Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Progress On An Arenado Trade?

Episode Date: February 5, 2025

Jeff Jones, Cardinals reporter from BND.com, joins us today to talk St. Louis Cardinals baseball - Nolan Arenado Update - Jordan Walker's Impact In 2025 - Jim Edmonds - Six Man Rotation Idea? - Right Handed Hitting Outfielder Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms… 🎧 https://link.chtbl.com/LOSTLCardinals?sid=YouTube Locked On MLB League-Wide: Every Team, Prospects & More 🎧 https://linktr.ee/LockedOnMLB Follow on Twitter/X: @JDSPORTSRADIO Follow the show on Twitter/X: @LO_Cardinals Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! PrizePicks Download the app and use code lockedonnfl to win $50 instantly when you play $5. You don't even need to win to receive your $50 bonus, it's guaranteed! Prizepicks. Run Your Game. Click Here: https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/LOCKEDONMLB Gametime Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONMLB for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime. FanDuel Super Bowl 59 is here, And there’s no better way to make every play more exciting than with FanDuel Sportsbook. New customers can bet just FIVE DOLLARS, and if you win, you’ll score TWO HUNDRED BUCKS in Bonus Bets. Download the app or head to FANDUEL.COM to get started. Bet with FanDuel—Official Partner of Super Bowl Fifty-Nine. FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) #ForTheLou #stlcards #mlb #lockedoncardinals Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Cardinals reporter Jeff Jones joins us today to talk all things Cardinals, including the report that the Cardinals are still in talks with one team about Nolan or another. You are Locked on Cardinals, your daily St. Louis Cardinals podcast, part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hey there, Cardinals. I'm J.D. Hafford and I'm your host for Lockdown Cardinals, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network covering your team every day. You can follow me on TwitterX at JD Sports Radio and the podcast at L0 underscore Cardinals. I want to thank those of you who make Locktown Cardinals first listen every day.

We're free and available wherever you get your podcast. You can find us on YouTube as well, like, subscribe and comment and hit that notification button so you know when new episodes are posted. This is a show serving Cardinal Nation, giving the best fans in baseball, all of the info about the birds on the bat. Today's episode brought to you by Game Time. Download the GameTime app, create an account, and use the code locked on MLB for $20 off your first purchase. We've got Jeff Jones back with us today. Covers the Cardinals for the Belleville News Democrat. You can find its work at B&D.com.

Jeff, how are things in your world? Are you staying warm? We're doing our best. You know, we went from 71 degrees on Monday to whatever the heck it is now with the freezing grain here on Wednesday. But I am something like 72 hours from being in Florida. So all things considered, I probably shouldn't complain too much. Yeah, yeah.

You'll fight through it so you can get out of town as quick as possible. The biggest story right now this offseason, obviously, has been the discussion of trading way Nolan Aronado. Priority 1, 2, and 3. We've heard all the quotes from Mo and how this is just something they want to get done. I know fans are exhausted about this topic. I get more pushback on this where they're like, dude, we're sick of this. Can we talk about something else? The problem is this is the top topic. This is the thing that is kind of sitting there just hanging over the head of the team right now. and, you know, I'm sure the Cardinals, I'm sure Nolan Aronado, they're exhausted dealing with this as well. But with pitchers and catchers reporting in a week and the position players following right after that, many are wondering whether or not something is actually going to get done or not. Now, yesterday we got a report from MLB networks, John Paul Marosi, that the Red Sox and Cardinals have had recent communication about a Nolan Arnato trade.

Now, I don't know exactly what recent means because of my world. reason is like within the past month. But is there anything that you can shed on this subject? And what are your thoughts on whether or not a deal can or will get done before spring training begins? Yeah, you know, I wish I had something more illuminating to say, no, there's nothing. You know, I'm glad that somebody told John Morose, you think that's been reported for the last three months and just noticed. Congratulations to him, I guess. But no, look, as far as anyone can tell, there was, there is not going to be progress on this front until Alex Breggman picks a team. If that's the case, maybe that's today, maybe that's a week from today,

maybe that's the middle of March. We have seen Boris guys drag into camp before. This is not necessarily new for him. You know, the Cardinals' inability to figure out a different way to do this without requiring Bregman to sign. It says what it says about their front office and their ability to kind of give through an offseason. But it doesn't appear that there is going to be any movement on that front until there's any movement on the other one. And so, you know, look, I, I, I get it, I understand that this has been hammered into the ground since probably October, honestly. But what is, what is there, they have done nothing out. There's nothing else. They've done nothing at all. And if their position is that that's not going to happen until this gets

done, then that is what it is. You know, I get that it doesn't make for the most exciting offseason or the more, most productive one for a team. But this is the path they've chosen and this is what it looks like for now. Now, if a deal doesn't happen, say we get to where position players are reporting, which, what are we, 12 days away from that happening. No one are not, would you expect him to come to camp on time or is there something that possibly they'd be like, well, let's, we're almost there. Let's wait it out. Or do you think he shows up on time? And if that happens, how awkward are things going to be around camp with him being there? They're not going to hold him out of camp. He's not going to stay home. He'll be in camp on time. If he's still on the roster on the 17th, when

pitchers and catcher, or I'm sorry, when position players do to report, then he'll be there. And we'll sort of see you what goes from there. You know, is he going to be there any earlier? Who knows? Hard to say. I haven't heard on that either way. So it's possible. Look, I said, I'm driving to forward this weekend. I get to the complex for the first day next Monday to 10th. And if I walk in on Monday and Nolan is at his locker, I'm not going to be like floored. but I also don't expect that necessarily to happen either. I think that we'll see him on report day, assuming anything happens between now and then, and they'll just go forward.

You know, in terms of offering this, like, I think by and large, his teammates get the score. I know by and large that his teammates don't fault him for anything that's going on, and it's just going to be what it is. You know, I think that if we get to camp and there's no deal, then, well, it's going to be waiting for a deal to happen during camp. And if it doesn't happen during camp, then I guess you put it back in the box until probably the deadline next winter. I don't know. Honestly, like, I have a hard time understanding how it got this far.

It is stunning to me that they let it bleed this far into the winter without figuring out a different path here. And I don't know what happens next because I didn't, for the wife of me, could not have imagined that they would have let this drag on this long. Yeah. And you mentioned the Alex Breggman. signing when or if that's going to happen. It seems like it's kind of down to a couple of different teams. Detroit seems to be a team that has got the best deal on the table for him. And if that's the case, he can either choose that or he can choose what we've heard the

Astros have offered him so far. In your eyes, do you still feel like if those are the two teams that Breggman might go to, do you feel like the Red Sox are still probably the best place for Aronado to land? because we've also heard that maybe like the Royals might be a possibility, might be interested in him. But do you still feel like Boston would be the top spot for Nolan and for a deal to get done? Look, what I would say is that the reporting all points in that direction. We know it's willing to accept a deal for the Red Sox.

We know that they have had consistent conversations about it and that there is probably a fit there to be had. So by default, I would assume that they would be, you know, be for lack of better term favorite in this situation. I don't honestly know. It's entirely possible that somebody crops up at the 11th hour. If this week into camp, people get heard, people show up, look in a certain way, who can say? I think it's the Red Sox by default until something else reveals itself. I will say, in the event that another team does sort of pop out of the woodwork and there is reporting that suggests that there's something serious happening there, then that probably would jump to the front of the line because to me, at this point in the offseason, if you were to

jump in now, you would have to be serious, right? Like, there's nobody calling on February 5th going, yeah, you know, we didn't check in earlier. We were just curious. That's not like, that's not happening. And so if you jump in or back in now, you're serious about it. And so maybe that's team that skips to the front of the line. And how about this scenario too? What if, uh, Nato's in camp, we've begun camp, is there a possibility that he would still get traded after he already joins a team? Or do you think that would be something that they'd be like, all right, we're just going to move forward and you're going to be a part of this roster. No, I think they'd be perfectly willing to trade him during spring if that's how it breaks down.

Again, you know, if Alex Breggman signs on February 22nd and on the 23rd, somebody calls and say, okay, we're going to get it serious about Nolan now. The Cardinals will do it. The Cardinals do not want to pay his salary. The Cardinals want to clear his roster spot. They're not going to burn the roster down to do it. And, you know, like there are things that they're not going to accept you. They're not going to pay the whole ticket, right?

but they want to move him. So, you know, when he shows up to camp, assuming that he gets there, okay, great, but that does not preclude him from being moved during spring training at all. The only thing I would say is that, you know, for a deal like this, it would be super unusual for it to happen at a time that is not the off season or maybe the deadline, which is to say that if the season starts, then you're probably looking at Aronado in St. Louis, likely until July. All right.

One of the key members of the team in 2025 is going to be Jordan Walker. And Jeff, you recently did a piece on him that I want to discuss next. We'll get into that next on Lockdown Cardinals. The big game is almost here. There's no better way to make it even more exciting than with prize picks. The best plays for daily fantasy sports with over 10 million members and billions in winnings awarded. Price Picks makes it fun and simple to get in on the action. Basically, this is how it works.

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Price picks run your game. Thanks again for making a lockdown cardinals. Your first listen every day. Leave your comments on YouTube as well as on Twitter X. Anytime you want, your feedback is always welcome and encouraged. Jeff Jones joining us today covers the Cardinals for the Belleville News Democrat B&D.com. If you haven't signed out to get his work, you're wasting time. You need to get on that. You just heard him talking about. He's sitting down to Florida. He is going to be in spring training covering everything going on with the Cardinals. So you don't want to miss out on all the info he's going to provide you. Jordan Walker was once the cream of the crop as far as hitters go in the eyes of a lot of scouts. And he had him touted as the top hitting prospect in baseball at one time. But things haven't quite gone as smoothly as everybody hoped since he made that opening day roster in 2023.

And you recently did an article about Jordan at B&D.com and what his impact can be for the team this year. In your opinion, is there any one player on this roster that is under more pressure and scrutiny to live up to the hype than Jordan is this year for the Cardinals? That's an interesting question in terms of pressure and scrutiny, right? Because I would say that I do think that probably Nolan Gorman, for instance, is under a little more pressure and a little more scrutiny just in terms of where he has an development curve. I would say that, you know, arguably guys like Eric Fetty and Stephen Mats who are staring down the barrel of free agency have a different kind of pressure on them, you know, there's ways to look at it. But, you know, the thing that I would say, and I think that I love that story with

is that there is no one that's going to be on the field for the Cardinals in 2025 that is more important than Jordan Walker, right? Like, he's got to figure it out in order for this thing to sort of progress in the way that they have described in order for them to succeed in pulling off a recent. set without having to ever call it a rebuild, all that good stuff. Jordan Walker has to hit. He's got to be a guy who hits in the middle of the lineup. And that's just what it has to be.

You know, is that entirely fair to Jordan? Maybe kind of, you know, look, that's sort of what kind of one comes with it, right? And he has the skills to do that. He has the tools to do that. And certainly we'll put in the necessary work to do that. It's just going to be a matter of whether or not the tools that I think we've all kind of seen in fits and stuff. starts can manifest themselves more consistently.

You know, if he can make the kind of adjustments that you have to make to be that hitter of the big league. And if he can sort of get himself back to maybe the hitter he was in that winter between 22 and 23, when we all sort of seen that breakout enormous minor league season that made him, you know, one of the top prospects in all of baseball, going into a spring where however they want to frame it now, the competition that was set up for Jordan Walker in spring of 23 was one that was set up for him to win. They expected him to make that team out of spring training from the day they got to Florida, right?

And they were willing to create a circumstance to allow that to happen. So, you know, that's the guy that they see. That's the guy that I see, frankly. That's the guy that I'm very confident that Jordan can be, will be will grow into. But he's got to show it now. You know, this is his third season. It is coming to a point where if this year looks at all like last year, then maybe it's sort of time to reevaluate what.

we were right about what kind of player we thought he could be. What do you think the biggest difference is for Jordan's struggles between, you know, that big gear that he had in the minor leagues and what he's seen at the pros? Is it just because, you know, different level competition? He basically went double A to, you know, Major League Baseball where, you know, obviously the pitching is much better. Or do you think it is something that he had changed with mechanics or something that has caused him to struggle more because, you know, they hear about the launch angles and stuff, and fans are like,

he was doing fine. Why are we messing with him? Where do you see the issues began and have forced him to, you know, kind of reevaluate what kind of hitter he needs to be? So I think that what fans assume when they hear coaches talking about making swing adjustments and, you know, talking about the angle of which they attack the ball and kind of lift that they get, is that they are trying to turn hitters into something that they're not. With Jordan, it's about trying to get him back to the hitter that he is. The reason that Jordan Walker was an attractive prospect is an attractive prospect, the reason the Cardinals viewed something in him is because he hits the ball hard,

and when he lifts it, it turns into power, right? And so it's not a question of trying to change Jordan into something that he has not and has never been. rather it's a matter of okay we know what you are how do we access it how do we locate it how do we get it to where you can repeat it how every swing gets you into that spot you know and i i do think there are a couple of things that i wonder about in terms of developmental path number one obviously anybody coming out of covid is going to be in kind of a weird situation developmentally and we know that the cardinals in fact were aggressive about pushing guys through your system coming out of it and as a result they had you know one of the worst minor league seasons at any like

like a horrible minor league season in the aggregate. I think it was 22. It was just like atrocious across the board in terms of record, right? And that in part was the result of the way that they looked at that post-COVID season and how they wanted to line their guys up. But the other thing, too, with Jordan is that, and I don't mean this as a criticism of him quite the opposite, right? Jordan has been like far in a way naturally the best player on every team he has played on,

his entire life probably until he got the AAA. Like just by, or got to the majors, I should say in the back triple A. But just by just by virtue of his natural talent and athleticism and ability, he showed up on teams and was the best guy like for forever. And so it creates, I'm sure, a situation where adjusting to the reality of that and getting yourself into a spot where you can make the first adjustment and then the adjustment to the adjustment is hard because my guess would be he has probably never really had to do that.

It hasn't been hard for him to climb through levels and then to learn new leagues, but his, his talent is so, like so exceeds the average that he is able or has been able, I would should say historically, to just kind of muscle through it, right? And so there is something to learning to be a professional and,

and learning how to get through the big leagues. You know, I think that there is a degree of like, because teams are incentivized now, to push players when they're so young. It creates some unreasonable expectations in terms of when a guy doesn't show up in the big leagues of 21 and he's not immediately like Gunner Henderson, there's a freak out, right? We saw this last year even with Jackson Holiday in Baltimore.

You got to the big leagues and he struggled because it's hard to hit in the big leagues. And now a guy who was one, one, three years ago is a bust. Jordan Walker hasn't turned 23 yet, right? Like this is a guy who would not be out, like it would not at all be out of his depth would be wrong expectation we're going to be a AAA this year. But he's got to be a producer in the big league because of the way that things have happened in this organization. So, you know, there is something to be said for patients.

There's something to be said for allowing that to happen. All of that said, like I just said a couple of minutes ago, this is an important year for him. And this is a year that if it goes badly will cause us and I think should fairly cause us to sort of readjust what the expectations for him would look like. And so it is like it is a balance between the two. And that is really kind of the Cardinals point in all this, right? They have not, they felt they have not been able to give Jordan the kind of runway you would like in the big leagues over the last two seasons to figure it out and work through it and to do what, for instance, Jackson Chorio did for the Brewers last year. He did not hit for two months and then he hit.

Then one day he got 150 played appearances end of the season and the bat turned on and now he's Jackson Chorio. So the Cardinals now are in a spot where they're going to let Jordan Walker do that. He's not getting option in April this year. Jordan Walker's healthy. He's playing six days a week. He's going to be in the lineup. They're going to go. And work through it and he'll figure it out.

And he will get himself to a level that he needs to be or he won't. And if you won't, then that changes a lot of what happened to this team over the next two, three, five years. At the winter warm up this year, you know, Jordan, you know, obviously got to speak to the media and everything. And I noticed at least, and I wanted to see if you picked up on the same vibes that he seems, he seems a little more boisterous, a little more confident. The way he just was speaking, he was very open about things he was working on and stuff. And it was quite the difference between the guy that we've talked to over the last couple of years in interviews and stuff where, you know, he was kind of like, you know, I'm just a kid. You know, I'm going to learn.

And now he's just like, now this is what we're going to do. And I'm doing this. And did you pick up on those vibes as well that he seems a little more mature and a little more confident? Yeah, a thousand percent. And I think that you kind of look at Jordan's first two years, coming into spring in 23, he is the big story. He is, he is the guy. And then he makes the team, and he is the story.

And then he gets sent down, and he is the story. Like all of these things are happening at the same time, and he got a little inundated, and I think got a little withdrawn about it, right? So the time he gets back to the big leagues, the team is miles out of the race. And he played well, but was able to sort of like settle down, get relaxed, and kind of sort of work himself through it, right? Last year, obviously, same sort of deal. Goes through, goes through it, doesn't hit, get sent down,

and it becomes the same sort of thing, where not only is Jordan doubting himself probably a little bit, but he's also sort of feeling the pressure of the reality of it. You know, and it's in my job, I have spent a lot of time kind of thinking about, like, what does it mean? Like what is a fair pressure? What is an unfair pressure? What does it mean for us to kind of create expectations for players?

And, you know, I was talking. So Jordan hit a home run at home against the pirates on September 17th. I was just looking this up. I was trying to remember the exact day. And it's a Tuesday night game, Cardinals win 3-1. Jordan hits a homer. It's the game where Lance Lynn comes back and pitches. Typically in the post game, you know, you go into the clubhouse.

We'll talk to that day starting pitcher. You'll grab one or two position players or more. Like if there's a big play, there's a lot going on maybe. But like a three to one game against the Pirates in September, you're getting the starter. You're getting one position player. You're getting maybe one. And then you're done. That's what's going to happen, right?

And that night, I remember distinctly we didn't ask for Jordan. I forget who we did talk to you honestly, but it wasn't Jordan. And I made a comment to a member of the team's PR staff that it was probably the first time in Jordan Walker's career that he had hit a home run and not had to do postgame media about it, right? That he was just like a guy who hit a home run and then the ball game happened. All of this is to say, like, it's been on Jordan a lot. And it's going to be, again, like this spring is going to be him and it's going to be Nolan Gorman, and it's going to be certainly Aronado if this doesn't get cleared up.

But they're going to be at the center of it, right? So these are all things to keep in mind. But, you know, all of this is to say, of Jordan that we saw at the winter warm up is a version that I think that whether by circumstance or by choice, he had kind of withheld for a better part of the last year and a half. And I think it's encouraging that that he feels comfortable being in a spot where he can kind of let that out again. Yeah, agreed. And to remind people, just like he said, you know, he's not even 23 yet. We know that he's been around for a couple of years, but he has been a kid this whole time.

And, you know, personally going into a new job just trying to. trying to, you know, keep it, like think about it as normal people stuff. Like when you go into it and, you know, there's all these other people who have been in that room for so many years, it's very easy to just kind of sit back and not be who you normally are, which can affect what's going on with you mentally trying to do your job, which is something I think might have happened to, you know, Jordan Walker, you know, and maybe even Nolan Gorman in these times where, you know, there's a veteran presence among this Cardinals Clubhouse over the last couple years. It wasn't them, it wasn't their clubhouse. And I feel like, you know, when I

watch that or even like a Dylan Carlson, it never seems like the tools aren't there. It just always seems like it's kind of a mental thing and that they're, you know, they're not, they're not feeling confident and stuff. And that's just my outside observation. So, uh, we're going to talk more with Jeff. Uh, I want to get your thoughts on the stuff going on with Jim Edmonds. And then we've got some questions from the fans about, uh, the rotation and, uh, whether or not a right-handed hitting outfielder would be in the future for the Cardinals, if something gets done with Nolan Aronado. More with Jeff Jones coming up next on Locked-on Cardinals.

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Download game time today. Last minute, take its lowest price, guaranteed. Thank you again for making Lockdown Cardinals your first listen today for your second listen. I encourage you to go find Lockdown MLB. Sully is your host covering all the teams this offseason. Even the Cardinals, who I believe are the last team to make any sort of free agent move whatsoever. They're the only ones who haven't done that yet. You can find a locked on on Immobile on YouTube or wherever you listen to your podcast. Chef Jones from the Belleville News Democrat

joining us here today. Jimmy Edmonds want to hit this real quick. We've covered it the last couple days. We don't have to get too in depth on it, but kind of stirred up a hornet's nest among the fans on Monday when he was on one-on-one ESPN show the morning after talking about not coming back to the booth, his discontent with doing the broadcast stuff. It wasn't that much fun anymore. And then he made comments about the Cardinals organization and that not being fun to be around anymore and how we had some issues with the way the alumni were being treated. What were your thoughts and what Jimmy had to say? Was all of this like new knowledge to you? Or was this stuff that it's kind of been simmering underneath the surface of that? Well, so before I answer

that question, let me ask really ask you kind of a nuts and bolts question. Sure. With your with your, viewership, you're people who listen to you. Do you feel like you get more folks watch on YouTube or listen to the podcast audio. It differs, really. Like sometimes there's big videos that'll go off and go crazy, but on a normal everyday basis, usually the audio. Okay. Well, that's good to know, because now I can't just roll my eyes and go on to the next thing. That's my big joke. Look, like, the Cardinals have had organizational problems for a number of years that has been well reported. I'm not going to deny that because I've lived it. I have seen it. I have reported on it. Of course they do.

They cut people during COVID. They've been strambling to catch up. That's like the entire off season is all these guys they're hiring now. Do I think any of that has anything remotely to do with Jim Edmund's getting his feeling? I don't. I don't at all. I think that people not wanting to hang out and talk to Jim is about Jim and is not about anything else. I think that Jim yak at how there are no Hall of Famers in uniform down there was interesting because I sat and talked.

Ozzy Smith in his uniform for like 45 minutes for a story I worked on last year. Willie McGee is there all the time. Izzy is there. Ryan Leibook is on the Cardinals Hall of Fame, but he works there. For Nardilke works there. I get that that's not Bob Gibson and Lou Brock. There are guys who are there and guys who are involved. You know, and I think this is a really good point.

I'm not going to put them on blast because I wouldn't want to stick them out. But a friend of mine, somebody I work with said to me this week, does Jimmy think that Gibby and Lou and Red and those guys had to get begged to show up, or did they just show up? And then they figured it out among them. If Jimmy is so concerned about having a voice and a place in the organization, he's free to show up, right? Like, and I'm sure to let him in. And I don't think that the mean old security guard down to Jupiter who wouldn't let him in the clubhouse. Number one, that doesn't happen unless somebody told that person to make that happen. And maybe, you know, who that somebody is, who can say, I don't know, because Jim went out of his way to talk about how

great he thinks moan ollie and the do wits are so i don't know who jim is that mad about um but also like he would never occur to jim that the problem might be jim it just would never occur to him and and so i don't like i don't know what to say about most of it because most of it is like yeah man i don't i don't have that same perspective as him now no one's asking me into the cage and and no one wants to be it and i don't talk about it either but i just i think a lot of what jim is talking about is about Jim. And, you know, if he's got problems with how Valley is run, look, he wouldn't be the first person to tell me that some of the higher executives at Valley, or now Fanduil, then Valley, have their hands into POS that shouldn't have their hands in, and that there was a lot

of national look down on a local market without maybe a lot of understanding about that market. That being said, while I don't know anything about putting on a TV broadcast, I got a pretty good idea that if you show up at the ballpark an hour before first pitch, you probably miss the production meeting. And so there probably are some things with the broadcast. They're going to feel disorganized to you if you didn't bother to show up for the meetings which organized the broadcast. That is sort of how I feel about it. All right. All right. And that is one thing I then continue to bring up. I'm like, please understand this is one guy's perspective. You know, other people aren't he can't speak for everybody. So unless we hear from other people, we can't really say,

oh, this is exactly how it is. And this is Jimmy speaks the truth. Two things can be true at once. The Cardinals have had organizational brain dream that has hurt them because talented and committed people don't work there anymore. And also, Jim's a pain in the butt and nobody wants to deal with it. All right. Well, let's talk about a different pain in the bud. How about actually having six healthy starters, Jeff? The idea of a six-man rotation is something that I've gotten a lot of questions about. You know, you've got gray, Fetti, Palante, Michaelis, Matt, and McGreevy.

All right now are healthy. odds are that won't happen. And it won't stay that way. Odds are one or more will get hurt at some point this season because that's just what happens. But is that something in your opinion that the Cardinals might or should toy with? Or is it just inevitable that one of them goes to the bullpen? And if so, should it be Stephen Maths or should it be Michael McGreevy?

What do you think? So there are a number of things there. I'll start with, I don't think it should be Michael McGreevy. I think Michael McGreevy should be in the rotation. in St. Louis or in Memphis. And then however that works out, it's however it works out. But I think, I think he's a guy who they want to start for them. And I don't think they need to yank him around. He should be starting whether it's here or whether it's there. You know, in terms of a six-man rotation, that's, I'm sure, going to be discussed during spring. I will say

that it would surprise me a great deal. It would be a pretty big change on the way that they look about things. I, you know, I know that they have in the past put a decent amount of value on schedules for guys and in sort of keeping things in a more predictable way and also generating, you know, the right kind of innings for guys and also, frankly, having the roster flexibility. You know, I don't, I don't necessarily believe that the team need to be able to use eight relievers every night, but major league managers do kind of trend in that direction. And also, and I think it's fair to point out, too, that with a six-man rotation, I think there would be some expectation that it would require more work from the bullpen,

because some of those spots are maybe not going to be as strong as you would like them to be. And so to put more on the bullpen while simultaneously taking a body out of it does not, to me, look like the way that you find success with that. I think that, you know, like you said, it's February 5th, everyone is healthy today as far as we know. Yeah. Who knows what that looks like the first time we talked to Ali five days from now. Who knows what it looks like a week, two, a month from now. the odds of them getting through spring.

And I went back to try to find this the other day and did not succeed because I could not go back far enough to find one. The last time the Cardinals broke camp with the five guys in their rotation that they thought were going to be in their rotation to start the year, it has been a long, long time since actually like the anticipated five broke, right? So something's going to happen and we just don't know yet what it is. And, you know, you just have to hope that it's not too serious. If the stars were to align and if the six guys that you named all kind of get through spring healthy, I do think that they will be willing to let McGreevy compete with, say, Matt's for a starting rotation spot. And if McGreevy were to win that spot, it would not necessarily shock me to see Matt's end up in the bullpen.

I think that is a totally reasonable possibility. You know, I think I don't know that they were necessary, that they are necessarily committed to, for instance, give Miles Michaelis 30 starts no matter what. I think that if Miles Michaelis looks like he looked last year, I don't know how far into the year that they would get before they would reexamine that, but I don't think it would be particularly far. You know, it's a different situation, obviously, with a guy on an expiring contract versus a guy who has a year still to come, a guy who you offered out this winner who said, no, no, I want to stay. these things all kind of change that dynamic and make them a little more willing to, you know, to maybe make that change if it should reveal itself as necessary. And also, you know, again, Eric Feddy was really good last year. He was really good in Korea. He has one really good season in the big leagues and it was last year. So maybe it looks the same this year as he did last year and maybe

it doesn't and they're able to be flexible. There are there are going to be innings available. There are definitely going to be innings because they have not filled anything outside of what they had internally. So they're going to be innings. And I think they're going to give guys opportunities. I think that McGreevy is first in line for that. Even ahead of Liberator, for instance, McGreeby is definitely first in line for those cracks in the rotation. And then we'll just sort of see how it goes.

One final question for it before we let you go. The Cardinals seem to be, and this was from a listener, I forgot where the name went, but the Cardinals seem to be left-handed heavy again in the outfield. If something does end up getting done with Aronado, Do you see there being a chance that the team will look at signing a right-handed hitting outfielder? Because there's a lot of people who are like, hey, Harrison Bader, our old friend is still out there. Do you think that's something that could happen if deal with Nato gets done?

I do. Yeah, I think that that is entirely possible. You know, a guy who I wrote about at this point, I don't even know three, four months ago, as like a low-cost fit for the Cardinals this winter is Garrett Hampson. He is still on the free agent market. that's right-hand hitter. He can play center. He can play short.

He's a good defender. He's a steady guy. A guy like that would make all the sense in the world. I mean, Bader honestly makes a degree of sense if this is a place that he would be interested in coming on a one-year deal. Obviously, a guy who is familiar to the clubhouse, a guy who you would expect to be a flip at the deadline. You know, I don't know what that looks like. You know, it was one year and 10 million from the Mets last year. He didn't really hit it all last year.

So I would be kind of surprised if he got to the same level financially. but even even at like five or seven that seems to be probably more than they would want to put in to that spot. You know, just sort of looking on the list of guys here, like, primarily if it's right-handed hitting outfield, you're going to want it to be someone who plays center. So, you know, your Kevin Pilar's and your Michael A. Taylor is on the veteran end of that. If you wanted to go young, you know, there's really not like Nick Senzel, I guess, is still a free agent. Mani Margo is only third. There are guys that, like, there's nobody.

out there here you're going to get in free agency who are you going to be like super excited about right but that's part of the deal and also consider the possibility too that in fact be moved they could bring back a roster player in that move like i'm not talking about chris and cossis but i'm talking about whatever a guy who you could see as a viable roster player just as part of that larger package all right well once again jeff jones from the belleville news democrat here today find his work at bn d.com make sure you follow him on twitter x at Jeff Jones, heading out to the sunny days of Florida here really, really soon. So safe travels, my friend.

We hope to talk to you real, real soon. And thank you guys for making Lockdown Cardinals for a list every day. If you haven't already, please give us a follow as well on Twitter, X and at LO underscore Cardinals and at JD Sports Radio. Like, subscribe on YouTube and help our channel and love for the Cardinals grow. You guys are the best fans in baseball for a reason. And we will see you next time on Lockdown Cardinals. Thank you, Jeff, for everything.

You're welcome. And by the way, before we stop, real quick, the twins just signed Harrison Bader. So cross-house. As we're wrapping up, I tabbed over. All right. Twinkies are getting Vader. Maybe Randall Gritchuck, if we're looking for former Cardinals. I don't know if he's still, I think he's still.

I'm back signed him last night. Oh, they got it. It's former Cardinal. Garhamson, come on down. Who's still a free agent and fits is Paul Be Young. Paul the Young is still out there. Keep an eye out. All right.

Thank you, Jeff. See you guys.