Loremen Podcast - S3 Ep6: Loremen S3 Ep6 - The Ghost of Cuthbert Shields

Episode Date: January 30, 2020

This is a spooky one! Get a toasty body warmer on because your spine is about to be chilled. You'll need a gilet at least. We'd love to hear your 'Cuthbert Shields' names! When you've listened to the episode, leave your new name as a comment on iTunes and we'll read out our favourites on the show. Did you ever make a time capsule? What on earth did you put in it? Tell us on Twitter and we will judge you accordingly! @loremenpod www.instagram.com/loremenpod www.facebook.com/loremenpod @JamesShakeshaft | @MisterABK

Welcome to Lawmen, a podcast about local legends and obscure curiosities from days of yore. I'm James Shakeshaft. And I'm Alistair Beckett-King. And this week, it's the return of Cuthbert Shields. This takes place in Queen's College in Oxford. Fans of remembering thingsbert Shields. This takes place in Queen's College in Oxford. Fans of remembering things. Fans of remembering things. We'll remember this.

From the Christmas episode. They serve a boar's head at Christmas to commemorate a student who killed a boar with a book and the boar did a joke as it died. Didn't happen though, did it? What, a boar didn't say a joke in Greek? Just live a little. Open your eyes.

Yes, right then. Okay. This is one from the University City of Oxford. Oh, yeah, I've heard of it. Yeah. It's very much the Cambridge of Oxfordshire. It is, very much so. It's like Cambridge, but with sort of a crappy-looking 60s bit added onto it. I'm a fan of Oxford.

Some of the architecture there, like you've got some really good stuff and some god-awful stuff. There's at least one that looks like an alien spaceship landed, and I like that one. That's probably one of the good ones. They've got those sort of porthole 60s windows where they're slightly rounded at the edges. Oh, that's nice. They've got... They do have the Carfax

Tower. Oh, yes. Which, to me, when we moved there in the late 80s, sounded like the most futuristic tower in the world. A Carfax? Combining cars and fax machines. Yeah, exactly. Two most up-to-date technology. Yeah. But is that named after Carfax Abbey from Dracula?

It wasn't named after cars and faxes. I know that much. It's like the oldest building. That might be a Dracula connection, faxes. I know that much. It's like the oldest building. That might be a Dracula connection, though. Maybe. Check that out. Yeah, I will. Write in if you know, if you're from Oxford.

Well, hopefully someone from Oxford who will definitely know that will be listening. Okay. Because this story comes from the book, came to my attention in the book Haunted Oxford by Rob Walters. I don't know if you're sure of Robin or Robert, actually. That's why I corrected myself. I don't think we'll ever know. Well, we might do, because I've emailed him. Because this is a really good book, and I really enjoyed it, but he says in his introduction,

in essence, he's done lots of things, and he was like a ghost tour guide in Oxford for a bit, and he's collected his stories in this book, and he says in the introduction, one of these stories I've made up. Rob's got game. Yeah, I like

that. But he doesn't tell you which one. Nice. And I had to email him to check the one that I really liked and wanted to tell on the podcast wasn't the made up one. He assures me it's not. And I even slipped in the email. I wonder which one was it by the way? Didn't reply. Didn't reply to that wasn't the made up one. He assures me it's not. And I even slipped in the email.

I wonder which one was it, by the way. Didn't reply. Didn't reply to that element of it. He didn't tell you whether it was a Rob or a Robin. Well, he's got to maintain an air of mystique. And he says in here that he's written the titles of all the things and it should be obvious to fans of Crosswords which one it is.

Ooh. So, I'm going to read the contents and see if you can work it out because I can't work it out. Ooh. So, I'm going to read the contents and see if you can work it out because I can't work it out. Right. Contents. Probably not. Introduction. Hopefully not that otherwise elaborate double bluff. Innocent ghosts, the black

man of Magdalen Bridge, hang me low, royal ghosts, godstow ghosts, a blow from below. So each chapter is a sort of different type of thing and then there's broken down to the lower ones. Overweight and overpowerow ghosts, a blow from below. So each chapter is a sort of different type of thing, and then there's broken down into the lower ones. Overweight and overpowering ghosts. The Pembroke Street Shuffler, which is a good name.

And Jane's Possession. Is that a band's name? I don't know. It does sound like a band's name. Jane's Addiction. Jane's Addiction, yes. Nameless monastic ghost. Last Rites of Magdalen.

The Wadham Wanderer. Stone ghosts. Alice's father returns to Christchurch. Exeter's lost statue. Today's tale. I've read that's about a gardener, not someone who's just like having a pop. Elusive ghosts of the pubs and inns. The interloper at the Eagle and Child. And undead at the Royal Blenheim. That's all of them.

That's all of them. Can I have a look? Does any of them jump out? Have you worked at... Well, as a fan of... Are you a crossword man? I'm a fan of Inspector Morse. Oh.

He lives in Oxford and knows about crosswords. Right. He's a big fan of cryptic crosswords, so I'm pretty well equipped, James, to solve this, but I haven't solved it yet. I think he does Morse tours as well. Well, that would make sense if he's enthusiastic about cryptic crosswords. And Oxford.

The one that sounds most like a cryptic crossword clue is The Interloper at Eagle and Child. Yeah, I thought so. Or Alice's Father Returns to Christchurch. Returns usually means we're reading something backwards. Oh, right. I'm going to take a picture of these and try and solve them later. Having read them, there is one that I'm like, nah, come on, mate. Which one do you think isn't?

Well, I don't want to spoil it. Okay. I don't want to give you any lead. If what you come up with is the same. But you might need to know the content of the story in relation to the title. No, no, he says you should be able to get it from the title. Just from the title. But also if you read the story, it should be obvious.

Right, okay. And one of them is like, surely not. That can't be real. That can't have even been told as though it were real. If anyone listening, we'll put the photo on the page and stuff. And you do your homework. Yeah, because if we work it out, we can't say what it is on the podcast, can we? That would ruin it.

If I did work it out. If you do work it out. can't say what it is on the podcast can we that would ruin it if I did work it out if you do work it out but maybe we'll get Rob on I did ask if he wanted to come on but he's out of the country don't rob his house I don't know where he lives Oxford

he lives in Oxford no I don't think he does oh double bluff yeah what a bluff stuff I know well I'm very I feel very warmly towards this book

and Rob it's a lovely one. There's another thing I wanted to say about that's not quite related to the story. It was about a new town and a new house. And I found something rather alarming. I think you'd better tell me now. Now that you've teed it up.

So when we moved in... You've just moved house. Yeah, reasonably recently to a countryside house. A house in the countryside. Full of ghosts. And the cat managed to pick the... You're supposed to keep the cat inside for two weeks. The first night, you managed to pick the lock and break out.

I opened the door to the little room. It was literally a locked room mystery. And the cat had managed to pick the lock on the lockable cat flap and had gone, disappeared. So I was looking for him. mystery when the cat had managed to pick the lock on the lockable cat flap and gone disappeared so i was looking for him and over our back wall is the grounds of like the old big house and i finally climbed over that i finally trespassed climbed over that with like just the torch on my phone looking around in these like old spooky trees with the evergreen type trees that hang down and the gnarly roots and stuff.

And looking around, I couldn't see the cat, couldn't see the cat. Looked around at one of the spookier trees that's right behind our shed. And at the bottom of that spooky tree sticking out the ground is a rectangular stone sticking out there. And there was no writing on it or anything. But that was like the second day I've lived in the house as well. So is the story that you saw a rectangular stone? Well, it looks like a gravestone underneath the tree, like right by our shed.

Well, my first question was going to be, is the shed safe? I don't know. That's really worrying. The shed may have been compromised. And it's also like, if you look at the trees that you can see, like hanging over the back of a house, the spookiest tree is the one with the seeming gravestone at the bottom. Terrifying.

Cat came back, by the way. Good, good. I'm glad to hear it. Okay, so this story from Haunted Oxford by Rob Walters. terrifying cat came back by the way good I'm glad to hear it okay so this story from Haunted Oxford by Rob Waters thank you very much Rob

Mr Waters this one is The Return of Cuthbert Shields which I've sung to the tune of Return of the Mac is The Return of Cuthbert Shields now this takes place

in Queen's College Library in Oxford it's about a man whose name wasn't actually Cuthbert Shields. Now, this takes place in Queen's College Library in Oxford. It's about a man whose name wasn't actually Cuthbert Shields, and he didn't go to Queen's College. Just getting that out there now. Wow. So when he was alive, Cuthbert Shields, or his real name, John Lang, studied in Queen's College Library quite a lot. But he went to, like, Corpus Christi or something.

He died in 1900 i did a bit of googling around it and i think his name was james lang and i think he died in 1908 or there was someone else with a very similar vibe to him right at that time because like there's his autobiography his self-penned autobiography is like in the ashmolean or the Bodleian Library or something. It's like a four-volume thing that attempts to explain why it was his own fault that he ended up in an asylum in Fulham. This guy sounds interesting. Yeah, Cuthbert Shields. When he died, he left Queen's College Library some of his books

and a sealed tin box that was about the size of a book and it was sealed with lace and sealing wax and he specified that it be opened 50 years after his death. He called himself Cuthbert Shields because he apparently really believed he was the reincarnation of St Cuthbert.

St Cuthbert? From Durham? Yeah, and Shields. Durham's own St Cuthbert? And he gave him the surname Shields because he was from South Shields. He was from South Shields? And his favourite saint was St Cuthbert. And he gave him the surname Shields because he was from South Shields. He was from South Shields. And his favourite saint was St Cuthbert, so he thought, I'm going to call myself Cuthbert Shields. Very much the old school version of the porn name, I think.

Which favourite saint last half of the town he grew up in? Is that how you find out what your saint name is? Yeah, mine would be Ken Elm Wickham. Mine would be... Teresa. You grew up in. Mine is... The last half, because it's like South Shields.

Okay. Mine was West Wickham, so I'm Ken Elm Wickham. I'm Demas Carville. That's good. Demas Carville. Demas Carville. Yeah. I think you were in the running to play James Bond. Demas Carville. Yeah. That's good. Deemus Carville. Deemus Carville. Yeah. I think you were in the running to play James Bond.

Deemus Carville. Yeah. That's a baddie. That's a good baddie name. You think so? I think like an oil magnate. Baddie. Still baddie.

Definitely a baddie. Definitely a baddie. Deemus. Well, they call me Deemus Carville. We don't like your tab around here. What type? I'm not going to go into it. I think that should be obvious.

For the benefit of the listeners, we're both miming having cigars. I've got a cheroot. I don't know what a cheroot is, but I'm miming it. I've got a thin black cigar, which is probably what a cheroot is. A cigarillo. Yes. Which is a cross between a cigarette and a gorilla. And an armadillo.

That's slightly better. What would... St Demas is the thief who was crucified next to Christ. Really? Yeah. The good thief. Have you seen the film Bill and Ted? That's the reason I brought it.

That's the reason I like it. Is that why it's your favourite one? Not bothered about the Christ story. It's because that's... They go to St Demas High, which is named after St Demas. St Demas rules. We're like Bill and Ted. Are we?

No. No. We're like Bill and Ted Are we? No No So in 1950 the box was opened so it was opened by the librarian the bursar of the university and a fellow In university speak that means someone important as opposed to normal speak that just means

unimportant By the dean, a bursa and a bloke. And some guy. Which means something specific in Oxford. Professor Russell. So they took the tin from the security cupboard in the basement and they took it up to an alcove on the first floor. Sorry, I like security cupboard because as a pairing of words, it sets you up and then

disappoints. Security cupboard. It had a lock. And they open this time capsule, and inside they found some letters to the Archdeacon of Christchurch. Who was presumably dead by then. Well, I think it's a good job role, isn't it? So you just say, the Archdeacon of Christchurch.

Oh, I see. So it's to whichever relevant... 50 years later, yeah. Yeah, okay. And a long document which contained Cuthbert Shields' predictions for the future. And those predictions were said to be rubbish. Very boring and inaccurate. So boring and inaccurate that I can't find anyone reporting what they actually are.

They must have just been like, he's obviously missed out the wars, the two world wars that happened between his death and it opening. Imagine missing the world wars if you're getting migration patterns accurate and no one would even have noticed. Just high tides. Yeah.

A duck will have hiccups on a Tuesday, but next to Hitler. Apparently this letter is kept in a library somewhere, but I don't know how you'd go around getting access to those things. Maybe Rob, help me out. Yeah, help us out, Rob. Come on, Rob. Help us out, Rob.

And so the tin box, they just threw it away, and the three men left disheartened, it says in the account, Rob's account. Yeah. And as they went down, the librarian and the professor went downstairs. The professor said, who was that fourth guy who was with us genuinely the hairs in the back of my neck just stood up

that guy with the white hair who said nothing and the librarian said there was no one here but you me and the bursar I mean these are probably not their actual voices you said that in the voice of Richard I. Wedding there was no one here but you me and the bursar. I mean, these are probably not their actual voices. You said that in the voice of Richard Iowetti. There was no one here but you, me and the Bursar. Let's go ask the Bursar if you saw anyone. Let's ask the Bursar.

And they spoke to the Bursar. They spoke to the Bursar and he hadn't seen anyone. End of that part of the tale. 24 years later. We're in swinging 1974. There are thieves in the library. They're nicking stuff books probably pulling pens off chains and whatnot so the new librarian puts imposes a new rule if you bring

anyone who isn't from this college queen's college into the library you've got to sign them in with the librarian so i have this is me speaking as a librarian now. I've had enough of people taking our stuff. They're ruining our Dewey system. Dewey system. Dewey system. Dewey system. You're still saying Dewey system.

Dewey. The Dewey system. They're ruining... They're stealing the pens. That's what I'm getting at. And then one day, the librarian saw a third year student reading philosophy come in followed by an old man and she assumed that it was an elderly relative because people you know they show their relatives around this is where i work this is where i study this is where people keep stealing

the damn pens and the librarian waited for the guy to come over introduce that's the rules guy just sat down student just sat down and started getting on, cracked his books out, started getting on with it. And the old man sort of stood behind her, sort of stood behind him. So the librarian was rightly furious. She went over and said, you're supposed to introduce people to the thing.

They've got to be signed in. Mention the pens, right? And the student was like, I don't know what you're talking about, man. I don't know what you're talking about. I haven't brought anyone in. The librarian looked round. There's no one there. And she

says to someone else at the table, do you see this white-haired guy with the long coat? Where's he go? And they're like, I don't see anyone. Someone else went, I think he just went upstairs, mate. So they went upstairs very quickly. And someone else had pointed them in the direction of an alcove. And they went to the think he just went upstairs, mate. So they went upstairs very quickly, and someone else had pointed them in the direction of an alcove. And they went to the alcove. There was no one

there. And it was the same alcove that they'd opened Cuthbert Shields, Tyne Catchell in those 24 years earlier. Which would be spooky had there not been nothing in it. But there was no one there. That was where the white-haired old man had gone. There's no other exit. How did they know he'd gone there, though?

Because a couple of people saw him. They didn't see him in the alcove. Yeah, they didn't see him in the alcove. He was going over to that alcove. Did they say he was going over to the alcove? I might be putting words in Rob Walters' source's mouth. Okay. I'm sorry to bring scepticism in there because...

So late in the day. It was a really spooky story I liked. It was a good little spook, right? Yeah. Top spook stuff. That's the end. That was the return of Cuthbert Shields. He'd come, he'd watched over his time capture being opened and then people think

that he was looking for the tin box. He was so embarrassed by how bad his predictions were, he didn't come back for another 24 years. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Score time. Time. Category one is reminding you about time capsules. It was nice to be reminded of time capsules. Did you ever make a time capsule?

Yeah, time capsules were a massive deal in the 90s. I think the main thing that time capsules will tell people in the future is how interested people of the 90s were in time capsules. That's the main thing. That's the only period of time. The medium is the message. Time capsules were considered important. Yeah, because it was on Blue Peter, wasn't it? Yeah, inside it's just going to be like a Steps album

on a tape. Bands. What's a f***ing band? You don't remember f***ing bands? I don't know if we can say f***ing bands. Do you mean friendship bands? Yeah, they're like friendship bands, but when they break,

you're supposed to have to have sex with the other person. Those sort of neon things that look a bit like sort of shoelace-y, and they have that very cool, interesting way of adjusting that involve two knots. I think so. I didn't have one, obviously, because I wasn't a cool kid. Didn't have any friends. Didn't have any friends. Friends without any benefits.

Didn't have any friendship bracelets. I think I bought my own one, to be honest. You bought your own friendship bracelet? That's worse. Yeah. When it broke, though, what a weekend. I think I did do a time capsule, but I can't remember. I think it's...

I think... I like to think that there was a loose floorboard in my cupboard and I put something underneath there, like a note to people in the future. But I think I just thought I should do that and then I forgot to do it. That's annoying. Yeah. Did you do what? I never actually made a time capsule, no.

Did they do it at school? They did it at schools and things because they'd done it on Blue Peter and no one had anything else to do. I certainly remember devoting a lot. I wasn't thinking about tree houses a lot of it was spent thinking about time capsules. Would you be designing those tree houses? Oh yes, drawing

designs and plans for tree houses was my main occupation at that time. Really? That's a good plan, that's a good occupation. The thing is we didn't have a tree in our garden so I don't think anyone really had a tree that could have a tree house in it. No. So I was trying to work out, can you have a treehouse without a tree? A shed.

Yeah, well, I hope it's not near a scary tree. Yes. Oh, no. So what's the category? Reminding you of time capsules. It's five out of five. Yeah. You have completely reminded me about time capsules,

and I haven't thought about them for years. Consider that to be a sort of a time capsule. Steps. Next category. Category number two. Quite the character. And who is quite the character in this story? The man who really

believed he was the reincarnation of St Cuthbert. Oh yeah, that guy was a bit of Cuthbert Shields. A bit fruity. Cuthbert Shields. To rename yourself. He gave himself a pseudonym because he really believed that he was a reincarnation of St Cuthbert. Yeah. And he needed

a surname, so he gave the surname of the town that he grew up in. Yeah, that's quite rubbish. What a guy. Here's the thing, I don't think he's that exciting a person, otherwise his predictions would be... He's no Nostradamus, he's no the Cheshire Prophet, he's none of the big name prognosticators

that we know of and I think there's a little bit of, I don't know I feel like the renaming of himself, it's a little bit of self mythologising isn't it he's looking for attention because he's not a good enough prophet.

From some of the descriptions, it sounds like he's wearing a leather trench coat. Oh. Which is... Yeah. Even if you are like a gravedigger, it's still creepy. Unless he was predicting the Matrix reboot. All right. I'm going to give you four because of the double meaning of the word quite.

Because quite the character could mean very much as a character. Or I'm going to go with quite a character. He wasn't that much of a character. And so it's four out of five. Okay. Thanks. It's just reasonable, I think. And, well, category three, naming.

Naming. Well, good names. Although I feel like you cheated by including our profit names. Hey, how can you... But it's like with the... Demas, Carville, and what was yours? Ken Elm Wickham. Ken Elm Wickham.

Who does sound like a bit of a thug from nowadays. Sounds like a... Well, there's a footballer called Connor Wickham. Is there? And he sounds like he's... Is he a good source? Yeah, he's a footballer called Connor Wickham. Is there? And he sounds like he is. Is he a good sort? Yeah, he's all right. Oh, no.

I'm recording both options there because I didn't look up whether he's... So we just find out and sort that out in the edit. Yeah. Great. Well, good names in the story. You've mentioned the Bodleian and the Ashmolean Library, both of which sound good. Queen's College, Corpus Christi. Corpus Christi, I thought, because we're mates.

That's what I call Christ. A.K.A. Body of Christ. Body of Chris. Yeah, we didn't... I mean, Oxford's famous for having slightly weird spellings like Maudlin. Magdalene is pronounced Maudlin. We don't say it the way we spell it.

No. To make people feel stupid for no reason. Yeah. Because I worked at a cinema, and there were two branches of that cinema. It was the ABC. There was one on George Street. Fine. The other one was on Magdalene Street.

I thought it was Magdalene when I worked there, and people would laugh. Even just the people who worked at the cinema. I thought it was Magdalene. But it's spelled Magdalene. Yeah. So I think it's a three out of five. Cuffbutt Shields? Cuffbutt. AKA John or Jameslin. Yeah. So, I think it's a three out of five. Cuthbert Shields? Cuthbert...

A.K.A. John or James Lang? Yeah. Ah, Cuthbert... No. Return of Cuthbert Shields. That's a good title. That's a name. Title's a name.

Rob's done a good job there. Absolutely no question. It's Cuthbert Shields I'm not impressed with. Cuthbert Shields is not a cool name. I know. That's what I like about him as well. Imagine the adventures of Cuthbert Shields. He's invented his own name and he's gone with Cuthbert Shields I'm not impressed with. Cuthbert Shields is not a cool name. I know. That's what I like about him as well. Imagine the adventures of Cuthbert Shields. He's invented his own name and he's gone with Cuthbert Shields.

It's so sort of piece of tape around the middle of the glasses. He does sound like he's got a Mac on. That was the return of Cuthbert Shields. Chilling, right? Extremely. Chilling. Extremely chilling. In an old way that meant scary.

Yeah, not just relaxing now. I think it means sex. What? It means sex? If you want to leave us your Cuthbert Shields name as a comment, please do. That would be really fun. Remind us, how do you work out your Cuthbert Shields name? Oh, it's very easy. You just take the name of your favourite saint and hometown. Please like, subscribe and share your Cuthbert Shields names with us, the lawmen. Yes.

Alistair Pickett-King. James Shakeshaft, a.k.a. Teresa Keens.