Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Mozeliak Opens Up About Arenado Trade Speculation

Starting point is 00:00:00 The winter meetings are underway, and we've got a little more clarity from President of Baseball Operations, John Moseiloc, about the future of Nolan Aranada. You are Locked-on Cardinals, your daily St. Louis Cardinals podcast, part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hey there, Cardinals. I'm J.D. Hafford and I'm your host for Locked on Cardinals. Part of the Lockdown Podcast Network covering your team every day. You can follow me on Twitter X at J.D. Sports Radio. the podcast at L0 underscore Cardinals. We want to thank those of you who make Lockstone Cardinals. You first listen. Every day we are free and available wherever you get your podcast. We're also available on YouTube.

Starting point is 00:00:44 If you haven't joined us there yet, please do me a solid stop on by. Like, subscribe and hit that notification button so you don't miss a single episode because this is a show serving Cardle Nation and giving the best fans in baseball, all of the info about the birds on the bat. Today's episode brought to you by Fandul. You can start the season with a big return on Fandul. New customers can place 8,000. a dollar bet and you'll get started with $150 in bonus bets if you win your first $5 bet is fandle.com to get started.

Starting point is 00:01:13 So the Cardinals had a relatively slow day one at the winter meetings in Dallas. And in all honesty, it was kind of a slow day for the league all around. Not a whole lot of really breaking news. Kind of hard to follow up on the Juan Soto signing with anything else that would, you know, make much of a ripple through the baseball news. circuit. So not a whole lot went down on Monday. Perhaps business will pick up here on this Tuesday. Most reporters are still just talking about this massive 15-year, $765 million deal that Soto signed with the Mets, as they should. I mean, it's a record-setting deal that had everyone's head kind of spinning like, wow, wow, I can't believe it got up to that. But now that Soto was

Starting point is 00:02:00 signed, teams are starting to move on to whatever plans they had. in the background in case they weren't the team that ended up landing him. So obviously the Mets will move forward, trying to find different pieces to fill out their rotation, which is, in my opinion, what is really the biggest concern for them right now. But then you've got all the other teams like the Yankees and the Dodgers and the Red Sox and all these other guys that, you know, were rumored to be in on them, the Blue Jays, who will have to go elsewhere to find whatever it they need that they think will bring them a world championship. The Cardinals still have some very interesting trade pieces.

Starting point is 00:02:42 Noon Aronado, though, has been the biggest talking point and the biggest topic of discussion so far as, as far as like with anything having to do with the Cardinals. As we've mentioned in previous shows, the Cardinals are reportedly leaning towards hanging on to close to Ryan Helsley now. So if he's off the table, which I don't think he's off the table, but I don't think there is desperate to move on from him. It's just trying to pick up off the vibe that I'm getting from the reports out there.

Starting point is 00:03:13 It's just, it feels like it's, unless they're blown away by a particular deal, they don't feel like they have to move on from Ryan Helsley right now. But trading Nolan Aronado does appear to be something that is eventually going to happen. We got some quotes from president of baseball operations Jamo Seelock on Monday. He was all over the place. doing interviews with media. So I've got some quotes and some stuff here from a number of different sources. Jeff Jones at the Belleville News Democrat, Katie Wu from the Athletic,

Starting point is 00:03:44 Derek Gould at SCL today on the subject of dealing away the Cardal's Future Hall of Fame third baseman. They were all in when John Moseilac was talking. So here are some of the quotes from Mo. He said these decisions are not something we ever take lightly. But when you understand really the profile of what this team looks like after meeting with Aeronado in Colorado, ultimately, he's not demanding a trait. He's not telling me I have to do it.

Starting point is 00:04:10 But I think in the best interest of both sides, I'd like to find him someplace. It is my intention to try. From a financial standpoint, we are trying to move our payroll. There are certainly other ways we can do this, but moving Aronado would be a big help. It's mostly financial, but it also creates runway for someone else. now when he's talking about someone else, what he's saying there, the runway thing is it allows a position to open up for other guys to play. We brought this up before. The Cardinals have guys who can play third base.

Starting point is 00:04:43 They've got Nolan Gorman who came up as a third baseman because Arana was, you know, entrenched at the third base. But he learned how to play second base. But he's got the arm of a third baseman. That's what he was used to. So that would be a solution of finding Nolan Gorman a spot. Brennan Donovan can also play third base. He can pretty much do anything you want defensively. So Donovan's a name.

Starting point is 00:05:06 Thomas and Jacey, although he doesn't have the arm that you would like to see over at third base. Sometimes you just, you know, if you've got to get his bat in the lineup and by all reports, that's something they want to do. There's nothing for him to prove at the AAA level. And to just have them sitting on the bench most games feels like kind of a waste, doesn't it? So Cajee, somebody who could also play some third base. And all of them, here's the important part. All of them are in a fraction of the cost of what it is costing to pay Nolan Arnato to play at third base.

Starting point is 00:05:45 Now, as far as the timeline for a deal to be completed, Mo said he didn't expect anything to get done by the end of the winter meetings, which will wrap up on Wednesday. But that a trade could happen within the next few weeks. The quote here says, I'm trying to keep them in the loop on how we're thinking through it and how we're doing it, but nothing has been written in stone yet. We both remain optimistic that both parties will end up happy somehow. Now, if this is the end of the Aronado era in St. Louis, it's hard to not feel disappointed about it. It really is. Getting him was such a big move, and it seemed like he was the missing piece to putting the team,

Starting point is 00:06:27 over the top again, and it just never came to fruition. I don't think many of us saw his play, specifically offensively, tailing off as quickly as it has over the last couple of years. I thought Nato was going to be one of the top sluggers in baseball until he was like 35 years old. I'm sure the Cardinals felt the same way. He did have some personal success defensively. Obviously, he's always been very, very good. A couple of gold gloves, a couple of platinum gloves since he's been with St. Louis, an All-Star three times. He won a Silver Slugger Award and had a top three finishing the MVP race back in 2022, losing to Paul Goldsmith that year. And after 2022, things just have not gone well for this franchise or Nolan and Aronado personally as far as his

Starting point is 00:07:16 play on the field. The team didn't win one single playoff game with Aronado on their roster, which seems crazy. But it's true. They got, they got back. bounced by the Dodgers in that wildcard game on that Chris Taylor home run in 2021. Then they got swept by the Phillies in 2022 to best two out of three. They lost two in a row at home. And have yet to make it back to the postseason the last couple seasons. And, you know, in those games that they did make it to the playoffs, you can point at Nolan Aronado's lack of production in those games as part of the problem. Those three postseason games that he played, he went one for 12, had one run scored.

Starting point is 00:07:55 That was it. Just nothing offensively. And it's hard to sugarcoat. Stats like that. There's no real way to look at it like, oh, well, but if you do, no, that's just not good. It's just not good. And things just did not work out the way everyone thought they would. It happens.

Starting point is 00:08:14 It happens. So what are the teams that are being mentioned in the latest trade rumors? We've got to, you know, since the one Soto signing, we've got kind of an updated look on things as far as what teams would be interested in Nolan Arnato still. So we'll tackle that question next on Lockedown Cardinals. Get ready to tackle the NFL action with Fandall. America's never one sports book because right now new customers can bet $5 and get $150 and bonus bets if you win. The Fandil Sportsbook gap gives you everything you need to place live vets on the NFL and they do it all in one place. I don't know if you're watching Monday night football last night.

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Starting point is 00:09:49 Never waste a hunch and make every moment more with $1. Vandal, an official sports book partner of the NFL. Thanks for making a lot on Cardinals your first list. Every day, you can leave comments on YouTube as well as on Twitter X anytime you want. That feedback always welcome and encouraged. Leave your thoughts on trading away Nolan Aronado. What kind of stuff are you expecting to get back? That's really the issue here.

Starting point is 00:10:19 First, you know, there's not a lot of places that no one wants to go. And of course, the Cardinals want to get something decent back. According to Derek Gould at STL Today.com, Cardinals have approached around five teams to discuss trading for Aronado. In that select group, he says the Yankees and at least one of the club recording Juan Soto before entertaining other moves. Padres and also Dodgers are two other clubs that fit the profile of teams. The Cardinals have been contacting. The Boston Red Sox have been rumored as a team that might have some interest in Nolan.

Starting point is 00:10:49 It would require them to kind of move some things around because they got that one guy, Rafael Devers. Pretty darn good hitter, right? Over at third base, although he's brutal, brutal defensively, which is something I would assume Boston would love to upgrade at and have Nolan Aronado over there. The chat has been that, you know, hey, maybe Devers could go to first base, but then you've got Tristan Kossis over at first base. So that's a whole bunch of problems that the Boston Red Sox would have to figure out

Starting point is 00:11:21 if they indeed had interest in trading for Nolan Aronado. So former Sall Young winner, Jake Peavy from MLB Network, proposed a hypothetical trade between the Cardinals in Boston with Aronado going to Beaten Town and then St. Louis giving their number five prospect and right handed pitcher Richard Fitz. Their number 13 prospect and outfielder Miguel Blyze, I think is how they said, and Major League outfielder, D.H. Masataka Yoshita. Now, Yoshita is not a big guy by any means. The Ushita is a 5-8, 192 pounds, 31 years old now, was used primarily as a D-H last year, hit

Starting point is 00:11:59 280, 10 home runs, and 56 ribbies in 108 games with an OPS plus of 112. Underwent laboral surgery in his right shoulder back in October, but I'll report say that he is expected to be back and ready for opening day. The year before that, in his first year with Boston and here in the States, hit 289 with 15 home runs and 72 RBIs. in 140 games, the OPS Plus of 109. He is under contract for three more years of a five-year, $90 million deal that he signed with the Red Sox when he came from Japan.

Starting point is 00:12:33 Roughly around $18 million per year is what he's expected to get paid. It's a lot of money for a guy that Boston did not trust to be in the outfield anymore. It was basically just a DH. So that's, I don't know about that. fits. Sixth round pick by the Yankees game to Boston in the Alex Verdugo trade. 24 years old, made four major league starts last year. He went 1-1-1-1.1-7-4 ERA. According to his scouting report, his fastball sits around 92 to 95, but he can peak at 98. And according to their scouts here, highest ceiling among Boston's pitching prospects right now,

Starting point is 00:13:14 decent bet to fit into the back of the rotation or is a multi-inning reliever. as for I think it's blise. Could be bleas. Either way, according to MLV pipeline, he was the top signing in Boston's 2020, 2021 international class earned 1.5 million bonus on the basis of his electric bat speed and potential to become a five-tool center fielder. Already has jaw dropping raw power at age 20,

Starting point is 00:13:41 thanks to his bat speed, still developing strength and the loft and leverage in his right-handed swing. He already has gained 20 pounds since turning pro. and could lose a bit of quickness as he continues to add muscle. But even so, his instincts will enable him to continue to be an asset as a runner and defender, looks to make things happen on the bases, and makes good reads in center field. Center field is a position where you've got Michael Siani, you've got Victor Scott second. I mean, you're always willing to upgrade certain positions if you can do that.

Starting point is 00:14:15 You've got Lars Newpar who could play center field this year as well. But again, he's 20. Two stops at A and High A last year. Hit a combined 220, 11 home runs and 47 RBIs and 95 games. Going through the comments under the post here about this trade for MLB Network. Most people on both sides of the fence think that this is not a very reasonable deal. Cardinals fans don't think the team is interested in swapping Nato for a bad contract like Yoshitas. Meanwhile, the Red Sox aren't sold on Nolan Aronado's offensive decline the last couple seasons,

Starting point is 00:14:55 but they do like the fact that he is a major, major upgrade over Debris defensively at third base. I tend to agree with the people who are writing, you know, hey, why would the Cardinals want a bad contract? Like, why would we do that? You know, why would the Cardinals want to take on a deal for a guy who is way overpaid and doesn't offer all that much? you know, I've seen the talk about, you know, what if Aronado was traded to Dodgers and the Dodgers sent Chris Taylor back in exchange so they can wipe out that bad contract? Like, why would the Cardinals want to pay these guys? Like, that doesn't make any sense. Like if you're going to pay a guy, they would just keep Aronado and pay them.

Starting point is 00:15:39 It's like, why would they want to take on money? Sure, they would save some, but like it's not, I just, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me to do that. my guess is sure they're going to be willing to eat some money by trading Nolan Aronado, which seems to be something that everybody's agreeing on that it's going to have to happen. But I would want to pay somebody else's bad contract just to move Aronado and save a few million dollars, unless you were dropping some very top high quality prospects in return. But still at the same time, I just don't see the Cardinals wanting to do that. As far as those Dodgers rumors go, by the way, because we've all.

Starting point is 00:16:17 been talking about Nolan Aronado for the last week or so and him dropping hints about going to L.A. and playing for the Dodgers. Their GM, Brandon Gumbs, actually was quoted as praising their current third baseman, who was Max Muncie, who was a very productive hit when he's healthy. On Monday, he was talking to L.A. base reporters and appeared to shut down the idea of actually bringing in someone new to play over at third base. Here's the quote. Muncie is going to play third base for us. He's such a a big piece of what we do and has been a staple. So yeah, Max is playing third base. That was something I brought up too. It was like, where is the room for No one Arnado on that team anyway?

Starting point is 00:17:00 You know, Max Muncie, who was playing a little bit of second base, but, you know, healthy. They've got, you know, the Mookie Betts looks like he's coming back to the infield again. I don't think they need Nolan Aronado. They might like him and be like, yeah, you know, he's cool. but I don't see where the actual need to go get Nolan Aronado is. Just because he wants to play there doesn't mean the other team is like, hell yeah, come on over. But we'll see what happens. Now here's another question that was brought up.

Starting point is 00:17:33 Would the Cardinals be willing to bring Aronado back if they don't find a good fit? And apparently that's not out of the realm of possibilities either. When asked if there was a possibility that Aronado could report Spring training is still a cardinal. Moseilocks said, yes, but added. I'm not sure that puts us exactly where we want to be. So as I've mentioned before, you've got the no trade clause hurdle to deal with. Plus, we still don't know where the top free agent third base when Alex Bregman is going just yet.

Starting point is 00:18:03 I have not seen an update on anything with Bregman yet. You know, obviously things can change minute by minute, but I haven't seen anything yet. most of the teams who would like an upgrade at third base are probably going to talk to Alex Breggman first. And as soon as that is over with, then he signs with whoever he sides with, then these other teams, then it, you know, it comes down to the next level, which in my opinion is Nolan or not. But the sooner Breggman signs with someone, the sooner a deal probably gets done with one of those other teams that have shown interest in Nolan. So just got to kind of wait. I don't want to say the P word. I don't want to say the MoP word.

Starting point is 00:18:44 Patience, just little patience. Like, I don't want to do that, but that's kind of where we are right now because no one or not is not the top of the packing order of players that people are trying to acquire right now. We're going to take a look around the league next, including an AL Central team that could be interested in former Cardinals first baseman, Paul Goldschmidt. This is Locked on Cardinals. Thank you again for making Locktown Cardinals your first list in today for your second list and find Lockt on MLB. Baseball Guru Sully brings you the third. daily blend of humor and baseball, keeping you updated on all the teams during this offseason.

Starting point is 00:19:23 You can find out on MLB on YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts. So according to the MLB networks, John Marosi, the Detroit Tigers, had interest in former Cardinal First Baseman Paul Goldschmidt. The first base market has not really gotten going yet. You've still got, you know, the polar bear Pete Alonzo who is out there. Christian Walker, the guy who replaced Paul Goldsmith in Arizona and is won a few gold gloves. is still available as well. So again, Goldie, not at the top of the packing order of first baseman that people

Starting point is 00:19:56 are trying to get their hands on. MLB trade rumors, Mark Polishuk says that acquiring Goldschmidt isn't the type of blockbuster move. It would have been just a few years ago as the veteran is coming off the first true middling season of his long career with a strikeout walk and chase rates all well below the league average, but says there is reason for optimism. and points out that most of Goldie's struggles were in the first half of last year. Ended up hitting 271 in the second half in 250 plate appearances.

Starting point is 00:20:29 And we do remember that Goldie started to heat up a little bit at the end of August. And then September, you know, you really started to, he looked more like the Goldie of old. But, I mean, I don't know how you can look at like, hey, he had a good like three or four weeks. and then look at the rest of his season where he was terrible and go, but we believe in that small sample size compared to what happened the rest of the season. He points out that Goldie, when he did make contact, hit the ball very, very hard, had strong barrel rates and a hard hit ball rate that ranked in the 92nd percentile of all batters. But again, the strikeouts and the swing and misses, they're all going up,

Starting point is 00:21:09 and they continue to go out for Goldie each year. The Tigers also have former number one overall picks, Mitch Torkelson, who looked like he was going to have a big year last year and took a major step back. Ended up getting sent down last year. He still, I would assume, penciled in at first base for the Tigers. So I'm not sure how they would maneuver that situation. Maybe one of them becomes a DH, but not my problem. Not my problem.

Starting point is 00:21:35 If that's the route they want to take, that's on you, Detroit to figure it out. Obviously, we do wish Gold did the best, wherever he ends up landing as long as he's not beating our cartels, right? The starting pitching market continues to become more and more expensive with guys signing well above their projections thus far. You still got huge names out there, Corvin Burns, Max Freed. Then you come down a level where, you know, Jack Flaherty is there. Walker Bueller, who was one of the best pitchers in baseball to the injuries caught up with him. Nathan Evaldi, another former Cardinal Jose Cantana still out there. Shumaniah had a huge year with the Mets.

Starting point is 00:22:12 You've also got former side young winners, Justin Berliner and Max Scherzer, who from all Fort still want to pitch, and they're looking for homes right now. But with prices, as far as free agent money going, the levels are quite high, I wonder if more teams might give the Cardinals a call about players like Eric Fetty and Miles Michaelis and Stephen Matts. You know, if they're just looking for back of the rotation kind of guys, they're not trying to sign any of these free agents because it's too expensive. Next best thing is to trade for some of these guys.

Starting point is 00:22:50 And Fetty, Michaelis, and Matt's all have one year remaining on their deals. So it's not like they would be locked in any long-term commitments. And they would get, you know, Fetty was pretty good last year for the White Sox, had a couple of good starts with the Cardinals. Obviously didn't live up to the expectations we were hoping when he came over. Um, Michaelis, you know, a lot of quality starts last year, a lot of team in quality starts. Uh, but obviously is one of the more hitable pitchers in the game. Stephen Matt's, you keep them on the field.

Starting point is 00:23:22 He's not so shabby, but that, that's the difficult part about that. Uh, the White Sox Garrett Crochet is a name that continues to be bounced around on the trade block. But, uh, I thought I saw something where the White Sox GM is like, we're not actively trying to trade anybody at the moment. okay. But there have been other names because of the rise in cost for starting pitching that other names on other teams who have expiring contracts soon could be made available. The names of the Astros Framber Valdez and Padres Dillon Cis. We're brought up by MLB.com's Mark Feincent, along with the Mariners Luis Castillo, the Marlins, Jesus Luzardo, and also the Cardinals, Sunny Gray.

Starting point is 00:24:06 but Gray has the no trade clause. He's the only one in that grouping that does have a no trade clause. And as far as I've heard, nothing has changed about his desire to stay with the Cardinals in 2025. That's what he wants to do. Could things change down the road? Sure, I guess. But as of right now, Sunny Gray is going to be in St. Louis next year. But those other names, obviously, some pretty big names there.

Starting point is 00:24:36 So we'll see how the trade market fluctuates here in the near future. Speaking of pitchers, according to Derek Gould, the Cardinals have signed right-handed pitcher Jan Ewing Cabrera, who was a 19-year-old, who was a member of Cuba's national team in 2022, and a standout where their under 18 team with a sub 0.30 ERA that season, excuse me, received a $250,000 bonus. And the MLB draft lottery is taking place tonight. or this afternoon, depending on where you live.

Starting point is 00:25:09 4.30 p.m. St. Louis time is when that'll take place, and you can watch that on the MLB network. Third year of the lottery during the winter meetings to determine the top of the draft order. All non-playoff teams are entered into this lottery for the top six picks. This year, 16 of those 18 teams are eligible for the lottery, including the Cardinals, who have a very slim 0.82% shot at the number one overall pick. The White Sox and the A's are not eligible. to get the top pick. Two teams that could really use that number one pick,

Starting point is 00:25:41 and they're ineligible to win it this year. So the Rockies have the highest percentage at 22.405, followed by the Marlins, the Angels, Nationals, and then the Blue Jays. Last year, the Guardians won the lottery, despite having just a 2% or 2% odds of doing so. And I ended up selecting Travis Bezana out of Oregon State with that number one overall pick.

Starting point is 00:26:03 So, yeah, we're telling you there's a chance. The Cardinals could get it. It's not a big chance, but it's a possibility. So 4.30 p.m. St. Louis time if you're interested in watching that. And also a little bit of news. World Series here, David Freeze. We'll be joining the Cardinal staff as a guest coach in spring training this year. So kind of cool seeing David Freeze get back in the fold after all these years.

Starting point is 00:26:26 So there you go. Thanks for making Locked on Cardinals. Your first listen every day. If you haven't already, please give us a follow on Twitter X at L.O. underscore Cardinals and a JD Sports Radio. Like, subscribe. on YouTube and help our channel and love for the Cardinals grow. Again, any updates that go down at the winter meetings.

Starting point is 00:26:43 Obviously, follow us on Twitter X. We'll get you posted there. We'll also throw up some videos and stuff, some video shorts with information on any major moves that might take place involving the Cardinals. So keep your eyes open for it. You're the best fans in baseball for a reason, and I'll see you next time on Lockdown Cardinals.

Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Mozeliak Opens Up About Arenado Trade Speculation

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