Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Who could be the next HALL OF FAMERS from the Penguins?

Episode Date: August 12, 2026

Everyone knows Crosby, Malkin, and maybe even Letang are bound for the Hockey Hall of Fame one day, but who are some other Penguins that might get the call to the Hall? Hunter and Patrick begin the Wednesday episode of the Locked On Penguins Podcast discussing the potential Hockey Hall of Fame candidacies of Marc-Andre Fleury and Mike Sullivan. (1:50) While Fleury and Sullivan seem like slam dunks to one day be enshrined in Toronto, what about Sergei Gonchar and Phil Kessel? (10:35) They talk about how those two have borderline cases, how they could get in, and how they might not. Finally, it’s the offseason, NHL Network’s Top 20 Defensemen list is out, and well…no Erik Karlsson? Let’s take some ragebait! (20:00) Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! Odoo Great organizations win because operations matter. And that’s why you should get Odoo. Try for free today at https://Odoo.com/lockedon. IndeedNow, you can speed up your hiring process with a $75 Sponsored Job Credit. Just go to https://indeed.com/podcastright now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Terms and conditions apply. FanDuel Today's episode is brought to you by FanDuel. Join all the action at https://FANDUEL.COM to play Daily Dingers and make your free pick on who’s hitting a homer this MLB season.   FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A few former Pittsburgh Penguins have Hall of Fame cases coming up pretty soon. Heck, some of them already have Hall of Fame cases right now. And Pat and I are going to discuss that coming up right after this. You're Locked-on Penguins. Your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network. Your team every day. Hello and welcome to the Wednesday edition of the Locked-on Penguins podcast.

I'm one of your host, Hunter Hodes. You can follow me on Twitter at Hunter. Hodes joined by my coast, Patrick Damp. You can follow him on most social media platforms at Sinan Verwet. You can also follow this show's Twitter at L.O. underscore Penguins. And you can find us on Instagram at Lockedon underscore Penguins.

And of course, thank you all so much for making this your first lesson slash watch of the day. We are free and available on all platforms a bit later on the show. We're going to talk about a couple of players who are right on the edge of the Hall of Fame. Will they get in? Will they not get in? We're going to talk about that. And then to end the show,

we're going to spend five to seven minutes talking about Eric Carlson, not on the NHL Network's top 20 defenseman list, just because it's their annual rage bait list that they like to put out there. And Pat and I, we want to spend at least a little bit of airtime talking about it. It's August 12 people. Hunter, it's the deadest period of the off season. And you're right, the NHL and the NHL network,

they put out the rage bait trap. And despite you and I, both knowing that it was a rage bait trap. Damn it, we're walking right into it. Yes, we're going to spend at least a little bit of time on it, but the bulk of the show will center around this little Hall of Fame discussion. And Pat, let's get right into it with former Penguins goalie, Mark Andre Fleury, and former Penguins head coach Mike Sullivan.

I will say this about Sully. And again, we all know what happened at the end of his tenure. Did not go well those last few seasons. However, the guy has A, two Stanley Cups, and now he has a, two Stanley Cups, and now he has an Olympic gold medal. You're going to the Hockey Hall of Fame with that resume. I'm sorry. There's just really no if ands or butts around that for me.

And then for Mark Andre Florey, I saw some weird debate on Twitter last week about his Hall of Fame case. He is also, to me, easily going to the Hockey Hall of Fame. I know this is only one stat. I know people roll their eyes, but this is one that the Hockey Hall of Fame Committee very much looks at. He is second all time and wins with 575. only behind Marty Roder.

But even outside of that, he has the individual ward with Ebisna. He has multiple Stanley Cups. Like, this is a slam dunk to me. And I know, in 2016, didn't really play much in those playoffs, but he was a big reason why the Penguins got to the playoffs that year.

In 2009, he obviously backstopped the Penguins to that cup. And then in 17, he sure started that run before Matt Murray finished it in the second half of the Penguins run for their back-to-back Stanley Cups. for those years. So to me, man, it's a pretty slam dunk for both Sully and Mark Andre Flurry. 100%. And something that is going to really be kind of a through line in all of the stuff I'm going to talk about the points I'm going to make. And I'm sure it's going to have a lot to do with what you bring up, Hunter, is I look at whether it's hockey, baseball, basketball,

football, all of the Hall of Fames, it's more than just individual achievement, team achievement, and things like that. It is history. At its core, it is a museum. It tells the story of the histories of the game. Right. And when you bring up a player or a goaltender like Mark Andre Fleury,

you have to talk about Mark Andre Fleury in his place in the game. He was a larger than life personality with his attitude, the way he played. If you think back to the early days of his career, he was an acrobat. He just made some wild saves. He relied so much on athleticism. And he kept his career going throughout the entirety of it, especially in the final few years, by becoming more of a technically sound goaltender. but he still could make those Gumby saves that he did.

And listeners of this show and people who have followed my work know that I have a complicated history with Mark Andre Fleury. I stand by my take that I have had all these years ago, that moving on from Mark Andre Fleury in 2017 was the correct move. Yeah. You were not going to predict that Matt Murray was going to turn into a pumpkin. You were not going to predict that Tristan Jari after him would be a dud. and the penguins were looking to win a third straight Stanley Cup.

They needed cap space. And Mark Andre Fleury was the easiest cap to cut out, especially after Murray had seemingly taken over the job. It doesn't negate how talented he is. It doesn't negate everything he did for the team. And you're also right about the statistics. He's second all time and wins. And while wins may be a flawed gold holder statistic,

to get 575 of them in the NHL as a goaltender is a pretty damn good achievement. He's got a Vesna. He was part of three really good Stanley Cup teams. One of them, he was the starter, another. Again, back to my point about stories. The 2016 2015-16 Penguins probably don't make the Stanley Cup playoffs without Mark Andre Fleury. because he was really good when they were trying he was good enough i should say when the team was building back up after the hiring of like sullivan and then he gets hurt matt murray goes on a run

you stick with the hot hand then as for sully i mean let's just put it this way he's already top 30 all time in wins by a head coach and he's only been coaching what it's more than a decade because he had the short run early on in Boston. Yeah. But the majority of it was with Pittsburgh. Speaking of stories, one of the most successful franchises in the modern era of the National Hockey League and the expansion era, I should say, is the Penguins. He's the only coach to win more than one of the five that the Penguins have won.

He's now got the gold medal. And of U.S. born coaches, he's third all time already in wins. He's behind only Peter LaViolette and John Torrella. Yeah, I think whenever his time comes, and he's showing no signs of wanting to stop coaching anytime soon. He's obviously with the Rangers. Tamwell Talpat if he coaches the World Cup team in a couple of years. We'll have to see if he also coaches the next Olympic team in 2030.

But whenever the time comes, I think he's definitely getting into the hockey. And I will say that resume already with the Cups. and you have the Olympic gold? Like, come on. I think the discussion on him comes down to a couple of different things. First is, I think at this point, with the two Stanley Cups, the gold medal, already being a top 30 in wins all time and then third amongst American-born coaches, the question now is, when does he get in after his career, which ballot?

The other part of it is, and I don't see. this happening because I think he's too smart and too good of a coach. I know. I know about the end in Pittsburgh, but unless he suddenly just completely face plants as a coach and he has another miserable season with the Rangers, he goes somewhere else, has another miserable season. Maybe it gets revisited, but at the end of the day, his resume already is pretty damn good. And when you're top three in a country in wins as a coach, you might as well, those three are going to get in at one point in another laviolette, torts however you feel about them, and then Sullivan. Those guys will one day be in Toronto. Right. Yeah. So really no surprise by our picks there. We both

have Sully getting in once he's done coaching. And then Mark Andre Fleury, that was very obvious, Pat, considering his numbers. I mean, we didn't even bring up, finished his career. 912 save 2.60 GAA. Again, every metric that the committee looks at, they are putting him in the Hockey Hall of Fame. So that's going to do it for our first segment here when it comes to Mark Andre, Florey, and Mike Sullivan. But what about Sergey Gonshar and also Phil Kessel,

who is 8 points shy of 1,000? Is he going to do enough to get into the Hockey Hall of Fame? Pat and I are going to discuss both of their cases coming up right after this. But before we get to that, we have to tell you all about our first sponsor, which is Odu. Running a business should not feel like you're trying to connect a bunch of systems that were never designed to work together. One app for accounting, another for inventory, another for sales, and somehow none of them talk to each other. That's where Odo comes in. Odo is an all-in-one business management software that brings every

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That's O-D-O-O-O-O-O-O-com slash locked-on. All right, we're back here on the Wednesday edition of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I'm one of your host, Hunter Hodeys. joined by my co's Patchfamp and Pat. Let's start with Phil Kessel. Obviously, he does have the Iron Man streak right now at 1,064 games, though. I believe he is going to be passed by Brent Burns this year because he is hot on his tail.

He plays this full season. He will pass Phil Kessel with relative ease. You look at Kessel's career stats. He hasn't played since 22, 23 when he was with Vegas. 413 goals, 992 points, 8 points away from 1,000. 14 games played away from 1,300. Obviously, he has the Stanley Cups, but Pat doesn't have any of those individual awards,

not even at 1,000 points. I think he's in the Hall of Good to Very Good. Don't think he's going to do enough to get to the Hall of Fame one day. That's my opinion. As for Sergey Gonshar, that one is going to be really fascinating to watch here over the next few years because you look at his numbers. He played in just a shade over 1,300,

games, finish his career with 811 points. Also, doesn't have the individual awards. He's come top five in Norris voting. Plenty of times, he does have that Stanley Cup with the Penguins. Though, I will say, he is the all-time leader among Russian defensemen in points with 811. I do think he has that going for him. And I don't know, man, like this one I've just gone back and forth with. I think there's a chance he gets in at some point, but I'm going to go with right now, my answer, it's a maybe with me for him. He's a maybe for me as well,

but a maybe with this should happen because you brought up a couple things there. One, he has the most points by a Russian-born defenseman in all of all time. He's also tied for 18th among all defensemen in terms of points with 8-11. Victor Hedman has time. with him now and Crystal Tang is actually going to pass him this year. But he does have that going for him as well.

And again, I'll bring it up. The Hall of Fame for every sport is a museum. It's there to tell the history of the game. And I know a lot of people are yelling at their phones or their radios or their computers and TVs right now. Listen, at this point, the veil has been lifted. Like we always wanted to tell ourselves the Hall of Fame is for the elite of the elite and every sport, save for maybe football, has pretty much told us that that's not what they do. They just want to be a museum. So if that's the way we're operating, Sergey Gonchar is arguably the best Russian defenseman, at least of the modern era. Maybe not, maybe if not all time. And you're right, though, the only thing that I think he has working against him. Not a lot of individuals.

individual awards. Just a two-time All-Star. He won the Stanley Cup in 2009 with the Penguins. I also think, though, to my point about telling the stories in the histories of the sport, he was a pretty big piece for a really young, exciting, talented team that was expected to carry the league out of the doldrums after the 04 lockout. He was there to help guide of Gennie Malkin, Sidney Crosby, Chris Latang, Mark Andre Fleury. And if you look back at those two seasons, 0708, 08,09, he was a really calm, steadying presence for that group. There was never any panic.

There was never any issues. He was the definition of a power play quarterback. When things needed to settle down for those groups, the puck went on to Gonch's stick. and he settled everything down, and he scored some massive goals en route to the 2009 Stanley Cup. But at the end of the day, he feels like a guy that it won't reach a certain level for a lot of hockey talk and a lot of hockey podcasts. But he feels like a guy that we should be talking about in the sense of why is he not in yet? why have they not put Sergey Gonchar in the Hall of Fame?

But he and he continues to be a part of the game as a coach. He feels like a guy that has all the makings of a Hall of Famer and hopefully one day he finds his way in. I will say I'd be very happy if he did get in. I'm just still going to keep my answer at a Will Slee. We'll see excuse me slash a maybe just because I'm not sure if it's going to happen. Again, we'll be very happy. He does have some of the international success. Doesn't have the gold medals, Pat, but does.

does have a silver and a bronze of the Olympics also has a silver and a bronze of the World Championship, so he's not going for him. Again, has the 811 points, top 20 all time for defenseman and general history in terms of points. Most points by Russian defensemen, as I said, in NHL history. So again, time will really tell with this, but I know I speak with you with this, excuse me. If he does get in, I know you're going to be really happy as well. So when it comes to these four. Flory 100%. Mike Sullivan when he's done coaching, pretty much 100%. Gonshire, I'm still kind of at a 50-50 right now.

And then Phil Kessel just don't think that's happening, Pat. Sorry. I think we're, you haven't said it. So I'll be the one to say it. I think Phil Kessel should get in because he's one of the best American-born players in history. But here's the problem. The people who vote people into the Hall of Fame don't like Phil Kessel.

I think that is the biggest thing he has working against him because he's a three-time Stanley Cup winner. He scored goals like nobody's business. He was an Olympian and he has 83 points in 100 playoff games played. He is a proven performer. He's one of the best American hockey players of the last 30 or so years. But the thing that I will keep coming back to, and I know I'm going to get people from Toronto mad at me for this, it's not just Toronto, man. It's everywhere. People don't like this guy.

Half because, yeah, pardon my French, but he can be a little bit of a prick. And people don't like that. and his thing was, I want to play hockey, score goals, win games, and then go play poker and or golf. He's doing that right now. Exactly. And because a lot of the people who decide Hall of the Fame Canada sees, even if you're not the most hockey obsessive person, they don't want you to seem aloof into them. Phil Kessel is aloof.

and especially after he wins the second Stanley Cup and then he wins the third Stanley Cup, he did everything short of telling all of the people who wrote negative stories about him. F you, I'm Phil Kessel, and that's going to leave a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths. Yeah, I understand that. And I definitely think he will have a case.

I just think with no individual awards, he does have the Stanley Cups, but outside of that, no wards, not even a thousand points. I just don't think he's going to get in. I could be wrong on that. But I think to me he is someone that belongs in more of the whole very good than the Hall of Fame.

Maybe that's just because I have some higher standards than you may be. I mean, if it were, listen, perfect world for me, a Hall of Fame class in any sport is four people max. It should be the elite of the elite of the elite. It shouldn't be the Hall of Very Good. It shouldn't be the Hall of Good Guys who we like. And if I apply that, I know what you're doing if you put Phil in.

No hate towards him. I love Phil Castle. Yeah. And if I apply the standard, I just said I wish there was for Hall of Fame. I think other than Flurry, everybody we're talking about today, they ain't getting in.

But we know what, we know how the Hockey Hall of Fame operates and I look at it this way. Flurry should be in. Gonsch has a case. Sully probably will. And a bunch of people who don't like Phil Kessel, the guy, are going to hold that against Phil Kessel, the hockey player. And he's probably going to be on the outside looking in.

I can see that, especially with people not liking him. But for me, just outside of that, it goes back to, I just don't think he has done enough to warrant it. In my opinion. That's just how I feel. But that's going to do it for our second segment. Coming up to end the show, if you've made it this far, we are getting to the Antoine Network's rage bait list for top defensemen in the league, and Eric Carlson was not on it.

Do Pat and I agree with that? We're going to talk about that coming up right after this. All right, we're back here on the Wednesday edition of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I'm one of your host, Hunter Hodeys, joined by my co-Patch, Patra-Damp. And here we go, Pat. Let's just get right into it. Anitle Network had their top 20 defensemen list right now. Their top 10 has Kel McCar, Quinn Hughes, Zach Wrenski, Rasmus Dahlin, Mero Heskinnan,

Lane Hudson, Matthew Schaefer, Jake Sanderson, Mo Sider, and Evan Bouchard. 11 to 20 is Charlie McAvoy, Jacob Slavin, Adam Fox, Brock Faber, Roman, Yosi, Josh Morrissey, Jackson, Lacombe, Victor Hedman, Shea, and Devon Taves. I would take Eric Carlson over at least a couple of those, especially after the season that he just had. I am also, I have been on the record in saying, I think Brock Faber is very overrated as a defense. that is my opinion. Some people may crucify me for it. That's fine. It's a hot take for a reason. I just don't. I just think people talk about him way too much, in my opinion. I think Devon Taves Carlson is still a bit better than him right now, especially after the season he just had. Otherwise,

I mean, I'm not taking too many others off this list. I know you might say Jackson Lacombe, but I am a big fan of Jackson Lecombe. I think he's already an absolute stud in this league. You might say Evan Bouchard as well. He had the offense last year had almost 100 points. Yes, I realize he is awful defensively. He might be worse defensively than Eric Carlson is right now at the stage of his career. But the offensive ability, especially last year, finished top five in Norris voting. That's kind of why I'm fine with Bouchard staying in the top 20.

If you want to move him out of the top 10, I think that's fine. But there's just a couple others who I mentioned before Bouchard that I'd be more comfortable taking off for Eric Carlson. But a lot of these, Pat, they're just absolute studs. This is why it is perfect rage bait from the NHL network. It is. Because here's why. Because the way they describe it is so ambiguous that you can have any sort of debate

about it that you want because it's phrased like this. NHL network producers and analysts chose the top 20 defensemen in the league right now what does right now mean? Does it mean at this very moment? Does it mean as we sit here on August 12th? Is it the 20 best defensemen from last season? Is it the 20 best defensemen from the last four to five years? Is it the best defensemen who you think are going to continue to be the best defenseman for the next few years? That's up to you to decide.

And here's the thing I will say. I think if we're going to just say if we're going to go totally and completely literal right now, I think you can knock the Von Taves off for now. He's great. That is still the one of the biggest head scratcher trades I have ever seen when the Islanders sent him to Colorado for peanuts. Like I can't believe they did that. And then the other one that I have a little bit of, I don't want to say disagreement with. is Jackson Lecombe. I agree with you. He's a stud. He is going to be a stud for a while.

But just not yet. He's very good. And I think he's one of those players you look at. And honestly, if you were to take Devon Taves off the list for last season, put Jackson Lecombe at 20 and then put Carlson at 17, I'm all good on that. Sure. Why not? And the thing is, the thing is overall is, much we're talking about rage bait for this. The top seven, I have zero disagreement with. I mean, yeah, McCar and Hughes. They're the two best defensemen on the planet by a mile. And then Zach Werenski, he's right there with them.

Dahlene continues to be great. Heiskenen, self-explanatory. Lane Hudson, I know that I know putting them up at six is tough or a little bit, maybe even premature, but damn, that dude's going to be good. and Matthew Schaefer, you don't see an 18-year-old defenseman have the type of season he just had. So overall, I think more than anything

is I look at it as, we've said it on the show a million times. Carlson's first couple seasons with the penguins were disappointing, but in no world was he bad. Last year, he was far in a way, the Penguins MVP. And the team made the playoffs when everybody thought they were going to suck.

I think that can put him in the top 20 defensemen right now. Especially in March when he was probably the best defenseman on the planet during those four weeks, especially with the way he was playing, the level that he was at, all those multi-point performances. I mean, it was vintage aircalls and still got to finish top 10 in Norse voting for the year. You know, other parts on this list real quick, please move my boys, Jacob Slavin and Adam Fox. into the top 10, the Adam Fox, disrespect, knows no bounds. I will die on that hill. I know a lot of other people don't like him as much.

I think he's a top 10 defenseman and Jacob Slavin. He also needs to get more respect. Best defensive defenseman in the league. He is insane. You saw it at the Olympics. He saw it in the Stanley Cup final. Put both those guys in the top. I'll say this too.

Evan Bouchard is what everybody thinks Eric Carlson is. I'm not going to sit here and pretend that Eric Carlson. is a lockdown, shut him down, defenseman because he very much is not. But Evan Bouchard might as well be a fourth forward out there. And there are times when he's okay defensively. And then there are times when he is unusable defensively. But when you put up 95 points, who gives a damn?

Yeah, I mean, you're going to be in a lot of people's top 10 lists when you have almost 100 points and you finish in the, top five for Norse voting. I know he is awful in his own zone, but when you have the season that you have offensively, when you're that good on the power play, especially and on six on five situations, yeah, it's no wonder you're going to be put in the top 10 there. So, you know, with Carlson, I think I'd have him over, you know, two defensemen there, maybe three, but I don't think it's this, oh my God, this insane snub. He sought a great season last year, and I expect him to have a really good season this year as well. And that's really all I want to say about the NH20 Network's

annual RageVate Top 20 defenseman list for this episode. And with that, that's going to do it for today's show. Thank you so much to take the time to listen to slash watch this one. Pat and I will be back with a fresh episode for you all on Friday. A lot of fan take Friday stuff. And of course, any news that comes out between now and then. So for Patrick Damp, I am Hunter Hodes. Thank you all so much for tuning in. We appreciate it. We'll be back on Friday.