Loremen Podcast - Loremen S7Ep19 - The Ghosts of Finchale Priory

Episode Date: May 21, 2026

James and Alasdair meet a retired pirate experiencing a self-imposed male loneliness crisis. Starting in the ruins of Finchale Abbey, we travel back to a time before the monastery was built (don't look for it, it's not there yet) and meet the notorious Saint Godric. This burly old hermit had a very hot & cold relationship with animals and would go to extraordinary lengths to impress the ladies. Well, one particular lady - Our Lady. Come see us in Oxford on the 1st July 2026⁠⁠ Join the LoreFolk at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠patreon.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ko-fi.com/loremen⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check the sweet, sweet merch here... ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.teepublic.com/stores/loremen-podcast?ref_id=24631⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @loremenpod ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠youtube.com/loremenpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.instagram.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.facebook.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Lawmen, a podcast about local legends and obscure curiosities from Days of Yore. With me, Alastair Beckett King. James Shakespeare. And James. I hope you're ready to hear about a real odd ball. Yes, I'll always. Always and forever.

Well, get your ball-catching hands ready, because I'm about to love one right at you. If they're going to be, if it's odd, I need a third ball catching hand, presumably, or only one. Because is it a triple odd ball? Well, I don't know. An odd amount of balls. Oh, I see what you mean. You've confused me mid-in intro.

Yeah, sorry. I've lost my thread. What's the story about? What kind of odd ball? Get ready for Godrick and the Finkel Abbey Ghost. Finkel. James, James, James, James. Alistair.

Alistairdester. Would you like to come with me to the northeast of England today? What's the weather like? Well, it was hailstones two minutes ago where I'm recording. I don't know if it's going to come out on the mic, but we just had a hailstorm. So it's got to be better than that. Yeah. Good.

I don't want to be absolutely satched. You won't get absolutely satched, I'm sure of it. Excellent. Although someone in this story will. Just a little pin in that. Yeah, yeah. Spoilers for us. Absolute satching is coming up. And also translate for our less eagle-eared, all-minded viewers.

Satched is northeast slang for saturated. Yeah, just wet. Just wet through. Absolutely satched. It just means basically it means absolutely satched. I'm going to have to bleep it, but the sort of equivalent down around, probably London way, is wet through, I think.

Oh, that's lovely. That's lovely. Bleep wet through. That really sounds worse than it actually is. I'd like to take you to a place that I call Finkel Abbey. Yes. I hope anyone else does. I hope no one else does and you have to ask for directions for it all the time.

Well, apparently it's called Finkel Priory more commonly. But I remember it being Finkel Abbey. And it's one of those places like Usher Moor and Pensha Monument that when I see how it's spelled, I go, what? Oh, because it's a place that I've heard more. than I've seen written down, and the spelling is weird. Well, it's F-I-N-C-H-A-L-E, so you might want to pronounce it Finchal or something like that.

But it's like Fink-H-H-H-L. Fink-L. Finkle. Finkle. These sound like medieval rappers, all of these, by the way. Finkle. Finkle Abbey. Usher is a rapper, right?

Usher Moore. Oshamua, it should be really. Oshamua. And what was the last one? Pensha, as in Pension Monument. Yeah, the notorious Pesha. Penshire Monument. What Finkel is the ruin of an old monastery and it's on the banks of the river Weir.

Weir. To locate it, that's three or four miles north-northeast of Durham Cathedral. It's north of Brassside or Brass side, as you might say. But it's pronounced Brass-side by the locals. And it's east of Pity Me. Oh, no. What, is that a town with an exclamation mark? You're thinking of musicals.

Yeah. Oh, no, it's Westwood Ho. Is the town. Oh, that's good. With an exclamation mark. I think it's because it's named after the book or something like that. Is that right? I assume, pity me.

It's pit as in mine. I can only assume. Like Pittington, also in Durham. Great name though. Pity me. Pity me. But Finkl Priory wasn't always a ruin, James. Originally,

Finkel Abbey was, well, it was nothing at all because it wasn't there. Don't look for it. It hasn't been built yet. It had faded into not being built yet. It had, yes. But then after that, it was built. And then after that, it became a ruin.

Whoa. But before it was built, it was the site of St. Godrick's hermitage. Oh, yeah. Now, do you know anything about St. Godric? Are you a blank slate, blank page? I can guess that he had a hermitage, and that is everything. He was a hermit, yes. He was not one of your more miracle-heavy saints.

So I don't get your hopes up, these are v wonders. Some saints are out there doing fantastic things all the time. St. Godrick is more like a... Did you have a weird neighbour who you just sort of steered clear of? I referred to the houses as murder houses. You'll get one every sort of five or six streets where they've eschewed curtains in favour of sticking newspapers. The inside of their class.

I was just going to say newspaper. Absolutely. Yeah. That's classic murder house in my mind. If St. Godrick had had a house, that's what it would have been like. Right. As it was, he lived in a hole. Oh.

Yeah, that's a murder hole then. Murder hole. And he was born around, I think, 1065. I've also seen 1070. So we're in the 11th century. This is the time immemorial. Well, speaking of memorials, Henry Leighton wrote a book called

Memorials of Old Durham 1910 and he was not terribly impressed by St. Godrick. He wrote This Godric whose name is indissolubly associated with Finkel Priory although he was in no sense

the founder of it was as selfish and dirty and old anchorite as ever attained the Brevet rank of Sainthood Oush! Yeah, that is slams. Slams are plenty. If you think that's bad, I'm now going to read Godrick's own opinion of himself, which is way worse. Oh.

This comes from, well, I think it comes from his biographer, Reginald's biography of him. So Reginald was his friend, and he wrote a biography of St. Godrick. He wrote it in Latin, but I found an English translation of it. Reginald told Godric that he was going to write his biography, and Godric said, You wish to write from my life? Know then that Godric's life was such as this. Scodrick, at first, a gross rustic, an unclean liver, a usurer, a cheat, a perjurer, a flatterer, a wanderer, pilfering and greedy, now a dead flea, a decayed dog, a vile worm, not a hermit, but a gadabout in mind,

a devourer of arms. Oh, that's A-L-M-S. Right. Yeah, just, I knew you would be upset there. Yeah, yes, exactly. Dainty over good things. greedy and negligent, lazy and snoring, ambitious and prodigal, one who is not worthy to serve others, and yet every day beats and scolds those who serve him. This, and worse than this, you may write of Godrick. Wait a minute, he had a hole, but he still had staff. I don't think he did. I think this is the 11th century version of Christian humility is when someone, you know, like when someone compliments, if you're a British, but if you're a British woman, if someone compliments your outfit, sort of a stock joke that you have to somehow say something self-deprecating.

Yeah, that would be better. I think that was what he was doing, but just taking it too far. Just hitting people for compliments. Nice hair, Godrick. Wush, he swung for me. Exactly. He did carry a stick at all times, so it is possible that he... So he did have stuff.

He had a small stave. That quote, the English version of it, was from Durham, a thousand years of history and legend. I'm still getting over the fact that there was someone called Reginald in the, around at the time of Billy the Kong. I think it's, I think it might have been his surname, but I don't know. Oh, okay. If you like good surnames, that book was written by Martin Duffer Weill.

Nice. Oh, Duffer Weill, looks German, Duffinville, maybe, who is also the author of Northumbria's bloody history. Oh, no, this guy. It doesn't seem to like history, Martin Duffelweil. But, so that's where that quote, of Godrick really doing himself down comes from. But basically, he was the original bad boy.

Yeah, he sounds it. Duffer Wheel calls him the pirate saint. He might have been a pirate. He was definitely a merchant adventurer, which might just be a sort of a polite way of saying pirate. Yeah, maybe, yeah. He travelled a lot and sailed around, and there is a reference in another, I think, 12th century text,

I'm not sure, to a pirate called Grericus Pirata di Regno, Anglia. That is Godrick, the English pirate. Yes. They can't have been that many Godricks knocking around. Not back then. Outside of Britain. So maybe he was a notorious pirate.

Oh, so he was, it was a medieval sounding rapper. The notorious St. Godric. But later in life, he got into pilgrimages. Mm-hmm. Which I think, I guess in those days is like when people get into doing marathons as they hit middle age. Yes. Or get very serious about coffee. Could you do a triathlon pilgrimage where you walk, then swim?

And then... Maybe. He did do at least three that I know of. He did the Santiago de Compostela. Yeah. The St. James Camino in Spain. Yeah. And he did Rome twice.

Oh. So the three saints challenge. Like a lot of rappers and bad boys, he loved his old mum. Good. And the second time he went to Rome, he carried his mum with him on his back. Oh. Piggy back. Not the whole way.

Right. Well, I just like the image of that. Apparently, only when Christ. Crossing streams. He carried her on his back. Okay, then. That's, that's better. That's practical. That is just practical, isn't it? Because she's an old lady. Now, I'm aware that I'm not getting much spooky in, so I've got my first, it's not exactly a miracle. Go on.

My first odd St. Godrick-related encounter comes from the hermits and anchorites of England, 1914. Sorry, what's an anchorite? Ankerite is like someone who lives in the middle of nowhere, lives in ascetic life, and sort of birches them. themselves and stuff. Right. Thank you. Really? I don't really know.

I don't know exactly what the difference is. It's like when we all say to have and to hold. Right. So the Hermites, the Hermites and the Hermites and Anchorites of England is written by Rother Mary Clay. I had to make sure Rother was her first name and I hadn't mistyped it. It is, seemingly. I assume Rother is Mary as a woman.

Mary will be an unusual middle name for a man. Yeah, I suppose so. And she writes, she, he, they write. that as they were travelling on their way to Rome beyond London, there met them in the way a lovely maiden who asked permission to join them

in their pilgrimage. They readily assented. And henceforth she served them with grace and diligence. They knew not who she was or whence she came and none of the company save themselves

saw the mysterious maiden. When they were returning and had reached the place where they had first met, she bade farewell with words of benediction. That's a bit mysterious. That is mysterious.

I'll give you that. Who could see? Only he could see. Only the people in me. Only he and Edwin, his mum, could see this helpful woman. Oh, all right. Just the first mysterious woman of today's tale. So he got back to England.

He moved around a bit and basically decided to get into hermitting in a big way. Right. But as I'm sure you know, James, being a hermit is a bit like being a Jedi. Yep. First, you've got to find like an older hermit to sort of teach you the ways of being a hermit. Oh, the ways of the hermit. I saw a hermit's hole recently. Did you?

A hermit cave, actually. Where was that? Batsford Arboretum. In an Arboretum. Arboretum. You ever been to an Arboretum? I think I might have been to it. It seems like the kind of place I would like an Arboretum.

It's like a safari but trees. I guess it's a vegan safari. A vegan zoo. Yeah. Yeah, it was interesting. I am now old enough to appreciate going to an Arboretum, it turns out, because I was like, oh, look at those trees. Big tree.

head, are you? Oh, look, an Acer. What's an Acer? It's a Japanese maple. Oh. They look very nice and they have lots of lovely, colourful leaves. Sorry, I fear I've derailed... Maybe slightly.

With talk of a hermit's hole. Was it good, the hermit's hole? It was a cave. Well, that's better than Godrick's hole, which you'll hear about in a second. Oh. But before we get to it, he's visiting Ayl Rick, an aged monk at Walsingham. Mm-hmm. And there's a nice bit where it says in that same book, in Rother Mary Clay's book,

entering the Hermit's cave, he received the unexpected salutation, Welcome, Brother Godric, to which, though they as yet, were strangers, he replied, How dost thou fare, Father Elric? So they just knew each other already. From like the hermit scene. Just, I guess so, they just sort of like, they followed each other on the socials, and so they were like mutual respect. On her own.

respectful sort of, yeah, just like that. You know when you nod by just moving your head backwards, you do like a reverse nod of respect. Yeah, the ultimate respect. When I'm in like, if I'm in Belfast and just another guy with a ginger beard sees me, he gives me a little like, oh yeah. Oh.

We both have the same beard kind of nod. Yeah. As he goes into his job in the tattoo shop or vape store. Or combination. Or tattoo vape shop. But don't, for heavens, children, listen to this, don't try and smoke a tattoo needle. Do not, or pump, vape into your skin. Obviously, don't do that.

That'd be horrible. Oh, gosh, no, yeah. Come on, kids. So he and Ayl Rick became close friends, and as far as I can tell, and not necessarily in the historical sense of close friends, although we don't know. He nursed Ayl Rick through his old age. And not in the medical sense of nurse. Well, maybe.

Maybe a little bit. I don't think he had any medical training. He was basically, you've heard him describe himself. It was just a kind of guy who would go around beating everyone who tried to help him. But after Elric died, he set up his own hermitage in a little loop of the river weir in Finkel. And that's where the Abbey came to be built. It's not there yet. Oh, still don't look for it.

It's not there yet. Don't look for it. It hasn't been built yet. I'm reading now from The Hermits 1875 by Charles Kingsley, who describes Godric. So the good thing is we know what Godrick looked like. because there were contemporary accounts, including Reginald's account. A strong and healthy man must Godrick have been to judge from the accounts. There are two, both written by eyewitnesses, of his personal appearance.

A man of great breadth of chest and strength of arm, black-haired, hook-nosed, deep-browed, with flashing grey eyes, altogether a personable and able man. He wore a hair shirt and an iron queer ass. What? Do you plan of RPGs to know what a queer ass is? It sounds more like an online shooter. You'd learn from online shooting games. Yes, it does sound like a slur, but it's spelled C-U-I-R-A-S-S, and it's like a torso armor or torso covering.

Right. Yeah, so it's made of iron, it's armor. So that would be horrible to wear a hair shirt under an iron queer ass. Yeah. He sat night after night, even in midwinter in the cold weir, the waters of which had hollowed out a rock nearby into a natural, bath. What?

Absolutely such. Absolutely. Oh, his hair shirt is going to shrink. Yeah, but he can't, and the iron, queer ass, is going to rust. Oh, no, the hair shirt would just get a bit boofy, I suppose, if he didn't condition it. We don't know if he used shampoo and conditioner on the shirt. Would you, yeah, do you need a hair shirt gel? They'll sell you all sorts of stuff.

They'll make you think you need all kinds of stuff. Yeah. You can probably just use that shampoo and shower gel and conditioner stuff. if you're getting budget hotels. Yes. That is less good than all three of those things. Yeah. The Jack of All Trade gel.

Yeah, exactly. You know, it's absolutely fine. Your hair comes out like corrugated cardboard. And after that, he bathed in a barrel, sunk in the floor of a little chapel of wattle, which he built and dedicated to the Blessed Virgin Mary. In them days, you didn't need to bathe after going in a river, presumably. I don't know if it means that he bathed in the waters,

and then bathed in a different barrel or whether he stopped bathing in the rock and started bathing in his own barrel, which is the way I interpret it. Right. I just don't know. For long periods or like... I think for long periods, yeah,

sort of ways of punishing himself. And when monks do these sorts of things for the Virgin Mary, it always makes me think of, you know, like Travis Bickle from taxi driver, not knowing how to impress girls, not knowing what they would want. It took her to a mucky move.

Yeah, exactly. It's like that is, that's not. I don't think the Virgin Mary wants you to sit in a natural well of icy water. It's like, well, what do you want then, ladies? If not, it's like he's been listening to podcasts about what women want that don't feature any women. Yes. It's like this, this, they'll see my, my broad chest in the icy water. I'll look mysterious if I'd sit in a river.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, you will. Got to play extremely hard to get. It would raise questions. Who is he? What is he doing and why? Well, it's only going to get stranger. Oh, wait, no, because actually this does make sense,

because girls love snakes, don't they? They like snakes because they're dangerous. Yeah? Right. As he would lie in front of his little fire at night, a wealth of serpents would slither up to him and coil all about his legs and get on his plate and stuff. And they never harmed him, but they were his friend until one day when he got sick of having snakes,

he told them all to get lost and they never came back. Oh. Oh, I wonder if he regretted it. Again, not really a miracle per se, that. No, just sort of snake bothering. Who's that guy writhing with the snakes? It's quite the opposite of snake charming, I suppose, as well. He was snake charming, but then he was actually quite snake rude to the snakes.

He was a frenemy to all animals. All of the animal stories involve him being sort of nice and then sort of quite mean to the animals. Just gets a bit tired of it. Yeah, like an impatient Francis of Assisi who's like, no, actually, this is enough. Get off, get off, get off. Yeah.

They loved, the animals loved him naturally and he carried that stick I mentioned for hitting animals. For hitting animals with. Yeah. He's most of the stick. famous for sheltering a stag that was being hunted. He saw it and he let it hide in his dwelling. Then when the hunt came by, they said, have you seen a stag? And he's a Christian, so he couldn't lie

and say, he couldn't do the Bugs Bunny thing of saying he went that away. But he had a solution without lying to save the stag. According to Helen Waddle's book, Beasts and Saints from 1949, he said, God knows where he may be. Did he do that noise at the end? I assume he did it a kind of a little sort of shrug gesture. Oh, that's like the reverse of like,

have you seen a stag? And then he goes, no, and they go, what never? Yeah, it's very sort of like, well, you are still, this is a lie of a mission at least, isn't it? You have misled them, but you haven't actually lied. It's very annoying. It's not a miracle to be annoying, is it? No.

It's not in the top ten. You'd think, I would have thought it would be in the top ten. Because aren't there two that are basically the same in the old top ten commandments? Are there? Let me just look at top ten. Is there a commandment against not being annoying? No. If not, there should have been.

We really missed. I've Googled top ten commandments as well, like I'm looking for a listical. I'm not sure if there's even 10 because there's different there's loads of commandments in the Bible aren't there? The top 10 from Moses The top 10 commandments

That's definitely the phrase we use And this picture Remember James is doing this So there could be up to 14 In at 10 No coveting Nevis EG neighbor's spouse or possessions Okay good done

Bang at 9 A non mover bearing false witnesses Oh, well, that would be lying, so that's what he avoided doing there. Eight, not steal. So in a way, he might have stolen the stag. Seven, commit adultery. Six, murder? Mm-hmm.

It's only in at six. In at six? What's worse than murder? Not honoring your father and your mother. That's worse than murder? Yep. Not keeping the Sabbath holy is in at four. Wow.

And at three, taking the Lord's name in vain. Again, worse than murder. Two, making idols. Making, well, like action figures is worse than murder. Yeah, He-Man, worse than murder. And having other gods before me, brackets, those are all worse than murder. And none of them is, don't be annoying. I can't believe Funkopops are worse than murder.

Wait, hang on. Actually, they were onto something there. That's the point, yeah. But also, they could have rolled that into being annoying. Yeah, yeah. If you just used our idea that being annoying should be a deadly sin or whatever. I don't know my Bible back to front, a commandment, then you could have avoided all of the details. Yeah.

Oh yeah, there's also the top six deadly sins, but we haven't got time to go through that now. Yeah, yeah. Join us in a future episode for the top six deadly sins. You won't believe number two. Doctors don't want you to envy. So that stag became his friend. and would regularly visit him after that. That's good. How did that end up, though? I don't know if he ever hit the stag with a stick, it doesn't say.

Or just like, hey, it's over here, actually. Yeah, he was quite fickle with his animals, wasn't he? I suppose I feel a bit like that with my cat, because I encourage it to come and sit on my lap and be stroked, but then at some point I have to go for a wee. or get a drink or go to bed or something. So I do have to kind of kick it off. You have to kick it.

I don't think you have to kick it. I can't kick my own lap. But, you know, I have to like shovel it off with my hands as a big shovel. I tried to lift it up as gently as possible and place it as though I'm a sort of a cat-based forklift truck. Yeah, which is how I imagine myself. Certified cat forklift. You've sort of inverted the standard thing that when you're stroking cats and the cats like it,

they love it, they love it, they love it, and then violence. Whereas you're the opposite, you're stroking the cat, and then after a while you kick it. I don't kick it. I'm just, I kick it off. Well, I refer you to your words of a few minutes ago.

I kick it off. Well, it's not in the top ten commandments, is it? Don't kick a cat. No, it isn't. It should be. It should be. First lawman commandment. James Shakespeare, stop kicking cats.

All right. Commandments, we're going to have a lot more than ten if they're person by person. Yeah. Stop kicking cats. General. Yes. Anyway, sorry.

He wasn't as nice to a hare that visited him. Well, he kind of was. He kind of was. A hair came to steal from his vegetable patch, a la Peter Rabbit. And this is from Helen Wardle's book. He came on the thief in his garden. That's the rabbit.

And as it turned in headlong flight, he bade it halt, presumably holding the stick as a sort of, whoo, watch out. The poor little creature stopped and waited in trembling and alarm the arrival of its pursuer. The saint caught it, struck it with his rod. Bang. And binding a bundle of vegetables on its shoulder, sent it off with these words. See to it that neither thyself nor any of thy acquaintance come to this place again, nor dare to encroach on what was meant for the need of the poor.

Oh, right. So he hit it and then gave it some vegetables and then said, come back. Oof. Yeah. So he's very, he's blowing hot and cold. That's going to confuse a hair.

Well, I don't know if it did because the hair never came back as far as we know. Yeah, I suppose he got the message, but did it steal from the poor? Well,

I don't know. I guess he wasn't going to eat the vegetables. He must have given them away because from what I read, he just ate his own food like mixed in with ashes to make it not nice.

He ate berries mixed with ashes. To impress Virgin Mary. Yeah, so with all ashes and berry juice dripping down his chin. Oh, how mysterious. What's his story?

He's a real bad boy. He's a decayed dog. He's a flea. So St. Goddrich died, not as quickly as you would have thought based on his lifestyle. Yeah. And Finkel Priory was built over the next couple of hundred years. And I think, I think, I think he was buried in Durham, but then some of his bits were moved. And so I think some of his remains are.

are or were in Finkel Priory. Should have checked that. How mysterious. There's a little chapel thing that supposedly held his remains. Ah. And there's an article about Finkel Priory on spooky aisles.com.

Oh. Yes. Yeah, the real authoritative sources. Mm-hmm. The article's by Gail Fiddler. Great. Who's a real living person. Okay.

It behooves me to point out that her name sounds like an offensive term for storm chasers. Blumming Gail Fiddlers over there And sorry, Gail, sorry someone who might plausibly listen to this It is a slightly funny name Can I remind you, Gail, my name's James Shakeshaft

Yeah, yeah, exactly He's called James Shakeshap Go fill your boots It implies, well, I can't say what it implies on the podcast, but we all know what it implies Yes The Shaking of the shaft Oh, me, right, yeah

Yeah Sorry, you know, we're doing you there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Whereas I just have a totally normal name. It's one of those articles with loads of facts or factoids but no references, so it's very hard to check up on the details. Right. So if you've ever, if you look up a picture of thing called Priory, it's very spooky looking.

Yeah. Go on, Google it, James, and then give me a thought. It's ruined, it's crumbly. Like I say, it's a little, it's a little loop. of the river Weir, so it's on a sort of natural kind of river peninsula. I googled Finkel Abbey and I got a... Did you mean?

Finchale Priory. Finchale. Finchale Priory, yeah. Yeah, well spooky. It's very spooky looking. So I thought it's bound to have some ghosts. Oh, those cloisters. Oh, it's got cloisters for days. Mm-hmm.

And a big side said, danger. Keep children under control. Yeah, that applies everywhere, really, doesn't it? That's not location-based. That's a good commandment. So that was why I thought it's bound to be haunted, and that's what brought me to Gail Fiddler's article. And there's a really interesting line in it,

which says local legend tells that it was monks from Frinkle Priory who murdered Lady Lily Lumley from nearby Lumley Castle. Lady Lily Lumley from nearby Lumley Castle. Oh, no. I got that right, first take. You did. Yeah, every single other thing. thing I had to do two takes on, but I got that right.

Oh no, poor lady. She's been murdered. I should stop. Don't worry, James. She doesn't exist. If you're starting to feel bad for her. Spoiler for the rest of this, not a real person. Okay.

But yeah, apparently it was monks from Finkel, according to this article, who murdered Lady Lily Lumley from Lumley Castle. And threw her body down a well. Her ghost is still said to haunt the castle. Ah. Now, I say she's not real. It's not fake law exactly. But you know those evolution charts where it goes like slug, tortoise, golden retriever, human?

Where they sort of show the development. No, not exactly. I'm simplifying. Yes. This is a bit of law that has evolved like that quite recently, relatively speaking, in folklore terms. So first of all, as I intimated, there is no historical figure named Lady Lily Lumley. Lily isn't a first name, it's a description.

She's the lily of Lumley, i.e. a beautiful lady. Oh, a lady that's the Lily of Lumley. She's like the Rose of Rabie Castle, who was a real person. And slash real castle. Right. Like Chastleton House is cucumber. I'm so sorry you're going to have to explain that in great detail. I've just made up. I'm just made up.

I'm not sure. I'm not sure it's cucumber. The watermelon of Warwick Castle. Yeah, usually they go with flowers. I don't know if a woman wants to be described as a watermelon, but I'll have to ask St. Godrick what girls like. I'm not sure it's a flattering comparison. He's gone into his own bedroom at a house party

and he's listening to Muse with a big bowl of ash. No, he's brought his own bongos. Oh. To a student flat. No, stop him. Get him out. of here. Give him the ash. Put it back in the river. Yeah. So it's not Lady Lily Lumley. It's the Lily of Lumley. And so I tried to find out about the lily of Lumley. So I read the North of England Ghost Trail, 1997, by Liz Linnehan.

Just for the listening, he didn't get that one right first time. I didn't. I didn't. I took two guys. And according to that book, the Lily of Lumley was married to Lord Ralph Lumley. And she had become a Lollard. This is very difficult for friends who can't say Elwell. The Lily of Lumley from Lumley Castle who became a Lollard. Yes. What's a Lollard? Is that someone who lull's hard? Yeah, I work hard and I lull hard.

And then there's Lollard with a vengeance. Yeah, Lollard 4.0. Yep. No, it's, I'm glad you asked James. I had to look this up. I didn't know. It's a religious, I suppose, heresy. She was a follower of John Wycliffe.

Wycliffe John? Or of the recording artist, Wyclef Jean, yes. At this time, a radical religious figure, rather than a hip-hop artist. Okay. So it's before he was in the Fugis or whatever. Yeah, I had a little note. I wonder if James is going to spot how much his name sounds like Whitelef Jeanne in my notes.

And you did it, James. You spotted it straight away. I think he's a politician now, isn't he? Whitelef Jean? Yeah. So, according to the legend, as printed in the North of England Ghost Trail, two priests basically popped round to Lonee Castle while Ralph were away, determined to save her soul. But having failed to do that, they decided that murder was the only alternative

and lured her into a bedroom where they brutally killed her. What? Afraid of discovery, they'd drag her. bag the body down the mural staircase, I assume that is a part of Lumley Castle, to the castle basement and threw it into the well. That's a bad idea. Throwing a body into a well?

Terrible idea. People go to the well. I'm presuming if we go to the well daily and they're going to notice if it starts to smell and they all get poisoned because there's a rotting model. It's Lady Lily of Lumley Castle. Yes. They'll know.

Dubbly scheming, the pair then took a fatally ill young woman from the village and installed her in a nearby convent, telling them of the superior that this was Lady Lumley. And then when she died afterwards, the priests informed Lord Ralph, not to be confused with King Ralph, of his, in inverted commas, wife's death. So that's one version of the legend. It's also mentioned in a book called Now the Duchess. Oh, now that's what I call Duchess is.

It's got an ellipsis in it. So maybe it is, maybe that's an abbreviation, because it's now dot, dot, dot, dot the Duchess. Lady Lily Lumley was a lollygaggar. No, what was she? A lollard. A lollard. And then she got lobbed down a well and they got a look-alike. They got a look-alike for Lady Lily Lumley who was lobbed down a well.

For being a lollard, yes. According to now, the Duchess, that's the Dutchess. The Dutch version of ellipsis there. Nice. Thank you. For people who remember things. Yep. Which I really included because you don't get dot dot dot dot's in many titles of books.

No. It makes it hard to know what sports. to say the title. Now, the Dutchess. It's a book from 1964. So you did used to get it in the Now That's what I call music dot dot dot, volume one. That's true.

Yeah. Anyway, sorry, now. That must sound so incredibly British to people who don't know that our sort of compilations of the hits of any particular year were released in an album called, Now that's what I call music. Now that's what I call music. Yeah, just a really.

odd, really odd name for a compilation. But they just tend to sell them as just now, and they don't bother with, that's what I call music. One of the, yeah, one of the suggested questions, because I'm obviously Googling it, is, does now that's what I call music still exist? And I think I know who might have written, who written the Wikipedia page,

because it's, yes, it does, and it's very active. It's very active. It's very active, particularly in the UK. Oh, so other countries have, now that's what I call music. I guess original United Kingdom and Ireland series, I'm looking at spinoffs. There was a Wii game.

Nintendo, I hope. Nintendo Wii game, yeah, not just like to see how many tracks you could urinate through. Yeah, Denmark, Czech Republic, South Korea, China. Following its introduction in China, the Now series has enjoyed great success. Well, there you go. Why are you asking if it still exists? Of course it still exists. It is very active.

They've even got now that's what I call duchesses out there in the 60s. All the top duchesses of the year. now has also been seen in Mexico. That sounds like they're being tracked or they're on the run. Yeah, it sounds like he's committed a terrible crime. There's just a passing reference in Now the Duchess, which I mainly brought up because I like the title. It's slightly different.

It says there was the Lily of Lumley, a fair Lady Lumley, who is said to have been flung down the Ubliette of the castle by the Catholic priest at the time. That's more sanitary. Yes. Unubliette makes perfect sense. And only one priest in that version.

I wish I'd stop digging there because that's quite a good story. And it's very hard to find accounts that are older than that because Lily of Lumley was the name of a racehorse in the 19th century. And so there's lots of newspaper records about The Lily of Lumley. The Lily of Lumley. A horse. Yeah. You'd be a good twist if she turned out to be a horse. But I'm afraid I found two books which blow this case wide closed.

Oh. One of them is The Lily of Lumley, 1869 by Edith Milner, which is a historical novel based. upon the legend. Right. And the other is the records of the Lumley's of Lumley Castle,

1904, also by Edith Milner. What's going on, Milner? Yeah. Well, it's very weird because in the preface of the Records of the Lumley's of Lumley Castle,

it mentions the Lily of Lumley, and it says that it's a fictitious account, and it says the author has added various details. Without mentioning that I am the author, like Edith Milner, the person who's writing that is the person who wrote the other book.

So it's very weirdly written where she says, the author of The Lily of Lumley said this. It's like, that's you. Oh, right. You wrote that, but she's sort of like being cool about it. Being coy. But the records of the castle make it clear that Lily of Lumley doesn't exist. There's no person who seems to fit the bill.

Wow. Slam on all Lady Lumley's. None of you are nice enough to be described as a flower. There were Lady Lumley's, but no lookers, not a looker among them. No, it confirms that there is a real legend that a Lady Lumley was murdered. But, bad news, almost all the details of the legends I've told you so far seem to come from Edith Milner's novel and are specifically things that she says she made up for the novel. So she invented the priests and gave them their motive. and she was the one that said

that Lily was the wife of Ralph Lumley rather than just Our Lady of the castle. Okay. So she didn't set out to deceive anyone and was completely honest. But somehow, I think, as far as I can tell, her novel,

the fictional version of it, has seeped into the real legend and now almost all the details in the legend seemed to trace back to that novel. That's kind of disappointing. I suppose it's a bit confusing because she also wrote a history

of a proper history. It is confusing. If you want to know another contradiction about her, she was a prominent anti-suffragist. A prominent and very active campaigner against women being listened to. Interesting character. So that's disappointing. I thought I had a good ghost on Wahans, but we don't. So we can't end the podcast there.

Can't end the episode and go straight to scores. So I needed a good ghost. Gail Fiddler's account includes a first-hand encounter when she visits. visited the ruin with a friend, the friend got spooked and had to leave and was convinced they were being followed by a figure with a limp. Which, full respect to Gelfiddler's friend, I thought was rubbish and kept looking. And I found Aidan Chambers book, Ghost Carnival from 1977, later reprinted as, this place is haunted. This place is haunted. Now that's what I call a place this haunted.

Now, I feel like I've recognised the title. I feel like I've been drawn to Ghost Carnival before. because of its excessively exciting name. This is a ghost carnival. Roll up, roll up for the ghost carnival. Well, I've got a story from a woman who didn't like a ghost. I did eventually find a proper ghost sighting for Finkel Priory in Ghost Carnival. This is Mrs. H. Woods' sighting.

This sighting happened 24 years ago, i.e. in the early 1950s. Right. On Christmas Day. Oh. So if you're listening to this at Christmas time, good. I couldn't be bothered waiting. If you listen to the 1950s, how? Yeah, even better.

Mrs. H. Wood was walking with her young sons one foggy afternoon, trying to get to her sister's house before dusk. You know what Christmas is like? Yeah, you're always trying to get around your sister's house before dusk. Exactly. She was trying to get to her sisters for Christmas dinner before the sun went down. Now, her husband was busy on the farm, and he wasn't going to be finished until after dark.

So he said, oh, you go ahead with the, you take the lads. I'll keep milking these cows. I'm adding colour here. I don't know. Yeah, I like it. That's what he said.

She was like, oh, well, I'll take the lads. Cows don't know even anything about Christmas. They didn't know it's the Lord's birthday. Apparently they do. They look towards. Sometimes they do, depending on who you ask. At east.

Don't they? Oh, well. So I'm also being, I'm trying to double up on it. But your farmer's got a sidekick that's quite annoying. We don't know how many people were on the farm. But we do know that Mrs. H. Wood and her two boys left the house. And her route to her sisters took her across the river on a little bridge and through the priory.

Did the ghost of Godrick give her a piggyback? Unfortunately not. That would have been great. They don't need a river. They've got a ghost who gives you a backer. Now that's not a bike, isn't it? Oh yeah Even if he had been there

I think she would have got bad vibes Because he would have been trying to impress her With his weird In the river Yeah sitting in the river being like Ladies I don't think you'd go for that Enough for two

Get out of here He's hitting animals with sticks as they go past My Lady Tips Fedora Yeah So by the 1970s There's a little visitor kiosk at the end of the bridge.

But at this time, the 50s, there was a small wooden cottage which was inhabited by Mrs. Woods' uncle, who was the custodian of the ruin at the time, and his daughter, who was a daughter. I guess that was her job. So I'm going to now read Mrs. Woods' account. Get really to be spooked, James.

As we crossed, of course, my young sons had to stop to peep down through the gaps in the wooden bridge to see the river. It seemed to have gone very still, and the mist was very much thicker down here. For some reason I felt sad and uneasy. I told the boys to hurry up or we would be late for tea. There didn't seem to be anyone about at all. And why were they so late lighting up? I looked at the bungalow and breathed a sigh of relief as I saw my cousin standing outside the back door. As we

moved closer, I was rather puzzled as she seemed to be wearing a long, pale, blue dress. Long dresses were not in fashion at the time. And instead of looking towards us, she was gazing up at the top of the steps with such a sad look on her face, sort of lonely and lost as if she was waiting for someone, and they never came back. I just could not figure it out, and there seemed to be an awful feeling of sadness all around. I said to the boys, there's Francie, wave to her, and I started to raise my arm. Just then she looked around and seemed to see us for the first time. Never have I seen anyone look so startled and frightened. She turned around and went into the bunkalow through the back door, as I thought. Well, you can imagine how amazed I was. I was. I

whether she had taken leave of our senses, or I had. James, do I need to tell you that when she reached the other side of the river where they found the cottage locked tight with all the lights off? There was no one there, James. No one at all. As I realised what had happened, my legs felt weak, and the boys were asking, where has Francie gone? We went off that road at double speed, I can tell you.

When we arrived at my sister's house, I couldn't believe that the bungalow was empty, as the figure had looked so real and I told my sister about it. Oh, didn't you know? She said. They decided to close up the place for once and I've gone away for Christmas. I sank down into a chair and to this day I can still recall that figure in the long blue dress quite clearly. Ooh. Yeah.

Spooky, very spooky. So the site of that cottage was near the site of the old monastery's cemetery, which is the connection she makes. So who was that? Was it the Lily of Lumley? Was it Godrick's invisible helper woman who vanished? But James, you know who else famously wears blue? The Virgin Mary. Oh, yeah.

Herself. Yeah, she does, doesn't she? The very Virgin Mary. St. Mary the Virgin. Extra Virgin. Yeah, yes. Mary, original extra virgin Mary. Oh, wow.

Yeah, it could have been her. Now, that's what I call Virgin Mary. Yes. Now that's what I call Jesus' mum. So those are several hauntings of Finkel Abbey, Finkel Priory. Finkel. That's really terrible. Yeah, that last one was very spooky. It's moved me. Yeah, we did get to a ghost in the end. I'm hoping we'd find one. So James, have you recovered from your spooky sensations enough to score?

Yeah, I reckon. My tales of St. Godrick and Finkel Abbey. Let's do it. All right then. My first category for you is name. Yes. And first of all, Finkel Priory has two. Finkle Priory, Finkle Abbey. Finkle. We've got pity me. Oh, pity me.

We've got Reginald. We've got an 11th century note. Yes, yeah, an 11th century Reginald. 11th century Reginald. We've got the compilation album name. Now that's what I call music. Yes. That's what I call music. We've got Goodrich's Pirata, Di Regno Angelo.

Yes, all those other words. The Pirates, anchorites. Anchorites. Lollard. Lollard. We've got Father Ayl Rick. Yes. We've got his mother, Edwin.

Lily Lumley, who was lobed. Like a Lollet. Yes. And then they got lob down a well. And they found a lookalike who was ill. Yeah, we've got all the elves. We've got Gail Fiddler. Yes.

There's a couple of elves in there as well. well. Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot of good names in that. And Whitelef Jean. And of course, yeah, he ran for Haitian president 15 years ago. Did he? Yeah. And succeeded? No, he wasn't allowed to in the end because he hadn't lived in Haiti for long enough at that point. But I think now he probably has, so he might do it again. You never know. Well, I'm not a Whitecliffe John expert.

Well, what? Then this whole podcast has been a farce. All this time, I thought you were a white F. Jean expert. No. I'm not a Wycliffe Jeannius. It's all I could think of. It's my genius, but with a soft G. A Wycliffe, Jean-Aseur. That's more like it. Thank you very much. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Janet de Gannett. Yeah, no, that was our own little side riff. That doesn't count. I feel like Janet the Ganit does count. My feeling is it counts towards the names. Some strong names. It's a bold four. A bold four. but you put it in bold.

Okay. Because I realised that's the equivalent of capitals in numbers. All right. I felt like it was going to be a five. But okay, four. Have you remember Duffer Wheel? Oh, yeah. Martin Duffer Wheel.

Northumbria's bloody history. Oh, and the Caravan of Ghosts. No, what was it? Carnival of Ghosts. Carnival of Ghosts. Yeah. All right. What about now dot dot dot the Duchess?

All right. It's a five. Is it? I'd forgotten about now. A pity five. The Duchess. All right. And now, supernatural.

Ooh. Now, I'm aware there was not a lot at the start. It was more an old cantankerous man punching wildlife for the first half. You think, like, that lady that they're supposed to have seen but they were now sore, was it just he sort of tried to punch her? He probably just, yeah. She went away before anyone saw him. Yeah. It was probably, yeah, it's probably just that he's really bad with women.

Mm. No, she wasn't even there. Or was he trying to show off that he had a girlfriend, but she was on another spiritual plane who didn't know her. Yeah, she's on a different pilgrimage. You could, yeah, he would be like, oh, yeah, and the Santiago de Compostela, yeah. Compostella?

That can't be it. I haven't got it written down in front of me. It can't be Compostella. Come on. No. I'm giving it a three. Because I think there were three. I've written down Compostela.

That's all I can tell you. Okay. There were maybe three ghosts. Three possible ghosts. Okay. I'll take that, yeah. What about the miracle of the snakes who he really liked him and then he told to go away? Is it a miracle to be rude to a snake?

No, I don't think it's supernatural to be rude to a snake. How did he become a saint this guy? I'm not actually sure if he's canonically a saint. I think there are some like local saints who aren't official Catholic church saints. I don't know if he's made it right the way up. Is he a saint like my auntie annie wasn't my auntie? I think it might be like, yes, yeah, I think it might be like that, where he's like just your mum's friend.

Your mum being that Virgin Mary. The Virgin Mary in this case, yeah. Yeah. I'll take three. I'll take three. It wasn't the spookiest one. No. I accept that.

My next category is the Mel Gibson film, What Women Want. Oh, no. You don't want a big score? The beloved Australian racist, Mel Gibson, made a film called What Women Want in the year 2000. One of the top reviews on IMDB for What Women Want, a romantic comedy that a guy can see two. And the second one says, for all us guys. Finally, a film a man can watch. Wow, I haven't seen this film.

I mean, the thing is, there are lots of examples. of this guy getting it wrong. Well, Mel Gibson. Yes, but also St. Godrick. But I'm so annoyed by that film and Godrick's antics that I'm going to score it very low. Oh, well, they should do a... What women want is none of this.

They should do one... Having cast Mel Gibson, they should do a spin-off where he hears what the ethnic minorities he doesn't like think and sort of learns a bit of... about them and learns to perceive them as human as well. That would be fun. Finally, a film Gentiles can watch instead of the reviews. So, yeah, I feel like I really shouldn't have

shouldn't have nailed my colours to Mel Gibson's mast there. I'm not sure. I'm not sure I've used the right metaphor. I really shouldn't have brought Mel Gibson into this. Because, actually, of course, I've called it what women want and say God it didn't know what women want. They don't want any of that stuff. What have I done?

But I'd say you're right, girls love ghosts. Girls do love ghosts. So I'm going to give it a one for girls, for girls loving ghosts. And there is one ghost at the end. Yeah, there was at least one. Yeah. Final category. Absolutely satched.

Oh. I feel like we've used this one before. I'm sure we have. spreadsheet checkers, let us know. I think that it feels like this has come up before. It is appropriate that this was. be, because he is satched, because he's not only would he sit in a river in a special little hard river seat made out of a stone. He'd also, so he could go to church but still be

river wet. He had that barrel, didn't they? He had a barrel, yes, and the queer ass hair shirt combination, that's going to hold in a lot of river water. Yeah, and even if it didn't, he would have probably invested in some wet look hair shirt gel. Very good, yes, yeah. So, yeah. Absolutely sass. And he probably got quite wet when he was a pirate. Yep, definitely.

You probably get quite sweaty under Santiago, Compostella. The Lady Lily was down a well, which is famously a wet, one of the wettest places. One of the wetter holes, yes, a well. The guys were going over a river. The two boys. The guys.

The guys. The guys. The guys and their mom and the doll. They were going over a river, which famously one of the wetter waterways. Wesser than a stream. Certainly wetter than a stream. Wetter than a brook or a burn, absolutely. And it was misty, which is one of the wettest types of air.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. You can be absolutely satched by mist. You can. So I'm going to give it a. full five out of five. Five out of five. So we're saturated in numbers. Absolutely.

Absolutely satched. It's tripped off other numbers. Wow. Thank you very much. You're very welcome. Wet through. Would it be, if you had a curly hair shirt, would it like tight, would it be bigger once it's wet and then as it dried it just got smaller?

Maybe. As it curled up. You'd probably have to do the curly girl method if you had a curly hair shirt. So that's going to be actually quite a lot of work to keep those ringlets looking good. Yeah. He could only go out in his hair shirt if he'd washed it like two days prior. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

You can't wash in the afternoon. The whole days are right off. But it would air dry, so it would probably be all. Yeah, yeah. You'd be like, oh, look at that St. Godrick with his split end. It needs to trim his hair shirt. And an undercut is just a crop top, I guess. If that's not what women want, I don't know what is.

A hair crop top. What do you like? A real oddball. Yeah, he was, wasn't you? I said he was. Card carrying, whole dwelling, river sitting in oddball. Please don't throw him back to me. I will look fumbling.

There is probably a couple of little bonus bits from that that are available via patreon.com forward slash lawmen pod and if you support us there you will also get access to the law folk where you can meet like-minded law folk thank you very much

to everyone who already does support us on there thank you very much and thank you very much. And thank you very much for listening. Thanks to everyone who leaves us a lovely review.

We do like the reviews don't we? We love a lovely review. Oh, we love the reviews. Oh, we do. Oh, we like them. That's very nice. Love a lovely review.

Don't chuck a lovely reviews. live you down in Lel. Don't do that. No, give us... Just make any sense. Slide five stars under our door. Hmm. This is a ghost carnival.

Roll up, roll up for the ghost carnival. We've got poltergeists. Cheptoplasms. Hey there, young man. You ever see the ghost? Come right in. Come right in. Here's the bearded ghost.

By a ghost, give it to your gal. Girls love ghosts. I'll impress them. Girls love ghosts.