Locked On Colts - Daily Podcast On The Indianapolis Colts - LOCKED ON COLTS 6/6/20: Predicting biggest breakout players with IndyStar's Jim Ayello

Episode Date: June 6, 2020

On today's episode, IndyStar's Jim Ayello joins as we run through the gamut on potential Colts breakout players this season.Parris Campbell and Nyheim Hines will be huge impacts for a QB like Philip Rivers. Expect to see plenty of these two on quick concepts, and maybe even Hines split out more often alongside Campbell in the slot.Defensively, Bobby Okereke is gaining a ton of steam as a big breakout contender internally. Will he take Anthony Walker's starting spot? We also discuss Kemoko Turay and Rock Ya-Sin as potential players who could take the big leap in 2020-21.Why is Braden Smith flying so far under the radar? He could be in line for a Pro Bowl year on the Colts' offensive line.All of this, plus so much more, in a jam-packed episode! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, everybody. Welcome back into your latest episode of Locked On Colts, probably Locked On Podcast Network. Today's host is Evan Setter. Enjoyed being a recurring guest on our show. I know it was always a joy having him on as well. Jim Aiello of the Indianapolis Star. Jim, how are you doing today? Doing well. Doing well. It's been an interesting couple of weeks. Very challenging couple of weeks, I think, for everybody, but I think in a good way. I know a lot of bad things have happened, but I think we're seeing a lot of,

hopefully, good coming out of it. Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate you starting off with that. I hope everyone's staying safe out there through these tough times. And we're definitely seeing a lot of reform and a lot of change hopefully happening here soon around the country. But, Jim, we're going to talk today about breakout, possible breakout players for the Annapolis Colts this year. Maybe some rookies, some second-year guys, third-year players. You're really taking a leap this year.

And starting off this, I wanted to hit on two players. I think we talked before, I believe, a month or so ago, when we hit on Phillip Rivers signing back in March. I really believe Paris Campbell could be in for a huge breakout this year, Jim, just with the way that he's always used these quick checkdowns. I know Naeem Hines could be like the new Danny Wood at Darren Sproles type, but I feel like Paris Campbell's kind of flying in the air right now, Jim. I agree.

Actually, I put out a Twitter poll the other day just kind of asking who people thought were going to have more catches. It was going to be Michael Pittman or Paris Campbell's kind of flying in the rear right now, Jim. I agree. Actually, I put out a Twitter poll the other day just kind of asking who people thought were going to have more catches. It was going to be Michael Pittman or Paris Campbell. And not just a surprise to me, but I think there's a lot of excitement around Michael Pittman, and there should be. I mean, the guy's got a lot of talent, a lot of upside, especially in this offense.

But he won pretty predictably. I think it was like 60% to 40%. And I actually would go the other way. I actually think Parisis campbell's going to be more involved and that's that has a lot to do with paris campbell but i'll let me get the other kind of caveat out of the way i think with the way the nfl offseason is working right now it's gonna be really hard for all rookies not just michael pitman but for all rookies to kind of get up to speed on these nfl offenses i know they're they're hard at work and they're

studying and they're working out and they're going to be ready i think physically but I just don't think there's any way to kind of replicate those, those reps that you get. And then, you know, you can kind of become, make habits of some of the things that you need to do. So a guy like Paris Campbell, I know he was hurt a lot last year, but he knows this offense. He spent a lot of time studying it. He actually spent a lot of time working on all three positions within the Colts receiving options, I should say. So, you know, he'll work with the X, work with the Y, work out of the slot. And he knows those positions and he knows how to, and he knows what is expected from those positions. So that's one of the reasons I actually think he's going to have a really good

start to the year is because again, assuming health because he's already very familiar with Frank Reich's offense. He's very smart guy. He knows how to pick up on the offense pretty quickly. So I'm not, I don't anticipate him being behind at all when the season starts and then to get to your point like I just the guy is still a game breaker in terms of the speed that he has and I know people maybe have forgotten about that like you said flying under the radar just because he he was hurt so often but when he was getting onto the field and getting into a rhythm he was very hard for corners to keep up

with um he's getting to become a better and more nuanced route runner. If you go back and look at him with his route running, he was working with Frank Reich and Kevin Petula and T.Y. Hilton on perfecting that part of his craft because, obviously, there's like the speed and the explosiveness. That's the other part about Ferris Campbell that I think people kind of forget. They see the 4.3 speed, but he's very explosive in and out of breaks. And so that's going to be something that DBs are going to have a hard time

keeping up with. If he could just stay on the field, I really think the Colts are going to do a good job of getting him the ball in space. And like you mentioned right at the beginning, at the top of this, I think that's going to be a lot of short throws. It's going to be some slants, some stuff behind the line of scrimmage. I think they're going to try to work hard to get him the ball and then let him

kind of just wreak havoc with that speed that he has. And don't forget, they have receivers, which I think is important in this part of the game, willing to block and who are good blockers. They're going to have guys like Zach Paschal out there and Michael Pittman, who is a big body who likes to block to create space for him in the open field. So I think those things are going to be really important. Absolutely agree with you. How important do you think Jim is for Paris to take this leap in year two? Because if he does take that leap forward, he is the game breaker Frank Reich was fawning over last year in the pre-draft process.

How much does that change things when you add Michael Pittman alongside him with T.Y. Hilton? I feel like Paris Campbell is sort of the X factor in this wide receiver room this year. Yeah, I totally agree. I mean, I think he's going to be used – again, if he can stay healthy, I think he's going to be up – maybe I wouldn't say a focal point. I think the offense in the passing game is going to run through T.Y. I mean, I think he's going to be used if he, again, if he can stay healthy, I think he's going to be up. Maybe I wouldn't say a focal point. I think the offense and the passing game is going to run through T.Y.

Hilton and you're going to see a lot of Jack Doyle, a lot of Naeem Hines obviously involved as well, but he's the kind of guy that can take the top off of the defense. He's the kind of guy that, that a defensive coordinators have to scheme for because they know that they can't play, you know, cover one. They're going to have to play with cup two or three safeties deep because of a guy like Paris Hilton speed. And you already have to worry about the guy with you know with T.Y.

Hilton speed but when you have two of those guys that's really really tough to uh defend but the other thing I wanted to say about him this is really important year two for him because he had such a year one and I think mentally he's a strong kid and he's got a lot of support he talked about his family support when we talked to him a couple weeks ago. He's got support within the team, but that's going to be really – and he overcame the hurdles of getting hurt, but it's going to be really hard for him to do that again. I mean, not to say he can't, but it would be really hard for him

if he had a second year with a lot of injuries. I just think it would be really hard for him to bounce back mentally and to get back to where he needs to be. So I think it's a critical year for him. And, again, if he stays healthy, I really do think he's going to be a big part of the offense. Moving on here to another underrated playmaker, I think one who's getting a lot of noise, really rightfully so,

with how silver is the running backs. And also we see how much of a game-breaker he was last year against Carolina in the special teams department, Naeem Hines, Jim. What do you think his role could be like in 2020? Because he could be one of those big beneficiaries like from rivers. Yeah, it's funny. We got a chance to talk to Naeem the other day and we spent a lot of time talking about, you know, the social issues that, that,

that Naeem brought to the light, which was good. But he also did talk about like, you know, when he first got to Indianapolis, he, he watched a lot of Danny Woodhead tape because that's, that's kind of the offense Frank Reich was installing from the San Diego days. And that was the guy that caught, I think, something like 80 or 90 passes in one of those seasons. And obviously, you know, that offense was different last year, but Austin Eckler had, I think, over 100 targets and 80 or 90 catches. So that's an offense that has really highlighted throwing to the running backs. You even look at,

like, Doug Peterson. That's the team that really loved throwing to running backs. Theron Sproles being kind of the inspiration there. So you're definitely going to see Naheem Hines on the field. I mean, I know a lot of people worry kind of about the play time. Where's it going to come from? You got Jonathan Taylor and you got Marlon Mack, and everybody says, hey, Jonathan Taylor is actually a better pass catcher than you think.

Okay, well, then where does that leave room for Naheem Hines? Well, Frank Reich said it. Like, we're going to make space for him because, again, he's an explosive playmaker. He catches the ball well. He's easily the best pass-catching running back they have. He's easily the best route-running running back they have. So on third downs, I expect to see him out there quite a bit. And I do think, you know, Frank Reich said there's going to be a game where he has 10 catches. They're going to have matchups against linebackers, against safeties, and even against some corners that they're going to like,

and they're going to take advantage of that. And so Naheem Hines needs to keep working on being that specialized weapon that he has become over these last couple years, which is one, you know, be explosive in the punt return game, the kick return game, which he was right at the end of last season, as you mentioned.

But then two is to take advantage of those opportunities that he gets in the running game and in the passing game. He wasn't the most effective runner last year when he got the ball, so he needs to do a better job of kind of being that change of pace guy when running the ball. But then obviously, like I said, pass catching, I think he's going to thrive this year just because Phillip Rivers

and Frank Reich have such a long history of throwing to the backs. How do you think it's going to be spread out there, Jim? Of course, you're going to see a lot of Taylor and Marlon Mack toiling the rock there for the Colts in the backfield. But do you think Hines will just be an exclusive third down back? Or maybe you see him more in like a wide receiver role this year? Yeah, I was about to say, I think that you could see him split out, especially if you get guys hurt.

If Paris Campbell were to get hurt or T.Y. Hilton were to get hurt, you might see a guy like Naheem Hines step in. Like if T.Y. got hurt, maybe you'd kick Paris out to the end. You could do that. I mean, obviously you have Zach Castle, and he's a solid receiver that we'll use. But you have different options that you can kind of toy with and play with depending on matchups. I wouldn't be surprised to see some two running back sets, honestly.

Like obviously they'll have Roosevelt next running fullback, so that's not really what I mean. What I mean is maybe a lineup with Naheem Hines and Marlon Mack or with Naheem Hines and Jonathan Taylor, where you can get him out there and do some creative things and kind of mess with the defensive coordinator. So I definitely expect Frank Wright to be creative. I think one of the reasons that he brought in

and created a new position for Mike Groh, and I shouldn't say he created the position for Groh, Petula became the pass game specialist, Groh became the wide receivers coach, but he's got another kind of passing aficionado in the room. And I think they're going to really kind of explore some different ideas and different concepts. And Naeem Hines is one of those guys I expect to be the beneficiary of that. Colts fans, Bilt Bar is the best tasting protein bar ever. As you all know, it's the best tasting protein bar with taste just like a candy bar as well. It's 16 amazing flavors, eight chocolate nut flavors and eight chocolate nut free flavors. The bar is covered in 100% chocolate too, and they're soft and easy to chew. The Bilt

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Again, Colts fans, use promo code LOCKEDON, L-O-C-K-E-D-O-N, for $10 off at BiltBar.com. BiltBar.com, B-U-I-L-T-B-A-R.com. Colts fans can take advantage of this deal right away. Yeah, definitely agree with you there. Moving over to the other side of the field for a second. Internally, Jim, we've heard so much about Bobby Okereke

from Jim Irsay, from Chris Bauer, and everyone on that defense staff. It was really rave about Bobby Okereke. He did really well last year for the Colts, second half of the year. What's the expectation, I think, for Okereke in 2020? Because I think it's a real possibility that if Anthony Walker struggles a little bit at the beginning of the season, we could see Okereke take over at Mike. I actually think we might see him anyway.

I haven't come out and said this right now, but I think it's going to be kind of an open competition in whatever form of training camp we get. We know that Darius is locked in to the weak side and, and Bobby's going to be the, you know, the locked in strong side starting linebacker when they're playing three linebacker sets. But as we all know, in the modern NFL, that doesn't happen very often anymore. There's, it's mostly two linebackers or even one linebacker out there because he's all

these sub packages with nickel and dime and those things. So you, like you said, I think it's going to be kind of an open competition to see who's going to win those, those extra snaps. And like you said, the mic. And so they love Okereke's athleticism. They love his length. Speed. It's going to be hard. Anthony Walker is a very, very solid veteran. I mean, the guy, I think he had, I knew it was leading tackler last year, but I think he had like something like 17 tackles in the final game of the season. I mean,

he's very good at what he does. Now, I don't think he's as physically gifted as Bobby Okereke. And when Bobby Okereke gets a hold of the scheme and really starts to feel comfortable in it, which he started to at times last year, it's just going to be a tough competition for Anthony Walker to win. I don't, I'm not saying he can't. And I do think they're going to find snaps for all three of those backers. But I think as we move through the season, you're going to see more and more of Bobby Okereke. And like you said, there's a lot of excitement for what he can do. They just really, really love his ability to get sideline to sideline

and his ability to cover. And that's something that you need to do in the modern NFL. You need to be able to cover tight ends and backs like Naheem Hines. And so that's something I think they think Bobby can do very well. And paired with Darius Leonard, that makes them very formidable. Moving to the secondary for a second, Jim, I think a player who did very well for himself as well the second half of the year. And after his really rough eyeing at Cortland Sutton and the Broncos last year, Rock is generally settled down. And I think he could be in for a big year too. If he takes another leap leap forward, Jim that changes this dynamic and secondary because if Xavier Rhodes gets back

to his 2017 form release gets close to that with Jonathan Gannon, now reuniting with him in the DB room. What do you think Rocky is sin and his year two could look like? That's I mean, that, that's, that's kind of the money question for me. Cause I think with the forest Buckner and the guys they have up front, you've kind of solidified the defensive line. We just talked about this, that, that second line of defense now in the, in the linebacking core,

which I think is again, one of the strengths of the team. They're pretty deep there, even beyond guys like Darius and Walker and, and Bobby. So now you have this backend and you have some question marks, right? I mean, other than Kenny Moore, I don't think there's anybody that you're like locked in on. This guy is going to be a star this year. Malik Hooker had that fifth year option to climb, needs to stay healthy, prove he can be, you know, a game, like a ball hawk and a guy that can kind of change games from where he is back there.

Kari Willis had a great, you know, rookie season, but needs to, I mean, I think he's going to try to make more of an impact. And again, sophomore year, you don't really know. And then as you mentioned, Xavier Rhodes has had two really tough years in Minnesota. I mean, really tough years. I think they liked him there. I know there was some clashes with the coach,

but I don't necessarily think they would have cut him or anything like that if he had played up to his potential. But really never, like, just didn't really ever look like that corner from 2017. And so Rock needs to step up because Xavier goes in, I think, as the nominal number one corner. But I think, outside of Kenny Moore, of course, but he's a slot guy. But I do think that if Rock steps up, that's a huge, huge thing for the Colts because if he doesn't, you could easily see that being the weakness

of the Colts this year is, hey, the secondary isn't really doing its job, and the front seven are getting to the quarterback, but they're still getting beat. So if Rock does take that step up, and to to your point after that game against denver he responded so well i don't think there's any more penalties the rest of the year maybe one but i don't think there were any penalties after after that game and he was quiet and that's one of his defensive backs are kind of like kind of like offensive linemen in a way if you don't hear their name called very often during during a game you know something's going well of course you'd like to see him get

interceptions and knock passes away but often they're just not being thrown at and I think a lot of the time Rock last year wasn't being thrown at toward the end of the season so he was definitely taking steps in the right direction if he becomes that number one corner that I know Chris Ballard thinks he can become that kind of gives them you know stars or really really solid players at every level of the defense. Kamoko Ture, Jim, I think is one more player to show on the defensive side because we saw against L.A. last year in the opener. We saw it in Kansas City over and over against Patrick Mahomes. The type of speed and bend he has on the edge there is very rare,

and the Colts are very excited about him. Frank Reich, Chris Bauer mentioned he could be buying for that starting spot to replace Jabal Shearer. If he's even a third down package player, Jim, just the potential that Kamoko Turi has is sky high. What's your expectation for Kamoko Turi entering year three where he should be in line for a big breakout with DeForest Buckner alongside him?

Yeah, it's all about that health. I mean, it's kind of the same with Paris Campbell, right? I mean, it's just a matter of if he can stay healthy and stay on the field. I think the potential is astronomical, really. I mean, like you said, it's rare bend combined with the speed that is astronomical really I mean like you said it's rare bend uh combined with the speed that he has I mean Frank Reich talked about this recently is like I mean most pass rushers have speed and bend but they don't really have it to the level that

Kamoko has it and so if he can put that all together which we saw glimpses of it and in Kansas City on the last play when he broke that, he was still getting a sack of Patrick Mahomes. I mean, he was doing things that the Colts were dreaming of when they drafted him. So he's the kind of guy that if he does take that next step can maybe change the Colts defense. Cause you have to force Buckner and you know, he's going to wreak havoc from the inside. I know Danico Autry didn't have a great season last year,

but he can definitely make a mess of the inside for, for the Colts in the right situations. And they have some other guys on the interior that they really like. Now, you know, you have Justin Houston, assuming that he, you know, doesn't fall off a table in his age 30, I think one or 32 season. Then you just have that other guy on the other edge that if he is making trouble for offensive lines on the other side, that just puts this whole thing, I mean, it puts it to bed for the Colts. They'll have great passers on both sides and on the interior. And then the secondary questions that we talked about just a minute ago

won't be as big a deal because these guys are getting to the quarterback so fast. So, Kamoko Ture is almost, I know we've all kind of talked about Devorah Spuckner being the kind of the key to unlocking the defense. One of the things he can unlock is more potential and less attention paid on the edges to Justin Houston, to Kamoko Ture. And if Ture is the defender that they think he's going to be, and the pass rushing force they think he's going to be, he could be in for a big season.

I honestly do think that last year we were looking at maybe an eight to nine to 10 sack season for Kamoko Ture. And if he can do that, then year three, that would be huge for the Colts. I know this player really isn't in line for a breakout, so to say, but nationally he does fly under the radar locally. I think he's very much well respected.

And that's Braden Smith, Jim, because the right tackle there, former draft to be the right guard alongside Quinn Nelson, left guard transitions over after an injury there and really thrives in that role. What's been your thoughts on Braden Smith throughout his career so far and entering year three where he could be in line, I think, for a Pro Bowl appearance if he keeps improving?

Total, like, couldn't agree with you more. Just total disrespect, I think, nationally. I think locally he's starting to get more respect. I think people don't understand that a lot of times the right tackle faces the best pass rushers in football. A lot of the time playing left end and that left outside linebacker spot. I wish I don't have the games in front of me, but there was a point where he was facing like all pro pass rusher,

all pro like after like one after another, one after another. And he was getting beat occasionally, but you know, those guys, that's those guys job. That's why they're all pros. They're going to beat right tackle sometimes. And I thought he held up very well. If you look at the stats uh that they on the running game he actually fared very well when the Colts ran outside his right shoulder so wide and and with and on the inside of him too they they did run well going right um so I do

think that he is like I know it's weird to say if a guy is going into his third year but I think he's kind of annually undervalued like you said he he switched positions first all. So we should all remember that that wasn't his natural position. They drafted him to be a guard. He's playing tackle. And he's doing it at a high level. And I think it's one of those things where maybe he gets overshadowed by the draft class that he was in. You know, he was in it not only with a guy like Darius Leonard, but one of the best guards in football now in Quentin Nelson. And then you have Anthony Costanzo, who is another guy who is very underrated at left tackle. And so a lot of attention gets paid to those two. You got Ryan Kelly, who's a pro bowler last year. So I think there's a reason he kind of flies under the radar. You have so many other great players with him. But I really do think he is undervalued

for what he does for this offensive line. He is so critical to that right side. And it's so young. I mean, you look at the Colts' offensive line right now with Ryan Kelly, Quinton Nelson, and Braden Smith. You have to think 25 to 28 other teams would be just in an instant trade what they have on offensive line for what the Colts have just on those three young guys alone. So Braden Smith is definitely part of that young core. It should be really – I wrote about this recently.

It'll be really interesting to see after year three for him, he's eligible for an extension just like Darius Leonard, just like Quentin Nelson, everybody else in that draft class. I'd be very interested to see if the Colts are going to pursue extension with him because I really do think he is a building block for their future. All the players we know today, Jim, on this episode, from Paris Campbell, Nian Hines, all the way to Braden Smith and the rest on the defense there. This young court,

the Colts put in place, I think is so impressive. And it feels like these types of pieces are going to be the really the swing pieces. So to say, if the Colts want to take that leap forward to make a tender next year. And if that does happen, generally the sky's the limit for this sort of team this year,

because they've already, they've upgraded where they had to get to force Buckner, Phillip rivers. And now if these young guys ascend, which I think the Colts are expecting them to, they could be in for a real surprise around nationally as far as being a team that can win 10-plus games. Yeah, it was funny. I was just thinking.

I was like, man, I feel like I've just been kind of rah-rah. Every guy you've thrown at me, I've been like, oh, yeah, the potential's great. But then I realized you've been throwing these young, exciting players that the Colts have, and they have a lot of them. So I think there's a lot of upside, and there's a lot of reason to be excited about all the guys we talked about and some of the guys we didn't. I mean, we didn't even dive into the rookies, right? Jonathan Taylor, Michael Pittman. I mean, some of the guys that are going to make big impacts,

and then maybe even some of the veterans like Doyle and Trey Burton. And I know I'm only talking about the offensive side of the ball, but those are the guys that could help this offense take the next step. But to your point, this was a team that won seven games with a kicking game that just completely fell apart and a quarterback who fell apart in the second half. Whether that's caused by injury or not, that's what happened in the second half of the season.

If they fix the kicking woes, if Phillip Rivers is the guy that Frank Reich says he is, which is the guy who hasn't lost a step from what is a borderline Hall of Fame career, there's no reason they couldn't be a 10-11 win team this year. Jim, always enjoy having you on the podcast and our listeners do as well. You can go follow Jim on Twitter at Jim Aiello. You can read his work at the Indy Star and also his Colts Cover 2 podcast he hosts with

fellow Indy Star, Joel A. Erickson. Jim, appreciate the time as always. Thank you. Thanks for having me as always. Thanks, Evan.