Locked On Cardinals - Daily Podcast On The St. Louis Cardinals - The Miles Mikolas Dilemma

Episode Date: October 25, 2024

Thomas Gauvain from RedbirdRants.com joins us today to talk Cardinal baseball - Miles Mikolas - Recent Hires - Arizona Fall League - Who Ya Trading - World Series Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms… 🎧 https://link.chtbl.com/LOSTLCardinals?sid=YouTube Locked On MLB League-Wide: Every Team, Prospects & More 🎧 https://linktr.ee/LockedOnMLB Follow on Twitter/X: @JDSPORTSRADIO Follow the show on Twitter/X: @LO_Cardinals Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! PrizePicks Download the app today and use code LOCKEDONMLB to win $50 instantly when you play your first $5 lineup. PrizePicks. Run Your Game. Click Here: https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/LOCKEDONMLB Gametime Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONMLB for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Download Gametime today. What time is it? Gametime. FanDuel You can start the season with a big return on FanDuel. Place your first FIVE DOLLAR bet and you’ll get started with TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS in BONUS BETS - guaranteed ! Visit FANDUEL.COM to get started. FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) #ForTheLou #stlcards #mlb #lockedoncardinals Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

One of the weakest links in the rotation, the last couple of seasons, has been a former two-time All-Star. What should we do with Miles Michaelis? A question we will try to answer today on Locked-on Cardinals. You are Locked-on Cardinals. Your daily St. Louis Cardinals podcast, part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hey, the Cardinals fans. I'm J.D. Hafford and I'm a national radio sports anchor, born and raised in the Lou and a lifetime Cardinals fan. And I'm your host for Lockdown Cardinals, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network covering your team every day. You can follow me on Twitter, X at JD Sports Radio and the podcast at L0 underscore Cardinals. We want to thank those of you who make Lockdown Cardinals your first listen every day.

We're free and available wherever you get your podcast. You can also find us on YouTube. This is a show serving Cardle Nation and giving the best fans in baseball, all of the info about the birds on the bat. Today's episode is brought to you by prize picks. Download the app today and use the code locked on MLB to win $50 instantly when you play your first $5 lineup. Price picks, run your game. So joining us today to talk some ball. We've got the great Thomas Govane from Redbird Ranson.com in the house. Thomas, long time to see, man. How you've been,

dude? I've been good. Those are such kind words coming from you. The great. I love it. Thank you. It just fits your last name. I feel like if you were a magician, Govain the Great would just kind of flow really nicely. So maybe maybe that's something for the kids. You can use that in the future for them. if they go down the magic trail one day. If Redbird writing doesn't go my way, maybe magician could be my fallback career. How are you with capes? Can you move one and all?

How are you with wands? Do you get it with those? Everybody's got one of those. Well, anyhow, let's talk some baseball. The Cardinals have done quite a bit so far this off-season, and we're just scratching the surface, right? You know, things don't really get moving for Major League Baseball's off-season.

and until after the World Series, which is going to begin tonight in Los Angeles. But, you know, they made some important moves by, you know, hiring Brant Brown and getting the new assistant general manager and Rob Serfolio. But I want to start with a guy on the roster that, you know, I feel like I've been really, really tough on it because I like Miles Michaelis as a dude. Like, I think he's very entertaining. He's just different. but he's a guy that, you know, obviously he's there with the ball each and every fifth day.

He's giving you all he's got. I just don't know if what he's got is all that good anymore. And judging by the numbers from the last couple of seasons, he hasn't been. He's been one of the most hitable pitchers in baseball. Like you constantly look up most hits, batting average against, like just about any category that's bad for a starting pitcher. he's right up there either one, two, he's usually in the top five no matter what. And what do we do about this, Thomas?

Because you recently wrote on Redwood Ranch.com, you kind of discuss what's going on with Miles Michaelis and what the Cardinals may or may not do with him in the future. We know he's not cheap. We know he's still under contract. What do you think they're going to do about Miles Michaelis in 2025? For some reason, the DeWitt family has always been, they've held on to their guys that they've signed for a long time. In reality, I don't know if you've ever read Keith Law's book.

I can't remember what it was, but he wrote about 2018, and one of the categories he talked about was sunk costs. And that's pretty much what Miles and Michael is at this point. He's not providing much value to us as a pitcher. His ERA was five and a half, I think, last year in 170 innings. That's not a guy you need on the staff, especially when you're trying to lean young, like what the Cardinals are doing. So when I wrote this, I took a look at two previous trades

that the Cardinals have done in the last decade or so with expensive players. They signed to long-term deals that just didn't pan out for the first three years or so. The first was Mike Leak in 2017. They traded him. He had three and a half years of control left at that point. So that's pretty hefty out of a five-year deal. They sent him to Seattle, and then they also sent $17 million to help offset his cost for that time. The Cardinals got, who was the problem?

Raider, Ascanyo. And if you don't know his name, it's just rolls right off the tongue. Yeah, right. You know, All-Star Raider. The reason they traded Mike Leak is Jack Flaherty was coming up at that point. So they had a guy to backfill behind Leak. And then in 2020, 2021, that offseason, they traded Dexter Fowler in his last year to the Angels. He had $14.5 million left that year.

We sent $12.75 million. And then we got, I think, I don't think we got like a player. be named later. That might have been who we drafted. Luke and Baker might have been that draft pick. I don't remember. Anyway, we got a player to be named later and we sent them a whole bunch of money and a wash-up dexter Fowler to make space for Dylan Carlson. So I think the same pattern could be used this year. Michael says 18 and a half as his luxury tax salary for next year. It's crazy, right? That guy is getting 18 and a half. Yeah. So I think if there's probably a a dollar value where teams would be very interested.

I think it starts around $14 million that we've got to send with him, and it goes from there. The kicker is who fills in from Michael is behind. Andre Pawante and Michael McGreevy would be the two obvious answers. I think it depends on who has kept for Kyle Gibson and Lance Lynn, possibly Quinn Matthews, although that feels a little bit too rash for my liking to send him all the way up to the majors next year. It'd be exciting, but I don't know if it'd be best for his development. Yeah, Quinn Matthews, obviously, you know, he wins the minor league pitcher of the year and is this top prospect. And I don't know, there's part of me with the Quinn Matthew stuff, which I know his numbers weren't as great when he got to Memphis.

But I also was like, well, this is kind of like the end of the season. And he's never pitched this much ever in a year. So, I mean, wearing down by the time he got to AAA, probably not the greatest thing. Like, I would love to see how he starts off the first couple of months. But we're not talking about a guy who's, you know, a high school kid. who's in his first year and he's like 19, 20 years old. We're talking about a, he's a man. I mean, this is a guy that they've played in college.

And, you know, he's, he's going to be pushing towards his mid-20s already. So I know that we're used to being patient because you don't want to force anything. You want to make sure he develops well and whatnot. But at the same time, like, isn't that what our pitching coaches and stuff are supposed to be able to do at the major league level? Like help these guys develop and get better. I mean, we saw Michael McGree. He pitched very, very well when he got up to the big leagues, which was something that he didn't do all that much at Memphis before he got called up.

And people are like, you know, we're kind of giving me flack about this. And I was like, dude, tell me coming into 2024 where Michael McGreevy was on your radar as a prospect. He really wasn't all that big of a deal. Like it was almost kind of like when I was talking to people, they were like, we don't know if this kid's going to work out. Like it might be a busted first round pick. And then something worked.

And I'm sure you know the stats and what he started doing that that made things a whole lot better for him. But like all of a sudden, he turned things around and it kind of coincided with that start with the Cardinals. Like, you know, things were better at Triple-A. But after that, he really took off and was outstanding. And obviously we saw what he did, did it as his next couple of appearances at the big league level. And now all of a sudden we're talking about a guy who's going to be a four or five in your rotation next year, as opposed to somebody who may not make the roster. or the 40-man roster anymore.

So I just, I get being patient with Quinn Matthews, but at the same time, like, if he's doing what he did at double A, and he's doing it at AAA, it doesn't make any sense to keep him down there anymore. I might as well, like, use his talents at the major league level. And maybe that'll offset the ability to trade somebody like Stephen Math or a Miles Michaelist, that would be great. In my office, I just don't know how much they're going to have to eat to get him out of here. It doesn't make any sense to have him out there every fifth day.

And what the funny part was, dude, I didn't realize this until I was going through stats. Do you know that he led the club and quality start class? Miles Michaels led the club. I would love to see what his run support was then because he was not saving many runs. No, that was the hilarious part about it. I was like, you've got to be kidding. No way. That's crazy.

Did he lead this team in quality? But he did. I guess Sonny Gray was hurt for about three or four starts, right? He lost him down there, Lance Lynn. And I wonder, and it's kind of the part that's kind of maddening about Michaelis to me is because when he's, you'll see him and he'll have like a two or three game, great game stretch. And you're like, there he is. You know, he's because he's got to live on the corners, right? He can't live over even remotely to the heart of the plate, or he gets shell.

It's not like they score like, oh, he gave a four runs. No, it's either like he gives up two over six innings or he gives up eight in three. Like there's like no in between. No, they'll still throw him up for six innings, though. If he's just going to eat him. Well, we need you to keep going, dude, because you got their rubber arm. And it's tough because there's like part of me like two years ago. I was like, why is everybody so down on Miles Michaels?

And now I'm that guy that's like, dude, it's time to move on. and I just, I don't know. If there's a guy like Quinn who's ready to roll, then I don't see why not. Or even like a Gordon Grecefo. If there's somebody like, I don't know if they're going to make him a starter. Get him another shot probably.

Yeah, I don't know if he's starting or relieving. I don't know what they're doing with Zach Thompson. Like where does he fit into the fold of anything? He's another first round pick. But there are some guys that I feel like most fans would rather see pitching every fifth day. Then Miles Michaelis, especially for the price that, you know,

you're paying Miles in the long. on. So, um, all right. So we really don't know what they're going to do with Miles. I'm on board with trading him if you can. I'm guessing that's where you're at too. Yeah. Please. Yes, please get him out. Yeah, please. What about what's your thoughts on Matt's real quick? Uh, do you want to keep him around? Cause, uh, you know, talking with Jeff Jones the other day, like, you know, he's right where he, he might be easier to trade because he can give you, uh, minorly or like a bullpen. He could be out there or he could be a starter. But at the same time, I'm like the Cardinals could use a guy like that as do we really want to push Matt's out the door when he's making 11 million.

I know it's expensive because he's always hurt. So maybe you want to dump him because you're afraid he's going to get hurt again, which makes a whole lot of sense. But where are you with Matt's? I'd rather keep him. I think he provides more value to us than what he could get in a return in a trade. Whereas with Miles Michaels, he's giving us no value on the team. Mays will ship him off, save some money.

Matt's, like you said, could be that swing man guy that we need bullpen starter, some sort of flux there. If we don't sign Gibson or Lynn, and if we trade Michaelis, he will have to be a starter probably for us, too. So it's a little bit of assurance with him. But I don't think he's an untradable person. 11 million isn't too much for a guy of his role. So I think he still has some value in the market. And it's his last year, right?

Like his contracts up. I hope. I think so. Yeah. I think this is the fourth year for him. So that would be the end of that. But yeah, it's, you know, and it's a shame, too, because we like Matt's. And when he's been out there, after he kind of figures things out,

like he usually pretty decent. It's not like he's been terrible when he gets out on the mound outside of a few starts over the last few years. But, you know, I just can't keep him out there. He's just constantly hurt. So I feel the same way. I feel like going into spring training, like I feel like I kind of want them around a little bit just in case, you know, that, you know, and if things do you work out in the rotation,

put them in the bullpen. I mean, there's nobody saying you can't do that. So, all right. I want to get to some of these off. the field hires because I want to get your opinion on new hitting coach, Bram Brown, and new assistant GM, Rob Serfolio. So we'll have more with Thomas Govain coming up next on on lockdown cardinals. Price Fix is the best place to get real money sports action with over 10 million members and billions of dollars in awarded winnings. Prize Picks has made Daily Fantasy Sports

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Price picks, run your game. Thanks for making Locktown Cardinals your first list. Every day, you can leave your comments on YouTube as well as on Twitter X. Anytime you want that feedback, always welcome and encourage Thomas Govane from Redbirdrance.com joining us today. You can follow him on TwitterX as well at Thomas Govane. the off season as far as filling out roles within the organization picked up some steam earlier in the week. Bram Brown is going to be your new hitting coach for the St. Louis Cardinals. And then you've got Rob Serfolio coming in from the Guardians and John Jay.

But I don't think anybody has really any questions about John Jay. Everybody loves them. Part of the family already. So I'm not really worried about that move whatsoever. He's just going to kind of take over for Willie McGee. But the Bram Brown hire. I want your thoughts on this. Is this a smart hire in your eyes?

Or are you a bit skeptical like I am considering what just happened to him in Seattle? I don't want to say what happened in Seattle is exactly what Bram Brown is. But at the same time, it's what we have to go on. You know, you got that. You got his year with the Marlins. And I go look at the Marlins stats. And I'm kind of like, I don't see anything that's all that great about what they ended up doing. Granted, the talent in Miami, probably not as good, at least in our opinion, what the Cardinals are offering.

But what are your thoughts on Bram Brown? Good or bad? Probably bad. But the more I've read about him these last few days, he's got support from Skip Schumacher, which goes a long way, in my opinion, too. Seattle, I don't know if that was necessarily fully him. You mentioned the last few episodes, Scott Service was fired afterwards. he wasn't even the primary hitting coach there either yeah so that it wasn't all on him necessarily

but also he was probably getting the most contact with the big players like julio rodrigo they have there and if julia was having a bad season that might be on brown too uh if if we trade everybody we may not have any big players but i i'm skeptical it felt like there were better coaches out there that we could have could have tried to hire i don't know what the interview process looked like I don't know who reached out to them. I've been making lists all summer about guys. I think I hit 10 total by the end of it all, who probably would have been at least comparable.

I would have loved Atlanta's old hitting coach, Kevin Siteser, but he might have been getting calls from where else, or we may not have even contacted him. I'm not sure how that would have gone. So skeptical would be my. Yeah, and I guess the thing is, you and I were not in the clubhouse, so we don't know how these guys take in information,

like who likes things, to be really analytical and who likes things simplified. But in interviews that I've gone over and heard Brant Brown speak, like he sounds like my old math teacher, the way he talks, like where it was just whoosh over my head. It was, I wasn't good at that.

I didn't take that information in well. It was tough for me to process. It was never very good at math. It wasn't my thing, specifically outside of like, you know, the basic stuff. I'm talking about when we get into algebraes and stuff like that. but the way he speaks is like super smart guy talk like to me where I'm like, whoa.

I was like like, and he was like answering the most simple questions in the most difficult ways. And I was just kind of, I would get lost like listening to him. I'm like, I don't even know what you said. But I mean, can you just tell me if I should swing at this?

You know, and I wonder if that was an issue for somebody like a Julio Rodriguez, you know, if that was where he just didn't mesh well. Overthinking. some of that roster was able to receive information. We all handle things in a different way. So, you know, and I mentioned in the chat with Jeff earlier this week about the

locked on Mariners guys were kind of like, I think if he was just focused on as a hitting, you know, hitting coach, things would have been a whole lot better. And you never heard any complaints really out of Miami under Skip Schumacher or any of their players, not understanding what the hell he was talking about. things obviously went pretty darn well when he was in the Dodgers organization. So there really has been more good than bad. It's just the bad just happened. And I think it freaks people like me out a little bit where I'm like, oh boy, oh boy.

Like, do our guys understand what the hell he's saying either? You know, it's, I don't know. We're going to find out. But obviously, if it was so bad, you wouldn't think they would hire him if it was somebody who couldn't relate to who the Cardinals have on their roster or else. what the hell are we doing? And his analytical approach might appeal to the younger players that we're trying to lean on to so that could help them as well.

I don't put a ton of stock in team stats for hitting coaches. We're talking about grown men playing a sport they've been playing for two decades plus at this point. Like in the end, it probably falls on the player's shoulders for the output. The coaches have a factor. However, I don't know if it's as great of a factor as some people make it out to be at times. Oh, it's always their fault. You know how this works.

put them on the steak. It's theirs. Never the players fault. They're perfect. The coaches are idiots and they're screwing them up. That's what's going on. All right, let's go into the front office. Rob Serfoglio comes over from the Cleveland Guardians. It's an organization that it prides themselves in developing talents. So they don't have to go out and spend big and free agency to compete, which seems like a direction that the Cardinals are trying to lean to and get back to, really? Because when, you know, when the Cardinals were in there, they're, they're, their top of their heyday. They weren't going out and blowing a lot of money on free agents. They were making bigger trades and then keeping those people with with cheaper extensions and developing their own talent within the organization. What are your thoughts on Rob joining Heim Bloom's staff? This seemed like most people think of genius move. How about you? What do you think? You mentioned it. It was my first thought, too. I went straight to his Twitter page. In his profile picture, makes him look so young. Oh, God, he looks like a baby.

I know, I'm three years younger, but it still feels different. He needs facial hair like you, Thomas. That's what it is. I mean, this took me about six years, so I can't give it. I think his hires says two things. One, it's a direction for the organization, younger, lower spending, and really heavy focus on player development. He and Hymn Bloom both have a very specific skill set when it comes to pitching development,

and I think that those will build well with each other. The second thing that it tells me is that we're in the Bloom era right now. I mean, he's an outside hire. He's a true outside hire. He doesn't have any connections to Hime. He's not a Boston or a Tampa guy. So we're truly spreading our touch out throughout the league. He comes from Cleveland, so low payroll, high output.

I think it's a good hire. I don't know everything about his background, but he's a Yale guy, knowledgeable, great player development production. You have Stephen Kwan, Bo Nailer, Hunter Gaddis, Tanner Bybee, Ryan Rokio. These are all guys that are true leaders for Cleveland, and they've been developed in just the last few years. Yeah, there he go.

There he is. There he is. There he is. He needs a mustache. Get him a mustache. And I think he'd be golden. I think he'd be well accepted. He knows what he kind of looks like a guy that needs like the sole patch right here,

right in a room. That, like, upside-down triangle sole patch. would look really good. We need some Photoshop listeners to do like four or five different options for his facial hair for us and we'll do a vote for it. Or we can get him like one of the, I don't know, the character with on Hunger Games with the weirdo beard. Yeah, just lean into it.

Something to really, you know, stand apart from everybody else and all the other people out there. But yeah. Put some pictures in the comments, people. Please get some of the edits out there. Like, it just, it makes sense. Like, there's nothing about him. Like, if you're going to knock anything, people,

People are going to be like, oh, my gosh, he's 32, but so what, who cares? Like, if he's good at what he does and clearly he is, then it doesn't make any sense not to bring somebody like that in. And it's something that, again, is bringing towards a more youthful look to this organization because these guys that have been around for a long time that, you know, we call dinosaurs and they've just been here forever. They're all starting to taper off. You know, they're starting to retire, move on to other things in their life. and this is going to be a new regime, you know, same ownership, obviously, same, same morals, same principles, but you got to bring in some some new blood from time to time. And obviously the Cardinals have gotten a little bit stale over time.

And I think this is a great thing. I'm excited about that. Speaking of prospects, let's hit this real quick, Arizona Fall League underway. And the Cardinals had eight players that were invited, which, which is nice. You know, that means you got some talent there. Nathan Church, Thomas and Jacey, Leonardo Bernal, Matt's Vonson, Bryson, Bryson, Mottes, E. Sean Henderson, Alex Cornwell, and Trent Baker are all playing for the Glendale Desert Nogues in the NFL this year. How are things looking for these guys? Because you recently wrote a piece about them.

How's everybody looking so far? Yeah, as of two days ago, it's not going too badly. Nathan Churchill, who I was not familiar with, is slashing similarly to Thomas and J.C. minus a little bit of the power. But Sejacy is the Cardinals clear favorite there. I am surprised that he's still hitting as well as he was, is. He has a 400, 545-720 slash line. He's probably very tired at this point, and he's still mashing.

So these are like AA pitchers, and coming off the majors and then going down to double A, you're going to see some success. But his defense is where I've been focusing primarily. second base most often, which feels like his sweet spot. Third base, he's gotten some time as well. I don't think he's a short stop unless it's in a pinch. But I would imagine the shortstop pecking order. He's above Brendan Donovan and then he's Brendan Donovan.

His defense is where I'm looking. I've never really been worried about his offense. Henderson, how did you pronounce his first name earlier? Eshon. It's spelled. What is it? I-X-A-N, I think. Yeah, that's the first name was spelled.

But it's pronounced E-Shon, Henderson. A left, you had some pretty good numbers. in A ball this year. Honestly, I'm going to be honest. I never even heard of a guy. And then he got sent out there. And so I looked at him as I was like, whoa, I was like not too shabby down there in A ball.

He's doing well. And Matt Swanson is also doing well. Matt Swanson is a Rule 5 candidate. So unless we add him to the 40 man, he is up for grabs for other teams. He is probably the most fringe candidate that we have. I'm working on something about that too. I think Tink Henson's co-a-robi are the two. shoe in for a spot and then he's a fringe guy. I don't know if they'll end up adding him.

But he and Eishon Henderson are having very good performances in AFL as well. Yeah, Sonson was, he was he was Paul de Young, right? He was part of that. Yeah, from Toronto with Toronto, had a really good year as a closer with double A. Yeah, a lot of saves. Yeah, had outstanding numbers, you know, and I was a little surprised that he didn't get bumped up to AAA. But yeah, he's one of those guys that, you know, We saw Ryan Fernandez, you know, make that leap from AA and do pretty darn well with the Cardinals through the Rule 5 draft. I would hate to lose a guy like Sponson because we know how the bullpen, like you got to keep churning arms out. Throw some young guys out there.

Yeah, you know, give them a chance. And, you know, that's kind of what they did last year. And so if there's not going to be in Andrew Kittridge this year and everybody's going to kind of move up in the packing order, you know, maybe Sponson's one of those guys that comes in like a Calais he did last year. or Chris Roycroft and can do some stuff for them there. But yeah, I would hate to lose them in Rule 5. So hopefully that is not the case. We're going to talk about the World Series. I want to get on that.

I also want to get your thoughts on Mo's quote the other day about youthful, you know, the youth getting more chances, more opportunities. And, you know, I want to see who. who you think the Cardinals are going to be training, whether it's going to be out of the big three. Will it be Nolan, Sunny, or Wilson, which one would Thomas Govain ship out to give somebody from the youthful side of things? More opportunities.

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baseball, keeping you updated on every aspect of the World Series. Again, game one tonight in Los Angeles. If I'm locked on MLB on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast, Thomas Covey from Redbyrance.com is joining us here today. Moe mentioned in his press conference that more opportunities for younger players. That was the phrase that continues to stick out in my mind. And I brought this up with Jeff earlier where I was like, not really an old roster anyway. So if you had to move on from one of the veteran guys who's got a lot of money, coming their way has a no trade clause out of sunny gray wilson contraris or nolan aranato you're the gm you're you're you're president of baseball operations john mosey like you're playing his role

which one are you trying to move on from first not which one makes the vote you know might be the most popular but which one are you trying to move first i don't know if i can answer this but my honest answer is none of them like we have no business trading any of these guys to cut payroll there's 60 million coming off the books and free agency alone that gets us down to like 130 i think for our payroll we've no business trading these guys but if we have to trade them uh it'd probably be no one aranaado i don't know i don't think he's on the wrong side of his career at this point i love the guy i love his fire he's got a great career he's probably a shoe in hall of famer but it's contract 30 million 32 million right yeah yeah that

he's not worth that money anymore. So if we're doing strictly value, I think it's got to be him. Sunny Gray is the leader of the pitching staff that we've been searching for. And Wilson Contreras is probably the most lovable player on the team outside of Lars Newpar, I think, and Alec Berlison. But people seem to have really warmed up to him these last couple years. So I think Nolanoa be at the top of the list. But I don't think we need to trade any of them.

Keep them here. Just let them roll and see what they can do in a leadership perspective. Yeah, that was something Jeff brought up was like they don't have to train any of these guys. They don't afford all of this. It's not that they have to do it. This is something they would be choosing to do. And it's kind of funny because like now that they're doing this reset and now they're trading off veterans where this past year they were taking anyone any veterans they could buy and like bring them all in. 35 and up club.

And now it's like, all right, who wants them all? Who wants all these old guys now? In my opinion, I feel like the. easiest one to move on from despite his personality is Wilson Contreras because I feel like you're fine at catcher like you are. And his price tag is very manned. Even if he's a DH, 18 million. Like look at your old on Alvarez's contract. Show Hey Otani without the deferral. Like these guys, John Paul Stanton. And he's still an outstanding hitter. It's not like his numbers were bad this year. He just got hurt in weird ways, you know. I mean, it just,

what are you going to do? And that was one of the. reasons why when I talk about people bagging on Ali and I'm like, dude, your three best hitters weren't around this year. Like you didn't, you didn't have a real Goldie or an Aronado and you only had a half of contraris. Like almost everybody's lineup is going to suck when those guys starting around. Look at the Braves. I mean, the Braves. Yeah. Yeah. And at least they still had a couple of those guys that were performing, you know, I mean, watching Ozuna do what he does now. I'm just like, we don't say his lady. When did this happen? Like, when did he become this guy again? Anyway, but yeah, I just feel like being able, I feel like the easiest one would probably be sunny because everybody wants pitching all the time.

And he's still top of the rotation guy. Yeah. Like, and I've mentioned that boy, like where he would slide in like one of these big market teams that's already got an ace in their repertoire. Like, he would slide it as a number two. What about somebody's guy? He could be a number three and just have this three-headed monster that they could put together. I know his money is expensive the next two years, but somebody's teams won't care about that.

But I don't want to lose them after a while. I don't want to lose any of these guys either. But if I had to trade one and I would actively be singing the praises of Wilson Contreras if I was going to do it just because of what they got at the catcher position already. Yvonne Herrera, you've got Pedro Pahas, and then you got Jimmy Crooks coming up right behind him who had this outstanding season in the Cardinals organization, along with Quinn Matthews. And he's a good defensive catcher, too.

It's not like he's just a bat, you know, he's got a hand in for an arm. His bat just came on, really. I mean, he's been defensive for most of his career. Yeah. So that's just something that I'm like, and then you've got, you know, Bernal, who's at the Arizona falling. I'm like, you've got some catching depth here. So unless you're going to move one of them to first base, that is something that, you know, could happen as well.

What are your thoughts on the World Series? Do you feel Dodgers or Yankees this year? Do you like this matchup? Because I love it. I think if our team's not going to be in it, I want to see the two best teams. I love that it's an East Coast, West Coast thing. I love that I'm seeing Soto and Judge, Face, Otani, and Betts.

This is what I'm here for. I want to see the best players in the game on the biggest stage. Yeah, you have probably seven future Hall of Famers here between the two teams. It's the two biggest market. From a guy whose team was not even sniffing the playoffs, this is the perfect. I did not want Guardians Brewers. Where's the fun? A, it's the Brewers.

And B, there's no fun there. You know, it's just two good old-fashioned Midwest teams, which is probably what people say about the Cardinals when they make it. But that's now they're here. I think this is a great matchup. It's two of the biggest markets, two of the best teams. You get the big names. You have the international appeal.

with Yamamoto and Otani. It's got everything. It's a little bit annoying that the two most successful teams are one of them is going to get just more success. But I can get past that. Yeah. Well, you know, if you got the money, it pays to be able to afford all these guys.

But even like the Dodgers, they're like homegrown guys and the Yank. Aaron Judge is homegrown. Claver Torres is home. Like there's a lot of drafting and developing there too. There's a lot of money. You're also seeing some former Cardinals. We got a Luke Weaver in New York.

You've got Tommy Admin. You've got Jack Flaherty over in L.A. Who do you think is going to win? Who's your pick? Probably, I don't know. Yankees because, yeah, Yankees because they're pitching, but I think I want Dodgers. Yeah, I feel like my heart is with the Dodgers.

Yeah. But I feel like I'm picking the Yankees as well just because of their starting pitching. All other bullpen's kind of been weird this. here so it has been it should be entertaining just throughout luke weaver for any six through nine and see what happens apparently he's a god now at age 30 just out of nowhere he's uh he's all they've ever wanted in the closer which uh for some reason nobody else could figure that out and then yeah all six foot of him yeah everything it just clicks by when he got to new york amazing how that can happen all right now before we let you go what's some future things that you're working on thomas

i've got a lot down the pipeline i've got 10 first base options after paul goldsmith I just wrote some guys that the card. Is any of them Wilson Contreras? I'm kidding. No, he's not on the list. No, he's not there. All right. And then I've got some guys they should sell high on.

And I just reviewed John Denton had a quote with 101 ESPN about Aronado and Heelsley being traded. So I talked about that a little bit too. All right. Yeah, that'd be another difficult pill to swallow. I get it. I understand the business side of it. But at the same time, I hate it.

I eat it. When you know that you have a franchise that's run by. billionaires and they can afford this stuff that they're like, we're just not going to do it. That's just, right. Just extend it. It's kind of upsetting. All right.

We'll check in with you again real soon. Make sure you guys are following Thomas at Thomas Govain on Twitter X, redbird ranch.com. Plenty of different stories, you know, the offseason where things can be a little bit dry for Cardinal fans specifically because they're not in the playoffs, but you guys are covering it so well and giving us a lot of content to talk about and discuss. So we'll have Thomas back on here real soon, but you guys go check him out at Redbird Rance.com. Appreciate your time, as always, my friend. All right. Thanks for having me on.

Thanks for making Lockdown Cardinals, your first listen every day if you haven't already. Do be a solid. Give me a follow as well as Thomas on Twitter X at L0 underscore Cardinals and a JD Sports Radio. You can grab him at Thomas Govain. Like, subscribe on YouTube, help our channel and love for the Cardinals grow. You guys are the best fans of baseball for a reason. And we will see you next time a lockdown cardinals.