Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Sonny Gray Spins A MASTERPIECE In Cleveland

Starting point is 00:00:00 Sunny Gray spends a masterpiece and the Cardinals win over the Cleveland Guardians. This is Locked on Cardinals. You are Locked on Cardinals, your daily St. Louis Cardinals podcast, part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hey, they're Cardinals. I'm Jody Hapford and I'm your host for Locktown Cardinals. Part of the Locktown Podcast Network covering your team every day. Follow me on next at Jenny Sports Radio and the podcast at L underscore Cardinals.

Starting point is 00:00:32 We're on YouTube as well as TikTok and Instagram. You can find us at Lockton Cardinals. This is a show serving Cardinal Nation and giving the best fans in baseball, all of the info about the birds on the bat. Today's episode brought to you by GameTime. Download the GameTime app, create an account. Use to code Lockton, Nimafee. That'll get you $20 off your first purchase.

Starting point is 00:00:50 So, joining us tonight is Salvoskovay from Redbird Rants.com. Before we get into the stuff that Sunny Gray did tonight, how is your summer going so far? And have you been sunburnt? Yeah, I got Sunburnt like the first. for second day. Add a boy. Had a boy.

Starting point is 00:01:06 Yeah, went out to the pool with my kids. I've been like 85 for the first time. Got Sundurned. Since then, I've been pretty clear, but I haven't been sitting at the pool, but one or two other times. So I've been playing it safe. All right, good for you.

Starting point is 00:01:19 It's good to have you back. What a night to talk some Cardinal baseball, Thomas. Because Sunny Gray just through one of the best games you might ever see. It's certainly one that, you know, one of the better games that we've seen a Cardinal pitcher in recent memory. In case you missed it, Sunny Gray, a masterpiece tonight. Complete game shutout on 89 pitches.

Starting point is 00:01:40 He gives up one hit. He strikes out 11 and the Cardinals 5 to nothing win over the Cleveland Guardians. In baseball, we call this the Maddox, don't we, Thomas, where you get a complete game shut out and you can do it under 100 pitches, named after one of my favorite pitchers of all time, Greg Maddox, because he's one of those guys who just wasn't a big guy. He could just do it. He was just really, really good.

Starting point is 00:02:05 13 of those, by the way, in his story and career, which is insane. But what a freaking game for Sunny Gray tonight. And it was just impressive all around. According to Sarah Lang, Sunny's 89 pitches, the fewest since Adam Wainwright did it. Did you know that, Thomas? I did not. I think we should just make up a new term and call anything under 90 pitches. Complete game.

Starting point is 00:02:27 Shut out, 10 of more strikeouts, a gray from now on. Okay. I'm on board with that. We can start doing that. It's not going to happen very often. No, that's true. Yeah, he just had a 13 like Maddox did, but that's all right. Yeah, it's very rare.

Starting point is 00:02:41 Adam Wainwright pulled a Maddox off in 88 pitches back on August 11, 2021 against the Pittsburgh Pirates. Wayno allowed two hits. He struck out seven in that game. He was also two for four at the plate with a ground rule double and an RBI single. Yeah, if you guys remember way back in 2021, that's when pitchers were still allowed. the head and swing the back in the day back in the old days when it was black white TVs. So I ask you, Thomas, whose game was better considering the offensive side of Adam Wainwright being a part of the complete game? Who you take it?

Starting point is 00:03:20 I'm going to have to go with Sunny Gray still. I need to go back and look at the score of that game to see if Wayne's hits actually made that much of a difference. But Gray was just dominant all throughout. Oh, I don't know. So they didn't need right to end that well. And he would have had two RBIs because he, the ground rule double, there was a runner on and they had to stop him at their base.

Starting point is 00:03:42 Yeah. Okay. So. Huh. I don't know. I'll give it to gray. There's no wrong answer. They're both awesome.

Starting point is 00:03:51 But I think what made Sunny special was the 11 strikeouts, right? They have 89 pitches and a strikeout 11. That's crazy, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, even if he had 11 immaculate strike, like that's still 33 pitches that he threw. Oh, that's a third. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:04:10 So the fact that he kept it down is the lowest pitch count is crazy. Yeah, that's just something you don't see anymore. Full count only did it once and it was the last batter of the game. Like you just don't see that very often, man. This guy was just locked in and they talked to him after the game, which I thought it was really cool that he made sure Pedro Pahas was in the interview with him afterwards. because of how important he was to throwing a game as good as this was. But he talked about how aggressive Cleveland was at the plate tonight.

Starting point is 00:04:40 And he's like, obviously that helped us out. They were trying not to fall behind in the count and get to a two-strike count. So they were swinging at a lot of first pitches. And I think, if I remember what I'm saying correctly, I think there was at least six of them where the guardians were swinging at the first pitch and made it out. So that obviously helps you out when they are that aggressive and they're not actually getting hits off of you.

Starting point is 00:05:01 So that was pretty cool. But what were some of your takeaways from tonight's victory over Cleveland when it comes to the pitching side of things with Sunny and Pedro? Yeah, his sweeper was on. He had 10 whiffs on 15 swings, 67% whiff right there on the sweeper. None of his pitches were extremely overpowering. I think he topped out like 94 with his sinker. His fastball sat around 92 and a half. But he was just dotting things up.

Starting point is 00:05:29 Like he said, Cleveland batters were swinging early. often at his pitches he got to those two strike counts, limited his balls. It was, I think he had some like 21 or 22 first pitch strikes out of the 28 batters that he'd face. Awesome. Yeah. I mean, it's utterly dominant everywhere you look. His sweeper is probably the most impressive part with those wits.

Starting point is 00:05:48 Yeah, they asked him about that too. They asked Pedro about it. They were like, is it tough not to call that pitch every time. And he's like, well, I mean, obviously, you got to mix it up. But, yeah, that thing was awesome. I think that was the pitch that, um, no one. and Jones got the hit on. It was a sweeper, I think. Let me check. And you know what, Sonny said, too, that that was the only thing that he actually, like, said no, like, shook off Pedro,

Starting point is 00:06:14 got the hit. So he was like, I'll just stick with it. It was very bold Durham type of moment because that's what happens in the movie where he's like, this guy's shaking me off. He's throwing a shut out. He's shaking me off. And so he tells the batter what's coming. But I'm guessing Pedro didn't do that. But it was just so impressive. And like, we're, I'm watching the game and they kept showing the sky and I'm like, why do they keep showing the sky? And I'm like, oh my God, it's still daylight out because how quick everything is going in this game. Like there was just no wasted time in and out of the dugouts and Sunny doing what Sunny does. So really cool to watch.

Starting point is 00:06:48 Offensively, the Cardinals got busy in that 30th evening with that rocket home run from Pedro Paw has 112 off the bat to make it one nothing. Alec Berlinson continued his onslaught here in the month of June with a two run homer to write. That makes it 3-0. And then the old man, Nolan Aronado had two, two-out RBI hits. One was a double. One was a single. And that's all the offense the Cardinals needed because of how good Sunny Gray was. Alec Berluson, real quick, has been something just special this month.

Starting point is 00:07:16 What are your thoughts on what you've seen from Alec Berluson so far here in the month of June? Yeah, he's brought the power that we need. Is he up to 11 home runs now? Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's especially from the left side, you see primarily right-hand pitchers and all that, but he's been balanced against lefties, too.

Starting point is 00:07:33 His average has pretty much been there for his whole career as far as an above league average batting average goes. But now he's starting to get some of the power stroke against the lefties as well. It's been nice, especially with the Von Pereira out for a while now. And Jordan Walker, too, who was supposed to be a fire bat. Yeah, for sure. Like, he's just been something else. And you can't get him out of the lineup.

Starting point is 00:07:52 But now you really can't get him out of the lineup because now he's a gold glover, apparently. Apparently he's going to make sliding catches. He's going to dive into the net. he's going to make him on the run. He's got it all now. Five to a player now when Alec Berlinson, he's hitting infield singles tonight.

Starting point is 00:08:08 I think they're giving him there, but, you know, you see him. I think it's good to see. Everything about Alec Berlinson is what you want in a cardinal player. Absolutely. I think it was Josh Jacobs said that whatever John Jay is getting paid this year is not nearly enough. So he needs a pay raise between this year and next year.

Starting point is 00:08:25 Yeah, turning things around for the guys who were considered defensively challenged. coming into the year. Jordan Walker obviously made some strides too. We're going to get back to the pitching side of things for our next segment because I don't know if you've noticed, but there are some really good young arms in the NL Central right now, which begs the question, who is the Cardinals future ace that is going to match you up with all these dudes? So we're going to get into that coming up next on Locked on Cardinals. Have you ever decided at the last minute to, you know what, I'm going to head down to the ball game with your friends, with your family, hey, you can go by yourself.

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Starting point is 00:10:21 Download the game time app today. Last minute tickets, lowest price, guaranteed. Thanks again for making Locked on Cardinals. Your first list in every day. Leave it comments on YouTube as well as on X anytime you want. We always like that feedback from you. Thomas Govane from Redbird Ranch.com with us, marveling over another great performance by Sunny Gray,

Starting point is 00:10:44 who was now 8 and 2 on the season, the ERA 3.36, 101 strikeouts and 93 and 2.3th innings. He is the Cardinals number one right now. People get mad at me when I use the word ace. Fine. He's still the number one guy in this rotation. And it's really kind of a bummer. Like when you look back on things that he wasn't in line to pitch against the Cubs in this last series at Bush Stadium,

Starting point is 00:11:06 because he's so good at. home. And of course, you want them against the better teams. I'd rather see him pitching against the division rival than, you know, an interleague game against Cleveland. But I think he is in line to throw against them on the 4th of July, if my math was right. But obviously, things can change between now and then. But there are some really good young arms coming up in the NL Central right now. The Reds have a trio, really. They got Chase Burns, Hunter Green, along with Andrew Abbott, who looks 35, but he's actually 26. The Brewer's got the new guy, Jacob Mizorowski. who's taken the league by storm and, you know,

Starting point is 00:11:41 his first major league appearance against the Cardinals looked awesome. The Brewers also have Peralta. The Pirates got Paul Skeens, Cubs got Imanaga, although he's not exactly young per se, but you know what I'm getting at. What are the Cardinals got? That's the real question.

Starting point is 00:11:57 People want to know who is going to be the ace of this team moving forward because, you know, as we all know, Sunday's Great's contract is going to be up here in a couple years. and he ain't getting any younger. So things are going to end up probably declining at some point. So where do the Cardinals go from there? You did a write-up on this at Redbirdbrance.com. So what are some of the things that you brought up in your article about the future aces of the rotation in St. Louis?

Starting point is 00:12:25 Yeah, I mean, you look at the three young guys, Skeens, Mizorowski, and Chase Burns. And what do they do really well? They strike batters out. That's what it comes down to. And the Cardinals haven't had that in quite some time. So you look at our minor leagues, and the bar that I set was 10Ks per nine innings. Tinkentz, Quinn Matthews, and Toccoa Roeby all break that pretty well as far as their minor league careers go.

Starting point is 00:12:51 Can they continue out in the majors? That's the question that needs to be answered. I don't think that any one of those three is Paul Skeens. In fact, I probably know that not one of those three is Paul Steens. But just to have that strikeout stuff, so we're not getting into this pitch-to-contact. mumbo-jumbo that we've been seeing out of our starting pitchers. I don't think that we will see Paul Skeens, Jacob Mizorowski, or even Chase Burns out of our rotation or our pipeline for the next few years,

Starting point is 00:13:18 but just to have a guy that's close to that. Matthew Libertur has a chance. Sunny Gray might be that right now, but we only have him for another year or two. I just don't think Libertor is the ceiling of those guys in the National League Central or our prospects coming up. Yeah, he doesn't come off as the guy that's going to hit double-digit strikeouts in a game. you know, that's just, that's just not who he is. Like he's going to be a good pitcher and we've seen him look really, really good at times.

Starting point is 00:13:42 But, yeah, the swing and miss thing, you know, that's one of the reasons why the Cardinals are kind of redoing things in the minor leagues because what their philosophy used to be, it wore out. And they just never changed. And, you know, the league passed them by in certain things. And one of those was finding swing and miss. Because you're seeing it out of bullpen guys, too. Like, there's nobody in the bullpen that's coming up. time soon. It's like, you know, rifling through people with a ton of swing and miss, you know, like that's why you're seeing guys like Andre Greenio and Riley O'Brien and these guys that don't have,

Starting point is 00:14:17 they're not top 100 prospects, you know, they're barely top 30 in the cardinal system. And those are the guys that are on the team right now. So it's part of the thing that they're going to be redoing and looking for in like the upcoming drafts. And obviously in future trades, probably, they're going to look for young arms that actually have a little more swing and miss. You mentioned Sikoraubi. This guy's having a hell of a season down there at AA right now. How excited are you about what Takaa Robe brings to the table? Actually, he's in AAA now. I'm sorry. Yeah, he is. He's struggled a little bit in AAA, but the ball is different from double A. It's a talent level is much higher between double A and triple A. Everything I

Starting point is 00:14:58 hear about Tocoa Robi is that he's the guy, like his strikeout, his fastball. Everything's there. He has multiple plus pitches between his fastball. And then what's his best pitch? His curveball is crazy as well. It's got high width rates and everything. From what I've been hearing, it's Tocoa Robia is the next best pitcher on the staff. The question for him is health still. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:15:23 Yeah, that's what you know all of them are dealing with. When you mentioned team Kent's injuries. He's been on the IL a lot. Quinn Matthews went through some stuff earlier this year. And yeah, there's been times that he's looking at. look good, but he's had a lot. You know, there's been a little bit of a bump in the road so far this season. And then Roby until this year, that was the big thing, was the injuries.

Starting point is 00:15:43 It was really cool to be able to see him the spring training for the first time to really get to pay attention to him and like, whoa, you're like, wait a second. We got to throw a 99. Where does this come from? All right. Okay. This is good. So, yeah, he looks like a hoss, like somebody that could do some things for us.

Starting point is 00:16:00 And then, of course, you got more like the old school cardinals philosophy with Michael McGreevy. He's not a big strikeout guy, but, you know, when he's hitting his spots, clearly he's had a lot of success at the major leagues already. Things didn't go quite so well for him against the Cubs, but it was really one bad pitch to Suzuki that made everything look really ugly in that game. Outside of that, it wasn't as bad as I think the final box score tells everybody. But yeah, they're, they'll figure something out. That's why they're changing things up. So looking forward to the future with those guys, Libby, McGreevy, Matthews, Roby, Hens, some, big names to watch for the Cardinals in the future.

Starting point is 00:16:38 Mention the offense of the Cardinals tonight and what they did to score runs, a couple of home runs. And I talked about this a bit on my last episode, the Cardinals and their issues with hitting left-handed pitching. We're going to discuss that more and pick the brain of Govain. Coming up next on Lockedown Cardinals. Thank you for making Lockedown Cardinals. Your first listen today for your second list and check out the all-new lockdown.

Starting point is 00:17:09 It'll be game night, every game, every night all season long, get local analysis on a national scale. You can find MLB game night on Locked on MLB on YouTube or wherever you listen to your podcast. And when we say every night, it is every night. Seven days a week, there are no off days for this. And they'll be back on there here in a little bit. So be sure to check that out.

Starting point is 00:17:29 All right, time to pick the brain of Govain. Here we go. We need to get a T-shirt with just your brain right there and like your glasses and a beard. Your glasses and a beard on it. That would be cool. Oh, yeah, a little toothpick on the top, too, just to really fit with the name. There you go. I like it a lot.

Starting point is 00:17:46 Let's do that. I don't come up with a with a photo or something. Well, we'll put that to me up. Issues against left handers, Thomas. Another lefty came in on Friday night. And guess what? The Cardinals, again, do nothing against him. That's if my math is correct once again, which I never trust, but I'm close, usually.

Starting point is 00:18:04 I think that's almost 24 straight shutout innings against left-handers for the Cardinals. what are you seeing here about these struggles against the left-handers? What's going on with these guys? Just looking at the raw numbers, the Cardinals, before games today, the Cardinals had the most played appearances against left-handed pitchers. So clearly the words out that we can't handle them. As far as hitting goes, they are right about league average against lefties and batting average, and on-base percentage where they fall short is slugging percentage.

Starting point is 00:18:35 Before tonight, where they face a couple of relievers, I believe. They were 21st in slugging percentage in the league against left-handed pitchers. But when you have as many prominent left-handed batters as you do, Brendan Donovan, Alec Berlinson, Nolan Gorman, and you have all those guys in the heart of your lineup, of course you're going to fall short against left-handed pitchers. The problem is now twofold. One injuries, Ivan Herrera has almost an 1150 OPS against lefties.

Starting point is 00:19:04 And then Jordan Walker's out, who is supposed to be your key right-handed batter. Yeah, and a guy that actually hasn't been, at least when I looked at him earlier today, Wilson Contreras doesn't really kill lefties like I thought he did. No, and not neither does Mason win either. Like right-hand hitters, you'd think, especially Contreras with his power, but Mason Wynn doesn't really do it either. Yeah, it's a little shocking to me. I think Aronado's got some pretty decent numbers, but it falls off quick after Evon-Herrera.

Starting point is 00:19:35 Like the dip in production from some of these guys is, it's crazy. Like if you go there and you don't, you take away like the qualified hitters. Like it's Pozo. Luke and Baker is still up there for the card. But it's none of the dudes who are actually on this team, really. And Ivan Herrera is the one regular guy that's around that is still, that has the tremendous number. So losing him again is, you know, this is going to be another month for this guy.

Starting point is 00:20:03 So that's two months of the season that you're going to be out of this dude. Obviously, that's going to be something that the Cardinals need to. to look at and fix. Problem is, because I was getting questions from people like, you know, who's somebody in the minors we can bring up? And I'm like, nobody? There's really not a lot of answers down there. They brought up C.

Starting point is 00:20:24 Who right-handed batter would do okay against him. And he was hitting okay, but was Ofer in the Cubs series. So that didn't work out so well. So hopefully somebody can step up soon. I really, the guy that I want to see do more is Contreras, really, against left-handers. It's shocking to me how low his production's been against them so far this year. One of the moves they made, Thomas, was the Garrett-Hampson and Jose Barrero out. Barrero did not get claimed.

Starting point is 00:20:51 I think he's back in Memphis now. I think that was an official draft action. I think I just saw something about it. Let me see if I can find it really quickly. He was designated for assignment. He cleared waivers and then rejected his assignment. He's now a free agent. There have been word that the Japan team is looking for him.

Starting point is 00:21:08 Oh, okay. So Barrero is gone from the system now. Your thoughts on that move? Like, because it kind of caught me off guard unless there was something behind the scenes where Barrera was like, I, you know, I want to play like because he wasn't ever, hardly at all. So unless he was like that, I don't understand it all that much of what Garrett Hamson brings you over what Barerro is bringing you. But what are your thoughts on it? Yeah, it's a little bit like shuffle on deck chairs in the Titanic for the most. I mean, we're talking about the 26th man on the roster here. it shouldn't affect the team too much, but it is interesting. I think the reason they went for Hampson primarily is he's a true ability to play center field.

Starting point is 00:21:48 He still has the speed. His defense is probably a little bit better out there than Barrera's was, and I have more sound, right-handed fourth outfielder in Hampson. I wrote about him in the offseason way back in January about being a 26th man for the team. His offensive numbers are putured. I wouldn't recommend you look at them for his career. rear. Yeah, but it's his versus.

Starting point is 00:22:10 I mean, he can play literally anywhere except for probably catcher on the field, and he can play it well. So that might be the key. Whereas Berrera was pretty pigeon old, the shortstop in center field. All right. All right. I guess this means, I guess, Hanson can play shortstop, but, you know, I guess is he the backup shortstop now, too?

Starting point is 00:22:27 I guess. Yeah, probably. I know, see. Brandon Crawford. Let's bring Brandon Crawford back. Where is BC? That's basically what you get. A guy just cannot hit at this point in his career.

Starting point is 00:22:37 and you're sticking him on the roster. I just, I don't get it. Like, I would rather have Jose Barrero and his potential, you know, the youth of him and all, and teach him. Like, I don't recall him killing us in the infield or the outfield with his defense. I mean, but I don't know. It just, it just was like, what? We're doing this. What?

Starting point is 00:22:59 Like, I just, I don't know. I didn't like it so much, but, uh, like he said, we're arguing about the 26th man on the roster. be affected in the world as much as it does. I need help. All right. We're a month away from the deadline. Cardinals are three and a half back in the division. Cubs lost to the Astros tonight, half game out of the wild card. If they are in this exact same spot at the deadline in a month, are you buying or selling? And if you're buying, what are you shopping for? Boy, how much freedom do I get? We're not spending any money, Thomas. You cannot spend dollars. I'm holding, honestly. I'm holding. Honestly. I think there's a way you can maneuver the roster to make it better. And that could look like moving Eric Fetty, maybe Miles, Michaelis, if A, someone wants him B, he'll wave is no trade clause.

Starting point is 00:23:48 You might want Michaelis over Fetty at this point when you're looking at. They might. Yeah, they really might. I think moving some of the junk out to make space for a young guy, so then you might get more competitive, I think McGreevy is probably better than both Fettie and Michaelis, and you lean into that youth movement more. I wouldn't do any splashes where you're trading to Co-Robi or Quinn Matthews or JJ.

Starting point is 00:24:12 I wouldn't do any of those trades. Maybe like a 15 to 20 prospect, but that's not going to get you anything serviceable for the major league roster. That'll get you a Garrett Hampson probably. So I think there's a way in which trades can be made where you clear out some of the junk and you make room for the young guys to come up and hopefully pay better, play better than those old guys. Obviously, Michaelis would have to wave is no trade clause or he's not going anywhere. So I don't even know if that's something he's even interested in to do. But Fetty has no say.

Starting point is 00:24:40 So if they can get something for him at this deadline, I think they're going to do it. I don't think they're going to hold back on that one because I think you slide, like you said, McGreevy slides right in and takes over that spot. I think Stephen Matt's is still a guy that people would be interested in as a left hand, either reliever or a back of the rotation starter. And then, of course, there's Helsley, who his value is probably much lower at this point because he's not nearly as, I don't want to say productive. He's just so much more hitable this year.

Starting point is 00:25:11 Yeah, his strikeouts are down. His fastball's getting rocked. Yeah, he hasn't looked the same. Even last year, I know he hit the save record, but his numbers, especially at strikeouts, were down overall. Yeah, when I get those tweets from people, and they're like, man, he just gives up so many hits. I'm like, you remember last year, right?

Starting point is 00:25:28 He had all those saves, but like it wasn't easy all the time. Right. But it was, I feel like it was a little bit easier last year than what we're seeing. him this year like he just he cannot get through an inning clean there's just always some sort of drama a walk a hit there's just something that always tends to happen against them which is uh what you're not looking for when you're looking for a closure to shut things down so right what are some things you're working on here at redder grants dot com in the future buddy uh i had that piece we talked about with the national league central aces i had one about cardinals versus cubs like all time players

Starting point is 00:26:01 at every position. The John Boy Media people talked about that, so I broke it down. And then I had one go out tonight about Gray's masterful outing. Yes, it was awesome. Go read it. Go check out Thomas's work and all the guys over and gals at Redwood Grants.com. And

Starting point is 00:26:19 you'll enjoy it. I promise you that. It's good, clean fun for the whole family and when's it ever a bad time to talk Cardinal baseball? Never. Thanks for making a lot. Talk Cardinals first listen every day. If you haven't already, give us follow on X at Ella Wonder's Cardinals and a JD Sports Radio. Follow Thomas at Thomas Govane as well. You can find us on TikTok and Instagram. We're on YouTube as well. You guys are the best

Starting point is 00:26:40 fans of baseball for a reason. And we will see you next time on Locked-on Cardinals. Thomas, thank you as always for stopping by, brother. Thanks for having me, J-D.

Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - Sonny Gray Spins A MASTERPIECE In Cleveland

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