Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - Indianapolis Colts: Revealing the Lou Anarumo Experience, with Ben Baby

Starting point is 00:00:00 It's official, the Colts have hired Lou Anarumo as their new defensive coordinator. And today we are joined by a very special guest who has covered Anarumo's time with the Bengals from start to finish. He's going to tell us the truth about the Colts' new defensive coordinator. Let's get to it. You are Locked On Colts, your daily Indianapolis Colts podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. All right. Thanks for tuning in and making us your first listen of the day.

Starting point is 00:00:38 This is your daily podcast covering your Indianapolis Colts, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. And today's show is brought to you by GameTime. Download the GameTime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off of your first purchase. What's up, everybody? I'm Jake Arthur from HorseshoeHuddle.com. I'm your resident credentialed media member for the site. And today we are talking more Lou Annarumo. Of course, Zach and I got to you guys

Starting point is 00:01:06 pretty much right after the news was announced yesterday. We're going to keep this train rolling because it's a very important hire that the Colts have made. Gus Bradley had some strengths and some weaknesses, but ultimately his groups were not good enough. And the Colts have things to improve across the board, but a strong defensive coordinator hire will certainly help. There's some new players they need to get in there for Anarumo as well. And so today I spoke with Ben Baby, the ESPN Bengals writer. He has covered Anarumo's time with the Bengals from start to finish again, 2019 to now. And Ben gives us a lot of really good context into what is good about Anarumo, what went wrong, and really where the truth lies and what Colts fans might expect from their new

Starting point is 00:01:53 defensive coordinator. You know, Zach and I are both optimistic about this hire. We think it should go well as long as Anarumo is given the tools to succeed, which for all of Gus Bradley's faults, he wasn't always given the right players either. But we don't want to sugarcoat it and make it seem like it's a home run, like 1,000% going to be a success. There is a reason things went the way they did in Cincinnati and why ultimately they felt they needed to move on.

Starting point is 00:02:27 Now, I will say, first and foremost, Anarumo is very well respected by opposing players and coaches around the league. We've seen, you know, Shane Steichen leading up to this announcement has spoken highly of Anarumo before, you know, even in the preseason, you know, the Bengals threw the Colts some things they didn't expect to see there. But, you know, Travis Kelsey from the Chiefs said he was pretty much floored, used some colorful language to express how surprised he was that the Colts, or that the Bengals rather, moved on from Anarumo. So this is a guy where statistically it doesn't always look great. And I'll start with that. So right off the bat with Anarumo's time with the Bengals, the defense finished 25th in yards and 29th in points. The next year, 22nd in yards and 26th in points as he started to lay the groundwork, get more of the players he wanted.

Starting point is 00:03:27 You could see a little improvement in the first couple of years. And then it's when they really took off. 2021 is when the Bengals went to the Super Bowl. And if you remember, that offense got really, really clunky late. They could not protect Joe Burrow to save their lives. And the defense really had to kind of help drag the entire Bengals team to the Super Bowl. They were 17th in yards that year and 18th in points. It got even better the next year, 16 yards and 16th in points. So things started to go really, really well. There

Starting point is 00:03:56 were some really good players there. Jesse Bates, DJ Reeder, Logan Wilson, Jermaine Pratt, Eli Apple was playing really good football. And then things started to fall off. You saw the Bengals electing two were just being unable to financially afford some of those guys anymore. And a lot of Amarumo's most important players on that side of the ball left in free agency. They also had some guys in the draft that hadn't panned out or just didn't develop quickly enough, which part of that could be attributed to coaching as well. But overall, I think Anarumo is the type of coach who is going to kind of fill the gaps that Colts fans wanted Bradley to do. They wanted Bradley to be more aggressive when it came to blitzing, be able to make better adjustments in game plan for specific

Starting point is 00:04:46 opponents, and just basically make it seem like there was a plan on the defensive side of the ball. And, you know, Anarumo from his players was nicknamed the mad scientist. So they know that guy's always got a plan. So this is an interesting hire nonetheless, but I'll quit, you know, bugging your guys' ears off and we'll get to this conversation that we had again with ESPN's Ben Baby. I love going to live events, whether it's sports, music, theater, or comedy. I've actually been to pretty much all of that in the last year. You can add a couple of live podcast tapings on stage to that as well. And Game Time has been a huge reason why.

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Starting point is 00:06:22 Download the GameTime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off of your first purchase. Terms apply. Again, create an account and redeem code LOCKEDONNFL for $20 off. Download GameTime today. What time is it? GameTime. All right, everyone, we have got ESPN Bengals reporter Ben Baby with us to give some context to this Lou Anarumo hiring. You know, some people think it's a really good hire and

Starting point is 00:06:54 experienced guy who's respected around the league. Some see, you know, the statistics from last year with the Bengals and not making the playoffs. And we got someone here who can kind of explain everything for us. So Ben has seen Anarumo's entire tenure in Cincinnati. So this is just the guy to talk to. So Ben, first off, thanks for joining us today. Yeah, of course, of course. Yeah, I think it's a really interesting hire for Indianapolis. I think, you know, it shows the quality of Anarumo that he immediately found a job as a defensive coordinator, did not have to go back and find an assistant job, go back to being a DB's coach.

Starting point is 00:07:29 You know, it's interesting when the Bengals hired him in 2019, and that was my first season, but the staff was already put together when I took over on the beat. You know, the Bengals had a hard time getting a defensive coordinator in the building on Zach Taylor's first staff, and Lou did not have any real significant coordinator experience. I believe he was an interim at one point in time, but there was a lot of questions about how he would do. And I thought he grew into the job pretty well. But after six years, the Bengals decided to go out and make a change.

Starting point is 00:07:55 Yeah. So just from the outside view of it, summarizing, it kind of looked like it took a couple of years to build things up how we wanted. Then got really hot. That defense really helped the team get to the Super Bowl. And then things kind of petered out. It looked like there were some really important free agent departures. So how would you kind of summarize, I guess, the rise and fall of Anarumo there in Cincinnati? Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head when you talk about the arc. And it did take him a couple of years.

Starting point is 00:08:23 You definitely got the sense of that from guys who played on that defense. He kind of had to feel his way out. And I think that as time went on, he definitely got an understanding and a feeling of how to be a coordinator, how to lead an entire group. And it was interesting, you know, towards the end of this season, I think a lot of people understood that, you know, Anarumo might be the one who ends up having to take the heat for the Bengals missing the playoffs, given how good they look. But guys on the defensive side of the ball really enjoyed playing for him.

Starting point is 00:08:50 You know, Von Bell, you know, came back to play for Anna Rumo as a free agent, was a starter. And I think that they were probably, when you go back and look at it, that's probably one of the decisions that will cost Lou a little bit here that maybe the inability to maybe trust some of his younger players early on this season guys like Jordan Battle who looked like they were he was good as a rookie in 23 but because of kind of the communication issues they had was hoping that Vaughn would help solidify that unfortunately Vaughn wasn't the same player that he was this first time in Cincinnati and so

Starting point is 00:09:22 you saw that change and develop, but you know, you talk about those free agency departures, losing Jesse Bates was huge. Losing Vaughn was huge. The first time DJ reader, not bringing him back was massive. And then, you know, the development of the younger players, how, who you want to put the blame on for that. I think that there could be a lot of finger pointing there, but I think if you're a Colts fan, one of the things that you probably like is that in the last five games of the season, the Bengals really did figure things out.

Starting point is 00:09:50 That defense was playing really well. And had they gotten in, I think that you would have seen a much different unit than you did earlier on in the season. So I think that you're getting, Indianapolis is getting a quality coordinator who has seen a few things and is very experienced in kind of what he wants his unit to do and what he wants it to look like.

Starting point is 00:10:10 And this guy, I think I heard the nickname, the mad scientist, you know, given to him for his players. And statistically, over the course of the season, you know, it doesn't always look great. Like, even throughout his entire tenure, there was a couple good statistical years there, but I feel like, you know, in big games, big moments, the defenses were always ready. So, and honestly, like free agent additions, you know, you mentioned the younger guys,

Starting point is 00:10:35 maybe don't always get up to speed super quick, but I feel like they're free agent guys. A lot of them really hit even the mid-level ones so when it comes to Anarumo's strengths what would you say Colts fans should probably expect it to see when it's at its best yeah you know I think that he like you said in big games he's very game plan specific and he'll match up specific and I think it's one of the things that you know he's talked about a ton and the players kind of enjoyed is that they would go out and really their identity was based on who they were playing that week there are certain things that Lou will do but he's very flexible in what he wants he's not going to say I'm only going to play quarters I'm only going to

Starting point is 00:11:12 cover three you know we'll we'll figure out what we need to end up doing for this specific opponent and you know we saw it during that Bengals Super Bowl run you know they would you know he had stuff in the bag that he didn't he didn't unleash until it was time. I think the most notable one was a zero blitz. He dialed up in the 2021 season AFC championship game, which he hadn't shown all year and really only use it when he had to get Patrick Mahomes off the field. Even going back this year, Mahomes had one of his worst games ever in week two against the Bengals. Had they not, you know, had the Bengals not,

Starting point is 00:11:45 you know, committed DPI on fourth and 16 or whatever it was, the Bengals probably end up winning that game. Mahomes numbers were really bad. I think you probably could quibble with the type of zone they played in that specific scheme. But, you know, when you look at it, those numbers were really good. And towards the back half of the year, again, I think one of the key changes was the blue finally switched probably schematically what they wanted the defense to do went from zone to more of a man concepts uh simplify things for a lot of the younger players that seemed to benefit he probably had they got that done earlier might still be in Cincinnati

Starting point is 00:12:21 if we're being honest that might have been the difference between them making and missing the playoff so that's definitely something that, in hindsight, probably should have happened earlier on in the season. But that schematic flexibility, like I think Eli Apple was the one who called him the mad scientist, just going out and really finding a lot of exotic looks and understanding that quarterbacks are too good now. You cannot give them the same thing over and over. They're going to diagnose it really quickly. So trying to keep a team off its toes while also making sure your

Starting point is 00:12:48 guys are confident in the scheme, that's definitely something that he prioritizes. And I mean, no one's perfect when it comes to calling the defense. So what were the things that, you know, maybe common fan gripes of Anarumo or things, you know, you mentioned he eventually did adjust some things, but what are kind of, when you look at it, like he probably should adjust this or that, like what are fans going to have to live with? Yeah. I think sometimes, you know, you'll see that where, you know, it looks like early in the year, they probably played a little too much zone and then ended up shifting to man, which would have been better. It's a pretty complex, you know, because there's a lot going on. I think that there is some complexity issues there. So maybe some of the

Starting point is 00:13:28 younger players did not grasp it quick enough. And when they simplified it, talking to a lot of guys on that side of the ball, they were playing a lot faster by the end of the year, playing with a lot of confidence. And there is a good rapport that the players are able to have to the veterans with Lou and saying, hey, you know, maybe we should go out and do it this way. And he has been receptive to that over the years, especially if he trusts those guys. And I think that's something you've got to earn, you know, so I think that's maybe something that you might have to live with is Lou, maybe we want to play a certain way to a degree. And it may take a little while to change, which is what we saw in 25. I think one of the things

Starting point is 00:14:02 that probably doesn't get discussed a ton, but should, is end of game situations, end of half situations, especially early in his tenure. You know, that's something that the Bengals defense really struggled with. This season, we saw that as well, you know, in certain situations that the Bengals just did not do. They weren't good enough in key spots defensively down the stretch. Sometimes they got bailed out by guys not being able to execute on the other side of the ball. But, you know, sometimes that's something you're going to have to deal with. You know, those margins are going to be pretty thin.

Starting point is 00:14:32 And so, you know, getting off the field late in games, late in halves, I think that's something that you have to watch in Indianapolis. Can Luke continue to get better in that regard? And then, you know, I think that you're going to have to see sometimes these mobile quarterbacks are going to give his scheme fits. We've seen that in the past because he does prioritize wanting to make sure that guys can't just run all over you. That's something that he knows.

Starting point is 00:14:54 I think that's a fundamental tenet. I think he would say that as well, is that you've got to be able to stop the run and force teams to throw the ball a little bit. Yeah, he's definitely a guy who we talked about this recently on our show. If this was truly Shane Steichen kind of driving the hire, then he might want to get someone who's kind of given him fits, and Anarumo has definitely done it, especially a couple years ago in Cincinnati. That was an ugly – even this preseason.

Starting point is 00:15:18 It was just kind of outcoached there. But we've seen some really good players there for that Cincy defense. You know, Bates, Hendrickson, Logan Wilson or Jermaine Pratt have had some really big moments. Mike Hilton, the Colts need to change some things up on defense, obviously. So it would be wise to give your new coordinator some guys to work with who we really prefer. So are there one or two like positions where if you give them the best talent possible it's really going to take this defense to the next level i think having a really rangy free safety is really big i think that's one of the things that people didn't uh estimate properly even inside the building about

Starting point is 00:15:56 letting jesse bates walk is that the schematic flexibility because luke could play so much single high you know it gave him a lot of tinkering ability with the 10 players underneath that free safety that's sitting up top. And Jesse had so much range, had great ball skills, had a lot of trust, had been in the scheme for a long time. And I think that's why you saw a lot of the kind of adaptations on that side of the ball, especially during those playoff runs, those last two, you know, in 21 and

Starting point is 00:16:25 22. You know, maybe a guy like Jermaine Pratt, you know, as someone who didn't play all that well in Cincy, he kind of had up and down moments last season. You know, if the Bengals end up cutting him, I think that would be a no brainer for him to go to Indianapolis, a guy who understands what Lou wants, what Lou's looking for, was voted a captain last year, has been productive. And Lou is definitely going to tell you, and so expect to hear this, he does not care about yards. He cares about points. He will give up all the yards on the planet, but ultimately, you know,

Starting point is 00:16:55 red zone efficiency, third down efficiency, that's what he is going to prioritize in that you want to, you know, he'll give up all the yards on the planet, but if you can create turnovers and get stops, force teams to create, you know, kick field goals, that's what he's going to value more than anything. And it's definitely, you know, the numbers over the years would suggest it's not been an elite defense, because when you look at the yards given up, you know, points per drive, things of that nature.

Starting point is 00:17:19 But in those moments when you need to get a stop, I think that's what Lou has done a good job of understanding when it's time to really unleash your best stuff and what you're willing to give up and what you're willing to let teams have. I think that he had a good balance of that last year, Bengals 30th in red zone efficiency, which is one of the key reasons why that unit wasn't good enough. Yeah, that effective bend-but-don't-break style is kind of what Gus Bradley

Starting point is 00:17:43 really aspired to. It didn't quite work out. Before I let you go here, are there any position coaches you think might be in line to join Anarumo? Yeah, that's a good question. We'll see how this Bengals staff shakes out, and then we'll see who ends up being kept here. I know that Jordan Kovacs and Chuck Burke were the two holdovers from the Bengals staff, and it looks like they'll have a coordinator in here pretty shortly. So we'll see what Anaruma does.

Starting point is 00:18:07 He's a guy who is a DBs coach by trade, heavily involved in that. I think he's done a good job as well of, you know, delegating certain aspects of the ball, you know, rush packages, things of that nature to different staff members over the years. And, you know, again, I think that you've seen him have a good command of an entire defense, which was something that was a question when he came here. So, you know, if the Colts have the players,

Starting point is 00:18:34 I think that's going to be the key component. I think, you know, in talking to guys around the league going into last season, that was a big question mark was did they bring enough external free agents in to really help that defense? And, you know, someone criticized, I don't really understand why they brought back so many internal free agents when the team was so bad in 23. And they just ran it back in 24, expecting different results. And that didn't happen. So, you know, I think Gus Bradley and Lou Anaruba can probably sympathize in a lot of ways in maybe the hands they were dealt. So I think it's going to be important to put Lou in a position to succeed.

Starting point is 00:19:07 He's going to have to have some pieces that can allow him that flexibility that has enabled him to be successful over the years in Cincinnati. Yeah, so far they're saying all the right things about adding the external free agents and not letting guys get complacent. So like you said, we will see. But Ben, thanks so much for your time. I appreciate it. Yeah, Jake, thanks for having me. It's playoff time.

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Starting point is 00:20:20 Run your game. Again, download the app today and use code LOCKEDONNFL to get $50 instantly after you play your first $5 lineup. Price picks. Run your game. All right. Thanks again to Ben for his time.

Starting point is 00:20:36 I thought we got a lot of really good context there and a really good explanation of who Anna Rumo is as a coach, what you can expect from some of those players, some important positions to look out for as well. So I hope you guys got as much from that conversation as I did as well. And so thank you guys again for making Locked on Colts your first listen today. Now go find Locked on NFL.

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Starting point is 00:21:37 That definitely helps get more eyes and ears on the show. And with that, we will see you guys tomorrow.

Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - Indianapolis Colts: Revealing the Lou Anarumo Experience, with Ben Baby

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