Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Do the Penguins have some help on the way from the Baby Pens?

Episode Date: January 25, 2024

The Pittsburgh Penguins continue to be off but the Locked On Penguins podcast is not. To start the show, Hunter and Pat dive into Jesse Puljujarvi's recent play in Wilkes-Barre and whether he will get a contract with the big club. They wonder if he deserves a chance to show what he can do in the NHL again while Hunter argues that he'd rather see him on Geno's line than Colin White. They then look at Sam Poulin's game as of late and whether he deserves a call-up. Who would he replace? They also discuss that before looking ahead to the offseason and what changes should be coming. Both Hunter and Pat give their analysis on what Dubas could do over the summer to turn this team around since they're not going to rebuild for as long as Sidney Crosby continues to be on the team. After that, they look at the future of PO Joseph and what his future with the Penguins is.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!eBay MotorsFor parts that fit, head to eBay Motors and look for the green check. Stay in the game with eBay Guaranteed Fit at eBayMotos.com. Let’s ride. eBay Guaranteed Fit only available to US customers. Eligible items only. Exclusions apply.IndeedIndeed knows when you’re growing your own business, you have to make every dollar count. Visit Indeed.com/LOCKEDON to start hiring now.SleeperDownload the Sleeper App and use promo code LOCKEDONNHL to get up to a $100 match on your first deposit. Terms and conditions apply. See Sleeper’s Terms of Use for details.GametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDON for $20 off your first purchase.FanDuelRight now, NEW customers get ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTY in BONUS BETS – GUARANTEED when you place a FIVE DOLLAR BET. Visit FanDuel.com/LOCKEDON to get started.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The penguins look like they might have some help on the way in Wilkesbury Scranton. Hunter and I are going to talk about that and more on this edition of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. Your Locked-on Penguins. Your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network. Your team every day. Welcome back, Penguins fans, to another edition of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I am one of your host, Patrick Damp.

joined as always by the illustrious Hunter Hodes. You can follow me on Twitter at Synonym 4WET. You can follow Hunter on Twitter at Hunter Hodes. And you can follow the show's Twitter at L.O. underscore Penguins. We are free and available every day on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. We thank you for making this your first listen slash watch of the day because we're your team every day. And today's episode is brought to you by Fandul. Make every moment more.

Right now new customers get $150 in bonus bets guaranteed. you place a $5 bet. Visit fandal.com slash locked on to get started. Now, set it purposefully in the intro, the penguins look like they might have some help coming in Wilkesbury, Scranton, some good news from northeastern Pennsylvania these last few days, as we have seen the guy that Kyle Dubas brought in on a PTO and has been subsequently working with the Wilkes-Berry Scranton penguins.

Jesse Pooyervey has had three goals in his last five. games to go with six points. He's starting to look a lot like what we expected and what we had hoped from him when he goes to the American hockey league. And that is he's consistently becoming one of the better players on the ice, if not the best player on the ice. And he's starting to produce like it. So to me, this looks like this may be a post all-star break post-by-week option for the Penguins. Kyle Dubus will have a little bit more time to sort out the roster and the salary cap because right now it's going to be very difficult to get him signed to any kind of contract because as of this recording on January 25th, they right now have all of a projected

$17,351 in cap space according to cap friendly, which I'm not a math guy, admittedly, not very good at it, but that seems like it's even lower than the league minimum that he may end up commanding on a short-term one-year deal. So what are you thinking about this, Hunter? Do you feel like this is a good sign? Do you feel like it's going to be a good option? What are your thoughts on possibly bringing Jesse Poyarvey to the penguins? The big penguins, not the baby ones.

Of course, the big squad, as I like to say. But I think it is a good sign that he's playing at this level. The first couple of games that he played in Wilkesbury, after signing the PTO with them, he looked a bit slow on ice, was trying to get his legs back a little bit. And that makes sense because he hasn't played in so long. And this is a really rough injury to come back from.

But slowly but surely, three goals in his last five games. And, you know, I've watched the three goals numerous times. They aren't the, I guess what do you want to call it? The best looking goals, but he's still scoring. That's what you want to see. I know you're going up against HL go tenders and maybe some of those shots don't go in at the NHL level. But he's still producing.

And you and I have both said it. We wanted to see that when he, sign that PTO with Wilkesburg. We wanted to see him play like one of the best players on the team, if not the best player on that team. And so far, he has, at least for the last week or two. I said it on Twitter on Wednesday night. I don't think he's going to be someone that provides a massive spark to this team.

I'm not really sure anyone down there can provide a big spark. I mean, you can maybe get a few good plays from him at times. Maybe Sam Poulan as well, we'll get to him in a little bit. But I still get a little afraid that you're just going to see. that rookie wall come up like it did versus Horna this year like it's happening to Pustin right now I feel like that's going to come after the first week or two.

But what I still rather see Paul Yarvey next to Evgeny Malcon rather than Colin White? Absolutely. I would want to see what he can do next to a all-world center compared to Colin White who really hasn't done much in three games. And yeah, I know it's a small sample size, but giving Evgeny Malkin Colin White

on his second line as we discussed on the Wednesday episode, it's not the greatest, I think, in my opinion. putting Pull Yarvey up there, someone with a lot more scale, especially offensively, I think that would be a bit better for him at this point. So that's where I see it for Pull Yarby right now. Yeah, and I'm right there with you on that. I do think that he would be a much better option on Malkins wing. I also think this could be a good moment to really shake up the forward group if you can get

him on a contract up in Pittsburgh and into the lineup because you look at the game he plays, despite being a fourth overall pick of the Edmonton Oilers, we can, you know, we don't have to talk about the failures of previous regimes in Edmonton and how they drafted and developed, but he has never been, at least not at the professional level, a high skill, high goal scoring kind of guy. He has been a very good forechecking offense and possession driving player. And I think if you really want to shake up this forward group a little bit and kind of get this team out of its slumber. It could also be an opportunity to maybe jumpstart Valtery Pustin in as well, because if you have a second line of Malkin, Pustin and Poo-Yarvi, you would be able to have Poo-Yarvi kind

of do that dirty work, to drive the possession, to be good on the forecheck. You have Malkin's playmaking ability, and then you can maybe get Pustin in to start doing some scoring and play a little bit more of a finesse game and see what he's really got at first. In no way do I think it's a long term solution, but it would be a good way to try to maybe jumpstart that second line. You get some younger legs in there with Malkin. You get a guy in Poolyarvi who's trying to make his way back into the league after offseason surgery and a guy like Pustin who's got to prove himself. So it could really be a nice jump start.

Would it work? I'm certainly skeptical, but I don't think at this point with where this team is and where they've been headed, you can start, you can't keep too many things on the table because, to quote Steve Dangle, midseason, the trade deadline in the playoffs, they come up awfully fast and this clock is ticking. Right. I don't think this is a long-term solution for Poo-RV playing on the second line or anything like that or just any of him or Poulin coming up and being on the scene for the rest of the year and any of that. I don't think that's a long-term solution. I think for those spots, you're going to have to deal with that in the offseason.

but I would also be intrigued by a Pustin and Malkin Plyarvi line, excuse me. It's funny. We used to have the Cid and the kids line. Now I think we would have part two of that except this time it would be with Gino. But I would like it because Pustin, he has a wicked one-timer. That I think could work really well with Gino, especially if he finds his game a little bit just because he's been a bit down the last couple of weeks. And then with Puyarvi, he can go into those dirty areas and forecheck aggressively and get Malkin the puck,

which then, obviously, he could feed Pustin for a few more goals. I really like, or I'm intrigued about that line, I should say. If it doesn't work after a few games, you obviously go back to other things that have work, but this also allows someone like Ricard Raquel to work more with Lars Eller. I like Raquel. He just hasn't been producing as much as I thought he would this season. But playing him with Eller, I don't think is the worst idea in the world because Eller has actually been better than expected for this season.

And if you can put Raquel on either the left or right wing, you can maybe get more offense out of that third line than you have at other times this season. Yeah. And then another guy that we kind of want to touch on here as well in Wilkeshire is Sam Poulan, who is starting to round into form a little bit. He's up to nine goals in 21 games. He's had five in his last eight. And part of the five in that last eight was a four game goal streak where four straight, games he recorded a goal. Again, I don't know if these guys are long-term solutions or if they're even somebody that you want to give a shot to. But again, you really can't leave much on the table

at this point if your stated goal continues to be to get back to the Stanley Cup playoffs. And there's no reason to keep any powder dry at this point. And if you've got guys like Sam Poulan starting to round into form and looking like an offensive. defensive contributor who could help at the NHL level. And Jesse Poo-Yarvey is starting to look like a regular NHLer again. You can't hold back. You can't leave it on the table. So again, there's also the impact that they could bring to the bottom six.

They could push a couple guys down or they could replace a couple guys in the bottom six to get the top six going again. Right now when I look at the bottom six, I mean, the team is, I would say, relatively healthy, I mean, compared to other years where this team has been so banged up. But that fourth line especially, that's where I look for a potential impact from San Juan if he does get a call up after the Ulster break. Right now, you have Noa Chari playing center with Jeff Carter on the wing, and then you have Jansan Harkins on his left wing.

I do think Jansen Harkins has played a bit better these last couple of weeks. But part of me also would maybe want to see Poulan down there for a few games playing with Achari and Carter to see if his success in Wilkes-Ber. can be carried over to the big squad. He doesn't have that much of an NHL sample size. So playing him, and I know it's with Achari who hasn't been that good offensively this year, and I know it's Carter who obviously is a lot older now, but still, playing him on that line, giving him some shifts at the national level, I think that can maybe unlock him

a little bit. Again, I'm not expecting that much from both him or poor Yarvi if they get called up. But at this point, you got to exhaust every option with your season on the line. and there's Harkins. I mean, the bottom six just needs to be, there's got to be more contributions from that units. Yeah, for sure. Because the top six can't do it every night.

Right. And to your point about putting Poulan in the bottom six, there's also kind of a similar test case from the last two seasons when you relate it to Jeff Carter. If you look at when Casperi Kappan in moments was at his most effective, he was in some way tied to Jeff Carter. Jeff Carter was there to kind of help him stabilize, to help him play a more simple game and be a little bit more productive

and get him right, so to speak, in the top six. So you could maybe try that again with someone like Sam Poulan. Now, again, will it work? We don't know. We don't have the crystal ball. But I also, the last thing I want to say about guys like Poo-Yarvi and guys like Poo-Lan, and hopefully again, as he's starting to look a little bit better,

the last couple of games in Valteri Pustin, and there needs to be a little bit of a motivation factor. And I think Sullivan has to play a factor in this of, tell some of like start playing a little bit better, a little bit harder every day. Start making some of these guys who feel like they have a comfortable roster spot feeling a little bit uncomfortable. Because in no way am I comparing this team to that one.

but if you remember in 1516, guys like Rust, Cheery, Wilson, Coonuckle, they came up and threatened the spots of guys who seemed comfortable on the roster and it was easy for Sullivan to go, all right,

well, if you guys are going to play this well, welcome to the roster. Yeah, and I think that would be best, best case scenario if they were to come up and take this team by storm like Rust in 2016 and Connor Sherry and Tom,

Koon-Nockel, then Jake Genselan next year. I don't expect that to happen, but again, that would be best, and I mean, best-case scenario. What I do want from Mike Sullivan, though, if they do call one or both of these players up at some point after the All-Star break, is for him to actually give them a chance. I don't want them getting five minutes a night, six minutes a night. They're not going to do anything if you give them that small amount of minutes. But if you give them, you know, 9 to 10, 11, 12 minutes a night, somewhere in that range, even though Poo-Land will be playing in the bottom six, most slides,

maybe pull your RV's on the second line. I'll probably be getting more minutes because he's playing with him, but for Poulan specifically, if you give him 9, 12 minutes, see what he can do. I think that will help his development. You just don't want to slow it down, and I don't want him to just hinder him as a young player on this team. Because I know he sometimes likes to default to his veterans at times,

and I know every coach does that, but I just don't want him to default to them all the time. case, especially if Poolean does come up for Poole-R-V, if he's playing on a v. Any Malkins line, he's getting a few more minutes and rightfully so because he's playing on the second line. But I don't want him to get hindered either if he has a couple of bad chips and then he gets put down on the bottom six and then someone comes back up. I just don't think either player is learning in that circumstance. Yeah, no doubt. And just for clarification, I'm not saying that those guys are going to come up and make the same impact that those young guys. But it would be nice.

but that's just something I was thinking of about how these guys can make an impact. But that is going to do it for this segment. When we come back, we're going to expand a little bit on something we kind of hinted at yesterday about how this team could maybe make some moves in the off season once we get there to make this team a contender once again. But before we do that, we have to tell you about our next sponsor. And that is Fandul. The NFL regular season is wrapping up, but there's still time to get on the action with Fandul,

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I'm one of your host, Patrick Damp, joined as always by the one and only Hunter Hodes. And we started this conversation a little bit yesterday about getting this team back to being contenders again before Crosby, Malkin, and Latang right off into the sunset. And I amended a take that I had yesterday that was in the first. the heat of the moment against the Arizona coyotes after the own goal. Emotions got the best to me. And I was saying, you know what, it's time for this team to be sellers. They don't deserve the playoffs. They don't deserve anything more than what they already have.

And while there's still a part of me that believes that, and we need to see how these last two games before the All Star break go, what kind of efforts they put forth. I do at the same time think, though, there's no real reason right now for this team to be buyers at the deadline. I don't think that they're in any position to get into bidding wars with teams with more assets, more to spend, because realistically, they're going to get outbid what they need, what they need outweighs, what they have to give in this moment to make them a true contender in the East. So one of the things I was thinking of is that this summer, we may see a similar trade that we saw.

right before they went on their runs in 16 and 17, where Kyle Dubus may have to make a trade of somebody you really like. I look at guys like Brian Rust, Marcus Pedersen, and think they may have to go for this team to kind of knock everything loose and get the juices flowing again. And in the moment, it would probably suck. We would all be really upset because Brian Rust has become one of the better players in the history of the franchise.

he's been a loyal soldier, one of the most versatile forwards they've had, especially in the Crosby Malkanera. But you're going to have to give to get. And I think this summer, they may have to resort to something like that. I agree with you on Brian Russ, though. He does have no move clause, but you've said that, Pat. Oh, those never get moved, right? I mean, he may waive it in the right circumstance. So I agree it may be something to explore over the summer. But where I disagree with you is Marcus Pedersen. I think if you move Pedersen, who has one year left on his contract, makes a little over $4 million right now, you don't have a replacement in-house ready for him. And no, my friends, it's not Ryan Graves. He's not going to be Marcus Pedersen during this contract. He's never going

to be Marcus Pedersen, to be honest. So if you move him, you don't have anyone that is a defensive first defenseman on this team. Your defensemen are as follows for next season. It's basically, Crystal Tang, Eric Carlson, Ryan Graves, P. O. Joseph, who's an RFA, will have to see what they do with him. And then right now you have what? I mean, Chabberweedle, but his contract situation is one to monitor. He's up after this season. So is Ryan Shea. I mean, John Ludwig is obviously a potential factor as well. They just don't have many answers if Pedersen gets moot. And then you'll figure out replacing him whether that's via a trade or free agency. I'd probably prefer a trade because in free agency, I'm not really too interested in outbidding teams for five to six to seven-year

contracts. And heck, the Penguins just signed Ryan Graves to a six-year contract. So I'm kind of a little scared after how much term and how much money they gave. Great. So I would keep him. After that, you look at other money that could come off the books over the summer, one of which is Riley Smith. So after this season, he has one more year left at $5 million. Then he's a UFA in 2025, 2025, 26.

I would maybe explore that because he hasn't been the answer that I thought he would be. Truggle to start the year, got red hot with Gino. But after that just hasn't been the player that I thought he was going to be. I mean, I predicted him to score 25 to 30 this year. I thought he was the perfect Jason Zucker replacement. We haven't seen that at all. So that's something they'll also have to figure out during the off season. And then, of course, you got to figure out the bottom six.

I know people really like Knowlachari for his physicality, for his defensive work, for his work on the PK. But he's not giving you any offense. And he's also making $2 million. And that's coming for the next two years after this one. He's also 32 right now. In my opinion, that's too much money for someone who is a defensive specialist at this point. in his career. I'm not saying they need to move on for him. I'm just saying that's something that, I don't know, maybe I wouldn't have signed that type of contract over the offseason.

You have to see what they're going to do with Jake Ensel, whether they trade him at the deadline or whether he walks after the year, you'll get quite a bit of money there as well. Got to fix the bottom six. You got to figure out a score if you move from Riley Smith. There will be ample opportunities for this team to improve. I think it's more so via trade, than Fray Agency just because I don't think this class is that good, but there will be opportunities to improve. They just have to use the salary cap space wisely. That's the biggest thing I could say about this off season, man. They have plenty of space this past off season, and they use some of the salary cap space right, but they use some of it in the wrong way. You got to use all that salary cap space

right if you want to make another run with Crosby and Company for next season and in years after. Yeah, and if there's one guy I'm looking at right now who could really come in this offseason and help the bottom six and be an option in the top six in a pinch, it's a guy I've liked a long time. I think he's spending money this year by playing in San Jose, and that's Anthony Duclair. He's set to be a UFA this summer,

and he has just not been good with a bad team. And while I think that it's a little bit, of both that he is having a down year he's on a bad team right he doesn't have a ton of help i think if you put him on a better roster as we've seen throughout his career when he's on a good team he's very effective he's not a consistent top six guy but he's a very good middle six forward and he's fairly young he's i think i only what is he 28 29 28 yes either way while that's not not getting a lot younger. It's still a guy who has good hockey ahead of them. And we'll talk more about some under the radar guys. I also think that we saw it this summer with the Eric Carlson

trade. Kyle Dubus is the rare NHL general manager who is not afraid to do difficult things. He's not afraid to swing for the fences and make a trade that a lot of GMs would look at and go, ah, well, golly gee, I don't have all the assets involved. I'm not. not going to be able to do that. It's really tough. What do you want me to do? But hey, we're three points out of a playoff spot last year. We were in it. So he has the fortitude to swing these big deals. So I think this is going to be a very transformative off season, regardless of how this season goes, unless all of a sudden this team morphs into a Stanley Cup contender.

Which is probably not going to happen. I think at best of what you're looking at right now, this team makes the playoffs, maybe wins around and probably gets knocked out in round two. I just don't see anything more than that right now. If this team does miss the playoffs and right now, I will say it's trending that way, there will have to be some considerable change over the summer. But that said, they're not just going to rebuild or tear this thing down. You still have Sidney Crosby under contract and the core players and you owe it to them to keep trying and to keep, I guess, maybe retooling on the fly to make another run at this

next season and then the year after that. That's what they're probably going to do this off season. They're not just going to rebuild or tear it down. They're going to make moves that put them in the best possible position to contend next year. And they're going to take another run at this for as long as Cindy Crosby continues to play at this level. They owe it to him to do that. And they have to get younger legs. Yes.

They have to find a way to bring in some guys mid-20s who they might not be the most impressive. They might not be big time, big ticket players, but they have to be guys who are positive offensive drivers and are in their mid-20s. And that's not me saying that I disliked the Eric Carlson deal. I thought it was fantastic. I think all things considered, he's been solid. He has not been the Norris Trophy winner that we saw last year. But for what his role is outside of the power play, he's been solid. But this season, instead of getting the big blockbuster, big take.

an item. This has to be very, very tidy business for Kyle Dubus. It has to be getting guys that are on the surface unimpressive. You have to go get the memes. You have to go get Mark Donk and Buzz Flipit to fill out this roster and support your big guns so they can take one more good shot. Absolutely. I mean, you just have to do a better job at filling out this roster because at this point, they can't do it on an every night basis. I mean, Cindy Cosby has been trying his best to do it on an overnight basis, but he's not getting the help that he should be getting. Well, outside of Jake Ensel, I should say he's been tremendous.

And I know of getting Malkin, stats-wise, is playing well, but he's still having nights where he's more inconsistent than a year's past. And that happens when he gets into his upper 30s. Eric Carlson, he's been, I would say, as advertised, but he obviously hasn't been as good as he was last year. Chris Leng, I think he's been really solid. But these players need help. And it's up to Kyle Dubus and company to get them.

that help this upcoming off season. Yeah. So we're going to keep the roster construction talk going a little bit in the final segment. We're going to talk about some under the radar trade candidates and a good story that was in the athletic a couple days ago. But before we do that, we're going to get to our next sponsor. And that is Indeed. We're driven by the search for better.

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One more time. I'm Patrick Damp. joined as always by the one and only Hunter Hodes. And like I said, we're going to keep. this roster construction talk rolling here in the final segment. There was a really good article in The Athletic a couple of days ago by Chris Johnston. It was titled NHL Trade Candidates Under the Radar, 10 players who are falling out of favor. On that list was Penguin's defenseman P.O. Joseph.

As we know, it has been an up and down and mostly disappointing season for the young defenseman. It really looked like, and we really hoped that he was going, to anchor that third pairing this year, really take the next step and look like an everyday NHL defenseman. And whether it's been injuries or inconsistent play, it just hasn't been there for POJ this year, which is disappointing to see because over the last two years, there were a lot of flashes in limited time. He looked like he had some good chemistry with Chris LaTang for a minute.

He looked like at least early in the season like he was going to be that anchor on, and not derogatory. He looked like he was going to hold down that third pairing, but his game has just not been up to snuff. And he's still very much young enough that I think if you're Kyle Dubus, you could probably convince a team to give you some return for him. Young defenseman has an HL experience. On the whole, so far, his career has been solid, although it's not looking like it's trending too much more upward at this point. But do you think there is a, that Kyle Dubus could make a market for POJ and get something in return. Yeah, I don't think there's going to be like a massive market for him,

but I definitely think he could create at least a small market. Lauren, if the Penguins do decide to sell at the deadline and they continue this slide that they're on right now. I do think there would be teams out there that would want to have him on, in their lineup, excuse me, every night, whether it's on their second or third pairing. He can eight third pairing minutes pretty easily, especially with the right partner.

His underwings this year, I mean, they're not even that bad. I mean, his C4 percentage is 53.7%. His expected goals percentage per natural statric is 56%. When he's on ice, the Penguins have 55.4% of the scoring chances, 55.8% of the high danger chances. You can create a market with that type of player who's been mostly playing on the bottom pair this season. And you would be getting something for him,

even though he's set to be an RFA at the end of the season. Yeah, the Penguins control his rights if they don't move on for him. you would still be getting something for him unless you decide not to resign him after the season, which I do think is a distinct possibility. I think if he continues to play like this throughout the rest of the season and he's not moved at the deadline pat, I'm not sure Kyle Dubas's company will want to keep him even though he's an RFA. I think he could be on another team next year because it just hasn't really worked out the way

I thought it would in Pittsburgh the way you thought it would the way I think a lot of people thought it would because when that trade was made, the Kessel won, and he was coming back, he was the one that I was actually most excited about because, yeah, okay, Alex Kowcena, he's been decent at times, but he was never going to replace Phil Kessel in the lineup. No. I was excited for Joseph because he looked like a bona fide defensive prospect who was maybe going to be playing in the top four every night for the Penguins, and it just hasn't worked out that way, and it's a bit disappointing.

And the thing is it very much could because you look at him, he's 20, he's only 24 and he's got a solid amount of NHL experience under his belt. And while there has been a lot of conventional wisdom that's been challenged in the last decade or so when it comes to the sport, one of the things that has kind of held up pretty well. And this also could be a case to keep him is that it takes outside of the true. Blue elite defensemen, it takes a little while longer for defensemen to develop because it's such a high volume position. It's not like you're a forward where you can get easily hidden, you can get put in easily sheltered minutes. It's really easy as a defenseman to get caught out in in situations that are not advantageous to the way you play because it's just you and one other partner.

It's not two other linemates. It's not two linemates in the defensive pairing that you're often stapled to as a forward. So there are a lot of positive signs in his game. And if you point to the fact that he's 24, he's cost controlled, he's probably not do any sort of a big raise going into next year, there's probably a team that might be a little bit closer to playoff contention, say someone like Ottawa, that and you can get him to go play with his brother, that might be willing to give you something in return.

for a youngish defenseman like that. Well, is Ottawa that much closer to playoff contention considering what they're doing this year? I mean, maybe next year that they could be. I think that team, similar to Buffalo,

has been hit with a lot of bad luck. I don't think they are as bad as they look, but I don't think they're much better than that. But similar to Buffalo, they are a team that with a couple of good moves and both of those teams at this point have shown they have more than competent front offices again. So they're not going to be in the basement much, much longer. I wouldn't think so.

And if one of those two teams does come calling, you're probably just getting a draft pick back for POJ at this point. And whatever team comes calling, I should say, whether it's a Stanley Cup contender, whether it's a team like Ottawa or Buffalo, whether it's a middling team that comes calling, you're probably just going to be getting back a draft pick. And that's fine. I'm not expecting some massive return that it. Yeah, I don't think we're going to get the Sun and the Moon for him. Right.

But I think you could get a solid prospect and a draft pick or one of those two. Because again, you know, 24 year old defenseman with NHL experience, RFA cost controlled that you know how. The team that's looking to make a run this year, I could see a bona fides only cup contender coming in and being like, okay, we know you're not playing him that much when all your defensemen are healthy. what do you want from him in return? Because we will play him every night because we want to bolster our lineup to go win this downly cup. I could definitely see that at the deadline if the penguins are kind of are where they are right now to say the least. And I think too, and this is less of a POJ trade return discussion and more of a market at the deadline discussion. I've been saying at the last couple of weeks that this trade deadline is going to be a seller's market.

Yes. It's going to be, there's still so many teams that think that they're in the playoff hunt, that they're going to try to go get things from some of the bottom feeders. This is where a general manager like Dubis could kind of nudge his way into the conversation and say like, hey, listen, I'm not quite a seller, but I'm also not quite a buyer. So I'm not going to try to fleece you for something, but I bet we could make a better deal rather than you say go to an Ottawa or a Buffalo or Montreal or San Jose because there will be a very real world where he could kind of manipulate the market

at the deadline by kind of telling those GMs who are on teams that have visions of the Stanley Cup, hey, I've got some assets and I'm not a seller, but we can work out a better deal here. And maybe this could be a hot take for me. maybe that deal shakes out the way the Simone DePray for Ben Lovejoy trade shook out before the Penguins went back to back, right? You're trading away a defenseman who definitely did have some talent for someone that maybe fits your team a bit better. Maybe that's the trade that Kyle Dubas looks for from POJ and bringing in maybe, say it's

a defenseman or something like that, a defenseman that maybe just fits the team better over POJ in that situation. Yeah. So it'll be really interesting to see. These next two games, I believe, are going to tell us a whole heck of a lot about what this team believes, how this, what this team is made of, and really where Kyle Dubus wants to take it. And that is what we are going to talk about tomorrow when we come back for the Friday edition. We are going to preview the Friday night game against the Florida Panthers and then the Saturday night game against the Montreal Canadiens.

So, as always, thank you for tuning in to the locked on Penguins podcast for Hunter Hodes. I am Patrick Damp and we will talk to you on Friday.