Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - St. Louis Cardinals and Boston Red Sox COLLIDE Again With Sonny Gray Trade—WIN or MISTAKE?

Episode Date: December 4, 2025

St. Louis Cardinals shake up MLB by sending Sonny Gray and $20 million to the Boston Red Sox for pitching prospects Richard Fitts and Brandon Clarke. Can Gray shore up Boston's rotation and fill the void left by Lucas Giolito, or will his late-career home run issues haunt Fenway Park? JD and Gabby break down the immediate impact, debate whether Boston’s rotation still needs a true No. 2 starter, and analyze Fitt’s potential as a multi-inning weapon if he stays healthy.Chaim Bloom’s leadership in St. Louis sparks conversation—can he replicate his farm-system magic or will his prospect-protective tendencies hinder major league roster upgrades? The hosts spotlight Toronto Blue Jays’ aggressive pursuit of Dylan Cease and Kyle Tucker and question if Boston must counter with high-impact bats like Kyle Schwarber or Pete Alonso. Are the Red Sox just one move away from catching AL East rivals, or is a bold offseason overhaul required?0:00 – Cardinals-Red Sox Sonny Gray Trade7:32 – Red Sox Rotation Needs17:01 – Evaluating Chaim Bloom's Impact27:13 – AL East Offseason Power MovesFollow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms…🎧 https://lockedonpodcasts.com/podcasts/locked-on-st-louis-cardinals/Locked On MLB League-Wide: Every Team, Prospects & More🎧 https://lockedonpodcasts.com/leagues/mlb/Follow on Twitter/X: @JDSPORTSRADIOFollow the show on Twitter/X: @LO_CardinalsSupport Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!GametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONMLB for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime.FanDuelToday's episode is brought to you by FanDuel. The NBA and NFL seasons are here, visit the FanDuel App today and start planning your futures bets now.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN)#ForTheLou #stlcards #mlb #lockedoncardinals #stlouiscardinals Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The Cardinals and the Red Sox shook up Major League Baseball with a blockbuster deal involving Sunny Gray. We're going to break down what this deal means for the future of both franchises on this Locked on Cardinals, Locked on Red Sox crossover. You are a locked on MLB crossover, part of the Locked on podcast network. Your team every day. Hey there, baseball fans. My name is J.D. Hafford. I'm a former national radio sports anchor, born and raised in St. Louis, a lifetime cardinals fan. Joining me today, our girl, Gabby Malginia from Locked on Red Sox.

Welcome into another Locked On crossover, part of the Lockedown Podcast Network. Now the number one sports podcast network. A big thank you to all of our everydayers for continuing to join us on both shows. And for those of you who are new, welcome in. We hope you enjoy the content. Today's episode brought to you by FanDuel. If you want to be right in the middle of the action this season, then you need to visit fanduel.com and place your NFL live bets.

all season long. Gabby, great to see you once again. It's been a bit since we talked. How was your Thanksgiving? And do you cook for major holidays? Are you part of the group that actually has to cook for the family during the holiday season? Are you just somebody like me who just gets to enjoy all the food and eat it all? Yeah, you know, my Thanksgiving was lovely, went down to North Carolina to visit my parents. And the weather was beautiful there. So then I came home to snow and 28 degrees, which I was not thrilled about. But it was really nice. It was nice to spend some time with family.

My mom luckily did all the cooking, which she has always done because she just likes doing it. So I've kind of been spoiled in that. Score for mom doing all the cooking. Here's the key. When they give you an assignment to make something, just suck at it the first time. And then you don't, nobody asked you to do it ever again. And they're like, oh, well, you're clearly terrible at cooking.

So we'll do it all for you. And that's how I've gotten away with it for years. So feel free to feel free to take that nugget and run with it, everybody. All right. Let's talk some baseball, Gabby. Our two teams got together again for a trade, which is almost an annual thing now. We get to get together in Boston, St. Louis, are going to find a way to swap some people.

Tyler O'Neill recently, Stephen Matt's last year. We talked about the Aronato stuff, but now sunny gray. is heading to Boston along with $20 million in exchange for pitchers Richard Fitz and Brandon Clark. When the news broke, you know, obviously this was Thanksgiving week. So people are running around like crazy. You were on the road. When the news broke, what was your immediate reaction from the Boston side of things?

Were you excited or were you kind of like? Yeah, it's funny because my first thought was another trade with the Cardinals. I was like, these teams are getting really comfortable with each other here when it comes to making trades. But yeah, my initial thought was, yeah, this is definitely somebody who is going to help boost the Red Sox rotation, no doubt about it, because pitching is the number one need for the Red Sox and looking at, you know, where they were at the end of 2025. There were definitely question marks when it came to that rotation. So adding a veteran proven starting pitcher is definitely going to help boost this Red Sox rotation. I will say my concern with him is definitely his age. I will

say and also, you know, just the fact that he did get hit a little bit in 2025, but obviously got tons of swings and misses, which is something that the Red Sox and Craig Breslo have made clear that they look for primarily in the types of pitchers that they want. And it feels to me like this is essentially a Lucas Gialito replacement coming in because of the fact that Lucas Gialito is a free agent. And it kind of tells me, you know, we're not really planning on bringing Gialito back. we have a guy who we feel like could take his place and potentially be an even better pitcher than Gialito was in 2025. And that's a tall order because Gialito had a really good season for the Red Sox this past season. So, you know, it definitely was initially met with excitement on my end thinking, wow, Sunny Gray at a solid season in 2025.

This is somebody who we certainly know can help boost this rotation, you know, hopefully to the capacity that. Red Sox fans are hoping that he will. On the flip side of it, there's definitely a little bit of fear that he could come here and end up being Walker Bueller 2.0 because there was a lot of hype surrounding Walker Bueller when the Red Sox signed him because of his postseason performance in 2024. Obviously, things didn't work out with him. So people have this fear that that might happen with Gray. So obviously, you don't, you know, it's hard to really know for sure what kind of pitcher he's going to be.

This is definitely a key piece that they can slot into that middle of the rotation who can hopefully eat some innings and be a guy that provides some, you know, much needed talent there because they kind of have some holes in the rotation still. So it's definitely an optimistic view on my end. Yeah, the one just from our point of view in St. Louis, it was something that we expected a deal for Sunny to get worked out. I thought it was going to be something like the Atlanta Braves, but apparently, you know, he had no issues going back to Boston.

I thought maybe there'd be a little bit of fear going back to the East Coast and going to a major city like Boston after his time with the Yankees. We've seen the quote from Sunny Gray. I didn't really want to go there in the first. Which I love. I'm all over that. Which I'm sure made Boston fans adore him a little bit more. Or he's like, yeah, I didn't want to go there anyway. But I did want to come to Boston because he had to because he cleared his no trade clause

so that it could happen. The last couple of years, Sunny Gray has been really, really good for the Cardinals. The one area that I feel like is, you know, something we didn't expect was the home run ball. He gave up a lot of home runs the last two years. That is the one thing where because when we got him from Minnesota and he was coming off that incredible year where he finished second in the Sight Young Award voting, he didn't give up home runs. Like I think he gave up like eight the previous year. And he's been in the 20s, both years, with the Cardinals, which also play in Bush Stadium, which is a cavernous stadium. Like it's ginormous. So you would have thought the home run titles would have been a little bit lower.

But he tends to give him up like one bad game. He'll give up like two or three. You know, it's kind of they kind of pile on them. It's not usually one here. And then a couple of games without one. And then another one, they usually come in bunches against. So hopefully that's something that he can get worked out. Usually against the fastball, by the way, his sweeper is just naughty, Gabby.

You guys are going to love that. The real question I have for you on your side of things, though, is, is Sunny the right guy to be right behind crochet? Or are you thinking Boston needs to even get somebody better than Sonny to be that number two? And then Sonny can slide down to the number three because the problem in St. Louis that fans had was they wanted him to come in and be the ace. and he really wasn't that guy. He's more of a number two, maybe even a number three for a really talented rotation like Boston might have. Yeah, you know,

I've talked about this pretty extensively on my show too. I definitely think the Red Sox need to do more. I think they needed no doubt 100% number two, a guy that we can look at and say, yep, he's the number two for sure, like a Joe Ryan type. He's the guy I keep going back to because the Red Sox, did talk to the twins about him at the trade deadline.

Obviously, weren't able to work out a deal then. I know they're very much still interested. It just feels like you want that solid one to punch because I keep looking at teams that made deep playoff runs. And I'm like, yeah, they had solid starting pitching. Their number two could be a number one on another team. And that's kind of what I'm getting at here because obviously, Garrett Crochet, no doubt, is the number one.

Brian Bejo is part of this rotation who's strong. a little bit down the stretch in 2025, had a really good season overall, but there's still some question marks with him surrounding the potential that he has. And I do believe that if the Red Sox get another starting pitcher who's a no doubt number two, it would take a lot of pressure off of guys like Sunny Gray and Brian Bejo so they can slot into the number three and number four. And there isn't that expectation of pitching towards that front of the rotation. And especially for a guy like Sonny Gray, who, which you mentioned too, obviously his struggles sometimes in a big market like New York, you want to be able to ease some of that pressure when he's coming back to a market like that.

And obviously he's really excited to be in Boston, but I do believe that if he wasn't expected to step up as that number two guy behind Garrett Crochet, we might see the results that the Red Sox are hoping to get by making this trade. So I do feel like if they go into the season with the rotation as is now, it's still better than it was last year because Sunny Gray is definitely an upgrade. But I believe that in order to maximize what he can give us, we do still need a number two. Understood. Yeah. It makes sense.

I mean, why not get better if you have the capability to do it? So it wouldn't shock me if Boston were to go out and do something else just to add to that. And you mentioned his age too. I mean, he's been very reliable over the last couple of years, but he is 36. So there might be a moment or two where, you know, things, he might get run down a little bit. I know he had some issues with how hot it was in the Midwest in the summer with the sweat and stuff. So, you know, it happens, you know, when you get older, it's not quite as easy to get out there each and every day. But Sunny's a great guy.

I think you guys can enjoy him a lot. Real quick, your assessment on Richard Fitz in his brief time up with Boston on the major league roster. Anything that we should know in St. Louis, things that you like, disliked about. Yeah, you know, he's definitely somebody who has a lot of potential. Unfortunately, we didn't have the biggest sample size from him because injuries are a concern. I would say that's something to keep an eye on when it comes to him. And really with both of these pitchers that St. Louis got in return, they both have a little bit of an injury history. I mean, Brandon Clark obviously is still so young and still so new in his career and is still kind of working his way up.

Definitely lots of raw talent there, though. I mean, he was the Red Sox number five prospect in their system. So he's certainly somebody who the Cardinals can develop within their system. But when it comes to fits, there were a lot of aspects of fits that I really liked. Really, really strong commanding fastball. That's super hard to hit. I will say he can sometimes have command issues when it comes to the walks and not being super consistent in that regard.

but is a really, really good ground ball pitcher. So he's going to generate lots of weak contact, which is something that I really enjoyed about him. I will say when it comes to him, he's somebody who, if he's healthy, could definitely be a starter every fifth day for the Cardinals. He's certainly somebody who I do believe that if he was able to stay healthy and the Red Sox didn't have the depth that they have,

he's certainly somebody that I could have seen being a piece in that rotation. Now, the other good news with him too, though, is that the Red Sox did have him pitch out of the pen. So he kind of got a good mix of doing both being a starter and being a reliever because there was a period of time where the Red Sox just had enough starters and there wasn't really a spot for him. So they had him throw in relief. So he would be a good multi-inning relief guy as well if that's the route that, you know, you guys choose to use him in. But there's definitely a lot of potential there. Again, like I said the injuries are definitely a bit of a concern with him. But if he is healthy and during the time

when he was healthy, he really stepped up originally got his call up during the 2024 season towards the end of that season and made a few really strong starts for the Red Sox, like unhittable type of starts. Then in 2025, we started to see him struggle a little bit. And that was because I think the injury bug was starting to catch up to him. So I would say health is the biggest thing. If he's healthy, they will be able to maximize his potential. And for a team like the Cardinals, if they're looking for a young pitching, that they can continue to work with guys who have a lot of the tools to be able to succeed,

he's definitely somebody I will say that you guys will be happy with. All right, good. Good to hear that you would have felt comfortable with him as a back of the rotation guy this year for football. Boston, if the steel had gone down. So that's good to hear. The Cardinals are in cell mode at the moment with Boston's former head honcho, Heim Bloom at the helm now. Does Gabby trust Bloom to be the man in St. Louis after what she saw him do in Boston?

We'll have that answer coming up for you next on this locked on Cardinals, locked on Red Sox crossover. The World Cup is coming back to North America for the first time since 1994. It's like a million years ago. And with 48 teams for the first time ever, it's going to be massive, you guys. So let's be honest, getting tickets to these type of events, usually the hardest part about it all. That's why game time, the app, it is so clutch. It finally gives fans a real advantage when it comes to snagging your seats.

With game time, you can track price drops in real time, get alerts when great seats open up. And you can buy the tickets the moment they hit the app. It just puts the power right back in your hands where it belongs and makes going to the World Cup realistic instead of impossible. You just pull up the app, lay out is super simple, easy to scroll through the matchups, compare seat views. You pick a game, you tap a section, and you get your tickets locked in within minutes. There's no confusion. There's no hunting for fine print. You get alerts from teams and matches that you're interested in to make it easy to go grab the tickets the moment they drop instead of missing out. So take the guesswork out of buying World Cup tickets and every match,

concert or event with game time. Download the game time app, create an account, use code locked on MLB for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Again, download the app, make an account, code locked on MLB for $20 off. Swipe, tap, ticket, go game time. Thanks for making Locked on Cardinals and locked on Red Sox your first listen every day. Thank you for making locked on the number one sports podcast network. Now, if you enjoy daily Cardinals and Red Sox content, make sure you give myself and Gabby a follow, follow our podcast. We're on X, YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, everywhere. We're everywhere. It's not very difficult to find us. Talking about what's going on with each team after the sunny gray trade. Cardinals clearly in cell mode.

You got a guy by the name of Hime Bloom, who is leading the charge as the new president of baseball operations. Gabby, you are quite familiar with this man. My first initial reaction to everything we've seen with Hime so far since he's become the guy. He's kind of been in the shadows the last couple of years with St. Louis. So he'd pop up from time to time. But now that he's finally the voice of everything and the guy that we're looking to for answers and moving forward. I've been very impressed with the type of guy he is.

He seems to be doing everything differently than what the guy we used to have and John Moseilock was where he was very kind of cautious about things he would say and what he was giving away. It seemed like he was always hiding something. He was very sneaky. That was just kind of his way. Heim doesn't appear to be that way. Heim seems to be very open, very transparent.

He wants to be honest with everything that's going on. He's not blowing smoke up our tailpipes about, oh, we could be going to do that. No, he's not saying that at all. Like, there's a direction here. It's long term, not short term, and he's told us exactly what we should expect. The question is, can we trust him to get this job done?

Is he the right guy for rebuilding not only the farm system, which we know he's been very good at over his career, but also rebuilding that major league roster and making deals because that was kind of the problem that we've heard about that he had in Boston was that when it came to the GM job and handling things up there, that's where there were some question marks. What do you think, Gabby? Do the Cardinals make the right move by hiring Heim Bloom or do you think it's going to blow up in our face? Yeah, you know, he's the type of guy who will do a really good job when it comes to identifying

young talent that can be in your system that can work their way up to being on the major league roster and can hopefully be reliable for you down the road. And that was something I really appreciated about him that he did in Boston was the Red Sox farm system was not in a good place when he arrived. It just wasn't. I mean, they had Dave Dombrowski who, I mean, it won them the World Series in 2018, but basically blew up the farm system to build that team. And then the Red Sox were in this place where they were like, right, we need to rebuild. Like we need to get some young talent in our system so that we can eventually work our way towards rebuilding the major league team. So they brought in bloom.

And one of the biggest things that I really like about him is that ability to really evaluate and understand this could be a special player. And a lot of the top prospects that the Red Sox have now, we have him to thank for them. And trades that the Red Sox have been able to make, we can thank him for, you know, giving us those assets and those talented young players in the system to be able to make those types of trade. I mean, when you look at guys like Garrett Crochet, that's almost, it's like a two-person effort of like, we're seeing some of Heim Bloom and what he did. And we're seeing also the results of what Craig Breslo is currently doing.

So for a team that's in rebuild mode, I would say Heim Bloom is a very good fit for that type of team because he is going to be able to get you the prospects in the farm system that are needed, not only to develop to eventually be the future of the team, but also ones that you can use in future trades down the road to help with the major league roster. Now, that being said, I trust him a lot more in that type of circumstance than I trust him with a team that is in win now mode. And the issue primarily is because he didn't ever really show that he was committed to going all in on trades that could help the major league team because he was a little too prospect protective. And with the Boston Red Sox, we know this fan base. We know the expectation is we need to win the

World Series every year. And that's just how things go in Boston. It's that winning mentality of, you know, we need to build championship teams. And people's patience was wearing thin because the front office didn't seem like they wanted to be competitive at that time. So when it came down to it at the end of the day, he wasn't always willing to pull the trigger and make the type of trade that like Breslo did for a guy like Garrett Crochet. Like, I mean, those prospects that he gave up for Crochet, Bloom never would have done that. He never would have given up that much of a haul, especially not a guy like Kyle Teal who he saw as one of their best prospects and somebody who eventually he hoped would contribute to the

major league team. So I just don't necessarily see that trade having happened if he was still here. So when a team is in rebuild mode, I think he's the guy who can really help when it comes to identifying that talent that they can use as leverage later on or can hopefully be guys they develop in their system, which is the case for some of the Red Sox current players, the young players on their roster now are thanks to him. But if you're looking to really improve the major league team and make it feel like a contending team, that's where I hesitate to feel like he can get the job done. Hopefully he's learned a thing or two from that time in Boston where maybe he won't be,

you know, a little trigger shy, if you will. I don't even know that's a phrase. I don't know if I just made that up. But yeah, because eventually you can't just rest on all prospects. Like eventually you use those farm system pieces to go get the bigger pieces that you haven't produced yourself. So eventually you got to let go of those kids and be like, all right, go play for another team because we need this guy because this guy will make the massive difference like Air Crochet did for Boston last year. So hopefully that's something that he's learned from. And we're a couple of years away from him having to make any sort of moves like that.

But, you know, to see him trade off the sunny gray to see over. ownership willing to throw in $20 million to get that move to happen. Does it make you nervous that he took Brandon Clark so so easily from you guys? Are you like, uh-oh? What does he know? Because that wasn't even one of his dudes. Like that was somebody who came to your system after the fact. Yeah, you know, that was an interesting move.

I was a little bit surprised initially because this trade when it first came out, you know, there was more that came out later. Like the Red Sox receiving $20 million in that trade wasn't known until a little. after the trade actually was broken. And I was surprised that they gave up Brandon Clark truly because he was one of their best pitching prospects. However, it really goes to show that the Red Sox front office believes in the pitching depth that they have right now.

And this is the first time in a while that they've been able to feel like they truly are in a good place with their pitching depth in the system because that hasn't always been the case. And a lot of that has to do with development, pitching development and the fact that the last couple years. They've really focused on getting the right people in place in their organization from a coaching standpoint to help with the development of these pitchers. And, you know, Craig Bresla was talking after the fact and said there are a lot of positive aspects of Brandon Clark. But we are really confident in the guys that we have here and the depth that we have in our

system. And eventually you have to trade from depth to get guys if you want to win now. And this was certainly a win now move for the Red Sox. And yes, I am. I am surprised by that, but it does go to show that there's something that Bloom sees in Brandon Clark that can really help him blossom because he would not ask for him in particular if there wasn't something about him that he saw. And that, again, is something he's really good at is if he trades for a prospect like that, you can feel confident that that player could turn into something special because he does have an eye for that when they're earlier on in their career.

So I am interested in seeing how his career evolves for sure. but I was definitely surprised that they gave him up. But then, you know, the Cardinals giving as much money back as they did, I think is a little bit of an underrated aspect to this trade that Red Sox fans aren't really talking about is that's huge in all of this, too, is, you know, that they were willing to send that much money back. And I do ultimately think that was probably the piece of it that led the Red Sox to say, okay, yeah, sure, we'll give you. Yeah, yeah, totally. And it was nice that it worked out because this is one of those trades. It seems like both sides got what they wanted. you got a guy in Sunny Gray that you can trust for at least one year. And if things go well, then sure.

Maybe you guys work something out and he sticks around. If not, you guys have restructured the contract and stuff where we can move our separate ways. It's okay. It's not the end of the world. And it's not costing you, you know, the $40 million that the Cardos were going to have to pay him this year. You know, them to take a big chunk out of that has to make people happy as well,

especially the owners who are like, yeah, that's pretty cool. You know, to get somebody like Sunny Green. and only have to pay $20 million for this year. That's pretty good bargain, considering how expensive things are for starting pitching these days. Free agency is going to be picking up here real, real soon. There's already been a few moves,

one in particular that I want to get Gabby's thoughts on. Could a former Red Sox make his way back to Fenway after mashing 56 Dinger this past season? We'll talk about it next on this Locked on Cardinals, locked on Red Sox crossover. NFL Sundays move fast. one big play and suddenly everything feels different. And that's why Fandle makes live betting so much fun to be a part of. Like it's so exciting, you guys. If you haven't done it yet, you're not just

watching the game anymore going, yay, good play. No, you're reacting to everything in real time with excitement and energy. With Fandall, you can place bets as the action unfolds, every drive, every momentum swing, every highlight moment. It's going to impact what's going on with you. The new week is here. It's Thursday. So you got a huge matchup tonight. Cowboys and Lions, stars galore. all over the field tonight, Gibbs, Pickens, Lamb, Prescott, golf. I'm on Ross St. Brown. I don't think he's playing. So that means Jameson Williams, who just went off against my Packers last week.

He's going to be a big deal tonight. So live betting is best when the game starts to shift and it's going to shift a lot tonight. I would imagine it's going to be a shootout. Receivers are going to get hot. The defense is going to be running all over the play. Should be a lot of fun. Live spreads, money lines, those adjust instantly. Player props updates as guys begin to heat up.

cool off, by the way. So if you want to be in the middle of the action, which is where we all want to be, right, visit fandle.com. Place your NFL live vets all season long, Fandul. The game moves fast, and so can you. Thank you again for making Locked on Cardinals and Locked on Red Sox your first listen every day for your second listen. You can find the Locked on MLB podcast where there is no offseason. Sully will keep you update on the contract negotiations, the rumors and everything you need to be the most informed MLB fan. You can find Lockt on MLB on YouTube or wherever you'll be. listen to your podcast, part of the lockdown podcast network, your team every day. Free agency is often running Gabby.

The Blue Jays, Gabby, uh, oh, Blue Jays, Gabby, uh, paid the King's ransom for Dylan cease. Not sure how you feel about the price tag that that cost. I was a little shocked by it, but, you know, price of business these days. Now the rumor is that Kyle Tucker's touring Toronto's facilities. How do you feel about these moves with, uh, you know, Toronto, know in your division along with the Yankees. Boston, you guys got a lot going on in the AL East. Yeah, you know, definitely scared about the Blue Jays. I mean, obviously after going to the World Series last year and then added a pitcher who will be a massive boost to that rotation.

I truly think it's an overpay, but what even is an overpay these days in this market? This is just how things go with these pitchers. I mean, honestly, good for them for really going after it and saying, you know, like, we just took the defending champs to a game seven of the World Series, although we fell short, like, let's make sure that doesn't happen again. So good for them for doing that. And I honestly hope that this is a wake-up call for the Red Sox of if we want to compete with the Blue Jays, we have to do more. Because if you look at where those two rosters are at right now, the Red Sox still have

holes that they need to address this off season. And I do feel like the Red Sox, and I said this the other day on my show, need to go and counter that Dillon C's move by going and truly getting their true number two. Garrett Crochet has been everything. The Red Sox have poked forward more for sure. Get him that number two behind him. And that would really feel like, okay, we saw that you got Dillin C's. Here's what we can do because we're serious about competing with you in 2026.

And the Red Sox also need baths. I mean, this Kyle Tucker situation scares me because that would be another huge addition to a Blue Jays team that's already stack talent-wise. And the Red Sox need to, again, you know, do something about that. Say this all ends with Kyle Tucker going to Toronto. The Red Sox, it feels almost mandatory for the Red Sox to get somebody like a Kyle Schwerber or Pete Alonzo to bring to Boston because it makes far too much sense right now. They don't have really enough home run power in their lineup right now.

They need to bring in somebody who they can rely on to hit home runs. and that was an area that hurt the Red Sox offense in 2025 was they just weren't hitting home runs as much as everybody else. And while they have a lot of athleticism in this lineup that they definitely used to their advantage and they were playing a lot of small ball to score runs, they just didn't have anybody who was consistently able to hit home runs a lot. And if you add a Kyle Schwab or type,

somebody who's already familiar with playing in Boston, that could be a great fit for this Red Sox team. And it would be a huge boost to that middle. middle of the order that could make you feel more like, okay, maybe we can compete with Toronto as long as we're healthy because we need to get those big names. That's the thing that the Red Sox all the way up really until last off season were lacking in was they weren't getting those big, no doubt proven names. And that is something that they need to do this off season. Bringing Alex Breggman back feels like such a big necessity, but it needs to be more than that. It's almost like they have to bring back Breggman and get somebody else. also to add to the lineup in order for me to really feel confident in their ability because if they go, I mean, this hopefully isn't going to happen, but if they went into spring training with the roster they have right now, it's not going to put them at Toronto's level.

Like they need to still do more. And Toronto, again, is continuing to add and doesn't look like they have any desire to slow down because they lost against a Dodgers team. That obviously is just, you know, this force of nature. that nobody else is right now. So them trying to get to that. If the Red Sox want to keep up, they have to do more than what Toronto is doing this off-season.

And it really scares me. And the Yankees, again, are always there. They're always lurking, right? And, you know, they just, you know, they're probably going to make some moves this off-season two. So I'm definitely very concerned about this division right now. But at the same time, I know that all of the pieces, are there for the Red Sox.

It's just you need to get those one or two more pieces to complete that puzzle and put you in that type of position to where you can compete within your own division. Because they're not that far behind. It really felt like in 2025, they were just like a step behind where the Yankees and the Blue Jays were at. Like they, you know, they ended up losing a few more games than each of those teams did. and it felt like, okay, if we had like two more solid pieces, then we probably would be at the level they're at.

So yeah, hopefully these moves are signaling to the Red Sox. You know, we've got to stay awake and we can't just continue to miss out on people because it seemed like it was this pattern of them missing out on big free agents and then saying they tried, but the players decided to go elsewhere. But this really feels like a Swarber or Alonzo type of player is a necessity for this team this offseason. Does it make you second guess the Devers dealer? Are you cool with that now considering kind of the drama that was going on just, you know, trying to move them around the diamond and stuff like because you say,

hey, you know, we were like a bat short while you traded one of them to San Francisco and hitting 35 bombs for the Giants. That was kind of a big piece. Like, do you second guess that deal now or have you moved on? Yeah, I've definitely moved on now at the trade. deadline, I was definitely like, well, if we had Devers, this wouldn't be an issue because they didn't replace Devers as bat at the deadline. And that was the biggest issue that I had then was, well, you said you wanted to compete for a World Series this year. So why did you trade away Devers

and then not do anything at the trade deadline to really boost this team and give you that extra push? I know Breslo said he was hesitant to ruin the chemistry that this Red Sox team had because they were playing really good baseball leading up to the trade deadline. But now that it's the off season, now you can trade people so you can either trade for somebody or, you know, man up the money and sign one of these free agents and, you know, really feel like you're, you're completing this roster. Because if the Red Sox do go out and they acquire one of those big bats this off season, then it will feel like, okay, at least they replaced Devers's bat in the lineup.

So it can be a little bit more justified of, okay, maybe they thought in the long term Devers wasn't going to work with this group of players. and maybe they didn't think he was a good role model for the younger players or whatever it may be, but they have to replace that talent level because if they fail to do that again this offseason, then it's really going to come back to haunt us of, oh, you know, if only we had somebody in the lineup who could hit home runs, we did last year. So this really is when they have to make up for it. I don't feel like it's a Devers or bust situation.

Like I feel like they can certainly replace what they're missing endeavors easily. They just have to actually go out and do it, is what the end. So is Schwerber like your top guy that you guys think you'll be chasing or is there somebody else out there that you're eyeing up? You mentioned Alonzo. Is there, is he another one? Yeah, Alonzo is an interesting piece because the Red Sox first base situation is a little bit uncertain right now too.

They have a guy in Tristan Kossis who missed basically the whole season with an injury in 2025. So he's going to be coming back, hopefully is the plan at spring training. And, you know, he'll be in the mix. But it's hard for the Red Sox right now to feel really confident in him truly being a reliable every day first baseman. So if they could bring in a guy like Pete Alonzo, who for one will provide power at the plate, which is something that they need. And for two, could kind of platoon between playing first base and D-Hing for the Red Sox. Like, that could be a good combination.

So I'm definitely very intrigued by him. I just don't know that the Red Sox would be willing to offer him. the type of longer term deal that he might be looking for right now if they don't feel like that's something that makes sense in the long term. So I could see them potentially not doing that. But the way that he would help this Red Sox team now is undeniable. Like that's a piece that you would want if you're the boss of house. How sexy would that be if Bregman returns goes over to third?

You get Schwerber and Alonzo and just throw up the middle fingers to Toronto go, your move dorks there you go that would be fantastic that would be a monster combo right there in the middle of your order with you know anthony and now here's the other question real quick uh jaron duran would he be around for something like this or do you think because you know they're talking about uh how much you know there's a lot outfielders in boston right now that are pretty darned uh satan raphael being one of them if he's going to stay in the outfit but there's a lot of going on there Would you be happy with them moving on from Duran if they were able to make the moves to go get, you know, a Schwerber and a line zone bring them in instead? Absolutely. Yeah. I do think there's no doubt about the fact that one of those outfielders is probably going to be traded this off season.

Duran is my guess. That's been my thought this whole time. I just think with the way that their outfield is aligned right now, he feels kind of like the odd man out a little bit because they have a guy who just want to go with glove and right field, the guy who just one of gold glove and center field and they're obviously not going to trade Roman Anthony. So where does that leave Darren Duran? So it feels like he's the odd man out. There's a lot of upside to his game that could be intriguing to another team. He's just such a versatile player that you don't really get in a lot of players. And he definitely is somebody who could be the centerpiece of a trade either for, you know, probably a pitcher because I would be happy if they traded him to get that number two

starting pitcher that they need. And this isn't any disrespect to Duran. It's just more because they have an overflow of outfielders right now. And I just feel like it would be a better use of their assets to move on from him to address another area of the roster. So if they were to trade him, get a number two starting pitcher and also bring in like Schwerber and Alonzo. Then that to me is a team I can get behind of, wow, this could be a serious contender if they're healthy. But again, they have to actually go and do it. And they have a lot of money to spend after relieving themselves of all that Devers money.

so we'll see how they spend that now. I mean, it must be fun where it's just where Boston is right now. The Cardinals are like, I remember these days when we used to be able to think about, okay, we did this, this and this. Now we're like, hey, is Dustin May any good? Can we have him? Can we sign him? Maybe not.

I don't know. Yeah, we're in a weird spot right now. Like two of your guys from last year, Dustin May and Walker Bueller are guys that the Cardinals are like, well, you know, we're going to be risky with somebody who's injured. Who do we take a risk on? I assume your answer would be if you had to choose one of the two, probably may, because Mueller really did not have a good time in Boston, although he looked better with Philadelphia.

But I don't know, another time for that conversation. But we got to wrap things up. So sounds like Boston's got a lot on their plate. If Tucker goes, I'll tell you this. If Tucker goes to Toronto, I would rather have the other Kyle in Schwerber than I would, Tucker. I don't get it. I don't know why everybody is obsessed with Kyle Tucker.

I still haven't seen it. The one really good year, but other than that, I just, he doesn't do it for me. He's just, he's just not my vibe, Gabby. So if he goes to Toronto, I answer with something else.

I'd be like, yeah, I'm not paying him what he's going to get this year. But we appreciate all of you guys for joining us. Thanks for making Locked on Cardinals, Locked on Red Sox, your first listen every day if you haven't already. Give myself and Gabby a follow on X. You can find us on TikTok, Instagram,

of course, on YouTube as well. Make sure you jump onto our channels. Like, subscribe if you haven't already. Gabby, we'll catch up again soon. Winter meetings are coming up here in just a couple of days. I'm sure there'll be some fireworks and maybe our teams will get together again on another deal. You just never know.

It seems to be something they're quite comfortable with. But thanks for hopping on here and hanging out with me. Yeah, thank you. This was awesome. You know, I'm sure, like you said, there's always a possibility that we hear about another Cardinals Red Sox trade. So we'll see if we're doing this again next week. We'll have to.

Time will tell. All right. Sounds good.