Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - Indianapolis Colts' Isaiah Rodgers or Brandon Facyson: Who Starts Outside at Cornerback?

Episode Date: July 11, 2022

The Indianapolis Colts have a competition brewing at outside cornerback: Isaiah Rodgers or Brandon Facyson? We know Stephon Gilmore and Kenny Moore II have the top two spots locked up, but will it be the former sixth-round pick or the newly-signed veteran that claims the third corner spot?Jake and Zach also look at the competition at strong safety between Nick Cross and Rodney McLeod as well as the fifth cornerback spot between Tony Brown, Anthony Chesley, Marvell Tell, and Rodney Thomas.Find and follow Locked On Colts on your favorite podcast platforms:📺YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLdpxJspi1hMh5HL7ExpWOQ🎧 Apple https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/id1151621306🎧 Spotify https://open.spotify.com/show/6meP450baAtjX4rTENZ5ij🎧 Audacy https://www.audacy.com/podcasts/locked-on-colts-daily-podcast-on-the-indianapolis-colts-21701🎧 Google https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vUFBZODk1ODUyODkyNQ🎧 Megaphone https://cms.megaphone.fm/channel/lockedoncoltsFollow Jake and Zach's written work on HorseshoeHuddle.com, and give them a follow on Twitter @JakeArthurNFL, @ZachHicks2, and @LockedOnColts!Today's episode is brought to you by BetOnline. BetOnline has you covered this season with more props, odds and lines than ever before. BetOnline – Where The Game Starts!Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!DaveDownload the Dave app from the App store right now for an Extra Cash account and get up to 500 dollars instantly. For terms and conditions go to dave.com/legal. Instant transfer fees apply. Banking provided by Evolve. Member FDIC.Built BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKED15,” and you’ll get 15% off your next order.BetOnlineBetOnline.net has you covered this season with more props, odds and lines than ever before. BetOnline – Where The Game Starts!Rock AutoAmazing selection. Reliably low prices. All the parts your car will ever need. Visit RockAuto.com and tell them Locked On sent you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Colts paid special attention to their secondary this offseason, adding veteran competition to an already talented group who will rise to the top of these position groups this year in 2022. This and much more on today's edition of Locked on Colts. Let's get it. You are Locked on Colts, your daily Indianapolis Colts podcast, part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. All right, Colts fans, thanks so much for tuning in

and making us your number one listen of the day. This is your daily podcast covering your Indianapolis Colts, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Today's episode is brought to you by BetOnline. BetOnline has you covered this season with more props, odds, and lines than ever before. BetOnline, you covered this season with more props, odds, and lines than ever before. BetOnline, where the game starts. This is Jake Arthur, of course, joined as always by my partner, Zach Hicks. Today, Zach and I will sift through some of the main player competitions in the Colts

defensive secondary, and we're going to tell you who we think is going to win out or at least have the more significant role in those situations by season's end. This will cover cornerback three, cornerback five, and strong safety. That probably sounds more detailed than you think, but they're real competition. So let's go ahead and get into that. So the first one that we're looking at is the Colts' first free agent move, outside free agent move of the offseason, Brandon Faison. They brought him in from the Raiders. He, of course, is familiar with Gus Bradley,

Ron Miles in that system. He is going to be going at it with Isaiah Rogers, third-year Colts, sixth-rounder, I believe. Of course, the Colts drafted him mainly as a kickoff return specialist. And then their hope was that, you know, kind of the fire that he brought on tape at UMass defensively would would pop with the Colts. And it did in practice. And it seemed like every little bit of playing time they gave him on the field, he lived up to it. He had a few picks last year. One of probably the most notable was against Tom Brady. Just pretty much ran the receivers deeper out for him, picked it off. And that's that's definitely one that he's going to have put up in a trophy case at his house, I'm sure. And I know you are very passionate about both of these players in this competition in particular, Zach.

So why don't you go ahead and tell us what you think? Yeah, no, I really am interested in this competition in particular because I think there's no wrong choice here, even though both choices are kind of flawed. Isaiah Rogers is not a bona fide starter yet, I don't think. We saw some things last year where there were some concerns. He got beat a couple of times late in the season. He had some issues at the catch point at times, you know, knocking the ball free of receivers when they got their hands on it. So, you know, it's not a sure thing that he's a starting outside corner. And the same goes for Brandon Faison. I mean, Brandon Faison has been in the league for, I think, four years now.

He really didn't see time on defense until this past season with the Raiders. And that was mostly in reserve role, you know, filling in for injuries. And when he got out there, you know, he showed some good things, some really good things that look like a good starting corner. But he also had some flaws, you know, got beat on some double moves.

He got beat down the field, wasn't the most physical guy for his size. So, you know, both these guys are flawed, but they're both super interesting players. And I don't think there's really a wrong choice here. Obviously, we want to see Isaiah Rogers be the guy that takes over you know the younger player the guy with more upside with his speed and as athleticism and the guy who showed you know he can he can make plays on the ball you know he had three picks last season all three of them were highlight real plays uh there

was one against the bills too that he dropped which would have been another highlight real play he had an outstanding season last year in reserve. And I think obviously we all want him to be that second outside corner. But I think either way that the Colts go here, if they go with the veteran and Brandon Faison, I think it's a good choice. And they go with Isaiah Rogers, I think it's a good choice because you're betting on that youth. And then if you go kind of a mixture of the two,

I think it'd be good as well. So I'm just excited to see what happens in camp and see who kind of pulls ahead before the season starts. Yeah, for sure. So fans, of course, this is with the assumption from Zach and I that Stephon Gilmore and Kenny Moore will be the starting outside corners in base defense. And then in the nickel or just other sub packages where you have three or more corners, of course kenny will go inside and then this is pretty much the rock you sent roll uh from last year of course rock was sent to las vegas so you'll have stefan outside i miss rock right i know you do that was your guy he was so good last year he was so good but honestly again i'm excited about face on i'm excited about gilmore

i'm excited about uh is Isaiah Rogers, but it does hurt losing rock. I mean, rock rock was outstanding last year. Yeah, he's he's really an unsung hero. And of course, if you're listening to this, you're more than likely a Colts fan. You know how polarizing he was. You know, his his lows were low because of some penalties. But he was one of those corners where he didn't have like eye popping or gaudy interception stats so a lot of times people don't understand if you're not calling a cornerback's name that probably means they're doing a really good job and that that was rock for probably at least half of the time he was here in indy um he did a really nice job he took some some guys away

physical corner it's panning out and of course last year i think was his third year you know that that's when it really blooms for these guys you know think tim jennings when he was with the colts back in this super bowl era and then went to the bears and was an all-pro now wait now we got isaiah rogers going into his third year though it's gonna be big it's gonna be be big. There we go. There we go. But no, I like this competition. There's a lot to like about phase on, you know, he's like six to right around 200 pounds, a lengthy guy. He can, he can cover plenty. He's not as fast as Rogers is.

Rogers is kind of, he's a lightning in the bottle guy too, kind of like Kenny Moore. He's a big play guy, of course. My stance on this is, you know, if the competition through camp is a wash and they're both even, they're both giving you a lot to like, then go with the guy who you drafted in the sixth round and have developed. You know, give him those plays,

because he's probably the bigger playmaker as well. Right. Right. So if it's all even in the end, I definitely would lean more towards Isaiah Rogers. Of course the guys have to earn it. This is with the assumption that they'll do, they'll both do well enough in camp to earn the spot, but if it's all even, give me Rogers. Yeah. You know,

it's interesting with Isaiah Rogers because I remember watching his rookie season and, you know, you kind of watch a rookie season of a six round corner who only played, I think, 50 snaps on defense. You're kind of watching it like, all right, let's just see if he's a capable guy who could maybe be like a fifth corner or something like that. You know, again, this is a special teams guy who is supposed to be a kick returner, maybe a gunner if things all went well. And I remember watching some of his clips from his rookie season. And then I actually talked with him after the season. I was like, look, like the stuff on this film is really good. Like again, five, eight, like one 70 he's tiny, he's tiny, but the movement scale. Like you don't see that in many guys at all. And again,

being a small guy does help a little bit. But I mean, remember the Ravens game last year, he got that ball in the open field and he outran angles lamarx and then devon duvernay like they were nothing and those are two four three guys you know like that play was so frustrating it was it was but the way that he the way he pulled away from angles from two of the fastest guys in football like they were just nothing tells you all you need to know about that kind of speed and you can see in the way he transitions how quick he is in and out of his breaks uh and then when you when you factor in the ball skills i mean that pick against the buccaneers like you mentioned uh it wasn't just you know like a super athletic play

but the ball tracking was like a receiver you know down the field he looked like a receiver the way he tracked the ball over his shoulder, got his feet down in bounds. I mean, it was an outstanding play. Against the Raiders, he outjumped Deshaun Jackson for an interception. Yeah, I mean, the play against the Texans where he got his pick, he was in a short cover two zone, pressed the receiver, the receiver got outside, and then he dove across his body

and made an interception. I mean, he's made a lot of outstanding plays in his short NFL career. And when you factor in the playmaking and the athleticism and his age and the fact that him, unlike Faison, is going to be here next year for sure. Like Faison couldn't sign back. Isaiah Rogers is still under team control next year. So I think it makes sense that if it's close, like you said, you have to give it to Isaiah Rogers.

Yeah, and he's not just a gamer either. Like he's not the type of guy that he doesn't really flash in practice either. Of course, fans, you don't get the benefit of watching practice. Some training camp ones, of course, but he does this stuff all the time. Like last year in training camp, he had several interceptions or big plays. It's not rare for him to be making big plays. So he's almost like a Darius Leonard where you can kind of live with some of the lows or missed plays, whatever, because of his big playmaking ability.

Yeah, and the Colts defense is littered with that. I mean, we're talking Darius Leonard, Kenny Moore, and now Isaiah Rogers. Yeah, I think when you have a guy like Gilmore on one side who's going to lock it down, you want to have playmakers all around that. So, yeah, I agree. Isaiah Rogers, if all things goes well, should be the second outside corner this year. But coming up, Jake and I are going to dive into the battle

for what might be the final quarterback spot on the Colts roster between some superstar players like Tony Brown, Anthony Chesley, Marvell Teller, and Rodney Thomas. Before that, let's talk about some bets. BetOnline.net is your number one source for all your betting needs and sports info. Find all your latest sporting developments, league reviews, and news, including this year's NHL playoffs and Major League Baseball. BetOnline is your continued source for all your betting wagering information,

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you want to talk about first jake who do you want which one's your guy of this group? Gosh. So I think I'm pulling hardest for Rodney Thomas just because I want to see what's there. That's a dude that's played linebacker and safety at Yale. And they you know, he's he's kind of a high weight speed guy. Real really good athleticism. So they want to try him out at corner see how it goes Tony Brown I think is a safe corner five uh really good special or you know quality special teams player uh you could do much worse Anthony Chesley I think that's someone they're kind of wanting to see what they got developed there a little bit I think he got a little playing time last year it wasn't great but he got it um marvell tell was someone i was real passionate about after his rookie year and then he of course was a covet opt out in 2020 and then last summer

i was just completely underwhelmed and camp i mean unfortunately obviously they cut him yeah but so they let him go during camp cuts but but then they brought him back. So they obviously want to they know what he can do. Then they were probably taken back by last summer, too. So, yeah, I don't know. I really like to see if Rodney Thomas can offer something, but I'm very OK if Tony Brown is your corner five. Yeah, I think Tony Brown's probably my guy for it. You know, you got some of that veteran experience you have a guy who comes out of i think he played at alabama in college which you know alabama you

play under nick saban you're going to be a corner who at least knows your stuff uh and and it also translates really well to a gus bradley scheme i mean saban is famous for a lot of his you know his man match stuff that he runs at alabama lot of his cover three stuff that he does down there. And that's kind of a lot of what Gus Bradley is doing, especially with the man match stuff in recent years. So I think Tony Brown makes a lot of sense for being that fifth corner. But like you said, I think Rodney Thomas is the best case scenario. Kind of what Marvell Tell was going into that 2019 season, you know, safety converted over to corner. Kind of see what he can do see if he can bring

that physical that physicality uh off the edge and also you know on as a gunner on on punt teams and stuff like that that's going to be big uh so i want rodney thomas to take it but i think it's going to be tony brow but also don't sleep on anthony chesley i like anthony chesley you know he i think he played i think he played like a total 10 defensive snaps last year and had like two pass breakups like technically a corner pro football focus he's the best coverage corner the Colts had last year by far and away far and away I mean I mean remember that mess of a Ravens game I know I keep bringing back this Ravens game but that mess of a Ravens game you know that was the game I'm thinking of where they were down to. Yeah, they had no corners left, it seems.

Yes, but he was the only one out there of all those backup corners who got a pass break up and didn't allow a reception. The other guys, the other guys, on the other hand, who was it? Bo Peet Keyes, I think, who allowed the touchdown on the double move. You know, I'll give Chesley props. I think Bo Peet Keyes, his performance is what I was thinking of Chesley. Yeah, that was not Chesley. Chesley was good. Apologies.

It was Keyes. Yes, Anthony Chesley I like a lot. Marvell Tell, I know I'm probably sleeping on at this point. It's just – it's kind of what I was saying about Des Patman on one of our other episodes is, you know, you can keep squeaking on rosters and getting some playing time, but when you're a day three pick, eventually you got to start doing something or, or, you know,

other day three picks like a Rodney Thomas will take your spot. So it's going to be interesting. This is obviously it's a make or break season for a guy who didn't even make the roster last year. Yeah. His, his coverage isn't terrible. And of course he is, his spider chart before the draft was, was huge. You know, there, there's nothing not to love about his blend of, of size and athleticism, but it just felt like he didn't pop.

He was just a guy in summer last year. Yeah. If he was aggressive and made plays on the ball like we see with Rodgers or Faison has done this spring, and you match that with his decent coverage skills and things like that, I think it gives you a lot more to work with. You can feel more comfortable if he's got to go out there. Right, right.

Yeah, the very long-aw awaited cornerback five debate. I think we fall in love with the corner fives though. That's our thing. You know, it was Marvell Tell in 2019. Last year, I think Isaiah Rogers went into the season as cornerback five. You know, it's, it's a thing for me to fall in love with some bottom of the roster guys. You know, my, my love already goes to Curtis Brooks so far this year, you know, it's all right. We found Curtis Brooks so far this year, you know, we found a way to get them in. I did. I did. Yeah.

I don't know if I have much more room in my heart for other players outside of Curtis Brooks this year, but if I did, you know, I'd probably take a corner five or something like that. You know, I'll find a way. Yeah. I can't wait to see who's going to be my darling of training camp. It'll probably be Eric Johnson, just someone out of nowhere. I'm not. It'll be Eric Johnson just to spite me. It'll be completely out of spite to rival my love for Curtis Brooks.

I'm going to pull for Rodney Thomas because I think we'll probably see him at safety at some point too. Because if you think Julian Blackman, if he starts on PUP or something in camp, you'll probably see more guys mixing it in at safety like they did last year because there's always a starting safety injured every summer to start camp. Can we just get that? I mean, I'm not saying I want this guy to get hurt, but let's just devote that to – like, Kyrie Willis can take that with him on his way out.

But I think when it comes to this cornerback five thing, the biggest thing by far and away is going to be special teams. It's always special teams. Tony Brown has a leg up. Tony Brown has the leg up, but Ronnie Thomas with his height, weight, speed, he could be a guy like a George Odom where he comes in, takes that job early

and runs with it. Ronnie Thomas, I wouldn't count out, but I do think it's going to be Tony's Brown, Tony Brown job, Tony Brown's job to lose. There you go. On video, you guys can laugh at me for that, but Tony Brown's job to lose, you know, not for nothing, but I think Tony Brown was like the top corner in the nation when he committed to Alabama. So there's something there. I mean, if you're going to Alabama, you probably are the top corner in the nation. Yeah. Most likely,

most likely. So yes, cornerback five. Again, we had, we had to do it to him. That is, that's not what the past.

Yeah. I've seen, I've seen too much of the Jenna Marvels and Julian podcast. I have to, gosh, you're old, man. You're old. I know I'm old. All right. You don't have to tell me that. Anyways, so we're going to move on from talking about our friends in the secondary, and we're going to move on to talk about our friends over at Rock Auto. This episode is brought to you also by Rock Auto. With the

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But he really likes them. You have a middleman. It's a rock auto is what you have. Exactly. I'm like, hey, hey man i'll pay you more for you to do all this yeah you're this is now in your your camp now we're going to talk about some guys that are fastest cars and hit like them as well oh gosh yes at least one of them yeah it's arguably the the sexiest battle in secondary, and that's for strong safety for the honor to play next to Julian Blackman.

That is between the veteran Rodney McLeod and the rookie Nick Cross. Lots to like about both these guys. Nick Cross, third round, the Colts were shocked he was still there, so they traded up to get him. Only like the third time, I think chris ballard has traded up for a player in the draft the others being carrie willis and jonathan taylor so if that tells you anything they they were really smitten with him um they they they they were willing to give up what they gave up because they said you know next year he'd probably be going in the second round so just go ahead and do it uh rodney McLeod can play

in a couple spots. He's a bit more of a free safety, but that was a really sneaky grab for them and free agency that a lot of people really liked. What do you think about this matchup here? You know, I don't really think it's much of a camp competition. I think it's more of like the veteran's going to hold the place for a little bit just until the rookie is ready. And I think Rodney McLeod kind of knows that, you know, Rodney McLeod came here with probably with the expectation where, you know, he'll be able to play a lot of snaps and he will get out there. You know, Gus Bradley does deploy a lot of three safety sets, a lot of sets where, you know, they'll have a safety in the slot and then two

safeties over top. And that's where you're going to want a guy like Rodney McLeod out there. But he's not really your prototypical strong safety. He's a good tackler, not the greatest. He's good around the box, but again, not the greatest. He's more of your traditional, you know, single high guy in a cover three, which is going to be around what Julian Blackman's doing. So I think him and Julian Blackman are both going to get a lot of snaps back there. Nick Cross is the guy that you want around the line of scrimmage. You want him in the box. You want him blitzing. You want him feeling it feeling against the run.

You want him over slot receivers. I think he's just perfect for that role. And that's why the Colts spent that draft pick on him. They always envisioned him being that long-term strong safety and long-term Jamal Adams, like safety in this defense. And now they have that guy. And I just think that car Willis retirement kind of fast tracks their process for when they're going to get them out there. It might not be week one or week two or week three, but I do think it's going to be really early in the season that he's going to be the starter at that strong safety job.

Yeah, I agree. I think it was Mike DeRice was the area scout that kind of oversaw drafting Cross. And he said that Cross is a lot farther along than people think because he's kind of young as a player. He only got like a year or so of starting experience. I think he's only 21 as well. Yeah, he's a young guy who hasn't started a ton yet, but they think he's already a pretty well-rounded player. He'll be able to hit the field sooner than a lot of people thought before the draft. But no, I'm really – I think his skill set goes with Blackman very well.

I'm really excited to see that because think of how many times, like especially this last year before he got hurt, Blackman just coming up and you know he he's he can do plenty you know in the back half of the field but he's just got he's got that that kind of screw loose that a lot of safeties a lot of the good safeties do where they just have no fear of flying up and taking out even a guy like derrick. I felt that Julian Blackman, for example, like put it on his shoulders to do work against Henry. And he looked really well doing it. And I think cross is kind of cut from that same exact cloth.

Like you said, he can cover guys out of the slot. He's got the range and athleticism to cover back there. So there's just not much not to like. We've talked about this before, how McLeod is just kind of the vast upgrade over Andrew Sandejo this year. He's not supposed to be the starter, but he's going to get some snaps, and he's just going to be a quality guy who can play free or strong. You're the vast upgrade over Andrew Sandejo.

Maybe in my younger years, but now I am fat and 32 years old. We had low expectations for Sandejo, but he still was worse than those expectations. At least you would meet your expectations. You can't say the dude didn't hit hard as heck, though. I think the one hit I remember was the helmet-to-hel helmet on Tom Brady at the goal line for like no reason. Like it was the one time Tom Brady didn't get a call. It was so weird. I was just talking about guys with screws loose.

So that's true. That's true. Had to draw a direct line right there. But one more thing I want to say about about Nick Ross is, you know, so many people in the pre draft world were saying, oh, look at this guy's speed. He's a free safety. He's a center fielder guy. Honestly, for me watching his film, I didn't see the instincts as a free, as a center field free safety. You know, you kind of have to be a guy like Julian Blackman where you can kind of see the routes happening before they are, where I think Nick Cross was very good. Don't get me wrong. Like when he ID'd a play, he was there because that speed is insane.

But when you take a guy like him, who's a 4'3 guy, who's almost 220 pounds, I think he's like 215, 216, and you put him around the line of scrimmage, you just let him roam and you let him fill against the run, you just kind of unleash him. I think that's a much better role for a guy like him where, again, I think there's going to be more struggles if you try to put him at free safety. And because the Colts have Julian Black, but because they have Ronnie McLeod, he's not going to be back there very much. He's like the supercharged Jonathan Abram last year that the Raiders had.

And last year with the Raiders was Abram's best year in the NFL. He wasn't outstanding, but it was his best year by far and away. You get the supercharged version of that with Nick Cross. You're going to have more mistakes than maybe what a Carty Willis had last season because Carty Willis just never missed a tackle. Carty Willis had the best tackling form in the NFL, and his IQ was off the charts. But you're getting a much faster, more aggressive, a guy who's going to fly down the box. And yeah, there's going to be some more mistakes, but I think the net return that you're going to get long term

with Nick Cross at strong safety is going to be really high. Yeah, there are some guys who just – they really excel at keeping things in front of them. And if you look at him – if you look at it as he's just basically like a deep linebacker, that's perfectly fine. You know, you can't really be mad at that. Yeah, that's – so I think I agree with you. He's probably not going to start right away.

McLeod is a placeholder. You've compared it to the Clayton Gathers, Kari Willis situation before from, what was it, 2018, 19? 2019, yeah. 2019, yeah. I think that's exactly what it is. I think we'll see him mixed in plenty in training camp, but they'll probably throw McLeod out there to start.

There's no reason not to. I mean, unless Cross is just jumping off the charts in camp, there's no reason really to do that. Yep. So, yeah, I think that is about it for us tonight, everybody. Locked on Colts will be back with you on Wednesday. This week we'll look at more positional battles. There's not many more left. The Colts kind of have with you on Wednesday. This week, we'll look at more positional battles. There's not many more left.

The Colts kind of have a nice little roster right now. But we'll also discuss who the Colts' most underrated player is. If you hadn't yet checked out On Horseshoe Huddle, the piece on Grover Stewart being declared the Colts' most underrated player. We're also a couple weeks away from training camp. So we'll of course hit a fever pitch on that soon as well. And be sure guys to join us on social media at Zach Hicks to make sure you follow me, everyone else, you know, it's not as big a deal.

If you follow them, follow Jake, you know, at Jake Arthur NFL, if you guys are on YouTube, you can see that you can follow the lockdown Colts podcast on Twitter at lockdown Colts. I think you've got our Facebook page up running too, right, Jake? If that's where- Yeah, a little bit. I've gotten some stuff. It's got stuff going on it now. Guys, jump on that Facebook page. We need to make our page the biggest page on all of Facebook. I know we can do it. And then over our YouTube channel, you guys have been great at growing this YouTube channel. I think we started off this past week at 24 subs. I think we're up to one 50 now around one 50.

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insiders keeping you guys dialed in with the biggest stories and the latest news from around the league because an offseason doesn't equal a break in the action not one bit you guys have a great night and we'll see you again here in a couple days