Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - LOCKED ON COLTS 4/8/19: Analyzing the trenches with Eric Galko of Optimum Scouting

Episode Date: April 8, 2019

On today's episode of Locked On Colts, Eric Galko of Optimum Scouting stops by to go over all things NFL Draft with it now less than three weeks away.- Are the Cardinals really about to take Kyler Murray and trade Josh Rosen? Galko says Redskins and Chargers are likely landing spots for Rosen- Outside of the Murray/Rosen saga, what are the other main draft storylines fans should be following along with?- Galko believes Chris Ballard is building one of the most talented rosters- The deep dive into the trenches begins as Galko and Evan go back-and-forth on plenty of defensive line prospects: Jerry Tillery, Clelin Ferrell, Dexter Lawrence, Chase Winovich, Jaylon Ferguson, Dre'Mont Jones, Renell Wren, LJ Collier, Ben Banogu, Isaiah Buggs- Galko dishes out the latest Colts scoops he's hearing related to prospects they really like, including at No. 26 plus someone they are thinking about trading up for on Day 2 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to Locked On Colts, part of the Locked On Podcast Network. Today's host is Evan Sutter. I'm joined by a very special guest today, Eric Galko of Optimum Scouting. Eric, how are you doing today? I'm doing great, man. How are you guys doing? Doing good, doing good. I'm glad to have you on here to talk some draft with me. I know the draft's getting pretty close here. It's one of the more exciting times of the year for me as an NFL fan. I just want to dive right into it as far as draft news. What's your overall assessment as far as what the top of the draft is going to look like? Because I know there's a lot

of smoke around Kyler Murray being a Cardinal. I know following along with you, you've been really on top of it as far as Kyler Murray is going to be a stone cold lock to the Cardinals. What's the last year on that? Yeah, not smoke. He will be the first overall pick in the draft. And I think the Josh Rosen situation should be resolved fairly soon. I think significantly before the draft, Rosen will be traded somewhere, possibly to Washington or the have put it out there on social media unless I was positive back when I did February 11th. But I think if you go aside from the fact that this is what I've heard, look at why it makes the most sense. Right. I always kind of say to myself and to our team, hey, think everyone is smart and rational. Why would they do this? And I think for the Cardinals and Cliff Kingsbury, most importantly, he is a guy that if this doesn't work out in year one, his GM, Steve Keim, might get let go. And he is a very easy scapegoat for the Cardinals won't be

successful. So he knows, hey, I've got to win right away. And I'm in the same division as Jared Goff and Sean McVay, as Kyle Shanahan, Jimmy Garoppolo, as for the time being, Pete Carroll, and Russell Wilson. So my division is also very difficult to even win two games in division. So all that said, I'm going to do it. They hire me because of my offensive ability. I need a quarterback that's going to be able to right away be successful as a quarterback in my offense. If you watch Texas Tech or any quarterbacks in that tree, Josh Rosen really wasn't going to be that. And Kyler Murray is that guy.

And also, as a side point, Cliff Kingsbury had the choice between the Jets job, who are picking later in round one at number, what, four overall, three overall, or first overall pick. He is the first overall pick on a lesser roster because he wants Kyler Murray. So I think all that together shows why the Kyler Murray to Cardinal situation, aside from what I've heard, makes a lot of sense on paper paper i think that's why cliff kingsbury and that whole front office have said hey you know what the draft starts at two because we're going to get a quarterback to help cliff kingsbury be who he wants to be i know you mentioned there the redskins and chargers as

possible josh rosen destinations what's the latest you're hearing as far as value for him because i know the cardinals team steadfast and not want to budge for and not really less than a firstround pick, but you think they're going to have to settle here for a second or maybe a third? Yeah, I don't think it's going to be a third. I think they've wanted a second and a little bit more, either being on their draft pick or a possible another third in the future that can be a second later on, two seconds, but they want some sort of escalator as well as just another asset. They don't want to be able to, and they've of say faithfully, but especially for G.S. Steve Kine, say, hey, I know I traded up in the draft a second and a third round pick

to get this guy. I want to make sure I get back at least that second and third round pick that I gave up. So I think right now that the Redskins seem to be, maybe the leaders in the clubhouse, they're willing to give up a second and a little bit more from what I've heard so far. I'll be honest, I haven't followed up and reported as much on that as maybe i could but um the redskins make a lot of sense they want a quarterback to come in be an inexpensive long-term backup because a they know case keenan's not the long-term guy and b they can't afford to try anybody else at a high expense because they're paying alex smith all that money so i think they make a lot of sense

but the chargers i think the cardinals know that Josh Rosen is going to be at his best when he's on the West Coast, when he's back to L.A. where he's from. And the Chargers have Bill Burrus for this year, possibly one more year after that, but one year extension. And Rosen can be slowly groomed and developed in a perfect situation for him. And it's a low-risk move for the Chargers. So I do think at the end of the day, the Chargers will match whatever the Redskins want to offer or a surprise team

wants to offer. But for now, I think it's very much wide open to what teams are going to be on next. Yeah, that's definitely the top draft storyline of the year so far. Just an interesting situation. You can tree up for Josh Rosen and then a year later everything changes with the coaching staff. Right, right. Now you have a guy that's going to take his own quarterback. And that feels like it's unprecedented.

It doesn't really happen that often as far as you take a guy in the top 10 and a year later he's traded. But what an urge. Yeah, and I think on that note too, not to cut you off too, but I think that why that's happening and also this whole Russell Wilson story is, you know, we've talked about, people have talked on the media for a couple of years now, right? This whole quarterback, what's the value? You know, what would you do?

Would you pay these guys $35 million a year? Would you draft one of the first two rounds every year? I think we're starting to see all that theoretical stuff kind of come to a head and teams are now figuring out in real time, hey, if you have a guy in a rookie deal as a quarterback who didn't have a great year, what's his value? Do you trade for him, right? Or do you pay Russell Wilson? I think the fact that these quarterback stories are coming up more and more is because people in the league more and more are thinking about it and saying, hey, you know what? We've got to find either some inefficiency or really kind of solve this because we can't afford to be the Redskins paying Alex Smith for three years. We also can't afford to be bad for 10 years by passing on rookie quarterback. So

there's a reason why it's all happening at once, and I think it's going to happen for another couple years here, too. Yeah, definitely interesting storyline to follow along with there. But what are some other draft storylines maybe that aren't getting talked about much because that Kyler situation is just so nationally – taking over just the national stream as far as the NFL goes. What are some other storylines you're putting in, Ariane? Yeah, you know, I think it's the defensive line, the pass rushers, and I know it's an obvious one, but I think what could be a lot of fun on draft day

is how different people feel about all these quarterbacks, right? I'm sorry, the pass rushers. And they don't think all these pass rushers are identical. I talk to some teams and they've got Brian Burns second, and then some teams have Brian Burns eighth. You know, most teams have Nick Bosa one, but some teams have Josh Allen two, and some teams have John eight. You know, I think that's, it could be a lot of fun on draft day because,

you know, we think we know how it's going to go, right? But what happens in the kind of mock draft season is, you know, mock drafts tend to be in the aggregate. And I do the same thing way, right? I talk to a lot of teams and I get a feeling, all right, where does Brian Burr rank? He's two for you, he's three for you, he's five for you, he's seven for you. So roughly that puts him fourth.

All right, he'll be my fourth defensive end draft. And in practical use, if the Jets took Brian Burns at third overall because they thought he was the second best pass rusher in this draft you know would that shock me a little bit but not too much because these teams have different opinions so I think the fact that there's so many good defensive linemen and so many good pass rushers that we kind of get lost in in either group thing or personally ranking these guys and we forget that the teams aren't doing that they're not saying what do the other 31 teams think? Okay, I think I slightly agree, maybe a little bit different.

I'll make my own board. They could be vastly different. And for some teams, they are. I think the pass rusher and defensive tackle and a little bit receiver, they're as wide-ranging as you'd imagine. Yeah, it's really one of the most loaded defensive draft classes I can remember, at least in the past few years. Let's dive into the cold center topics here, Eric.

And for me, I just want to get your general thoughts on the general manager running the entire ship here, Chris Bauer. He had a home run last year in a 2018 draft, high expectations for 2019. What are your thoughts on him and his staff? No, I think, I think the Colts do a fantastic job. And I think, you know, Chris Bauer comes from the, you know, same, I went to the GM tree of John Dorsey.

I think the John Dorsey tree, right, comes from Green Bay. But I think one thing that a lot of the people who are descendants of that Ted Thompson GM tree are guys who are willing to take input and advice and really genuinely trust their scouts at a high level. I think that's really, really important for all of those GM trees. I think Valorant does a great job of that. And, you know, most people on the league feel that Dorsey is the best at that and Valorant might be number two.

That's so important because you're able to be so much more successful as a GM. I tell young scouts all the time, hey, if you really want to develop as an evaluator, you should scout 50 guys, a conference, two conferences at most, and not try to be a top 300 board big

guy because it's just too hard to do that. I think the smart GMs appreciate that. And they say, Hey, I'll use analytics and our scouting staff. Tell me who I should like and I'll watch those guys. And then we can agree and disagree. And when it comes to especially day three, day or day two, day three of the draft, if you have an input on the guy, I want to hear it. And I think, you know,

Dorsey does that an extreme level into that last year's draft. I think Howard has a two. So, and the fact that you do that, it fosters your scouts to work hard because they know at the end of the day they're going to get a payoff for it and they want to be right a lot more. If they are right, they get promoted. So, I think he does a great job building a culture. I mean, the Colts, there's a reason why they've hit on so many draft picks.

And it's not because Ballard's a genius, although I think he is in some ways as an evaluator. I think he's also a great leader and a great manager. And that comes from John Dorsey before him, Ted Thompson. Yeah, it's really interesting that just how good Chris Fowler is already getting at just the executive job. I mean, I know he carried a lot of weight in Kansas City, but now with him at the helm in Indianapolis, it's a quick turnaround ongoing right now.

But let's dive into your mock draft. The recent one I saw in Optima Scouting, Eric, you had Jerry Tillery going to the Colts at 26. You mentioned there you used to be like teams in the 20s there that seemed like they really liked Tillery. What stands out about him and his fit there? Yeah, I think he's a guy that I know a year ago, I evaluated him pretty closely, thinking he was going to be a part of the draft class before.

And he's a well-known guy among scouts because he was a big prospect coming out. He's from the South, but he has a lot of high school ties. We're from the South area. And then, obviously, he's been in a big school with Notre Dame, too. But I think what I've been most intrigued by for NFL team-wise is a lot of teams feel they can fit their defense and fit what they want. And those things can be very different. And that usually is a good sign that if a guy is well-liked character-wise,

which he absolutely is, goes to a big school and has produced and started multiple years, and a lot of teams think he can fit in their defense, it's a pretty good sign the guy's going to go early in the draft. But I didn't really think of it. I know our grades, and I don't do no name for our staff. I trust our staff the same way Dorsey and Ballard trust their staff. But I know our grade right now is an early round two pick, and I think I agree with that on film. but especially late in round one where all those playoff

teams are picking, they're not looking for always high upside guys. They're looking for guys that can contribute right away and help a team that's in the playoff get back or go higher in the playoff, and that's why the Colts are a good fit for them. Yeah, Jerry Tillery, I like his fit, especially in Annapolis here. We're going to dive into the trenches here, Eric. We're going to focus on some defensive tackles and some edge rushes here that could be some good fits for the Colts on day one or late day two

or even just early day three. And first off, I want to know after Jerry Taylor, Dexter Lawrence, you had it going here in top 20. How do you like him and also how his fit could be in Indianapolis? Yeah, I think he'd be a great fit in Indianapolis. And I think when I first started doing the mock draft, I think I put him in there and kind of penned him, thinking like if he's there, they're going to take him.

But, you know, talked to a few more people just last weekend and said, hey, I think he's going to be a higher than that. And if Dexter Lawrence crashed the top 12 picks, I won't be totally surprised. And I think he's an interesting case study of, you know, coming into the year and last year he was a top 15, top 20 pick. And then he played the whole season and played pretty well for a very good team, and now he's going to go lower than that? That's not how really I would operate.

So I think he's going to go earlier than people think, too, and I entirely agree with him. He is one of my top ten players in this draft class because I know exactly who he is. He's a high-character guy, again, a leader for that team when When he had the issue with the failed drug test or whatever it may have been, steroids, whatever it may have been, his teammates, his coaches, said nothing but strong things about him, too. That stuff really matters in your first-round pick. I think a lot of GMs feel that way.

He can play a nose-tackle spot. He's never been out of shape. He's always had a good weight over his entire career. He's been very reliable. He's been very open to supporting his teammates, which is something a lot of defensive linemen nowadays don't do a great job of. He's never a guy that has a motor concern,

and he's been productive and successful for three years at Clemson. So I think all those reasons are saying, hey, he's not the edge rusher or the DK Metcalf or the linebacker who has freakish ability like Devin White, but he's a guy I know is going to play in the league for the next 10 years and be a leader of your defense.

That's why I think he goes somewhere in the top 15 picks. But if he did follow the Colts, oil him up to get him, I think he'd be very, very excited. The same way Quinton Nelson can build your offensive line for the future, Dexter Lawrence can do that, and maybe more for a defense because of how impactful he can be. Yeah, just speaking about Dexter Lawrence there, I think it's kind of an underrated picker now between Colts fans. He's not really broad much, but if he's on the board there at 26, I think there's a good chance they might snatch him up there. But if he's there, I will be shocked if they don't take him.

That's one thing I will say. Like, I won't get shocked by a lot of things. If he's available, either there's something major going on behind the scenes or they will take him because he is a perfect fit and I know their staff likes him. Yeah, Dexter Lawrence is definitely a name to watch there for the Colts at 26. Going down the interior defensive line list, Eric, we have our next one. Kind of a guy I like who's under the radar right now,

Renaud Renaud of Arizona State. Active guy. I think he can play inside and out as far as a nose tech or a three tech or a five tech. And I think the way he played in the circuit, whether it's all-star game, senior bowl, whether it's the pro day circuit, I think teams I've talked to have been really, really impressed by him. And I'll be honest, he's a guy on film that I don't really see as a top three-round pick. I obviously evaluated him for the senior bowl and I know who he is. I know what to like about him.

And I'm always very open-minded in lot of players especially defensive linemen because i don't believe that's one of my strong suits as an evaluator um you know speaking humbly right there but uh but i do think he his activeness and his improvement over the course of his career has been really really impressive for teams too so um i do think he'd go somewhere on day two i'll kind of find more about the day two guys this week um as I talk to more teams and kind of go through all the data I have here on my notes for the whole season. But I think he's probably a late day two pick. But I think the value is he's active. He's well liked by scouts. He's fun very, very highly by West Coast scouts. I think I know some teams have round two grades on him. So he's a good guy to get in sometime on day two. I don't like

him as much, but teams seem to do. Another guy here on the interior, before we go on our edge rusher list, Eric, it's Draymond Jones out of Ohio State. There's a lot of variance on him as far as a first-round pick, maybe even a late second-round pick. What are you hearing about his status and also just him as a prospect overall? Yeah, and I'll just say overall, you know, it sometimes can be too obvious, but you generally want to draft good players from Alabama or Ohio State in the last couple years.

That seems obvious, right? And it's like, oh, I have to cop out of the evaluator. But you're not going to be wrong too often. The teams think that way, too. He gets very high praise from his coaching staff. He did a lot of things at Ohio State. They often move around and play positions and do things he probably wasn't great at,

and he did them well enough. And I think that versatility by force is a really strong thing to play positions and do things he probably wasn't great at and he did them well enough. And I think that versatility by force is a really strong thing for NFL teams. Because, you know, want to do a couple different things in the defensive line and want to move guys around. And they had a lot of retooling in the defensive line. I know that's a big area of need at multiple spots, and you know that better than I do. So I think having a guy like him is really important.

And I don't think he's going to be a guy you want to take on the round one, round two, a.k.a. a starter at the NFL level at a high level. But I think he can spot start. I think he's a really valuable backup. And I think without the Colts, he's a great fit for the Ravens. He's a great fit for teams that value defensive line depth and versatility at a high level. And then the final interior defense line I have on the list here for you, Eric,

is Isaiah Buggs out of Alabama, who you mentioned there. I think he's an Alabama prospector. He's probably going to be a little bit higher rated. What do you think about him as a prospect as well as an interior defensive lineman? Yeah, I mean, same thing, massive guy, right? Massive, long, can play on the perimeter. I think he's a five technique.

If I had to play him there, I'd play him there all day too. And he's a guy that had some, you know, there's some issues in Alabama on that defensive line this past year off the field that I think some people were, you know, there's some issues in Alabama on that defensive line this past year off the field that I think some people were, you know, hey, these guys' character issues, are they just young and getting complacent in the program? And I wouldn't say him directly, but there's been some, you know,

some issues related to the defensive line on the team overall. But I think as a talent and as a person, I talked to him, he's a great kid, works hard on the perimeter, active with his hands, can get a bit too long at times on the perimeter, but I think overall he'd be a great fit for them. And that same type of role of a guy who can be a little bit versatile, has length to play on that high technique role, even play a strong center if he had to,

but really a guy you want in the interior can be a one or two dapper. Yeah, he feels like an underrated prospect right now. I feel like he could really surge up some boards as far as watching on film. But let's go over to our edge rushers, Derek. And for me, the first one on the list here, a guy who was first off the board for you

as far as edge rushers in this range for the Colts, Cleland Farrell out of Clemson. What do you think about him? I think he'll be a raider. I think they like him quite a bit. But no, I think, you know, same as Dexter Lawrence.

I know Christian Wilkins, he went to my mock draft. I got two texts from some teams. He's going to go. He's going to go. I know that. But, you know, no, I think, you know, same as Dexter Lawrence. I know Christian Wilkins, he went to my mock draft. I got two texts from some teams. He's going to go. He's going to go. I know that. But, you know, again, something to set up for guys that are just reliable. And Colonel Farrell's been productive and successful.

And I think he does a great job of consistently generating pressure on the edge without losing gap contain. And a lot of edge rushers, especially you can go out like Josh Allen in Kentucky does it too often as well, where if he makes an outside rush move, he's giving up that spot. But Farrell really works hard, and all those Clemson guys did, because they knew that, hey, we're only going to send four, and we've got to get pressure but also not hurt our linebackers in the run game.

I think Farrell has really adopted that at a high level over his college career. So he's a guy that gets another very reliable starting edge rusher in the NFL for a long time. Can play 4-3 or 3-4. Obviously better as a 4-3 guy, I think. But I think his accuracy on the perimeter, but also never losing gap contain. Something to be said for that. Again, like Lawrence, very highly respected guy in that locker room and has a really strong

grace. From a coaching staff, it's usually pretty honest to scouts. So nothing positive things, but I do think he'll be a Raider with the 24th overall pick. That would not surprise me one bit. And they definitely need an Ed Rucker over there. And he fits a lot of the boxes they're looking for. But another guy on the list here I wanted to go over with you, Jalen Ferguson, who I know you're high on still. You have him go in your first round.

Why should teams or even draft Knicks like me not be concerned about his slower time to post at the Pro Day? And what do you think of his production overall as well? Yeah, I'll ask you that. I got a lot of pushback on him as a first round pick. And again, I have not read, I don't follow Twitter that closely, especially the last, you know, five, six months. But, you know, you tell me what,

why is there so much pushback on him as a first round pick? Because teams were not surprised at that. I mean, I think it was kind of an outside, outside the box, but I'm around one, but, you know, productive guy, et cetera. But you tell me why, why was kind of an outside of the box round one but you know productive guy etc but you tell me

why are people so opposed to him being in round one for me it's just from what I've seen and really it's just

just the slow times in the pro day and that's really all it is just that and because the production's there Eric

so it's definitely there's definitely no reason for quite some top 30 guy top 40 guy minimum but just the slow times I I think everyone's concerned about.

Yeah, and I think we value analytics a lot. And our director of analytics, Justice Mosquet, they got a lot of respect in the internet as well as with NFL teams with his pass rusher analytics and how much that combine testing can be predictive of that kind of stuff. But that being said, not every NFL team values it the same way, and I think sometimes they're right. And I think a guy that's that productive and has the length,

we've seen it enough. We've seen it, and he even played a top conference, but it's not that hard to find over the last four years, find reps against current NFL offensive tackles or top four or five-round draft picks that teams like that offensive tackle. So I think we've seen him do it well enough. He almost split up for the draft a year ago. Talking teams last year, it would have been a second, third-round pick.

I think this year he'll probably go somewhere in round two. But I'm not feeling concerned as people seem to be about his 40-time pass. I think he does go round two, but I think for a team like the Chiefs, who now they have him in the line, but since I made that trade, or I think made that mock draft, but I think that would have made a lot of sense for guys to plug and play. Hey, he may not have the highest ceiling, but he's a pass rusher that's

won in multiple ways as an end rusher and can help us right away. That's exactly what playoff teams want in their first-round pick. Yeah, Ferguson's definitely an interesting name. Listeners should be watching out for just a guy who is productive and also he has the traits, but we'll definitely see if he goes to a contender.

I think if he goes to a winning team like the Chiefs or the Patriots, he's going to fit right in over there. But let's go to the next guy on our list here, which is Chase Winovich out of Michigan. I know there's definitely a lot of barrier from what I've read. What's your thoughts on him? I think the teams that value PFF will take him pretty early. I know the guys at PFF like him a lot.

There are some teams like that. I mean, there are some teams that, you know, maybe a handful that – I mean, a lot of all teams, most's a PFF. There are some teams like that. There are some teams that maybe a handful that really – I mean, a lot of all teams, most teams get PFFs, but a lot of teams – some teams value it very highly. I think those teams are like Chase Winovich. I know Winovich well. I've seen him play live twice. I've talked to him very, very briefly.

I've talked to the coaching staff about him. He's kind of exactly what you think he'd be. He's a hardworking guy. He is very strong. He's a good athlete in getting in the air and knocking passes out as well as, you know, exploding speed to power at a very high level too. And he's won a lot of reps at Michigan, especially two years ago and a time this year.

I think the biggest thing for Winovich and what I would want him on my team on day two of the draft is that he wins reps against the best players he faces. And I think that's so valuable for a pass rusher is that he wins those reps, he gets pressure, and when he has a chance for the sack and the tackle for loss, he generally can finish at a high level. Finishing and winning a tough competition are the two things, aside from analytics on film, that I want to see and a lot of NFL teams want to see because NFL teams are investing more and more in offensive linemen,

investing heavily in that position, the guard and tackle spots. So we're getting the best of those talents, getting more money and getting a lot more snaps, a lot more focus. And pass offense, run games are much more play action or draw or quick passing offense. So when you get a shot as a pass rusher, you better finish. And Winovich does that. They're one of the better guys.

I think him, Christian Wilkins, and I think I'm missing somebody who are the best finishers when they get a chance for a sack in the backfield. So I think Winovich goes somewhere maybe early day two. Yeah, that wouldn't surprise me at all. He would be a guy who actually would fit, I think, well in the Colts system of what they do. And I wouldn't surprise me if he was picked at 34, to be honest. But let me ask you a quick question as far as two guys in the Big 12 here

to close things out with the final process here on my list for edge rushers. Ben Bonogu of TCU and also LJ Collier of TCU. Bonogu, I like a lot as far as an upside guy. I don't think I would take him in the first two days of the draft just because I think he's still very raw. And coming into the year, we had, I think, a late second round grade on him. We were very bullish on him. We heard great things about his athletic ability,

and he sort of was shown that in the draft process. But I think he's still a bit raw, and I don't trust him as an edge guy right now. And I think maybe his best fit might be a situational Sam edge rusher, and he can, you know, engage on tight ends a little bit too. So I think overall he's a guy I'm pretty impressed with. But I mean, before I tell LJ, you follow, I'm sure people on the draft mean more than I do. And I've talked to a lot of teams about these two guys in particular,

but you know, who, who do people like, seem to like more, Bonobo or Collier? I mean, they're pretty similar rated by us. I think for most draft words I'm reading around the internet and also just on draft Twitter, people that I follow along with, it seems like a near consensus about LJ Collier above him. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I think too. I think coming into the year, we didn't have that. I think we had Collier as a middle day three guy, maybe early day three,

and Minogo as a solid day two guy. But I just think Collier is an easier translate to a skill set. He can play strong side D in the 4-3 or 3-4. I think he has a great job of being aggressive, delivering with his hands, very, very strong, finishes really well, doesn't lose gap integrity on the inside. I think he's a guy you see having success in the NFL consistently. I don't want to say a guy like Chris Jones, but he can kind of add that, hey, he can play outside, he can win on the inside despite being a slider guy

and a sub-300-pound defensive tackle. I think he shows from those same flashes that Chris Jones is. Again, I don't think he's Chris Jones, but I think he'll go somewhere in the middle of the day, too. Yeah, I totally agree with you. They're a guy who's really rising up boards recently across the board. But before I let you go, Eric, appreciate the time, as always. I wanted to ask you

the ideal scenario for Colts fans out there listening to this. They've got two picks at 26 and 34, so they can get two impact guys there. What do you think is the ideal scenario for Colts fans that they're listening to this, if they're, where they had two picks at 26 and 34, so they can get two impact guys there. What do you think is the ideal scenario for them? Yeah, I think for the Colts draft, they,

they think they will and probably should wait until round three for receiver. I think that's a really important need they want to address. And I think Colts fans, I would aggressively speculate that if they can trade up in round two, round three, get Andy Isabella, I think Colts fans, I would aggressively speculate that if they can trade up in round three to get Andy Isabella, I think they will. I don't think they'll take him to round two, but I guess it wouldn't totally shock me.

But I think waiting until round three and addressing that defense in the first two rounds would be why. They crushed it last year on the offensive line. They can get a receiver somewhere on day two and again on day three of the draft. But if they can really address that defense and make that a strength, I'm going to see moving forward, which is not that far off from being after the draft

they had a year ago with Darius Leonard. And that's what they really want to do in this draft class is add key defensive players, draft a couple receivers in the aggregate, hopefully find one or two guys they can contribute this year, and then really rely on Andrew Luck, that rushing attack of a lot of guys they drafted recently, a great offensive line to be back in the playoffs next year. So I think a Dexter Lawrence or a Jerry Tillery

and then input your pass rusher or linebacker in round two to really round out that defense. Interesting about Andy Isabella. I know you mentioned that you have Dexter Lawrence on the board. The Colts are definitely interested in him. Have you heard anything about Andy Isabella with the Colts? Because it seems like you might know something there. Yeah, I might. I might. But we'll see if they take him in round two or round three of the draft. But a lot of teams like Isabella and, you know, I tell a lot of teams early in the process,

our analytics are pretty darn good, especially at receiver. And they say he's going to go mid to early, probably late round three, unless he has an unbelievable NFL combine, and he hit an unbelievable NFL combine. So I think he goes somewhere early day three. I know PFF thinks he might be a round one pickup. He's not going to go there at all. But I think late round two, early round three makes a lot of sense. And I think if the Colts want him, and they feel he's a guy that can be a slot guy or

an outside guy, along with T.Y. Hilton and keep that offense vertically attacking. I think it's a great fit. You always find possession guys or situational inside guys later on, but having explosive downfield threats like T.Y. Hilton and Eddie Zabella would be awesome for Andrew Luck's arm talent. Absolutely. I appreciate the time, Eric.

Before I let you go here, if anyone doesn't know about Optimum Sky or any other work you do, go ahead and plug whatever you want right now yeah i appreciate it man yeah well um not much to plug really optimuscouting.com we uh we do a pretty good job our job always there is to have readership and content that nfl teams and nfl agents and people in the industry care about and i hope that fans come and appreciate that too because that's what the nfl teams want to read too but um i guess things i'll say is we work with the XFL. I'm the director of player personnel of the XFL. Our team is a scouting partner of the XFL.

So now that we're the only non-NFL league in town, make sure you follow for updates and see all the cool stuff we're doing with the XFL. I'm going to forward, man. All righty, Eric. Appreciate the time. And that'll do it for today's episode, folks. Appreciate everyone listening in. We'll be back with you guys tomorrow for next episode.