Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - LOCKED ON COLTS 3/28/19: Ohio State beat writer Dan Hope on Terry McLaurin, Parris Campbell and Tyquan Lewis

Episode Date: March 28, 2019

On today's episode of Locked On Colts, Dan Hope of Eleven Warriors joins Evan to discuss plenty of topics.- How does hometown kid Terry McLaurin translate to the NFL, and how was he used at Ohio State? What's McLaurin's ceiling within the Colts' system?- Parris Campbell is electric with the ball in his hands. Who are some players in the NFL who compare to him from a usage standpoint? Would Campbell's burst be the perfect median between T.Y. Hilton and Devin Funchess?- What does Dan remember from Tyquan Lewis' tenure with the Buckeyes before Chris Ballard traded up for him? In 36 games as a full-time starter, Lewis recorded 34 sacks. How will Lewis fare moving inside to DT?- Finally, some closing thoughts on Ohio State QB Dwayne Haskins. Should teams in need of a signal-caller feel comfortable with Haskins as the face of their franchise for the next decade? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to Locked On Colts, part of the Locked On Podcast Network. Today's audience is Evan Sider. I'm joined by a very special guest today, Dan Hope, who covers the Ohio State Buckeyes for 11 Warriors. Dan, how are you doing today? I'm doing good. Thanks for having me. Yeah, no problem at all. We're going to hit on a lot of different Ohio State topics today related to the Colts. A couple of draft prospects, Tyquan Lewis is what we're going to hit on in a little bit. We might as well start off here with maybe the hottest Ohio State prospect right now outside Nick Bosa, and that's Terry McLaurin, who actually is from Indianapolis with the Cathedral High School. It's really

interesting to me, Dan, how really a couple months ago, if that was a third or fourth round pick from all the draft picks that I've been reading and listening to, but all of a sudden Mel Kuyper's latest mock draft this week has him at 26 to the Annapolis Colts. How surprising was that, and is it really a surprise to you ever seeing him all the past year or so? Yeah, it's pretty surprising. I think if anyone would have said in January that Terry McLaurin would be getting first-round projections right now, I would have thought that was pretty crazy, because I don't think that's really what anybody saw at that point in the process.

You know, I think when I always thought of him, you know, through his last couple seasons at Ohio State and starting this draft process as probably a day-free guy, a guy who was going to get drafted more for his blocking ability and for his special teams excellence than for being a great receiver. So I thought of him, he's more of a middle-round guy. Definitely thought of him as somebody who was going to make an NFL team and is going to stick around for a while because of those things that I just mentioned.

He's excellent on special teams, was fantastic in punt coverage for Ohio State, is also an excellent blocker, great character guy, great leadership, does all the little things well. So I think there's a ton of qualities about Terry McCorin that we already knew about that made him a solid middle-round pick and a guy that you'd want on your NFL team. But this pre-draft process has really just led to a huge rise for him because first he goes down to the senior bowl has a fantastic week there is one of the best players there then he goes to the combine runs a four three five which i think is a little bit faster than anybody expected and uh looked great

doing everything there and then he goes to pro day last week and again looks fantastic uh making highlight reel catches uh really showing off that deep receiving ability that he has with that speed. So you put all of that together. Now, all of a sudden, this isn't just a middle round guy who's going to play special teams. Now people are looking at him as a possible early round pick. And, you know, I still think the first round stuff is probably a little rich because you look at what he did at Ohio State.

He didn't have first round what he did at Ohio State. He didn't have first-round kind of production at Ohio State. And I think if you're looking for him now as all of a sudden somebody who's going to be a number-one receiver for an NFL offense, I don't think that's who he is. But I do think that, you know, if we're talking, you know, second, third round, what he's been able to do in his pre-draft process and then all those great qualities that he has about him, I think he's somebody that if you take him in day two, you're probably going to be happy you took him because there's going to be a lot of good qualities that he brings to your team.

Whether he can be an elite receiver in the NFL, I'm not positive about that, but I think that he's going to bring a lot of good qualities to your team no matter what. What's really interesting to me, Dan, when I look at his stats here, it just seems like he didn't really get enough usage as far as a top receiving option goes. Obviously, Paris Campbell got a lot of yards of production, who we'll get into in a little bit, but from people maybe who didn't watch a lot of Ohio State this past year, what was Terry McLaurin's role, his role like, and how was he utilizing that offense? Yeah, so Ohio State has three different receiver positions. They have the X receiver position, the Z receiver position, and the H

back position. McLaurin primarily played the Z receiver position, which is basically their deep threat kind of receiver. So he's running a lot of deep routes uh and if you if you watch ohio state's offense even with duane haskins this year and him having that ability to make those deep throws and we did see terry make more big plays as a result of that they still like a lot of the shorter to intermediate throws getting guys like paris camp and K.J. Hill involved with a lot of shorter throws. So they weren't throwing to him 10 times a game. A lot of times, you know, they're picking their spots when they're throwing the ball to him. And, you know, like I mentioned, there's a lot of times where he's out there and they're throwing the ball to somebody else and

he's out there and he's making a block for somebody uh so yes and when you talk about his usage he wasn't somebody that they were he wasn't the number one target or number two target in terms of throwing the ball to him all the time uh but he did this past year show substantial improvement in my opinion uh and i think that was twofold. I think that was one, because of Dwayne Haskins throwing the ball deeper more often than JT Barrett. That gave Terry McLaurin more opportunities to use his speed and make those deep plays. And then secondly, I think Brian Hartline taking over as the wide receivers coach, of course, a guy who's been in the NFL. We saw him have a huge impact on that entire receiver

room this past year. And I think Terry, as much as anybody, really benefited from a year of coaching from Brian Hartline. I think we really saw his game become more well-rounded, become more consistent as a receiver. And I think he definitely, even though he didn't have huge numbers, from watching him from his junior year to his senior year, you could definitely see that he had become a better wide receiver.

Another point I wanted to hit on as far as Terry goes is just from the outside looking in and seeing why he's rising up board so much. It seems to me that he's a really high character guy. You were around him almost every day in the football season. From talking to him and speaking to his teammates, what's it like as far as his character and how does that check out? Because it seems like that's outside of his production on the field. That's probably one of the main reasons why he's really skyrocketing out of boards right now. Yeah, if you're grading him for character, he's going to get an A+,

because he's a guy who you could talk to any of his coaches, any of his teammates, any of his teammates. They love him. He was a two-time captain at Ohio State. He's a tremendous guy to talk to. You know, he's a very mature, very smart young man. Somebody who, you know, goes about his business the right way, is a very selfless player. Like I mentioned before, you you know this is a guy who

was playing on multiple special teams unit and was urban meyer actually called him the best gunner he's ever coached because he was so excellent at what he did on the punt team and he's always out there blocking for guys you know he's never somebody who is going to complain about they're not throwing me the ball enough. He's a very selfless team player, a tremendous leader, a tremendous character. You won't find anybody that has a bad word to say about Terry McLaurin. So you talk about character, you talk about leadership. He absolutely is going to check all the boxes in that area. And that is going to help his draft doc because he's one of those guys that if you if you have him on your board compared to somebody

else who maybe you have similar in terms of skill set I think Terry could get the nod because of all the off-field qualities that he brings in terms of his character as far as just from my point of view my high school win against Terry McLaurin in their state championship game, and he torched him, I think, for four touchdowns on five touches the entire game. So I have firsthand experience about how good Terry McLaurin could be. But final points here on him before we move on to Paris Campbell. If you were to take him, let's say, in that early second round

for the Colts' sake, 34 overall. What do you think his overall upside is? Do you think he has the K of Bows of being maybe not number one, but a very high number two receiver in the NFL? Yeah, you know, I think the big thing is you're going to have to take advantage of that deep speed that he has. I think that if you can compliment him, you know, if he can be a deep compliment to maybe somebody who's got a little more well-rounded game in terms of, you know, being able to make catches in traffic, being able to route run. I think he's somebody who could help you stretch the field because of his speed.

And I think he did that for Ohio State. And then, you know, like I said, I think a lot of it is going to be, no matter what he does as a receiver, you know, this is a guy who from day one is going to be able to help you on special teams. From day one is going to be able to go out there and block for you. So, you know, I think, you know, his ceiling, in my opinion, is probably a number two receiver. I think worst case scenario, he's a guy who's going to be a special team standout for you, and he's going to be able to go up there and do the little things well. Yeah, it seems like it checks definitely a lot of boxes for what Colts general manager Chris Bauer is looking for, but let's go to the next Ohio State receivers generating a lot of buzz lately. That's Paris Campbell. His name's here in the first round. I see on some boards, even some late second round,

his name's pretty much all over the place right now, like Terry McLaurin. From an outside-looking end point of view, what can you explain about Paris Campbell and how he's going to transit the NFL from what you've seen in the past few years? Yeah, so another guy, you're talking about elite speed, ran a 4.3140, which tied for the fastest at the combine. So this is a guy, the ball's in his hands hand and there's clear field in front of him. Good luck catching up. We've seen that plenty of times in his Ohio State career where, you know, if he gets

that lane and he gets out in the open field, you know, most of the time, nobody's going to catch him because he's one of the fastest players on the field. And even in the NFL, he's going to be one of the fastest players on the field most of the time. So that's certainly his number one trait. You know, I think the big question that teams are going to have with him is how well does he use that speed in terms of actually being a receiver? Because most of his success at Ohio State came on short passes, and sometimes they'd even use him as a runner on jet sweeps and motions and plays like that but you didn't see him make a lot of deep catches at Ohio State most of the time he's

running short routes he's catching short passes and trying to turn those into big plays so I think the biggest question for him going forward to the NFL is just what can he be in terms of a deep pass catcher, in terms of a route runner. The role he played at Ohio State, he wasn't asked to do that all that much. So it's kind of a projection there in terms of him becoming, you know, that deep receiver. But I think in terms of a guy that, you know, you're talking about pure speed, there's no question that he's got that, and that's going to make him a dangerous threat. If you can find the right way to utilize him within your offense, he's going to add a lot of big play potential. If you were an NFL

offensive coordinator, Dan, how would you use Paris Campbell? Yeah, I think you've got to be creative. You know, I just, I don't think from what I saw at Ohio State, he's somebody who is going to be a deep threat in terms of he's catching passes 30, 40 yards down the field. So I think you've got to find creative ways to get him into space. I think of a guy like Cordero Patterson and how he's been used, and he's a guy – sometimes he's lining up in the backfield, and sometimes he's running motions and, you know, taking jet sweeps

and sometimes they're using him just as a slot receiver. And I would do the same with Paris Campbell. I would try to find ways to get the ball in his hand that aren't necessarily just conventional routes because I think that if you can find ways to create open field for him with the ball in his hand, he's always going to be that home run threat. He's always going to be that threat to go the distance. But I think if you're just expecting him to win one-on-one routes and catch deep passes, I'm not sure that's going to be his game in the NFL. Speaking from a cold-spit point, how would you – I'm just envisioning for a moment here, if he does get picked,

let's say at 26 or 34, even 59 if he goes that far, do you like the fit as far as Paris Campbell next to a guy like a T.Y. Hill and a Devin Funches with Andrew Luck as the quarterback? Do you think that would maybe be a right to him, bring him to the most out Campbell's skill set? Yeah, you know, I think you look at, you know, a guy like Funchess, he's a bigger guy. He's not a speed guy. So I think if you're putting Paris Campbell in there, you're adding another speed guy in there. You know, I think in terms of T.Y. Hilton,

there's probably, you know, some similarities in the kind of role that they would play. But I think if you're looking for an infusion of speed in that offense, which, you know, I think is why both McLaurin and Campbell have been tied to them. I think you're certainly going to be able to get that out, out of Paris Campbell. And, and, you know, obviously the Colts, you know, one of their big strengths last year was their offensive line. So we know that they can open up holes for people.

I think if you can be creative and find ways to get Paris in some running situations and open up holes for him, give him some running lanes, I think that can help as well and make him useful in that offense. Yeah, maybe using like a Percy Harvin type of player back in the day, I think that'd be really exciting as far as a Devin Funches guy and a T.Y. Hilton pair with a Paris Campbell. That'd be really exciting to watch from my standpoint. But before we move on to our next player here,

it was just former Ohio State Buckeye and Indianapolis Colt Taequann Lewis. I just wanted to ask you, head-to-head, just taking the Colts out of it for just overall player here, head-to-head, Paris Campbell or Terry McLaurin, who do you think is the better receiver? You know, that's a tough one because I think they're two very different players. And I think that in terms of what you're looking for might change your conversation there. Because I think, you know, Paris is generally, until the past couple weeks, he's generally been projected as the higher pick.

And I think, you know, a lot of that has to do with, with his speed and, you know, in terms of if you look at the production, he was more productive at Ohio state. He, he had bigger numbers at Ohio state. I think he's a little more proven in terms of what he can do for an offense. But I think if you project forward, you know, with McLaurin, I think there's some untapped ability there in terms of what he can do as a deep receiver that might translate well to the NFL.

And then you add in all that special teams value that I talked about and blocking value that I talked about. You know, I think it could go either way. I think that if I'm looking for a guy just to be a big play threat for my offense, I'm going to go with Paris Campbell because I've seen him do that more. But if I'm looking for a guy who can do a lot of the little things and I know can contribute on special teams and maybe has a little more long-term potential as a downfield threat, then I'm probably taking McCormick. That's definitely going to be an interesting debate from a Colts standpoint,

also from an NFL draft standpoint. Those two guys need to be ranked to each other on most draft boards right now. Who's going to be the first one taken? It's definitely going to be, I think, a debate away until draft night, Dan. But let's move on here to Tyquan Lewis, a current Annapolis Colts defensive end. Might be moving inside this year defensive tackle, but looking back on his career at Ohio State right now,

he had 34 sacks and 36 starts in his last three years there as a full-time starter. What do you remember about Tyquan Lewis during his tenure with the Ohio State Buckeyes? Well, this is another guy. I mean, you just asked me about two guys, Terry and Paris, who the coaches loved at Ohio State and was a team captain and a leader and was a very highly respected a leader and, you know, was a very highly respected player in the program. And Taekwon's another guy like that.

He's a two-time captain, a guy who, you know, really was very highly respected by his teammates and did a lot for the program. And, you know, I just remember him being a, you know, a really consistent player for Ohio State. Somebody who, you know, he wasn't as flashy as a Joey Bosa or a Nick Bosa. He didn't necessarily dominate and make, you know, the kinds of game-changing plays as much as those guys did. But I think he was a very consistent player, really good against the run,

solid pass rusher as well. Very much a team leader and a guy who the coaches really had a lot of trust in. So a lot of good qualities about Tyquan Lewis. You know, he was a Big Ten defensive lineman of the year. So he's a guy who really had a good career at Ohio State. And, you know, I don't think, you know, anyone's surprised to see him, you know, in the NFL have some success at that level as well. Yeah, he's 6'4", around 260, 270. He's going to be moving inside this year. What do you think about Tyquan Lewis as far as him moving more inside, maybe long-term in his career?

Because I know he played mostly defensive end at Ohio State. Yeah, well, the thing that was interesting at Ohio State is especially when he was there and they had, you know, his senior year, they had four NFL defensive ends and him, Sam Hubbard, Jalen Holmes, and now Nick Bosa, of course, is about to be a top two pick most likely in the NFL draft. Holmes has moved to defensive tackle with the Vikings, and a lot of times in their rushman package, which was what they would use in their nickel defense, and they'd put all four of those guys in the field at the same time, most of the time Holmes

and Lewis would play inside in those packages. So I always thought with Taekwon that especially in pass rushing situations, being that interior pass rusher was a role that would probably suit him well. You know, I don't think that in terms of his, you know, being that elite athlete on the outside, he's not a guy that I ever saw being a 10 sacks per year guy on the outside of the NFL, because I don't think he quite has that elite you know bend and and and speed that you'd look for in that position but when you look at his size you look at his strength he's got a good burst to him I think he's a guy who could do really well in that interior penetrator free technique kind of role and he did get some experience situationally playing in that role

at Ohio State. Yeah, definitely going to be fun to see Tyquan Lewis grow from here. But before I let you go, Dan, I wanted to ask you, correct me if I'm wrong, but you used to cover Clemson as well, I believe during the Deshaun Watson days. And I just want to hear your thoughts head to head, Dwayne Haskins and Deshaun Watson, you were up close with both of them. What do you think as far as Dwayne Haskins might be a top five pick this year? And you also saw Deshaun Watson, you were up close with both of them. What do you think as far as Dwayne Haskins might be a top five pick this year? And he also saw Deshaun Watson might be the best quarterback in that draft outside of Patrick Mahomes. What do you think about those two and how Haskins really stacks up compared to Watson?

Yeah, you know, I think they both have some very similar qualities to me in that, you know, they're both guys who I think, you talk about kind of those intangible qualities of being a quarterback. I think they're both guys who really play with a lot of confidence. Their teammates really rally around them. Of course, they're both very talented passers. Deshaun's certainly a better athlete in terms of running, in terms of being that dual threat.

Dwayne doesn't really have that element to his game that Deshaun did. So that's one area that I think Deshaun is better. In terms of comparing them as passers, I think they're pretty comparable. Dwayne's arm may be slightly stronger than Deshaun, but I think they're pretty comparable in that area. I think the one thing DeSean, you know, had on Dwayne, well, two things is one, he's got that athleticism. And then secondly, he came out with, you know, almost three full years of playing experience, whereas Dwayne only has the one. So I think if you were putting them in the draft together, I think that Deshaun would probably rank ahead of Dwayne, at least in my opinion, but not by a big margin.

And I would say that covering Deshaun, I was very bullish on Deshaun. I thought he was the best quarterback in that draft class. In hindsight, you'd have to say Patrick Mahomes right now because he's been phenomenal. But I always thought watching Deshaun, this is a guy who's going to succeed in the NFL. And I think the same thing about Dwayne. And I think the big thing for me, a big thing that I always look for in quarterbacks is I want to see a guy who at the college level has performed his best in the biggest spotlight. And you looked at Deshaun Watson at Clemson. This is a guy who, you know, they went to the college football playoff. They played in these huge games, and he stepped up his game. And then you look at Dwayne last year. You think about the Michigan game, and, you know, that's the biggest game of the year if you're Ohio State.

And he really played well in that game. You know, same thing with the Big Ten championship game. Same thing with the Rose Bowl. So I think they're both guys who you looked at and go, the spotlight's never going to be too big for these guys. And, you know, Deshaun's off to a good start in the NFL. And I really think Dwayne's going to be successful as well. Another Haskins question I wanted to ask you before I let you go, Dan, what's, if you're one of these teams at the top of the draft, like a Giants or even the Raiders, the Bengals, the Dolphins, the Redskins, if you're one of these teams that's really high on Dwayne Haskins,

how would you really sell the front office as far as committing to him as your franchise quarterback for the next 10 to 15 years? Because it seems like he has all the intangibles, and really he could be a star in the league if everything goes right for him. Yeah, I mean, I think he's got all the qualities you're looking for in a franchise quarterback. He's very smart. He's confident. He's got good size. He's got all the qualities you're looking for in a franchise quarterback. You know, he's very smart. He's confident.

He's got good size. He's got a great arm. He's a very accurate passer. He's a good decision maker, great character. So I think he's got all the things that you're looking for, in my opinion, as an NFL quarterback. I don't think – I think the only real weakness there that you're looking at is because the game has changed and there's a lot more dual-threat quarterbacks now, and there's a lot of teams looking for Kyler Murray now, and that's not Dwayne Haskins.

He's not a runner. He's not somebody who is going to make many plays with his feet. So if that's what you're looking for, he's not going to be your guy. There might be some questions just in terms of his footwork and in terms of how he handles pressure, you know, those are things that he's going to have to work on a little more, but I think all the tools are there. I think he's someone that he's got all the tools you need and as smart as he is and as committed to the game as he is. I think if you put him with the right coach, you get him in a good system and you work with him on the small things that he needs to work on, I think he's got all the qualities to be a great quarterback in the NFL for many years to come. So, you know, to me, if I was the New York Giants, Eli Manning's near the end of his career.

This is a guy who grew up in New Jersey. He grew up as a Giants fan. To me, it should be a no-brainer. I'm not sure if they're going to do it, but to me, it's a no-brainer of it. I would draft Blaine Haskins to be your quarterback in the future. Appreciate the time, Dan, coming on. Before I let you go, if listeners aren't familiar with your work or 11 Warriors, do you want to plug anything as far as your Twitter account or anything else?

Yes. You guys can follow me on Twitter at Dan underscore Hope. That's D-A-N underscore H-O-P-E. And 11warriors.com, we cover Ohio State, mostly football, a little bit of basketball and other sports as well. We try to cover everything from Ohio State as completely as any website out there. So go to 11warriors.com if you're interested in Ohio State football. We try to cover it as completely as any website out there. So go to 11warriors.com if you're interested in Ohio State football. We try to cover it as completely as anybody.

So hope you guys come check it out. Thanks for the time, Dan. And if we do draft a guy like Terry McLaurin or Paris Campbell or any other Ohio State Buckeye, we'll definitely try to get you back on after the draft.