Loremen Podcast - S3 Ep7: Loremen S3 Ep7 - The Third Eye

Episode Date: February 6, 2020

Alasdair brings an "account" of how to open your third eye. And it's squirm-inducing stuff! Meanwhile, James can't get over the fact that Tibetan lama sounds a lot like Tibetan llama. For a whole episode. There's also a man whose name is Tuesday Lobsang Rampa. Really what more could you want... A portentous owl? You got it. A  Yeti cameo? You got that too. A cat with a surname? You got that three. That's one per eye. We, like the ambassador who hosted that reception that time, are really spoiling you. Enjoy! @loremenpod www.instagram.com/loremenpod www.facebook.com/loremenpod @JamesShakeshaft | @MisterABK  

Welcome to Lawmen, a podcast about local legends and obscure curiosities from days of yore. I'm Alistair Beckett-King. And I'm James Shagshaft. This story is about Tuesday Lobsang Ramper. I don't want to give away anything in the intro. If you haven't heard of Tuesday Lobsang Ramper. I don't want to give away anything in the intro. If you haven't heard of Tuesday Lobsang Ramper, do not Google it. No, because you'll get a response saying, did you mean

Tuesday's Lobster Rampage? Are you ready for a story, James? Yeah. Well, it's not exactly a story. It's the tale of a man. Okay. And his name is t lobsang rampa what does the t stand for stands for tuesday what his name yep the man's name is tuesday lobsang rampa i'm showing you the cover of the book he wrote called the third eye and i showed i showed you this before and you asked me what period of time he belonged to because he

looked like he was from the future yes definitely lobsang rampa was a buddhist and so was really from from the past having had many many lives lobsang rampa was a a little boy from tibet right so the whole premise of the story is that he's from tibet okay i couldn't remember where he was from. Lobsang Rampa was a seven-year-old boy who was taken to the Lama Seri, I think I'm pronouncing that correctly, which is like a monastery, but for would-be lamas. Stop laughing at lamas.

Oh, like the Dalai Lama. As in the Dalai. Do Irish people think they're called khamas? And he became a llama. Sure. A neck-stretching procedure. No, but there was a very strange procedure. He underwent a procedure to open his third eye,

which is on his forehead. Oh. Yeah, so after undergoing a series of trials to make sure that he was worthy and that he had the necessary sort of talents, he was prepared by the senior lamas. Stop sniggering every time I say it. I'm going to say it loads more, James. Okay.

I'm going to say lama almost throughout. All right. So one of the llamas took him the senior llama takes his head between his knees in a room you've got very serious now but it gets kind of better but kind of worse um and another llama took a tool which which he describes as being like a braddle oh yeah yeah so it's like a little um it's like a screwdriver but for making a small hole yeah

it's one of them i don't have one i wish i had a braddle yeah yeah you can kind of just use a screwdriver though yeah yeah but this was different because the end was sort of u-shaped and had sharp teeth and he placed if you like a horse u-shaped looking at you so imagine that there's a sort of a hollow like the um like the central valley of a sword running down the length of it he placed it right in the center of of young tuesday's forehead yeah and began to turn the handle and drill into the forehead of the little boy. So it's trepanation is what we're talking here. Yeah.

And with a little scrunch sound, I think he describes, he doesn't feel any pain even as it goes through the bone. And once it's through the bone, he takes a... He wouldn't be able to feel any pain. No, no, everything's in the brain. No. He takes a splinter, a needle of wood, perfectly conical, hardened wood as hard as metal,

and slides that into the groove in the tool and then gradually, very gradually, into the brain of the little boy. And he experiences a piercing flash of light and intense pain that subsides very quickly and starts to feel unusual sensations. Why? They withdraw the Bradwell tool

and they bind him up, leaving the splinter, the little conical pointy bit of wood, in there for three days. And he stays in a darkened room for three days. And then nothing happens. And then they come and they remove him. And when they remove it,

he discovers that his third eye is now open. And he's able to see the golden auras around the llamas that were attending to him and i forgot all the way through the llama was doing it please visualize it and that indicated he later learns the gold aura around them indicates their purity it takes him a while to get used to this so he looks out into the hallway and he yells, help, help, the cleaner is on fire. But actually the cleaner is just very angry and what he's seeing is sort of blue smoke billowing out of the cleaner with flecks of red. That represents the anger and the fury in the cleaner.

And the Lama's teaching how to read the auras and how to interpret them and also how to close his third eye so that he isn't overwhelmed by this knowledge of people's innermost secrets and personal truths the book is the book t-lobs i'm right for the third eye is the account of his life it's not a highly directed story it's very sort of picaresque one thing happens then another thing happens and then this big thing happens and then he has a bit of an adventure and he sees a yeti. Oh, yeah, there's a yeti in it. Whoa. And this book came to the attention of the publisher Frederick Wahlberg in the early 50s, and it was being presented by Dr. Carl Kuhon Suo.

Yep, a mysterious figure known as Dr. Carl Kuhon Suo. Yep, a mysterious figure known as Dr. Carl Kuhon Suo. Now, I can't tell you how the biography of Tuesday Lobsangreber got into the hands of that man. But the important thing is it did, and then it got into the hands of a publisher, and then became an international worldwide hit, printed in lots of languages, and was very, very successful. And this is where the story of magic and child abuse gets strange.

Yes. Because the Daily Mail investigated Dr Karl Kuon Suo and found out that his name was actually Cyril Henry Hoskins and that he was from Plimpton in Devon and was the son of a plumber who... The son of a plumber. The son of a plumber who had never not only not been to tibet but had never left the country and it is hypothesized by some that that man wrote the book

now before walberg published it he sent the text to a variety of tibetan scholars all of whom said absolutely not this was not written by anybody with any knowledge of Tibet. It's complete nonsense. It's definitely not true. But don't let that colour your view of it. Right. Because once it was revealed that Cyril Henry Hoskins, Plumerson, was involved in the authorship of the book, he explained that obviously he hadn't actually travelled from Tibet

after the communist invasion, as Tuesday Lobsang Rampa said he had. What happened was, and I think you're going to find this very persuasive, he was in a tree trying to photograph an owl. Cool. And he fell out and hit his head, and at that point the spirit of the lama,

Tuesday Lobsang Rampa, entered his body. And from that point onwards, he was Tuesday Lobsang Rampa entered his body. And from that point onwards, he was Tuesday Lobsang Rampa. And to his enormous credit, he maintains that for the rest of his writing career, writing, I think, like 18 other books by Tuesday Lobsang Rampa. He never at any point says,

I just, it was the owl. He never blames anybody else. Right, yeah. He never credits anybody but Tuesday Lobsang Rampa that isn't quite true he does give co-credit

for one of his books to his Siamese cat Fifi Grey Whiskers who communicated some of the material some of the substance of that book telepathically James

oh of course he was hounded hounded by the press in the 50s in the UK. And so he had to, he moved, he went to Canada where he lived out the rest of his life. He left the country. Yeah, had to leave the country.

So he did finally leave the country. Didn't go to Tibet. No. It was under Chinese occupation by then. Oh, okay. So, fair play. Wouldn't have been welcome. And there is a statue of him. Where might it be? Tibet? Calgary in Canada where he lived? Plimpton?

Plimpton? Devon? No. It is in Kemerovo in Russia. A statue of him and Fifi Greywhiskers the cat. And I can't find out why. I have no idea why there's a statue of him there. I've no idea what connection he has to that location.

Do you think maybe, like, a sculptor was in a tree trying to make a sculpture of an owl and he fell out? LobsongRamper.org exists and is a completely straight and sincere account of his teachings and a variety of sort of Tibetan mysticism. It's very 1.0. It's very much web 1.0. it's basically it's it's it's very 1.0 right it's very much web 1.0 I'm imagining

a black background with green writing yeah alright but I'd like to see you having that much of a visitor count on your side James

so we should be so lucky yeah no one's signing our guest book alright I can see that you're sceptical I can see that you're sceptical and you think the word llama is funny you're ever so clever james well okay maybe you don't believe he was a better maybe

you don't believe that he left tibet after the communist invasion and learned to speak english from an american woman in a japanese prisoner of war camp maybe you don't believe that but he has anticipated in the year of the wood sheep, which is when this preface was written. He's anticipated your criticisms. And he, I don't know when that year is. He has prepared a defence. And it is, and legal experts will recognise this. It is a classic example of the giant turtle defence.

Ah. Okay. I'm not going to do the accent. It's the Devon slash Tibet accent. He writes, some of my statements, so I'm told, may not be believed. That is your privilege. But Tibet is a country unknown to the rest of the world. The man who wrote of another country that the people rode on turtles in the sea was

laughed to scorn. So were those who had seen living fossil fish. Yet the latter have recently been discovered and a specimen taken in a refrigerator aeroplane to the USA for study. These men were disbelieved. They were eventually proved to be truthful and accurate. So will I be. I feel like I should be reading that in more of a Garth Marenghi voice. A refrigerator.

The man who wrote of another country that the people who rode turtles in the sea was laughed to scorn. So were the people who'd seen living fossil fish, yet the latter have recently been discovered and a specimen taken in a refrigerator aeroplane to the USA for study. These men were disbelieved. They were eventually proven to be truthful and accurate.

So will I be. Put that llama down, Garth. Is that meant to be him on the cover? That is him on the cover. That is him on the cover. That is what Cyril Henry Hoskins, a.k.a. Dr. Carl Kuhon Suo, looked like. A.k.a. Tuesday Lobster... Tuesday Lobster Rampa.

I mean, arguably, that is the face of a white man holding a diamond. It looks like Donald Pleasence in make-up. It looks an awful lot like Donald Pleasence. With a fake nose. Yeah. What's happened to his hands? His hands are cupped around a ruby.

Oh, cool. I don't think the ruby's a literal ruby because, you know, Buddhist monks eschew trappings of wealth. I suspect it's representative of the gift of the vision cleverness of the Third Eye. Oh, yeah, being like a ruby. Yeah. Because rubies.

Look, book covers aren't easy, James. No. And you've got to admit, that is a cracker. I mean, the reason I'm bringing this story to you is purely because I bought it for 20 pence in a charity shop based exclusively on the cover. And the name? And the name, T. Lobsang Ranga.

T. Lobsang Ranga. T. Lobsang Ranga. It's probably Tom. Oh, people also fly on kites. That's another thing I forgot. Fly around on full-size kites. Oh, that's happened. That happened. Yeah, yeah.

That happens. Yeah. So do giant turtles, James. There are more things in heaven and earth. I'm not even sure I believe in refrigerated aeroplanes, to be honest. Let alone that Tuesday's a first name. The reason it's Tuesday is that everybody in Tibet is named after a day of the week,

which you would know if you read this book and no other accounts of what the naming practices in Tibet are. Apparently that's not true. So there's seven first names. There's seven first names. Very confusing. That's my story.

That's a good... Make of it what you will. The answer may never be known it was a wild ride I felt a lot of it's got unnecessary amateur surgery really made me squirm that

yeah I did want to go into detail because it's because it's quite it's a very entertainingly written book even if you don't find Llama funny

time for the scores James yeah my first category is names I'm going to take that My first category is names. I'm going to take that. My first category is names. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred out of five. It's the name. Yes. T-Lob Sang Rampa.

A.K.A. Carl Kuan Suo, A.K.A. Cyril Hoskins. Cyril Hoskins. Yeah. Tuesday. That Wednesday. Why Tuesday? Why? Where did you come up with the name? If you were going to make up a fake name for a Tibetan monk.

Yeah. Let's hypothetically say you're in Plimpton, you're photographing an owl and you have an idea. I could write a book from the point of view of a Tibetan monk. What should it be called? Couldn't need a name. And then you look at the calendar. Yeah.

Oh, that's it. Tuesday. Tuesday. Tuesday. that's it. Tuesday. Tuesday. It's very much the Madame Doubtfire style of writing. Yeah. And then there's a lobster singing on a ramp. Doing the rumba. It sounds like a T, like Lapsang Souchong.

It does sound like a T. T. Lapsang Souchong. I feel like, yeah, if you did say that in a Central London tea shop, they'd come back with something. Yeah. Five out of five for names, obviously. Thank you. I feel like yeah if you did say that in a central London tea shop they'd come back with something yeah five out of five for names obviously

thank you five out of five for name name I'm shifting the category just because we're not going to get better than that next category supernatural

there was a yeti oh yeah what happened that was quite the lost yeti from the programme lost

I don't know he saw the abominable Snowman. I didn't go into that much detail. I spent most of the time reading the bit about the drilling into the head. Okay. Did he even get an aura read off that? Off the Yeti? Was it an Abominable aura?

Chilly. So cold. Because might it not have been just a big mountaineer who had a white aura? Who knows more about the Himalayas and their denizens, James? You or Cyril Hoskins? Plummer's Sons from Plimpton. Yeah. Sorry, the plosives on Plummer's Sons from Plimpton are off the hook, James.

I'm glad we invested in pop shields for this episode. Hold on. Whoa, whoa, whoa. You're looking like you're negotiating yourself down from... It's not loads. It's just clairvoyant. It could see into people's souls, James. But that's like bringing in Harry Potter and going, oh, here's a book. How do you explain the owl? I don't know. How do I explain the chatty cat? Yeah. Give it its name. Fifi Growwhiskers. I didn't even bring Fifi Growwhiskers into naming.

That's how confident I was. And she was psychic. Yes. I assume Fifi's a feminine name. Yes, I think so. And all cats are girls. Yeah, the other one didn't do any writing. It was just lazy.

Yeah, just another second Siamese cat. Four. Four? Yeah. Decent. It's a lot of considering. All right. A bit of it is because of the Russian...

Yeah, the mystery of why is there a statue. I mean, arguably, I could have done more research, but I can't find out. That definitely exists. I've seen a picture of it. Right, okay. But I was sceptical enough that I double-checked that it wasn't just a picture of a statue of a man with a cat.

Man and cat. That had been mislabeled by a liar. And I managed to find another website referencing the first website. Also Geocities? Very much so. Sort of Lycos area. Nice.

I asked Jeeves, and he didn't know anything more than I already knew. My next category, chutzpah. Oh, yeah. Because I don't think we've ever had anyone on the podcast with as much chutzpah as a main subject as T-Lbsang Rampa.

Or Cyril Sneer. Or Cyril Henry Hoskins. Cyril double H. Just because Lobsang goes off on his own, walks all the way to a lamissary, lamissary on his own. Doesn't even hitch a lift on one. They make him sit for like three days outside in that sort of cross-legged position. His body gets all stiff, and he wakes up on the third day, no food,

and then all the other boys beat him up. And he puts them down with sort of kung fu moves. What? Yeah, and you'd expect to be quite stiff. Like you and I in our 30s. Yeah. Absolutely no way we could sit completely motionless for three days and then beat up four children.

Even child llamas? Even child llamas. Yeah. Mostly headlocks. Yeah, two headlocks. They children even child llamas even child llamas yeah mostly headlocks yeah two headlocks and then you they're not actually llamas i was thinking this for kids one kid under each arm and then you've got two legs free to kick the chicken yeah but if it was if there was an odd number of them i don't know what i'd do so so the the Tibetan monk who was reincarnated himself has a lot of chutzpah. And Cyril Henry Hoskins, to formally change his name, as he did, to Carl Kuwansuo,

and to approach multiple publishers, it took a while, trying to publish his revelations, also just takes, bearing in mind, you know, he dropped out of school when he was 15, Cyril. You know, he had no real education. Takes a lot of guts. What's the point of the Dr suan suo persona i don't know okay i do i do not know why is it i think it's that nobody would find sounding name and i don't kuon suo sounds vaguely eastern but not particularly tibetan to me as someone who has never been there so same as i.e an expert yeah but well here's an interesting aside

apparently several people who are now students of tibet or subsequently became students of tibet um got interested in it and so he got interested in sort of the tibetan liberation movement through his writings so so so a lot of people uh even though they might not necessarily be strictly speaking historically accurate um lots of people their first interest their first introduction to Tibetan culture was through his books. Is that like there's a lot of wicker people now because of Harry Potter?

Oh, right, I thought you meant the wicker man. No, not wicker man. Wicker people rustling towards you. Get away! They're weird. Yeah, can I just bring up the wicker people? They'll haunt my dreams. I've absolutely had it with the wicker people.

Yeah, is that like there's a lot of modern witches because of Harry Potter, though? I think it's a bit like that. Except that Tibet is a real place and witchcraft. Scotland's a real place, Alistair. Isn't that? I don't know. Is that where you think Hogwarts is? Isn't it Scotland? Isn't it Edinburgh?

I don't know. It's probably Edinburgh. You get the train from King's Cross. So it's going up the Great North Eastern Line. It's very much like being a comedian. You go to Hogwarts, Edinburgh Festival. Good chance you'll die. And the rest of the year, you live in a cupboard under the stairs in London. Yes, it is.

So, chutzpah. Five. Thank you. I don't think I've ever seen anybody as gutsy. You're talking about tree-related fallings. Only Newton has got him for coming up with this bigger thing. Yeah. Except, obviously, Newton's thing was real.

Let's gloss over that. Final category for he of the third eye. Eyes. Oh. So it's at least three. It's minimum three. Minimal three. oh so it's at least three

it's minimum three minimal three I kind of imagine that if you can prove when he adopted the persona of Dr Kuran Suo

Karl Kuran Suo Dr Dr Karl we'll call him Dr Karl it's a character in Neighbours as well is it yeah if he when adopting that character

to give the gravitas put a pair of glasses on I almost certainly would have. That would make him... Four eyes. Four eyes. Plus his hidden... Yes.

That would be a fifth eye. Okay. So I am actually going to give you a five for eyes. Really? Also, because they just... If it's true that they drill into someone's head to create an eye... Yeah. I just need to give you those points just to make that person feel better.

That's great. Well, I'm accepting that even though, just to be clear, I don't know if that is true. But five points it is. Yes. I think that must be one of the most high scoring stories ever. It's when you texted me to say, have you ever heard? I'd like to just this is my i mean it's just my favorite one of my favorite texts it's what's great about doing this podcast yeah so sorting out arranging meeting

for recording podcast 909 in the morning get a text from alistair nine in the morning i texted 909 yeah 909 wow i'm yeah well on my game that day have you heard of tuesday lobsang rampa a text from Alistair? Nine in the morning I texted this. Nine oh nine, yeah. Nine oh nine. Wow, I'm, yeah, well on my game that day. Have you heard of Tuesday Lobsang Rangpa? Wonder if this story is obscure enough. And as I replied, I stand by it,

not really sure where the name begins. you've been listening to lawmen with me alistair beckett king and me james shakeshaft and that was the story of tuesday lobsang ramper. whoever that old bloke was. Loads of names. Next week is Valentine's Special. Last year, we had Jenny Collier on telling a Welsh Valentine's story about Santas Dwynwen. J. Clo. J. Clo. J. Col.

J. Col, I think she calls herself. We had such a fun time, we thought we'd have her back for this year's Valentine's Special, which is another Welsh tale. I hope she doesn't listen to this episode where i did that llama joke oh she'd she'd love that did you get much in wales no i've been banned