

the way they did two years ago in 2022, which is the last time I think they were able to do it with any bit of regularity. Yeah, I think they blow out the Steelers if they could have ran the ball effectively. They had a two-score lead. Like a lot of these guys, games that finished where it's like down to the wire, the Broncos, I think they're able to

control it a bit more after they had seized control of the game and end it. And so it's not just in games they lose and losses where we look at it. It's like, man, these close wins that they had down the stretch might not have needed to be that close. Those Ravens games, if they're able to run the ball, maybe you're not throwing a pick on a slant to Marlon Humphrey in that first Ravens game. Yeah, in that first Ravens game after Lamar lets the ball go through his hands, you get the ball. Maybe running the ball gets you closer than 53 yards. Maybe it leads to an explosive game-ending touchdown. You just never know.

And so, yeah, I think that element of it, you're going to talk about the scheme part, I think. That's why you mentioned Joe Brady. But the personnel, the guards, you need some guys that are going to be able to run through, run through guys, and really be these tough physical blockers, regardless of who you're playing. Baltimore didn't care. Baltimore didn't care that they were playing Pittsburgh in this rough and tough Steelers team. No, they didn't care. They were like, all right, well, we're going to run the ball, and you're not going to have any answer.

And Lamar is a big part of that. There's no doubt. But the bills are going to see the Ravens this week. Do we have any doubt that both of those teams are going to try to run the ball? Of course they are. It doesn't mean that Lamar and Josh, they're not going to have to go win it. But having that would help for sure. And so I think there's a scheme element, and there's certainly a personnel element.

both need to be addressed in the coming days, weeks, and months. Yeah, it's not just one or the other. It's getting guys that are able to physically displace in the run game and is marrying up your scheme to your passing game. And that's what Joe Brady has done so well, the reason that, you know, back after the Pittsburgh game, for example, when there was a lot more, the Pittsburgh lost, when there's a lot more like, fire everybody, blow it up.

And people are talking about Ben Johnson. People are talking about Joe Brady at the time. I'm kind of thinking, like, is there actually a fit between Ben Johnson and Joe Burrow? And then if it's Joe Brady, why would that be any different? Wouldn't that just be the same Joe Burrow offense that we've seen him be so successful in going back to LSU, where he and Joe Brady were together? The answer to that question is actually no.

The reason that Joe Brady and the bills have been so successful since they let Ken Dorsey go last year is the willingness to marry the past game to the run game. Obviously, they have a huge. schematic advantage because those quarterbacks exist and they can run a read option with those guys or those guys can be such a part of your running game that you have to account from them. And Joe Burroughs is a good scrambler, but he's not those guys as a runner. So you're not going to have a significant read option game as part of your development in the Bengals offense. But you could look at the bills and see what they're doing with the extra linemen stuff in their run game

and going under center with Josh Allen and incorporating that into their past game as well. and having those things married so well together. And that's where I'm really impressed with Joe Brady, is that he went from the guy that put Joe Burrow in this situation, getting guys into the pattern, really setting the groundwork for the Joe Burrow offense that we see today. And then you watch that game and you watch the bills this year, and they're doing so much, they're leading the league in extra linemen sets,

and they're getting explosive passing plays off of heavy extra linemen sets because they're building the past game and the run game in such great synchronization. if that's a word. Yeah. Yeah, no, it is a word. And if not, it is now official word of lockdown bengals. I have one thought on that when you talk about Joe Brady,

and then we have to get to a familiar face as well. But my final thought on Joe Brady coming up next. Today's show is brought to you by GameTime. Game Time is the app you need. Download it right now, literally right now, unless you're driving, of course, wait until you're done driving. But if you love going to live events, and you do. I guarantee you do. Whether it's sports, music, theater, comedy, game time is going to help you get there.

And it's just going to make the entire process easier. It's going to save you money. It's going to be convenient. It's going to be easy to use. And they made it so easy with their new game time picks feature. This feature filters out of the fluff. It filters out of great stuff. It filters on great stuff. It's a lot on NFL. So you don't have to waste time searching through thousands of tickets. Take the guesswork out of buying tickets with game time. Download the game time app. Create an account. Use code locked on NFL. for $20 off your first purchase. That's code locked on NFL with the GameTime app. Terms apply. Again, creating an account and redeem code L-O-C-E-D-O-N-N-FL-L-O-N-FL-N-FL-O-N-FL-L-N-FL-O-N-FL-O-N-FOL, download game-time. What time is it? Game time. All right, Jake, as far as Joe Brady is concerned, that's something that in the back of my mind,

and I've thought about this for the past week, probably about week. I was going to say week or two, but the season's been over for a week, and I didn't really let my brain get there. Obviously, the Bengals are keeping Zach Taylor. But if you're a Bengals fan, you'll want Joe Brady to stay. put this cycle. Just wait one more cycle, just in case. Just in case things don't go right.

You want that option available. You don't want him to get a head coaching job now. And I'm sorry, Joe, I'm not rooting against you, Mr. Joe Brady. I don't know you, never met you. But it would be nice to have that option as a possibility with Joe and Jamar and whoever else could potentially be on the roster next year that knows Joe Brady. I have come to a point where I think I fully. agree with that. Of course, this can change over time. There was a period of skepticism with Joe Brady

when he transitioned to the NFL. But I think that his ability to adapt and incorporate new ideas and involve his offense that we've seen in Buffalo. And like I said, really the willingness to marry and lean into the run game and incorporate that with the past game and really integrate those things, which is something that we've been talking about with the Bengals for years now, hopefully the transition to a new offensive line coach gives Zach Taylor, Dan, pitcher the opportunity to embrace and get on the same page and do the same thing. It's been really impressive for Joe Brady.

And as part of the reason that I've really changed my tune, thinking about Joe Brady's ability as a coach, I think he's every bit living up to the kind of prodigy label he got all those years ago. And by the way, maybe Zach and Dan with new personnel and new offensive, maybe it all comes together and it doesn't matter. Right? But it's always good to have options. It just is. And so that would be the one thing is it's like, yeah, let's wait a year, Mr. Joe Brady, just in case, just in case. That's all. It's an interesting thought. But, you know, I think ideally, given the reality that we live in, we see the Bengals transition to that world where the new offensive line coach and run game coordinator is just a perfect fit for what Joe Burrow wants to do, what Zach and Dan pitcher want to do. that thing synced up in Cincinnati.

Now you're talking about options and the luxury of options. Talking about options. Sounds like. Options. Mike Zimmer. I'm supposed to be the franchise player and you're talking about options. Oh, that was practice. Go ahead.

If you're interested in Mike Zimmer as a D.C. and a reunion in Cincinnati with the Bengals having that job still open, I actually have a bit of a hard time making a case for Zimmer looking at his most recent results both his head coach in Minnesota and his one year in Dallas, but I would be remiss, I think, to totally dismiss the idea of what are your thoughts, James? Yeah, I think he's still a good coach. Obviously, personnel matters always. It was a weird year in Dallas.

I was looking at the numbers. A lot of them would be negative. I could look at turnovers as positive. I could say middle of the road in some categories. Like, it just depends on what you want to look at. Ultimately, though, it's like, all right, well, what about the fit? And I think the reason why they didn't jump at, not that they haven't kicked the tires on, but they didn't jump at Dennis Allen, right?

Or some of these veteran coaches. Not that they aren't interested. There might be some interest there in Matt Eber flus and some guys, but fit. They want the right fit. And I just wonder, I don't know. I don't know the answer to this. Would Mike Zimmer, a known for his toughness, non-sugar coating being very clear, direct, and I think tough personality with players in a good way, right?

He's trying to get the most out of them, but that's what he's known for. Is that what they're looking for at 68 years old and what was in Dallas for one year and then was consulting for a few years after losing that Vikings head coaching job? I don't know. I don't know how it would fit. What I do think, though, Jake, he's still well respected in the building. A lot of people in that building still hold him in high regard. And so I'm not willing to just dismiss it.

But I'm not sure that he was ever on Zach Taylor shortlist. Not saying that he isn't, but I would lean toward him not being on it. Like if you had to have me guess, Zach Taylor shortlist, I'm not sure Mike Zimmer would be on it. He might be on Mike Browns, might be on the front offices. And so I do think that's interesting too. But I would be sort of surprised, I think, because of the fit. I'm not sure that they would view him as a fit. Yeah, and at this point, I don't think, given the decision to keep Zach Taylor and move on from other coaches, that this is an instance where the front office is going to put their thumb on the scale and say, we're going to hire Mike Zimmer.

If you're going to keep Zach Taylor and you're going to make the choice to believe in Zach Taylor, you've got to let Zach bring in the coaching staff that he wants and ride or die with that coaching staff. Crash and burn or win the race, you know, whatever is. Brady needs to wait, wait, Joe. Well, as a contingency plan, right? But the other thing with Zimmer that I think is interesting is, I mean, unless you just want to waste a year, which I don't think any of us are interested in. No. You got to still try to win in 25.

The other thing with Zimmer that I think is challenging is you just look at the recent results. And in 2024, running the Dallas defense, they gave up the second most points per game in the NFL. His last couple of years in Minnesota, it wasn't so good. either it was like the 10th worst scoring defense in the NFL in 2021, his last season in Minnesota, the third worst yardage defense. In 2020, it was a fourth worst points per game defense in the NFL. And again, one of the worst yards per game defenses in the NFL, the six worth yards per game defense in the NFL.

Go back to 2019, that's the last time Mike Zimmer's team fielded a great defense. They were top five scoring defense in the NFL really good that year. and as far as yards per game, again, a top, relatively top unit, giving up more yards per game than points per game in terms of rankings. But it's been a while since he produced or his defense produced like a statistically excellent year. And so that would be another reason. In addition to, I think in your perspective is the right one, the primary fit-based reasons, I would take a little bit of pause and say,

how is Mike Zimmerer doing in terms of keeping up? And I would have to dig into this. How is he doing with keeping up with the current trends around the NFL? Because I think he's still doing a lot of the same things, but probably some changes that he was doing when he last produced good defenses. And obviously, the game changes considerably over time. Yeah, I will say missing his two starting corners, Michael Parsons missed time, Lawrence, missed time.

You know, like you're talking about his four best defensive players now. And so just to give context, Because, yeah, the stats are ugly. And one of the things that we're talking about in Cincinnati is being able to get the most out of players, even when there are injuries and you don't have the guys. Right. So that's part of the job, too. Sure, no doubt. And those four guys are better than everyone but Trey on the Bengals defense.

All four. You know, so it's just tough. That's all. So I think he could still coach. I don't think it will necessarily be here. put it that way. It's an interesting thought nonetheless. Yeah, it is.

I think three years ago or two years ago, it might have been different. It's just right now I do think that it's going to be up to Zach. Zach doesn't know Mike Zimmer from Adam, right? Why would he know Mike Zimmer? You know, they might have coached against each other when Zach was in Miami, when Zach was in Miami and Mike was either with the Bengals or with the Vikings.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, obviously, They coached against each other this year technically as head coach versus defensive coordinator. But the point is it's not like you're talking to every defensive coordinator when you're the head coach of the other team a bunch. So they've probably said hi and met each other a few times, but I'm not sure that there's necessarily a relationship there, which is a factor when you're looking at, right, who am I going to hire, especially if it's a veteran coach at 68 years old that's done it for a long time. You should probably know that guy at least a little bit if you're going to go that route.

versus young upstart guy or insert whoever this is it to me this mike zimmer's in a different tier than the uh matt e refluses or the robert salas or the the other head coach NFL head coaches or former NFL head coaches that might end up as defensive coordinators yeah we'll see where mike ends up maybe he follows deon to wherever the sanders family lands in the NFL maybe he comes here i don't want to completely dismiss it because there's a chance there's a chance Yeah, we don't have any new information today on that note. We're talking about Mike Zimmer because he becomes available with the Dallas decision to let Mike McCarthy look for greener pastures and we'll see if he finds them.

But the reason we talk about Mike Zimmer is because he becomes apparently available in a time where the Bengals haven't had much news around their defensive coordinator search since the Matt Iber Fluse news. And we'll continue to keep our eyes and ears open. And as we have information that we can share, we will certainly share. we will certainly share it with you and share our perspective on those things. When they make a DC hire or an offensive line coach hire, we'll make sure that we have done our history checks and our due diligence there as well as we bring you the analysis of those hires as well.

But that's going to do it for this episode of the Locked-on Bengals podcast. Until next time, thanks for listening, Ho day, and have a good one.