Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - COLTS SQUAD SHOW: MORE from Mooney | Can the Colts Get a Healthy and Productive Season from Ward?

Episode Date: May 22, 2026

As we continue our series on Returnee Reviews for the Colts, we head to the defensive side of the ball and Charvarius Ward. After being plagued by personal tragedy and serious concussions, can Ward return to All-Pro form alongside Sauce Gardner? Also, the Squad takes a look at the Colts cornerback room and discusses one national reporter who disagrees with the Daniel Jones extension.  Find and follow Locked On Colts on your favorite podcast platforms:  🎧 https://lockedonpodcasts.com/podcasts/locked-on-colts/  📺YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLdpxJspi1hMh5HL7ExpWOQ  Give the squad a follow on X/Twitter @Schultz975, @JakeArthurNFL, @ZachHicks2, @allenpinkett, @LockedOnColts, and @ColtsOn_SI, as well on TikTok and Instagram!  Locked On NFL League-Wide: Every Team, Fantasy, Draft & More  🎧 https://lockedonpodcasts.com/podcasts/lockedoncolts  Everydayer Club If you never miss an episode, it’s time to make it official. Join the Locked On Everydayer Club and get ad-free audio, access to our members-only Discord, and more — all built for our most loyal fans. Click here to learn more and join your team’s community: https://lockedonpodcasts.com/everydayerclub Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! Square If you’re starting a business, or running one that deserves better tools, Square helps you sell, manage, and grow without slowing down. Right now, you can get up to $200 off Square hardware at https://square.com/go/LockedOnNFL. FanDuel Today's episode is brought to you by FanDuel.Right now new customers can bet just five dollars and get one-hundred and fifty dollars in bonus bets if your first bet wins. Visit https://FANDUEL.COMto get started — Play Your Game. Indeed Listeners of this show get a $75 Sponsored Job Credit to help give your job the premium placement it deserves at http://Indeed.com/podcast. Gametime Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONfor $20 off your first purchase. FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to the Colts Squad Show. I'm your host, Derek Schultz, and I saw some of those old pictures, Alan. You jealous? And I'm Zach Hicks, and I clearly did not get the memo that we're doing Andy Reed Fashion Week on this show. I'm Jake Arthur. Derek, what are you feeding that thing? And I'm Alan Pinkett, former Euler. No longer with a mustache, because mine comes in great.

Colts Nation, rise up. It's the Colts Squad. everything Indianapolis Colts every week. Covering all the big hits and game changing plays from the Circle City, the way only the locked on podcast network can. It's time to squad up. The Colt Squad Joe starts now. Welcome to the Colts Squad show.

I'm still Derek Schultz, long time indie sports talker and columnist for the Indianapolis business journal. I'm joined by a Notre Dame legend, long time NFL running back and a formerly mustache to Alan Pinkett along with the dynamic locked on Colts. of Jake Arthur and Zach Hicks, your first listen every day. Facial hair distractions aside, guys, we are back to getting to our return reviews, our return e reviews, I should say. This is a series where we take an in-depth look at a key cult's returnee whose role

may have changed. I mean, I would say may or may not. I guess everybody's role changes year to year because the roster changes as well with some of these off-season shifts. Some will change more than others. I'm not sure how much the person that we're going to focus on today, his role is going to change outside as you just hope. hope that he is mentally and physically right.

And that's Charverius Ward. So we'll jump into Mooney Ward for this week's returny review and talk about how important he and Soss Gardner are to the Colts success. We'll get into that in segment number two, especially with some of the shortcomings and the pessimism surrounding the pass rush. In corner number three, in segment number three, I should say the cornerback room, is it the best position group on the Colts? We'll dive into that and get into that in the second half of the show.

And someone, I'm not going to tell you who, it's not anybody, any of the smiling faces that are sitting right here, someone nationally. Hates the Daniel Jones extension. I was reading through some covers and I was like, oh, I had not seen that take before. So we'll share that take with you coming up and react to it in segment four before we round out the day. But guys, let's get into Charverius Ward senior. You know, he was a signing that was celebrated, right? Because you always heard the term bargain bin Bowered, right? Zach where they got cheap or they went the UDFA route or day three picks and you throw them out there

a corner and you had Dallas flowers and you had Jalen Jones, you had whoever else. And then they finally invested in somebody with an all pro pedigree, not only that, but a Super Bowl pedigree in Charverius Ward Senior and his 2025 season for a myriad of reasons, both on and off the field, just never really felt like it got quite off the ground. Obviously, he had the multiple concussions, but then the terrible tragedy, family tragedy involving his daughter as well. And there was talk late in the season that we might not see Charverius Ward, not only in a Colts uniform, but in any NFL uniform in 2026.

He's back. There was some availability this week as well. He's been telling his story about bouncing back from the mental and physical struggles of last year. What are you hoping to see out of Mooney Ward, who is a player? I think I'm right in saying we all like. Yeah, no, a very good player. I mean, he's a Hall of Very Good type of player.

and you know, been an all pro in his career. I think he went to a Super Bowl with the Kansas City Chiefs as well, or at least with the 49ers. He's been, you know, a very good cornerback on, very good teams in his, in his NFL career. But it's just been back-to-back seasons from hell for a multitude of reasons. Like you mentioned there, Derek, both on and off the field. He's had a lot of injuries in the past, the past two years from the concussions last year to, I think it was like a leg injury with the 40s.

Niners that cost him most of that 2024 season as well. So since 2024, 2025, he just hasn't been that caliber of corner that the Colts are paying him to be. And he's gone through a lot of, you know, tragedy in his life. And obviously, like, that plays a part of this as well. But, yeah, I think I'm of two brains, really, when it comes to a player like Mooney Ward. Like, one is what your heart is thinking, right? We all love the romanticism of football and the romanticism of sports.

Jake being the beat writer on here, I'm sure. You think of all the great stories that you could write about, like, hey, like this guy coming back from all this adversity and being able to be a productive player for the Colts next year, our brain wants to go to that, right? We grow up watching Miracle on Ice, Rudy, and all these movies and stuff, thinking about the beautiful aspect of sports

where guys can overcome these things. But you also have to think with your brain where, you know, logically thinking here, the last two years have not gone well for this guy. on like we're just going to focus on the field here because there's there's been a lot bigger pieces to this as well but on the field it hasn't gone well for him his body hasn't really responded super well to the NFL game and typically as you get older you don't get healthier you know it's it's a big part of of the sport right as you get older the wear and tear keeps building it doesn't

just have a completely clean slate so he's kind of a wild card for me this year I don't know what we're going to get out of him going into 2026. I think anything that you can get out of him is kind of a bonus because the first half of last year before the concussions really took their toll. He was playing some great football for the Colts. He was very good against Los Angeles Rams, very good against Miami Dolphins. I thought his game against the Raiders was really strong as well. It's just we didn't get to see much of him before those concussions really took their toll on him and then late in the season, it just wasn't what you wanted to see from him before he got ultimately shut down. So, you know, he's probably not going to be a great return on investment

with the contract. You hope for the best. You hope this is, again, like your miracle and ice, like your Rudy type story where we're all saying at the end of the day, like, oh, my gosh, this comeback great for a player who's had a really great career. But, you know, odds are when you have two seasons the way that he's had and you're already in your 30s, it's going to be tough. It's going to be tough for him. I really hope he can bounce back, though, because very, very good cornerback in his career. He's been an excellent player for a long time. And you want to see him get back to what he's been. Yeah, I'm pretty bullish on him, honestly, this year. I'd like to think, you know,

a lot of the struggles he went through last year behind him. Number one, the concussion stuff is like, that does follow you. So we can't discount that totally. He seems to think that, you know, at the time when last year ended and he made the comments to us that he did like you know if i get another one i might retire and like he's he was contemplating retirement in general uh he said that came from kind of a dark place and at the time he just you know that that that's where his head space was and you know i i i'd like it sounds like he's put himself in better position you know he mentioned the impact that you know therapy has had on him he's got his family with him now which has been a big thing last year.

I think they stayed back home in Texas while he was here in Indy. And he said that was a mistake for that to be the case. So he's got a support system with him. He said his son has really been a big part of kind of pulling him out of his funk. So I do think mentally he's entering this year in a different spot than he did last year. But, you know, while that is the case, it's the concussions to me. that's like really the biggest part because it could be one more that really derails this entire thing. Because while he said he's not just going to, you know, drop of the hat, you know, retire if he gets another one,

if it's another major one, like the one that occurred after the Ogletree hit, that, yeah, his career might be in jeopardy and he might be rethinking things after that. Because I don't, I don't think people realize how messed up he really was. that guy was dizzy and throwing up and all that stuff for weeks and weeks after that. He was completely blacked out on the field when that happened. So if anything like major happens again, then we'll see. But yeah, I do think the guys got good football in him, though, like coming back to the actual football part of it. I was, you know, I think he passed the eye test generally. There were a couple bumps in there.

But I looked at pro football focus recently just to. to kind of like see what they said about his statistics, like his targets and everything. Him and Soss Gardner were actually the seventh and eighth graded corners in the entire NFL last year. So when he was on there, he's playing pretty good football. You know,

I look at like the Chiefs game, for example, the vast majority of that game went really well. Those two played together. And even Patrick Mahomes didn't want to test those guys on the outside. Late in the game as things wore on and everything, things started to break down. But I think we saw, if you have a healthy sauce,

if you have a healthy Mooney Ward, that this Colts defense could be pretty good. And we've talked about it recently. Like the potential of this entire defense kind of hinges on their health. So all fingers crossed that this thing goes well and Mooney can stay healthy just for him personally. Like forget about his impact on the Colts.

For him personally, I want him to stay fine. Wow. So I don't know when I said this, but you remember we had an episode where I said him going through his trials was probably the best thing for him because being the competitor he is, he would just say, I'm not going out like that. And, you know, sometimes you have adversity. and it makes you want to come back stronger. I can speak personally about my season in 1990.

I sucked and didn't score a touchdown. And I just made a decision that I'm not going out like that. So in 91, and sorry, I'm not trying to make this about me. But in 1991, I actually committed to two charities that, look, for every touchdown I score, I'm going to donate $250 to your charity. And so I put that pressure on myself. And I did that because in 1990, I didn't score a single touchdown. But, you know, sometimes when you commit yourself to being better, you know, the good Lord blesses. you. I had 10 touchdowns in 1991. And so I had to give some money away. I say that because

Mooney speaks about his faith, or he did speak about his faith and how, you know, he talked to God a little bit more. And, you know, I guess what I can say to that is, you know, the good Lord puts you through trials sometimes just so you can. trust him that you'll come back even stronger. And I think he's showing that he's coming back stronger. And you talked about the dark place that he was in. You know, when when you have a family and you're playing this sport and your family's not around, it just feels like a job.

You know, I'm glad he made the decision to have his family around him because that that reminds you every time you come home that's a plan for something else you plan for something bigger than yourself you're playing sometimes to create generational wealth for your family you're playing so that you can send your kid to private school you know not to public school uh you're you're you're playing so that you can create you can create you you know, this joy. And it's fun to come home and share that with the family. If you had nobody to come home to, it's a pretty boring existence.

And yeah, you might have a lot of money, but the money doesn't mean a damn thing if you can't share it or experience it with someone. So I expect him to have a big year. and actually was quite impressed when I saw his press conference because he is very revealing, even given the therapist's name that he used. He was just, he's an open book, you know. But I think he's a great example to, you know,

other young men that are going through things that, look, you can come out on the other side and be better. And as far as losing his daughter, you know, one of the ways he can glorify her life is by making plays on the field. You know, his purpose may be to show folks that when you have tragedy, you know, that if you stay faithful,

then good things will come your way. So I think that all signs are pointing up and I say all this without knowing some of his past, but just watching them on the field, I just had the feeling that even though he was undecided, I knew that he was going to come back because he just don't want to go out like that. Yeah, and that's something that he didn't mention.

And really one thing I want to mention with him is, you know, I can't really speak to the physical aspect of what this next year is going to look like, right? Because that's the big question, Mark. how is he physically going to get through a season? And I think that's just not going to be answered until the season picks off. But I mean, mentally speaking, from last year, he's still less than a year removed from the loss of his young daughter.

He comes to a new place that he's never been to before, like never lived in before. He's by himself. So he's having to still grieve by himself away from family. And then he just has probably the most frustrating season of his career. Right. So you're trying to put all this effort into football to get away from all the off-the-feel distractions and I don't even want to call it distracting.

That feels callous to say, but you know what I mean? Like the tragedy that he's dealing with still, you're trying to just put it all in the field and focus on that, but you can't get on the field because you're having these concussions and not just want like a minor concussion, like a major, major concussion or you're scared for your long-term health with that. And he's doing this from a place of like just solitary essentially here in Indies. So I do think that his mental health is going to be a lot better this year. I'm hoping at least I know we're kind of speculating here.

but getting some family out here, being removed from the concussion, having people that rely on in his circle to really, like, get through all the tough things that he has to. Like, I hope mentally he's in a better place this year. I think the big question is just physically, is he going to get through this whole season? That's going to be the biggest thing for him, because I still fully believe that he's a very good football player when he's on the field.

He was a very good football player for the Colts last year. He just needs to be on the field. So physically it still remains to be seen, but I hope at least mentally you can be in a much better place this year with some family around here as well. Yeah, it's tough. I mean, you go back second half of the 2024 season and he loses his daughter. There was an injury or two that were mixed in there. And then he has only the seven games with the Colts and you're talking about 10 games over the past essentially a year and a half. And sometimes for these guys, I remember Reggie Wayne said it when his brother died during the season, tragically was killed.

And he said the only time he didn't cry that week was when he was playing the jet. So, you know, sometimes, you know, some people may look at that and say, wait, what, like, your family member just passed away. How could you be out there on the field? But it's the distraction of that, right? Because football is just football. And when you're in it, you're in it and you're not thinking about the other things, too. But, yeah, we hope, just from, you know, this is a football show, right? And we're talking about what it could be on the field.

But you can't help. But, you know, I have a son, you know, Jake, you have kids, Alan, you have kids as well. I mean, you know, we've all to think even about going through that and then trying to play football as well. it's a pretty terrible thing. So we're rooting for Mooney Ward. We come back more on Ward and Sauce Gardner, how critical is the Colts cornerback duo to lifting Indy's entire defensive unit?

Jake kind of outlined some of that. We'll discuss further when the Colts Squad Show returns next. This portion of the Colts Squad Show brought you by Square, the system that helps fix one of the biggest headaches in running a business. Starting a business is exciting, but actually running it, well, that's where things can get really complicated fast. Payments, inventory, staff,

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Run your business smarter with Square. get started today. We're back on the Locked-on Colts squad show alongside former NFL or Alan Pinkett and the Locked-on Colts duo of Zach Hicks and Jake Arthur. I'm Derek Shultz. I apologize for my appearance. Every Day or Club. I wanted to

remind you about that. Don't forget to check the Everyday or Club, Brad, free episodes, and access to a group chat with Jake, Zach, and other listeners of Locked-on Colts. Tap the link in the show notes or go to Lockedonpod.com slash Everydayer Club. I see some of you guys already in here in the

comment section as well. We really appreciate our everydayers. I don't always support the daily show, but also support us Tuesdays and Thursday, nice during the offseason here with the squad show. So, Jake, I wanted to start with you because you said something interesting that I did not know. I was actually looking at this because I was prepping for the show tonight. I was trying to, you know, kind of see. And, you know, we're talking about a small sample where Saus Gardner and Traverius Ward were actually playing together this year. But overall, last season, the seventh and eighth graded corners in the entire NFL. And yes, I know Zach's probably his eyes are rolling out of his skull, right?

Because I know the grades are an inexact science. But you look at their pedigree and you look what they've been as high-end players. You know, needless to stay, they've both been very, very good. Even failing that, if they could just get somewhat towards that level, how big of a difference would that make for this Colts defense in 2026? I think it makes a world a difference because those two playing man coverage and getting up in receivers' grills and throwing off their rhythm. everything. It's what Lou Aniruma wants to do in order for his defense to function at its peak

performance. That way you don't have to manufacture all this pass rush. You can hopefully, you know, do whatever you want when it comes to blitzing or, you know, rushing with four. I personally, when I'm just kind of thinking ahead to this thing, you got the two guys on the boundaries that are, you know, doing a good job locking players down or at least quarterback's not wanting to test them. Well, now on the inside, you have Cam Bynum and A.J. Halsey, both of their specialty being their ball skills, that's probably where the ball is going. If it's going downfield or, you know, beyond the sticks at all, it's probably going in the neighborhood of Bynum and Halsey, guys who are really good at taking the ball away. So I think it influences a lot of what the offense, offenses will want to do. And again, I just think if we're ever going to see Lou Anirumo's deep. defense and his creative genius at full strength, it's going to be with those corners playing at a high level locking guys down. Because there's a whole lot of diversity that Zach can explain much better than I can with this type of defense. But you see it with just these insane

defensive coordinators like Brian Flores in Minnesota. We've seen his defenses look really, really good, either because they've had really good pass rushers before or they've had good corners. But when you have elite players in the spots, you want to have them to run a defense like that, it just makes all the difference in the world. Like, think ahead. I mean, you think of the Dolphins game and Zavian Howard was insane. Like, obviously not an adequate player, but his intel of what he was able to tell them about Tua Tonga Vailoa and how to attack him. Like that was a completely smothering defensive performance to the point where Howard didn't

really need to get targeted whatsoever because they knew what was coming. So, you know, when you have factors like that in there, it's just huge. It makes so much of a difference. So, Zach, if you can more eloquently detail what I'm trying to say. Yeah, I mean, it's not even like to go too far into being like crazy scheme here. I mean, I think what the Colts want to do with Louie and Arumo is early downs, you know, you're going to have your zone defense. You're going to have some run blitzes mixed in.

But you're going to be in your nickel more often than not. But a lot of what the Colts want to do is they want to show pressure on third downs or on passing situations, show pressure, bring a diversity, like a diverse amount of pass rushers. So if you have six or seven guys up around the line of scrimmage, it could be five to seven guys, we'll say that around the line of scrimmage. You don't know who's rushing, right? So they're going to bring upwards of four to six players, and it can be players that you don't expect, the defensive end dropping into coverage.

It can be a defensive tackle dropping into coverage and all these guys blitzing. But that doesn't really work unless you have corners on the outside that can win their matchups. That's the most important part of this, because no matter how many guys you're showing up front, if Mackay Blackman's going to fall down on the other side of the play and get beat vertical, it doesn't matter. If Jonathan Edwards can't run with Trey McBride because you're going to be, you're going to fall down, you don't have anyone to put on Trey McBride in that situation, it doesn't matter. You're going to give up a third and 20 conversion.

Like we saw a couple of times last year. So, yeah, Lou Hintan Ruhu wants to play man coverage on third downs. That's really when they rolled it out. He wants to play that cover one robber. And if you have guys like Mooney Ward, you have guys like Sauce Gardner, long, athletic, physical cornerbacks who can get into receiver's faces because at the end of the day,

you don't need these corners to be perfect in these man coverage situations, right? it's getting in the receiver's face disrupting at the at the point at the contact point and press coverage and then making sure you're in position after that so you can get the five guys home the four five six guys whoever's rushing the passer and you can get those guys home but this doesn't work if guys like edwards and mackay blackman and all these like fringe roster players are getting beat by receivers quickly on the outside so yeah it's it's vital to have corners with this ability for any kind of defensive scheme. But if you want to play man coverage, that's when you are on an island. You know, on main coverage, unique corners that understand their assignment, understand how to play against who they're going against across from them,

and understand the nuances of the NFL game. And we saw that it just wasn't there with guys like Edwards and Mackay Blackman last year. So, yeah, I think we saw glimpses of what this could be. I would even go back to the Rams game. I thought Lou Anuromo called an outstanding game against the Los Angeles Rams.

if they would have had Sauce Gardner in that game instead of Xavier and Howard, they probably hold the Rams to under 10 points. Like, it was a tough game for the Rams. I know Stafford threw for almost 400 yards in that game because, I mean, 80 of them came on Mackay Blackman falling down on that last play. But they were, I think the Rams were like three of 14 on third down in that game. It was a very good defense performance. The big issue was just they didn't have another corner on the other side that can stay in

man coverage and they got burnt because of that. So I think that there's a lot of good ingredients here for them to have a good defense. But it starts with these two corners on the outside, locking it down, and giving the defense more creativity on the interior to make life health or opposing quarterbacks. Well, Zach, I couldn't say it better, but I will add to what you're saying by saying that one of the reasons I love this sport, I love football is because it's a team sport. and it's, you know, one position complements another position. And it also makes me say things like, you know, Tom Brady's a hell of a quarterback,

but he can't throw it to himself. You know, so I think that with Sauce and Mooney, they are the most important aspect of that Lou Anorumo defense, you know, just as if you had, a bona fide rush, then you don't have to have that grade of a corner. But if you got two locked down corners, you don't have to have that good of a rush. You know, they're going to buy you some time by not letting the receivers of the covering be open. And so, you know, maybe a JTT can get there. You know, maybe LATU, who had more pressures than anybody, can finally get sacks.

know, because they've got such good coverage in a defensive backfield. And I tell you, the other thing that's good about having these two in the defensive backfield, they're two high-level corners, you know, and so they can be, I know that they're extremely competitive, but they can create a nice competition between themselves. I remember, I don't know why I keep going down memory lane, but I had in the backfield with me, Mike Roseir, Hiseman. trophy winner. Alonzo Highsmith, first round pick. Lorenzo White, first round draft pick. I was drafted in the third round. But we had a competition.

Every game, whoever got the longest run, you know, we put money in a pot. And whoever got the longest run, got that money. Well, I wanted most of the time, because usually I was coming in, like, in the second half after the defense was all beat up, and I'd bust the 25-yard run. and the guys would be mad to me. But just imagine the type of games that these two could come up with themselves saying, okay, you got this receiver, I got that receiver.

You know, whoever has the most PBIUs, you know, dinner's on, dinner's on you. You know, just that friendly type of competition. And sometimes you need that in a game because now you're really playing for something, you know, for some bragging rights. But it's healthy competition. And, you know, with those two, they're not just good cover guys. They're tacticians. You know, so they know the little nuances of, okay, I've got outside leverage this time.

And, you know, they can just, with a nod, look over at their safety and just say, okay, I got outside leverage. So be ready when he comes in. you know, that type of thing. So it not only leads to a more talented secondary, but potentially, you know, a very formidable, strong secondary that nobody wants to play against. And I can tell you right now,

a lot of offensive coordinators of minds that are already blown because before they even go into a game, they know you got two high-level corners out there. What the hell are we going to do? or you're just going to throw it to the tight end all game? You know, are we going to run screens? Because we can't throw it outside. So you've put doubt in the offense already because these two guys are back at corner.

So like I said, they are the most important aspect of this Lou Anorumo defense. Yeah, it's extremely enticing. You just need to see both of them out there healthy at the same. It's even sauce. You know, it was sauce last year with the injuries and the Knicks and bruises and whatever else. didn't have the season that he was hoping to have from a health standpoint. So I mean, I'm excited and I want to see it come to fruition. But first and foremost, both of those guys have to be out there on the field.

Speaking of the Colts cornerback room, the entire group, not just the starters, is it their strongest position on the depth chart? We'll take a look at the rest when the Colts Squad Show returns next. This portion of the Colts Squad Show brought you by our friends at Fandul. The NBA playoffs are here. In fact, it's conference finals time, and every possession matters. If you're looking to get even closer to the action, Van Duel has a great offer to get you started. Right now, new customers can bet $5 and get $150 in bonus bets if your first bet wins.

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I should say, happy Carb Day Eve for those who celebrate. It's Indianapolis 500 Race Day weekend for the Colts fans that are at least somewhat local. We're talking about Chavarious Ward Senior, and we were doing our returny review with him, and we kind of brought Soss Gardner into the conversation in segment number two. Now, guys, in segment number three, let's bring the whole cornerback room into this, because you talk about health,

another guy on that cornerback debt chart that I think we're all excited about, enticed by the Colts. I don't know if anybody's more excited than the Colts are about Justin Wally. He's going to be making his debut, hopefully. You know, knock on wood, what happened last year doesn't happen again, but making his debut in the pros for the Colts in 2026. And that's the guy who they really like. And you know what, Zach, I think as much as we've gone after some of the other

Colts cornerbacks still on the team, I like those guys as reserves, you know, and spot players. I just don't like them as CB2 or even in some cases CB1 like they were last year. And I think when you look at this group, I think it's a really good group. again with the caveat as long as they're fully healthy. Yeah, the caveat's the most important aspect of this. So to answer kind of your question, I don't think I would have corner as the strongest position group on the Colts

just because as we've kind of heard from me throughout this whole episode, I'm a little skeptical on how much we're going to get out of Mooney Ward this next season. I hope, again, I hope he plays all 17 games. I just, it's kind of hard to really count on that right now. And also, I'm not very high at all on Cam Taylor Britt. I think he's more of a camp body than any, meaningful depth on this team as of right now. So I'm not as high at Corner.

I'd probably have safety or maybe even O-line ahead of them in terms of position strength on the team. And if we're going like real narrow-minded with it, I'd say three tech defensive tackle would be probably my strongest on the roster because I love the top three guys they have there. But all that to say, like Corner is a pretty strong position group on this team. Probably the strongest it's ever been in the Chris Ballard era, right? which obviously when you invest two first round picks in one of the guys and then the other guy on the other side,

you're paying $80 million over four years or three years, whatever that contract was. And also drafting another guy in the top 100 to start in your slot, it sure has held better be your best cornerback room in your entire tenure as a general manager. So it's got the biggest names. It's got two guys who have been all pros in their careers. I mean, for Sauce, he's not even what, well, there's actually debate on this. We don't know if he's 25 or if he's 24 right now. But whatever age he is, he's been an all pro twice in the league so far.

And he's not even halfway through his second contract yet. And then Wally, a player they really like as well. So I like the starters if they can stay healthy. If those guys can stay healthy, I really like the starters on his team. And I still have faith in guys like Jonathan Edwards and Mackay Blackman. I don't think they were terrible last year. Like Edwards was in over his head. He was an undrafted free agent that just,

wasn't ready for it yet, but he was always in position, just couldn't find the football. And Mackay Blackman, for as long as he, like, it was the two plays where he fell down in man coverage, right? If you fall down in man coverage as a corner, that's like 200 yards given up right there in coverage. So that's like half his season was on two plays where he just fell down. I thought he actually had some pretty good games in there. I thought against the Falcons in London or in Germany, whatever that game was. I thought he had a really solid game in that one. and I thought he had some really good moments here and there. So, yeah, I love those guys as like bottom of the depth chart type players.

I like the starters if they can stay healthy all season. So I think it's the strongest we've ever seen in Indy in the Chris Ballard era. And, yeah, if you get Mooney at full strength and you get Sauce Gardner at full strength, those are two all pros, guys who have been there and done that in the league. So, yeah, I mean, the potential for the room is the highest on the roster because those guys have been all pros in this league. Yeah, I do think as a group, it's probably the deepest. I've got eight guys who are rosterable.

That doesn't mean they should be playing serious. You might have like eight guys who are rosterable in there. And there's only two starting positions at safety. So that's why I had safety a little bit higher. Yeah, safety is kind of crazy. But no, I mean, let's have it with the caveat of guys who have played as well for corner, I guess. And I mean, if you look at tammoms and like how top heavy they are,

They could kind of compete with a lot of the other spots. Like Guard, obviously, with Quentin and Gonzalez is good, like Pierce and Downs, Buckner and Stewart. So, like, there's, it's certainly up there. But I just think there's too many question marks around them to declare them the best. Because, I mean, Mooney, Mooney situation is what it is. We just talked about it. Sauce played, like, two games with the Colts, essentially two, three games. Justin Wally coming off an ACL.

else. So it's like we don't like the guys you're really relying on to put the weight here on like how good this group is. We can't make any declarative statements about them because we just haven't seen them enough in Colts uniforms. But on paper, of course. But Zach and I said the same thing last year. So I got to kind of be a bit of a hater with it and say like we can't trust this group until we see it happen. And for me that means like into the regular season. because, you know, I guess we got kind of fools gold with it a little bit. Like Mooney started, he got his first concussion in week one. And then Wally was hurt, you know, mid-August during the Raven stuff.

So, like, we need to see this sustained into the regular season in order for me to believe it. But, like, I think there's plenty of reason to be optimistic. Because even the worst of the death chart, basically, Cameron, Mitchell has played ball for a couple years now. Jonathan Edwards, he's a height, weight speed guy who has now played a decent amount of football. Again, like Zach said, if he can just locate the football, he's in position pretty much all the time. Jalen Jones, I don't think he'll wind up being on the roster when all is set and done. But, like, as far as guys who can and have played football before, it's a pretty deep group.

Yeah. If you look at the names at corner, right? If we were to, if this was the cornerback room three years ago, this is the best in football by a wide margin, right? Moody Ward, Sauce Gardner, Cam Taylor, Britt, best cornerback room in the league by far and away three years ago. The problem is it's 2026, not 2024 right now. That's the biggest, biggest issue right now with this quarterback room. And the crazy thing is this is, we're saying all this after having just released Kenny Moore as well. He would have factored into this just a couple of weeks.

weeks ago. But yeah, it's it's obviously a deep group. The potential for it is the highest, like Zach said. But I'm just going to, I'm just going to be kind of, I don't want to say I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop, but my trust is very much going to be have to be earned on this one. Well, I wouldn't say it's the strongest room. And you'll forgive me if I combine the safeties with the cornerbacks and just call them all defensive backs. I don't think It's the strongest room, but it is a strong room. And I think what makes it one of the strongest rooms is the fact that with sauce and Mooney back there, if you're backing them up, you know, you should take every opportunity to examine the way they practice, the way they cover, the way that they try to master their craft, that's got to rub off on you. just seeing greatness every day at practice.

And I know health is going to be a big concern, you know, being on the field. But I think having those two there makes it a very strong room. And, you know, just knowledge level of watching these two guys plays, you know, sauce and Mooney. The other guys on the roster have to get better if they can just try to emulate what these two are doing. But as far as stronger rooms, I think offensive line is a real strong room, especially with fellow Notre Dameer, Quentin Nelson. I just think he rubs off on everybody else there. I think he raises the level of play of that offensive line.

And I think he's one of the better leaders on the team, especially when, you know, they make a pass 30 yards down field. And he'll be sprinting down the field just to pick up the receiver so he can get back to the huddle. You know, that kind of stuff, you know, it's not knocking somebody over, but it's showing that you care about your teammates. And all that does is just build that camaraderie. And I think another strong room, although. It may be, I may be fantasizing a little bit. I think that wide receiver room is strong. I do.

I'm still waiting to see what Dionne Burks does right now. He would be the sprint champion in the room. And he'd be the weightlifting champion in the room. Well, maybe not more than Tyler Warren. But I just think you have such a good collection of talent at the receiver position that you just can't isolate on one. Now, I think folks will try to isolate on Alec Pierce because, you know, if he's getting all that money, that ball is going to come to him. And that's a good working relationship, Daniel Jones and Alec Pierce. so they may try to double him or slant the covers over to where he is on the field.

But you do that at expense of having Josh Downs just, you know, running circles around you. And you do that at the expense of Tyler Warren being singled up on somebody and just muslin anybody he's up against. So the receiver room to me, I would say it's the same. second strongest behind the offensive line. And yes, coming in a close third is that defensive back room. You're going to get a lot of people disagreeing with you on wide receiver, Alan. Everyone's calling for that as the biggest need position on the team right now because they're looking at that third outside wide receiver, like who is that next guy? They're not as high as we are on Ashton Doolin for some reason. Like, come on, do it all Doolin is the perfect player.

I mean, he's going to break out this year. It's going to be like the year nine breakout for him. And it's going to be great on offense. I agree, Alan. Yeah. Wide receiver, I won't say it's as far as you are. Alan won't say it's like a big time strength on the team. But I do think we're going a little too far with how.

Yeah, you've kind of shrugged your shoulders at the whole like, eh, okay, yeah, they lost Pittman Jr., but whatever, they'll be fine. Yeah. Is that Pierce faith more than anything else? Like him taking another step. Yeah, I know we're at the end of the segment here. And this is probably for a future show. but like go back and watch what Pittman was running in the offense last year.

He was running slant, in-breaker, occasional double move, and then sniffer tight end blocking. Like, I'm not saying that that's not valuable, but if they were to have lost Downs or Pierce or Warren, that would have been bad. Because Pierce is the guy who opened everything up. Warren did so much, and Downs was their man coverage beater. to beat your kind of tough guy over the, to lose your tough guy over the middle, like if they could have got Pittman back for like $10 million a year, because that's kind of what he was last year,

like a $10 to $15 million per year receiver. If you could have him at that, fine to have him back. But they had to make that move and move on from him. And I think it's easier to replace tough guy over the middle than it is to replace elite vertical threat, isolated man coverage beater, and then crafty tight end that you can use in so many different ways. So I don't really think they lost a big core of their offense.

And I think a player like Doolin can especially do a lot of like the sniffer tight end stuff. I think he can do some of the tough guy with the middle stuff too. Not to the same level of Pittman. So, you know, again, I can't go as high as Alan with this because I know Alan is very high on downs and his boy Pierce, obviously, and Warren. But I don't think it's as huge of an issue as some are making it out to be. And I do like Birx a lot too.

I hope that he's able to stay healthy throughout camp. but I'm not as concerned about receiver as some people are. Real quick, I have a very important point to make before we move on. You know, receiver is our group full of nicknames. We've got the Labrador receiver. We've got first downs, do it all doing. I'm workshopping a name here for Dionne Burks because he's here for the long haul. When we think about Mighty Mouse.

Yeah, I was that Muscle hamster is already taken. So we got to do Mighty Mouse. R-I-P Doug Martin, muscle hamster's already taken. Mighty Mouse. Small and stature. but very strong for his small size. I like it, Alan. What do you think?

There you go. I like the Mighty Mouse. Perfect. I just off the top of my head. It started here. You know, after off the top of my head, I said, Burks works, you know, but. Oh my God.

That's even better. I like the one too. This is a throwback, but I think Damon Stodemeyer, the old point guard was Mighty Mouse. Oh, no. Mighty Mouse tattoo. Portland Trailblazer. I do think Burks works as like a sarcastic, like,

question mark type thing works. Like, if he has. ends up being decent for them this year where everyone's like, who's going to be our other outside receiver? Like, eh, Birx works, right? Like, yeah, Burks work. Like, I think that has some potential. Yeah, yeah. I will let you in on the little secret when I got traded to New Orleans. You know, they didn't know anything about me. And we were in the wait room and I was, you know, lifting just as much as the offensive lineman. I got called Mighty Mouse by a couple of different. This is personal for you. Okay.

I like the Mighty Mouse. Yeah, I do. There's a national pundit who during a write-up about off-season moves around the league was pretty outspoken about how much he disliked the Daniel Jones contract extension. We'll tell you who that is so you can spam their Twitter feed next when the Colt Squad Show returns for a final time. Welcome back, Colt Squad Show. Appreciate you guys being here and supporting the show.

So segment four, especially in the off-season, generally we're doing sometimes like a news and notesy thing. or, you know, I go through, I think, like we all do, and you sort of see things just sort of sprinkle through the feed, right? And you decide, okay, is that legitimate enough where I want to react to it or is it newsworthy enough, yada, yada, yada. And I did see this from somebody that I like. And, you know, the point of being, I think, a good pundit is not having people always agree with you.

You want to challenge the way people were thinking. I just thought that the explanation was a little bit of, a little bit odd from Bill Barnwell of ESPN. So he was going through the entire league and I think he picked a best move and then a worse move. So you have to pick a best move and worse move.

And for a Colts team that didn't make a ton of really big splashes this year, it's pretty much either you didn't like the Pierce deal, which I think everybody liked for the most part, even if some people felt like it was a slight overpay, or you didn't like the Jones deal. I think it's easier to not like the Jones deal because I think there's a lot

more unknown with Daniel Jones and there is with Alec Pierce, who to me is already a proven commodity. He's just going to keep going like this. But I'll keep it brief here, Zach, when you talk about what he said about Jones. So he said guaranteeing Daniel Jones nearly 50 million for 2026, he said was the worst move of the offseason. And he points to this, was anybody really going to pay 37.8 million or more to trigger the transition tag and force the Colts into a difficult decision?

Yes. If that was a real concern, why did the Colts give? why didn't the Colts give Jones the $43.9 million franchise tag? This kind of probably falls under if you're local and you understand what's totally going on. It's hard for the national guys to know anything. That would have created an untenable situation for the Colts cap-wise if he played under either of those tags this year. So I think part of the reason they had to guarantee him so much money is because they needed to add the second year, right, to just kind of space out everything for him and make it so they had some flexibility this offseason.

Yeah, so they could add void years at the end. They added a bunch of void years at the end to spread out the cap hit. Now this does impact, you know, now it impacts 2028, 2029, 2030 a little bit. You know, there are parts of the contract that stretch out that way, but it makes it way more feasible this year. It's why they were able to sign Alec Pierce back. They wouldn't have got Alec Pierce back if they didn't extend Daniel Jones. And look, I understand the criticism. I mean, yeah, if you want to look at the Daniel Jones contract and say like, hey, giving

that kind of money to a guy who he's what played a year and a half of good football in his career at this point, right? And since he was a first round pick, that year that they went to the the year they went to the playoffs with the Giants and then last year as well were pretty much the only good years of his entire career at this point, maybe a little bit in his rookie season, had some good moments. So I understand being skeptical about the contract, but for how it is for teams in the NFL, where look, a quarterback is going to get paid. Like a quarterback who just played decent football is going to get paid a lot of money, right? To only be on the hook for two years of him with that, with all of his known concerns,

like Jones really could have played this differently and said, I need at least four years, right? Because who knows what the future holds for him, right? He could have wanted that security with a place where he felt comfortable, right? He had all the leverage there because if the Colts didn't get Jones, where were they going at quarterback? Tyler Murray? I mean, sure. I guess, but then you're right back in the same boat after the year. Imagine him with Stichen, too.

I mean, talk about a non-starter. Right, right. Stuyckin would, yeah, that's not the quarterback for him at all. So, yeah, it just, I think that the Colts played this as well as they possibly could have. You could say that they got taken to the woodshed to a degree, right? Because you were going to have to give him a lot of money. But Jones played well. Last year was the best quarterback play they had gotten since Philip Rivers in 2020.

And you could argue the best quarterback play they had gotten since Andrew Luck in 2018. It was a very good quarterback play to start last season against a couple tough defenses. It wasn't all cakewalks. Or as Alan says, there's no cakewalks in the NFL, right? They're all NFL teams. So, yeah, I think that it made sense to give the deal. And I was, I mean, Jake and I did a reaction the second they signed it. I was pumped that it was only a two-year contract, right?

Because if Jones exceeds on these two years, you're happy to give him like six more years on top of whatever. If he shows that he can do it for two more years, you give him whatever he wants, right? Because that's a quarterback. If he doesn't show it, then you can get out of it after two years. Like, yeah, you have to deal with some of the void years afterwards, but most teams are dealing with void years, right? The Colts have actually been really clean historically on the books to where that's probably going to be their only like void year commitments on there.

Maybe a couple here and there, but they don't have nearly as much as like the Eagles. We have to keep pushing everything 20 years down the line to get capped compliance. So I thought they handled it as well as possible. I thought the easy contract to pick, like I know it's not as sexy for a headline, but the easy contract to pick is just the Michael Clemens contract. Right. Like he was.

No one would have given Clemens that money. He was a bad football player last year, right? Like, and I know that there's with the, the way the contract is structured essentially like a one year, six and a half million dollar contract, right? So they can get out of it after the year. But even then for how Clemens played last year, like a one year six and a half million dollar contract is not very good. Like it's better than what they gave Taekuan.

Lewis last year, but like, it's not a very good contract. So I thought that was the easy one that you could have picked there for your article. But, you know, like you said, Derek, when, when you write these kind of articles as a national guy, you have to pick one of the big ones. You can't, you can't just say like, oh, this contract to get Michael Clemens is, is the rough one. You know, like, you have to pick one of the two big ones. And obviously, the, the easier one is, is the Daniel Jones contract. So I understand where he's coming from. I understand the concerns with it, right? The Achilles injury. You guys know how I feel about Achilles injuries. I'm terrified of them. So there's a lot of questions, but at the end of the day, they needed a quarterback.

And there wasn't really another option, especially when you just had recent evidence of this guy playing well on your offense. So they were kind of stuck paying it. And to only be on the hook for two years of it, I mean, two years of the big time money on that contract, I thought they played it as well as you possibly could. We'll see how it goes. We'll see exactly how it goes, but I think it's the best possible way the Colts could have played it. They're going to be a tough place if it doesn't work out regardless, but it could have been a much tougher place than where they put themselves with this contract. So I think Mike Bloom and Chris Ballard actually did a really good job negotiating this contract.

Yeah, so they were never going to have him play on the tag. This offseason, part of the mission was to expand their resources. That's why you see them get off of the Michael Pitman deal. Zaire Franklin. I mean, Kenny Moore was later down the road, but like they were trying to create cap space. They made just enough for Trey Hendrickson, too. They restructured.

They restructured Ryman. Like they were set out to create cap space. If you do a tag, that's a guaranteed $37 million, 43 million, like you're not doing that. That's insane. That's part of it. Zach also mentioned,

without securing Daniel Jones, you don't get Alec Pierce. How many times, as Alex said by now, I had to treat the Colts as if they had no quarterback until they secured Daniel Jones. So your two most important check marks would have gone out the window potentially had you not secured them. That would have been crazy. And then the last big thing for me is everyone's going down with the ship in this last, in this last ditch effort to save things. You're not, you know, you're giving Shane Steichen and Chris Ballard one more go at it. You're not letting them start something new here. Like, you're going with the quarterback who, you know, for the first half of the year, was legitimately in the MVP race until things got derailed until the Colts belief, the Colts really

do believe injuries screwed their season, which. to a degree you can say, yeah, you don't want to make excuses, but yes, the season probably looks a little different without injuries. You're like, there's no time for them to start a new rebuild. And if you're getting rid of your quarterback, which we then say means you're starting over at receiver two, that's a rebuild at this point. It's too close to a rebuild. And you're not giving Shane Stuyken and Chris Ballard that sort of leeway once again. And for a quarterback, to play decent football, again, to be in the MVP race for a chunk of the season, you just pay what you pay. Like, you have to have a quarterback. That's why you've seen guys like Jared Gough get paid enormous money.

You've seen a bunch of just kind of dudes get huge money because that's what quarterbacks cost. If you're going to get a guy who's a no doubt starter, you're going to pay out the nose for him. So, like, I get it because it's poppy and no one wants to give to him. Daniel Jones $50 million, blah, blah, blah. But where would the Colts be without that? Kyler Murray was not going to happen. I don't even remember the other quarter. Like, Justin Fields wasn't going to happen.

Like, you had to do it. It's like the Daniel Jones discourse is a little wild. The worst part of it is if you just want to hang everything on the Achilles, because I get that. But good Lord, there's so much detail that goes into it. Like, they were never not going to do it. And they had to. like of course they needed to do this so I don't know it's a mourn out I'm worn out with the Daniel Jones discourse I could tell yeah yeah well I think Barnwell may have been making that

comment based on the body of work he saw with Daniel Jones from the Giants and he mentioned that in here too Alan yeah so yeah yeah but when you watched him the first seven games or the first half of the season, if you watched him, there wasn't a national pundit who did not have him in the running for the MVP of the league. You know, like he found his spots, shorter like Sam Darnel found his spot. Did the Colts overpay a little bit? Probably. But just like you guys say, quarterbacks are the ones that get the big two.

checks. Did, you know, how do I say it? Could he have gone for more years? Yeah, but I think two things happened there. I think the two-year contract is good for Daniel Jones because it's his way of saying, okay, I might struggle a little bit this year, but if I get a third year in this offense, y'all going to have to pay me a hundred million a year. So he's banking on himself. I mean, to me, that's a motivating type contract, much better than a one-year contract. And I think for Chris Ballard doing a two-year contract is his way of saying, look, we trust you.

We have faith in you. And that's why we're doing two years. And if for some reason you blow it up after two years, we're more than happy to give you a hundred million a year. So I think it was strategic getting what he was going to get. Was he going to get that from somebody else? I doubt it. But the Colts really had no choice.

It's just the nature of paying quarterbacks. Like you have to pay them. Like it's just like it's rare to get a case where. you're like Daniel Jones you got for $14 million last off season, right? There's a reason why Daniel Jones only signed a one-year contract because he knew all I need is a couple good games and he could get all the way up to 40-something million. It's the nature of the position. So I think when you factor in the nature of the position, the fact that this is how they

were able to also get Alec Pierce back and the fact that they had no other options at quarterback, I thought they made out pretty well. And you guys know, like going into last year, I was not a Daniel Jones fan at all. And I'm still skeptical going forward. but this is the best case scenario they could have come up with. We'll see if it works out this next season. Again, if I had to do a prediction, I think they're going to win eight to nine games like we always guess.

I had them at 11 and 6. Yeah, Alan has them at 11 and 6 on the optimistic side. I'm in the doomer type side, I guess, like the eight to nine wins like we always are. But like, this is still the best way they could have played it this off season. So we'll see what happens going on. But like I think the decision making was good from the Colts this off season. I like Jake's line about paying quarterback. Should you pay what you pay?

That's what my wife says when we're planning vacations. And I'm going over the thing. We're just going to pay what we pay. Thanks much for joining us here on the latest edition of the Colts Squad show. We'll be back with you Tuesday, 930 Eastern after the holiday weekend. As always, the Colts news cycle never ends. So keep it locked on Jake and Zach every day on Locked on Colts. Be sure to follow at Lockdown Colts on socials and check out our other great content on YouTube and TikTok.

Have a safe and restful and reflective Memorial Day weekend. and we'll see you next time right here on the squad show.