Locked On Penguins - Daily Podcast On The Pittsburgh Penguins - Who is the new general manager of the Pittsburgh Penguins gonna be, with Josh Yohe!

Episode Date: May 22, 2023

Happy Monday, and this could be a MASSIVE week for the Pittsburgh Penguins organization. Hunter is joined by Josh Yohe of The Athletic to discuss everything regarding the Penguins and their GM search. They start with the new rumors surrounding Kyle Dubas and whether he is a legit candidate. Is he fired up about what happened in Toronto? Would he say yes to Pittsburgh? After that, Hunter goes over Eric Tulsky and if he should be considered the favorite for the gig before they discuss some of the other finalists. They then analyze the Jason Botterill situation and why it seems to be a very murky one considering that nobody knows how serious it is. They also discuss John Chayka and if he's a candidate, plus end on the "hockey men" and if any of those people are still in it. After that, Hunter gets Josh's thoughts on what the team should do with the No. 14 overall pick in the 2023 NHL Draft before asking Josh to predict who gets the gig. All of that, plus if the Penguins will hire more than one person for their front office, is on this episode of the Locked On Penguins podcast.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!BirddogsGo to birddogs.com/lockedonnhl and when you enter promo code, LOCKEDONNHL, they’ll throw in a free custom birddogs Yeti-style tumbler with every order.GametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONNHL for $20 off your first purchase.eBay MotorsFor parts that fit, head to eBay Motors and look for the green check. Stay in the game with eBay Guaranteed Fit. eBay Motors dot com. Let’s ride. eBay Guaranteed Fit is only available to US customers. Eligible items only. Exclusions apply.Built BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKEDON15,” and you’ll get 15% off your next order.FanDuelMake Every Moment More. Don’t miss the chance to get your No Sweat First Bet up to ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS in Bonus Bets when you go to FanDuel.com/LOCKEDON.FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as non-withdrawable free bets that expire in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Well, I think this is going to be a pretty monumental week in the Pittsburgh Penguins franchise history. There's a good chance that a general manager is going to be named this week. And for all that kind of talk, I have Josh Joey from The Athletic on. That's coming up right after this. You're Locked-on Penguins. Your daily podcast on the Pittsburgh Penguins. Part of the Locked-on Podcast Network. Your team every day.

Hello, and welcome back to another episode. episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast. I'm your host, Hunter Hodes. Now that will follow me on Twitter at Hunter Hodes. Follow the shows Twitter at Elwhores for Penguins. And of course, thank you all so much for making this your first listen to today. We are free and available on all platforms.

Today's episode is brought to you by GameTime. You download the GameTime app. Great an account and use code locked on NHL for $20 off your first purchase. And joining me now is the man, the myth, the legend. Josh Oyev of the Athletic, who I have done a few shows of the Triple-H show. which will be resumed, I think, very soon potentially for some GM stuff. But Josh, thank you so much for coming on. It's been a while.

And I don't know about you, but I think this could be a pretty big week here for the organization in terms of maybe hiring a new GM or present hockey ops. I think so, too, Hunter. And first of all, I have to show you because the Pirates will only be over 500 for probably another day or two. I'm wearing my Razet shirt for the show today. I thought that was the only time I'll have to wear it until. next April probably. Just had to show that off. But, yeah, I think, and listen, this has been a long search.

We're going on six weeks here. I don't think the Penguins want this to get past Memorial Day weekend. Whoever the new GM may be, this person deserves at least a little bit of time to make plans before the NHL draft and free agency, which is coming a lot faster than people think. So I think there's a good chance this could indeed be the week. Yes, and as you said, the actual draft is June 28th and the 29th. Free agency is July 1st.

That's what, five, six weeks away at this point is coming up really quick. And, you know, you allude to a Josh, they want to get it done this week. Do you have a sense of who a frontrunner is for this? I mean, the Penguins have done a good job, keeping this quiet. You know, you look at various reports from Pierre LeBron and Elliott Friedman. Sounds like they're down to maybe five, six people. Kyle Dubis has come back in the picture a little bit. Do you have a sense of who a frontrunner is for this?

Well, not necessarily. There hasn't been a lot of information coming out from Penguinsland. When you see the national reporters getting these news reports, whether it be Pierre or Elliott, whoever, I think most of that information comes from people who were being interviewed, who the local guys, such as myself, just don't have the same relationship with. So I'd be lying to you if I said I had a ton of it. of information, but I can't tell you a couple of things.

I really believe when Kyle Dubus became available, it probably changed things a little bit for the penguins. They were deep into the second round of interviews, and now all of a sudden there's been a bit of a freeze. And if you're the penguins, you have to ask Kyle if he's interested in some capacity. I know there are some people out there that like to say, he's never won anything, he's overrated, blah, blah, blah.

Well, you may think that, but I can assure you he's very highly regarded around the hockey world. And when you look at Fenway Sports Group, the kind of people they really like, they like young people, smart people, progressive people, people who are very heavily involved in analytics. He literally scratches all of those boxes. Dave Beasts and the guy who's basically leading the charge for the Penguins, grew up in Toronto. He knows the Maple Leafs very well, knows dubus. He just sounds like an FSG kind of guy. He sounds like Billy Bean.

Only people saw Moneyball. That's seen in Moneyball when John Henry at the end of the movies at Fenway Park talking with Billy Bean. This is kind of like Billy Bean. This is the kind of guy they like. So I think we have to consider that if Kyle is interested, the Penguins, I believe, would be willing to. talk to him in what role and what capacity for how much money. Who knows?

Maybe it won't get that far. Maybe it will. So I think there's been a holdup because of Dubus, which makes sense. But if I were to throw a name out there, even though I, you know, this is not me reporting. This is just from everything I've heard, everyone I've talked to. Eric Tolski is a really interesting candidate, and I think they like him. and between the Penguins job and the Toronto job, I'd be surprised if he's not involved with one of these franchises in the next few weeks.

I think he's another guy who checks a lot of boxes that FSG likes. He's a hot commodity around the league right now. If you really want to devote yourself as an organization to a more analytical way of looking at the game, you could do a lot worse than this guy. So that's the name that just keeps on popping up. up. Yeah, and I know Eric Tolski is regarded as this spreadsheet guy, someone who looks at a lot of data, looks at a lot of numbers. I know people will say he's maybe not ready for it, but I will say this, he's been in that organization, Carolina, for eight, nine years. He's been

around the game a long time. And he's, he's right there under Don Waddell. He's helped draft Marty Natchis. He's helped draft Sebastian Ajo, all those guys there. He is signings, trades. He's, been there for it. And in terms I think of the candidates who have not been GMs for, and I think that's most of their candidates right now, he is probably the most ready guy. And I think it would be who the penguins do bring him in.

Either as a GM or, you know, President of Hockeyops, if they want to go that route. We'll get to that later. Going back to Kyle Dubas, Josh, he said last Monday, it's Toronto, we're out. He basically was saying, I'm going to go be a family man with my wife. Is that going to change now that he's gone? Is he upset about it? You know, that I think that's the main question because sometimes talk is cheap with that when money comes around. So I'm,

would he go back on his word to take this job with the penguins and kind of try to stick it to Toronto a little bit? Well, a lot has changed since then. Let's be honest. There's been talk for a long time now that the relationship between Dubus and Brendan Shanahan is an icy one. And Shanahan frankly said some bizarre things a couple of days after Kyle talked. I was shocked

at some of the stuff Shanahan said basically sounded kind of offended by the money that Kyle wanted and all of a sudden made a kind of a hasty decision because of a press conference and because of a couple of things that were said in an email. If you are the

kind of person who likes drama, You should be very thankful for the Toronto Maple Leafs. They just find a way. It's unbelievable what's going on in that organization right now. I don't know, Kyle. I watched his press conference, you know, about a week ago like everyone else did. It honestly struck me as pretty heartfelt. He looked like a guy who was exhausted, who had just been through the ringer.

And, you know, I don't know what it's like to be the GM in Toronto. I'm sure it's not fun. the pressure is different there and even for players. Did you see the comments Matthew Kachuk made after Florida eliminated Toronto? He basically said, you know, I wouldn't want to play here. Like, I love being in Florida. The pressure Austin Matthews is under is unbelievable. And I told a story on Twitter the other day.

This is probably seven or eight years ago. I asked Sid, I said, are there a part of you that ever kind of dreamed of, you know, playing in Montreal or Toronto, you're Canadian kid, Canadian hero? I have to think that crossed your mind. He looked at me like I was crazy. You want nothing to do with it. So Dubus, I don't know. You're a week removed.

It's like all that pressure's gone now. You're removed from the organization. If FSG gives you a call and says, hey, you get to work with Sidney Krausby in the final years of his career, we're going to pay you an obscene amount of money, and we're going to give you full control. What do you say? I mean, you have to think about it. And I realize money's not an issue for him and he could probably pick his job a couple of years from now. Okay.

If you take a couple of years off, sure. But I have to think were I in Kyle Dubus's shoes? I'd think about it. I'm sure I would. And maybe that's what's going on right now. I don't know that. But I have zero doubt that the penguins have at least reached out to him to talk. Yeah.

Funny enough, that's what, you know, we just started recording this. And Darren was apparently on a podcast recently. That's hockey. He basically said, you know, there's been a lot of speculation that possibility of Pittsburgh in some capacity. If not, GM may be the president of hockey operations. He even said the Fenway Group is looking for someone young, someone aggressive who has some experience. That is Kyle Dubus in a nutshell. And I can't help but think, Josh, Kyle Dubus as your president of hockey ops, which he did not have in Toronto.

That was Brendan Shanahan. And we've seen numerous reports saying that he wanted to make some moves. Shanahan blocked him because. he didn't want him to make that move. If he were the president of hockey ops and maybe you hired, I don't know, Eric Tolski, Steve Greeley, whoever, whatever candy you want, Dan McKinnon. And you pitched that to Kyle and you said, we would hire you in this position. We would make this person or GM, what would you say?

I think he would also very much think about that because that's a very progressive front office. He would have total control. And I think he would honestly welcome the challenge of getting this team back to being a playoff team or potentially a contender next season. Yeah, and I know it's easy for people to say, well, the Penguins job stinks. You know, their great players are old. They have no one in their system. And I understand that.

But I wouldn't say it's a terrible job. FSG has a lot of money. Pittsburgh's a great sports town. You get to work with the greatest captain in the sport in Sydney Crosby. The Penguins, despite not making the playoffs this season, and they remain a really relevant NHL franchise. There are only so many jobs that open up that get your attention.

Pittsburgh Penguins are one of those jobs. It's still a marquee franchise, and it's still a team that's willing to spend to the cap. So you take all those things into consideration, and I think anybody is going to be intrigued by the idea of showing Pittsburgh or being the GM or whatever the case. may be. So yeah, you mentioned Kyle and Eric. I mean, it sounds like the analytic dream team,

doesn't it? And I have had people tell me about Eric. A couple of people, you know, in the last week have told me he's a really good guy, really smart, he's great at what he does. Problem with him in regards to Pittsburgh. And I've had people tell me those people who used to be in the Pegwood's organization said he's the kind of guy that likes to surround himself in his spreadsheets in his office and you won't hear from him for a while. Like he keeps to himself that's just how he is and with the penguins, especially with Crosby. Sydney Crosby and Jim Rutherford used to have lunch all the time. And like that was important. Sid's never going to be the kind of guy who says, hey, I need to know what's going on or hey, you need to trade this guy or you need to get me

this winger. He's never done that. But he doesn't like it if he doesn't know what's going on. He likes to feel included a little bit. He was one of the five greatest players in history. That's pretty common. I mean, listen, Mario and Yager were coach killers. Like they, they had full control. Sid doesn't want that, but he likes to be involved. And I do think Ron Hextall, who's not an analytic guy at all, but Hextall did bury himself in his office all day and had no relationship with Sid at all. And he didn't have a relationship with Latang or Malkin either. That bothered them. They never knew what was going on. They wanted to know who was in control. and so they need somebody who has those people skills.

Maybe Tolski does. I don't know. But one of the hires had better. I think that's important. And I think Dubas actually does. Like, in that experience that Kyle has, if you could get him, you know, he's not some guy just staring at his computer screen and his spreadsheets in his office all day. Like, he knows how to deal with people. He's a bright, personable guy. You need a little bit of that when you're working in this capacity.

I really believe that. So that would be the ultimate. That would be the dream team. I don't know that they could pull that off. These are two guys who both might want complete control. Yeah. Did a new respective job, and I get that. So maybe it wouldn't work, but it's certainly nice for fans to dream about a little bit, I think.

Yeah, I think, you know, I posed that question on my Twitter last night on Saturday night, I should say. And I think 95% of the responses, I asked like, what's your dream from office? And they're like, oh, do this Tulsi. He's like, yeah, I probably should have figured that most people would say that, considering that Dubus has done a fairly decent job in Toronto and Tulski, I think, is the most ready of the assistant guys. But that would do it for this segment. Coming up in the second segment, we're going to get into a whole lot more when it comes to the GM search. A lot of the other candidates slash, I guess, finalists that are involved here and so much more.

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Last minute tickets, lowest price guaranteed. All right. We're back in this episode of the Locked on Penguins podcast. I am your host, Tomorhodes. I have Josh Yo, The Athletic here. So, Josh, we've done Tolski. We've done Dubis. I think those are the two main people that I think most fans in this city want.

But there are still, it looks like, a couple other good finalists. And one that I really did not know much about, Josh, until this week. Dan McKinnon worked in the organization 2006 to 2016. Sounds like there's real interest there based on what I listened to from Elliot Freeman on the 32 thoughts. podcast. He's an assistant general manager in New Jersey now. He's part of that really good brain trust that Tom Fitzgerald has brought in. Were you surprised to see him as, I guess, one of the finalists? And do you think he has a pretty good shot at getting this gig?

I guess you would consider him a dark horse, but I wouldn't discount the possibility of it, nor would I discount his credentials. I can tell you this, he's a hell of a scout. this is a guy who absolutely knows how to identify young talent. He always had a knack for it. Ray Shiro thought the world of him. He worked with Ray's whole time here. They were together. And very highly regarded a guy.

When you look at the job he's done with the devils, well, you have to be impressed. I mean, you always want people who work for good organizations, right? And that's one of the things about McKinnon and Tulski, I think. that really jump out at you. Carolina and New Jersey, you know, the direction that the game was going in in the last five to ten years,

those are two teams that are very much on the forefront of it. And, you know, they're good organizations. They know what they're doing. So you want people from that kind of a background. And McKinnon. He's a bright guy. Got to know him a little bit. Not super well, but good guy knows the game extraordinarily well.

I still think he's probably a dark horse, but he's an interesting name, and it doesn't hurt that he has a relationship, you know, with people in the organization from Mike Sullivan, especially. Worked with Sullivan. He worked with Sidney Crosby. I mean, they've won cups together.

That's a relevant thing. You could not deny that. So, yeah, he, I was a little surprised to see his name surfers, because, you know, all the names we hear, it's like, oh, that name kind of came out of nowhere, but I can kind of see why maybe. maybe that would be an interesting candidate. And he got a second interview.

So he's certainly somebody they're interested in, at least. Yeah. And then of the others, Josh, Steve Greeley, I've seen the Dallas executive, Jason Carmanos. I think everyone knows who he is. He used to work in Pittsburgh. And then Matthew Darsh, who helped work on the CBA for the NHLPA, good assistant general manager in Tampa Bay.

He's been linked to a number of NHLGM jobs or the past couple of seasons. What do you make? I was just giving your thoughts on those candidates and how you see them stacking out for a job as well. I mean, Darsh, again, works for a good organization, right? Yeah. A couple of Stanley Cup rings. And I think it's noteworthy with him. If the goal is to win right now, if the goal is to, and that's pretty much what Dave Beeson said last month after Hextall and Burke were fired, you know, he said,

we're not so much worried about our system right now. We want to win another championship, basically. Which is probably what should be the mindset while you still have Sidney Crosby on your roster. You're not rebuilding as long as he is here. So, Darsh is a guy who, Tampa. They go overboard. They give up like five or six draft picks for average forwards. Like they don't mess around.

But maybe that's the kind of aggressiveness of Penguins want. And I, you know, by all accounts, he is a very qualified, very intelligent guy. He's one of those people. He's going to be a GM. It's a matter of when and where, but I was not at all surprised that, you know, his name came up to be a candidate. Greeley's a guy I'm not as familiar with.

But again, Dallas, look at how that team has been built. It's not necessarily, even Dallas is actually a great city, but it's not really a destination where you're going to get pre-agents to sign their left and right. It's, you know, it's the classic non-traditional market where sometimes in cities, like that you have to draft well if you want to win and yeah look at what the stars have done they

might be the most complete team in hockey um so again this is a guy who has played a very prominent role in the construction of that team it only makes sense that you would be interested in somebody like him so yeah these are you know we heard the list of what 10 or 12 people and i know there were some names that people liked and some names that they didn't like and now the names that have floated out that are in the round, everyone's kind of like, yeah, those names make a lot of sense. I think everybody's pleased with who's getting the second interviews, right? Yeah. There's one other one.

Who did I forget? Oh, Carmanos. Oh, Jason Carmonos, yeah. I mean, you know, Jason, a really quiet, understated guy. He never struck me as somebody who necessarily had the quote-unquote personality to be the guy. Maybe he does. I mean, he's really bright. and during a time when the penguins were not leaning on analytics at all,

like when Jim Rutherford was hired, that was kind of Jason's thing. And he worked with Sam Ventura very closely, and they did kind of develop a little bit of a system for the penguins to use, even though, you know, Jim Rutherford, I'd be lying to you if I said that he relied on analytics. This is the guy who signed Jack Johnson and traded for Eric Good Branson. Like, obviously Sam and Jason weren't telling him to do that.

But Carmanos, really bright guy. I mean, he's highly regarded. Even if you could get him back in some capacity, even if wasn't as a GM, he's just one of those people you like having around. You know, the Penguins had such of an embarrassment of riches, of assistant general managers. At one point, you had what, Jason Carmanos, Billy Guerin, Jason Botterill, Tom Fitzgerald, like all in the same staff under Rutherford. That's insane. That's crazy. No, we're never going to see anything like that.

that again. But no, he's certainly, again, he's not going to blow you away with charisma, but he's a smart guy. He knows what he's doing. So I probably put him as the biggest underdog, the guy's still remaining that we've heard. But he's a worthy guy. He really is. Yeah. No, I'm not surprised that he's got a second interview because, you know, he's familiar with the organization. I think they like that at least a decent amount. Finally, Josh, you know, your column this past week, you were arguing for Jason Bottero to get the job. I've said on this show, look, I wasn't his biggest fan when he was in Buffalo.

The Tage Thompson deal has looked a bit better because Tage has turned into one of the better players in the league. He signed the Jeff Skinner contract. He did draft some good players, though, obviously. Dahlene, Samuelson, you know, middle stats turning into a good player finally. You can go down the list. What has been going on with that situation?

because you read various reports. And it's like, oh, he's maybe in. Oh, then he's not in. Oh, he then gets interviewed, but he's still not sure. Do you know how the latest on what's going on with him or if he's still being considered for the GM job? I know he's somebody who the Penguins were interested in initially. And yeah, my article I wrote, you know, I think,

I don't want to say he's the safest pick because I think that comes with a negative connotation. but Jason Botterall is a guy who is incredibly smart, very highly regarded. Mike Sullivan loves him. Sidney Crosby loves him. Jim Rutherford to this day thinks he should be a general manager somewhere in the league. I know things didn't go well in Buffalo, that that's undeniable. I also think that was a really tough spot to be in in a pretty dysfunctional organization at the time.

The Pugulas are a bit much. They're not the easiest people to work. And FSG is the opposite. are as hands off as it gets. Sometimes people need second chances. Jason just turned 47 the other day. He's a young guy. And he does, you know, he believes in analytics.

I think he would be very eager to develop the Penguins' analytics department in a big way. But I also think he has a little bit of old school in him too. And I don't think it's a bad thing. I just think he's a nice mix. And I, you know, I wouldn't be against him getting the shot. I think the real question is, and I don't have a bad thing. an answer for it. I don't think anyone does. How interested is Jason Botterall in this job?

I don't know that he's knocking down the penguin's door to get hired. I don't really have that sense necessarily. So I'd also consider him a dark horse at this point, but I wouldn't completely ignore the name either. Yeah. And again, it's obvious why they wouldn't have interest in him. He worked here for so many years. Assistant General Manager, Associate General Manager goes on to Buffalo. you said he is very close with Cindy Crosby, Mike Sullivan, and a lot of the other players. So I totally get why they would have interested in him. And he's done a good job in Seattle,

helping out Ron Francis with that team because that Seattle team is good. So I'm curious to see what happens there. And I don't know where my computer went. There we go. That was a little whack. Hopefully it doesn't show up on the screen there. Do my screen go dark there? No, you're good.

No, perfect. Yeah. That was my PC was being a little weird, but we'll go in it. And I'm going to say for Bottero real quick. Go ahead. He worked under Ray Shiro, Jim Brotherford, and Ron Francis. There are three guys who know what they're doing. A lot of Stanley Cup rings among those people.

I always am in favor of hiring people who have worked for successful people. I do think there's something to be said for that. No, I definitely hear you on that. It's very true. And again, compared to some of the other names that are in these other GM searches, I would be fine with them hiring Bottero. I just personally think there are some, a few other better candidates out there than I certainly wouldn't be, I guess, disappointed if the Penguins hired him in any capacity. Last name before you, Josh, before we get to a commercial break, or one more question after that,

John Chica, you know, I listen to 32 thoughts a lot as I keep saying. I read stuff. What's going on with him? Have the Penguins interviewed him? Is he being considered for either president of hockey operations or do the general manager job? what's going on with him? The penguins have spoken with him, and I know for a fact,

they did a lot of homework on him. And again, he's the kind of guy FSG would like. No question. He comes with some baggage. Let's be honest. He got a lot of trouble in Arizona. And yes, he did. He was very young.

And speaking of dysfunctional organizations, there's no more organization as dysfunctional as that one. So he probably deserves something of a mulligan. Is he really the best candidate? Okay, he's bright. He's great with analytics. That's wonderful. A lot of people are.

You know, you need to have some other qualifications, too. This is never anyone who's at any success. He got in trouble with the league on a couple of occasions. They talk to him. They're interested in him, but I don't think he's real high on the lists. And I keep hearing that there could be other teams interested in him in some capacity, too. So he's definitely trying to get back into the league. I'm sure he will.

Maybe this is just a thought. Maybe he doesn't need to be a general manager yet. Maybe I hate the expression paying your dues, but maybe you should be an assistant for a couple of years and just kind of get back acclimated. Get acclimated maybe to a good franchise and how they operate and then he can put his brain power to use. That would be my advice for him. Yeah. You know, the trouble you mentioned, scouting combine violations, he that went behind the coyotes back to try to look for another job when he was there.

And, you know, when you work for the coyotes and their ownership group, I can understand being... You get it? Yeah. He still can't do it. Yeah, it's still a bad luck, you know. Yeah, and I understand why they would be interested in him. You know, he did make some decent moves there, but, you know, still not high up on my list.

Finally, Josh, before we do, we get to commercial break. We'll touch on a few other topics like the playoffs and YR picks are looking terrible right now in the conference finals. Wow. I have to ask this, of course. Is there anything new on just, you know, the hockey men, as we all like to say, is like, for example, you know, I saw in the first one of the reviews, at least Mark Bergen, Peter Shirelli, some of these other, like, old school hockey men, are any of those guys in the mix right now?

Because it seems like for the last week, it's really been narrowed down to five or six people to the point where I don't even think they're in anymore. Well, I don't either. Peter Shirelli, for one. How does he get interviews? FSG, you know, these people are all from Boston. He won a cup in Boston once upon a time, so they know who he is.

I'm guessing that's why they gave him a courtesy interview. I can't imagine he would be a serious candidate at this point. His body of work is horrendous in the last decade. He's not the kind of guy they're looking for. I was floored when I heard that they interviewed him, to be honest. Berzsvon, you know, he comes with some baggage, too. I think he was better in the last few years than Shirelli is a general manager. Not saying much.

No, it's not. And, you know, the obvious connection to Mario Lemieux, but I, you know, listen, Mario owns half percent of the penguins. Mario hasn't been around in a year. And I don't think Mario wants to be around. I think Mario never really wanted to own the penguins. the rest of his life. I think he's enjoying his life and golfing in Florida, and he still cares about the franchise deeply, but he's not involved in any decision-making right now. He's really not.

So, you know, we can talk about that angle all we want, but I don't think it's that relevant. I'd be very surprised if Berchivan ends up being involved, but I'd be utterly shocked of Shirelli day. There's no way that one's happening. No, I mean, I saw the last one. I saw the one saw the list. I'm like, how does this guy get interviews after the trades that we have seen him do? And the same with the thing with Mark Berzman, Josh. I'm sorry. The only thing he did well was just, oh, I got Carrie Price. I have the, I have arguably the best goaltender of the generation outside of Henrik Fungquist. All right. I mean, that's really all. I mean, she got Shea Weber, Nick Suzuki. Actually, it was a rare win for him with the Petruetti deal. But there's really not much there. No, and again, he doesn't

check the FSG boxes at all. He really doesn't. Not at all. And, you know, there are some, we still have to see Hunter, you know, is it going to be a GM and a president of hockey ops? I was going to ask you that, my final question. Are they going to do that or are they going to do something else? I don't know.

I don't know. And I don't think they know yet. I think it really depends on who all says yes to certain jobs and then they can kind of piece it together. It could be, you know, they don't necessarily have to have a president of hockey operations, but if Kyle Duba says, hey, if you want to give me $5 million a year, I'll do that. Huh, that might make some sense, but, you know, that's just an example. I think they'll probably use the same system that they've used in the past with the president

of hockey operations, a general manager and probably an assistant general manager. That would probably make the most sense. But I can't tell you for sure what the plan is, because I really think it's a matter of which people are available and then they will kind of proceed from there. Yeah. And I think that makes a lot of sense. And I mean, yeah, I think this is going to be a big week for the team. You said it.

And this should be a lot of fun. But we'll park the GM talk for a little bit. Coming up after this commercial break, we're going to get into the conference finals, how this sound like a final probably is going to start by this upcoming weekend by at this rate. And a couple other things regarding paying us just to ground for that coming up after this commercial break. All right. We're back here on this episode of the Locked-on Penguins podcast.

I am your host, Hunter Hodes. Remember to follow me on Twitter at Hunter Hodes follow the shows, Twitter, Eleanorist, or Penguins. And, of course, thank you all so much for making this year first list in the day. We're freeing available on all platforms. I'm sticking with the Penguins, Josh. We'll get to the conference finals.

Just a second. It's been a while since we've obviously talked. The Penguins have the number 14 overall pick in the Antial draft. They will have a lot of good options available to them if they keep the pick. If you are the new GM, do you keep it? or do you send it off to get immediate help like a goaltender,

like a top pairing offenseman to play with Chris LaTang, like an impact forward if Jason Zucker doesn't come back? What are you doing with that pick? Well, the penguins have three options that I see. Number one, you keep the 14th overall pick. And that's not a bad thing. This is the best draft in years. You got the 14th overall pick and a great draft.

You're going to be able to get a, presumably a legitimate blue chip player, which the penguin system needs. Okay. You can do that. You can trade that 14th overall pick and trade it away to try to clear up some cab space. Hey, you want McCall Grandland? I know you don't. You want the 14th overall pick too?

You know, something along those lines. Might be a long shot, but I think it's probably worth considering. And, you know, the third choice is you trade that pick. and in return you try to get an impact player. That's probably what I would do. I think Granlin is going to be bought out, and I don't know that because I don't know who the GM's going to be, but I think any GM is going to watch what that guy did last year

with the money that he's making. You know, you probably don't have much choice. So presuming you do that, I think if I were in charge, I'd probably use that pick as the ammunition to try to make my team better right now. It's a hard thing to do because so many teams around the league are just looking to unload players because of the salary cap, not necessarily trying to make hockey trades, which is what the penguins want to be doing right now. COVID screwed up the salary cap, you know? It should be about $5 million higher than it is right now.

And because of the league revenue situation, it's not as high. So a lot of teams are being affected by that. The penguins do have some money to play with this summer. Now, the problem is it's not a very good market. I mean, sure, there are some good players available, but not that many. It's not a critical. The weakest re-agion class I've seen in a long time for every position. It's not good.

So, I mean, I would think making a couple of major trades is probably the best way the penguins can make themselves better before next season. And including that 14th overall pick, that's the best chip they have to trade, probably, unless you want to trade a Jake Gensel or somebody like that. And I'd be hesitant to do that. So I would probably advise at least strongly considering trading that pick. I think if the goal is to win now, that's all that makes sense. I like Owen Pickering.

I can tell you from watching him in rookie camp last year, he's impressive. I think he's going to be a nice NHL player in a couple of years. He looks like a young Brian Dumlin type probably. There's nothing wrong with that. That kind of guy is not going to help Crosby and Malk could win right now. And if that's the point, if that's the object, then I think they probably need to be pretty aggressive with that pick. Yeah, no, I totally hear you on that. I mean, again, I would probably lean towards training it for an impact player, but man, this draft is a lot better than last year's.

I'll say that you're going to get a player that's better than Owen Pickering. And I like him, but I think there are players there in any position, especially forward-wise, that I think could be a really good player down the road, even though it's not going to be incident. from us being and E. Malkin's final few years. I had a scout tell me a couple of weeks ago that there are six players in this draft who all would have been the top pick in last season's draft. That's how much better this draft is than last year's draft. So penguins are picking at 14th under in a normal year, they're probably going to get a player that would have gone like ninth or 10th. But that's just how good this draft is. So it's not at the end of the world if they keep this pick.

They presumably are going to get a really talented player if they do. That's great. But you have to consider moving it if the object is to win now, in my opinion. Yeah, I definitely agree on that. And Josh, we'll finish up here with some playoff talk. Is it still a final going to start before Memorial Day at this rate? I wish it always did. I'm old enough, Hunter.

I remember when the Penguins won their first cup, it was game six in Minnesota. It was May 25th, 1991. it was the Saturday of Memorial Day weekend. What a city in the park, what a party it was in the city that night because it was Memorial Day weekend already, and the thing was win the cup. Boy, it feels that way. Florida, I mean, they just have that whole team of destiny feel right now

in a really big way. I'm not saying they're lucky because they've played great, but I don't think they're this good. They just keeps team rolling everybody. What they've done is incredible. If Sergey Bobrovsky wins a cup, like I saw it posed on Twitter the other day. If he wins a cup, is he in the Hall of Fame? He's got two Vezina.

He might be. As crazy as that sounds, he's been unbelievable in the West. And by the way, like you, I pick Carolina to win the series. In the West, I really think Dallas is the most complete team left. They should have won game two. Brian Souter was just a horrendous turnover. and then even worse awareness in front of the net, Vegas ties that then they win in a couple of minutes into overtime. We certainly appear to be on a Vegas-Florida collision course.

I like to think maybe Dallas, if I had to pick, they got the next two at home. Maybe that series isn't over yet. That Dallas team's really good. They're tough to be in that building. But it's just been an unbelievably unpredictable Stanley Cup playoff. And if parity is your thing, that's the great thing about that. the NHL. I mean, Florida barely made the playoffs. Let's be honest. If the penguins could have, you know, managed to beat Chicago and Columbus who were trying to lose, Florida wouldn't even be in the

playoffs. How weird would the playoffs look right now? Oh, I mean, let's be honest, Boston would have killed the penguins. I don't care. I've heard people say, oh, see, the penguins want to beat Boston. No, they wouldn't have. Oh, no. They would not have. But it's up for grabs. It's wild. I give Vegas and Florida, a lot of credit they are just both on an incredible role. I really did not think Vegas was going to beat Edmonton. And not only did they beat them, but especially in the last game of that series, just the way they silenced McDavid and Drysidal.

I only got one right. Man, that wasn't, oh, boy, I'm hurting badly in my, I don't remember the last time I got a pick right. I didn't pick Dallas. Yeah, I think that was my one second round pick that was correct. But two for four in the second round, six of eight in the first and I'm looking at O for two right now. Beating the hell out of me, Hunter.

I went four and four in the first round of one and three in the second. I'm staring down the barrel at O and two as well. May have made a small investment on the Dallas starts to win the cup at some point. And I'm feeling a little letdown right now by the men. Yeah. Vegas is just, they probably didn't deserve to win today. Ottinger played really well. The stars just played great, but let them tie it with two minutes left.

and you go to a coin flip overtime. That's how it goes. Florida has just been kicking the crap out of team since they were down three to one. I guess I just let a fire under them. And they have been awesome ever since. And I want to see the takes, Josh. If we go to Vegas, Florida Stanley Cup final, the takes from the big market teams are not steel beams.

That's funny. I made people mad a couple weeks ago because I tweeted that ESPN and TNT aren't going to be happy about this. But they're not. But the league should be happy. Okay, the league, yeah. Because if you really, if the goal is really to see the game grow, this is great. I mean, it really is.

And I can tell you, especially in Vegas, like, that's already a good hockey town. I've, you know, I'm out there every year when the Penguins play there. It's amazing. Everywhere you go in that city, like all the poker dealers, they're all wearing golden night shirts. Like, they love that team. That is a legitimate sports town. already and the more exposure they get, the bigger of a sports town that will become. And, you know, Florida could really use this.

They have had a difficult time turning that team into a big draw. But listen, people don't understand from the context of geography. They don't play in Miami. Sunrise is an hour away from Miami. Okay. It's like 50 miles away. Fort Lauderdale is even a half hour away. sunrise is just in the it's a nice little town in the middle of nowhere and there aren't that many

people there so it's just naturally difficult for them to draw on and it's always heard to draw in miami anyway because it's always nice outside it's those usually don't make for great sports towns people are always at the beach um it's just the way it is but you make a stanley cup run it does make a difference with your season ticket sales it does make a difference with your tv ratings it does turn communities into hockey towns and maybe that's exactly what is happening. So I'm all for it. And the hockey,

we have four games so far and they all went to overtime. Yes. You can't complain about that if you're a hockey fan. It's great stuff. No, they've been really fun games to watch. The second round games were just absolutely terrible. Right.

But Josh, I think that will do it for this one. Real quick, though. I hate to do this. I'm going to put you on the spot. If you had to make your prediction, Josh, who becomes the next GM. Throw a name out there.

You go for it. If I had to guess, I'd probably rank Tolski as the favorite right now. That's just the name I've heard the most. He checks all the boxes. And Dubus, who I think would probably be

their number one most coveted guy. I don't know how interested he is. I don't know. I don't think he was lying at his press conference. I do think he's burned out. and I wonder if he does maybe need some time away. He would be the most interesting name, no question. And they're all possible.

They really are. So I don't say that with a ton of conviction. But Tolski, he's a hot commodity right now. And if he doesn't end up in Pittsburgh, I would not be shocked if he ends up in Toronto. Well, that's if Toronto wants to go for someone with no experience. And according to Brendan Shanahan, he wants that experience because he's a good old hockey man. But it seems like he knows what he's doing these. So yeah, we'll see.

Yeah, no, we'll definitely see on that. And again, Josh, thank you so much for coming on. I very much appreciate it. Tell the audience, what you got coming this week from the athletic outside of, I guess, GM stuff. Well, Hunter, people might have to wait for a day or so because I have to get a root canal tomorrow. And so I don't handle pain very well.

So I might be, in fact, if I start tweeting really strange things around dinner time, that's because I just had a root canal. I might be a little high. I don't know what I might be tweeting. It could be very interesting. But yes, between myself and Rob Rossi, we will have a lot of GM stuff this week. It just changes all the time. But I will tell you, I really think the decision is coming this week.

They don't want to let this get past the Memorial Day holiday. They want whoever the new GM is to have four or five weeks before the draft. I really firmly believe that. So I would guess, honestly, by Thursday at the latest, I think we'll know who it is. Well, this should be a pretty fascinating week then as I, especially as I introed. So again, Josh, thank you so much for coming on. Very much appreciate it. And we'll back with another episode on Tuesday.

And maybe by then, Penguins will have made their decision on their next regime for this front office as they will try to navigate a very interesting time here in franchise history. So again, thank you so much for tuning in. I'll be back with another episode on Tuesday.