Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - LOCKED ON COLTS 5/14/19: Ben Banogu 360

Episode Date: May 14, 2019

Part II of our rookie 360 series drops as we hone in on TCU EDGE/LB Ben Banogu. During his tenure with the Horned Frogs, Banogu racked up 17 sacks in 27 games on his way to also destroying the NFL Scouting Combine with a unique speed and power blend.Brett Yarris, CEO of BiokinetiX Fitness, worked with Banogu during the pre-draft process refining his pass rushing techniques. Yarris tells you all you need to know about Banogu not only with his work ethic, but also his true genuine character.Within the Colts' defense, Banogu's trainer suggests he's someone who will be utilized all over. Whether it's moving to the EDGE on pass rushing downs or playing SAM linebacker, Indianapolis loves the versatility Banogu possesses.Drew Davison, TCU beat writer for the Fort Worth Star-Telegram, stopped by during the second half of the episode to provide his perspective of Banogu. After watching him up-close at every game, what is Davison's main takeaways? Don't be surprised if Banogu is a perfect match in Matt Eberflus' scheme.If you want to learn all about Indianapolis' latest chess piece on defense, definitely tune in here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, everybody. Welcome to Locked on Colts, Partly Locked on Podcast Network. Today, as always, I'm joined by a very special guest today, Brett Yarris, who is the CEO of Biokinetics Fitness. Brett, how are you doing today? I'm doing good. Thanks for having me. Yeah, no problem at all. I know some listeners might be asking why I have the CEO of Biokinetic Fitness on, but you have a unique relationship with Ben Banigou. What are your overall opinions on him and what's your relationship with Ben? Yeah, so I had the opportunity to meet Ben right before the combine. I'm also, I also work with one of his TCU teammates, Lucas Niang, and that's how I got the chance to meet Ben and we met because Ben is probably one of the most self-aware individuals I've ever come across especially in the world of football and he had significant interest in improving on his pass rushing technique I think if anyone out

there had read any of the pre-draft assessments of Ben they would notice that a lot of people kept echoing the same theme and that he needed a lot of refinement in his pass rushing technique. And what sets Ben apart from a lot of the other guys I've worked with is that's something he identified himself and was actively seeking to work on. And so what I do with biokinetics is we use behavioral science techniques to work on positional technique for football players. And so Ben sought out my services and we formed a working relationship and we've been working together ever since. What's it just been like working with him? I know you alluded to it there is how self-aware he is, but it feels like when you see his athletic numbers, Brett, just he tests off the charts for an edge or a linebacker.

He puts up a crazy broad, broad broad jump number just 40 was a 462 for a guy his size also his vertical jump was 40 inches for a guy his size just it feels like he's a ben is a guy who's really like a multiple ball play at the moment if he could really if he goes to the 10 at the colt it seems like with a good coaching system he could really flourish in their system yeah i think you knowically speaking, you know, Ben is one of the best athletes I think who's ever come through the combine at his height and weight. You know, when you look at the different percentiles that he tested in. And the great thing about that is athletic ability for the most part is something that you can't teach. And what you want to do

when you have somebody as raw as Ben is you really have the opportunity to mold it into whatever it is you need that athletic ability for. And for Ben, the biggest issue really was learning how to take a lot of that athletic ability and put it towards something specific in terms of technique. And for a lot of people who may not know this, when you watch Ben's film from TCU, it can be real easy to sort of say, oh, he can't do this or he can't do that. And what a lot of people don't realize is that in TCU, he really was only asked to do one or two things. As an edge player, he was never really allowed to just go and get after the quarterback. He had to really do what we call a contained rush, right, which is he could rush the quarterback, but he had to do it with outside contained being

his primary responsibility. So he never really got an opportunity to really flash that athletic ability that you talk about. And so in my work with Ben, what we do is we really work on the hand technique, the footwork, all the things involved that go into being a pass rusher. Now, in terms of how that translates to the Colts defense, you know, the Colts are running a really nice version of the Tampa 2 with Eberfluss there as your defensive coordinator. And what they kind of envisioned Ben being is sort of that movable piece in really utilizing that athletic ability. I can tell you in the pre-draft process, there were a lot of teams who viewed him in that way.

The Miami Dolphins, for example, really looked at him as that Dante Hightower type of piece. The Bears really wanted to use him in that Khalil Mack role. And so the Colts have really carved out a role in their defense that, in all honesty, they had never really used before, which is this piece that can really line up anywhere in the front seven. And with Ben, all it really comes down to is learning how to maximize the different techniques involved and really incorporating that into his already stellar athletic ability. Brett, when you see the moves that he puts on tape,

I know I tweeted this out last night on my Twitter account, but that move he made, just a subtle little hesitation move on it, a guy like Drew Samia of Oklahoma gets right in Kyler Murray's face in about two seconds. What do you see on tape of the guy like Ben? Because his speed obviously is freakish, but his tools, like you said, are still a little bit raw. But what do you think is going to happen once he learns how to use his hands, once he gets the nuance of the game in that position? Yeah, I think once he puts it all together, I mean, I think there's really no stopping him.

You know, that play that you mentioned that you had put on your Twitter feed, you know, what you really see in that clip is just the elite quick twitch that he has, you know, Drew Samia is one of the top guards who were coming out. I know he wasn't a first round pick, but that's just the nature of the position, but he's a, he's a, he's going to be a great player in this league. And Ben puts it, puts this little, you know, stutter step on him and it's so sudden and so quick, but it looks so deliberate that Samir really had no chance to come back to the inside when Ben

really got in there to get to the quarterback. Now, if Ben's able to combine that with his handwork, there's really no stopping him because that's the thing that Ben has never really been asked to do before, right? At TCU, Ben's responsibility really was to engage the tackle and then disengage and make the play. And what we're seeing here is if we can teach Ben to avoid engagement altogether and really use his hands to make sure that the tackles and the guards don't really ever get their hands on him, there really is no stopping him when you combine that with the speed and the quick twitch that he has. And that's the nature of the work that him and I are doing together.

It's how to use his hands, how to set up tackles, how to be strategic and deliberate in his pass rushing. And I think we've already seen, I don't know if you guys have been able to check any of the reports coming out of minicamp and the OTAs, but he's already flashed that pass rushing ability to his coaches and to his teammates from all the things that I've read and that I've seen and heard directly from those guys is he's been dominant in his pass rushing reps so far. I know it's probably hard to explain over audio instead of like a video format, Brett, but what are some of the techniques that you use when you work with Ben? That's a good question. The best way I can explain it is the way I would to really anybody,

which is the way that I, as a behavior analyst, look at movement patterns is we look at them as what we call movement chains. One movement pattern can be broken up into individual links on a chain. And what I've done with Ben is really start to work on Neil's individual links one by one. And once one link gets mastered, we move on to the next one until we eventually put the whole chain back together. So more specifically speaking, what that means is what we've done is we've actually so far worked on about six or seven different pass rushing moves, three or four outside pass rush, and then three or four counters. And the thing that we really stressed in our work together was making sure that the first half of every single one of those moves was identical,

so that a tackle or a guard wouldn't be able to pick up and read and see what's coming. And so what that starts with is making sure that his footwork is the same each and every single time and making sure that his hands are the same each and every single time. And I think that's the refinement and that attention to detail that Ben was never really exposed to in college. But I can tell you in our work together, just like everything else, when you have these naturally gifted athletes, he picked it up very quickly and allowed us to work on these new things each and every day and we didn't have to spend so much time working on just one thing so ben went into rookie minicamp you know we were working the day of the draft so he went into rookie minicamp with five or six moves

in his back pocket that he never got the chance to showcase on tape but when he showcased it to the colts there in minicamp they were blown away wow that's super exciting stuff to hear for not only me but the listeners out there Brett but I wanted to get your thoughts as well just when you're working with Ben I know you have a close relationship with him over the past few months just I know Chris Bauer and the Colts really value character in that locker room what has been like as a person overall just his character I mean mean, that quite honestly, beyond his athletic ability, beyond anything else he does on the field, that's the thing that sets him apart is his character. He is quite honestly, one of the most genuinely good people I've been

around. You know, as a technique coach, you know, who I work with different, you know, populations, I either work with the special needs population or I work with elite athletes. And I can tell you that my work with elite athletes is very rare in that I turn a lot of people away. I'm not in the business of working with people who don't want to put the time in. I'm not in the business of flying all over the country to help kids out if they don't want to work hard or or if they're not good people and i can honestly tell you that i would fly to the moon and back if ben asked me to because that's how much i believe in this kid and believe in the young man that he is he is um you know when we when the day he got drafted you know you look at the tv and you see all these other guys who are hosting these big

parties and all these all these other things you know Ben was bunkered down in a family friend's house with about nine or ten people there total, just his closest family, his siblings, his mom, some of the family friends who helped raise him. And, you know, you really got to see his true character in that for him, it's not about the pomp and circumstance. It's about the work and it's about the journey to greatness and again just a testament to the kind of to the kind of man he is he understands that this is something that is a job this is his career and so rather than partying on draft day him and I are at his high school field working on pass rushing waiting for that phone call to come in and so that's the kind of guy Colts fans can expect, which is somebody who's going to give it his all off the field and he's going to give his all on the field. You know,

just another thing too, just to highlight, you know, throughout the entire draft process, I think there was like seven or eight different elementary schools Ben was going to just to be with the kids and talk to the kids and work with kids. You know, Ben really is one of the nicest guys. I know it sounds like I'm kind of hyping this up a little too much, but I got to be honest with you. I have not come across a guy who's the total package on and off the field with Ben. And I've worked with a ton of athletes. I've worked with guys like Ray Rice.

I've worked with guys, you know, in the college and the professional ranks. I've worked with all kinds of coaches. Ben's going to be a special kid because he has a desire about him to be great in every single facet of his life. And football is just a part of that. There's so much more to Ben than just football. Those are definitely traits that I think translate me to success long-term and short-term once you're in the NFL. And Ben definitely, it sounds like, possesses all those traits. But, Brett, before I let you go, here are some final few questions.

From Chris Ballard at his post-draft press conference, he said that he was going to play Ben at Sam Linebacker. What's your thoughts on kind of moving him around with the speed in the Appalachian he has? Because when I see him on tape, especially like the Oklahoma game, I watched it last night in full, there's so much clips in there where he goes silent to silent, where you see this really crazy speed for a guy his size.

Yeah, I think moving Ben to an off-ball linebacker position on the early downs, so when we're talking first and second down, I think that's when you really get to utilize his full athletic repertoire. You can utilize him in coverage. He can cover the tight ends in this league. He can cover the running backs out of the backfield, something we got to see him do a little bit at TCU. I think it's a great move. I think I wouldn't be shocked to see him and Leonard kind of bounce back and forth and be interchangeable pieces where one's at the Sam, one's at the Mike and vice versa. And then in the

sub packages, I think you can expect to see Ben getting after the quarterback a little bit. And again, I think that's just what he brings to the table, which is his ability to play pretty much anywhere in that front seven. And when you have a versatile piece like this, it's, you know, it's no shocker that the Colts who have a renowned coaching staff, Chris Ballard's one of the best GMs in football, you know, these guys know how to use players like that. And I think Ben brings an element to that Tampa 2 defense, that 4-3 Tampa 2 defense that the Colts run that they haven't had before, which is a guy that can put his hand in the ground,

a guy that can line up on the line in a two-point stance, and then a guy you can put at the same linebacker and have him cover multiple positions. Yeah, that's going to be really exciting to watch with Ben Banigou this season and moving forward because I think he's going to be a guy who starts from the jump day one and really what it sounds like from what you say he's really impressed the coaches so far in rookie minicamp OTAs starting up here soon going to be really exciting Brett but anything else maybe a parting shot to the listener out there as far as a final closing thought on Ben and what they're going to bring

Indianapolis yeah you know I my first time going to Indianapolis was at the combine this year and I, you know, I personally fell in love with the city. And one of the things you hear about Indianapolis, you hear about Colts, you hear about the Colts fans is, you know, they just want hardworking guys. They want guys who are going to come in and contribute to this winning culture that Chris Ballard has really put in place. And quite honestly, I think that was just as big a piece into taking Ben Banigou in that second round as anything else in that he's

going to come in and he's going to contribute to that strong culture that makes up that Indianapolis Colts organization. And he's going to not only do that in the locker room, but he's going to produce results on the field. I'm excited for the young man. He's somebody that I've gotten to know, you know, quite well over these last couple months. And he's one of the, he's certainly one of the players I've been most excited in working with. And just to give you guys one last example, you know, when we were working together, we work about two, three hours at a time and we go nonstop, no breaks. And I have a pretty good practice format in which we try to go and get through as many things as we can. And one of the things as a coach, you love to hear from a player is when you go to move on to a next drill, when the player doesn't feel 100% comfortable,

you love to hear that guy say, hey, you know what, let me do this one more time. Let me run it again. I want to run it again, instead of just being happy to move on towards the end of the practice. And that's the kind of guy you're going to get from Ben. He is not going to stop until he gets it right. And I think Colts fans are going to be really excited to have him on their roster. This was a lot of fun, Brett. I appreciate you coming on. You can follow Brett on Twitter at Brett underscore PFN underscore BX.

Thanks again for coming on, Brett. I really appreciate it. Thanks a lot, Evan. Have a great day. Hello, everybody. Welcome in to Locked On Colts Party, Locked On Podcast Network. Today's host is Evan Sider. I'm joined by a very special guest here for part two of our Ben Banigou 360 series,

and that is Drew Davison, the TCU beat writer over at the Fort Worth Telegram. How are you doing? Hey, I'm doing good, Evan. Thanks for having me on. Yeah, no problem at all. Thanks for calling, Drew. Appreciate it. And we're going to dive in more into Ben Bannego.

We just had on his technique coach, Brett Yarris, who was helping him out during the pre-draft process. But from your point of view as the beat writer for TCU, what was it like covering Ben Bannego the last year? Yeah, I mean, he is certainly a dynamic player coming off the edge. Had eight and a half sacks each of the last two years, all Big 12 conference. And he was a guy who certainly, you know, he always made a big play, it seemed like, you know, kind of at the right time. I remember a fumble return for a touchdown earlier this season, which kind of broke that or put that game away.

And, you know, he seemed to come up with a timely sack when TC needed it, especially late in the season when they were fighting for bowl eligibility. So certainly a guy you easily noticed just watching the game, whether, you know, you were watching it real closely or if you're just a casual fan, Ben Vannegut certainly stood out to you. Let me ask you this. I know he blew up the combine with his freakish numbers at his size, but when you saw him up close at every game, did that speed stand out to you in person? Yeah, absolutely.

That's the thing. In Gary Patterson's defense, he did a lot of stand-up off the edge kind of rushing, and his speed is something that, you know, you could notice immediately. And I, you know, know there's a few knocks or questions about, you know, his ability to defend the run. But, you know, I remember him chasing down running backs and things of that nature. So, you know, I'm not exactly sure what scouts

or what some analysts kind of saw where they questioned his run defense. But I thought the speed showed up. And, you know, he's a guy, you know, he'll be a quick study. He picks up defenses quick. And certainly he utilized his speed well to get around the edge and get pressure on the quarterback as well as, you know, chase down the ball carrier, whether it's, you know, the running back or something out of the backfield or wide receiver.

I wanted to also hit on this, just the character standpoint of Ben, because we had on Brad, he gave some really glowing praise for Ben as far as his character goes. From your point of view as the beat writer, you probably interact with Ben a lot throughout the season. What was your interactions like with him? Yeah, I mean, obviously a very friendly guy, a very knowledgeable guy, a very smart guy.

You know, he's a kid who, and I'm sure it appealed to the Colts, you know, they're not going to have any sleepless nights or I would be surprised if they have many sleepless nights worrying about Ben Banigou off the field and whether or not, you know, he's doing the right thing. You know, he's a guy who's committed to, you know, giving back and doing what he can and kind of understands the platform he has and really used it, you know, even at TCU, you know, he was obviously done with the season, and he's

sitting there working with Parker Workman, one of their JUCO defensive end, you know, guys coming in because he wants to kind of make sure the TCU legacy, the defensive end legacy, so to speak, is all well and good, so he's a guy, you know, who was kind of a Gary Patterson. You know, they don't make a ton of players available to the media, but Ben was certainly always one of them because they trusted and knew he would, you know, handle himself the right way. And off the field, you know, like I said, the Colts, you know, I'm sure that was part of the appeal, you know, being able to just go to sleep and not worry about one of your top draft picks.

How valuable was Ben Banigou, that TCU defense, over the last year or so? Because obviously LJ Collier won the first round, Banigou won 49th overall, but what does it say about that defense producing not only Banigou, but also LJ Collier out of that front seven? Does it seem like elite talent dripping out of TCU right now? Yeah, well, and here's the thing. I mean, TCU is coming off a double-digit win season in 2017, and they had some pretty high expectations.

But, you know, there's the point of the season. They were four and six. It looked like the season was lost, and they weren't going to make a bowl game. But kind of the constant, the one thing that carried them, especially down the stretch, was Ben and LJ, the two, you know, top 50 draft picks, you know, getting pressure on the quarterback and doing the things, obviously, on the field to keep them in contention and keep offenses from scoring points. But more than that, you know, especially Ben kind of didn't let guys get down on themselves

and still finish the season strong, even though, you know, they were just playing for a second-tier bowl. You know, those are the kind of guys I think Gary Patterson likes. And, you know, he made a huge impact, like I said, I mean, especially down the stretch. I mean, TCU could have easily gone four and eight this season and ended up winning their last three games. And, you know, they had some off-field issues with a couple guys,

one guy to get kicked off the team. So it really could have been a disastrous season or one of the very few losing seasons under Gary Patterson. And I think Ben Bannigan, I think Gary Patterson would tell you the same thing, is a significant reason why they were able to get to where they went. If you had to pick one moment over the last year or so covering Ben at a game, what was the one game where you said, whoa, this guy is a NFL prospect, he's really impressed me right now, if you had to pick one game?

Putting me on the spot, Evan. I'm trying to think one game you know there is a uh I think you know I apologize I'm going blank on one specific game because of course we knew he has an NFL caliber talent uh you know coming in, you know, even the bowl game, I know he was already there, but, you know, I think the Cal bowl game, he really showed up and finished strong, was able to get a sack. And TCU had several guys get sacks that game and really kind of end on a high note.

I know Ty Summers, he was the seventh-round pick by the Packers, and LJ and Ben, they each had sacks. So, you know, that's one game that kind of stood out to me of just, hey, you know, this – especially Ben, he's ready to go and, you know, trying to boost his stock and whatnot. And they, from start to finish, they knew how valuable, you know, getting good film out there was for the Scouts. Yeah, it's really interesting just to see the production he had. Also, LJ Collier, those guys really made a lot of noise for TCU over the past couple

of years. But if I had to just hone in on one sort of trait with Ben, I think it's his speed. And when you hear Chris Ballard say at his post-draft press conference that they were thinking about moving Ben to Sam Linebacker instead of an edge rusher position, what do you think about the possibilities of moving Banigou from defensive line to stand linebacker instead of an edge rusher position. What do you think about the possibilities of moving Banigou from defensive line to linebacker position? Yeah, I definitely think that's a good possibility. And, you know, he worked at edge linebacker with the Raiders at the Senior Bowl and picked it up fairly well. He, you know, I remember one play, you know, in team drills where, you know,

he picked up the run pretty well. So I think he will be a good study. He'll be an interesting – you know, I thought they – Ben feels he can play all seven of the front seven positions. I don't know if, you know, he's going to line up at nose tackle ever in his life. But, no, I do think, you know, he has, he played a lot of coverage, you know, he did, he did cover the tight end and things of that nature, you know, kind of from the standup defensive end in Patterson's four to five.

So I think that'll be a fairly seamless transition and, you know, he'll still be able to bring some pressure off the edge in that regard as well. But I do think, you know think he's going to be a quick study. He's going to learn. And I still think there's a pretty high ceiling for him just because of his athleticism. And if he gets in the right system, right scheme, he'll be able to do some damage. How challenging is it, I mean, from Ben's perspective, I know other players

perspective on defense, but it seemed like Gary Patterson's defense is pretty intricate, pretty demanding. I know Ben was wearing the, when I watched the film, he's the one wearing the play call sheet. Just how demanding is from Ben's perspective, running that defense, sort of being the leader of Gary Patterson's system? Oh, I mean, there's definitely pressure. And certainly Gary Patterson, you know, is known for his defense, is known for having a pretty healthy defensive entry. And, you know, he had to, you know, there's more responsibilities. He was not a guy who just, you know, hey, just go rush the passer or whatnot. I mean, there's a lot of intricacies to the defense where he had to pick up

and get other linemen lined up and, you know, whether he had to carry a back out of the backfield or whatnot. So he did have a lot of responsibilities, and certainly he was able to lead that defense. And, you know, for as much injuries as they had on the defensive front, you know, they were still able to get pressure on the quarterback. And a big reason was Ben. And, you know, he certainly kind of embraced that leadership role being that kind of the point man, so to speak, on the D-line. Yeah, it really does intrigue me, I think, just long-term because I think he carries all the traits that the Colts really covet,

just the character standpoint, the athleticism standpoint. I just think he's going to be a really super exciting piece to add to this defense. One more thing I wanted to ask you, Drew, before I let you go, is the versatility aspect of a guy like Ben Banigou. What do you think, just when you see a guy come up close and linebacker, but what do you

see as far as a versatile chess piece like Ben Vanigou in the NFL? Well, I think he's definitely going to be an interesting thing. Matt Eberflus, I was the backup Cowboys rider kind of when Eberflus was the linebackers coach and he's a very uh I know kind of a Rod Marinelli disciple but you know they've always you know but you know kind of you could just tell by his

coaching style well first off he's very similar to Gary Patterson in his energy and intensity but I think you know just kind of how he sees players and utilizes them to their best abilities, it will be intriguing. I think he's in a great spot, you know, especially with, you know, kind of Matt Eberflus calling the shots and really getting the most out of him, whether it's, you know, putting him in pass rush situations or playing him at linebacker and whatnot. So I think, you know, he's got the versatility to do it all.

You know, I think he was a quick study at the Senior Bowl, but obviously there's a lot of growth still to go in the linebacker room. So I think he'll be able to pick it up. And once he does, you know, for a kid who runs as fast as he does, I think he'll, you know, kind of be able to really carve out his niche and make a nice mark with the Colts. But obviously I'm a Matt Eberflus fan. I think he'll do a good job with Ben Banigan,

especially just with the Ross traits and being able to mold him into that versatility role, which is, you know, obviously so valuable in today's game. You know, having guys being able to do multiple things on the field and things of that nature. I'd be remiss not to ask you now, Drew, since you brought it up. It's about your Cowboy experience. Do you believe that Matt Eberfluss, I know he did awesome last year,

he added in the piece like Banigou to give him more help, but I think it was so impressive the way he did last year with the defense and the lack of piece he really had with how young they were. Do you think it's only a matter of time before someone scoops in and kind of steals away Matty Rufus from the Colts? Yeah, I certainly think he's a head coach in waiting, or obviously not for the Colts, but just a head coach candidate. I think he'll get a job.

I know he got a few interviews this offseason. But, yeah, I definitely do. And I think, you know, he'll make a very good head coach one day because, you know, he learned just looking at the pedigree. I know Rod Marinelli didn't have the best Detroit Lions head coaching stint, but still his defense and being from that Tampa 2 tree, you know, going back to the Tony Dungy, you know, that's a pretty good tree and good mentors to kind of have lineage to. And I do think Matt Eberflus is going to be a head coach one day

and a pretty dang good one. Hey, Drew, this is a lot of fun. I appreciate you coming on here to talk a little bit more about Ben Banigou and what his field will be like in Indianapolis. You can follow Drew over on Twitter, at Drew Davison. Thanks again for coming on, Drew. Appreciate it.