Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - Indianapolis Colts: Jelani Woods to Bounce Back, Mo Alie-Cox On the Way Out?

Starting point is 00:00:00 For the second consecutive offseason, the Colts tight ends are an incredibly intriguing group, but it's actually going to materialize this time around. Let's get to it. You are Locked On Colts, your daily Indianapolis Colts podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. What is up? Thanks for tuning in and making us your first listen of the day. This is your daily podcast covering your Indianapolis Colts. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:39 And today's show is brought to you by GameTime. Download the GameTime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off of your first purchase. Terms apply. What's happening, y'all? This is Jake Arthur and Zach Hicks of HorseshoeHuddle.com. And today we continue our series looking at each position group on the Colts. And today we talk about a really, really interesting group, and that's the Titans. We had the same conversation last year about how high the potential was and how it might even be the deepest group on the roster. And then everyone got hurt or there was just

Starting point is 00:01:11 circumstances to derail the whole thing. And so we are running it back this year. I think, again, this is a very intriguing group with a ton of upside. So we're going to talk about who we think the starters probably ought to be to begin the season Those next few guys that are up And then how we think this is all going to shake out and kind of go over some different scenarios You know, training camp is going to determine a lot of this And hopefully, fingers crossed, everybody stays healthy enough to see this all come to fruition So Zach, we're going to start out first with Jelani Woods and Kylan Granson. Granson is the guy that he kind of does a little bit of everything for the Colts right now.

Starting point is 00:01:51 Good enough at a lot of different things to be able to stay on the field quite a bit. And his 496 offensive snaps last year led all of their tight ends. That was 43.2% of the offensive snaps last year. Jelani Woods is obviously, they're not projecting to be Travis Kelsey or any big time guy. But if you want a stud tight end who is your playmaker tight end, you got to look at Jelani Woods first and foremost. So had a nice semi flashy rookie year back in 2022. But he had some really just freak hamstring injuries that caused him to miss the entirety of last year, really dating back to this time last year, because he started getting banged up in OTAs, was able to be there for like a couple practices in training camp, and then everything

Starting point is 00:02:39 just went off the rails again. So Shane Steichen is still, Steichen and his whole staff are still fresh in their evaluation of him. They're really getting eyes on him for the first time right now, like he's a rookie. So we're seeing this big, you know, six, seven, 260 pound freak. And it's probably pretty cool to see. I know Shane Steichen talked a bit about it

Starting point is 00:02:59 the other day when we were there. But I'd have to say Woods and Granson are who you hope to come out on top in training camp. Is that what you would agree with? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think it's easy to project Granson to be in like that starter or like pseudo starter type of role, like in two tight end sets, because he's the guy, like you said, you can do the most with. Now he's not a great blocker. Like I'm not going to sit here and say he's some even average blocker. That would be me just being hyperbolic here saying that he's even an average blocker.

Starting point is 00:03:31 It's not the best blocker whatsoever. But the versatility he brings is you can put him out in the slot. You can put him out wide. You can have him backside in a three by one and have him by himself there. And he can be that separator in the passing game. He can be a guy who can line up at fullback and line up at the sniffer back and be, you know, doing like a lot of those things that you that you like to see in this offense in terms of the RPO game in terms of the trap blocks and the backside blocks. So he does a lot of things for this offense in terms of

Starting point is 00:04:02 just where he can align and how he can win from those different alignments. So like you said last year, that he had 43% of the snaps on the Colts offense. He had 30 of his 50, he caught 30 of his 50 targets for 368 yards and touchdown. I believe the 368 led the Colts tight end room last year as well. Most consistent passing target in this tight end room for the Colts. So it's easy to see him being that guy yet again in 2024. Like he's going to be the guy who gets on the field quite a bit. And he had great chemistry with Anthony Richardson. Like we really can't just throw that to the wayside.

Starting point is 00:04:36 I know it wasn't always perfect where they were connecting every single time that he was targeted. But, you know, Granson was certainly a guy that Richardson felt comfortable going to. So it makes sense for him to be one of two guys that we're looking forward to, you know, having that big role in offense. But Jelani Woods is the biggest wild card in this group, because we just don't know what we're getting out of him. I will say one thing about Woods is when you're really looking at, you know, this Colts tight end room, you're looking at guys like Mallory and, and Granson and Allie Cox and Ogletree, those guys all have kind of specific roles where like one can be a blocker, one's the veteran in the room, one's the possession guy, one's the yards

Starting point is 00:05:15 after catch guy. The one thing they don't have is, is a vertical threat. They don't have that guy who's a legitimate threat, you know, where if you're going to put them backside running a double mover or a chair router, you know, something kind of vertical and he's on a linebacker, which one of these guys is going to scare you and make that safety, you know, just book it to get over the top of these guys. I don't think any of those other guys do, but Jelani four sixes, you know, four fives, whatever it was at six, seven, uh, 255 pounds. Like this is a massive human being. You can go up and high point it, who can run with, with the best athletes in football. Uh, so he's the guy who actually is a threat in the receiving game and a threat to opposing defenses, especially in the vertical aspect of the game. So if what's can just be that guy,

Starting point is 00:06:01 if you can just be the vertical pass catcher, the guy who can get down field and consistently catch the ball, you know, 10, 15, 20 yards down the field, that's a great new element to this offense. And obviously he can be more than that. If he can be your starting tight end and be your, again, I don't want to say like your Kelsey's or anything like that, but just like an above average starter, that's a big plus for this offense. So, you know, I hope Jelani Woods can come back from that hamstring injury. I hope he can build on the flashes he showed as a rookie, but as of right now, he's a big wild card. Like he needs to bring that new dynamic to the offense to, to prove his worth. But I mean, look, at the end of the day,

Starting point is 00:06:35 you were hoping that he can be that guy for this offense. Yeah. And as we stand right now, again, it's OTAs. We're a couple of weeks out from the veteran mandatory mini camp. Everyone's available right now again it's otas we're a couple weeks out uh from the the veteran mandatory minicamp everyone's available right now uh you know we were just out there last week watching uh the first media available practice of of otas and woods made a couple nice plays a couple yak plays which like you just mentioned uh that's really great to see i think him and mallory you know they tested really well at the combine. You know, Mallory was the fastest in the 40 of all the tight ends last year, I believe.

Starting point is 00:07:10 And, you know, so those are your guys who can maybe take the top off. But to see it actually happening in practice is really good. I think Woods even made one like in traffic up the seam, like 20 yards upfield. Like it was really good to see those type of plays build confidence and things move smoother after that so that's really great to see Granson at this point you know you do have some guys on the team with a lot of upside like Ogletree and Mallory as well obviously Woods like we're talking about but Granson I think at this point is a guy who you know what he is. And I think that's good enough to be like one of your, your primary tight ends. Because again, of his utility, you can move them around a little bit. He's kind of, he's kind of turned into,

Starting point is 00:07:56 you know, he does make some big plays here and there, but he's mostly that chain moving tight in. And he's been the most reliable one for the last couple of years, dating back to each of the last couple of training camps. So again, that's a guy who maybe he's, he's not Will Mallory in terms of athleticism or playmaking. Ogletree has even made some big plays, but you know what you're getting.

Starting point is 00:08:19 He's reliable. And I think there's something to that. You know, you have your Woods out there, your projection, your, you know, super high ceiling guy that you have time to build up a little bit, but Granson is the guy you can try it out there right now.

Starting point is 00:08:34 Yeah, at the end of the day, Kylan Granson is your high level role player. He's probably never going to be more than that. You know, he serves that specific role for you. He plays that role well, and he's your, you know, your second best separator on the team as of right now. I mean, hopefully A.D. Mitchell can be that second best separator behind Josh Downs.

Starting point is 00:08:50 But as of right now, he's your second best separator. And then Jelani Woods, that's the guy you're banking on to be Shane Steichen's Hunter Henry, to be the Dallas Goddard, to be the Zach Ertz, whatever that top tight end is. You're banking on him being that guy. So for Granson, it's just stay the course. Be who you've been. Maybe, you know, a little bit better with the hands and be a little more consistent. But it's just stay the course with him.

Starting point is 00:09:13 With Woods, it's, okay, we need to take this next step. He needs to be a starter by the end of the season. Or what are we doing here? So it's a massive, massive season for Jelani Woods. And I'm hoping that he can get out there and show that he can be that tight end one for the team. Yeah, absolutely. That duo gets the stamp of approval from us or the stamp of hopefulness, I guess you could say. We're going to talk about a few other guys that kind of factor into this thing as well,

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Starting point is 00:12:15 Network, your team every day. All right, everydayers. All right, Zach, let's talk about some of the other guys that really circle into this thing here. So you got Mo Alleycox, who is just the de facto key ingredient to tight end at all times until someone unseats him. We thought it may not be much of a factor last year, but Jelani Woods goes down. Drew Ogletree was in and out of the lineup.

Starting point is 00:12:44 Essentially, during training camp last year, but Jelani Woods goes down. Drew Ogletree was in and out of the lineup. Essentially, during training camp last year, Kylan Granson was about the only guy who was there all the time. Otherwise, everybody else was there. So Mo Alleycox, being the veteran, easy to slide him in and be able to do whatever. So you got Mo Alleycox, Will Mallory, and Drew Ogletree are the big three behind the first two that we discussed. So Mo, he's since like 2018, 2019, he's been a big factor in the Colts offense. He's withstood the test of time through multiple head coaches now. You know, last year he had 434 snaps, which was just behind Granson. Took a dip in production, which I think tells you last year, among any year of his career, would have had a good excuse to have bigger numbers, especially with a quarterback

Starting point is 00:13:34 like Gardner Minshew, who's going to be a little quicker to the trigger, looking for stuff quicker to line a scrimmage. But just 13 receptions for 161 yards, three touchdowns though. And then Mallory, nice little rookie season. That was a guy who pretty much caught everything that was catchable to him. Out of 18 receptions, 11 of those went for first downs. And then Drew Ogletree, who played a little bit, he got banged up a lot. I know he had a concussion at one point. He had the suspension that took away the end of the year as well. Not a great catch percentage, just 9-21, but he did average 16 yards per catch

Starting point is 00:14:12 and 10 combined touchdowns and first downs, two touchdowns, eight first downs. So you got guys here who, number one, I'm looking at their yards per catch. Everybody, you know, the whole group is easily over 10. And of these three, the lowest is Mallory at 11 and a half. And he's probably the biggest play threat out of these three. So luckily, you know, you got a lot of guys to choose from. You don't know who's going to rise to the top. But these guys can make some plays happen downfield.

Starting point is 00:14:43 I don't know how Mo does it every year, but Mo is like a big play machine, even though he's not the most nimble guy that you're ever going to see. No, no. He's a, he's the Buffalo and the open field or whatever the nicknames had been in the Colts press box the last couple of years. But yeah, I think, you know, we're going to talk about in the last segment, but if, if this is another year of Morley Cox getting 37% of the snaps or over 30 or over 20% of the snaps or over 10% of the snaps,

Starting point is 00:15:12 or even over 0% of the snaps, then something's going wrong. And what are you trying to say here? Zach? Yes. I think those numbers keep decreasing. Look, Moelle Cox. I love Mo. I'm a Virginia guy. He went to VCU. I grew up watching him play basketball. It was great seeing him with the Colts these last couple years. But look, at the end of the day, if he's making the roster over any of these other guys, something went wrong. Something went wrong with Woods' recovery and his rehab. Mallory or Ogletree just didn't look good in camp. There's no reason for Mo to make this team in 2024.

Starting point is 00:15:43 I'm fine with him being on the roster right now. I know some people are saying cut him right now. Like it's perfectly fine having him for training camp and having that veteran presence. But at the end of the day, he's not the best blocker on the team anymore. That's Drew Ogletree. He's not the best receiver on the team.

Starting point is 00:15:57 I mean, he's probably the fifth best receiving option in this group right now. And he's not bringing you really much of anything that you don't have in these other four guys. So there's just really no reason for Mo to be on this team this season. Like, again, I love Mo, I love Mo to death, but it's just time to move on from him. The other two players I'm very intrigued by because Drew Ogletree,

Starting point is 00:16:18 I think for me is very Jack Doyle in a lot of ways where like, again, I know we say this about a lot of players. He's not as good as Jack Doyle by any lot of ways where like, again, I know we say this about a lot of players. He's not as good as Jack Doyle by any means, don't get me wrong, but he's Jack Doyle in a sense that he's very good on those wham blocks, very good on those, on those split zone run blocks and those backside blocks, uh, getting a lot better as an inline blocker as well, doing some good things there. And then when he's targeted, like, yeah, it's not Mr. Consistent like Doyle, but you see him make a lot of difficult catches over the middle, a lot of difficult catches in traffic,

Starting point is 00:16:47 had a really big part in that Colts comeback against the Los Angeles Rams in week four where Anthony Richardson was leading that comeback. Ogletree was the big-time target in that game. It was actually really the last time he actually saw, like, legit targets in a game all season last year. But, yeah, I mean, I think he brings a lot of that blocking element that just underneath stuff he can get down the field pretty well as well. So I think Ogletree can kind of supplant Mo as that blocking tight end

Starting point is 00:17:14 and get a lot of snaps that way. And then Will Mallory, I talked about him at length in yesterday's podcast, so I don't want to go too crazy here. But Will Mallory was up there with the elite tight ends in football last year in terms of yards per route run like he was up there with the Kelsey's and the Wallers and and you know the Mark Andrews and all that like I'm not saying that he's going to be that way if you give him more snaps like obviously that would come down with 300 400 snaps because he's not that type of guy but he was a very productive pass catcher. I charted him with 90% of a catchable ball rate last year. So 18 of the 20 balls that were within just his catch radius

Starting point is 00:17:52 he caught last year, he did a lot of great things when he was targeted. And I think that he just brings that possession tight end element to the team. He's very Zach Ertz in that way where, you know, he can get to that zone beater spot. He can just work his way open from that zone beater spot and he catches everything thrown his way. So I think if you go with the four tight ends, and again, we're going to talk about this here more in a second, but if you go with the four tight ends of Granson, Woods, Mallory and Ogletree, you have one guy who can do your, you know, your sniffer back, your, your, you know, fringe fullback type stuff in Granson.

Starting point is 00:18:29 You have your possession guy in Mallory who could just beat zone. You have your blocker and Ogletree and you have your vertical, hopefully tight end one in Jelani Woods. You have a guy for each role. I think that's the way you want to just, you know, work out this offense. Like each of those guys maybe are getting 30 to 40% snaps, like whatever it's going to be. If you do like more two tight end stuff this year, but you have a lot more versatility in that group where it's like, hey, we have four guys that are very role specific and can kind of do those roles to a very good level. So I think when you're looking at guys like Mallory and Ogletree, like, yeah, they're not perfect. They're not going to be super well-rounded, perfect players, but you have a really good possession guy in Mallory, you have a good blocker and a reliable player in Ogletree.

Starting point is 00:19:05 I think those are good things that you can bring to this team and be really good depth tight ends next year. Yeah, I think for me, Mallory is the real interesting one here because if you assume he's going to take, with health, a natural next step in his development, that's a pretty good player because as a pass catcher really reliable in a small sample size again only 159 snaps but caught 18 of 26 total targets you said you chart him with 90 of balls he should have caught i mean that's really reliable 11 first downs

Starting point is 00:19:37 again and under 200 snaps to have 11 first downs i think is is really nice. So I do think it's that thing you mentioned, the zone beater stuff. If him and Anthony develop enough of a rapport where Anthony knows, you know, Will's going to find this spot here. He's going to just sit right there. He'll find the spot in between the linebackers. I think that will be super, super important because like you mentioned with Granson at the top of the show with that comfort level, as much as things are schematic with making Anthony Richardson comfortable and everything, having guys out there who can get the job done and that Anthony feels super

Starting point is 00:20:16 comfortable with is going to be huge too. So we know injuries are going to happen. So as long as Mallory is not a part of it, if he gets enough snaps with Richardson during camp, I think he's going to sneakily find himself a pretty decent role here. And just like you mentioned, I keep finding myself with Mo as the odd man out because Ogletree, when we saw him in there, he was involved in blocking heavily and there's just no reason that he shouldn't supplant him there. And then you have those four very defined tight ends. We're going to get into it more in a minute as far as how the pecking order goes.

Starting point is 00:20:55 But it's a really intriguing group. Yeah, coming up, guys, we're going to talk about all five of these tight ends in totality. We're going to talk about the pecking order and how we would really see it playing out here come training camp this offseason. But first, it's winner take all time in the NBA and NHL. And FanDuel is giving you a shot to bring home a big win of your own. Right now, new customers get $150 in bonus bets with any winning $5 bet. That's $150 to bet on spreads, money lines, player props, and more. I know the Indiana Pacers are knocked out of the NBA playoffs, but you150 to bet on spreads, money lines, player props, and more. I know the Indiana

Starting point is 00:21:25 Paisers are knocked out of the NBA playoffs, but you can still bet on the NBA finals with FanDuel. It looks like it's going to be Boston Celtics and the Dallas Mavericks. So make sure you're checking out FanDuel.com to make every playoff shot count. FanDuel, America's number one sports book. All right, Jake. So we're talking about how we think this whole tight end room transpires FanDuel, America's number one sportsbook. All right, Jake, so we're talking about how we think this whole tight end room transpires this offseason. Do we think an outside addition comes in? Probably not, but it certainly could work that way. They do have two other guys on the roster in Jordan Murray and Eric Tomlinson.

Starting point is 00:22:02 Tomlinson's kind of interesting because he's been around a long time. I believe he's like one of the oldest players on the entire Colts roster right now. So, you know, he could be an interesting practice squad guy just to have that veteran that could come up. But, you know, we're looking at the top five guys. The top five guys are obviously what matters the most. The Colts could roll into this year with three, likely four guys that make it. So, you know, again, we've kind of talked about Mo Ali Cox is the odd man out in our eyes. But what would it tell you, as someone who's going to be there for all these practices, this offseason in training camp, if we're sitting by, you know, second week of August, and the two guys running with the first team is Granson and Mo, what are you thinking as someone

Starting point is 00:22:41 who's watched this transpire the last couple years? Yeah, I think it would be really damning on the group because it would just mean that no one else has taken that step up. I understood that being the primary group last year when everyone was hurt, suspended, whatever. And you just needed your two veterans who you could rely on to be in there. And to me, that just shows, you know, it's your two guys with, again, their ceiling is probably capped. Like, Granson is a fine role player, but it would be surprising if he showed even more to this point. Mo has been around since 2018, so you know what he is. But you've got these three uber talented players behind them in Woods who probably would have worked his way into being a significant player in the offense last year.

Starting point is 00:23:31 So you're getting a chance to see him with a new coaching staff who, again, like I mentioned, is really getting their first eyes on him. Ogletree, who they really liked last year and did play a nice little role before he was suspended. And then Will Mallory, who always was earning more playing time, went from being a game day inactive all the time to getting a role. Whenever another tight end was hurt, he was in there and he was making plays or at least moving the chain. So it would be very surprising, but it would mean that those guys have just been not really taking the next steps forward that I'm not going to say it should be easy for them, but like it's all there for them

Starting point is 00:24:12 to do it. You know, Mo is again, what we think probably not as secure in his roster spot. He may be more because again, the coaches can rely on him, but Granson is not an irreplaceable guy either. Now, we still think he'll probably be one of the top two. But it's really Jelani Woods. There's every reason in the world to get a mismatch freak out on the field like that. So if he's not really cracking the playing time, because I don't even want to say it has to be week one that these guys are like starting but throughout the first several weeks of the season if we're not seeing it transition to more of those guys then I just think these coaches aren't really going to be sold on

Starting point is 00:24:54 those you know uber talented but not capitalizing players yeah yeah I think so too and again when it comes to the Marley Cox thing like I do think that that now is the time again, unless injuries happen in training camp, I think now is the time because with Reich scheme, it kind of made sense to have Mo because it's a lot of inline blocking from the tight end. It's a lot of down blocks from the tight ends. And, you know, you need a guy with most size where most nearly 270 270 pounds just to just to add that extra oomph on the outside. But now with this scheme, this scheme is all about misdirection. It's all about athleticism and mismatches at the tight end spot. Again, Mo just doesn't bring you that. I mean, if you're if you're talking about how how athletic all these guys are most, probably the least athletic one out of the group right now. And that's not saying that he's some terrible athlete. It's just he's working with a lot of very good athletes next to him. So I do think it's time to go with

Starting point is 00:25:49 the four young guys, the four guys who are mismatches, who are athletic, and just roll with those guys and really lean into that passing game with them. But now we got to talk about the ceiling of this group, because you mentioned very athletic players, very talented players, young players players I did see our guy Colts film room on on Twitter the other day did say something about like you know what we don't have Travis Kelsey in this room but maybe in the aggregate we could have him like you know the money ball quote basically being like in the aggregate we can create Johnny Damon with all these young players I don't think I can go that far with this room because this room last year, I mean, again, dealt with a lot of adversity, had Gardner Minshew as the quarterback and kind of a new system.

Starting point is 00:26:31 They barely encroached 900 yards receiving last year. So it's hard to say that this group can be the Travis Kelsey aggregate when they barely, you know, approached 900 yards receiving. But I do think, again, in a way, these guys all work their roles so well. It doesn't need to be Travis Kelsey, but it can be still a very productive tight end room that complements this receiver room very well. I don't need 1,000 yards out of this tight end room. I just need guys who can get the job done.

Starting point is 00:27:01 If Ogletree this next season has 90 yards receiving but is a very good blocker, that's fine for me. If Mallory only catches 30 passes, but 15 to 20 of them go for first downs, that works for me. If Jelani Woods catches 30 passes and averages 17 yards to catch, whatever, cool, awesome. If Kylan Granson catches 10 passes, but they're all like little fullback or whatever he does, whatever it's going to be, that works for me. Like, I don't need the aggregate to be some superstar player. I need the aggregate to be good. Like just, just to be fine. You know, like let, let Pittman Jr. lead the way, let AD Mitchell, let Josh Downs lead the way in the

Starting point is 00:27:38 passing game. Just be productive. Don't be liabilities and compliment that group well. And we'll be fine. Like again, we don't need to put the expectation on all these players to be superstars. It's just, you know, do your role and succeed in that role. I mean, Jelani Woods is probably the only one with the big time expectations on him right now. Yeah. And I think that's what it's going to be because there's a lot of mouths to feed in that passing game. Cause I mean, we talked about, we've talked about these four tight ends that are probably going to make it last year there was like three receivers that made it on cut down day now obviously isaiah mckenzie they had a plan for that but now we

Starting point is 00:28:15 both think there's a firm six receivers that they will keep so four is really the number i think this is gonna be super number one it's to be based on the matchup each week in the defense and specific matchups as well, because there's going to be certain guys with different skill sets that attack each defense differently. But they're going to rotate these guys through. There's not going to be one ball dominant guy. Even if they're even if, let's say, Jelani Woods does take off, he's not going to have 70, 80 catches. It's just not going to happen. All of these guys will

Starting point is 00:28:50 be involved in executing their specific role. Like you mentioned, that's what it's going to be. It will be Pittman and Downs probably as the dominant target guys, but everyone is going to have their role just like in the receiving group. So I don't think success for the tight end room looks like one guy stepping up and dominating. I think it looks like efficiency and, you know, just not being, like you said, not being a liability when it comes to, you know, okay, we need an important play here. Don't drop it. Number one. And then don't blow all of these, these you know blitz pickups and stuff like essentially doing your job and making

Starting point is 00:29:32 decent plays is what i'm looking for out of this group you got athletic freaks so some of these plays need to be better than what the average tight end could make but i don't need some gaudy stats from the group right right i think you know at the end of the day but I don't need some gaudy stats from the group. Right. Right. I think, you know, at the end of the day, again, they don't have, they probably don't have that difference maker in this group right now.

Starting point is 00:29:50 Like again, we're holding out hope for Jelani woods, but they probably don't have that difference maker, but you know, you don't need an entire roster of difference makers. You need a couple of difference makers and a couple of guys who just do their job. And I think this tight end room can just do their job.

Starting point is 00:30:04 And that's perfectly fine by me. But you let us know in the comment section, what. And I think this tight end room can just do their job. And that's perfectly fine by me. But you let us know in the comment section, what are your hopes for this tight end room this year? Can they, you know, succeed when it comes to our expectations? Can they surpass your guys' expectations? Let us know in the comment section. And also before we get out of here, Locked On has launched the first ever national sports 24-7 streaming channel

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