Locked On Lakers - Daily Podcast On The Los Angeles Lakers - Grizzlies Trade Desmond Bane for Multiple Firsts. Could Lakers get Same for Austin Reaves?

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey, everyone, welcome to Lockdown Lakers for Monday. Brian Komenetsky, Andy Kaminetsky, Memphis Guard. Desmond Bain is heading to Orlando for four first round picks. So what does that mean Austin Reeves' worth? That's next. You are Locked on Lakers. Your daily Los Angeles Lakers podcast, part of the Locked on Podcasts Network. Your team, every day.

Starting point is 00:00:30 Thanks to everybody for making Locked on Lakers. First listening to every day, Monday through Friday, no matter how we get your podcast. This one's always free, never behind a paywall. Locked on Lakers on YouTube is where over 35,000 subscribers, including the guys in the control room at the Hollywood Bowl, are all hanging out, watching us, talking to each other, leaving questions, leaving comments.

Starting point is 00:00:53 We appreciate all of the feedback that we get, all of the interaction. We do read the comments every day, so make sure you are leaving stuff there, especially in the offseason, because it does inform our choices for what we talk about. And to make sure people understand what Brian's talking about, one of our producers over at 710 ESPN

Starting point is 00:01:14 where Brian and I regularly appear and I do my weekly show Lakers talk, one of our producers was at the Hollywood Bowl on, I believe, Thursday night seeing Mumford and Sons and happened to walk past the control room, you know, where everything, ground zero, where everything is taking place. It keeps everything on the rails. And someone on one of the monitors

Starting point is 00:01:38 had locked on Lakers. One of the sickos who likes to watch, baby. So thank you very much to them. Where's our free tickets? To Mumford and Sons. I'm sure they had maybe had something to do with it. Not sure. But Sunday, of course, Andy was Father's Day.

Starting point is 00:02:01 Happy Father's Day. I hope all the dads out there had a great Father's Day. The NBA provided a gift to us to parents who, in the form of content, Andy, a blockbuster deal that has real significance across the Western Conference. Desmond Bain sent from Memphis to Orlando for old friend Contavius Caldwell, Pope, Colanth. Backup Guard for the Magic. And four, counten. Four, one, two, three, four first round picks, including this year's in the 2025 draft and Phoenix's pick in 2026, which could be valuable depending on what the sons do this

Starting point is 00:02:48 offseason. So I'm, you know, waking up late, you know, the family's letting me sleep a little bit, you know, all that kind of stuff. And I kind of grab my phone and I'm just sort of looking at stuff. And I see like an alert. and I'm I'm double-checking to make sure it's a real thing because not quite, wait, I'm sorry, Luca Donchich got traded where?

Starting point is 00:03:10 But like four first-round picks for Desmond Bain, this was a pretty, especially for something that wasn't really being talked about. Like this wasn't like a big rumor around the league. This was a really, really impactful trade kind of sprung on people for a Sunday morning. I do think it's important to remember. that while the four picks, obviously, that is a lot. And depending on how each of these individual

Starting point is 00:03:37 picks and there's a pick swap that I believe is top two protected, so short of some type of massive fall for one of these teams, that's likely going to end up swapped in some form. That is a lot going to Memphis for Desmond Bain. I do think it's important to remember beyond the fact that Desmond Bain is a really good player. You know, he's, I think somewhere in the census like a top 50-ish player. One of those picks at least has to be thought of as the cost of getting Memphis to take KCP's contract because while KCP, his 40-ish mill that he's owed over the next two seasons, it's not an awful bloated contract.

Starting point is 00:04:25 it's not a great one for a guy that's now 32 and coming off perhaps the worst season, if not of his career. It's certainly the worst season of the last several years. There could be concerns now that KCP is in decline, which becomes problematic, physical decline, which can become problematic for a guy that one of his calling cards is that defensive versatility and the ability to stay as a point of attack defender with a lot of different types of players around the league. And look, we covered KCP, we like the dude a lot. And there's a very good chance that he just bounces back in Memphis, just for whatever reason it didn't click in Orlando. Guys have down seasons.

Starting point is 00:05:15 But I do think it is important to remember that at least one of those picks has to be thought of as a cost of doing business to take on KCP. Fair enough. But I mean, the general consensus from most people when they saw this deal was that's a lot for Desmond Bain. I'm not saying it isn't a lot. I'm saying when you break it down, you need, if you want to break it down responsibly, I think you need to think about part of that is you're also taking KCP as opposed

Starting point is 00:05:43 to just getting Desmond Bain. Three first round picks for Desmond Bain would still, I think, be seen as a pretty good all. And so what, and instantly, you know, there's the influence on the Western Conference. Memphis, while they finished the season quite poorly, still, you know, is a team with a lot of talent in the West. And, you know, a lot of teams, a lot of people I should say now are wondering what they're going to do. Does this mean Memphis is restructuring? Are they going to go, you know, figure out a way to kind of go for it again next year with just a slightly different, differently configured roster and all that?

Starting point is 00:06:17 And if you can even kind of chip away at the dozen or so teams in the West that seem like they are trying to or potentially could compete for something next year, that has an influence. But I think for most people, Andy, the first question, for most Lakers fans, as I'd say, for most Lakers fans, the first thing that went through their minds was, oh, my, well, if Desmond Bain is worth four first round picks, what is Austin Reeves worth? Like if the Lakers just put him out on the market, could they get four first round picks and a potentially useful veteran in return, a player like Cole Anthony, who is certainly a depth player that could help,

Starting point is 00:07:04 you know, add something to the Lakers or teams like that? Like if that's the market, is Austin Reeves suddenly maybe a guy you'd want to put? put out on the trade market. I thought that was overwhelmingly the direction that Lakers' Twitter went once this trade was announced. Yeah, absolutely.

Starting point is 00:07:29 And it makes a lot of sense. And I will preface everything that we're going to get into over the course of the show with the reminder that I am of the overarching opinion that the Lakers should be gauging Austin's value more proactively than they seem to. I think they should be more open towards the idea of trading Austin. I'm not saying that they should be aggressively shopping him. I'm not saying that they need to move him necessarily. But I have expressed the concerns that I have with Austin as he becomes more expensive in this particular CBA paired up with Luca when they have many of the same weaknesses and concerns and the number one goal is to try to not just build around Luca and enhance

Starting point is 00:08:23 Luca, but you also want to supplement Luca as well. And I don't consider Austin somebody who necessarily supplements Luca in a way that you would look for the players around them to. So everything I'm going to get into with the caveat of or I guess right. But let's I mean, but the other thing that I think is interesting about them, we'll get after the the break, we'll kind of start breaking this down as to whether or not like, wait, does this establish what a market for Reeves might actually look like? It's important to remember, too, like it's in almost every trade scenario where people talk about AR as someone you would want to move. It's done in the context of a center. This would be done in the context of getting

Starting point is 00:09:10 draft capital as much as anything. You've got to find a player to send back or a couple players or whatever might be, but more likely this, the context of something like this is less about, is less about getting a specific position back, like trading for to fill a need. Maybe. Well, maybe not. But I'm saying like it opens up the, I think it widens the conversation about what in Austin Reeves trade could look like beyond where it has typically been, which has been, would you trade Austin Reeves for Center X, Y, or Z?

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Starting point is 00:11:11 So we will try to get to it today, but if we don't, we'll certainly get into it this week. There was another bit of big NBA news this weekend where Stephen Adams re-signed with Houston for three years, $13 million per. Not necessarily surprised that he stayed in Houston. It's not a surprise that he signed for more money than the Lakers could have paid him in the open market. But it is a relevant signing for the Lakers. Lakers for sure, which we don't get it to today, we will get to it tomorrow. But back to this Bain thing. There's a lot, there seems like there's a trade like this every year now where like,

Starting point is 00:11:59 oh my God, McHale Bridges, they gave five first round picks for McHale Bridges. If that's the case, then, you know, Janus is worth, you know, 23 first round picks and all these kinds of stuff. And so I think people at the very least, like, is, is, they're not exactly apples to apples players, but who do you think is better? Like, if you could pick one guy, would you rather have Bain or A.R? Bain, because he's a two-way player. The only thing I think Austin is better at than Desmond Bain is creating for himself or creating for others. Like, he is a better generator of offense for others or like creating for himself off the bounce, getting to the line.

Starting point is 00:12:42 than Desmond Bain, but Desmond still has averaged over the last four years, roughly 20 points a game, and he is an elite shooter. He's an absolutely elite shooter from behind the arc, and he's a much better defender than Austin Reeves. I think it's not even comparable. The only other thing I think you could put in Reeves is another thing you can put in Reeves side of the ledger is availability. Bain does get hurt a lot. So he has been banged up. I consider them roughly at the same level. Right.

Starting point is 00:13:20 I consider Bain better, but I don't think he is worlds better than Austin. No. And if somebody wanted to make an argument for Reeves, I think it's fine. I think the way you put it, like they're kind of in the same tier. Bain has been there longer. You know, we're coming off of Reeves' best season. And so if Austin continues to do. this than he and Bain are equivalent. It's like, what do you want? What skill set do you need a little bit more and things like that?

Starting point is 00:13:48 So, you know, I think for starters, it's important to establish like we're talking about relatively equivalent players. So do you think it is a mistake? I certainly have my thoughts on this to look at it and say, if Desmond Bain can get you a couple role players and four first round picks, Austin Reeves ought to be able to get you a couple role players and four first round picks. Yeah, I think that's absolutely a mistake for a few reasons. First of all, I think people talk about the market setting more concretely than it actually happens. I thought Matt Moore over at Locked on Nuggets and the Action Network summarized this really well in a tweet thread. He sent out, quote, we need to have a discussion about this. There is no, finger quotes, market in the NBA.

Starting point is 00:14:42 because the Grizzly's got four picks for the third best player does not mean you will get seven for your second best. That's not how this works. It's this is what we're willing to part with for this player because he matters more to us. We're trapped in this cycle of, well, if Desmond Bain got that, then Austin Reeves has to get eight picks because I'm a Lakers fan. That's probably a little unnecessary from that. But there is no market. Players are not put on a digital trading board, and teams all put in offers and you take the best. That's not how this works.

Starting point is 00:15:13 Austin Reeves might get more than Desmond Bain if a team believes he's the secret to them winning a title, making the leap. He may get way less if the Lakers need to move him and everyone's like, cool. And I think that's actually a really smart way of looking at this. Like the market is in a lot of ways what individual teams need. And like we look at the Rudy Gobert trade, for example, with Minnesota, which at the time was widely panned. And I think some of that just has to do with people, everybody seems to dislike Rudy Gobert, whether you're talking about his peers, whether you're talking about NBA fans, maybe even some NBA media. Like they don't like him. He rubs a lot of people the wrong way and a lot of the analytics wonks don't like him because they say he can be played off the floor.

Starting point is 00:15:56 And a lot of his defensive metrics are noisy, yada, yada, yada. But for the Timberwolves specifically, a team that never gets free agents. the opportunity at a, I believe, four-time defensive player of the year, a multiple-time rebounding champ, you don't get cracks at players like that very often. So to the Timberwolves, that guy may be worth. I believe it was four first-round picks and a swap because he's better than most of the guys that you would use or use those draft picks to try to get. You know, as it turns out, actually, the trades worked pretty well for the Timberwolves.

Starting point is 00:16:38 It's hard to argue against the logic of having made it. But I just think it's important to remember, like the wolves need to pay more for Rudy Gobert than say the Lakers might need to or the Knicks or the Warriors, like these teams that are perceived as being more attractive to players around the league as free agents. So I think to Matt's point earlier, like the market is more individualized than some type of set thing. So beyond some of the other reasons that I don't believe Desmond James. And in the case, just to, you know, for people to sort of catch people up, Orlando was a very good team last year. They were the worst, like by a fair margin,

Starting point is 00:17:25 certainly among playoff teams, the worst three-point shooting team in the NBA. Yep. They were terrible. And so, you know, you're adding this now to Franz Wagner and obviously Paula Bencaro and Jalen Suggs and like, you know, you're starting to put some stuff here that makes a lot of sense. And they desperately needed floor spacing and added it with arguably the best shooting guard, you know, shooting shooting guard around the league. So that's that was one of the best, he's one of the best two-way role playing, you know, somewhere between high-end role player low-end All-Star at his position in the entire league. He's never made an All-Star team, but he's good enough that he could.

Starting point is 00:18:12 And that, to your point, provides the context of why Bain was valuable to Orlando enough that they were willing to say, you know what? And then you factor in the Eastern Conference wide open next year. We're willing to put this stuff, well, kind of throw some chips in because it fits on the timeline for Orlando and their younger players. Like there's all sorts. Look, when the Knicks gave up all that capital for McHale Bridges, could be anything, you know, a combination of they like his skill set.

Starting point is 00:18:46 They love the Villanova connection both as a marketing thing, but also this is something that we think can be good for our locker room. Like there's all sorts of things that dictate why certain teams will make moves that others don't. So it, to get something like this for Reeves, you need to find a team that values very much what Reeves does. And I don't think that's a crazy idea because AR is very good.

Starting point is 00:19:20 You know, he is, you know, he elevated as a playmaker last year. He showed the ability to score, his three-point shooting, I think has become pretty consistent, 39% two years ago. 37 last year. 37% last year, 38% this year. The one we just had, he shot about 38%, 37 the year before 39.5 the year before that. So he's pretty well established as a high 30s three point shooting guard, which is pretty good.

Starting point is 00:19:54 He can create for himself. His scoring averages have gone up every year. he's a great chemistry guy, works hard. There's a lot of reasons a team might want someone. Elite at nothing but very good at many things. He's a really good player. But you've got to find a team that values him

Starting point is 00:20:17 and has a hole for what he does to get that kind of haul. And that becomes the big question. Is there a team out there that needs Austin Reeves to the point that that, they are willing to trade a lot of capital and also has this stuff because a lot of the really good teams at the top of each conference don't really have the capital because they've traded away already to get other players.

Starting point is 00:20:43 And we'll get into it next to with everything else we're going to get into. There's also one big problem with Austin Reeves that separates him greatly from Desmond Bain and could be very difficult to overcome. So you can do that coming up next. Lockdown Lakers brought to you by Fandul. The NBA playoffs are in the fullest of swings. We're coming up to game five of the NBA finals. Every night delivers highlight-worthy performances.

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Starting point is 00:22:03 Make every moment more with Fandul official sports betting partner of the NBA. All right. So what did you have in mind, Andy? As far as the big thing that separates Austin from Desmond Bain, that could be a real problem. That phenomenal tease before the end of the second segment, yes. Desmond Bain is under contract through 2029. So when Orlando traded for him, there's no outs in his contract.

Starting point is 00:22:33 contract, there's no options, whatever. And they traded for him. They know he is going to be in house between now and the end of the 2020-9 season. Austin Reeves is entering what everybody expects to be a walk year. And the most he can sign an extension for this off-season is, I believe, four and 89. And as a free agent, the following off-season in 2026, he can get anywhere from like the max with the Lakers would be like 5-2-45, and from any other team, it would be like 4-189.

Starting point is 00:23:09 And to be clear, I don't think he's getting anywhere close to either from the Lakers or from another team. Austin Reeves, unless he takes a big leap, like another very big leap, I don't think he is a 40 to 50 million dollar player. but as things currently stand, I think he is going to be seen around the league as a $30 to $40 million player. I think somewhere in the $30 to $35, something like that. Unless Austin just decides, you know what, I don't want to play with this thing

Starting point is 00:23:42 hanging over my head, $90 million is still a lot of money. It's on top of what I've already made, which is more than I ever expected to. I don't want to have to think about this for an entire year and just decides, I'd rather have the security. He's going to be a free agent for 2026 for the Lakers or any other team, which puts, I think, a decided ceiling on how much any team is going to give up for him,

Starting point is 00:24:11 knowing there is no guarantee that he will be around past 2026. Right, because usually... Big difference between him and Desmond Bain. Usually when this sort of thing happens is like, if you trade from him, you can have that conversation, or maybe not usually often when this happens, you can have that conversation. If we trade for you, do you think, you know, are you going to extend with us? You think you'll, you'll do that.

Starting point is 00:24:36 And a player get there, sign an extension, whatever. There's a zero percent chance. A.R. is going to sign an extension with anyone. It's not personal. He's just not doing that. He's not locking himself into $50 million less than he could make at least than, you know, the following year.

Starting point is 00:24:50 Even if you got hurt next year, he's not going to do worse than that. the number he could get with the extension now. He's still going to get 20 million next year. Even if he had had an injury-filled season. So that makes a big difference. And just that, like you say, that potential of walking. I'm really curious. Maybe we'll get to the Stephen Adams thing tomorrow.

Starting point is 00:25:18 Because just because the impact on what this looks like at the center market, I think is worth a few segments. So the other part about this, though, is what I think it could do to the rest of the trade market, though, like this offseason. Kevin Durant is obviously a domino that everyone is expecting to fall. Does this change what Phoenix thinks they ought to be able to get for Kevin Durant? Is there another trade that's out there?

Starting point is 00:25:46 You mean the Memphis trade? Yes. Because if, well, Desmond Bain is worth four. Here's what I think sometimes happens with these things. I mean, the songs are run by a lunatic owner who might decide that. But I think any rational owner GM would say, kind of like what I talked about with Austin Reeves, it's not one to one. Kevin Durant is 37.

Starting point is 00:26:09 And like, there's no question. But a lot, when you have a, when you have a situation, you know, look at what's happened to Nico Harrison. Look what's like, it, the average sort of. be a media person, the casuals reacting, the local columnist, whatever it is, whoever it is you care about, there can be a pressure when Bain gets four first rounders. If you've got a player that you think is better than Desmond Bain, but all the context, like you're saying, it's like it's not the same thing.

Starting point is 00:26:42 It's not an Apple's comparison, but most of that nuance is going to be lost in the reaction to a trade where it's seen that you traded a best. better player for less than Memphis got for Desmond Bain. I mean, look at this. Like, people are already using this to talk about how, again, how terrible Dallas's return for Luca was as, you know, it's like, yeah, they could have gotten and should have gotten more picks, more stuff, or whatever. They got Anthony Davis, right, who would be the equivalent.

Starting point is 00:27:17 He's the human equivalent of multiple people. picks. Like if Dallas put Anthony Davis on the market and side note, not necessarily for this show, I think it's something they should at least consider. Anthony Davis would fetch multiple picks. Like, I mean, that's a given. So he is the multiple picks that. Right. But you understand what I'm getting at them. Yeah. The way that a market can be, it sometimes trades like this, get it going. Okay, here we go. All right. First one's down. Domino's fault. Max Christie's worth a first round pick at this point. These things can have the impact of freezing the market as well because now everybody

Starting point is 00:27:58 is recalibrating what they think their guy is worth. Is my guy two-thirds of a bane? Okay. Well, that's two first rounders and one role. I mean, is he one in a third baines? Well, that's an extra pick and maybe one more role. Bain. Double bane.

Starting point is 00:28:24 So I'm very interested to see what this does to the broader market. As we get closer to the draft. And that's the first time in the offseason when trades typically start to happen is right around draft day. It could speed things up. I could also lock things up. And I still remain. Could be 100% wrong. We could look at this in September, October and be like,

Starting point is 00:28:48 Brian, you're dumb. Wouldn't be the first time. I still think an active market benefits the Lakers. And so if things get locked up, if the market seizes up for whatever reason, whether it's because you're waiting for a trade to happen, for a second to look like me, it might be the Janus Domino, that may not be a thing. Whatever it may be to now, like that is bad for the Lakers.

Starting point is 00:29:19 if the market seizes up. For what it's worth, the last few years have been pretty active. And with all these different pundits who are much more plugged in than you and I are, the one consistent thing they seem to agree on is that it's going to be an active offseason. My expectation is it's going to be an active offseason. And 1,000 percent, that is better for the Lakers. To be clear, it guarantees nothing for the Lakers. but if you're asking which scenario is better, a quiet market or an active market,

Starting point is 00:29:55 it is without question an active market, especially for a team like the Lakers that one for one could be stuck in terms of trying to make their assets stack up for the deals that they want. Like, we've been through this a lot. They do not have a lot of really coveted assets. They don't have cap space. They don't have a lot of maneuverability on their own. but the more potentially active and complicated things get around the league,

Starting point is 00:30:22 then maybe the Lakers can kind of help grease the wheels and get something in trouble. All right. So we'll maybe do a little bit more on this tomorrow, and just in terms of talking about the different ways, if you wanted to put Reeves on the market, which way would be more beneficial to the Lakers? If this is a choice, Andy, where the Lakers can maybe not necessarily look at getting a center back

Starting point is 00:30:43 as part of a Reeves trade, if you were going to do it, but you could get this big hall of assets that the Lakers could then turn around and use to feel like which which avenue might be better. Would it be better to kind of make that move, sacrifice Reeves for that kind of thing? I can see pros and cons to both. We'll, of course, cover the Stephen Adams thing as well. All of that coming up tomorrow.

Starting point is 00:31:11 Lockdown Lakers on YouTube is ready to hang out with over 35,000 subscribers. We'll see everyone on Tuesday.

Locked On Lakers - Daily Podcast On The Los Angeles Lakers - Grizzlies Trade Desmond Bane for Multiple Firsts. Could Lakers get Same for Austin Reaves?

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