Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Constructing the perfect Erik Karlsson trade with JD Young of Locked On Sharks!

Episode Date: July 25, 2023

It's Tuesday, July 25th, and Erik Karlsson is still providing us with much content. Because of that, Hunter is joined by JD Young of Locked On Sharks to break everything down when it comes to Erik Karlsson. They first look at Karlsson's comments over the weekend to a Swedish reporter and what their main takeaways are before diving into how much longer this is going to go on. They analyze whether Mike Grier is going to stop playing this game of chicken with every team before diving into whether the Penguins are the best fit for Karlsson. JD discusses why they're definitely up there, but he does have another team with them as a good fit, and no, it's not the Carolina Hurricanes. They also discuss how Kris Letang has given the Penguins his blessing to bring Karlsson in before ending the show with a mock trade proposal. The two come up with a trade that works for both sides and come to the conclusion that it's time to call Mike Grier and Kyle Dubas. All that, plus much more, is on this episode of the Locked On Penguins podcast.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!FanDuelMake Every Moment More. Don’t miss the chance to get your No Sweat First Bet up to TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS in Bonus Bets when you go to FanDuel.com/LOCKEDON.AG1If a comprehensive solution is what you need from your supplement routine, then try AG1 and get a FREE 1-year supply of Vitamin D AND 5 free AG1 Travel Packs with your first purchase. Go to drinkAG1.com/NHLNETWORK.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as non-withdrawable free bets that expire in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It is an Eric Carlson-centric episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast for Tuesday. Joining me is J.D. Young of Locked-on Sharks to break down everything when it comes to the Eric Carlson situation. Your Locked-on Penguins. Your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network. Your team every day. Hello, welcome back to another episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I am your host, Hunter Hodes.

Are you going to follow me on Twitter at Hunter Hodes follow the shows, Twitter at L.O. Central Penguins. And of course, thank you all so much for making this your first lesson slash watch of the day. We are free and available on all platforms. As promised, joining me for this Tuesday edition of the Locked on Penguins podcast

is J.D. Young of Locked on Sharks. And this is something, J.D., that we probably should have done a couple weeks ago, but maybe both of us probably thought a trade would be done by now. But I think all these teams just really don't want to do, well, I think the teams that want to acquire Carlson want to do the deal, but the sharks are being a little bit more patient.

But in any case, really appreciate you coming on this episode. Oh, no worries. I mean, yeah, the Eric Carl, at least it has provided us with plenty of content. And that is what this is all about is manufacturing that content and the doldrums of the summer. And my career is doing his job there. So that's what more can we ask for? It's about to be July 25th. We're recording this on Monday night.

And yeah, right, the dog days of the offseason. and Eric Carlson is still providing us quite a bit of content, especially over the weekend here, JD. There is an article from Sweden because Eric Carlson won the golden puck for this year, Sweden's best hockey player for the country. And during the interview with the reporter, he obviously addressed the elephant in the room, which is the trade situation.

And the biggest thing I took away from that is he's just ready for this to be over. I think he wants to be traded any second now, to be honest. And it sounded like to me when I was reading, through it. He has the say when it comes to, well, I think, well, he also has to say because he has to do a movement clause, but he has the full say when it comes to where he wants to go. And I think that could be the main reason why a trade hasn't gone through yet, because maybe he's still thinking it over with his family or something like that. What was your main takeaway from that article? Yeah, I mean, we, we knew this was coming at Sharks fans, right? We knew Eric Carlson

would be traded. We knew that this has been a possibility for a while. He there was talk of him being traded the trade deadline. The M. Oilers were huge players in that. Nothing was able to come to fruition, especially with how difficult and complex this trade is going to be whenever it does happen. But, you know,

like you said, Eric Crosson doesn't have a full, no movement clause. So it doesn't matter if the Arizona coyotes come up and say, hey, we'll give you guys five first round picks and you don't want to retain a salary. If Eric Carlson's like, I don't want to go play for the coyotes, it doesn't matter. Sorry, Robin.

I'm just picking the coyotes out of a half. But that's the thing, right? It seems like my career is going to work. You look last year, right, Brent Burns. Brett Burns, a little bit older than Eric Carlson. He's done everything you could do in the league except for win a cup. They worked with Brent Burns to, he had a three-team no-trade. They worked with him to give him to Carolina, who wasn't actually one of the teams that was on his no-trade list.

But they worked with him to give him to Carolina. I think it's going to be the same thing, right? It's going to be a, we want to make sure kind of everything. Every asset, every avenue is looked at and explored. And my career is being patient, right? And if you go way, way back to when Eric Carlson got traded from Ottawa to San Jose, that didn't happen until the eve of training camp. That was a mid-September trade.

So I kind of have no reason to believe that this, you know, what was the same, deadlines kind of, you know, spur action. And I think once we start getting a little bit closer to the training camp, And if there's still, that's, I think, when teams will start to put it those final, final offers. And if you're my career, what's the rush, right? You're going to get the same package now that you would in September, and you might get a better one if a team gets a little bit more desperate. That's going to be the big question, because I think a lot of people have been just thinking,

like, if it gets closer to camp or closer to the season, is the price going to go down where their sharks are going to be like, okay, we're just going to get rid of him because we don't want him on the team heading into the season. we also know that he doesn't want to be on the team heading into this season. And with the penguins, I mean, they're willing to wait. Right now they have one Sally arbitration case left in Drew Connor. That's on August 4th. After that, they have the buyout window that opens up the second one.

And maybe that's Michael Granlin. Maybe that's John Ruda, something like that. But they can wait. They have the patience here. It's just all about how much longer do the sharks want to wait with this? Because this is turned into a game of chicken. Yep. No side has blinked yet.

And I think Mike Greer is pretty happy about that. I was listening to the DFO rundown today with Frank Servali and Jason Greger. And they were both talking about how it sounds like a lot of these teams that have trying to go after Carlson, they're like, okay, you don't want to do anything right now. We're going to take the rest of the month off. Call us in August if you want to try to make a deal. And that's even worse when it comes to the dog days of summer. But, yeah, I mean, and honestly just seems like at this point, there's really,

not much going on. Do you expect this to go into camp or do you think this is going to be similar to the trade that we saw a few years ago when he went to San Jose right before training camp? I think once we get closer to training camp, I think that's when we'll see a little bit more action with it. And Mike Greer and head coach David Quinn had both said we'd be happy to have Carlson back. You know, it's not like if you don't trade them now, it's not like you can't trade them during the season at the trade deadline.

yes, there's risk of Carlson re-injures himself or anything that could happen. But again, it's Carlson's still has four years left on his contract going to the season. It's not like, you know, he's got to be an UFA or anything like that. There's plenty of time. I think, though, for both parties, we know the sharks aren't going to be competitive. And for the penguins who are trying to squeeze one more run out of this core that they have, adding a guy like Carlson, who we'll talk about where the best fits possibly are, adding in a garla like Carlson can add a little bit more kind of juice to the or gas to the tank here.

So but again, like you're Mike Greer, right? You know you're not going to be competitive. This is your last big asset. You traded Brett Burns last offseason and people were pretty underwhelmed by that. You traded Tim O'Mire and we'll see, you know, I think that the initial run didn't look good after the draft getting Quentin Musty. I think a lot of fans are a little bit more happier about it. But this is kind of your last big piece that you're going to be. be able to trade. And, you know, I know those hurdle and Coutor, but I don't think those guys

are going to go anywhere for a while. Flastic's unmovable. And you have a bunch of young guys who are going to be starting to enter into the league. And I think this is the last big piece. So if you're my grade, you need to hold out for the best possible offer because you're not going to really have any big, big pieces like this to move. And I was going to ask you about that because, you know, I'm of the opinion that, you know, I don't think the sharks are going to get that much in return. just because they don't have a lot of leverage. But it seems like to me, they're hoping that one of these teams

is going to get desperate enough to throw them a pretty big offer. And then they're like, oh, okay, we're glad that we waited. But it seems like also to me at the same time, maybe the sharks aren't valuing the cap space that they're going to get when they make the trade because I think that's going to be a pretty big asset. You know, whether you're retaining 20, 25, 30 percent, we can get into that a little.

a little bit later, they're not valuing the cap space asset of that right now. And I think that's another big reason why you haven't seen that trigate because they're still looking at getting young pieces back that can help them in their rebuild. And teams like the penguins, they're willing to take Carlson off the shark's hands. They're just not willing to be like, okay, we're going to send you this massive package. And in a perfect world, Eric Carlson should be worth so much because he just had over 100 points this past thing. But when there's only a couple of suitors, there's only so much the sharks can get in return. Yeah. And I think that's an interesting point because the caps space, right? But it's,

we were the shark going to sign, right? Like, Matt Dunba, cool. Like, there's, you know, like it's not like there's a plethora of douges out there kind of sitting there. And the team, the sharks should be signed anybody, right? They should be trying to get assets that you could flip at the trade deadline or take swings on guys like Phil's Sedina that they, that they, they signed this off season. You're trying to kind of, you're in the roster turning phase of their rebuild right now. And you shouldn't be using that caspways. Maybe utilize it during the trade deadline to help facilitate another deal for somebody else.

But, and the sharks going into next season, they're going to have plenty of cap space if they want to be aggressive in free agency. And you know, the cap's finally going to go up, you know, going forward. But, you know, I think for them, they, yes, the caps stays to be nice, but it's not like a big thing for them right now. in the future, maybe having some of that cap space when you have to start resigning some of your younger players. But that's a problem for future, Mike Greer to deal with, not with right now. I think for him, it's get the best possible package you can get back, whether it's picks or prospects or NHL ready guy or young NHL players,

get the best possible because this is your last card when it comes to big trade pieces going forward. You make a good point about that because, you know, you discuss Tomas Hartle, Logan Gature, but they're not going to be bringing back the return that Carlson, excuse me, should be bringing back. But that wraps up this first time. And coming up in the second segment, we're going to get into what some of the best fits are for Carlson. I obviously know what my answer would be, but we have to get into what JD thinks is the best

fit for Carlson. But before we dive into that, our next partner is AG1, the Daily Foundation of Nutritional Supplement that supports whole body health. I drink it literally every single day, usually around 8, 39 a.m. Eastern time when I wake up for work. I usually honestly drink it right before I have my first cup of coffee for the day because it gets me started the right way. All great athletes have one thing in common.

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Again, that's drinkag1.com slash NHL Network. Check it out. All right, we're back here in this episode of the Lockton Penguins podcast. I'm Hunter Hody, that is J.D. Young of Locked on Sharks. So in the article as well, J.D. Carlson did confirm that he has spoken with members of the penguins,

especially Kyle Jubis. There's been reports that he has talked with Chris Lange and Cindy Crosby. Latang especially has given the penguins his blessing on trading for Carlson. Sometimes, you know, franchise defensemen can be a bit weird with that stuff. But hey, Chris Othang is a little bit of an old man now. He's won three Stanley Cups. I think he can give up maybe some of his top power play duties to a guy who just had

100 points this past season. But he has given his blessing on that trade. He's also confirmed he spoke to the Seattle Cracken, the Toronto Maple Leafs, and, of course, the Carolina Hurricanes. So they just signed Tony G. Angelo on Monday. I'm not really sure what that means for their pursuit. when it comes to best fit for you, J.D., who do you think fits that bill? I think you actually have to go between the penguins and the Cracket, if I'm kind of going.

The penguins, like we mentioned before, they're aging core. They're almost like when the sharks acquired, Eric Carlson, and aging core trying to make that one run, right? Granted the penguins have a couple banners up in their ceiling and the sharks don't, but you could see, right? You had Joe Thornton. You had Patrick Marl. You had Logan Gator, Tomash Hurtle, Timo Meyer, coming into his prime. You had all these guys, Joe Pavelski. Eric Carlson was supposed to be the last piece, right, to kind of get them over the hump.

And if he doesn't tear his groin, I fully expect the sharks be to beat the peng, or not the bank, to beat the blues and beat the Bruins and the, and it's like, I'm right, I, Eric Carlson was, even with a torn groin, he has 16 points of 19 playoff games. He had, was the only a full, my, my, my, my, running joke. He's a point per game on half a Pee-P. Like, what else could you want from this man, right? But it would make a lot of sense, right? Coming off his best season, statistically his best season, adding some juice to this penguin's offense, which, I mean, outside the top guys, right, it has struggled to kind of produce some points and be consistent, especially on that middle

and bottom kind of forward units. And Eric Carlson, the man can provide offense. He was making Noah Greger and I mean, go look at the Sharks roster last year. Look at the guys he is playing with. He was, and he still put up 101 points last year on this terrible Sharks team. And granted, he's probably not going to have the same leeway on this Penguins team to just go out there and score points because the Sharks needed him to score every point possible. But it makes a lot of sense for a team like the Penguins, if you want to try to get one more for Crosby and the gang to get in a guy like Eric Carlson.

for the Cracken who I think would also make a lot of sense, right? An up-and-coming team, you don't have that star yet. I know Maddie Baneers is well on his way to being a star type of player, but Ercawson is a legitimate star. We'd be your first legitimate star. And they would go from a fringe playoff team to kind of a dark horse, Stanley Cup team, especially if Baneers, you know, kind of continues to develop. Maybe if Shane Wright can surprise and make the team out of training camp,

or you have a lot of pieces there and they have solid defensive foundation. They have a lot of guys who can chip in, but they don't have that star power guy. And I think those are the two teams that would make a lot of sense. They also have the cleanest cap, right? They have no issues with their cap space going forward and it would

be the easiest transaction out of the group. Yeah, I mean, even after they just signed Vince Dunn to that, I believe it was a little over $7 million per for a couple years and you just had a great season. They still do have the cap space and they have the young players that I think the sharks would really want in a deal. The penguins really do not have that, and JD and I will get to constructing a trade that works

for both the penguins and the sharks at the end of the show. But the Cracken definitely do have the young players to make it work. They have the picks, and they're starting to develop a pretty good prospect. If they really wanted to take a run at it, and I know they have, and I'm not sure how much involved they still are, they definitely could. As for the Penguins, you're right? I mean, they're all in it to win one more in these Cindy Crosby. getting malcon crystal tank era it would make the team as as long as sidney crosbie's on your team

yes you should be trying to win another cup that is the same thing like you have a generational player as long as he's on your team is the same thing the sharks are you had joe thornton you try to win a cup until you just can't anymore and then you try to you figure out the future in that at some other point but you keep trying and taking swings at it until it just the wheels fall off basically heck yeah i mean you know that better than almost anyone on this network heck you know Patrick Marlowe, Joe Thornton, Brent Burns, Mark Edward Vlasic when he was still really, really good. Man, those Sharks teams from the late 2000s to early 2010s, even the mid-2010s, they were very, very good. I mean, we saw both these teams playing this in the final.

Sorry, JD, by the way. But I had to. I'm sorry. It's okay. It's okay. It's okay. It'll all be good at some point. But, you know, to get back to what I was saying, you know, the Penguins,

they need to be more of just a fun team in general to watch. I know a lot of fans out there who have just been kind of bored watching the team these past couple of seasons because, I mean, outside of the top guns, there really hasn't been that much there. And Carlson would especially help them offensively. The Penguins were 21st in the league this past season in five-on-five scoring. That's not good enough for a team that has one of the best top sixes in the league.

If you can get him, put on your second pairing with someone like Ryan Graves, Marcus Pederson, we'll get to that in just a second, considering Rob Rossi's report. that would be best case scenario in my eyes. Now that I think about the second pairing with for Carlson, J.D., was he as bad defensively as a lot of people make him out to be this past season? So he, you're not paying Eric Carlson, $11,500 million to be a shutdown defenseman, right? He is a game-breaking talent offensively.

And you have to think about the sharks, right? They, they kind of were playing a all-gas, no break style because they just didn't have the horses to kind of compete night in, night out. So Eric Carlson was put in charge a lot to go, go do stuff and make us at least semi-relevant. You talk about the 5-1-5 scoring. Like Eric Carlson 101 points last year, 75 of those were 5-1-5. This is not Eric Carlson just dominating on the powerplay because the Starck's power play unit was, PowerPlay 1 was okay, like it was Logan Coutor, Tomash Hurdle, you know, some guys who've been around. The second unit was, It was just like I had to play second unit power play minutes because they just didn't have

enough guys to go put out there for the second unit was basically just let the first guys get a rest for 30 minutes or 30 seconds. So Eric Carlson, he's a five on five machine. Defense, yes, you need to put him with a strong stay at home defenseman as his partner. But it's easier to find that than it is to find a guy like Eric Carlson who can legitimately night in, night out when he touches the ice and he's feeling health. healthy, he can be the best player on the ice. And it doesn't matter who else is there.

Connor McDavid, Sidney Crosby, whatever. Eric Carlson can be the best player on the ice that night. And we saw it random nights in December where Eric Carlson is just like, I'm going to just put up a hat trick tonight. I'm going to put up five points tonight. Multi, multi, I think he had five games. We had at least four points last on a game. Again, go look at the Sharks roster last year and tell me who is,

other than Tim O'Mire before he got traded, who is a threat to score at any given time. It was Eric Carlson doing majority of the work. And the Penguins have the perfect partner for him if he is not included in a Carlson trade, and that is Marcus Pedersen, who ranked in the 87th percentile for five-on-five defense this past season in the 81st percentile for five-on-five offense. He has been linked to the Sharks. J.D. Rob Rossi, of the athletic reporter, that the Sharks are interested in him.

Not surprised considering he just had the season of his life, but there are, that is probably, he's probably one of the only players or just any assets in general that I would not give up to get Eric Carlson just because he is that good of a defenseman and he would be a perfect partner for Carlson but yeah I mean it just it makes sense for so many reasons even if with the penguins over the cap they have ways to get under net never underestimate team a team's ability to get under the cap with this kind of deal now JD before we get to our final second. I did have this question for you with the retained money with when it comes to this. So it sounds like the sharks are not budging on, it goes around 20%, which takes it down to,

I believe that's $9.5 million, if my math is correct. Somewhere around there, yeah. Around there. I know it's been reported that teams want them to retain 25%, 30, maybe upwards of 40. In order to get a deal done, do you think the sharks are going to have to come off their asking price of 20%? I think so. I think, If you look at, right, you have to remember when Eric Carlson signed this contract, and he signed it summer 2019, entered the first year of the contract, summer 2019. This season we had a little thing called COVID, right? And then we haven't seen the cap go up basically in three years.

It's gone up a million, two million dollars over the past three years, if that. And that's what makes the, just the timing of this contract has been so bad. And especially when you see guys like Kil McCar, signing for nine. million a year. You're seeing a lot of the new defenders signing for much, much cheaper deals. If we had seen the cap continue to rise that we had expected and the cap was maybe sitting around maybe $93, $94, $95 million, this contract wouldn't look as bad. Would it still be a big contract? Yes, but it wouldn't look as bad. I think teens are trying to get Carlson into that like $8 million range that you're seeing a lot of the other top defenders signing for right now, which would

mean the sharks would have to retain, you know, three and a half million. And I still think that's very feasible for the sharks, right? I mentioned earlier. Their cap situation really cleans up after this year with some of these old contracts coming off the book. They're getting, you know, they're still going to have some of the big names like Vlastic and Hurtle and Couture round. But you're going to, a lot of the other talent that's going to be is guys on their ELCs or got RFA type of guys who are on cheaper deals that you can kind of continue to ride those RFA years as your other contracts come off the book. So I think Greer will have to budge. how much he's willing to budge is going to be, I think is one of the, one of the factors in this big game of chicken.

And then the big question comes up, the more you retain, the bigger return you get, or if you the less you retain, the lower return you get. That's, then the game of chicken is really going to go when it comes to that. But that wraps up the second segment coming up to in the show, J.D. and I are going to do our best to construct a trade that works for both the penguins and the sharks to stick around. for that coming up right after this. All right. We're back during this episode of the Locked on Penguins podcast. I'm Hunter Hodes. That is J.D. Young.

All right, the fun, well, this whole episode has been a blast, but the very fun part has arrived here when it comes to us constructing a trade that works best for both teams. My biggest thing is, obviously there's going to be picks involved because the Penguins have a whole quartet of picks for the next several years. I think when it comes to Kyle Dubis, and this was reported in Rob Rossi's article a few days ago, and I'd been saying this even before he reported this, the penguins are going to put lottery protection on their picks. Just in case this year goes bad. I mean, there's, you have to always put that. Believe me, I learned the hard way about not putting lottery protections on picks.

Even, you know, they got Phiddy, Evgeny Malkin and Crystal Tang and Ricard, Raquel, and all these other guys, he still got to put the protection on it. So I think Abdubis does trade a first, and I think he's going to have to in this deal. Yes. it's going to have a lottery protection protected it was lottery protection excuse me and maybe some other conditions on it i don't think it's just going to be a first round bit going and say hey you know that's it i don't think it's going to be two first rounders though i think that's a little bit much if you're asking me i wouldn't be surprised at like what we saw with the team of myer trade where it's a first and then like a conditional second where if

um carlson plays you know maybe x amount of games or if the penguins go like they get to Eastern Conference Finals or whatever like I think you could see something like that. For the Devils right, the Devils make it to the Eastern Conference Finals this year. That second round pick turns into a first round pick. Go Devils. And then you could see the same thing, right? If within the next two seasons or something, if the Penguins make it to the Eastern Conference Finals, okay, then that and Carlson plays, you know, X amount of games or percentage of games

along the way, then that pick becomes a first round pick. I think that would, that's, you're seeing a lot more of that. I think nowadays, but with these trades, though. That would also make sense. I could also see a trade in like 2020, not a pick, excuse me, in 2025 or 2026. Yep. On the other way, like a second round pick, a third round pick, something like that. Prospects-wise, J.D., you know it, I know it, but penguins don't really have many prospects

in the system. They're not going to trade Braden Yeager, who they just picked in the draft. Nope. Maybe Owen Pickering, but I don't think he's going to be traded either. I mean, they have a couple goalies that could go in the trade. But there's really not that many prospects in the system. So if the trade happens here, probably going to see a boatload of picks and some players. Penguins do have some players that they can offload if the sharks are just looking for anyone.

I mean, the big one is Jeff Petrie, but this complicates it with. He has a 15-team, no-trade clause. And it sounds like he doesn't want to move to California. It's funny. He was just in Napa with his. his wife and his wife called it one of their happy places. So everyone is starting to speculate when it comes to that. Probably doesn't mean too much,

but his family is from the Detroit area. I don't think he's going to want to play on a Sharks team that's going to be rebuilding these next couple of years. If you can maybe flip him to say Detroit, Chicago, who has a lot of cap place, I threw out Nashville out there too just for grabs and gigs, some other team out in the Midwest. That makes sense.

they have Michael Granland who they could get bought out after the Drew O'Connor deal is signed but he could also be involved in a trade here. I think, yeah, I think the kind of way to figure is you're probably, you're going to have to, the sharks are going to have to take a bad contract back, right, to help to counter. So whether if it's, you know, Petrie, if he's willing to come over or, you know, or Granland or whomever, one of those guys, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, It's going to be kind of, you've got to eat the poop a little bit when you bring it a little bit back.

But then the sharks have been really, it's been interesting because, like, if you look at, you know, the Timel Meyer trade and the Brett Burns trade, they, they acquired guys who were pretty close to NHL ready, right? Stephen Lawrence was kind of a tweener guy and ended up being a really solid fourth liner for the sharks last year. And then E2 Macanemi's probably going to, he made his NHL debut last year, going to be the Barracuda, their HL affiliate. He's their number one goal tender.

wouldn't be surprised if he plays, you know, 10 NHL games this year, right? Going to the, to the Timoid Meyer trade, right? They got Shakira Mukumadoulin. It's probably going to be playing this year in the NHL. Then is probably going to be an NHL or the year after. I think he's looking for guys who are, like, those kind of tweener guys who are ready to start kind of making an impact. And that's why a guy, like a Ty Smith, who's been kind of a tweener for, for,

them. I know Pierrot Oliver Joseph, who's been a full blown NHLer, you know, guys like that who are young, but are still kind of reaching their soon. I think that's going to be kind of the key piece coming back for the show, at least what Mike is going to be looking for is one of the key

pieces coming back. The problem is they have a thousand left-handed defensemen and both, like in their prospect pool, and both those guys are, I know, are left-handed defensemen, but throw them in there and figure it out. the guys can play offhand. So I think that you're looking at a bad contract coming back from the sharks,

one of these prospects, a first round pick, and then probably a conditional second round pick that could turn into a first round pick if the penguins do good things. That would make sense. There's also some, I mean, just to fill that tweeners, something that you were just talking about, JD. The penguins do have some of those guys down in Wilkesbury who are, I think, really close to initial gravity, but could get some minutes with the sharks,

someone like a man some fans are probably going to kill me here someone like a valetary Pustin who is going to be pushing for a roster spot this camp i don't think he's going to make it but someone who i think is very close to being in it already there's also sam pool and that's the other one who's been kind of and i know he he missed a big chunk of last year with uh mental health issues or hoping he's he's good to go but i mean you know the sharks that those are the type of guys i think who could either help the barracuda right now or be pushing for NHL minutes on a very wide open Sharks roster going into this season. So I think another player who fits that bill perfectly and fans are probably going to

eat me alive for this one. Alex Nealander, a lot of people have him as an NHL player this upcoming season. He impressed in his small sample this past season. He's going to be pushing for a spot if he is on the team during training camp in the preseason, but I could see him going back to the Sharks based on what you say, J.D. because he's probably too good to play in the NHL right now, especially on the Barracuda. And on a rebuilding Sharks team,

I think he can definitely pot you some goals in the bottom six. He would make some sense in that area. And this is throwing this out there. Drew O'Connor, maybe. I think he's probably going to be on the Penguins, though, this upcoming season. But that's always an option as well. So I think what we're looking at right now is a first-on pick with lottery protection and other conditions, a conditional second that can turn into a first,

maybe a bad contract, whether that's Jeff Petrie or Mikhail Granland. Granlin could also get bought out. And then, you know, some tweeners, maybe like one of P.O. Joseph or Ty Smith, I would lean towards Ty Smith being sent out because I think POJ has a lot more to grow at this point. And then maybe someone like, you know, a Valetre Poussinan, St. Poulin, or just other players in that area. So something like that. Or a goalie prospect, because the sharks were still looking to try to find a goalie prospect. I know the penguins do have a couple in their pipeline as well.

So, you know, I think that's kind of there. And I think with it comes to salary retention, because that's, again, that's going to be the big question is, I think if you can get Carlson in that like $8 million range, whether that's 30%, 35%, something like that. And if you look at the Brett Burns, going back to that, right, the sharks can, they held or they, they, they retain, sorry, 33% of that. So it's a little over $2 million for the next now two seasons going forward.

But I think if you kind of just look to the framework of the Brent Burns trade, granted, it's a little bit more expensive. But I think that's kind of where you're at with this. So if it's the two picks and a bad contract and then kind of whichever of the prospects the sharks want or those kind of tweenier prospect guys, I think that's kind of where we're going here. And I mean, I know you wouldn't want to joke. Joseph, I would probably go Poolean just because I think they've added a lot of defensemen recently, and I think they still want to continue to add to their forward group.

That would be my ideal trade. We would maybe take him back a guy, you know, Petrie or Grandland, whoever you want to send back, whoever's willing to come back. And then I would take Poolean and then the first and the second with conditions and get whole, you know, if it's 33%, whatever gets Carlson to a nice $8 million. I would take him back at 8.7.5 heck, the lower the number, the better, JD. That's how I see it. The lower the number, the better, but then you got to start throwing some more stuff in.

But I think, I think we've reached the deal. We'll call it Mike. I'll call it Mike. You call up Kyle. And we'll be like, guys, we got this done. I don't know what's your problem. I'll get his number from a couple of people who I know actually do have this number. Then, you know, there's always the possibility if we want to get even more fancy you're here.

a third team comes in because I think the penguins could have to do that with their salary cap situation, especially J.D, if Petrie does not want to go to the sharks. So then you have to send Petrie to another team and then you have to send an asset there, probably another pick, something like that. But I think we have a trade here that maybe fits both sides. I think so too. And I think it gives the penguins that one last, you know, oomph to try to, especially what's going to be an insane Eastern conference.

It feels like an arms race. especially when you look at what New Jersey's done. I think Florida is still going to be competitive. I think Boston's probably going to take a step back. But, I mean, this Eastern Conference is going to be insane. And the sharks continuing to kind of asset gather, what they've been doing. And, you know, if you buy out Grandland or whatever you do with him,

like I think he's got two years left on his deal. You know, if you just kind of keep trotting him out there, whatever you want to do with him, like you can do with that. Or play him for a year, buy him out, whatever. you have the gap space. It doesn't matter if you have the sharks. The picks and the prospects are what you care about. Yeah.

And if you don't buy him out, you can just watch him pass the puck to whoever is on your team because that's basically the main skill that he still has left as an NHL player. He did not really do much else as a member of the Penguins after Ron Hextall traded for him. But, J.D., I really appreciate you coming on this episode. This was a lot of fun. Hopefully a deal gets done here at some point because I know everyone in this city is just waiting for this to happen. And there's plenty of memes out there with Eric Carlson, plenty of other talking points, all that stuff.

But I think everyone is waiting to see what happens here so that, you know, the show can get on the road because we're almost to August at this point. But I really appreciate you coming on. What do you have coming up at Locked on Sharks this week? So we have a very, very special guest. I'll spoil it for you. You know what, William Eklund making his return to the podcast. So William McQuinn will be back on. That'll be on Thursday show.

also doing a roster reset and then have another one of the Sharks newest draftees coming on for next week as well. So plenty of good interviews and good stuff coming up here at Lockdown Sharks. JD has all of the content coming for the show. They don't call me a content boy for no reason. I'll tease something before we sign off here. Lockdown Penguins is going to be growing either later this week or next week. And that's all I'm going to say on that. I'm going to stay on that. here, but someone else is going to be coming to the show. And it's someone who has been on the show before, someone who has hosted a Penguins podcast before. And I'm very excited about this. I've been doing this. So yeah, it's JD, guys. He's the new co-host of Lockdown Penguins. But it's someone who

I have a lot of respect for. And I've loved doing this solo for the last four years. But I think the show is going to be taken to a whole new level once this person joins it as the co. So look for that announcement either later this week or early next week. But again, thank you all so much for listening to slash watching this episode. Really appreciate it. I'll be back to another episode for you all on Wednesday.