Loremen Podcast - Loremen S7Ep25 - Weird Antarctica with Ellie Gibson

Episode Date: July 16, 2026

Brrr! It's chilly at the South Pole! The boys are joined by comedian & videogame sage Ellie Gibson (Scummy Mummies, Go 8-bit), who takes us on a guided tour of Antarctica in all its creepy splendour. And then Alasdair takes us on a quick tour of the Arctic, for a very good reason that is absolutely not a clerical error. With penguin hi-jinks, Lord Franklin's passage and Ernest Shackleton's indispensable banjo player, this ep is so cool it's sub-zero. Plus, it really felt like there was a fourth presenter, silently following us across the Antarctic* tundra... *Or was it the Arctic? Edited by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laurence Hisee⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Join the LoreFolk at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠patreon.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ko-fi.com/loremen⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check the sweet, sweet merch here... ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.teepublic.com/stores/loremen-podcast?ref_id=24631⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @loremenpod ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠youtube.com/loremenpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.instagram.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.facebook.com/loremenpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Hulu original series Furious is coming to Disney Plus, starring Emmy Rossum. Furious follows FBI agent Alice Black on the hunt for a mysterious and calculating serial killer. Both walk their own paths toward justice, and as their lives start to intertwine, the line between right and wrong begins to blur. Don't miss the three-episode premiere of the Hulu original series Furious on July 27th, only on Hulu on Disney Plus. My name is Peter Parker, but I'm also... Spider-Man.

This July... We're faced with a threat. That can be anyone. The world may have forgotten Peter Parker. I'm just a neighbor, friendly neighbor. But he hasn't forgotten them. Sometimes Spider-Man has to do the hard thing. That's my responsibility.

Dr. Banner? I didn't know you could get that big. Spider-Man, brand-new day. In theaters, July 31st. Welcome to Lawmen, a podcast about local legends and obscure curiosities from Days of Yore. With me, Alastair Beckett King. And me, James Shakeshaft.

And I haught you there, Mr Shakeshaft. Oh, avast, Maharty? James, I hope you have not got your jilay on, because it is far too warm for that. Is it? Even if I was only wearing a jillet, it would be too hot. It would be too much. Nonetheless, I have a chilling set of tales from Weird Antarctica for your perusal. Oh, yes, please.

With Deputy Gas Lawperson and Scummy Mum, Ellie Gibson. Yes. Take the icy plunge with me. Hey there, James. Hi, Alistair. I'm affecting a stage whisper, and you know what that means. Yes. We've got a guest on the podcast.

Oh, yes. Are you a little bit warm there, James? I'm too hot. Has the heat wave reached you in Oxfordshire? It has big time. I've broken out the emergency flannels. Okay. Now, is that a piece of clothing or just wet cloths?

Just a wet cloth. Every family member is issued during heatwaves with a wet cloth. that they need to lay upon their body. Don't think about James' body being rubbed down with a wet cloth, listener. It's simply draped. It's just draped. It's just a moist cloth.

It's just a moist cloth draped on a hairy man. What's wrong with that? Guys, come on. Jeez. Well, don't worry, because the icy wit and cool subject matter that our guest is bringing today will take the heat right off.

And I don't know, I kind of think I've made you sound quite bad. Anyway, it's Ellie Gibson. Hi, Ellie. Hi. Do I not have to whisper as well? You don't have to whisper. No, in fact, it's not allowed for you. No, we gave up on the whisper. You have to talk normally. Very quickly. I can imagine. No, thank you for having me. I'm very pleased to be here.

And I do find that in the heat, talking about the polls, as in the places, not the nation, definitely helps with just thinking about icy things. Before we kick off, let me reel off some of your achievements, Ellie. Hit podcaster with Scummy Mummies, the podcast about parent. and being revolting people, I believe, is the premise of that. Well, he sort of started out about parenting, but that was 13 years ago, and we can't be bothered. We don't really want to talk about happiness anymore.

The kids just got quite easy to deal with, and now it's just quite laid back. I wouldn't say that. It's more that you sort of swap Haribow and Octanauts for them asking for a vaping what the thing is. But that's, you know, something for you to look forward to, James. Sorry. Thank you. Are we not supposed to be rude on this podcast?

No, no. What we'll do is we'll bleep that, and then people will be like, what is happening in that house. Nobody will know exactly what verb you said. But it's not in Octanaut. That's all they need to know. It's absolutely, not in any episode I've seen. It's in the lost episode, but you have to look really deep on the dark web for that. And of course, the listener might well know you from your career as a games journalist. I just read your very, very funny in-depth review of Games Master, the classic 90s. We're on a gantry TV show about Everything was on a gantry in the 90s. Every British TV show came from a gantry, and I've been re-watching clips of it

and enjoying Dominic Diamond saying, lovely games, playing, good to play some lovely games, because he's being a big macho 90s TV presenter, but here's the voice of a Scottish granny. Oh, it was good times, yeah. No, yeah, I was, I would work at you again for a long time, and then I was on, like, that Dara O'Brien's go eight bit,

or as I like to reprimson's Go 8bit. With featuring, featuring, a guest feature, Darrow O'Brien, yeah. Yes, that's right. He was on it sometimes, yeah. Yeah. And now I still do a bit of games to do Twitch and that. Oh, yeah. What are your games, what games are you gaming? At the moment, we just started gaming James Bond.

So we started playing that on Friday. But one of the things we like to do on my stream is when we start a new game, we always like to read the NJ user licensing agreement in full, just to make sure everybody's on board. That's good. We're all okay. We need to know whether we can play it on an oil rig or a cross-channel. or ferry. It's things like that.

Yeah. If it's going to go on Games Master reboot as well, should that happen, you need to know if it could be on an oil rig or a prison? Yeah. So we started streaming that on Friday and literally spent a full hour reading out the Yula and debating it. And then we were like, right, let's start the game. So I pressed X and then it opened up the privacy policy. So we got another 20 minutes reading that. Oh, the chat going wild. Yes. Oh, people were losing it. It was better than Kennedy Shoehl. Well, I mentioned that it's hot and you were bringing us something cold.

Now, I got confused. Now, I think that you're to blame, Ellie. You sent me a message saying, I'm in the Arctic. Yes. And that's how, that's the reason you're on the podcast. Explain what happened. So, yes, I sent you a message saying I'm on a boat in the Arctic and you thought I was a fraudster. And I double down by saying.

Yes. Like someone says, Mum, I've lost my phone. It's like a very weird start. I'm not going to send you. you any money, even if you are in the Arctic. Anyway, the point was, I was on the boat, and I was seasick for a little bit. So I was lying down in my cabin, and I was listening to your excellent podcast. Eleanor and Alistair read that?

Oh, no. Yeah, yeah, exactly. My other, my lesser-known podcast, Lawmen. The other excellent one, yes. Oh, yeah, you should go on it, if only goes away. Yes, and then I thought, well, I've got Alistair Beckett King's phone number. I'll just message him and say, I think I should go on your podcast. but I wanted to talk about Antarctica

because I went there a couple of years previously and got, I fell down a real wormhole of, some might call it a hyperfocus of learning loads of stuff about how weird Antarctica is and weird stuff that's happened there and I ended up pitching a book to someone about Antarctica and me and everything and they rejected it summarily

but that's not the point. I thought let's recycle that unwanted material on your podcast you lucky lucky boys Yes. And naturally, I got confused and researched the Arctic. So we've got a very polar episode. They're so far apart, but they're both cold. What's the difference really, apart from them being literally opposite ends of the globe?

Bears, I think, and penguins, right? Because the Arctic has bears. Yes. And the Antarctic means no bears. That's right. That's very good. You have been on Wikipedia. I think Arctic, yeah, I think it just means bear.

Barry. There's bears here. An Arctic truck, like an Arctic glory is full of bears. No wonder they're so dangerous. That's what it's a roll of a bear game. They were originally made from Arctic bears. It's absolutely right. They took the bears out because of political correctness. Oh, bloody won't flakes. Yeah, there you go. Wow.

Well, while I try and drop my North Pole-related facts into your story, why don't you set off, tell us some stuff about the, the, the, weird, the weird uncanny Antarctic. Well, the big uncanny thing that I think most people have heard of about the Antarctic is like Shackleton and his third man. Are you familiar with this? Yes. No.

No. I'm familiar with Ernest Shackleton and, of course, his brother, sarcastic Shackleton. Which was the first ever online sketch I did. And it absolutely bombed. Nobody enjoyed that bit of wordplay. That's a wonderful bit of wordplay. Socastic Shackleton was like, oh, brilliant, pack ice. Fantastic.

That's great. I'd say that would have gone down a storm on the MS fridge off Nansen when I was out there. You would have had a receptive crowd, let me tell you. So Shackleton, so in case he was like this bloke from, he was originally from Ireland. He and I have a lot in common, actually, because he was originally from Ireland, and I'm not by Irish heritage. And then he moved when he was 10, he moved to Sidham, which is very near where I live, and he grew up in Sidham.

and his father also wished he had chosen a more sensible career path, much like mine. So, even though my dad was also a comedian. I was going to say, your dad's a comedian. I met your dad. And look where it's got him. So, rodeying for me. That's been his career highlight. So there we go.

So that was Shackleton. And then, yes, and then he did these trips to the Antarctic. And famously, he went there with this ship called The Endurance. And they ended up getting stuck there. they got stuck in the ice and then they had to get off the ice because they're off the boat because the ship sank and this was like this went on for like years and then they had to sail to elephant island then he had to leave a load of lads on elephant island when he well he went off to try and get help from the whalers which he did and he had to hike 800 miles it was all like there's

whole films about it with kenniff bannerin if you couldn't stand him so um you know you can you can um speaking of the endurance yes now it was on that trek that so when he was treking across um the island to try and get help that he was with these other two men. And they all said afterwards, they didn't talk about it during the hike, but they said afterwards that they all sensed the present of actually a fourth man. So there was three of them, and they all felt like there was this fourth companion walking alongside them. And then as soon as they reached the whaling station, he just sort of disappeared. Was it Jesus?

It's usually Jesus in these situations. Or was it a psychological manifestation? It's just so hard to know, isn't it? How many sets of footprints were there? Was he wearing sandals? Because that's inappropriate for the weather. They had inappropriate. Well, they were wearing their normal, like, boots.

They obviously didn't have, like, they couldn't go to millet. But before they left, the carpenter... You're not wearing your face jackets or anything. No, no militz on Elephant Island. Not so much as a Kendall Mintcake between them. And before they left the other dudes, the carpenter banged some nails into shableness. Sackleton's boots so that he could have like grip on the ice. Like it's mental.

From the inside going out, I hope. Well, are you worried about, is it like with fences? It depends which way the nails go. Who owns it? Which is whether they just nailed his feet to his shoes or just gave him placing these spikes. Yeah. Hopefully he took them off before this happened. But Jesus would have been able to assist because he had a similar issue.

Yeah, he had a lot of. A carpentry background. Similar podiatry issue. Yes. So it was a fourth man But then it became the third man Because T.S. Eliot wrote about it in the wasteland But famously T.S. Eliot was a great writer but shit at maths

Like all great writers And he got it wrong and said it was a third man And it was played by Orson Wells Awesome Wells, yes in the film Awesome Wells That's what I like to call him So that's sort of the sort of spooky Shackleton thing

And everyone, you know, goes on about how brilliant Shackleton was basically and oh he did you know and all right he did all these things he never actually reached the south or the north pole basically he didn't but he did keep these i mean to be fair if he started in antarctica i'm not surprised he didn't reach the north but he didn't reach the south no he had a couple of goes um and you know he is hailed as a sort of hero but i think uh he's a terrible and here's why uh do we get in the believe oh no no it's not the worst one i'd say i'd say it's in the top five though probably but anyway. Can I say

you're going to have to bleep that as well? Just bleep it. What do you reckon, James? Probably. That's fine. Yeah. I'm just going to say... I think it's funny to just bleep it. I'm going to say Shackleton was a very silly man. There you go. How's that?

I'm going to bleep that and he's going to sound like you said he was a silly. What? What is she saying? We're just going to believe the name. Yeah. So, yeah, so Shackleton. So he married this woman called Emily. First of all, he was a silly man when he was dating Emily. He was chatting her up and I think he might be proposing in her house and he left his cigarette on her oak mantle piece and

nearly burned the house down. Do you want to go to the bottom of the world with this man? A man who can't use an ashtray. But he can easily light a fire. I mean. And if you're on the problem wasn't that it was too cold in that living room, was it? It was that it was too hot. I think by the time they went to the Antarctic, he'd switched to vaping, so it wasn't a risk. So, so yeah, so he asked Emily to marry him and she, she stupidly did. And then she, two days after the birth of their second child, so she gives birth to Cecily, right on the 23rd of December, 1906. On Christmas Day, 1906, he's like, by the way, love, I'm going to go to Antarctica. I'm going to leave for literally years.

She's literally holding the baby. I'm just going to go off now. I've got the funding. Like, it was all tucked in. That, you know, that's not, that's not okay. That's not, as a parenting expert, you don't approve of that. I strongly disagree. As a Christmas expert, I'm dubious as well.

Yeah. That's not Christmas news. What's Ernest got me for Christmas? Is it maybe some Lindor balls or a nice Paschmina? No, he's telling me that he's going to the bottom of the world. probably to certain death. No, he's going to go and eat his own leg or something. Yeah.

Awful. Did he replace the cracker joke with that statement? I don't get it. I don't get it. In the Christmas pudding, instead of a sixpence, he hid a little ice axe, and that was hopefully, it was really nice. So not only that, he was a terrible philanderer, Schackleton. I think he should actually...

Look up your penguins. Yes. Well, I think he should be called Shacky, as in he was always doing it. on the bathroom floor with... It was him. So he had not one but four other women. Was it? I can't remember three or four. He had...

He shacked up with four other women. He did. Wow. Wow. And who was that fourth man? It wasn't him. Who was the other bloke in that shaggy video? There was another bloke.

Rick Rock. Was it? Rick Rock, I believe, was the other artist in It Wasn't Me. Oh, so Rick Rock was the fourth man. And his cousin is Rick Roll? Best Google it. I'd best Google that. I can't believe a man, I can't believe one of our national heroes, or indeed Ireland's national heroes would turn out to be a bit of a wronging

when you look into the details. I mean, it would be like, imagine finding like, yeah, a great British figure. You know, it'd be like finding out that, you know, the king of our country had had an affair for years and years with a woman he later married and made queen. that would be, oh, that'd be shocking, wouldn't it? Absolutely outrageous. And then there was Janet, who she used to lend him loads of money, so that's great.

And then there was Hope, who he named Mount Hope after. What? What? I mean, there's cheating and then there's cheating. Come on. I mean, yeah. You're naming mountains after your flusies. I'd be furious if I was whatever his wife was called.

Exactly. So, yeah, so Emily, she, So then he went off and he did all this and then he got lost and all this stuff. Anyway, the point is he promised that every time he came back from Antarctica that he would never go again and then obviously he just he just did. Bloody shacking. Once a cheetah who goes to Antarctica, always a cheetah who goes to Antarctica. That's exactly right.

Yeah. Antarctic me once, shame on me. Antarctica me twice. Antarctica to the fourth man. Yeah, can't get a... in tactics again. No. But Emily was very tolerant,

much more tolerant than I would have been and famously said how could you keep an eagle tied up in your backyard to which I would say don't get an eagle, Emily, just get a house.

It's going to pick up your eyes. You're not Kez, Emily. Just, you're not in Kess. Just get a normal pet. So, yeah. And he, so he announced that he was going on the endurance and 5,000 people applied

to go on it, including three women, but obviously, you know. Wow. He was like, are they hoties? If not, no way. Exactly. He was like, send me... No mingers. That was his one rule.

Yeah. He's like, send me a pick or GTFO. That's what he said. Bloody shacky. But he picked people, not on the basis of like how good they were at reading maps or smashing up eyes, but like whether he just sort of thought they were good characters. He picked one man because he looked funny.

This is a real sort of stag-do approach to the pole. It really is. And he picked, the meteorologist he picked said, can't say that meteorologist, said, can I bring my banjo? Now, what is the obvious answer to that question? Get off my ship. Exactly, James. No.

No, let's start a hoe-down, lads. This is sounding better and better. Does he bring two? No, lads, lads, lads. One for the fourth guy. I don't know if I can bring my Very good I can do a little

Yeah On washboard Or playing one of those Boom boom boom T-chest basses We're going to do an Antarctic Quartet But there's no Where's the baseline coming from?

I mean Can you think of a worse instrument To be stuck on a boat with Than a banjo I think maybe the bagpipes Maybe bagpipes I think deliverance has a lot to answer for In terms of our association

of banjo music with impending horribleness. Because it's a fine instrument. If you want a really much sort of louder, more piercing version of the guitar, the banjo is available. It's quite an annoying tone. Like, it's quite whiny.

Yeah. It's the sort of chihuahua of, of, like, guitar-y type instruments, isn't it? Yeah, it's the Daphne and Celeste of Girl bands of the 90s, the banjo, I think. It's not for me. I don't want to show off, but my one's got retweeted by Daphne and Celeste. You didn't.

Yeah, no, I did. Was it the Shackleton sketch? Yeah, no, they're mad. They're mad about the South Pole. What did they retweet? I did a tweet saying, because they were doing a comeback. They did a comeback album, which was kind of funny and ironic, and made fun of pop music, which I thought was quite a funny idea.

But I said I would never forgive them for sticking not only me, but both of my parents. and they retweeted them. So I thought, I got a sense of humor about themselves. Well, I see your Daphne and Celeste retweet and I raise you. I was wished happy birthday on Twitter twice, two consecutive years,

by Oxide and Neutrino. Oh. Very impressive. That's nice. And why? Do they wish everyone a happy birthday or are you special? Because I'm obviously a big fan, like all right thinking people.

That casualty sample is just one of the best produced piece of music ever made. And Big Bad Tom A from my Twitch community, he messaged them and asked them to wish me happy birthday. Oh, that's lovely. Yeah, it's really, really sweet. Who needs a telegram from the Queen?

This is what I'm saying. I undercut all of these by the fact that the other day on the Elizabeth line in London, I saw Mr Motivator. Oh. With a partner. So, yes, there is a Mrs.

motivator. Wow, incredible. And so yeah, and the banjo, right, so when they had to, when the ship was, the ship had gone in the ice and they were like, we've got to get on these little boats and we obviously need to take as little stuff as possible. They got rid of like everything. Like, even the Nintendo Switch, they were like, we can't, even if it is portable screen. But Shackleton was like, no, we've got to get rid of all our stuff.

And to demonstrate like how serious he was, he threw his goal. watch and his gold cigarette case and two gold sovereigns into the snow, which I think actually is a bit ostentatious. How much gold was this guy? It was just like a rapper there, up until that point, laden with gold. Yes. Why was he taking it to the Antarctic? It was like, was it expecting to come across a welcome break, pick up a phone charger

and a subway? I don't know. Yeah. Or just maybe pawn it. If they run out of money, you can go to one of those cash for gold places and just hand it over. get some ready money. This is a digression, but did you know?

I once met Buster Rhymes' gold holder. Do you want to hear that story? Yes, please. So I was at an Xbox party years and years ago where, you know, when Xbox, like, they were just wiping their bums on $50 bills, like it was menthol. Back when they had employees, yes. Yes.

And consoles. Yes. And fans. And it was such an exclusive party that, Simon from Blue was there. He kissed me on the cheek, but that's another. Jeez Louise. Because I told him I liked both his albums. Anyway, and then, and then I was a bit drunk. And I got talking to this guy, so Buster Rhymes was at the party, but he was sort of surrounded by like, cooler people than me. You couldn't really get near him. But I got talking to this guy

who was standing it there and he had just his hand on this rucksack, this big black rucksack. And I got chatting to him. And he had a very strong American accent. So I said, oh, what do you do? And he went, oh, I went for Boston Rams. And I thought he said, the Boston Rams. So there's about five minutes of confusion with me going, oh, are they an American football team? And he going, I said, no, there is no Boston Rams.

And eventually. Every American sports team is just a place and then an animal. Yeah, exactly. The Denver cows. Exactly. There you go. There's one. so and then eventually I learned that he I won't do the accent for the whole thing he um his job he'd

known Buster Rhymes since he was a kid right so Buster Rhymes really trusted him and his job was to go with Buster Rhymes wherever he went around the world on the private jets everything and carry Buster Rhymes's gold all wrapped in tissue paper in this rucksack in case there was some sort of global economic meltdown or apocalypse Buster Rhymes would have hard currency wherever he went Wow, so he's not like burying it under the floorboards in his house or keeping it under the bed in the mattress. He's just got a guy holding it in a rucksack at all times. He's got a gold holder.

And that was this man's job. And I said, I don't believe you. Because I was in my 20s. I'd been told a lot of things by a lot of men by then. And I was like, yeah, whatever. But then he opened the bag and opened a bit of tissue paper and showed me a bit of Buster Rimes' is gold. this sounds like a terrible gold holder

yeah I was going to say that that is exactly what you don't want a gold holder to do when someone says I don't believe you please show me the gold let me see this gold I feel like a drunk female 27 year old games journalist from Lewisham probably did not pose a massive I suppose yeah because even if you grab

if you manage to grab it and run away this guy plays for the Boston Rams so he's gonna be he's quick he's going to tackle you to the ground immediately The Legend of Busters gold. Incredible. So, anyway. That was so good.

I don't know how you're going to cut. Because I know you're going to want to cut that out for time, James, and put that on the Patreon. But I think that should go in the episode. I think it should. Just making that clear that I think that's episode worthy. Absolutely. You're very welcome. But back to Shackie.

So, yeah. The other Shack. Yeah, the original Shack. I don't need any of this stuff. He's taking a picture of his wife and just ripping it up saying, too. I'm leaving that behind. Yeah, exactly. Like at this point, they're shooting dogs.

They're shooting like Mrs. Chippy, the Chips Cat, all of that. It's all horrible. And the spring is gold in the snow saying we can't even, I can't even take my gold watch, lads. That's how serious this is. We can't have any extra weight on these little boats. And the meteorologist... He's throwing his gold holder overboard.

His childhood friend. We don't need you anymore. And then the meteorologist says, oh, well, then I better say goodbye to my banjo. And Shacky, goes, no, no, keep the banjo. What? Of all the implements that have been mentioned

over, that's the only one that would double up as a paddle. So it may be. Maybe there was some logic. Or a fine, man in a real emergency. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. What about the guy that looked funny? Was he already been abandoned?

Even the guy that's just here because he looks funny. He's gone. No, they need it. They've eaten the guy who looks funny at this point. Did he taste funny? Yeah. He had four buttocks, so he was really nutrition. That's a lot of meat on this funny guy.

So again, if I was Butterpour sailor who just signed up for this exposition because I saw an advert in the paper, and I saw Shackleton throwing actual gold money into the snow, but then going, not the banjo, though, I'd be upset. I would be cross. So anyway. So you see the gold holder, yeah. So again, anyway, they said,

survived all this nonsense then he went to the antarctic again a couple of times and then he died and then but obviously his legend lives on perhaps most famously because of his all his philandering and his like five wives or whatever it was um he was glorified forever by benny hill with the song ernie the fastest milkman in the west which is actually based on ernest shackleton not a lot of people know that really yeah that's a good shack fact yeah it was originally he wrote it as Ernie the fastest unsuccessful polar explorer in the south But for the budget they couldn't afford a ship for the shoot So he was like, let's just reframe it, let's make it a milk float

Just make it an old one, yeah? Yeah, it makes sense. Wow. So that's my, that's my shack facts. That's good shack facts. Would you like to pop over to the North Pole and hear about another ill-fetched expedition? While we're here in the Antarctic, let's go to the Arctic.

Yes, now you've enjoyed my shack facts and my moral judgment. Well, I think these guys are going to make Shackleton look really wise and judicious. Okay. Because his ship was called The Endurance, but Lord Franklin's ships were called the Erebus and the Terror. Who's getting on a ship called The Terror? And Erebus is, I looked up Erebus. It's the spirit of darkness. Oh my gosh.

Did he bring someone along because he looked scary? Well, in the TV series The Terror, Captain Crozier of the Erebus is played by Jared. Harris. Oh yeah, he is, yes. Who is quite, and he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's a, he's, I think he's Northern Irish, I can't remember what accent he's doing, but he's the sensible one who keeps saying, we shouldn't tail the ship's end of the ice, it'll be, it'll be, it'll be, it'll be, chilly, it'll be too chilly, and they sail into the ice anyway, and then they all die. Great, great show, the Terra, James, you recommended it to me, and then I found out you had stopped watching. Yes, I recommended the first two episodes, and then I'd, I'd,

dropped off. Did it, did it, did it finish as good as it started? It's very, very good. Okay, okay, I'm going to tell you this, it's got, for my money, the funniest scene ever televised. This is a bit of a spoiler, except that we know that in real life, Lord Franklin's expedition was lost with all hands, so they all definitely die. Franklin dies in the series, and all they get back of him is his leg. Oh. And then they have a funeral for the leg. Oh. And there's a shot of the coffin. Oh. Is it a leg-sized coffin? Is it a leg-sized coffin? Or is it?

Yeah, did they have to... You know when you get an Amazon package that's too big and they put brown paper in? Did they do that? There's a full-sized coffin with just... And they're all being so serious because they're all the greatest, you know, the best British actors working now.

And they're all being really serious and then it just cuts to the coffin. I don't... It's so funny. I had to stop the show. I laughed for 10 minutes. I don't know much about the norms of the time, but I would say for that,

I wouldn't do an open car skit. That seems... He seems silly. Did they at least put... He seemed smaller than I remembered. Did they put a nice sock on it? Maybe like a nice shoe. It's like tied up with a bow at the top.

It's really beautifully done. What's their trouser? No, well, it was more sort of breaches times. So they didn't just have a bit of sort of hollow trouser, no. Like you've got to watch this show. It's very good, very scary. But it's a bit aside. No, they're ridiculous names for shit.

Imagine if P&O in the show. instead of like the pride of Normandy the pride of abject fear. The shame of skegness. So I was looking at Dr. Shane McCorostey's 2010 book, The Spectral Arctic, which is interesting because it was written in 2010, which was a few years before the wrecks of the Erebus

and the terror were actually finally found and the mystery was resolved. But this book was about the psychic attempts to work out what was going on because, of course, the ships were lost and nobody could get any word back. So Lord Franklin, if you don't know, was trying to find the Northwest Passage,

basically a way of sailing around the Americas via the north because it's very long America, you know, the continent. You've got to go all the way down to South America. And it would be a huge, huge trading route. It would be fantastic if you could sail around the top. Find the NWK. Because it's too cold. Oh.

Yeah, but they wanted to see if they could find a route. It wasn't really mapped. And so it was very important. and then they got lost and nobody knew where they were, except for Emma L, the C-R-S of Bolton, who was a psychic who was able to make connection with the travellers using her psychic abilities.

She was described by Harriet Martino as a vulgar girl, anything but handsome and extremely ignorant. That's actually almost worth to work when my Edinburgh reviews, so that's fine. It's so relatable, isn't it? Isn't it? We are all the CRS of Bolton. And she was mesmerized by a man called Joseph W. Haddock.

What? Yeah, not a captain. I'm sorry, James. Unfortunately, just a... Listering Blue Barber. Just a landlubber. Joey Haddock's. And working from a sample of Franklin's handwriting and hair,

she followed the Lost Mission, basically live tweeting what they were up to for people in England. And she got... some stuff right. She described, well, she said lots of the men were dead, which fair play. Fair play for the aspect they were. In terms of lucky guesses, do you know what I mean? A lot of this is something you could have guessed. She described bodies buried in shells, which was the name for the cheap coffins that they would bury people in. But she said Franklin was alive and clothed in rough skins. She correctly described him as being bald,

which is the last thing you want in the Arctic. And she could see their... Apparently she could see their watches, even though she couldn't really tell the time, but she was able to set the hands on a watch to what she could see to work out where they were. And she maintained that... What? How?

Well, because she could, she could through psychic powers, see his watch. Right. But they didn't have time zones, did they? Well... Well... Well... Apparently they did. She said that they were seven hours behind.

Bolton from that was what she claimed Which is where the Meridian line was at that time if you remember in Bolton meantime Well I'm no expert in Lottongitude or latitude You can barely even say the words I really struggled to say the words

That was like take three And I still couldn't say longitude Longitude Longitude But the place where the terror was found Is seven hours different from us So she was right about that. But that's like me saying,

oh, I think he's in America and everyone going, oh my God, America's seven hours time difference from us. I mean, yeah. Yeah, I mean, yes, you're absolutely right because they showed her a map to ask, you know, where are they? And here's the quote,

a map being shown to her, she put her finger upon Prince Regent's inlet. Hello. Thank you. saying Sir John Franklin is there, which again is basically like she pointed to northern Canada. Because it's like that's quite a lot. She was about 300 miles away from where the ship was eventually found, which to me, a British guy seems like a long way off. But to Americans, that probably seems like where the nearest 7-Eleven is.

Basically there, yeah. Yeah, so basically maybe she was right, maybe she was wrong. Apparently she took down letters. it must have been annoying for Franklin because she was talking to them, supposedly, and he was sending messages back. Imagine you're at work and you're just being bothered by this unattractive, invisible Boltonian woman.

Just cold calling you. Yeah. And she would write the letters down on her arms invisibly, and then again another quote. She professes to read the result of her right arm, pouring it forth with extreme volubility and considerable incoherence. Why is she writing on her arm? Because in the psychic state, I guess she didn't have any paper, but she wasn't really writing on her arm.

She was just mining writing on her arms. Oh, I see. So I do think there was a lot of guessing going on there. But before I wrap up on Franklin's ill-fated quest to find the Northwest Passage, would you like to guess where in 2016 the terror was finally found? Prince Regent's outlet, which is like the sort of knockoff. The other end of the inlet. That's the cheeps shop where you get the sort of. of end of season sales.

No. I mean, you're not far off. About 300 miles off if you're guessing Prince Regent's inlet. Just north of the Isle of Man. It was just close.

No, not really, but it was near King William Island in a place called Terror Bay. Ah. Ah. Which is named after the terror, but was named that

over a hundred years before they found the terror there. What? What are you doing? But it was named after the terror had disappeared. It was named after the lost ship that was there and nobody found it for 100 years. To be fair, it was at the bottom of the sea. It was, it was under, oh, it was very underwater.

Right, okay, that makes more sense. It was so underwater. Because I was imagined it stuck in the ice and they named the bay and just ignore the ship, ignore the ship, right? Nobody, we don't know what that is. Nobody knows what that's called. We just call it the thing. also a scary thumb set in the ice

and the aerobus was also found in 2014 yeah so they all died of of cold and uh being too cold

and being too cold not having Jesus with them sounds like mm hmm wasn't there something as well with their food the tins weren't soldered properly I think I read

so that they got lead poisoning there is a hypothesis yeah that they were all going I think that is folded into the terror that the badly packed the badly, um, badly, um, badly stored tins were driving them all mad. This is why, as I said to my son on his Duke of Edinburgh, you know, pot,

noodle over Freibentos every time, son. Yeah, here's your banjo. Off your go. Yeah. Here's your banjo. And here's like, five thousand pounds and a gold watch. If you get lost, just throw them away. Is that funny looking good, good, good.

Something to look at. Something to look at on the cold nights. No, that's, that's my son. Oh yeah, by the way, listener, if you're in a party to the Antarctic and you can't see any funny looking person, oh, it's you. You are a belligerent Boltonian woman. Do you want another fun ship's name fact?

I don't even know if you'll be able to include in the main episode. Uh-oh. So do you know who was the first female sea captain? No. Why should you? Because you're terrible sexists. It was, obviously. It was Betsy Miller. She became the first sea captain in 1792 after basically all her brothers drowned.

So obviously very sad, but they wouldn't have made great sea captains anyway, clearly. And for 30 years, she ran a cargo ship between Air Shear and Ireland. She paid off all her dad's debts. She lived until she was 70. And then she gave over command to her sister Hannah. So obviously she's brilliant and her ship, can you guess what it was called? Ooh, you said that we might not be able to broadcast it.

I'm wondering if it's something terribly rude now. It begins with the letter C. Okay. Very exciting. Is it where Coonard came from and they kind of, is there some sort of shortening going on? It's good, but it's not right, James. Okay.

It was called the Clytus, or sometimes spout. by the newspapers C-L-I-T-U-S that was the name of the ship of the first female sea captain so there you go very I mean also possibly a premise

for a apart from the fact that they were sisters a premise for a sort of saucy self-published novel I think Hannah and Betsy yeah on the on the clitus so there you go

wowzes so that's just a little taste of the North Pole Shall we return to the South Pole, Ellie? Have you got anything nasty for us? Let's go south and let's go to the modern day. I wanted to talk about a weird crime in Antarctica. There have been a few crimes over the years. For example, there was, in 1984, there was some arson

where this doctor on this Argentinian station was told he had to do another whole year in Antarctica and he didn't want to do another year, so he just burned it down. Wow. Wow. I don't know if you've ever done that. I just left a cigarette on the mantelpiece.

I don't know if you've ever done that to get out of a job, but I thought, I definitely felt that way when I work in Forest Hill Sainsbury's. But anyway, so that was that. But this is my favourite Antarctic crime, okay, so 2018. Speaking of Arctic temperatures, Forest Hill Sainsbury's, how cold is it in there? It's absolutely. I'm wearing shorts. I can't survive.

Freezing cold. Just go to Liddle. It's broken in there. So the 2018 Bellinghausen station, right? So you've got these Russians, you've got engineer, Sergei, Savitskyy, and the the welder Oleg Beloguzov, I hope I'm saying, right, and probably not. So they were together, they absolutely hated each other these men, they just didn't get on, but they were stuck together for four years, which, you know, anyone who's ever been married knows that's a difficult

situation, isn't it? That is tricky. And so they were, and then it all sort of came to a head because apparently Beloguzov kept giving away the endings of books that Zabitsky were reading. Yes. Oh, wow, that is trolling. So this is like pre-kindles. You know, there's only a limited number of books on this station. And he kept going, oh, he dies at the end.

And one day, Savitsky just couldn't take it anymore. And he stabbed him with an ice axe. Wow. I mean, that's some serious provocation. I mean, what do we think? Is that in any way understandable? I don't think.

There is a sort of, It is bad. We do condemn... Murder. Spoilers. Murder on this podcast. Oh, right. And spoiler.

Yeah, you're right. We do also avoid spoilers. Well, we can, except for that one about the leg in the terror. Mm-hmm. It's really good. And Transformers a movie. And Transforms the movie. And Back to the Future.

And, yeah, the entire plot of Back to the Future. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah, so I think we have to condemn murder because if you kill people for doing spoilers, then we are in big trouble. Yeah. Yeah. Now, the law in Antarctica is that if you commit a crime in Antarctica, you must face the law of your own country.

Because obviously Antarctica was going to say law of the penguins. Law of the penguins. Law of the penguins. You have to face the law of the penguins. Yeah, no, you have to slide. It's like ducking with witches. You have to slide off an iceberg and if you die, then you did it. No, you have to go back and face justice in your own country. So they had to go, he went back to Russia. He survived this guy. He survived the staff. So they'd go back to Russia. Oh, good, good.

Spoiler. Yeah. And then there was obviously a court case. And in the court case, Beloghazov, so the victim came to Savitsky's defence and filed a motion asking for the case to be dismissed because he was like, look, dude, seriously, I get it. You try spending four years in an Antarctic research station

with someone who's just told you that Neville dies at the end of Harry Potter. that is Spoilers Don't think he does die actually Don't think he does Anyway the point is No one's finished I think he does

Spoilers Yeah so the judge And the judge went Never gonna watch it Yeah Drop the case All good Another

Another case of sort of classic lad banter Yeah In the South Pole There Just banter that went A bit too far And someone got stabbed But it was just all in good fun

I have Sorry I have a question Because I was imagining the twist would be that it would get thrown out because he hadn't been spoiling the books, he'd just been making up stuff and saying

that's what happens at the end. And would that still count? I don't think the law would account for that, James. I do think the stabbing would probably still stand spoiler law. In the realm of spoiler,

if you're making stuff up, is that? You're right, yeah. If you make it up, is it a spoiler? Good question. I think we might have to refer to the handsaw for that one. I'm not sure how that works. Yeah, we just have to read the end user license agreement just to see where we stand on that one. Absolutely.

Yeah, so dropped the case. And so Savitsky was free to go. But he did complain later in an interview that he found it really, really hard to get a job saying, who needs a man branching a knife in Antarctica? You've got to diversify. You've got to look at transferable skills, Oleg. Imagine the interview though. I'm the knife guy.

Yeah, and why did you leave your last job? Well. It's a funny story, actually. Can you tell me about a difficult situation in a previous employment and how you dealt with it? Well, okay, so you know how we all ate spoilers? Yeah, what are your hobbies reading? I'm a big reader.

I'm a big reader. Do you have any stabbings for us? Avid reader and stabber. And they had to read because they weren't allowed to play chess because chess was banned from all Antarctic, Russian Antarctic stations in 1959 after a scientist murdered his opponent with an axe. So after that, it was like no chess. It's not the chess is it.

Sheff doesn't kill people, axes do. Russians, people. It's Russians is the problem, seemingly. Wow. Russians were blades. You'd think Russians would be quite used to sort of austerity and cold temperatures, but apparently not. No. I guess that's my completely inaccurate stereotype there. Have you ever had a big fight over a chess game?

I've had some quite big fights over risk and monopoly, but, you know, not to the point of wanting to murder someone with an axe. No, we didn't, when I was a kid, we didn't understand the rules to risk because we didn't read the, they didn't read them properly. You'd never make this mistake. and so we didn't realize that if you win in risk you're allowed to keep going. It doesn't go on to the next player until you lose a battle. Yeah, that's the best bit.

But if you don't know that, the games last about 30 hours and are incredibly boring. Amazing. Yeah, I used to be in a risk club when I lived in Vietnam, which again is another story for another time. But we had to make a rule that we would never play more than two games. The first rule of risk club was you don't play more than two games of risk in an evening because by the third game, everyone was all adults, everyone was a little bit drunk and a bit tired and shouting and people start going, have you got any, have you got any axes? And then you have to draw a line of it. I can imagine there's a sort of ceiling fan going fum, fum, fum, fum, fum, fum,

overhead. It was exactly the sound of insects chirping, slatted, slatted blinds, light coming in through slatted blinds, sounds of very tense. And then we lock the loser in the tiger cage. It was a whole scene. Perfect. Stop playing the doors. So that's my Antarctic crime.

Do you want some penguin facts? Yeah, let's finish off with some penguin facts. I have been in front of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of penguins. And let me tell you this, they literally stink. They really, really stink. I mean, there's a lot of rotting fish lying around. There's a lot of, it's just unpleasant. It's really, really unpleasant.

and after about a week it's it's enough it's too much quite honestly and also they're absolute terrible lunatics and stupests oh really wow yes so you're talking about it as if you were gigging for an audience of penguins and it was a really bad show like the scumming on me's like oh it's sold out but they really stink it was yeah it was awful we're never we're never going there again they just heckled us the whole time very sexist but morgan freeman said they were kind. What does he know? I bet he hasn't been to Antarctica.

But he said in the film. March of the Penguins. What film? March of the Penguins. Oh, haven't seen it. It looks rubbish. You'll be amazed to hear the worst behaved penguins are the young male penguins. Who are called this.

I'm not making it. The official term is hooligan cocks he described them as. Yep. That's a bird term so we don't need to bleep. Yep. That's a literal thing, isn't it? So, first of all, obviously, this is not problematic. He said they engaged in homosexual behaviour and non-procreative sex,

which obviously there's nothing wrong with that. If we start saying there's things wrong with that. Penguin boys will be penguin boys. Yeah. Exactly. That's fine. No problem with that. And actually, once, when the kids were little,

me and my friend Steve took into London Zoo, and we were a bit bored while the kids were on the swings. So we looked at Grindr just to see what was going on in London Zoo. And most of the action is around the penguin enclosure. I'm not even, that's not a joke. I'm not making that half. But it's not the penguins. The penguins aren't, they don't have smartphones. It's not, but... Well, how do we know? We don't know. Yeah. But yes, they also engaged in the abuse of chicks and necrophilia.

Oh, no. Wow. It's not okay. And Douglas Russell, who is a modern day historian at the Natural History Museum, said the thing with penguins is that sperm is cheap. The birds will pretty much have sex with anything, which is an accusation that was leveled at, me and a couple of my friends at university, but that was a long time ago. Was that a business plan that didn't go through? It wasn't quite well thought out. Cheap sperm. Yes. So, yeah, penguins are droplet and they stink.

John Ruskin said, one can't be angry when one looks at a penguin. I can 100% tell you in the first person that's absolute nonsense. You can be furious. Yeah, Ruskin. You're talking nonsense Ruskin. Yet again, talking rubbish. Rubbish.

Rubbish Ruskin. That's what they call him. on rubbish. Well, thank you for those icy, chilly, weirdly sort of sexual stories. No, you're welcome. Of the Antarctic and some from the Arctic from me. Just to finish, I just want to say,

we should forget all these, all these, you know, all these, you know, Shackleton and Franklin. Never mind them. The real explorer we need to focus on is Hillary. No, not Sir Edmund. No. Blow your mind. Barbara.

Oh yeah. So Barbara Hillary was the first black woman to reach both the North and South Pole, and she did it at the age of 79. Yikes. Which Shackleton didn't even do? No, exactly. And he's got a movie. She grew up in Harlem.

She was a nurse for 55 years. She had breast cancer in her 20s. Then she had lung cancer in her 60s, which meant she had 25% less lung capacity than like most of us. But she was like, no, I'm going to go. That's what I'm going to do. She couldn't even ski. She had to learn to ski.

Wow. And they were like, oh, you can't ski. And she famously said, well, skiing was not a popular sport in Harlem. Yep, yeah. Wow. Which did remind me of when I came back from backpacking and I went to sign on at Lewisham Job Center. And they were like, oh, did you get any qualifications while you're abroad?

And I said, I'm a qualified scuba dive master now. And they went, right, right, we'll just put that into the computer. Nothing's coming up. And I was like, no. Yes. So, and then she died, Barbara Hillary, died comfy and warm, not in a terrible ice cave or on a boat. She died in her own bed in Queens at 88. Nice. She is my real polar hero. Never ate anyone's leg. Not one leg. Not a sausage of leg. Not a leg. Not a leg sausage. Should we score?

Okay. Our first category is names, James. Oof, there's some good ones. Barbara Hillary. Shack attack. Two first names. Yes. Joe Haddock. Yes, I liked that name. The CRS of Bolton.

Yes. And the Erebus, the Terra, the Terra Nova. Teranova, too. What was the name of that? What was the name of that? The Stabby station? The Stabby Ice Station. Hang on. It's Russian, so I can't remember it off my head.

It's very good. The Bellingshausen station with Beluguzov and Savitsky. Come on. Okay. I'm going to give it a... Classic Russian double act. Three? O straight men.

I give it three because it wasn't, apart from the Haddock there was nothing that made me chortle. Oh, come on. Okay. All right, whatever. Go on then. What else you got? All right.

Okay. Next category, supernatural. Ah. How could a woman from Bolton know anything? The argument basically was she was so stupid. She couldn't be making this up. Right. What about maybe Jesus, the third or fourth man?

What about Jesus? Yeah, Jesus. I feel like that does run me down the road of giving you three or four for a score. Maybe I should give you three, but it's like actually. a four when you look when you look away you think oh i think that should have been a four all right fair enough a three that should have been a four um we are rattling through the scores for time constraint reasons the next category james is icy reception oh very much what ellie received from those penguins yes very much what shackleton received from the poles hopefully what

Shackleton received from his wife. We can only hope, yes. Rightly so. The icy reception to the book Spoilering based bans was an ice pick reception. Yeah, absolutely.

So I think that's high. It's five. It's got to be five. Everyone received an icy reception. Final category then, and go with us on this, James, is pack ice. No need.

We've packed this banjo. Oh. So you've got to know what pack ice is for that to work. Yep. And you have to remember the banjo, which they did bring. It's wordplay, yeah. I hope they threw away any ice that they brought as well.

If they had brought ice. It would be ludicrous to pack ice. We're going to the Antarctic. Come on. Are you allowed to get that through security as well as it counts? Because it's not a liquid, is it? That's a really good. Yes.

So if you froze. a kilo of lighter fluid and just took it on his hand luggage what are you going to do? Can't touch me? Yeah. That's a good point. I did see a sign in an airport in Japan which really drilled down

into what's liquid means and it did have things like liquids that are currently a sort of jelly. You're not allowed that. No, sir. So, yeah, pack ice, I barely know ice. well, he's got to be five for the darn banjo.

It's a funny looking five though. It's like in a silly font. Yeah, that's why you like it, though, right? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. If I throw in a gold sovereign and a pocket watch and a cigarette case. Oh, yeah, that's consolidated the five. Yeah, we don't go above five.

But still, good try, good try. Ellie, thank you so much for sharing Spooky. whole mysteries with us. Oh, you're very welcome. Thank you very much for having me. If any publishers of weird books are listening, you should publish Ellie's book about the Antarctic. Definitely, please do. Are the Scummy mummies currently on tour? Can people catch a show?

Are you all sold out? Yes, we have a break for, I don't know, Scout. We have a break for the summer holidays because I can't do children and jokes, apparently. But then we're back in the autumn, October, November, and then we've got Christmas tour, and then we're writing a new show for next year. Oh, lovely. Because what else are we going to do?

Exactly. Oh, that was a lot of fun. Probably a few little offcuts there that you'll find in the bonus. There are definitely some slanderers and outrageous offcuts. Oh, massively. And enjoy those by going to patreon.com forward slash lawmenpod. And you can also join the Discord there with talk with like-minded law folk. Thank you very much to everyone already does do that.

And thank you very much to Lawrence for editing this episode. Yeah, and hop into the reviews and tell us which you think is best, Antarctic or Arctic. Oh, whoa, whoa. You're going to break the internet? That is my aim. And if we achieve one thing from this podcast, I would like it to be breaking the internet. Okay. Do the Ice Podcast Challenge.

The Ice Podcast Challenge is where you imagine cold things. Because there's a heat wave. Yes, exactly right. And British infrastructure can't handle it. Thank you.