Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Danny Shirey returns to the show for ALL the Penguins talk!

Episode Date: May 2, 2023

It's a new month but the hockey content doesn't stop there. As Promised, Hunter is joined by Danny Shirey for this special episode of Locked On Penguins as they touch on everything regarding the Penguins' offseason. They start with the GM search and if there's any update regarding that since it's been over two weeks since the firings. They then pivot to the goaltending and discuss why Connor Hellebuyck seems like a slam-dunk acquisition for the Penguins if he is made available. They at least have to call, right? Hunter then gets Danny's thoughts on a new LHD for the defense and gets his opinion on whether the Penguins should wait to extend Jake Guentzel. Danny then gives his take on the Jason Zucker conundrum and whether the Penguins should sign him back. They also discuss the first round of the Stanley Cup Playoffs and what caught their eyes before ending the show. All that, plus much more is on this episode of Locked On Penguins.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!GametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNHL for $20 off your first purchase.eBay MotorsFor parts that fit, head to eBay Motors and look for the green check. Stay in the game with eBay Guaranteed Fit. eBay Motors dot com. Let’s ride. eBay Guaranteed Fit only available to US customers. Eligible items only. Exclusions apply.Built BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKEDON15,” and you’ll get 15% off your next order.Athletic GreensTo make it easy, Athletic Greens is going to give you a FREE 1-year supply of immune-supporting Vitamin D AND 5 FREE travel packs with your first purchase. All you have to do is visit athleticgreens.com/NHLNETWORKFanDuelMake Every Moment More. Don’t miss the chance to get your No Sweat First Bet up to ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS in Bonus Bets when you go to FanDuel.com/LOCKEDON.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as non-withdrawable free bets that expire in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Happy May, everybody. It's great that we are now the fifth month of 2020. That's crazy how fast this is going. But I have a special episode for you all today. Joining me will be Danny Shirey of D.K. Pittsburgh Sports talk everything relating to the Penguins off-season and get into a new goalie target that emerged over the weekend. It was actually a listener that brought it up. And then, you know, this goaltender had a lot of big comments.

We'll also get into the GM search update. All that plus so much more coming up right after this drop with Danny Shire. You're Locked-on Penguins, your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins, part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hello, welcome back to another episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I'm your host, Hunter Hodes. I'm going to follow me on Twitter at Hunter Hodes, follow the shows Twitter at Ellen on Spar Penguins. And, of course, thank you all so much for making this your first list in the day. We're freely available on all platforms.

joining me now is Danny Shiree of DK. Pittsburgh Sports, and this is long overdue because I don't think he's been on the show. And I think it's almost been a year now, which is way too long, to be honest. But Danny, really appreciate you taking the time here. This should be a very chaotic offseason. It's quiet right now, but I don't think it's going to stay that way much longer. Yeah, once, I mean, we're kind of like in limbo right now. It's really hard to kind of get a gauge on where their offseason is headed, obviously. without knowing who's going to be at the helm and who's going to be the general manager.

So it's like, oh, like, do the Penguins want to resign Jason Zucker? Well, I don't know. Maybe we can answer that question when they have a GM. Yeah, no, exactly. And, you know, speaking to that, Danny, it's been almost two and a half weeks now since, you know, Fenway Sports Group, Fire Run, Hextall, Chris Pryor, and Brian Burke. Have they even started interviews for this position yet? Because it seems like it's been fairly quiet.

I don't really think much has gotten out at all. Yeah, it's, it is very, very silent right now. There's not a whole lot that I'm, I'm hearing at all. Like I do know that they are well into their process of at least like narrowing down who their, who their candidates might be. But as far as interviews going on or anything like that or who they're even talking to right now, it's, it's really just tough to tell at this point. Yeah. Yeah. It feels like, you know, once that part comes out, then people will start to be like, oh, like this is the kind of person that they're targeting and that. And, you know, speaking of that, you know, Danny, I read your article for, you know, the five potential candidates for the GM spot. And, you know, I noticed you left someone off there and you tweeted about it until you're like, I should have put them on there.

That was Eric Tolski of Carolina. You know, who, you know, other than those five and plus Eric Tolski, is there anyone else that, you know, is on your radar for this position? So personally, I think it's going to be somebody that comes completely out of left field like Taylor Hawkins. She also wrote a separate article that had five other candidates, and they were good candidates as well. Any of the 10 people we had on either of our lists, I think, would be fine general managers for the penguins. But I just have this underlying feeling that for all the time and energy and brainpower that we're spending here, trying to figure out who the candidates might be, who's going to be the best fit, who has the inside track. I just cannot help but feel like whoever the general manager is going to be, that person is just going to come straight out of left field.

Yeah, and it seems like they're just casting a very wide net for this. And this is their first rodeo in hockey. They want to get to know people. I think they're going to look at, you know, experience people. They're going to look at younger people, more analytical people. There's really no knowing, you know, who is going to get this job. It's really going to be fascinating to see, you know, once the reports come out there, the interviews they've done, and then once they cut down the finalists,

that will be really intriguing as well. It's just, it's so different, Danny, because this time a couple years ago, when Rutherford resigned, Ron Hextall was filled within two weeks, if I'm not mistaken. They started that very quickly. I know it was during the season, so that you have to speed that up. But they interviewed a few people, cut it down about two or three, and then boom, they was hired. But this one, it is not like this at all. I was warning people on the show a couple weeks ago that I could see this tracking out. honestly until the Stanley Cup final and that might be a little late because the draft is coming up

about what is it like a week week and a half after this time they cut final ends and then the agency is two weeks after but you know there's really been no indication of when they want this to get done yeah i would i'm kind of with you i don't think it's i don't think like tomorrow for instance there's going to be a press release like oh this is our new general manager um i obviously there there is a little bit of urgency there because you don't want to be running up like a week out from the draft. And, you know, obviously hockey's a lot different than like the NFL, for instance, like the people you're drafting in the NHL aside from maybe the top handful of picks, they're not going to be up with the NHL club anytime soon. So it's a little bit different, not like, okay, we've got to have the urgency and know who we're taking right here to plug in the lineup right away. But you still want to make sure that you're, obviously the draft is still a foundational piece of your organization.

so you want to make sure you have your ducks in a row for that. So I think that it's still going to be, you know, several weeks, maybe another month or so before we really have anything substantial. But I hesitate to say it was like good timing because it's never really good timing to have not have a general manager. But this is a different situation where they're not going to have to rush in over a two-week span and hire a Hextall, for instance. They're going to have the ability here, even though I'm sure some of their candidates are still

with some postseason teams right now, they are going to have the luxury of taking some time here and actually going through a thorough process rather than having to rush through it. Yeah, I very much agree with that. You know, they're not really pressed for time here. And forgive me if I'm wrong, Danny. They can request permission to interview candidates on teams that are currently playing, right? Like an Eric Torsey and stuff like that. Okay.

Yeah, that actually happened in 2017. I want to say when the Sabres hired Jason Botterill away from the Penguins. That was actually during the postseason. Okay. Okay. Yeah, I thought that was the case, but I had to double check. So, you know, they probably, you know, for all intents purposes, maybe they have reached out to Carolina about Eric Tolski or, you know, someone else on your list or other list that are out

there. But, you know, and sticking with that GM search, you know, the Penguins, it's funny, Danny, they already got to some business this weekend. They re-signed Alex Nealander just. a bunch of interim guys and Mike Sullivan, I guess, helping out the exit interviews. I guess they all got together and decided, hey, we're going to bring back Newlander on a one-year, one-way deal. For those freaking out that it's one-way, it really doesn't mean much.

He's just, you know, that's just the money at the NHL level. He can still be sent down. It's really not a big of a deal. Yeah, I think the biggest thing, like with the whole one-way, it's like, people think the one-way means it, like, you have to go on waivers. to be sent down or whatever the case may be. It literally just means that you get paid the same amount, whether you're up in the NHL or down in the AHL.

But the thing with that is, like, last off season when P.O. Joseph signed his one-way deal, it was kind of like an indication that, okay, like, we're comfortable with you being at the NHL level. So we're going to give you a one-way deal because, you know, we anticipate you being there. I don't know that it's the exact same situation with Nealander here, but I still, like, I still view it as there are. comfortable with him, like in a worst case scenario, it was like a depth or 13th forward, because obviously he's making like a league minimum deal or just slightly over.

So it's not like they're breaking the bank here or taking some giant risk by bringing them back. Yeah, I was going to ask about that. Danny, like it was I was going to ask before, you said it, you know, it was just kind of similar to P.O. Joseph where it's like they're comfortable with him in their top 12 full time next season, but it might just be like, as you said, you know, fringe depth. You know, he impressed me during the games when he was up here, but, you know, it's just not enough of a sample size to really know if he's going to contribute at, you know, a full-time level next season. That's my thing. Yeah, I was really, really impressed with his game when he was up.

And it's it had very little to do with what everyone thought that they loved about his game. Like it, it's the, since he was drafted, his calling card were his hands and his offensive prowess. his offensive ability. The knocks on his game were his defensive plays, play away from the puck, all those kind of finer details. But when he came up, I saw a very, to use a Mike Sullivan term, a very conscientious player. I really keyed in on his play away from the puck in his details, whether it was on the forecheck, whether it was in transition defense or even his defensive coverage. I mean, he's not going to ever be in the conversation for a Selky Trophy. but at the same time, I saw a guy who was taking care of business and those components

and knowing the offensive ability that he has, I think they would have been crazy to just let him walk because if he can continue. And again, like you mentioned, it was a nine game sample. You can't really, you know, you can make assumptions and guesses off of that sample, but you really don't know what it's going to look like over a half a season, a full season. But with that being said, from what we saw in that nine game sample, his play away from the puck and all of those little details were, I would say average or above average. There weren't any areas I thought that he was necessarily deficient in. And with the offensive abilities that he has, I really view him as a very low risk,

high upside guy. And the other thing I think that gets lost on a lot of people is that he's not a prospect anymore. He's 25 years old. The thing with him being 25 is that what we know about most standard average age curves for NHL players. A lot of the time, this is the age where forwards are peaking right now. So there's a very good possibility that the Nealander that they're going to get this season

or this come next season, I guess, is the best version of Nealander that they're going to get. So getting them on a one-year deal at a just above league minimum contract that I thought it was a slam dunk. Yeah, I completely agree with that. You know, I don't think, you know, I'm not part of like this massive Nealander fan club that I know was out there during the season. And yeah, the Penguins' depth was pretty bad. I think everyone knows that, but I wasn't, you know, clamoring for him to come up and play all these games over them just because, you know, I don't really truly know how many difference makers there are down on Wilkesbury. Let's be honest here, Danny. There's not much down there besides him. I guess Voluntary Pousson, if you want to argue him, Sam Poulin now that he's back with the team. But, you know, still signing him as a slam dunk, he'll be, you know, probably the first player up from Wilkesbury. He starts the season there next year. But, you know, best case, he's in the bottom 60. He's contributing at least decently.

on an every night basis. But that wraps up this first segment coming up in an X segment. We're going to continue some GM stuff and why, you know, the next GM should be going after a top goal, especially one that made his feelings quite clear that he's not interested in a rebuild after his team got eliminated. So that's coming up right after this break. But before we get to that, if I can get my wonderful, there it is, my wonderful little athletic greens promo.

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All right, we're back here on this episode of the Lockdown Payments podcast. I'm Hunter Hodes. I'm joined by Danny Shower of D.K. Pittsburgh Sports. So, Danny, I'm sure you caught Rick Bonas's comments to the media after they got blown to hell in five games by the night. Oh, yeah. And he basically just called his team a bunch of soft pansies that should not have been on the ice and like wheeler didn't like it no one else on that team liked it uh that is going to be a summer for the ages of the i think conor helibuck said he's not interested in

rebuild i don't know about you i saw i was asked about this on my friday episode by our youtube commenter i don't regret sort about it for pensburg this morning if i am the new gm i am calling the jets and kevles jello down and saying hey what what is your asking price for someone like Connor Hullough because he would be a slam dunk acquisition for this team since they're going to be in the market for a new gold tender if they don't want to bring Justin Jari back. Yeah, I mean, when all of a sudden it's starting to look like, and granted, if there are other teams in the equation, and they can almost 100% put together a better trade package and the penguins will be able to. With that being said, it is starting to shape up like the penguins

are going to have some serious options here on the trade market if they do decide that they're not going to run it back with Tristan Jari. And that was only just blown open with Hela Bucks. And again, we don't necessarily know emotions could kind of simmer down here into the off season. And Halebuck might be like, you know what, I just want to play my last season here in Winnipeg. And he seems like the kind of guy that no matter what, if he wants to stay, like the Jets

will keep him around. With that being said, I cannot think of a better, like, match here. I guess it would be like one of the targets that both Taylor Haas and I have talked about a lot that we both think the penguins should like throw the draft pick cupboard and any prospect that Nashville would be interested in for UC Soros, right? UC Soros makes a lot of sense because he's at a pretty reasonable cap hit for the, for the production that he's played at over the past couple of years. They've got the top goaltending prospect in the league while they're kind of transitioning here

into a rebuild. So if they're willing to kind of move on from Soros, I think that would be great. But what might even be greater is if they can get a guy like Connor Hellebuck, who I would probably take him over Soros if I had to just take a goalie for one game and needed a win, I would probably pick Hellebuck over pretty much anyone, maybe save for Shasturkin or Sorokin. And the other thing is that he only has one year left on his contract. Yeah. And as much as everyone wants to, you know, we've been saying it basically since the back-to-back Cups like, oh, we don't know how much longer Crosby, Malkin, and Latang are going to play like this.

But eventually they're not going to play like that anymore. So if we realistically look at their competitive window here, I'm not going to say this is the last season that they absolutely have a chance. But I feel like they need to operate on the basis that whatever season they are in or whatever season they are going to is going to be the last season like that. So is there a better target out there as far as goalies are concerned than someone like Hellebuck? Because you don't really have to worry about his age because he's just got one year left on his deal. But if he performs anywhere close to the level that he's been at over the past three, four, five seasons, that would be

huge for the Penguins. Like if the Penguins had Hellebuck this season compared to Tristan Jari, they're in the playoffs, easy. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's not a debate. Right. So when you can, and again, there's the question of the penguins have the trade assets to get him. Would he want to come to the penguins? Would the jets be willing to do a deal with the penguins? Those are all tons of variables. But just purely looking at the fit here, I think it is a great fit. It absolutely is. And one year left, believe his contract 6.1 million. The penguins, they have the cap space for it. They have 20 million in cap right now. You can up that to about 24 if you buy on Michael. Randlin, which in my opinion, I think you see her, she was saying that as a slam dunk to do for the new general manager. You know, sure, you have four years of his con, or you have four years of money to pay, but you still get cap space for the core. But, you know, you're right. You don't know how long they're going to play at an elite level. And if you are the new GM in this front office, you owe it to them to take the best shot at winning another championship.

Wow. Or I came up winning another championship in this era. And it also, yeah, he's, he also, yeah, he, It's one more you left on his contract. If you can't extend him, you know, that's a problem. But you wait for that, right? Danny, you wait for that until after the season because if you win a championship, I don't think anyone's really going to care that much, care as much, I should say. Yeah, no, I mean, at the end of the day, that's what this is all about.

How many, you know, pirates fans will sit there and tell you, like, I'll take another 30 years of losing if it means we can get a World Series, right? So I, and in that kind of sense, Penguins fans have been spoiled. here. I mean, even dating back to like the Lemieux era, but specifically in the Crosby era, getting to go to four Stanley Cup finals, coming away with three victories in those finals. At the end of the day, I think one more, and again, I don't even think it necessarily has to be an end result of a Stanley Cup, but what a spectacle it would be to watch this course so late into their career still excelling and playing at this level to at least make another,

take another run at a cup and maybe get to the, get to the conference final or maybe sneak into the, into the Stanley Cup final. I don't know. Setting the bar is winning a Stanley Cup. Like we just saw it with the Bruins, you know, it's such,

such a difficult task to do. And there's so many things that are stacked against you on top of hockey, just being an incredibly luck-driven, variance-driven sport that you never know what's going to happen in these small samples in these four-game, five-game, six-game series. You just never know what's going to happen. right so i i don't think it's fair to even if they go out and have the most ridiculously good offseason and add all these impact players you can't set the bar at the stanley cup but i still think

one more run with this core would just be quite the sight to behold no absolutely you know i that's the one thing i think most i mean i think i think every fan wants another long run here it's been six years now next year it'll be seven oh funny enough that's how long it took between the 2009 and the 2016 cup so maybe you can say in a way that they're due but yeah, I definitely agree with that. Sticking with goaltending before we get to our next commercial break, Danny, are you under the opinion, or do you have the same opinion as me where the penguins should get

two new goaltenders next season, or do you just want them to replace one of them, whether it's the Smith being traded and Jari staying, but have someone else coming in as like a 1A, 1B, or do you just want them to completely gut it and just start fresh? No, so I'm of the opinion to, let Tristan Jari walk and just go after a new number one. I personally, I know everybody can't stand Casey DeSmith. And I fully aware that he had a very, very wishy-washy season and was

completely inconsistent. One game, he's making 45 saves and the next he's given up four goals on a bunch of muffins from the point, right? So he had a very inconsistent season and it was only made worse by the fact that he had to play so much because Jari was unavailable. But the fact of the matter, I'm a data-driven fact-based guy and you look at the numbers over the past three, four seasons, DeSmith is a perfectly adequate backup NHL goaltender. And I know there's all kinds of like nuance there and all kinds of like straw man arguments about why that's actually not the case. But when you're looking at save percentage, goals saved above expected over a three, four-year sample, it's really hard to argue against that. And to Smith ranks favorably in the top half of the league of the 60, 70,

80 goalies who have played, you know, a qualifying amount of games over the past three, four seasons. And the fact that they have him at a $1.8 million cap hit, you look, if you move on from him, where are you realistically going out and finding a backup who is going to be statistically better than him other than just being like, oh, he's not small and flounders out of the crease on the goals he gives up. Like, just realistically looking at it, I don't see them improving on DeSmith at all at a better rate. And I don't think it would be worth it to spend an extra million dollars for another backup

just to say they got another backup. Like I, I, again, DeSmith is not perfect. He's not a starter by any means. And he's not even the kind of guy that you can throw into like a 1A, 1B kind of situation. But for the Penguin situation, I think he's perfectly fine as a backup and especially at the cap hit that the Penguins have him at for next season. Yeah, I mean, you could definitely make the argument that, I mean, you can definitely

make the argument, I shouldn't say that. He played too much this season, Danny. Tristan Jari's injury, I think, really hampered him. Hampered, well, both, obviously, but in terms of Desmith, he just got too much playing action. And I think the more he plays, the worse he is. Yeah, that's my main thing. And I just, I wish, like, you know, and you're right, you know, the numbers, they compare

pretty well to other backups around the league. I just wish you wouldn't get one God version of him one night. Like, for example, against the Capitals, right? When he almost was just stealing that game, but then he's given up like five or six the next night and it's just completely off his angle. It's just like, which version are you going to get? And it's just like so frustrating to watch. Yeah, I definitely understand the frustration with it.

And like in the moment too, you definitely feel that as well. But then you kind of take a step back and just look at the goaltending position as a whole and just consider how freaking random it is and up and down it is and how much performance fluctuates. And then you take that a step further by just looking at the sample of backup goaltenders around the league. It's like, yeah, half the league's backups, probably two-thirds of the league's backups are doing exactly what the Smith was, but on a much worse level. Yeah, no, I totally get that as well. So, you know, it's definitely, I would say it's a good option. I just, you can't run the same tandem back for.

Not the same two. You can't bring the same two back. No. I mean, that's just, I mean, that's just, you know, doing the definition of insanity, which I think everyone knows. Another option I have out there, I want them to either, I believe I did see the offer sheet picks. They can't, they don't have a third, so they can't really sign that one.

They can do a different kind of offer sheet. It's just the money has to be a little bit different. I would look into Jeremy Swayman. I know he had a bad, I don't say. that. Kind of the nigh game seven for the Bruins. But I would either look to do that or just trade for his rights because there's going to be a cap crunch in Boston. Linus Allmark is there for two more years. I believe he has a five million cap hit. That's another big option for me, Danny, considering how young he is, how great of a season he had. Again, I understand he didn't

play that well in game seven. The Bruins were kind of checked out when that overtime came, though. But I would aggressively go after him if I heard of the new gym and I couldn't get Soros or hella. Yeah, I'm right there with you. you, that was something that Taylor and I were talking about right at the beginning of the off season two. We were kind of before the Hellebuck thing, it was like Saros is kind of the top target here. But as a fallback option, Swayman's really enticing. As you mentioned, the penguins won't have the draft capital to offer sheet him. They do have a third round pick in this coming draft. The problem is that it's New Jersey's third round pick and not their own third round

pick. So they wouldn't be able to meet the requirements for the offer sheet. With that being said, they could, could trade for his rights and then sign him themselves. But I'm starting to wonder now, especially with the news coming out that Olmark was dealing with some like debilitating, like chronic injury that was like really hampering his performance throughout the postseason. I almost wonder if the Bruins are going to try and trade Olmark instead and then lock up swaying. That would be interesting too.

And I think, you know, the penguins, they should be, I don't know, I don't think this is a hot take. I think they should be interested in Allmark, if that's the case too. I understand he makes a decent amount of money. I know he was bit banged up. I know he had a season for the ages and he's probably going to win the Vesna. I also don't think he's probably going to have a 930-8 percentage again. But is he a better option than Tristan Jari?

Yes. Yeah, 100%. That's just that's the reason enough, I think, for me to, you know, trade for him. Even though, again, two years, five million, I'm not really big on paying for goaltending unless you are. the elite of the elite like Ilya Serochen, Igor Shusurkin, Andrei Fasselowski, Connor Hellerlbuk, UC Soros. But I think it would be worth it, especially, you know, with two years left, I think that's really what you can count on in terms of this core still playing at elite level, at least one of those years, I hope at least. Yeah, I mean, two years ago,

we were talking about, oh, like the Corps probably got two years left at most, right? So the fact that we're sitting here now and talking about the possibility that they have another two years is quite honestly a miracle in and of itself. But I'm not expecting. Like I, that's what was really frustrating about the season the Penguins just had is that like they're 100% never going to get a completely healthy season again out of both Crosby and Malkin, especially at the level that they were playing at. And the top six in general, Danny, I'm pretty sure they all missed a combine less than 10 games

this past season. That's not. I mean, heck, Jason Zucker was only missed a hand. full of games all year. Yeah. I mean, it's crazy how compared to almost every other season that this franchise had in the Sid Geno era where, you know, it's almost like a penguin's injury curse, that went away this year and it's probably not going to be the same again. So yeah, you're definitely right about that. And speaking of real quick before we get to Ray, Danny, are you re-signing Jason Zucker?

Ooh. This is not a real quick for me, but I'll make it as real quick as that game. It's a tough one. So I am fully aware that there are, there's maybe one player out on the market who might be able to replicate like the on ice value that Zucker brings. And that's going to be Tyler, Tyler Bertuzi. I see him. Yeah, I don't think he's coming to the Penguins either. Someone out there is going to give him a ridiculous contract and he's going to price himself out of the Penguins budget real quick. With that being said, I really, really struggle because, yes, I'm sitting here.

talking about the penguin's competitive window, maybe being another year, maybe another two years. So it's like you don't really have to worry about term. And well, yes, you do want to get younger and a bit speedier is like, I just really struggle with it because Zucker was one of the top five on five goal scores in the NHL this past season. He was one of the top drivers of offense, quality offensive looks at even strength. But I'm also sitting here and looking, it was a contract year for him. It was coming two years after a bit of injury. disappointment, on ice performance disappointment. It just really felt like so many things culminated for the strong season that he had were,

and again, it was just kind of like a, I must wonder if it was like a prove it year for him. Like, yes, I can do this. And like, you guys can feel justified, even though it was a completely different regime. This franchise can feel justified in having acquired me. And I feel like he showed that. But like I just kind of brought up with Crosby and Malkin in that situation, I feel like you have to view the season Zooker just had as a best case scenario.

So if you do bring him back, you need to be aware of the fact that there's probably going to be a bit of a dip in what you got last season, but you also need to be aware of what he did on the ice when he was healthy the previous two seasons and be aware that that might be a lot closer to what you could be getting. So with that being said,

I'll bring Zooker back if the cap hit is at or below 5 million, but anything over. I unfortunately I think you got to move on. Yeah, I'm kind of around there. You know, he's probably going to have to take a discount to come back. 100%. Yeah, he's not going to be getting $6 million per here, 5.75, maybe even 5.5.

I think the term has to be a bit short. I don't think you can do five or six years. And I know term probably doesn't mean too much because the team is going to be bad at that point. They just did that with R. Krokelle last year. But I probably can't see the new regime giving him a lot of term at that point. But that's going to be an interesting one to follow. That wraps up this.

I've been coming up to end the show. Forget Danny's thoughts on them potentially getting a left shot D. Plus we'll end with some playoff talking how this might have been the best first round in recent memory. And I can't believe I'm saying that because even the penguins aren't in it. And I guess it took the penguins missing to not have to finally have a good first round. I can't speak today. But anyways, that's all coming up right after this commercial break. All right.

I'm back here on this episode of the Locked on Penguins podcast. I'm Andre Hodes. that's Danny Sherry. Danny, I continue to beat this drum down repeatedly on my show that outside of goal-attending, a left-shot-D, top-four preferably, is one of their biggest needs this off-season. Ryan Dumlin, you know, happy trails. Great here for a number of years. It was not good the last couple of years.

He's probably not going to come back, nor should he come back. No offense to him. So after that, got Marcus Pedersen. Great year. He'll be in your top four. P.O. Joseph, fine. I don't know if he's good enough to be consistent getting top four minutes. And then you have Ty Smith, who of course came over to the John Marino trade. That left side, it's not nearly as good as it should be. And it's why they really need to be calling some teams this offseason to acquire a left shot to you.

Because that free agent market, oh, it's not good. No, no, it is not good at all. Like the, I was looking recently. He's just at the crop of left-handed defensemen, not even just like top pairing guys, but like just all of the left-handed defensemen that are out there. And there's like one mildly enticing name from that crop, and it's Dmitri Orlov. And he seems like another guy. And well, yes, the penguins need to be getting younger. They need to get faster.

They shouldn't be signing more guys that are on the wrong side of 30, blah, blah, blah. I think if they can find a player who they know is still good, screw it if he's still old. so be it. But with that being said, I think Orlov kind of had a coming out party with the Bruins. Like I've thought he was a very, very good defender for quite a while now. But it seems like more people didn't really catch on to that until he was acquired by the Bruins. So I view him as a guy who's probably going to end up getting priced out of Pittsburgh as well, even if they did have interest in him. But I'm absolutely with you. It's happy trails to Brian Dumlin. Thank you for your time here. they wouldn't have won those back-to-back cups without him, especially the 2017 Cup.

Do not win without him. But I think this team has, for lack of better terms, I think this team has been hindered a little bit by a comfortability factor over the past year or two seasons. And part of that has to do with the fact that Dumlin's been here for so long. Brian Rust has been here for so long. Obviously, you don't want to throw that on your. on your core three superstars. But those kind of complementary pieces, when you start to get attached to them,

it really kind of becomes a problem. And like, you look, Brian Dumlin led the penguins in ice time this past season. Like that, that tells you really a lot about what you need to know about the season they had. Yeah. So anyway, enough belaboring over, over Dumlin.

I think that they need a top four left-handed defenseman, preferably one who, I hesitate to say that like defensive-minded because obviously if you're playing in a top four role you need to be able to push the puck up ice and you need to be able to contribute offensively. I was going to say that brings more offense. Right. So I think that that that defenseman needs to be able to take care of business in their own

end, but I don't think that they should necessarily like target the left-handed version of Jan Ruda, who really is just Dimitri Kulikov anyway. So, yeah. looking at it now, Ty Smith is a restricted free agent. So assuming that the penguins do re-sign him as well, you look, and they've got Pedersen, Joseph, Smith down the left side. I would be okay or at least interested into going into next season with a top pairing of Patterson and Latang,

because while they didn't play very well together intermittently for a good chunk of the season, when they were paired up together early in March, they were dominant together. I'm not exaggerating that at all. The penguins crushed the opposition with those two out on the ice at full strength. Obviously, Pedersen ended up getting hurt, you know, several weeks later. And that obviously didn't get revisited again because he was out until the final game of the season. But I think that there could be something there going forward where Latang can still have that trustworthy defensive presence on his pairing.

But Pedersen showed this past season that he can do a whole lot of driving offense as well, even if he's not going to put up a bunch of points. With that being said, he also showed very well next to Jeff Petrie for most of the season. And even though I think Petrie did not play very well at all after he came back from his injuries in the second half of the season, they showed pretty well in a large sample as well. So assuming that Pedersen slots in with one of those two guys, you're going to need someone else who's going to complement either one of Petrie or Latang. Because I just don't see them going into next season with Peterson, Joseph. and Letang down, or Pedersen, Joseph, and Smith down the left side because Joseph and Smith are

kind of the same player in a way. And really, I view the season that P.O. Joseph just had as like a best case season for Ty Smith, right? One where you're putting up really strong offensive results in a relatively sheltered role, but you're also giving a lot of it back defensively. I think that that really is kind of like a best case thing for Ty Smith. So I, I just think they're two similar players and two guys who are probably going to need a little bit of a more reduced workload that you just can't go into next season with those three guys as down the left side. So as you've, as, you know, we've both brought up here now, I think that has to come down to someone who can play up on one of the top two pairings down the left side. Yeah. And I think it's why also, Dan, they were rumored to be in the Jacob Trickren sweepstakes because they knew they needed someone at a good cap hit and who's the ear for the next few seasons.

can play with Letang or play with Petrie. Fortunately if they didn't get in, but it made a lot of sense. At first when I thought about it, I was like, well, it didn't, but then I was like, oh, nope, with the one walking, no, you have another top pairing guy. Obviously, it stinks that didn't happen. But, you know, someone, you know, kind of in that similar mold is who I'd be looking at. I brought up Noah Hannafin from Calgary because I think they might be making a lot of changes there next season.

And heck, they just fired Daryl Sutter today. So, no, those are really already happening. But I just want to get your thoughts on that. that. Also, I brought this up last week. I wanted to ask you about this. This is going to be really interesting off season in terms of Jake Gensel. One year left on the deal, six million going to have a big raise, I would assume. Are you starting contract talks with him this offseason? Are you, so you're waiting. Yeah. No, no chance. I'm not looking at extending anybody beyond this season.

Like if there are players locked up for this next season, I'm not looking to extend any of them beyond that. Like they've already locked up like Latang, Malk, and Rust, Raquel, you already look at those guys and their son, as good as they were last season, they are locked up to, to term that's going to exceed their expiration date as effective players. Right. So while I, I'm okay with, you know,

leveraging a bit of the future for the now, that has to like there has to be a cutoff point like you can't go down to your third line and all a sudden be you know extending guys for four or five seasons out and I get that Jake Gensel is not a third liner but with that being said um you know it sounds kind of funny to say it was a disappointing season for someone who scored 35 some goal I think what he finished the season with 37 goals and he was 36 I think yeah yeah 36 goals even though a handful of them were empty netters and he was almost in a point per game so it's really tough to sit there and say that that was a disappointing season, but based off of the

standards that he has set for himself, especially the prior season, the 21, 22 season. I'm predicting 50. Right. There were a lot of people that were going into this past season that thought it was a legitimate possibility that he could at least sniff 50. you know i i i struggle with looking at gensel beyond next season not saying one way or the other whether he should be back but where my mind is at is that and i guess i'll just squash like the whole like maybe look at trading him or whatever like you you have to consider the fact that even though he is probably a bottom five bottom 10 being generous defensive forward in the n hl like he he gives a lot back defensively. With that being said, he's also a 99th percentile driver of quality chances.

And as we've seen in the past, he can absolutely fill the net at five on five. So if I'm to assume that going into the next season, Gensel's going to get a little bit of his finishing touchback. You know, he's not going to the world championships. So maybe there was a little bit of a minor hindrance there injury wise. I don't want to speculate on that too much. But assuming that. at his finishing touch at least finds a middle ground between where it was this season and where he was at two seasons ago, I think that that is like you're going to be getting a surplus value out of him of anywhere from like three to three and a half, four million dollars, like a worst case scenario kind of

thing. So I'm not looking at extending him because just on the off chance, well, I don't even want to call it an off chance, but in the event that he does have a repeat of this season that he just had, I wouldn't want to be extending him until after that happens because obviously if you extend him now, it's going to be more so about what he did before this past season. But then all of a sudden, if you have two seasons of, okay, well, this maybe seems to be more of where you're at now versus a down stretch kind of thing. That obviously changes the implications. And who knows if we're sitting here another year from now going, oh, maybe there's still another year on the window here. Well, then that difference in a million and a half, two million on the cap could be a big difference.

Yeah, no, I 100% agree with that. And, you know, who knows how much the cap is even going to go up next year, Danny. I mean, we've been saying that this is going to have for some time that COVID happened, and it's just been going up like barely even a million. And everyone's hoping that it's going to go up a decent amount in the next couple years. But, you know, I'll believe it when I see it. And obviously, that would help the penguins a lot. But, you know, yeah, that to deal with, SIDS up in a couple years.

You know, these, you know, these are some competition. Well, SIDS not. I think everyone knows what's going to happen with that. But real quick here, before I let you go, give me some observations from the first round. Have you thought this is one of the best ones in recent memory? Anything outside of, I guess, maybe Boston losing or Seattle beating Colorado? Anything outside of that maybe surprise you? Maybe I guess the Leafs finally ending their curse.

Yeah, so during the preseason, I actually picked the Leafs to come out of the Eastern Conference. with that being said, going into the postseason, I was like, look, I'm not sticking with them necessarily as my Eastern Conference pick, but I am going to pick them to finally move on and win a series. Well, obviously they did that. But what I found interesting about that is that if you take a look at last postseason series against the Lightning and this postseason series against the Lightning, they probably deserve to win last postseason more than they did this postseason. Yeah. I found that amusing, but honestly, I did get quite a bit of enjoyment out of like giving some jabs to the Leafs organization and their fans for just never being able to advance. With that being said, seeing the reaction out of Toronto, especially from their fans, like that, obviously winning championships is what it's all about. But like that, all that just 20 years of like pent up frustration and rage and anger finally coming out to like finally be like, we we conquered like the. the first villain on our quest was just so awesome to see.

So I've really enjoyed that. And I also just like that cracking team is so fun to watch. Yeah. Like Colorado was banged up. I probably, what's the word I'm looking? I probably diminished the loss of Gabriel Landiscag. Obviously it hurt not having Natchushkin around. And then McCar was out for a game as well.

So I think I probably just assumed that, you know, McKinnon and Rans and we're going to be able to take care of business against them anyway. But I went into the series going like, look, this, this Cracking Team Lack lacks star power, but they are a very deep and effective team. And I could see them making it a competitive series. So I think it was awesome to watch them take down the abs, the defending cup champs. And I'm excited to see what they can do here and maybe put a run together. Yeah, then going up against Dallas will be interesting.

The stars, they can beat you in a lot of different ways. They're deep. They're fast. They're nasty. They got the goalie that can steal games. I think I also underestimated Seattle a little bit coming into this series. I just didn't realize how Colorado's depth really just took a massive hit going into the season. No cadre.

Latest Cogs out. Berkovsky's gone. It almost felt like when Ransson, McKinnon, McCar, when they were on the ice, they just were not generating any offensive. They were just strapped in their defensive zone. They quite literally weren't. Like I forget who posted it on Twitter. but somebody posted a chart of the avalanches shot differential with McCar on the ice

versus off the ice. And as the series went on, the shot differential kept going up with McCar out there. And it kept going down without him out there. So it really just don't have to look any further than that. Yeah, no, I agree. And, you know, just what a collapse by the ruins. They had 10,000 chances to win that series. They were a millisecond away from winning that series in five games.

I think people gloss over that fact. If Brobroski doesn't make that save there, pucked in the back and the net, the series is over, to multiple third period leads in game six. And then last night, losing that game in overtime and just seeing that crowd so dejected, it just goes to show how hard it is to win this time of year. That's a Panthers team that barely got in over a bad Penguins team. No Penguins fans, the Penguins would not have been able to pull off a 3-1 comeback

against the Bruins despite them be finishing a point behind them. But that was a really interesting one to watch. you know, Matthew Kachuk said, I'm going to take that series over. And he did just that. Yeah. Honestly, I, you know, I've always thought that Kachuk was a good player and fun to watch. But this like ascension to stardom that he's had over this past like two years now, I guess it was, is just, has been insane to watch because you turn on a Panthers game and you don't even have to know anything about hockey to realize that that dude's making a, significant impact, not only with just his puck skills, ability to put the puck in the net, set his teammates up, but he's getting nasty after the whistle. He can play that grind game,

and he really embraces a lot of the qualities that are necessary for postseason hockey. So I, I'm glad, you know, it would have been cool to see the Bruins go on a run and complete their awesome regular season, but I'm glad that I'm going to get to keep watching some more Matthew Kach, because he is quite fun to watch. Yes, absolutely. He's, He is, he's such a treat. And, you know, there's a series in the West that's going to has a lot of my attention. Vegas Edmonton is going to be a ton of fun. I want seven games of Stone and Eichel versus McDavid and Drysidal.

Just feed me that matchup. I understand McDavid and Drysidal or a big step above Stone and Eichl, but they are still also elite players. And seeing Mark Stone celebrate like the psychopath that he is on the ice, that will never be beaten. I just, I cannot get enough of Mark Stone. watching him at least. No, if there's one player in the NHL who likes scoring goals more than Jason Zucker, it's Mark Stone.

So, like, those two guys scoring goals is must watch theater, must watch theater. Like, there's so many, like, little, and maybe it's just because I've been, like, a hockey nuts since I was, like, a little kid. But, like, of all the, like, extra things that go on with the game, like, the stick taps on the boards or, like, all the. camaraderie or whatever is watching guys celebrate like they are six years old when they score a goal. These are grown men out here acting like they just won the lottery. There's nothing better.

There's nothing better than that. But as far as the series is concerned, I'm with you. I think it's going to be a great series. Edmonton was my preseason pick to win the cup. they were my post regular season, pre postseason. Does that even make sense? I probably made that way more confidence than I needed to. But the Oilers, they are my cup pick.

I'm sticking with the Oilers. I still don't love their roster top to bottom. But with that being said, I think this is some of the best depth that they've had in the McDavid Drysidal era. Matthias Eckholm has been a great, great, great addition for them on the blue line. and obviously when you've got playoff dry-sidal going and knowing what McDavid is capable of. Like it's really hard for me to pick against them, even knowing that it's the Oilers and even knowing that they are susceptible to screwing up just as the Leafs might. But the Leafs advance.

So maybe the Tides have turned. Yeah, I mean, and the West is pretty open this year. Colorado's out. You know, potentially seeing Dallas go through and play Edmonton would be a lot of fun. But there's still one more first-round series. And that's the last thing I'll get to before I let you go here, Danny. Rangers Devils, game seven tonight, actually in about an hour. I get the feeling that if the Rangers blow this game,

I think there's going to be a coaching change up there. I don't think with the expectations that they had coming into this season, especially the playoffs, you go up 2-0, you lose three straight, you win on home ice. This is a big game for them. And I just can't help the fact, especially after what they did at the deadline with getting Kane, Teresenko, Nicola, that if they don't win this game, I think Gerard Galan's out of a job.

This might sound like a ridiculous take, considering that the Rangers went to the conference final last year. But like, I think there at least should have been like a thorough evaluation of whether or not Galant should have been brought back for this season. Like, he's not a good coach. You know, I struggle with it because obviously situations are different from team to team, but you look at last season's Rangers team, they were horrible at controlling play. And like the one, the two redeeming qualities that they had were that they had the best goaltender in the league and that they had a handful of players that were adept at counter attacking and scoring off the rush and being opportunistic. Well, what did they do to going into this season?

They did nothing. They went out and swapped a couple of pieces here and there. They were moderately better at controlling play. But they're largely the same team that relies on goaltending and relies on the. their quick counter attack to score in bunches and catch the, it was maddening. Like they, what they did to the Penguins last postseason where they spend 15 of 20 minutes in a period getting hemmed into their own end and then they score on the one chance they get. Like that's what, that's what their game is predicated around.

And I just don't think that's a foundation for winning hockey. No, I completely agree with that. And I think, you know, their star players have to show up tonight. You know, Zabedinjad finally showed up in Game Six. has been there all series. It's time for Artemic Paneraan to actually do something in a playoff game outside of ending the Penguin season in Game 7 last year. I think that's really all he did, to be honest.

Still pretty big, of course. Right. But no, I think that will do it for this episode of the Lock on Penguins podcast. Really appreciate you coming on. This game seven tonight should be a lot of fun. Round two has been great. It's funny. My girlfriend, she asked me to hang out a couple times.

I'm like, oh, I'm watching the game. She goes, oh, is this going to be your life until July? I'm like, kind of, yeah. I'm like, it was just funny how I just get used to it. I'm like, yeah, just get used to it. I said, I said Tuesday, there's no games tomorrow. That's a, that's a prime opportunity. Date night.

Yes. But Danny, really appreciate you coming on. Tell everyone, you know, what you've got coming up at DK. Pittsburgh Sports. Yeah, so over at DK. Pittsburgh Sports, I'm a beat reporter, beat writer. We, even though it's the offseason, we basically have stuff coming out. every day or every other day, whether it's, you know, analysis, reporting, fun stuff. I do lots of film breakdown. Every Thursday, I have a drive to the neck column, which is kind of like an in-depth analysis column where I'll either really dive into the stats or I'll really dive into the film or I'll

do a blend of both. So that's some of the most fun work that I do. And it seems to be received pretty well. That's one of my favorites that I do. But other than that, if you're, you know, not a subscribe, Make sure you go and sign up. It's only a dollar a month for your first four months. If you're not interested in doing that, follow me on Twitter at Danny Shirey PGH. I tweet out all my content there, all my articles. I tweet out some fun videos, locker room videos during the season and all that good stuff. And yeah, I love talking hockey with anybody and everybody. So shoot me a message, respond to me. Shoot me an email. I don't care. I'll get in touch with you. Yeah, yeah. Go follow him at all those places. And again, Danny does incredible work. So I really appreciate you coming on.

We'll have to do this again soon. I have another episode for you all on Tuesday where we continue the season reviews, plus a whole lot more. We'll get into the Rangers Devils game as well. So thank you all so much for listening slash watching, and I'll talk with you all on Tuesday.