Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Helsley To The Phillies?

Episode Date: December 5, 2024

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With all the talk about Nolan Aronado being moved, what team in the National League East makes sense for closer Ryan Helsley? We'll talk about it today on Locked on Cardinals. You are Locked on Cardinals, your daily St. Louis Cardinals podcast, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Hey there, Cardinals fans. I'm J.D. Haffrin and I'm a national radio sports anchor, born and raised in the Lou and a lifetime Cardinals fan. And I'm your host for Locked on Cardinals. on podcast network covering your team every day. You can follow me on Twitter X at JD Sports Radio. You can also follow the podcast at L.O.

underscore Cardinals. I do want to thank those of you who make Locked on Cardinals your first listen every day. We are free and available wherever you get your podcast. If you haven't stopped by yet, please give us a try, like, subscribe, comment, hit that notification button. So you know when new episodes are posted because this is a show serving Cardinal Nation and giving the best fans of baseball, all of the info about the birds on the bat. Today's episode is being brought to you by Fandall. You can start the season with a big return on Fandall.

New customers can place a $5 bet and you'll get started with $150 in bonus bets if you win your first $5 bet. Visit fandle.com to get started. So the Cardinals continue to be a hot topic team as we get closer to the winter meetings. Once again, that's going to start on Monday down at Dallas. names like Nolan Aronado, Ryan Ellsley, Eric Fetty, Stephen Matts, you know, these are these are names that have been brought up that are on the trade block, you know, for for good reason. You know, they're good players outside of the Nolan Aronado contract, relatively cheap. And, you know, people are going to be interested in adding these guys. the Cardinals are a team that is willing to shed some payroll in exchange for prospects right now,

which is basically like throwing chum into a swimming pool full of sharks, which is essentially what the winter meetings are going to be like for the Cardinals. At least we're hoping so. We're hoping to see a lot of action come from these winter meetings, get the discussions going, get things moving. You know, this is that time of the year where it's just room. Rumors, rumors, rumors, rumors, rumors, and not a whole lot of action going on. And you're just like sitting here like, oh, my gosh, this is boring.

But the winter meeting should kind of jumpstart things for the Cardinals and for a lot of teams around the league. It would be an awful shame if nobody wanted these guys or if the competition for acquiring them is minimal because that means, you know, crappier trade offers. It means the Cardinals would likely have to eat more money to get these guys off the roster on certain guys. It's just not what you're hoping for, right? And the free agent market is still in a holding pattern with teams waiting on Juan Soto to sign. We've heard the rumors that maybe by Monday he'll have come up with a decision. He's apparently using this weekend to meet with teams and kind of narrow things down and eliminate people. So take that for what it's worth.

After that happens, teams can start making other arrangements, right? That is most certainly one of the reasons nothing has been done with Nolan Aronado yet. You know, if the Dodgers are his preferred choice and L.A. is rumored to want him. They're going to wait until Juan Soto makes his decision first, since they are one of the teams that is rumored to be in the running to acquire himself. you know, which makes most people around baseball want to vomit in their mouth. You see the people out in L.A. who are like, shut up, quit whining, just because we can do all this and you can't, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you got the rest of the people are like, this isn't fair. This sucks.

Like I said, I'm more interested in just keeping balance in the game where I need guys like Juan Soto and Aaron judging these people to stay on the East Coast, which is where most of the teams that seem like they're in the running. for Soto appear to be. You know, you've got the, the Yankees, obviously, and then the Mets, and then the Red Sox and the Blue Jays. So that's all the East Coast teams. And then you got Dodgers is the big name on the West Coast. So until this Soto stuff is done, there's a lot of these teams that they're not going to move forward onto any other orders of business, which is holding things up. The Yankees have been linked to being interested in Nolan Aronado, red Sox as well. So we'll have to play the waiting game there.

Unfortunately, you've also got Alex Breggman's free agency to contend with when it comes to teams looking for a third baseman. You know, Bregman could still return to Houston. That's still a possibility. But teams like the Yankees and the Red Sox and the Mariners and even the Phillies are places that have also been mentioned that want to upgrade their hot corner situation. Now, Bregman is a few years younger than Nolan Aronado and has been more productive at the plate in recent years. just snagged his first gold glove award this past year. He won't be cheap. Whomever does land him is going to pay a pretty penny.

Whoever does not land him will then be able to pivot towards other players like Nolan Arnato. Because it's a pretty steep drop off after that when you go look at the names of third baseman that are available via free agency, you know, Yohan Moncata, who, you know, a few years ago was supposed to, to be one of these upcoming stars when he's with the Red Sox and then he goes to the white socks and injuries have really plagued him. So, but, you know, that's a name. Nick Madrigal is a name that was a high draft pick in the first round, but he hasn't quite panned out to be the player that many thought he would be, Gio or Shella. I mean, there's just not much there, which is good for the Cardinals. That's very good for the Cardinals. But again, Nato has to sign

off on where he goes. So if his heart is set on Los Angeles and that doesn't work out, is he even willing to go any other place? Or would he rather stay in St. Louis until something else can be worked out? That's just part of this whole process here. We don't know. We have no idea which cities are actually places that no one or not would want to play at. And he has the last say on all of this because of that no trade clause. Ryan Halsley, on the other hand, He does not have a no trade clause. So the cardinals can do what they want with him, when they want with him. A lot more flexibility there.

And, you know, him being at the top of his game doesn't hurt. Obviously, teams are going to want him. And some of the teams that have been rumored to be in on Halsley are these big market teams that are still waiting on one soda. There's still this, you know, soda is going to be the first priority. And then things will trickle down after that. So once again, the Cardinals are just kind of sitting here waiting like, all right, when are we going to get the ball rolling here? Jim Bowden at the athletic was talking about some trades that he would like to see go down at the winter meetings, which once again begins on December 9th in Dallas. He did mention one that included Ryan Helsley and possibly Nolan Aronado going to the Philadelphia Phillies.

So I'm going to tell you what he had to say about that particular trade coming up next. on lockdown cardless. Get ready to tackle the NFL action with Fandol America's number one sports book because right now new customers can bet $5 to get $150 in bonus bets. If you win, the Fandall Sportsbook app gives you everything. You need to place live bets on the NFL and it's all in one place. We've got the Packers at the Lions for Thursday night football. Lions are a little beat up right now after they're winning against the Chicago Bears on Thanksgiving,

which music to my cheesehead ears as a Packers fan as a Packers owner. Because last time they played in Lambo this year, the Lions did put a whooping on them. But if you remember last year, the Packers actually spanked the Lions in Detroit when they went on that heater at the end of the season. We'd love to see that again. And Fandola has got the Lions currently favored. Last time I checked it was at three and a half. It could be down to three now. but, you know, the Lions still have their full complement of offensive stars.

I'm on Ross St. Brown. He's healthy. Jamir Gibbs, David Montgomery, Jared Gough. They're all fine. So it's not like it's going to be an easy game just because the lion's got a few guys on the defensive side hurt. So I don't know. If you feel like the Packers can pull it off tonight, might be something you should be interested in. So when you think about those things or you get a hunch in the middle of the game, make sure you can check out the latest stats. live play by playing so much more right there on the same page where you place your bets with Fandle. So visit Fandul.com website, fandle.com joined today. You'll get started with $150 in bonus bets if you win your first $5 bet. That's fandole. Never waste a hunch and make every moment more with Fandle, an official sportsbook partner of the NFL. Thank you again for making

Locked on Cardinals your first listen every day. You can leave your comments on YouTube as well as on Twitter X anytime you want the feedback. Always welcome and encourage we are going to be doing a fan feedback episode. Tomorrow, we are going to get one of those out for you guys, where we just kind of rifled through some questions, some trade ideas and whatnot, and get your voice out there. So if you got something of interest, you want to talk about, let me know in the comment section,

and we'll get to that tomorrow. So the Phillies, this trade with the Phillies that was brought up by Jim Bowden at the Athletic. Let's talk about the Phillies real quick, because they're in a strange spot. where they haven't won a World Series since 2008. They've been making phenomenal trades and great signings, and they brought in all this talent.

You know, you get Bryce Harper, you get T.Rey Turner. You get J.T. Real Mutu. Kyle Schorber. Nick Costiano's. Brandon Marsh was a great trade with the Angels. You know, you trade and sign Zach Wheeler. You keep Aaron Nola. You've got all these big names and these expensive names.

And no World Series to show for it over the last. last few years. You know, they lost in the NL divisional round against the Mets this year. They lost in the NLCS to the debacks in 2023, lost in the World Series to the Astros in 2022. The regular season wins have gone up over the last three years, but then they get eliminated one round earlier each season since 2022 when they upset the Cardinals in the in the wild card round, a team that I think going into that series, people thought the Cardinals were going to win that. I mean, they were, they were the, they had home field advantage. They had the red hot Albert Pooholz. Uh, they had the MVP guys and Goldie and Aronado. Uh, you had Monty doing his stuff.

You had Jose Cantana. Like, all of this stuff was going well for the Cardinals. And then one bad inning at the end of game one. And then it all just fell apart. And, uh, they were gone. Uh, the Phillies continue to try to find those missing pears. And then, um, the Phillies continue to try to find those missing pieces to get them over the hump and finally bring home that trophy again at the end. And perhaps Ryan Helsley and Nolan Aronado are two of those pieces that would help them get that done. Now, Jim Voden had this to say about a deal between the Cardinals and the Phillies at the winter meetings.

And again, this is at the athletic. And these are deals that he's just saying, I want to see these deals go down at the winter meetings. This is what he had to say. Cardinals are focused on rebuilding. and the Phillies need a hard-throwing impact reliever. The Phillies lost two key high-leverage relievers to free agency and Jeff Hoffman and Carlos Estevez and have made it a priority to address that area this offseason.

Housley won the Trevor Hoffman Award this year as the best closer reliever in the National League, logging a 2.04 ERA with 49 saves and 79 strikeouts in 66 and a third innings. The Cardinals wouldn't be able to get top pitching prospect, Andrew Painter, or the Phillies top position player prospect, which is third baseman Aidan Miller in a deal. But they are trying to move Nolan Aronado in his contract. So perhaps if they package him with Helsley, they could get third baseman Alec Bome from the Phillies,

which would be a much better long-term situation for St. Louis. Baum is 28 and under team control for two more years. Aronado has a full no trade clause. The athletics, Katie Wu, friend of the show, as reported according to a team source, he wouldn't waive that clause unless it was for a consender. If the cardal significantly paid down Aronado's contract, he's owed $32 million in 2025, $27 million in 202026,

and $15 million in 202027, they also could probably get another prospect back in the deal, like outfielder Dante Nori. Nori is 20 years old, was the Phillies first round pick this year, Helsley and Aronado for Bome and Norrie. What do you guys think about that? Like I said, Norea was the Philly's first round pick this past year.

He was number 27 overall out of high school. So very young. He's only 20 years old. Currently, they're number seven prospect, according to MLB pipeline, who had this to say about him because I wasn't familiar with this guy yet. They say his all-around tools compare favorably to Alec Thomas of the Arizona Diamondbacks, another former first round pick, was part of a state division one championship team, has a mature approach at the play, controlling the strike zone, and looking to make consistent contact to all fields.

He has a quick, direct, left-handed swing and will shorten his stroke with two strikes. While he's strong and shows average power during batting practice, he focuses on producing line drives rather than launching balls during games. Nori Post's top of the scale 60-yard dash times and is a well-above average runner who is aggressive on the bases. Formerly, Mississippi State Committee chases down balls from gap to kick. gap as a no doubt center fielder and his solid arm strength is another asset. He's physically maxed out and offers no projection, but has plenty of talent and Scouts love his makeup as well. So, you know, former first round pick, scouts are going to like them. In a 20 to 80 grade scale, in case you're not familiar with how scouts grade players,

it's 20 to 80, 20 is lowest, 80 is the highest. Pick grade is at 55, the power at 45. starting 65, arm 55, fielding 60, overall they give them a 50. So if 80 is the top and you give them a 50, you're kind of like, oh, that's kind of average, right? Well, in the card system, because it's not an easy grading scale. It's not like they just hand out 70 grade guys all the time. And the card system, only J.J. Weatherholt, Tinkins and Quinn Matthews are rated higher than 50. Okay. They all have 55 grades.

Thomas and Jacey was a 50, just to put it into perspective. So he'd be one of their top guys. Will the Phillies force the Cardinals to eat much of Aronado's deal in a trade like this? Who knows? You know, it's not like the Phillies have trouble spending money. So I don't know. But my question would be, would you be okay with Alec Boehm over there at third base? Or would you rather them make a deal for just prospects?

and, you know, send somebody else over there to third base, whether it's Brendan Donovan or Nolan Gorman, you know, those are possibilities as well. You know, we've heard about maturity issues with Alec Bome, which is what we assume is one of the reasons they might be willing to move on from him. And there are other teams that also will be in the hunt for Alec Bome. You know, there's reasons to like him. According to reports on NBC Sports, the Phillies,

and the Mariners are a team that have chatted a little bit. And according to this report, the Phillies asked for one of the Mariners' top pitchers, Logan Gilbert or George Kirby, in exchange for both during their initial trade talks. Seattle said, no, no, not going to do that. That seems like a pretty steep price. But, you know, the Mariners are a team that has a massive pole

at the hot corner entering the off season. and, you know, the two teams seem to line up. You know, it's why you hear about the Cardinals and Mariners matching up, and we've been listening to that rumor for a couple of years now. The Cardinals are trying to get some of the Mariners pitching prospects because they got a nice grouping of them. I don't know if Arnaud would want to go to Seattle. Are they enough of a contender that he would want to go there

if the Mariners were interested in getting him. Baum was coming off the best season of his career, has reportedly been on the trade block for a couple weeks now at this point. There is the Phillies try to shake up their core after another disappointing postseason. So that's another team to keep an eye on. As far as Baum goes, personally, I mean, it's not like I sat down and watched a ton of Phillies games this year. But anytime I turn it on, it seemed like he was doing something positive. I'm not saying he's a superstar, but I like this game.

You know, it just always seemed like he was coming through and doing something well. 301 this past year is what he hit with runners in scoring position, had 80 RBIs. And, you know, after watching what we watched this past year with the Cardinals, I mean, I'm looking for guys with that clutch gene, you know, that come through when the game is on the line and when things are getting tight. I saw so much failure this year when the Cardinals would get up in these situations and to see a guy like Alec Boehm coming through and on a consistent basis that that's very attractive to me. OPS plus of 131 with runners in scoring position like, gosh, we could use that inside that Cardinals lineup, couldn't we? I'm not opposed to an Alec Bowman trade.

You know, the maturity issues thing, obviously that would be something you'd have to look into. if that's indeed an issue. But, you know, to get younger, to get cheaper, yeah, it sucks trading Aronado, and it sucks trading Ryan Helsley and you're still doing it in the, you know, in the national league. But, you know, if you're able to get a guy like Baum and then a prospect or two, something you got to think about. The Cardinals were also added.

We're also able to add some new faces with their player development side of things. I want to talk about those guys coming up next. on Locked on Cardinals. Thank you again for making Lockdown Cardinals, your first listen today for your second listen, find Locked on MLB, where Sully brings you a daily blend of humor and baseball, and he'll keep you updated on all the stuff going on with this offseason.

For all the teams around the league, you can find Lockdown MLB on YouTube or wherever you listen to your podcast. So some hirings on the personnel side of things, behind the scenes, not on the field. St. Louis has hired Larry Day, as its new farm director and will name Carl Cochin, the team's director of performance, a new position within the organization.

Additionally, Matt Pierpont has been hired as the Cardinals director of pitching. All three will report to new assistant, GEM, Rob Serfolio, who was hired back in October to oversee player development and performance. By the way, Rob Serfoglio followed locked on Cardinals. So I don't know, maybe we can get, you know, some sort of relationship together.

and we can get Rob on the show at some point. Young guy, he's hip to the podcast world. So maybe that's something we can work on, but that was exciting to see that he gave us a follow. Day is 39 years old, takes over after longtime farm director, Gary LaRocke announced his retirement back in September, was an assistant field coordinator for the Guardians and worked under Cofolia, who previously served as the Guardians director of player development.

They also spent three seasons managing in the lower levels of the Guardian system guiding various rookie league teams between 2017 and 2019. You know, still pulling guys from, you know, Cleveland who, I mean, let's be honest, you know, for a team that doesn't spend a ton of money, they're always around. They're always pretty good. So you like pulling guys from organizations. They've had a nice track record. Coaching comes to the Cardinals after six years with the Dodgers, another, another.

another good organization was most recently a minor league strength and conditioning coordinated before his time with the Dodgers. He spent two seasons with Giants, including seven as the team's major league strength and conditioning coach between 2012 and 2018, was part of two World Series staffs and was named MLB's strength coach of the year back in 2016. Pierpott takes over the organization's pitching department after four years with the Mariners. just talking about how the Mariners got a good group of pitchers had to develop them.

And it's an organization that that's what they're known for. They're trying to go out and find hitters. But they've been able to develop pitchers over the years on a consistent basis. Pierpont's role within the Mariners range from pitching coach to assistant pitching coordinator and then pitching coordinator in 2024. So just more names and additions to help bolster. the weak spots in the organization. And hopefully this all works out.

You're finding these guys with organizations that have a pedigree for success. And that's what you're trying to bring in. You want a culture of winners. You know, you're not trying to pull guys from organizations that struggle a lot. You know, these are guys that they're getting from organizations where, you know,

they've got people, you know, Bram Brown has been with the Marin. He obviously probably had some input like these guys are pretty darn good. Might want to go after them. Sorfolio with the Guardians guys, you know, pulling people from the Marlins, you know, getting a good word from Skip Schumacher about guys like Bram Brown, John Jay coming in. You know, this is, you're surrounding these young players that you're going to be relying on. You're surrounding them with guys that have been in places that success has been the norm.

And you got to love it. got to love it that that's how they're attacking this whole thing. So Cardle's putting forth effort to make their player development the best they possibly can. And that's all you can ask for at this point. Let's see. We got some time here. News from around the league real quick. A's have reportedly signed three-agent pitcher Luis Severino to a three-year deal worth $67 million. Largest in club history. Look at the A's spending money. We'll enter his age 31 season, had one of the more impressive comebacks here in 2024, after signing with the Mets following all of the injuries. If you remember, he was like one of the better pitchers in the league with the Yankees

and then just injury after injury just kept happening. And that's why, you know, signing pitchers is risky. You know, he had the rotator cuff, which was an issue. The lat strain, that was a big thing. I had to go under Tommy John surgery. Oblique strains. Like, I mean, he's just had a lot. It kind of reminds me of Jack Flaherty, just issue after issue.

issue. In its first full season since 2018, this past year, 31 starts, 3.91 ERA, 161 strikeouts, and 182 winnings. Nothing like just like eye popping, but pretty darn good season. In Atlanta, it lands in the three-year, $67 million deal. You've got snell to the Dodgers already, Montas with the Mets, Matthew Boyd went to the Cubs, Kukuchi to the Angels. still a lot of big names out there, though, Corbyn-Burns, Max Free, Jack Flaherty, still out there. Sean Mania, Nick Pavetta, Nathan E. Valdi, Andrew Heaney, still a name out there. Burns reportedly met with the Yankees and the Blue Jays, who are obviously still waiting on the Juan Soto's stuff. So a decision, again, could be made on Soto's future by Monday is the rumors we've heard.

Garrett Crochet, still trade bait from the Chicago White Sox. reports are the Reds and the Cubs are in the mix to, you know, at least might, are looking into acquire it. Let's put it that way. But the Orioles, the Red Sox, the Dodgers, the Phillies are also some other names that have been brought up and interested in Garrett Crochet. It ain't going to be cheap. Obviously, you're going to have to give up some prospect capital to go and get him.

But he was pretty darn good this past year with the White So, you know, if he stays healthy, he's got that pitching arsenal. It's pretty darn dominant at times. So it reminds me a lot of Chris Sale when he was younger. So I would hate to see him come to the division. Personally, I hope he goes to some other teams. I do not want to face him if he's in Cincinnati or in Chicago if I don't have to. And as much fun as it would be to be discussing some of these names and, you know,

the Cardinals trying to put their foot in and try to acquire these guys. I think, you know, seeing these salaries and stuff, it's just more proof that the Cardinals are doing the right thing. And they're going to focus on developing their own players and stop playing these games where they have to go out and compete against all these teams that don't care about spending money. And they're just willing to spend whatever it takes where the Cardinals are still running this as a business. And they're not interested in doing it that way. Develop your own guys. And I feel like it's the best way to get back to the top. maybe not the quickest way to get back to the top,

but in the long term, to become what the cardals used to be, the cardinals that you and I grew up with, and we remember and cherish all these great memories, this is the best way to do it. That's how they used to do it, trying to get back to it. We hope it works out. So thank you again for making lots on Cardinals your first listen every day. If you haven't already, give me a follow on Twitter X at L1-Underscore Cardinals

at a JD Sports Radio, like, subscribe on YouTube, help our channel and love for the Cardinals grow. So you guys are the best fans in baseball for a reason, and I'll see you next time on lockdown cardinals.