Love Life with Matthew Hussey - 134: What Trauma Does To Your Relationships + Healing Your Emotional Wounds

Episode Date: September 29, 2021

Matt and Steve sit down to talk: Where trauma and bad beliefs come from The effect of trauma on romantic relationships Getting over pain and changing emotional associations Boomer, Gen Z, Millenials + the failure of empathy --- Follow Matt @thematthewhussey Follow Stephen @stephenhhussey Email us your thoughts at [e-mail] --- Don’t waste time & energy. Find love Faster: Download Your Free Guide to Learn the 3 Love Habits... → http://www.3LoveHabits.com  

Hello there, Podcast Pickles. It's your old pal Stephen Hussey here, just checking in before we start today's episode. And it's been a couple of days since we finished our final virtual retreat of the year, and we just had an incredible three days as a team. Our whole team have been buzzing off the event. We're feeling really satisfied and thrilled and exhausted also from those three days. But the way you all came and played full out, the those of you who came and joined us, there was over a thousand of you. It was an amazing event.

And the three days were just truly special for those of us who got to enjoy them together. And I've heard from some of you in my DMs on Instagram who have told me how much fun and what profound transformations you had on the program. So thank you, thank you to all of you who came, who played full out, who really went for it and, you know, showed up for yourself to invest in yourself over those three days. It really means a lot to our team and we're just so proud of all the people who went through that process with us. So on with the show today, Matt gets quite deep into a meaty discussion of trauma and why trauma holds us back either in relationships and we get triggered in a relationship because of old wounds

and the way that can send us into a negative spiral in our communication with a partner or the way trauma can stop us getting into a relationship even in the first place because we have certain negative beliefs that we've inherited from our parents and lord knows what they did or taught us over the years or we just have certain trust issues where that trust has been broken before or insecurities or whatever it might be and look we know these things are not easy to snap our fingers and change but we talk about some of the ways we can start to unwind some of those beliefs and why it's just important to do the work of self-understanding of self-examination in this area so that we can,

you know, start that healing process because that's how we start to improve the way we relate to others, the way we are in a long-term relationship and just our suitability for any kind of intimate relationship. So it's really, really important stuff and also we end up touching on some of the intergenerational debate between gen z millennial boomers and you know the way those generations finger point at each other and blame each other for the world's ills regularly and dare i say matt brings a little bit of sanity a bit of empathy to that well-trodden debate. So enjoy that as well. All right, thank you so much again for such an amazing three days. We'll let you know in due course about upcoming retreats, but thank you for making this one so special. On with the show. Welcome to another episode of the Love Life Podcast, where me, Matthew Hussey, and my brother, Stephen Hussey, come together to, well, I suppose, talk and share ideas with you that could help not only your love life, which has traditionally, what we've been known for is helping people with

their dating lives but also increasingly so i i think i can say steve we've worked on ideas that increase people's love for life and that's a big reason we name the show love life is because we really believe that the greatest route to a great love life is to have a wonderful love for life itself. And if you didn't get that double meaning, then shame on you. And we're going to repeat it until we're blue in the face and you can't stand to hear it anymore. Always a good sign when you have to explain a title. Yeah, and admonish the audience if they don't get it. That always goes down the drain. Right, yeah. explain a title yeah and and admonish the audience if they don't get it that always right right yeah

yeah yeah uh well steve i we've traditionally been starting with reading a review from itunes um just to give a little acknowledgement to the people that that acknowledge us and take the time out and i had uh i had one here that i wanted to read from Buttercup7325. And this is the latest review. She says, so I'm in my early 20s. By that, I mean 21 to 23 years old. I have recently discovered this podcast when I got rejected by a guy who liked me first. I thought there was something wrong with me, but listening to these episodes helped me realize that I wasn't doing anything wrong and doing nothing wrong with him. We were just talking, but I didn't like him at first, not until I learned more about him. But when I told him that I liked him, he said he just wanted to be friends. Once he said that, I just needed to hear a podcast and understand slash process what happened.

Then this podcast popped up and I have been hooked. So thank you guys for this podcast. It helped me process this rejection and realize what I should be looking for within myself and within the next guy I'm interested in. I thought that was lovely. Yeah, thank you for that. Review. And there was another one.

Yeah, thank you, Buttercup. There was another one from name Great Way to Get News. Which can't, she must just have that name as a reviewer because it can't be, she can't be talking about this podcast. God help you if you're looking to get your news from

this podcast she says thank you i recently discovered your podcast and follow you on instagram after hearing some of your advice that i thought was great the episode how to feel secure again after your trust has been destroyed is something so special and insightful I just had to write a review. I really want to say that the tips you gave are life-changing. Well, at least they are for me. I didn't really come full circle that one of my biggest issues was my fear and inability to want to trust again after I've been hurt by so many until hearing you talk about it. By the end with your final tip of loving so beautifully that even if trust is broken, you leave that relationship with the most loving person, yourself, left me in tears. My soul felt truly soothed and at peace after

hearing the reassurance and being reminded that I will have my own strength to rely on. So thank you for reminding me of the strong, kind and loving woman I am, who will now be a lot bolder and less scared than she was before. Well, thank you. That means the world to us for you to say that. And I'm so glad that that particular episode resonated. I think that, and I've been thinking more and more about this, Steve, just trauma in general, the trauma that's either created in relationships or in childhood, where we learn that doing something that, you know, that dealing with people might mean tremendous pain, or loving might mean tremendous pain, or trusting might mean tremendous pain. And through our trauma, we come to associate huge pain with some of the things that we might need to do in order to access some of the best experiences of life. But these things get wired at times in our life where we don't even know that the wiring is happening or that the rewiring is happening in some cases. We don't choose the wiring in those moments do we that just we go through something that's unbelievably painful

and the wiring happens the associations get made and what can take a very short amount of time to to wire neurologically can take what feels like an incredible amount of time to change. And that trauma comes to dictate so much of our lives. And someone cheated on you, someone broke your heart that you really trusted and you thought it was going well, and they led you to believe it was going well. Or your parents, you know, your fundamental safety growing up, you know, you didn't feel safe either physically or you didn't feel safe emotionally, or you learned you couldn't trust when someone said something, you know, or you learned that your parents weren't there, you know, you learned a certain kind of anxious attachment because you felt like you were always,

you never knew when your parents were going to be around or not, or you felt abandoned by your parents. There are so many ways that trauma gets created. And then we spend the rest of our lives in one form or another, trying to unpack that trauma and trying to rewire ourselves so that we don't end up avoiding all the all these good things in life because of a pain association we have with them yeah yeah i think it's like when you know some people never feel they have so much trauma around feeling like a failure or feeling worthless that no matter how much they achieve it never erases the feeling that they are underperforming they are failing they you know and it might just be because it was drummed into them that anything they did was not if it wasn't perfect it wasn't good enough you know the classic person who's like oh you only

got an a why didn't you get an a plus on the test and that person you know connect could have a constant trauma of no matter how many data points you get it doesn't erase some feeling that you're a failure yeah and and that it that's why rewiring is an important word for this, really, because it really is about coming things from a different paradigm altogether. The problem is, it's really hard to get outside of ourselves. You know, we have this emotionally speaking. Well, first look, there's an evolutionary component to these things, right? We get burned in some way, you know, trauma occurs, and then there's just a evolutionary response to that, which is, which can be good, right? Oh, this means danger. This means pain. When someone says this,

pay attention to it. It means it's a giant red flag or, you know, we, we, we learn these things and then our, our emotions, uh, our brain develops a kind of a reflex response to that thing in the future, which can be good and bad. We're wired to avoid pain. So the good side is that it can stop us getting hurt again. The bad side is that we can make the wrong associations. So now what we're learning is to consistently avoid this thing, but it may be the wrong thing to avoid. You know, it may be that the lesson we take from a betrayal or a heartbreak is not love is dangerous, but that not trusting my intuition is dangerous when I get the sense that something is wrong, or that not having boundaries is dangerous, or that not paying attention to certain issues as they arise, you know, hoping that certain bad behaviors will just go away, even when unaddressed. That would be a good association to develop that oh me not having

boundaries is is dangerous means pain but if we develop the association that that love equals suffering which i suppose on some level is true you can you know, love does equal suffering, but you know, hopefully we decide that the good outweighs the bad there. But when we think of the traumatic suffering that we've had in the past, it may be less to do with love and more to do with what we chose to ignore. But when the wrong association gets formed, we end up avoiding this thing that could make us it could bring a lot of richness and joy into our lives because we've just sort of globalized this this pain around the whole issue of just love in general as opposed to the kinds of love that i let in or the kinds of bad behaviors that i have allowed to be present in the past and go unaddressed. But I do think this issue of trauma is just is sort of fascinating because we can intellectualize

it but what's real to us is our pain. It's so easy to say to someone, oh my God, but there are so many wonderful experiences out there to be had. But if your experience of being in relationships has been tremendous pain, then that's real to you. Now, on one hand, you can focus on the moments in your life that have disproved that and choose to shine a light on those moments. very simplistic picture that, oh, loving equals pain or getting close to people equals pain. In order to have a very simplistic picture of that, we have to ignore a lot of other evidence. We have to, our pain focuses us on the worst experiences we've had of that thing, but ignores the other experiences we've had that suggest that well actually people can be quite lovely or that people can stick to their word or that you know people don't always have the worst intentions we're ignoring all the evidence even in our own lives of that and of course we're ignoring the evidence in a lot of other people's lives but focusing on the the moments in our lives where that wasn't true can be useful it can also be useful to focus on other people's experiences that don't accord with our own

because if we go i i think curiosity is is a really important element here when it comes to trauma. Trauma is such a heavy word. And to me, curiosity is such a light word, but it's deceptive. Curiosity is a word that, you know, comes through the door very lightly. But it's a very powerful word, deceptively powerful. I've tried to make a practice of being curious about the people in my life who seem to not have the same troubles with things that I do, or people who are getting different results than I am in some area of their lives. They seem to be getting results or they seem to be getting different results with other people than I'm getting. I try to be curious about those people and just go, well, what is that? Because my experience keeps being this, but they're not having that experience. They're, they seem to be, they seem to be getting on better in this area. What,

what is that? And I don't think that has to start with some, I don't know, intense modeling exercise, but just curiosity, asking people questions like, well, so, so how do you deal with that? Or why this, the way that you approach people, how do you do that? How do you experience this thing in your life? And just, just getting curious about it because it really is, if you think about it in, in a way living, we all have trauma and it all, and it is for all of us, it's going to flare up from time to time. But if we're absorbed in our trauma and if we live there constantly, then it to me almost is a, becomes a reflection of a kind of slightly

myopic view of life that that we're seeing everything in life through our lens and we're not getting curious about what other lenses actually exist. I don't think it starts with suddenly being like, oh, I'm just going to adopt a different lens. The way that I've witnessed people change in life, especially if you think about it, what is it that, what is it that really changes people around us? If you go to your friend and you start preaching at them and you say, oh my God, you have to read this book. It's amazing. It's going to change your life. There's already going to be some resistance to it, right? Because no one wants to be sold to in that way. People don't want an evangelist. It doesn't, and it's

people, everyone's experienced that in a relationship. You try telling your partner, oh my God, you have to do it this way. And they're like but i don't want to or that's not my way or that's not what i'm used to or stop preaching at me yeah but if we say to someone if if we're if we're reading something and someone looks over our shoulder and says what's that and you say oh it's this thing i'm reading right now um i find it really interesting it's really helped me and they go well so what's it what what's the idea and you know well the idea is this let me know if if you ever want to borrow the book I've I've you know it may help you I don't know but I've found it really interesting and so I was

like well maybe I will pick it up you know that I actually think that that the relationship we have with getting people around us to start to pay attention to things that might help them is the same way we can get ourselves to start to pay attention to other things. Instead of having this approach of someone telling us there's a better way. You know, you don't have to go through all of this trauma you're going through right now or whatever, which makes us be like, but you don't understand what I've been through. You don't understand how bad it's been for me. You can't possibly understand.

And you telling me that there's just a better way or whatever minimizes what I'm going through. Instead of that, if we allow ourselves, if we give ourselves permission to just have our eyes and ears open to other types of people and experience of life and experiences of life, you know, if we struggle with trusting in relationships, what can I learn from, you know, what can I learn from just asking questions of people who don't seem to struggle with trust in their relationships? Like, how do they do that? What do they do differently than what I do? Or when they discover, when something that would normally trigger me

happens to them, what's their response to that? And it doesn't mean you're the same as them. We're always going to react a bit differently to other people because we're different. But having a curiosity about that is really fascinating to me. And I think opens the door to other ways of being than how we've been our entire lives. And that is the thing that is the hardest thing to get out of. That the more, I think that when we're young, we naively, or at least I naively thought that change was, I don't know, perhaps not easy, but just, I treated it like it was easy. Even in my

coaching, when I was 21, 22 and working with people and, you know, I just, I had this naivete about how, how easy it would be to get people to change, but change is so hard. It's so, so difficult. And part of the reason it's so difficult is because we're, we're us and we're trying to change, we we're trying to change using the the same brain that got us to all of the problems in the first place yeah your brain gets well-worn grooves it gets set like a piece of clay where you've molded it in a certain way yeah and it's tricky it's kind. It's kind of, you know, one of the, what I find to be the, if we talk about, if we get into the conversation of what's out there in the universe, how much does science really know? Are there entire planes of reality that we don't even know about or experience that are going on. I think that one of the interesting and most compelling arguments for the fact that there's so much more going on or out there than we are able to understand or test for is that we are limited by their own brains. So we're trying to solve problems that might be, we may not be, there may be things going on that we can't even sense because they're not within our sensory field of vision or within our sensory reality. So saying there's nothing more out there because we can't see

it is, is just what we can't see or experience because of our brains. And anyone who knows me knows this is not my big argument for, you know, I, I, I, if anything, I'm some, I'm a huge skeptic. So you won't hear me talk like this too often in these ways. But I do think it's one of the most compelling arguments for the fact that there's so much going on that we don't even know about. Is that we're stuck trying to solve these problems within a human brain. Well, I think similarly and somewhat analogous is this idea that it's really hard for us to change ourselves because we're stuck with ourselves. We're stuck with the mindset and the lens that we've developed that that's dictated most of our lives, if not all of our lives. And so we are, everyone's had that experience of, of learning. Steve, you know,

when you have an experience of learning a lesson that you feel is almost embarrassing to admit to everyone else that you've just learned, because it's so absurdly, it's one of those things that if you say it to someone else they'll be like yeah uh yeah that's obvious yeah oh yeah that's an obvious emotional lesson how you're what do that just became real to you like that you feel almost embarrassed to say it it's so obvious and a lot of life is like that yeah a lot of life is us coming to i would honestly argue that growing up maturing evolving becoming wiser is us viscerally learning what are really really obvious things to a lot of other people. Yeah, I remember Charlie Munger, the famous investor, said that a lot of the things about happiness are very, very simple.

Right. And so many crucial lessons in life are so simple, but connecting to them viscerally is not simple. Learning them for ourselves is not simple. And so much of the exchange of deep lessons today is so superficial. Meme culture and endless motivational captions is borrowed wisdom, regurgitated and passed around at scale that people aren't truly connected to for themselves. The most important obvious lessons that we learn in life are hard for us to arrive at. And I do think the beginning of learning those lessons is to stop assuming that we know so much or that we have so many answers or that our truth is truth and to stop being curious about the way that other people live, about what their experience of life

is. I'm not saying that our experience isn't valid or important or even profoundly true. It doesn't hold out its own truth. Of course it does. Just that it can be very dangerous to get too tied into it. And living a life that is kind of obsessed with our own trauma long term seems to me to on some level be one that is inwardly focused that makes our experience of life the only experience of life that we think is by its very nature in a sense in order to say I'm now going to avoid this forever because of my trauma it's kind of like saying my experience of life is the only experience of life that there isn't actually another way to experience a great relationship or a parental

relationship or a brotherly or a sisterly relationship or a friendship or a business partnership. That my truth is the only truth. And I'm not saying our trauma isn't real or relevant or doesn't contain some grain of truth in it. I'm saying that everyone has their version and that there are people with really beautiful versions of the very thing that we have trauma around and if we get curious about where that beauty comes from for other people we can start to have our trauma lessen its grip on us because we realize our experience of this life isn't the only one that's available. And the whole reason we've been avoiding this thing over and over and over again is because

our, our, our fears, our demons have been telling us that the only truth of relationships is that they're pain, that the only truth of parent-child relationships is abandonment that the only truth of friendships is betrayal and and that becomes this singular truth that isn't actually representative of the kind of life that we can live and this is why exposure just to people ideas and places you know travel learning uh you know reading because you can't experience enough different people's lives people because they may have completely different ways they lived in you places because suddenly you're exposed to the parochial nature of your own concerns all these things are ways of shaking that box in a way where

because you can't think your way out of a lot of these things you have to you it's action clarifies the way and if you just sit and think in a room perhaps you can get very zen and mindful which is a process of not thinking but but you can't think out all your traumas and problems because again you're still using that same brain you've gotten used to you want to find ways to continually challenge it because sometimes the answer to your trauma or even just the same groove you've gotten into is actually asking a very different question sometimes it's a sideways thing of saying maybe the entire thing i'm thinking about isn't very important maybe an entire value system i'm thinking about is a is a faulty goal maybe it's a flawed idea maybe i have to reduce

maybe i have to like maybe i've got to strip things away um you know and that's like an abstract way of saying but sometimes you need to get out and see through other people's eyes the things you are currently struggling with the things the paradigm you look at the world on you know if you look on the world as like everyone's out to get me or love is pain or i am you know these little goals i have for my career are so so crucial and i need more and more of this yeah i i think you have to shake that box in a lot of ways that's right and and again that comes back to curiosity that's why curiosity is such an important trait because it leads us down unfamiliar paths in a in a gentle but progressive way do you think people have to unwind their trauma do you think that's just a life a lifelong thing

that in reality that everyone will just always have to keep doing is unwinding trauma well our relationships there are relationships there to placate your trauma or do you have to fix your trauma to have good relationships i i think the right relationship helps you heal i really believe that I think that it helps you heal. It doesn't placate. It helps you heal because it provides a, it holds a mirror up to us. Hopefully, you know,

sometimes our partner models what a loving response to something looks like that we haven't seen before. And that can either illuminate a different path than the ones we've seen before, which maybe have previously been toxic. And it might also teach us a better way of being. It might start to reveal the ways in which we're a little toxic, right? We live in a world where we're really good at calling other people toxic and we don't pay much attention to the ways that we bring toxicity to a relationship. But when we're with someone who models better, more loving, more compassionate responses than even we would, then that becomes a fork in the road. It either becomes a

call to be our best or a call to be intimidated and to sabotage and to run away. But if we're brave enough to take that call to our best selves by interacting with people who have learned things that we haven't, then that can be a beautiful path of healing. But I suppose all through our lives, we're encountering new traumas. You know, where new things are happening that could either reignite old traumas or create new ones. And, you know, then there are parents who are who become traumatized by the you know their kid taking a really bad bump on the head um and seeing blood you know come out of

their kids head for the first time and they're traumatized by that and all of a sudden now they're they're scared for that reason there's there's always something waiting to give you a new fear that you didn't have before you know i've talked about the time where i completely lost my words on the today show live in america in front of millions of people on live tv i didn't used to get live TV nerves to the same extent before that happened. And then that happened. And all of a sudden I started to get nervous going on live TV. It made me aware of something that could go wrong. Right. That I wasn't even thinking about, not really, you know, I was thinking of all the things that could go wrong, but me going completely vacant in the middle of an interview wasn't one of them. I'd been pretty good up until that point of keeping a train of thought going. It opened up a new, a new room. Oh my God, I can

be in that situation and completely my inside of my mind goes black. And I don't know, I can't remember what's going on or what was said or what I was trying to say. And this cold, oozing feeling creeps up my entire body. You know that now I have a completely new fear. This new thing that I didn't even really, oh my God, this I'm afraid. Now I have this to be afraid of. I had enough to be afraid of before. Now I can add this to the list. So, um, you know, we, my God, we could do more and more episodes on how I dealt with that and how I continue to deal with that. And, you know, all of these things, it's fascinating conversation, but this is what I was thinking about, Steve.

It's trauma. You know what? One of the things that made me think of this today is I was watching TikTok and scrolling through just nonsense. there was a, there was this video, this TikTok someone had made that basically said to the audience as like a fun prank, sneak up to your dad in the middle of the night and start yelling that, you know, they texted us, we got to go. Like, we got to go get your stuff now we gotta go and like really freaking them out and see what they do and and they did it to their poor dad elderly father who in the middle of all this is screaming like they're saying we gotta go we gotta go and even the mum's in on it and they're like we gotta go and the dad's like he's freaked out he's like where

where like and i but what does he think is happening he doesn't know he doesn't know that's supposed to be the joke but and you look at all these comments and everyone's in hysteria where by the way where are all the sane people? Like I'm reading, I'm reading the comments. I'm like, wow, I'm really going to see how much people hate this. Everyone loves it. I was like, this is hysterical. The way the dad says where, oh my God, I'm dying laughing. I'm like, where are the sane people? And then, do you know, and I'm not saying this is true or not, but do you know what it made me feel? I was watching and I was like,

oh, like this person hasn't been through any real shit yet. That's what it made me feel. I don't know if it's true or not, but that's what it made me feel. I was like, oh, you can't have been through some real shit. Cause if you have, you know, this is,

this is not, to me, this is not funny. That's not funny. Like for someone who's been through some, some serious stuff, going into a room and being like, we've got to go.

We've got to go. That could ignite any number of things any any amount of trauma from the past and just your nervous system now is just ruined in that moment it's like prank your girlfriend by running into the room and saying baby i have something to tell you. I cheated on you last night. Those pranks exist. Yeah.

Watch this hilarious reaction. As I melt down this poor person's nervous system and ignite all their old trauma and then go just joking. I just, I honestly, I, I find, I don't know why this is a different point I'm making

right now, but I just, I'm just, when I watched it, it made me want to talk about trauma today because I was just like, this isn't funny to me. I don't get how this is funny to people. I mean, I get it. You have to be like ignoring the fact that of what this can actually do to someone internally in order to find it funny. Cause you just have to find it funny on a surface level. But to me, I was just like, Oh, this, I wouldn't do this to someone I love. I would never catch me doing that to someone I love just creating all of that all of those horrible feelings in them i don't know what's funny about that yeah i i could never do i can never do pranks that involve manipulating someone's emotions i'm always it's just too it's like to me it's like i can't put someone through a fake

bad emotional experience for sure i just don't know how it's worth it i don't i don't know how it's worth it there's stuff like yeah i don't know i that one seemed particularly there's versions of it i'm sure that just funny that one seemed particularly just in the in the light of the theme of today i just was like wow this is this is like what we're doing to entertain each other these days it makes me want a return of mr rogers like just to be like that's not like this this isn't funny like how is this this is what we're stooping to now in order to entertain each other like let's bring a little mr rogers kindness back into this world my god mr rogers would do a prank like where i could imagine him doing like

oh turns out this chocolate cake is also vanilla on the inside now that's a good prank exactly i'm imagining i'm imagining the tiktok prank now and then it just cuts the mr rogers just going that's not funny yeah exactly well i we have to you have to remember matt dads are not popular on tiktok dads dads are figures of ridicule on TikTok. They are the butt of jokes. They are boomers. They are seen as expendable figures. Yeah, well, you know how I feel about that too. Jameson and I share a similar opinion about that whole okay boomer thing,

which is just, there's just so much nastiness. Like, God forbid we get to a certain age and people start like, people start going, okay, millennial. They already do that to millennials. They do. But guess what? It's going to happen to them. And it's such a lack of empathy. And by the way, that's one thing if like a 13 year old is doing it. But when I see 20 somethings and 30 somethings cynically like talking about the older generation, like, okay, boomer. I just, I honestly find it to be so, such an ungenerous interpretation of every action that it is. It shows no kindness. It shows no empathy.

We are all going to be met with people who know better than us, who have a different perspective than us, another generation that, you know, are going to in some way move the ball forward in ways we didn't. And aren't we all going to want some grace? Aren't we all going to want some kindness in our life? And are we also going to want some, my God, some respect for what we actually know? Some respect for the wisdom that gets accumulated over the over the years i just i yeah it's uh i find that all a little sad there's like an idea now that anyone over 60 doesn't know anything worth knowing you know i mean that's that's the implication right it's utterly absurd it is utterly absurd um but there we go i hope that you keep listening to this podcast because we are getting to have conversations on this podcast that we're not having in quite the same way anywhere else. It's not like our love life club where we actually coach people who are, you know, kind of very intentionally making changes in their life and want to plan and a path for that and real live coaching. It's a kind of conversation that's more casual and more relaxed

and hopefully invites you into it too. We get a lot of our topics from the things that you guys talk about and seeds that you plant as our audience. But if you would like to actually come on a coaching journey with Steve and I, we have the Love Life Club. Go to askmh.com and you can join with a 14-day free trial. I have either Steve or I does a webinar every week that is coaching, answering questions live. We even bring callers on to do live coaching demonstrations. It really is a powerful, powerful coaching tool. In the same way that you would join a gym, you join that Love Life Club to work on your mindset, your happiness, your peace, and the results you're getting in life, whether it's your life in general

or your love life. It's an amazing place to be. So there's a 14-day free trial come to askmh.com to come and be a part of that with us we will of course see you all or speak to you all in the next episode we look forward to having you all there and thank you steven for another thoughtful episode thank you pickles peaches puddings and pears And careful out there on the old TikTok. Because that clock comes for us all, baby. Goodbye, everyone.