Locked On Bengals - Daily Podcast On The Cincinnati Bengals - Zac Taylor revising offseason plan to try to fix Cincinnati Bengals slow start problem

Episode Date: February 27, 2025

As the offseason begins, the Cincinnati Bengals are set to address their early-season struggles with Zac Taylor considering changes to the offseason program. We break down what that could mean, and then dive into some of the takeaways from other coaches' comments at the combine. That includes Dan Pitcher alluding to a desire to maintain the 12 personnel packages that succeeded with Erick All last year, praise for Chase Brown, and hints at a change at the safety position. Join the Locked On Bengals Insider Community! https://joinsubtext.com/lockedonbengalsFind and follow Locked On Bengals on your favorite podcast platforms:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/locked-on-bengals-daily-podcast-on-the-cincinnati-bengals/id1159723162Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7AObc0lh0WmQl5fJVgtajsGoogle Podcasts: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vbG9ja2Vkb25iZW5nYWxz?sa=X&ved=0CAYQrrcFahcKEwio_sXtj8nuAhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQAgStitcher: https://www.stitcher.com/show/locked-on-bengalsSupport Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!FanDuelRight now, new FanDuel customers can get ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTY DOLLARS in Bonus Bets if your first FIVE DOLLAR bet wins!Download the app or head to FANDUEL.COM to get started. Bet with FanDuel—Official Partner of the NBA. FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Is Zach Taylor ready to revise the Bengals approach to the off season to do something about these slow starts? Let's break it down. You are locked on Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. What up Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast. I'm your host, Jake Liscoe. He's your host, James Rapine, and we are locked on Bengals on the Lockdown Podcast Network. your team every day.

The everydayers are already subscribed on YouTube. And if you're looking for a place to get your daily fix of Bengals News and Analysis, you're in the right place, whether that's anywhere you get your podcast or on YouTube. You can hit that subscribe button. You won't miss an episode. This week has been packed. We had a draft primer with Mike Renner from CBS Sports on Sunday afternoon,

Sunday night. The first episode of the week, we have some takeaways from Duke Tobin's comments and some of the themes that have emerged in the last couple of days. days at the NFL combine, and today we're going to talk about what some of the coaches had to say and some of the themes that came up from those coaches in an episode sponsored by Fandle, where you can get $150 in bonus bets at fandul.com in bonus bets if your first $5 bet wins. And James, let's start with Zach Taylor. Zach obviously spoke on the podium.

He met with you guys off podium as well. He talked to Judy Batista. And I want to start with a Judy Batista interview quote. And there's obviously plenty to get to on the podium and off podium as well. Zach's gotten really good about not saying a whole lot and compared to his early years in Cincinnati when he was more forthcoming. But asked about slow starts, Zach told Judy Batista, we're looking at revising our whole offseason plan, our training camp plan. And that to me stood out significantly among the many, many words Zach Taylor said to not say. a whole lot, this acknowledgement that, hey, maybe we do need to do the offseason differently,

starting from the various offseason programs before training camp. Yeah, it's something that I think, I thought they had a pretty tough camp last year, but the results were the results, like for them, to be clear. It was different. It was different, and I don't think that has been acknowledged enough. We talked about it last year, but it was different. It was different. And they had two joint practices.

they played in the first preseason game. There were things that were different from a starter standpoint. And yet you still get off to the slow start. And Duke Tobin said this. He was like, yeah, we got off to the slow start by losing in New England. Like that's the one. I mean, losing on the road against Kansas City, that's a tough loss. But we kind of thought that that could happen when the schedule came out.

That's not crazy. The commanders ended up going to the NFC championship. game were better than people expected. So that's part of it. But you can't continue to be 0 and 3 or 1 and 2 or 0 and 2. And they've just, when you

look at the Zach Taylor record in the first couple of weeks of the season, he's got the lone win. The lone win against the Vikings. I believe that's it. And so something has to change. Now, what I did like from Zach's messaging,

And she was like, we're not going to make that excuse about Jamar's contract or we're not going to make it about this or that. But I do think that all of these those are. There is some circumstantial stuff to each one that can be explained. But ultimately, you have to be able to win games when you're not playing your best football. It doesn't have to be pretty in September, but you need to get Ws. And I think that's that's it. Like when I think about the Patriots or when I think about the Chiefs or when I think about any of these teams, if you, like even the Eagles, they started two and two. It wasn't like they started 0 and 4 and then figured it out.

So it's okay to still be figuring things out as a team in September and even in October. But you got to get wins in the process. And you can't put yourself in this hole where you're just looking up and trying to get to the surface. And that's what the Bengals did, and it was too little too late. And playing like that, there's just so much pressure on every game, every moment. When if you win a couple of those games early on and the whole landscape of literally every season of the Zach Taylor era, what would have felt much, much different, at least the Zach Taylor-Joe Burrow era. So, yeah, I think the fast start, it was something that they knew about last year, though.

Like I had an interview with Ted Karras, and he's like, we got to start fast. And I remember, it was like a week before the season, two weeks before the season. And I did the schedule game in front of him. And I said, all right, well, let's start here. You have the Patriots, the Chiefs, the commanders, and the Panthers. You should at least be three in one in September, at least. And obviously they were one and three. So I am off at the schedule game.

two, they just continue to start slow and that can't happen. And to your point, if they're two and two in their first four, instead of one and three, they're in the playoffs. And of course, butterfly effect aside, they're in the playoffs. But it just illustrates the lack of wiggle room when you start like that. And why you often hear those stats, so oh and two teams have a 5% or whatever it is. I don't remember the number. Hopefully you don't have to talk about it again next year.

and see these charts on in our face, but like a 5% chance to make the playoffs or whatever it is when you start 0 and 2, or when you start 0 in 3. But they claw back and then they go and lose three straight games again. And even with that second three game losing streak in the middle of the season,

before they win five straight to finish the season, if you don't start 0 in 3, you can overcome that and get into the playoffs. Now, you don't want either. You don't want to be losing three games in a row in a season, period, when you're trying to compete for the one season. That was our expectation for this team last year in the preseason, and the defense was not where it needed to be.

They were unable to finish games on either side of the ball. That is not just a defense, but obviously when you give up over 400 points in the season, your defense isn't doing so hot. You can't have those slow starts. So I wonder what's in consideration here. One thing that immediately comes to mind is, every year we get to the offseason program and mini-camp in these things.

And every week we're talking about our podcasting schedule for those. Every year we're talking about our podcasting schedule for those weeks, James. And we're like, oh, you think you're going to have to be down there for that last day? Do you think they're actually going to have the players there? Are they going to let them go early? And for the last few years, it's been, let them go early. So I wonder if that's something that they consider changing.

Maybe training camp, they're pretty happy with the direction they took last year. Maybe they want to get the starters out there a little bit more, in a preseason game to give them a little bit more exposure to a game situation. Maybe that's a change, but maybe it's the offseason program. And that's where we see some more significant changes. And then maybe they take another step for training camp as well. But like you said, and I don't think it's been acknowledged enough, at least universally enough, training camp was different last year.

It was more intense. And we talked about that when I was in town. So I wonder where it starts and what Zach's thinking of when he's talking about revising the plan. Yeah. It's, are we talking about more intense practices? Because I know they were kicking themselves when, when Miles Murphy got, not kicking themselves like blaming,

but they were like, man, Miles Murphy gets hurt right before the start of the year. And they're like, ah, and it was just one of those many defensive line injuries that they had to deal with. And so it's a balance. And you know what I would say,

too, is they've had practice injuries. They've had injuries. And so I, does it matter? Should you just go harder? because you're going to have injuries regardless. Like, I think it's still a balance, but whatever it is.

And it might be as simple as, in all seriousness, it might be circumstantial, and it might be as simple as, man, they better learn how to win games when they're not playing their best. And by best, I mean, in sync, you know, like, yeah, that Patriots game, that's just a game that you know the Chiefs would have won. You know, that's a game that they win if it's the same game. and they're that that slow that's a game they would have won in December even how many times did they do that last year in all of their close games yeah yeah and and that's that's the

element that that has to change you can't just bank on it turning around so i i get it zach's got to take action and we'll see what what changes he makes it's a sensitive spot because it's definitely a topic that has come up repeatedly for a couple of years i remember when al goldham was asked about it he he's saying and we're going to keep that internal, but it's something that's a priority. It's something that I think is easy to believe. They've got a big focus on this off season. Let's continue by wrapping up with Zach Taylor, James. Anything else that stood out to you from your on or off podium opportunity to hear from the Bengals head coach

before we dive into the other, what was it, five coaches we heard from, from the Cincinnati Bengals, some themes emerging there. Big week for themes on the lockdown Bengals podcast. We'll continue that conversation coming up. up next. This episode of Lockdown Bengals is sponsored by Fandul, and Fandul knows that when NBA games tip off, the action is just getting started. And if you're looking to live bet and get in on that action, there's no better place than Fandual, America's number one sportsbook, where you can get in on those live bets throughout the game. Even if you miss the opening tip off and you want to bet on

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and what we've seen and heard this week out of Indianapolis. And we heard from Al Golden. We heard from Dan Pitcher. We heard from the new position coaches as well, including Scott Peters, the offensive line coach. what stood out the most to you? Obviously, I'm here, but what stood out the most to you from what you've heard so far?

I think there are a couple things from each coach. We talked yesterday about the way Scott Peters talked about the tackles versus the way he talked about the guards, and that was obviously a significant difference and kind of betrays their very obvious intention to improve at that spot. I thought from what I heard from Dan pitcher, there were some interesting remarks about what they would like the offense to look like in terms of things they learned from this year.

I thought from Al Golden, there were some interesting comments about the safety position or lack there of about a particular safety. I think we'll get to that topic in a bit. A lot of alignment, again, that is that word continues to come up throughout the week. But let me ask you this, James, before we dive into, I want to start with Dan Pitcher when we got to some of the non-Hague.

coaches, coaches, not head coach coaches. But from Zach Taylor, what did you feel from talking to Zach really translated into your subsequent conversations with, with coaches from a thematic perspective? Well,

I think the biggest thing was the, the alignment, the messaging, especially on defense, just kind of echoed. Echoed is the wrong word because I don't think they were repeat. what Zach said, I think that they, whether it's being on the same page, whether it's being flexible on defense, whether it's maximizing the young guys, the plan for the young guys.

I think all of these guys are in lockstep there. So, I mean, I think that that part of it from a defensive perspective probably stands out the most is just, I think how big of an issue it's been and how fresh. it's been behind the scenes probably stands out because of how much they're they're saying oh well this is why we're doing it this way and this is why we view it this way and uh being aligned i keep using that word because they did but i think that was a major major stress point and especially early on you want to talk about slow starts if you're aligned you might not have the slow start that might be one of the changes that that helps them early on yeah yeah that was definitely and continues to be a

theme. I think that will continue to be a theme when we hear from anyone involved with decision making for the Bengals and trying to set them up for 2025. But Dan Pitcher's comments a lot of run game talk and 12 personnel talk. And this brings me to a question that is kind of tricky. And I don't know if they'll be able to do it, but it sounded like they really liked what they were able to do with Micah Secki and Eric. call. And Gaseki, obviously, as a free agent, Erichol, not expected to be available for 2025. They were obviously able to continue to score plenty of points when they lost Ericol for the season and unfortunately for a season and a half. And when they had injuries for T. Higgins

throughout the year, they were able to continue to score points when they weren't in 12 personnel at the time. And Dan Pitcher talked a lot about Andre Yosevash as well. And there was a lot a discussion around the emergence of Chase Brown and how highly they think of Chase Brown and his development in all areas of his game. But the question is, is if they really liked what they got to

with the 12 personnel wrinkles and forcing teams to play them a little bit differently than they're used to having to play them and a little bit more physicality from having a guy like Eric All in the field. And that's something that they really liked and they liked being able to have the Eric All presence on the field with

the Mike Keseki type of body who is essentially a big receiver right a mismatched receiver because he's a giant for a wide receiver how did they reproduce that with those guys having either an entirely unavailable due to injury

season coming up or free agency like what would be the plan to get back to that does that signal that we should expect to see an investment in two tight ends yeah I think so. I think I would be stunned if they didn't draft a tight end.

Stunned. And because it's such a good class, because it's an obvious need, it's going to be hard for them to find that guy that Eric all is and was in free agency. I'm not sure he's there because they loved what he was doing in the passing game. And I think they thought that that was going to expand a ton. and then this kid was all I tell it all the time because I'm still it's still so funny he's like I love blocking I like blocking more than catching passes and he's just he loves that and so is that available in free agency I think Mike Gassiki might get a big deal and part of that

is just because there's not a lot of tight ends out there and at least you know Mike Gaseki matters in the passing game go ahead it's just such slim pick as a tight end there's just not much And so what it's like is, does that mean that Mike Gaseki's price goes up? Or does that mean everybody just waits until the draft? And I don't know the answer to that, right? And maybe the answer is both. But if, yeah, if you're the Bengals, Mike Gassiki gets the free agency. I mean, we'll see if I'm him, I get to free agency.

And you might get blown away by a number if you're Mike, because there's just not much out there at free agency. And so that's why the draft, people dismiss this, but I'm going to keep hammering at home. There are scenarios where they take a tight end at 17. And I definitely think tight end is in play early. I'm not saying that it's going to be in the first round. But if they don't take one at 17, when we do our recap show and then our look ahead to day two of the draft, you better believe we're going to be discussing tight end.

I don't really see a scenario where that will change over the next few months. A lot of things can change, right? Like we're going to be talking about the defensive line for sure over the next few months, right? Wide receiver, probably not talking about that on day one or early day two if they get Chase and T done. Tight end, we're going to be talking about it, I think, on day one. And definitely day two. You mean the Bengals aren't trading for Sam LaPorta? What do you mean?

Would you trade McBry? Would you trade? Would you trade pick 49 for LaPorta? All right. Does he have an injury that he's coming off of? That would be the only thing to clear up. Yeah, but you would, right? Yeah, from the, I went for Tray McBride, too, like from a player perspective.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're not getting a player like that at Pick 49. Like, those are bona fides. Unless it's a, yeah, unless it's a, no, you're not, because even Colston-Loveland's going to be long, long-go. And even if you get him, you're getting the rookie version of him is 21 years old and probably needs a year to cook to become what either of those guys. Like, Trey McBride's awesome.

Took him a year to cook, right? It takes some time. But you're right about the free agency class. PFF has currently Mike Keseki projected to get two years, $6 million per year. And Joanne Johnson is their top ranked tight end free agent. He weighs 230 pounds. He's not doing the Eric all thing, but he's projected to get three years just out the $10 million a year. Tyler Conklin expected to get another three-year $9 million deal.

Zach Hertz, a year for $3.5 million. Do you buy the resurgence that he had last year at 34 years old? The Bengals, 34 years old. calling me skeptical. Austin Hooper at 30 years old, projected at two years, four million. That's it for the guys PFF is projecting in terms of tight end free agents.

You're talking slim pickings there, man. That's where I think you explore trades and the Bengals, not the team that does a whole lot of that, the NFL in general, not a league that does a whole lot of that, but I think you explore it. And then you're talking seriously about what is Mike Gaseki worth to us for two years. and what does that kind of thing do for us

and get us to the draft without that particular need still left? And so that makes me curious about the offseason plan is the way they're talking about what they liked with 12 personnel. More to talk about here, James, to finish up the show as we wrap up with the rest of the coaches and anything you have left on Dan Pitcher's comments, Scott Peters comments on the offense here as well, coming up next.

Jake, one thing I asked Zach, and I was just kind of curious. I was like, how talented would a tight end or a running back have to be for you to pound the table for him? And he was like, he's like, it's all about the big picture. And they may view it as like, oh, well, we can get a stud tight end that's going to do a lot of what Eric all did. Maybe he's even more dynamic in the passing game, for example, and a little less of a blocker. I'm describing Colston-level one. I don't know if they like him or not, but I'm just,

that might be part of their offseason plan. What if it is? I think Zach's comments, he was very much open to that idea in how it fits. He's like, it's all about how everything fits. And Duke said the same thing, we're not going to cross off any positions outside of quarterback today, basically, in round one. And so I do think that there are scenarios. People are going to get really annoyed about this. But you could make the argument.

That that might make sense. Now, at 17, maybe not. But at 49, 17 or 49, like, that's probably the most likely position tight end would be that isn't guard in the first two rounds or, you know, offensive line in the first two rounds. Would you agree with that? You're including defensive line in there too? Oh, yeah, just offensive. Just on offensive positions. Yeah.

Like guard and then tight ends probably the next one. So yeah, I think that would definitely be the most likely. I think the only other one I would make any argument for is if a running back, because there are a couple really good running backs in this class in the second round. That would be the other one that I would put in the conversation. And would have, Ashton Jinti's there at 17. I'm not saying they would, but I don't know. I don't know if they wouldn't.

I don't think he will be, but I am so unprepared for that conversation. Like, give me a couple weeks on that one. Me too. I am too. I'm unprepared for it too. But the thing is, is like people already have dismissed it without even looking. And we don't do that here at Lockdown Bengals.

Well, and the Bengals won't either. Although, like, you listen and you read between the lines, like, I would say that that's probably pretty unlikely. Like, I would say that them, unless they're blown away and there's a clear tier difference, this is where this happens for like corner. The buckets. Yeah. Well, the buckets.

Like, what if, what if Genties a top five player on their board? Yeah, if he's a 1A and their next player is. one C. Yeah. Yeah. Even one B, I think they would take it. Yeah, definitely possible. I think running back is an extreme example of this sort of thing, but we have talked over

and over this offseason about finding those impact players that can make a difference for you right away. The thing is with running back that makes it tricky is that I think Chase Brown is actually really good. Scott Peters had had a ton of praise for Chase Brown, and we can mention that in a second here before we get to the safety position. But the last thing I wanted to say on the draft in terms of what players we think they would take and being open to all these positions is I think they are pretty bullish on

their secondary group. And I think that they are interested in adding for corners specifically. I think they're interested in adding there, but I think they like the five young corners they have right now. There's certainly some questions between injuries and slump years for Cam Taylor Britt. it, but I think it would have to, again, be a pretty big gap for them to go corner, especially in the first round. It would have to be a pretty significant gap for them to go corner in the first.

Yeah, and running backs obviously the same way, too. To a much more extreme. But yeah, but you just don't want to just dismiss it to dismiss it. Right. And so I agree there. You're right, though. He did Scott Peters praised Chase Brown a ton, said how awesome he was. Dan Pitcher, same thing.

Zach Taylor, same thing. That is one of the themes. They really believe in Chase Brown. And at the same time, the other theme is they know he can't continue the workload that he was on. And so they're going to, I think they're going to draft the running back, too. And part of why I do, Dan pitcher was talking about the pass blocking element. And that's why they brought Zach Moss in, right? There's a big part of it is because he can help ease, ease those waters, calm those waters.

And obviously things are uncertain with his future from a just football playing standpoint with his neck injury. But the way Dan described Chase and his confidence in Chase as a pass blocker, that means you can go after a young rookie and not necessarily a veteran that has proven to be a past protector because you trust that chase can be that. And so I think they're going to add a back at some point in this draft. They're going to need to add a pick is the conclusion that I keep reaching. If they're going to draft the tight end and a running back and add the defensive lineman and offensive lineman

and maybe a safety and maybe a linebacker, I guess that's six picks. There you go. There you go. I think they're going to do two defensive linemen. Now I need seven picks. So we'll see. We'll see if there's some picks coming,

but Scott Peters quote on Chase Brown. He's one of the best backs in the league. I think he took a massive step. They're very excited about him. And the ability to pass block, as he said, James, really does open up the possibilities for them as they look for RB2. But they do need that depth because they have nothing behind Chase Brown right now. And you need the injury insurance at that position.

I think more than many positions, but you definitely need the injury insurance there. And just a guy that can play a handful of snaps for you again, because you don't want to be. be forced in that situation again that they had with Chase Brown in 24. Let's wrap up with the safety position here, James, where Al Golda was asked about his safety. He said some good things about Jordan Battle, sounded excited about Jordan Battle's future, and I don't think he had any words for Gino Stone, which by omission is significant because he was asked about both.

He was asked directly about both safeties. Genostone was named, and the answer, and maybe he was. he just forgot. But the answer was about Jordan Battle. And so whether it was a Freudian slip or just a slip of regular proportions, maybe neither of those is an appropriate way to describe what kind of slip this was, that could certainly point to the Bengals looking for a different safety. He was asked about his safety in Notre Dame as well, Xavier Watts, who I've joked about a lot on this podcast being mocked to the Bengals in the second round. So I guess you've got to get your tight end in the first round, James, but what did you make of the safety stuff?

Man, defensive line is going to get pushed. Can you imagine if they went tight in in safety? And then you get John Marie Calvo in the third round and everything's fine. That's right. That's right. I think, much like what Mike Santagita echoed, I don't think Geno Stone makes sense. Now, maybe they keep them. I would try to trade him for a late pick.

and shed that $6.5 million in cap space. I think they're going to be, I mean, the bucks are not going to bring back Jordan Whitehead, for example. Like, I think there are going to be safeties that you could bring in if you want to go get that veteran presence, someone that's just been better than Stone. But the two things that Zach said that he wanted out of a safety, and they're basic, that Al Golden wanted out of a safety, same thing. communicator, be able to tackle. Communication and tackling. They also mentioned range and all those things. I don't know what Gino Stone does that Tyson Anderson can't do.

I mean, I just, I don't. Now maybe you'd say, oh, well, Gino Stone had seven interceptions for the Ravens. Well, this isn't the Ravens defense we're talking about. We're talking about the Bengals defense. And for the Bengals defense, I don't think Gino Stone made many big plays. Even at the end of the year. I know he had some interceptions at the end of the year. A tipped interception is something Jake Liscoe can catch.

So just throwing that out there. I can catch. That's the one thing I can do. That's what I said. I said, you can catch it. You know, it's not like you made a play. You got to catch it. Sure.

You get credit for that. But come on. I think it's a solid safety class, too. If they are interested in going that direction, he was asked directly about Xavier Watson and had good things to say and called him very important to his defense in Notre Dame. It's a good free agent group. It's safety as well.

And it depends on what. the Bengals are looking for there if they choose to to sick with Gino Stone or if that's one of those players where they're looking for a replacement that fits what they want to do a little bit more. New defensive coordinator in the building, that's a prime time to see changes like that at positions that could be considered key.

And when we talk to Mike Santagin about this Al Golden back half of the defense, that safety position, certainly very easy to reject that as being a key to the Al Golden defensive approach that we're going to see in Cincinnati. There's a lot more we're going to have to talk about regarding this combine. James, there's a lot going on this week. We're very likely, I would say, to hear various things about various players. We got Adam Schaefter talking about

Dee Higgins. We got all sorts of people talking about all sorts of players. If we're going to have some players start to test between now and the next time you hear from us. So not sure what the next episode will bring exactly. We're going to have to figure out what the news is between now and then we're going to have NFLPA report cards to talk about as well and some improvement. for the Bengals in some areas that are frustratingly to fans, I think, and to players not improving with the team. So we'll have plenty to talk about in our next episode, but that's going to do it for this episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast.

Thanks for listening. And until next time, Ho-Day and have a good one.