Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Ever wonder why Jim Rutherford quit? We now reportedly have the answer!

Episode Date: July 16, 2022

We've reached the end of another busy week! Hunter has a bit of a different show for this one as he goes into DK's Friday Insider article and touches on the reported reason for Jim Rutherford's absence. He goes into what that move could've been (No, it's not a Kris Letang trade) and also speculates what that conversation with David Morehouse looks like. He also wonders if more about this story will ever come out in the future. Following that, Hunter gets into a report from Taylor Haase about what the Heinen camp was expecting if he was qualified and if it went to arbitration. He looks at why the Penguins made the right call in that circumstance and wonders what a new deal would look like if the team does circle back. He also looks at why Brian Dumoulin may not be moved (according to Danny Shirey) and how management makes a pretty good point in the opposite direction. Finally, Hunter brings up a couple of talking points from the 32 Thoughts podcast and wonders what the proposed trade would've looked like had the Penguins moved a defenseman at the NHL Draft (per Friedman). All that, plus much more on this episode of Locked On Penguins.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!Built BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKED15,” and you’ll get 15% off your next order.BetOnlineBetOnline.net has you covered this season with more props, odds, and lines than ever before. BetOnline – Where The Game Starts!Rock AutoAmazing selection. Reliably low prices. All the parts your car will ever need. Visit RockAuto.com and tell them Locked On sent you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello there. Happy Friday, July 15th, the second to last full week here of daily episodes on the Lock on Penguins podcast for today's episode. We're going to get into part of Dale and Kovacovic's report about why Jim Rutherford actually resigned. We finally have at least one answer as to why he suddenly left a little over a year ago. It's been, well, I shouldn't say a little over a year ago. It's been well over a year after the horse, Ron Hextall took over it, which is just a little over. just such a sudden resignation and you know at least according to dk he finally has his reason so i'm going to get into that um talk about that for a segment also getting some other notes from that article penguin related including one on danton hyman and why um it was pretty crazy what he was searching for

in arbitration also get to a couple of notes from the 32 thoughts podcast of the penguins and what elliott free and we'll talk about with regards to the malcon negotiation what led to that finally happening and then i'm an interesting nugget at the end when it comes to a potential trade that almost happened at the draft. So that's what's coming up for today's episode of the podcast. Without further ado, let's get right on to do it. You're Locked-on Penguins, your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins,

part of the Locked-on Podcast Network, your team every day. Hello, welcome back to another episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I am your host, Hunter Hodees. I'm going to follow me on Twitter at Hunter Hodes. and also have all this show, Twitter, at L.O. WarnerSore Penguins, and, of course, thank you all so much for making this your first listen to the day.

It's been basically two full months since the Penguins got eliminated in Game 7 by the New York Rangers. This month so far, the listenership up 30% exactly, I should say, over last month. From the bottom of my heart, thank you all so much for continuing to listen to and support this podcast, even though the next game that will be played is about, three months for now. So, you know, we have a long time, a lot of content to get into before the Penguins officially play their first game of the 2022, 2022, 2020, 2020-2020 season. But let's get into this first topic. So, Dejanovac, I actually got a little bit of a tip from someone that this was going to be coming on Friday, about a few days ago.

And so I was looking forward to as one of the first things I read this morning. And this is what D.K. writes when it comes to why Jim Rutherford resigned. There's just been so much speculation. Well, you know, here we go. So he said, according to a team source with whom I spoke with at the NHL draft, it was as simple as this. Two weeks into the COVID-19 shortened 2021 regular season. So that would be 2020, 2020, 2021, I believe is that one.

I think so. Oh, wait. No, no, no. Excuse me. Pardon me on that. I think so. I believe that would be the 2020, 2021 season. unless I'm just like being really stupid right now.

Yeah, yeah, that was the one. I'm sorry. It's been a long two years here, people. I've like just been losing my mind. Sorry, it's not 2019-20. It is 2020. It's because Ron Hicks office. He was hired last year.

Sorry about that. He says, Rutherford was set to make a move. He was rejected by David Morehouse, the team's president and CEO at the time. Rutherford was livid. And according to this source, he said some things to him that aren't the kind of things you can take.

back. Further talks between the two over the following two days, not said on anything. Rutherford to inform more house that he would be resigning and all concerned agreed not to discuss the matter publicly, which neither of them, by the way, have done as D.K. writes, I guess the stuff that you can't take back, I mean, I don't know if he told him to go F himself. Like, you know, I mean, like, he just like cuss him out for five and ten minutes. I have no clue. I got to imagine it involved some form of cussing. And D.K. goes on his right. As for what the move might have been, the only specific thing I have ever been told from inside the organization. It was not a Chris Latang trade.

I'm sure some of you all might remember this. That was a wild rumor going around at the time. I think it was someone from 937, the fan was saying that he was told that Rutherford was trying to trade Latang. And that put everyone into frenzy, like, whoa, glad he resigned and all that. But that was, I think a couple days later, that was denied. And then Dejaun just now denied it, too. it sounds like it was not a crystal tain trade he said i've also heard that it was not a trade at all so

that is interesting rotherford wants to make a move but it's not a trade did he want to sign someone like i mean i don't think evander i think evander kane was only i mean did he want to sign a van der kane or something like that despite all that baggage he has um did he want to fire mike sullivan because I mean, I remember that, you know, they did start off the season a little rough for 2021, 2021, 2022 before, you know, they really picked it up, you know, down the stretch, especially in March when they had that, I remember they had that big win over the flyers in mid-March and after that, you know, they were just steamrolling a lot of their teams in the division. You know, I don't know if he would fire Mike Selden, but, you know, I think it's a pretty good guess.

I just, I don't know, like, what the move would have been. Did he want to fire, like, an assistant general manager or something? thing like someone else below him i don't know did he yeah i mean if it's not a trade you know it can only be you know so many things you know bringing someone who knew as baggage firing us two times i only kept winning coach firing an assistant general manager something like that but the fact that you know someone like more house had to deny him um that's definitely big to say the least and something that um you know it sounds like to me maybe that it could have been a little controversial.

And, you know, and D.K. also writes, as for what specific words might have been spoken, I've not heard a syllable. I do know that once it happened, both were eager to make the cleanest, least controversial exit possible under the odd circumstances, and to their credit, they've held that to even now. He also says, after that, Morehouse and Lemieux created a new position of president of hockey operations and chose Brian Burke. Basically, he says they wanted to avoid any future situation, which a non-hockey executive held authority over a hockey GM. That makes sense. I mean, Morehouse, everyone knows he did not come from the hockey background. He was from a very political background.

I mean, he's from Pittsburgh and he grew up cheering for the penguins. But, you know, in terms of like working in hockey, I mean, he basically had next to no experience. So I think he was, you know, I think, I don't know, Maria was just doing him a favor since he loved the team so long. And, you know, he'd been in, you know, a lot of business politics and all that stuff so that he could. get involved um with the sport and you know that i mean that that's basically it um for what dk said but you know definitely interesting you know i i mean again like i wish i could you know find out what that i would love to know what that move was um you know at least we also find out that you know he cussed out more house basically saying like you can't tell me to do my job and probably

a whole bunch of you know cuss words on here that i'm probably now i'm not allowed to say to but, you know, just I wish I could, you know, know, what that move was if it's not a train, you know. So coach, player that want a player, player roster cut, you know, assistant general manager, another assistant coach on the staff, you know, like what would it be? I think that's, you know, the big, or, you know, maybe can you even buy out a player during the regular season?

I don't, yeah, I mean, I don't think you can, right? Yeah, so it's definitely not that. So, you know, what could it be? I think that's, you know, a pretty, you know, big thing there. But, you know, at least we got to the bottom of it a little bit. You know, that's definitely been all my mind. I remember I wrote an article a long time ago for, you know, last word on sports day. And, you know, I think it could be because, you know, Rutherford, you know, smelled that, you know,

the future was not bright for this team. And he wanted to dip out early before, you know, things got really bad. But, you know, the fact that it sounds like it was a pretty heated argument between Morehouse and Rutherford. I guess that's not too surprising. Again, I just would love to know what that move was, to say the least. So that'll do it for this first segment of the podcast. Coming up in the next, I'm going to get into some of the other news from this Friday Insider article, especially when it comes to Dayton Hinen.

But before I get to that, banon line.net is your number one source for all of your bed and needs in sports info. You can find all the latest sports developments, league reviews and news, including this year's national playoffs and major league baseball. Beneline is a continued source for all of your sports wage of information, including live betting, e-sports and scores, and beteline.net remains the best spot for all of your sports scores, podcasts, and news this season.

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So a couple other things here with regards to the Friday Insider from D.K. Pittsburgh Sports. He did say, this one was interesting about how Malkin was able to sign his contract. He said, I'm told that although Lattangian, Crosby both communicated with Malkin in the final days before his contract was complete, neither was singularly influential in getting him to change his contract. mind about hitting the NHL's open market rather the most prominent influence came from his wife Anna Castorova as well as other family and friends you know I mean I honestly think everyone played a role I don't think it's you know one specific person that just helped change Gino's mind I mean sure Anna you know being his rock and all that and I'm sure she you know helped convince him to say but

I you know I definitely do think that Sid I mean what's in the thing but especially Sid leeched out texting you know told him kept his cool and all that stuff. So I'm not, I mean, I guess what I'm trying to say is, I think a whole lot of people played a very big role with that. Now, here's one from Taylor Haas in this article. That was very interesting. She says,

Dayton Hinen doesn't have any set salary in advance, and I was told that any number floating around there is simply speculation. Still, his can't believe that he could get as close to four million in arbitration had the Penguins qualified him. The Penguins opted to avoid the chance of arbitration with Hinen, But negotiations continue beyond that point, and Heinz remains flexible on salary if the term is right for him with the penguins. So there you all go. So many people were, you know, and this was, you know, and I'll say this, you know, at the time, when I saw it, I was like, oh, this doesn't make any sense.

Why is he not getting a qualifying offer? I was going to remind him about a couple people that he does have our rights. I thought he didn't because he's been in the league, you know, for several seasons now. I did not think he had that at this time, but I was wrong. I'll take the L on that. but now that, you know, with what Taylor wrote is out there, you know, it makes sense. I don't think Denton Hinen should get close to $4 million for a one to two year salary. Or I believe it would be for, I believe it's one year for arbitration.

That would be ridiculous. You know, for someone who just set our career high in goals at 18, do you really think he's going to do that again next year? Making almost $4 million? Probably not, right? I think the Penguins, you know, they were right to make the decision that they did for not, qualifying heinen um you know uh you can probably get him you know i guess what two to two point five million something like that um i mean i don't think i even think three million would be a little much for me you know i think he is someone that i would definitely be intrigued about bringing back

he's still on the open market i'm sure he's you know heard from other teams remember you know the penguins they signed heine and i should want to say that was like a day or two after you know the main free agent frenzy day so you know he's gonna buy his time like he was um last year you know and see if another team could potentially give him a shot whether it's on this on the second or third line but you know i i do like hymen you know 18 goals it's definitely you know got to replace those somehow some way you know the penguins they have not done that so far and you know if they do you'll bring him back i won't be mad about but you know i'll have to see you know if the term and the salary is right to say the least.

And, you know, Taylor also says, yeah, I mean, everyone knows that there are, there is tampering in free agency. You know, you always hear this either during every free agent friends. Well, you know, teams are going to like file like a suit or something and they're going to file a former complaint and all this stuff. I'm like, you know, this, this happens, you know, it's like, this feels like such a, is that even like a good comparison to say,

I don't know, I'm probably not going to put it out there. because it's probably like a dumb thing. But, you know, everyone basically does it. You can't stop it. You know, teams 100% start talking to other players. At least, I would say, a week before Free Asian frenzy opens. You know, if it's not a week, it's probably three to four days or something like that. But I would say it's probably at least a week at that point.

And Danny Shari also had an interesting report here. So I think this is one of the last things I'm going to get into here. for this segment. He says the Penguins have way too many defensemen. One, if not more, will be traded, but don't expect one of them to be Brian Dumlin. If you do not listen to my episode on Thursday, I am of the opinion.

I made a bold prediction that I think you're going to see two defensemen off this team heading into the regular season. I think one could be traded for futures. I think another one could and should be traded for a top six to top nine winner. I think if, you know, even if I think if you trade just one of the defensemen, if you're not getting a forward back and this team is definitely lacking at least one right now, especially when you look at the top six, I think you are doing it wrong. If it's one, I don't want futures in return for them.

If you're doing two, I'll accept that because I think that's a bit better. But I think if you're doing one, you've got to get a decent forwardback that can finish their chances because you're the penguins, A ranked in the bottom, third of the league last year in terms of finishing. I want to see that come around to see. to say the least next year. And Danny goes on to say, I was told management has concerns about his performance, especially now that he's coming back

from another significant lower body injury. What concerns them more, though, is the lack of a viable partner for Let's Hang in his absence. Duman does have one season left remaining on his contract, and appears to me that the Penguins are going to ride it out. So, you know, my thoughts on that, I get why they want to do it. You know, could they get a big package, I think, back from now?

yes, teams are always willing to pay for that kind of defensemen. Look at what Eric Goodbranson just got on the open market, four times four. Nick Lettie also just got basically that same contract in St. Louis. Teams value defensemen differently, but the fact that those two players who are significantly worse than someone like Brian Dumlin are getting, you know, that kind of money, you can definitely bait a sucker into giving you at least a couple of picks back or potentially a roster player in return, hopefully a finisher.

In my opinion, I think he should be the one. I think he's traded, but, you know, I think management also brings up a nice devil's advocate that, you know, if you do trade him, who is playing up there with him? You know, with Jan Ruda, he's a righty. You know, is Sullivan comfortable with righty, righty on that top pairing, even though, you know, Ruda did a good job with Hedman down in Tampa Bay. But the thing with that is,

headman's a lefty, and Ruda was a righty. So I think John Cooper was much more comfortable with that. that down there. Are you going to elevate Mike Matheson up to that role? I think that's a little much. And we saw how that was in the playoffs when Dumlin was out. I know, I know Dumlin, some people probably didn't notice him as much. I think part of me didn't, but I think part of me did at times when you saw three to five pucks basically go off Matheson skate and in. So, you know, is Brian Dumlin in that exact same spot during those times? I would probably wager not. You never know. But again, my betting money would.

would be saying that he would not be. I don't think, you know, I don't think you're going to elevate Marcus Pederson if he's not even on that team. At that point, I think that would be a very dumb move. You know, POJ, we've seen Joseph up with a tang and he looked decent, but, you know, the underlying numbers were not kind of. We only had, like, 45% of the shot of Thames, like not even 50% of the scoring chances. You know, Joseph was just playing too many minutes.

And that was last season when the Penguins were dealing with some injuries to the rule. And, you know, not this past season, you know, but the shortened season. before that, I should clarify. So, you know, I think Joseph is ready for actual minutes, but I don't think he's ready for top-peering minutes. To say, Lace, you know, look at the other options down there. I mean, you're not going to move John Murillo to the left side.

Mark Freeman, I mean, he's the righty, but what plays on the left side, is he going to go up there and play top-pering minutes? Probably not. You know, I do think if you had to move, Duman, you know, almost have to, like, just, I don't know, bring someone else in, but, you know, that also wouldn't make any sense because you have nine defensemen on your roster. right now. Traver Ridele's not going to play out of the way out of the way. So, you know, I definitely

understand the devil's advocate to it. You know, I think they respect him enough that they think or hope that he can have a bounce back season next year. I'm definitely hoping that he can. I hope that he proves me wrong. But, you know, the back of my mind, you know, it's just like, you know, he hasn't been the same since that ankle injury that, you know, he suffered a few years ago. His skating has taken a massive hit. You know, his defensive breakdowns in his own zone are are coming up, I think, a lot more lately. You know, he just hasn't been that same player. So, you know, it sounds like, you know, based on, you know,

what a lot of people are, you know, saying in the Penguinsland and, you know, reporting on DeKittsworths and other places, you know, and I think he always had that same report on the athletic. It sounds like it's going to be one of Marcus Pedersen or John Marino, if not both. Or not, again, that's been my bold prediction since yesterday. So, you know, we'll have to see on that coming up here in the next segment,

we're going to get into Elliot Friedman's, a couple of nuggets that he had on 32 thoughts. There was really nothing else in this article. Those are the main points that I want to touch on for the second. I'm going to give my thoughts on those to, you know, just talk about that heading into the weekend here. So I'm going to touch on the stuff from Elliott Freeman's 32 Thoughts podcast. We talked about the Penguins. One of them involves a gunny malcolm. Either one involves a potential trade that looked like it fell apart towards, you know,

the end of it. So stick around for that coming up here in this final segment. All right. I'm back here on this episode of the Lockdown Penguins podcast. I am your host, Honored Hodeys. I'm going to follow me on Twitter at Homer Hodes, follow the shows, Twitter at L.O. underscore Penguins. So, you know, Friedman and Merrick, they dropped the final thoroughly two thoughts podcast. Today, if you do not listen to that podcast, I, you know, implore you to all to do it. You know, I think it's probably the best hockey podcast out there. You know, I, you know, I, I chew my horn enough. I think I offer quite a bit. on this show. I definitely love

talked about listening with you all, but in terms of how they do it with Amo as a production person, you know, I would love to have someone like that for this. I will say that, you know, I'm like decent with that kind of stuff when I was it back in college, but with how he does it, you know, mixing stuff in, you know, I would love to have

someone like that I could just, you know, rely on for those kind of sounds. So, you know, they did a great job. Hope they have a great summer. But, you know, Freeman, he touched on the Malkin negotiation. And he said, you know, he said he was told the biggest thing was getting Malkin cool down. And, you know, I'm doing my own horn a little bit here. But, you know, that was something that Josh Yowen and I talked about a lot on our,

on my episode on Tuesday where it was like, yeah, like if they can just, you know, if Malkin, you can just settle down. I don't know he's an emotional guy, especially on the ice. We all saw that towards the late stage of the regular season when he lost his mind on one of the Nashville Predators players when he just like was a made a stupid play and just like cross check into the face and was suspended four games just stuff you can't do you know he's also like that off the ice and you know

cooler heads did prevail. Freedman said they started working on it Tuesday afternoon and by the evening it was done and you know he also said that the team you know they felt like they offered a four year term and Malkin apparently said at the time when he was testing free agency that he thought it was too late and you know it's basically because he was ridiculously emotional. But, you know, that's who Gino is. You know, he's, he's been that way for 16 years. He is not going to change to say the least. But he also did say that, you know,

said he heard that did play a role and a lot of other people did to make sure that this was going to happen. And apparently this was an interesting topic that he discussed. He said that teams were lining up to give him a short-term one-year deal, low A-AV, but easily attainable bonuses so that he can make potentially, you know, up to eight, maybe eight point five, even nine million for a season. So, you know, for example, he was maybe going to have an AAV at like two or three million for the season, but have very easy bonuses to get where again, he could get up to, you know, seven, eight, nine million.

And, you know, I think a lot of contenders, you know, they would be, I mean, some of the teams I'd be thinking of Colorado, Florida, Florida, obviously has a residence down there, where he trains during the off season. The Rangers obviously are out there. You know, the Washington Capitals, they signed Dylan's turn, which was, I thought, a great move by them. You know, all these, I think I saw Dallas was thrown around,

even though they're not a contender. But, you know, teams, you know, even though they were maybe not crazy about term for Malkin, you know, they were apparently lining up to give him a short Aav with easy bonuses. And, you know, I think that would have been a really, you know, if Malkin had gotten a front of. free agency. I think that probably would have been enough to have him leave. I think even if the Penguins offered him that contract, and I'm not really sure if he would take it, to be honest.

So the Penguins, I definitely think they dodged a bullet there by him not getting to free agency. Thank God they locked him up at the 11th hour. I know Malcolm was able to circle back and able to make that deal. And then Friedman said when they were talking about the Jan Ruda signing, he said what he was told at the draft, the Penguins did have a trade for a defenseman to be shipped out and it looked like it was about to happen before it fell apart at the last second. So I'm curious to see who that was. I think Friedman went on Vancouver radio yesterday, Thursday. So maybe you all might be listening to this on Saturday.

I'm recording this late on Friday night, but I believe it was on Thursday. And he was talking to them about Marino because, you know, all of Vancouver fans just want him at this point. And he said, you know, I think that was the first time when he mentioned he's like, yeah, they felt like he almost got moved last week, but it fell apart. And to me, my pure speculation, was that the trade that was going to go for the number seven overall pick? That is my big question on that before maybe Ottawa pivoted to DeBring Kid. Maybe it also lines up with the Jeff Petrie report that DK had on his side. Maybe was Marino going the other way and Petrie was coming back and Montreal was,

they have that salary, you know, maybe if that works. I know Montreal doesn't have a lot of cap space and maybe that works. Maybe it doesn't have to go on cap-friendly and check that out. But, you know, maybe that was it. You know, who knows, but it's definitely something that, you know, they're, you know, they're close to potentially making this move. I know Josh Joey said on Wednesday that the parents have been trying to make a trade all day.

No one was budging. They are eventually going to make this move. You know, a team is going to be out there that needs help. you know, on their back end and they're going to, you know, hopefully give up a decent score to get the player, or, you know, it's going to be future something like that, but, you know, preferably a player. And the Penguins are either going to have eight defense for next season or they're going to have seven. But, you know, the fact that Hextall was being aggressive at the draft shows, I think that he wants to get this done sooner rather than later,

would not be surprised if you see a move here at the date here in the next week or two, I guess. And then as for the Johann Larson stuff, no word on that today. Very quiet day and free agency. You know, it's been super, it's been super quiet, I should say, since Wednesday. I think you're really feeling the lack of money this year due to the COVID-19 pandemic. You know, last year, you know, you had Seattle and, you know, 80 million worth of, you know, revenue. You know, all this money of revenue coming in and, you know, teams were able to spend some money. But this year, you don't got an expansion team coming in.

Seeing a lot of teams, you know, I think a little bit scared. to pay up for some of these players because they just don't have a lot of salary caps waste. And I don't think a lot of other teams are looking to take on salary at this point. And there's still a lot of really good players out there. So we'll have to see what happens here, potentially of the weekend next week and all that. But that will do it for this episode of the Locktime Penguins podcast. I really appreciate all of you listening to this one. Remember next week is the final full week of episodes before we go down to three week.

I can't thank you all enough for continuing to make the Lockdown Penguins podcast. Hopefully your first listen of the day. I'll be back on Monday. Hope you all have a wonderful mid-July summer weekend. Talk to you on Monday.